These movies are obviously horrible, but you're sighing, bitchy review style almost makes me want to defend them. Try to be less passive aggressive, or reserve it for emphasis so you don't come across as so grating. You sound like a girl going too far excoriating an ex-boyfriend.
I think Lindsay Ellis and cinema snob could make a way better movie, I guess Lindsay bus a better writer and I think Cinema snob use to work in B movies, but more importantly in a personal level they are more self aware. However even if it was impossible to make a good movie with all that creators, is Doug ego that fucked up everything.
@@robbyrobot3303 uuuh, what exactly is passive agressive about it? it's a full on attack and rightfully so.. so much that has come out of this channel awesome debacle is just unbareably annoying horseshit
part of me wants to make a disaster artist style movie about the making of these movies, another part of me wants to make a dark gritty logan-esque fourth channel awesome movie where all the internet reviewers are all old and grizzled and have to come back together for a deep psychological journey that critics will describe as "confusing" and "bad." doug is not there.
Linkara kind of did this with the audio play 'The Voice from the Dark' which has him and other former Channel Awesome producers investigate a haunted house and the whole reason Linkara did this was because he wanted to recapture the comradery of the anniversary films without actually reliving the horrors. It's actually pretty good. The story is interesting with a good mystery and the production is smaller but more effective. Plus there's no Doug to be found.
I picture an elaborate setup by Johnny Knoxville and the crew to put him and his ilk ln front of a parade long line up of sugared up third graders punching them in the nards.
@@joelmole3157 Apparently Linkara actually bothered to get input from the other producers to get their characters right. Geee, respect for your collaborators, what a novel idea.
As someone who does watch Film Brain's videos, it's always noticeable in his crossovers with Doug that Doug has never watched a single one of his videos. Film Brain is a sarcastic, glass-half-empty snarker in his videos. He's insanely negative about everything. He never has that happy-go-lucky lap dog persona in his own videos. Doug just straight up gives him an entirely different character.
Sad thing is that personality transitioned into other crossovers like his The Spirit review with Linkara where he kidnapped the guy and acted like a complete nutcase and his crossover with Nash where he reviewed The Punisher and cane off as an overly innocent man child who doesn’t know any better
i just imagine them calling for a break and film brain just goes off to smoke and look forlornly into the suburban middle distance and wonder how his life turned out this way
He's not really overly negative now, mainly he reviews current films these days and he's genuinely a good critic and gives each movie a fair shot. I think he's benefited a lot from Channel Awesome being long in the rear view mirror of his film critic career, because let's face it, there was no room on CA for anyone who wanted to do actual film analysis who didn't also have some sort of gimmick, e.g. Lindsay Ellis managed it because she reviewed 'girly films', even Dan Olson was there for a while with his weird puppet 'persona' that he has long ago abandoned. (2 more creators who have benefited hugely from exiting CA and never looking back!) Otherwise on CA you could basically go through movies point by point riffing on them, negatively only of course, and pretend you hated everything, and that was all there was. Doug and Rob didn't know any of their creators' work but it was most obvious with Film Brain because of the super creepy persona they wrote for him.
You know what's funny? In his "Is parody dead?" editorial, Doug said that parodies should not just be references and that they all need to be a clear understanding of what you are spoofing. And yet here he is, making random pop culture references for the sake of making them.
@@georgekostaras dying is easy compared to coming clean and facing the consequences. He took the cowards way out...though his suicide makes a lot more sense in the context of someone who knew his "Mr Rogers of the internet" image was unraveled and he was going to be found out for what he was
I felt so fucking betrayed. He seemed like such a sweet, genuine guy. Then it was not only revealed he was a rapist but that the higher-ups at Channel Awesome kept it quiet.
As someone who worked on a short film partly shot out in the Moroccan desert, the idea that Walker expected people to work without food or water (especially in those conditions) is frankly insane.
I'm looking forward to part 2 as well. I liked NC and watched him quite a lot back in the day. However, once kickassia (or whatever the title was) hit, I was stunned how goofy and cringey it has become. It seemed like a bunch of disorganised fools making one bad joke after another. I was kinda glad that James Rolfe didn't play a big part in any of those shameless movies. Sometimes I still watch AVGN due to my video game nostalgia, but NC and TGWTG is dead to me.
I think Doug was trying to invoke the premise he brought up in his Top 11 Batman TAS Episodes: that putting a bunch of beloved characters in a scene together and letting them work off each other results in great comedy. Here are four reasons why he couldn't execute that premise properly: 1. The characters are only equally strong to an audience that knows them all well. Most TGWTG viewers never watched absolutely every show. 2. The characters are only strong in their own right if they're allowed to be themselves, instead of being forced into the mold of their shrieking half-witted director. 3. These characters aren't really characters at all. They're reviewers. They all have quirks, but quirks don't automatically make characters distinct from the people who perform them. 4. There are too many characters. The human brain can only get to know so many personalities on screen at once. Also, Phelous and MarzGurl were the worst performers in these movies, other than Doug.
Yeeep. Like, here's the thing: The idea of just getting two or more comedians in a room and letting them play off each other CAN make for awesome comedy. It's literally the premise of a Comedians In Cars Getting Coffee: Just getting two or more funny people in the same location, and letting them play off each other. But, that only works with improv, not tightly-scripted productions like this. It could have worked if he'd, among other things, actually watched their shows to get an idea of their comedy and how it differs from his, and given them a LOT more to improv and come up with their own lines. The whole POINT of this sort of thing is to get a bunch of people that are understood as funny in a room, then let them work off each other, but that doesn't work when they're working from a script, written by someone who has only one comedic mold, and not given rom to improv.
I’m still bafflingly impressed to this day that “DanganRonpa V3: Killing Harmony” has 22 total characters and yet I can remember each of them by name. I consider that game, and the series as a whole as a damn good example of ensemble character writing. Lol
I can dismiss #1, 3, and 4 because I did keep up with most of the reviewers at the time and enjoyed their content. In other words, I was the target audience. I can't forgive #2, though, as it invalidates the whole point.
Yeah. When Batman TAS uses multiple characters, there's not too much. Or when there is too much, like the court episode, all the villains are still entertaining
I agree with you except for one thing : The appeal of these aniversary specials was the big crossover with everyone from the site. The huge problem is that they are all reducted to an often bad gimmick because he didn't watch any of the cast's work (except maybe Cinema Snob's).
I feel it is important to add that these "movies", if you can even call them that, were all released episodically in 20 minute segments. This probably explains why the pace is so herky-jerky and why everything feels like a bad internet sketch.
I wouldn't even call the first two movies. They were extensions of the one year anniversary video: a novelty act where a bunch of people got together and acted silly. The stories were completely irrelevant, so it didn't matter if a single episode contained little to no plot progression. In fact, the narrative bits were usually the parts that I felt most tempted to skip. To Boldly Flee, on the other hand, seems to think of itself as a movie, which is one reason why it was unwatchable even when it first came out. The other reason, of course, is that it's one long session of Doug patting himself on the back.
I mean James is actually a really competent filmmaker behind the camera and he actually knows how to tell a great story if you think about it, unlike Doug, since neither of those things I mentioned applies to him at all.
Doug is basically a random guy who blew up because he made mildly entertaining videos in an era where competition was scarce. James is more like a legit filmmaker who knows he isn't exactly Steven Spielberg or Alfred Hitchcock, but who is determined to make whatever he can make as good as he possibly can.
@@michaelvessel4604 it probably helps that James actually went to film school on top of making short films since he was an actual child, not to mention he's probably watched more movies than most of us ever will. in other words, he knows what he's doing.
You're right if this was just a bunch of friends making a dumb movie for fun it would feel kinda wrong to make fun of this but he takes himself so seriously and that behind the scenes drama ruins any wholsesomeness
I hate the way that *all* those involved talk about it like it was some professional movie shoot, rather than a load of dweebs fuckin around with costumes and camcorder. Doug is a dull-witted egomaniac but the others were also up their own asses about these projects.
@@videogamenostalgia If Doug is gonna pretend these are big movie shoots, he should act like they are and have taken proper care of his supposed friends. Forcing them to work long hours with minimal sleep and extremely abundant lack of care for their wellbeing is not someone who supposedly wants to be seen as a serious film maker does. A one off incident could be forgiven, when it became clear this was the norm and they HAD to do all this or risk losing their sole source of income, its not even a "hey everyone gets together and has fun!" thing
People look back and are embarrassed to have enjoyed these when they were young. You know what's more embarrassing? Doug Walker was a fully grown man when he wrote these and he must've thought they were genuinely good.
Funny enough, for someone who loved to repeat the "Timing!" gag, NC really doesn't understand the structure to a joke, often dragging them out to the point of it being painful.
I live in Chicago right now, and dragging those poor bastards out into what looks like late winter/early spring here wearing those outfits is criminal.
I was a huge fan of Channel Awesome starting in 09. In their later years I was somewhat in denial about having outgrown most of them, particularly Doug himself. But that whole Change the Channel scandal snapped me right out of it. Covering for a sexual predator like that not only made never want to watch or even look at NC videos again, it tainted all of my fond memories. Honestly, these movies, bad as they are, don't bother me nearly as much as knowing what most of the producers had to endure behind the scenes.
Same. I kept watching Doug right up until Change the Channel even though I hadn't really enjoyed his work in a long time, it was some weird sense of loyalty I think. CTC snapped me out of it as well. I used to get kind of cranky at producers in the past who would let their disatisfacion with the site come through in their words and actions- now I just look back and think wow, the problems with CA were really in plain sight and I just ignored them! Ugh. I hope I am more critical of things like aggregate sites, networks and platforms these days and ask more questions about how their talent is treated and compensated. And I'm proud of people like Alison, Holly, Kaylyn and Lewis for speaking up the way they did, they took a lot of shit during CTC but consistently fought in the corner of the former CA producers despite it.
The funny thing is that Doug Walker would direct the other producers to just act like him when he was given them direction working on these movies. Listening to the producers talk about how horrible filming these movies and how bad Doug and Rob Walker treated them on set it is not surprising that many of the producers gave lacklustre performances.
The whole "everyone gets a line, so things drag" thing isn't even that everyone needs a line, it's that Doug, for some reason, LOVES to drag out jokes. I recall in a commentary for his review of Quest for Camelot, he said something along the lines of "he likes jokes that are funny and remain funny now matter how long they go on". He seems to be under the belief that anything he says or writes is funny, in that case, because SO MANY of his jokes drag out, even the ones (Hell, ESPECIALLY the ones) that weren't really funny to begin with. Edit: same goes for his thoughts on shouting and screaming; apparently, to Doug, being loud and shrill automatically means your funny, to the point where he forces other contributors to act like that even when it's out of character for them to do so. Edit2: I seem to recall during other commentaries that Doug would go out of his way to make his stuff look as crappy as possible, like he get really excited over getting a crappy Darth Vader mask for a skit. It makes me wonder, what is he even striving for? Does he want to make actually good content, or does he want to emulate bad content because he thinks that's inherently funny? Edit3: I gotta stop doing this, but yeah, Doug is a bad writer, but he also seems to be under the impression that "misery/suffering = comedy", therefore he deliberately writers the characters in his productions to be either idiots or assholes, which is probably why a lot of the creators that showed up in these movies come off as unlikable. Also, yeah, Ma-Ti was a recurring character/gag, not that it changes anything.
The Nostalgia Critic's funniest moments (i.e. from Doug's performance, rather than just showing something funny from the movie he's reviewing) were little almost throwaway bits where he would enunciate a line with a particularly over-the-top degree of venom or something. I genuinely can't think of a single one of the recurring jokes that was remotely funny the first time around.
To be fair on the creators, Doug basically wrote the exact same character for them to play i.e. his character. Granted most of them were essentially copying his thing to begin with, but the fact they're all written and directed as Nostalgia Critic clones probably didn't do them any favours. Though on the flip side, yeah most of them just could not act. It's funny how Spoony originally wanted to be an actor, yet consistently turned in some pretty turgid performances.
The really funny thing with Spoony is that he could act if given proper direction and is something he’s passionate about. His counter monkey series, the ultima series, there’s a few moments scattered in those where he gets really into something and he feels really genuine and the entire review feels like a special experience because of the passion he musters up. If someone handled his life outside of whatever role he’s doing, he’d be great talent for a lot of projects, but due to various reasons he’s probably too volatile.
In fairness Spoony's choice to be extremely over the top in these movies is clearly deliberate. In his own videos he's nothing like the way he is in the Channel Awesome movies. I assume he was the least embarrassed about doing the constant screaming stuff so Doug zeroed in on him as a good guy to give a lot of silly dialogue/moments to. As other people pointed out they're all just playing different versions of the Nostalgia Critic in the movies.
I actually saw Kickassia twice. I still say that the general idea, a group of friends trying to take over and run a micro-nation, is not only unique, but also the right kind of stupid to still be entertaining. Too bad these guys beat us to it.
I wish I were this lucky. Although I could never finish To Boldly Flee. Even in the height of my Nostalgia Critic fanatism, I could never finish this movie. It is _this_ bad.
I stopped watching Doug after that letter came out. As a film student I felt insulted. We learned on DAY 1 of class that if you can’t pay your crew, you feed them. If you can pay them, then you still feed them. ALWAYS HAVE FOOD AND DRINK ON LOCATION WITH YOU OR GIVE THEM MONEY SO THEY CAN GET THIER OWN FOOD. These people are giving time out of their lives to help make something for you. You need to take care of them and treat them with the upmost respect and kindness. Doug, I appreciate the laughs you gave me in middle school and high school but couldn’t watch you anymore noting that you put your cast and crew through hell, which should never be the case. It hurt to know someone I looked up to didn’t even have moral standards that many other people have when it came to productions. Having correct industry morals is something I’m glad I cherish and respect as I work my way through the industry. All the while treating everyone I work with the upmost dignity they deserve.
I hate how Doug just blames his audience for Kickassia's failure. The trailer made it look like an epic movie but then he says "No that was intentionally misleading to parody misleading trailers." NO! Satire only works if you convey to the audience that it's a comedy right from the start. That's the same equivalent of saying "I intentionally poisoned your food."
I remember being initially disappointed with Kickassia because I expected the tone of the opening credits and the melodramatic acting of Spoony's scenes to be consistent with the whole movie. But no, instead we got a bunch of little DW sketches strung together. Looking back, the movie I was expecting probably wouldn't have been much better.
Lmao who was expecting Kickassia to be a serious fantasy epic? I was a really dumb kid but even I knew it was basically going to be a Nostalgia Critic comedy movie. I don't remember any of the fans expecting a straight-faced movie at the time. I do remember being disappointed by the fact that they were in a really visually interesting part of the country in a great location and decided to shoot 90% of their movie in some guy's kitchen and living room.
I really want to like Doug Walker. When he does vlogs, he seems like a genuinely good guy, very charitable, and overall down to earth. But holy crap, every time I see in giant bold lettering “WRITTEN BY DOUG WALKER AND ROB WALKER!”, I can’t help but notice the man’s ego. He needed his name to be out there. He needs the world to see the truly brilliant mind behind his second-third rate work. He doesn’t want his art to speak for him. He wants to speak for his art.
I get the impression that Doug may suffer from delusions of grandeur, and the "success" of Channel Awesome probably only made it worse. He obviously thought the Nostalgia Critic was going to be a temporary thing he could use as a stepping stone to a legitimate film career, but every time he tries to branch out it becomes increasingly clear that he doesn't have the talent or knowledge to do any better.
@Gary Hall I've read up on change the channel and the most I can find Doug guilty of is incompetence. He just has no clue how to run a professional shoot, but he thinks that he does so he never bothers to learn from his faults. The major problems with channel awesome seem to have been from others and just general incompetence overall.
@@lanceturley7745 I can, to be honest, kinda relate, to the idea of having done the same thing for years, and wanting to move on...Only to learn, when you try, that people only like you when you're being that original character.
i remember back in the day how i used to love these channel awesome movies because of getting to see all these content creators come together and seem to have fun. I got a real family vibe of seeing all these creators together. Of course in the following years, with many of these content creators gradually cutting ties with the group with their own stories, and the all not so awesome documents, we now know things were different behind the scenes, making these movies harder to swallow
This guy wanted to be an actual film maker and he still insisted on making 4 hour movies with ONE camera...I don’t know shit about film but I know that’s not how you do it
As a former film student, I can tell you that 3 cameras minimum is the industry standard. Doug and Rob took film classes, and how they failed to retain this basic basic fact is beyond me.
@gamewizard I One in the middle and one on each side. They form a triangular pattern. The middle one is ideal for wide and medium shots. The other two capture closeups and side angles. This can be utilized not just in movies, but also tv shows like news and sports. When filming a live show for example, Camera 1 (in the middle) can stay put to capture the wideshot that shows everything going on. Then the producer can cut between the other two cameras to get different angles. And when they cut back to camera 1, the other cameras are free to move about and get different shots for the next cut. In movies, several cameras are best to make editing simple. Even if you have the most detailed storyboards imaginable, you're still going to make a lot of new decisions in post. Since editing is really what gives the movie its feel, its best to have several angles and several takes of each scene to create the best effect. And it's because of three or more cameras than a director can use shots from multiple takes without the audience knowing. There's more to it than that, and I know I didn't explain it using the correct terminology, but that's basically it. I hope that answers your question. So for example, when you watch Doug reading all of his lines in the exposition scene in SK with Rob pointing the camera upward from his crotch, you can see why it's amateur hour. The same shot of Doug talking from that one angle is boring. But with at least three cameras, that one scene could have been very different.
I used to work as a camera assistant, cinematographer and in a rental house and one camera doesn't have to be bad, at least on some smaller films, it can be the norm - mainly due to budget constraints. For movies shot mainly on location (not sound-stages) it can also end up being the case, as fitting multiple cameras (and camera crews) is sometimes frankly not possible. And on films with a lot of camera movement, one camera can be more common, as blocking a scene for two cameras flat out wouldn't work (either "oner-shots", but also stuff like Spielberg's moving masters, blocked for one camera). One camera can also allow for more creative lighting, as each shot is lit specifically, instead of just having to use the Master shots lighting (you might want to add some extra fill on the close-up). In the same vein, it can also differ from scene to scene - big action scenes or scenes with lots of extras tend to be shot with multiple cameras from lots of angles, for very obvious reasons, while they might stick to single camera for dialogue. At the same time, some films will use multiple cameras from different angles during dialogue to allow actors to improvise or play off each other (comedies being the prime example, but also scenes like the diner in Heat). Cameras are tools - and (unless dictated by budget), sometimes you need more or less for the job. Saying someone is unprofessional because they use one camera is frankly a lie… as long as they know why they would use one camera. Doug (and Rob) never did. Hearing the breakneck speed they had to work at, the huge amount of people and not great production values (nor artistic ambition) means that these were shows that would have benefited GREATLY from multiple cameras.
@@aaronsarchive82 Because they're greedy fucksticks. They didn't want to buy more cameras, food/drinks, permits, hotel rooms, plane tickets for their foreign reviewers or more crew member salaries. They have a few whales like mobile gaming has so they pocket as much money as possible while making sure they do just the bare minimum to keep them. All you have to do is look at their "game show" which supposedly has a budget of $100,000 but looks like it was made for $1,000. What do you expect though? I also love the story where Doug argued with Lindsey about shot 180 shot. Doug didn't know what that was and said it doesn't matter. I think Doug suffers from double think and cognitive dissonance, simultaneously.
@@gabrielledebourg2487 I wasn't "lying" about what I said. I was trained by professional cameraman, and I was just explaining what I was taught. This was nearly 15 years ago at this point though, so the technology used has changed dramatically, and that means the methods used would be different too. I imagine with the right equipment, it would be possible to pull off an entire movie with one camera, but with a cast the size of the CA crew, it would involve a lot if them standing around with nothing to do while the Walkers set up a shot several times, change batteries and usb drives, etc. It would still be cumbersome b/c they didn't plan everything out. And that's really the main issue, the lack of planning and tact that went into these. Online videos or not, you basically have two film school rejects directing 15-20ish people hoping they can just work out any mistakes in post or explain anything that goes wrong with the term "plot hole." I appreciate your modern perspective, Gabrielle. A lot has changed in the digital world.
Honestly, from what I’ve heard regarding these films, I think the biggest problem they have is the fact that the people behind the film’s production didn’t really seem open to taking advice or suggestions. Another issue is the fact that every contributor was encouraged to basically ‘Act like Doug’ despite the fact their characters were far different than the Nostalgia Critic. Also, I’m pretty sure Doug and Rob don’t really know much about directing a movie. Edit: In retrospect, a lot of what's happened, and a lot of what I've said, has been because I got caught up in the rage and anger stemming from the controversy, so much so that I wanted to see Channel Awesome's reputation completely fall apart. That was uncalled for.
Yeah, just looking back on the Good Witch gag in this video feels so surreal because Linkara isn't the type of reviewer whose character mocks being 'good' as a weakness. The guy's a Star Trek fan who has gone on several tangents about how we need to bring hope back to comic books and about how there's a purpose to showing things ideolistically even if they're not 'realistic' enough, because he's seen where creators trying to go dark for the sake of going dark goes and it's very clear that 'compassion is not weakness' is an idea he genuinely believes in. Hard cut to Doug writing his character into the circle to mock the Good Witch for not being threatening enough. Instead, shouldn't this gag be something like Linkara tries to give a big speech about the nature of heroism and then after the Good Witch shoots him down, THEN Doug or someone tries to attack and it leads to the fight scene or whatever? Like something actually focused on these characters doing things they're known for?
@@dracocrusher I'm curious why you brought up his Star Trek fandom. Is that connected to the rest of what you were talking about, like you think Trek taught him to value heroism?
@@adamdavis1648 Because Star Trek is clearly something he's passionate about and TNG might actually be one of the most insanely optimistic shows I've ever seen. Sure, conflict still exists and there's death and screwed up situations, but the entire run is very much all about how talking through problems with diplomacy and dignity is the best solution. I don't think the show necessarily taught him to value heroism, but I really do think it has had a big impact on him overall. Like maybe I'm reaching, but I feel like that type of situation where Picard walks into a room and is able to sit people down and work through things is like the height of badassery for him because when he makes his own content it feels like that's the type of situation he tries to replicate, right? A lot of his stories end with situations like that where he's able to shut someone down and give a big dramatic speech that gets to the heart of things and solves the matter. Because that's like the height of good-ness in a sense, right? Being able to end things without even having to fight. Just pure speculation on my part, but I think it does make a lot of sense overall. So it's just super bizarre to see him be like "Oh, you can't use force? Guess you can't stop us, you dummy dum good witch!" because that kind-of feels like the exact opposite of what this type of stuff would make me think he believes, right?
"Erosion of good will" That phrase nailed it. When all that faded away in 2018, fans began to view these films in a new light, and that left them to stand on their own merits. There are none.
Quinton Reviews said that this is what he called a “lore movie”, in which the only appeal of it is playing to a small group of hyper fans with lots of fan service and references that the writing and production quality are far less important. Movies like this work ONLY because of the novelty and fun of the setup and not the execution. If you take that away or taint it, you are left with NOTHING.
One thing I think bears mentioning is how poorly designed the original TGWTG website was. Like to find anything you had to navigate this ever branching maze of dropdown menus, and if your mouse cursor slipped at any time you'd have to start all over again. So they had all these producers come to do these movies working for "exposure", but unless they were in the top tiers already they were almost impossible to find on the site. Like I remember quite a few times seeing producers doing cameos in other people's videos and thinking "They look pretty cool, I should check their stuff out," and then being utterly baffled as to were to even start to look for their content.
Mm. I remember YEARS ago asking Marzgurl on twitter if she’d gotten accidentally kicked off the site because I couldn’t find her near as I could tell. Turned out she was still on there at the time, just buried in a dropdown somewhere. Meanwhile, NC stuff was relatively easy to find, always front and centre. (which from later stuff we know, was probably 100% intentional)
"Why would Film Brain and Spoony intentionally act badly?" It seems pretty clear that they're intentionally hamming it up as a joke because it's a comedy. Just look at the guy next to Film Brain, it's obviously a bit.
Dracocrusher As a Spoony Fan (or as much as one can be nowadays since all he does anymore is livestream due to his physical and mental health combined with apathy) he would definitely ham it up, it's part of his character. Even the times he's legit overreacted or gotten angry irl were incorporated into said character to make it hammier, such as his "BETRAYAL" joke that originated from actual anger.
@@Tundra0stalker It's not really that uncommon at all, honestly. If you want to be funny then you need to act exaggerated, and most Channel Awesome reviewers were trying to follow the trend Doug set, so a lot of them acted exaggerated for comedic effect while still rooting their thoughts in their actual opinions. Even people like Linkara, who aren't as loud or crazy, ham it up a lot in how they perform to make their jokes work better.
Spoony definitely had talent, but boy did he fall hard. Hasn't made an edited review in 5 years, now just spends his time on Twitter complaining how depressed he is, then telling everyone who tries to help to fuck off. His house in in the middle of being repossessed and he still complains almost daily that turning on a camera and streaming is too difficult.
Yeah it's a shame that screaming in a weird way and contorting your face like you're suffering from a severe disability is just annoying rather than funny.
@@videogamenostalgia You can't deny it's a way to do comedy, not everybody's going to try to hit that subtle well-timed rhythmic sweet spot of insults like George Carlin or something, sometimes you just have to get excited and act big. It's fine if you hate it, but not everyone can pull off the super calm dry wit angle, but it's not always the best approach, either.
It always made me roll my eyes to see Doug Walker complain about Christopher Nolan. Say what you want about Nolan and his films, but the man's got critical praise, Oscars, a member of the Order of the British Empire, and directed a trilogy of game changing superhero movies, one of which got put in the Library of Congress last year. All Doug Walker's got as a filmmaker is a trilogy of progressively more embarrassing vanity projects that most of his cast hated working on. Congrats, Doug, you're a less self aware Tommy Wiseau.
The world might be shitty and unfair but I’m forever happy that Lindsay Ellis is doing way better, both in terms of numbers but also respect (not to mention being a published author and working with PBS) I would even argue she’s doing better than Doug (certainly in the respect department) but of course Doug will always have a large fanbase and my feelings aside it is a bit like comparing apples and oranges
honestly, there are people from channel awesome that i still watch like linkara, bennett the sage, angryjoe and sf debris. i think each of them are great content creators in their on right, outside of the LPers like woolie vs they're the ones i watch constantly.
Lindsay Ellis' content post-CA is honestly better than any of her Nostalgia Chick stuff. She is easily my favorite video essayist on TH-cam. And Todd in the Shadows is easily my favorite music reviewer.
Say what you want about Doug and CA, it seems like they had a decent eye for talent. His own stuff has aged terribly but a lot of the people around him have gone on to be pretty good content creators. I guess I'm glad Doug's early success was around to give them that boost, I certainly wouldn't know who any of them are if not for the NC. But given all the drama behind the scenes I'd imagine they probably have mixed opinions on whether he was a net positive or negative influence on their lives/careers.
My experience with Nostalgia Critic and Channel Awesome was similar to a lot of folks. I first heard about his videos back in 2012 and binged his work even, the 3 anniversary movies, and I loved them; Doug was funny to me, he had a neat personality, and I was hooked. From 2012 on up I was a fan of nostalgia critic and while I knew of the websites he had and the other content creators, I never bothered to check them out and only knew of them through his crossovers. However it was around 2016 to 2017 when my interests in Dougs material as the Critic began to wane, his skits were fun in most parts but it felt like he wasn't hitting the mark and any attempts he had at those skits felt like a miss more than a hit. I soon stopped watching his videos altogether because he began reviewing movies that felt less "Nostalgic" and more modern and one of the videos that turned me away from Doug was when he celebrated his 10th anniversary episode. I assumed he would try to do some skit with the other content creators (mind you I was unaware of the mass exodus that happened on the channel) or that he would probably do something like have a skit where he goes down memory lane to see how far he came, maybe even review a transformers movie since that was the subject that started his career, alas nothing happened and he reviewed a bad movie that felt more like another cog in the wheel of production instead of a celebration. After learning about the Not So Awesome Document and what went on behind the scenes, that was another blow that turned me further away and seeing how far things were going and how BAD it was getting, I have sworn off Nostalgia Critic altogether and haven't watched an episode of his since 2017-2018 Instead I watch Linkara and i'm much more entertained and feel like i'm getting what I subscribed for. Ps. Lewis does a better job at doing storylines and making a small budget story work, case in point. Linkara's storylines + the 10th anniversary movie
WOW, honestly, that's more or less how i was introduced to NC and CA. And it ended the same way as it did for you too, you pretty much hit the nail on the head for my experences. XD I actually did meet Doug and Brad... kinda regret it in hindsight. But jokes on Brad, i gave him my VHS copy of "Grim Prairie Tales", so he has to suffer knowing he owns it. XD I did also meet Doug's dad too, he's the only one i don't regret meeting. My one regret is originally creating one of my own characters in my videos being more or less a Alt. Universe version of the Cinema Snob, only he covers Anime. Though i decided to make him his own character (Who gets REALLY pissed whenever CA, Brad, Cinema Snob, or just the whole thing is brought up), so least there's that.
remember when doug walker thought he was so clever and funny for thinking up "what if it's a wonderful life, but people's lives really ARE better" only to find out the god damn fairly oddparents beat him to it
I would say Beavis and Butthead beat them to it. There were around long before Fairly Odd Parents and it was during a christmas episode where everyone's lives were better without Butt-Head.
@@vt_973 Most tropes are older than we think. Odds are that when you subvert a trope or cliche, somebody at some point has already done it. The only thing to do is add your own spin to it.
Oof, I found out about Nostalgia Critic when I was first starting college around 2010 and loved him. You were 14 and five years later you cringe at the same age I discovered him... What was my excuse?
@@RossMcIntyre I'm not gunna lie, I loved it too. Me and the roomate have a theatrical poster of the pink ranger in our living room. Now we just need Ivan Ooze or something...
@@RossMcIntyre As long as you're not hurting anyone and no one's being hurt to make what you like, you should feel free to like anything at any age. It's too bad that second prerequisite wasn't true of these movies or Channel Awful in general.
TLDR: Linkara did a much better job respecting the producers who he worked with in ‘A Voice From The Dark’. No, seriously, look it up. It’s on Linkara’s channel. It’s fantastic! Edit: In retrospect, a lot of what's happened, and a lot of what I've said, has been because I got caught up in the rage and anger stemming from the controversy, so much so that I wanted to see Channel Awesome's reputation completely fall apart. That was uncalled for. I shouldn't have said that.
Yep. I mean, it being audio, he didn't have to deal with lots of the issues that Doug fucked up on, but he still did better. He watched episodes of everyone's shows, in order to get their styles down, he gave heavy freedom to improv or come up with their own jokes if they thought the ones he'd written didn't fit, and he even changed the script on a couple occasions to better suit someone's comedic style, whereas Doug was infamous for forcing everyone into HIS one mold. That's important, because the whole appeal of these crossover movies should be ""Here's a bunch of people who are funny (to a certain audience) together, watch them play off each other", but that doesn't work without room to improv. The whole appeal should be in watching these different comedic minds play off each other, but when they have a tight script, it can't work.
I remember ERod (aka Blockbuster Buster) describing his experience working with Linkara on A Voice From the Dark VS working with Doug for the ultimately cancelled 10th anniversary movie. With Doug it was literally three messages. 1: "Hey do you want to be in the anniversary?" 2: "Okay cool here's the script." 3: "The movie has been cancelled." Meanwhile Linkara kept him actively involved all the way through, was *regularly* asking for feedback on how he was handling ERod's character, like, was he in character? Did he have his own ideas for what he would like to do? He also apparently invited every producer who was involved with the project to a group chat so that *everyone* could work out what best to do. So in short, whereas Doug basically just wrote a thing and had everyone do the thing he wrote while taking basically no input from his actors, Linkara genuinely did try to make it a collaborative effort that would represent everyone in it well.
The difference between Doug and James Rolfe is that Doug lacks self awareness. James Rolfe is completely aware that he's famous for saying fuck loudly over video games and in all his other content he's an extremely humble and knowledgeable person Whenever I see Doug all I see is the Nostalgia Critic. He's like a living cartoon character who's content hasn't evolved in over 15 years. Which is honestly impressive.
It's relative. the time you were online as a teen is gonna be the "early internet" to you- for example someone who came of age in the early 00s probably thinks of that time as early internet. But the generation who came of age in the 2010s are gonna be too young to remember the internet back then so the 2010s is now their early internet, etc etc
I think "early internet video era" is a more accurate term. Around when the NC got started is also around when it first became a feasible career uploading fairly lengthy videos - reviews, vlogs, Let's Plays, whatever - to the Internet. (Things like TH-cam getting rid of the 10-minute limit are milestones along the way). Internet culture, even Internet video culture (with stuff like flash animation) goes back much further than that but we didn't really see "facecam" video content like this start catching on until around like 2007-2008.
If you overlook the inaccuracies like Brad Jones siding with the other content creators and Rob Walker making things better in the end, then Kickassia is a great meta commentary on the Walkers' management of Channel Awesome.
My favorite thing about 'Kickassia' is that it made me discover The Cinema Snob. Brad Jones' acting really stood up from the rest and I was immediately intrigued. He gradually became my favorite person on the internet after that. That ended in 2019 unfortunately, the elephant in the room just became too unbearable for me. I'm not going to lie, that was a bummer...
This video is surprisingly a good video to inform future filmmakers. I have seen these movies but your points about the basic story and technical issues are right. It’s a good showing for future filmmakers
I kind of enjoy both 'Surburban Knights' and 'To Boldly Flee' in the same way that I enjoy 'The Room', they're complete garbage but it's fascinating to see how someone as egotistical as the Walker brothers or Tommy Wiseau genuinely believing they've made their magnum opus, and yet it falters in almost everyway humanly possible. (Though I'll give To Boldly Flee some credit, I quite like I'm a Distraction as a pardoy song.)
Suburban Knights was the only one that I kinda liked at the time, and even it was interminable. It was enjoyable enough for its central conceit: "Watch your favorite content creators LARPing really badly in the woods!" That said, its enjoyment factor is completely ruined by the revelations from the document. The fun of it was imagining that they were all a group of friends hanging out and goofing off for a few days--a vacation disguised as a miniseries project. Now we know for certain that this wasn't even close to the case. To Boldly Flee is still the worst, since it had the pretense of being a story with something to say rather than simply being an overlong sketch comedy strung together with a dubious premise.
Wow this takes me back. I had just graduated High School when I started watching these guys. They used to be so funny, and there are a few episodes I still go back to that make me laugh. But you're right. This format would NOT work now. Kind of makes you wonder what made it work at the time for people.
I never heard of the Room before Nostalgia Critic and I will credit him with introducing me to that long before James Franco. However now I only remember the movie and none of his review of it.
I could gladly go forever without ever hearing "Well on the other hand it looks like they're having a good time making it, at least" again. With "movies" this horrible, it doesn't make it any less of a waste of time for me knowing that the actors had fun making them. If anything I think they should've had less fun and instead put more effort into making the movies good. I mean look at the "fight" scenes in Suburban Knights: it's literally just a bunch of manchildren and womanchildren having fun, instead of working to make good fight scenes.
"If you drive through your neighborhood, and you see this (Doug & Co.), you should think about how quickly I should move my kids away from them" Now THAT made me laugh.
Your intro hit home hard. Well spoken. I always used to think why do I don't like young adult films and books anymore and it's true our brains grow up. Things we liked younger we don't connect with anymore.
I think the most telling elements of people's distaste for the Kickassia project was Nostalgia Chick, who at all times looked blazed out of her mind or at best, that she couldn't give less of a shit what was going on and Phelous, who's usual brand of sarcasm and condescending joke seemed like they were coming from an all too real place, as opposed to a style of humor. I remember noticing this when I first saw the movie and thought it was kind of odd but upon learning about all the behind the scenes issues, it makes too much sense... and admittedly, kinda makes it funnier.
As someone who was in high school back when this whole thing started, Channel Awesome's rise and fall feels like a perfect parallel to growing up and becoming a jaded adult. That being said, after Kickassia, I didn't even bother with Suburban Knights and To Boldly Flee.
if doug didn't treat his fellow creators so poorly, i could watch these movies as well as nostagia critic's regular content with the mindset that it's not good, but i like it anyway. but knowing the mistreatment people suffered at the hands of people who thought they knew what they were doing and became complacent because of that makes this whole thing actually unwatchable.
The films are pretty comparable to like a low budget version of the Friedberg/Seltzer trilogy. I don’t know, they share a ton of similarities in structure.
Okay...I'm going to have to call bullcrap on that. Even if there's a comparison to be made with the referential ethos, they're NOTHING alike in structure or storytelling. Altho...the poor souls in Seltzer/berg crap _probably_ were actually paid...
Channel Awesome is such a cautionary tale. Thank goodness Blip died when it did, since now most of my old stuff is lost. Never forget that content on the internet is like pee in a swimming pool - once it's in there, it's in there. I wish everyone the best in their endeavors, but the past won't ever be forgotten now. Glad my knee is ok tho
I think that’s only a coincidence. Several other characters were considered during the script writing. Paw was originally going to be King Graham from the King’s Quest series.
I'm going to be honest, I had fond memories of Kickassia and Suburban Knights. They were badly made, but they were entertaining and it was fun imagining these reviewers as a big happy family having fun together. The "Not So Awesome" document pretty much ruined that rosy mindset for me, and it's impossible for me to look back at these films without that tainting the experience for me.
Frightening Volleyball Yeah you just know she locked herself in a bathroom crying for several hours. . . . Shit, that joke is distasteful as that is true.
I'm very glad that I outgrew Channel Awesome stuff early on. There were a lot of things he got wrong in reviews and it annoyed me, and eventually it dawned on teenage me that a lot of people who disliked things had no reason why beyond 'Doug said it's bad'. It made me realize that reviewers are unreliable and people often don't form their own opinions, just echo other people's, which in turn made me more likely to give things a chance that were critically panned because I didn't want to be unfair to media. Through sheer incompetence, CA instilled basic media literacy in me.
I agree. I also used to enjoy NC. However, about a year before #ChangeTheChannel, I began to lose interest. Also, I watch videos like this to remind myself why I outgrew NC in the first place.
Hindsight's a funny thing. It's easy to forget but there was another anniversary special Doug made before he started making these movies. The "TGWTG Year One Brawl". A goofy little video that was only 20 minutes long! I really think that if Doug tempered his ambitions and just made anniversary movies that were like, 40 minutes long at most. They would have turned out so much better. ...Also a smaller scale project would have likely put less stress on its staff and crew and would have made things less... *controversial.*
If I were writing the screenplay, I would have designed the characters to match their distinct personae on the website. I would have had Phelous be just plain odd, Cinema Snob be a snob, etc.
So would I, but that would require watching their material, respecting your colleagues, and being able to write multiple kinds of humor or at least take input from other people. Things Walker cannot do.
To me this was the beginning of the end for the Nostalgia Critic being tolerable, it's when he first truly embraced that all he wants to do is play dress-up.
I genuinely felt sick to my stomach when I heard about someone's knee being "bashed in" and how they couldn't get medical attention until after they signed some form, which knowing Doug was probably a misspelled note saying "don't sue us" written on a ketchup stained napkin
Oh no, if it's contractual stuff you know it was Michaud drafting up disturbingly air-tight documents to make them as unaccountable as possible. This is the man who owns the Critic brand after all.
It never ceases to amaze me how so many people with professed love for film and filmmaking all, universally, can demonstrate any knowledge or skill of the actual craft on almost any level
20:25 I remember multiple instances of Linkara talking about how much he fucking hated doing this scene just off the top of my head, and I feel like that says something considering he was one of the "better treated" producers...
A good antidote to all this is Linkara's audio play A Voice From The Dark. It's a much more thoughtful look at... yes, really. It's _thoughtful_. It has a lot of subtext about how jaded the former producers are, how much abuse there was behind the scenes, and how despite everything they do miss getting to hang out together. Plus, it's a much better story. Not that it's _hard_.
Suburban Knights was my introduction to Channel Awesome, and by extension everyone associated with that site. I used to think it was a “so bad it’s good” kinda deal. Like, I thought they all knew full well it was bad and that was the joke. Yes they made a bad product but they had fun making it. Again, that’s what I thought. But after all the #ChangeTheChannel drama, hearing how nobody had a particularly fun experience (and even less so for To Boldly Flee), knowing that Doug honestly thinks he made a good product... it just soured the whole thing for me.
What's always fascinated me about Doug Walker is that he is so unbelievably blind to his hypocrisy when he reviews things it's almost like he's talking about himself and his failures as a Movie Maker in one of the biggest forms of ironic coping I've ever seen from somebody.
To be 100% honest, Kickassia never bothered me and it still kind of doesn't. There's a sense of ammeter, early internet fun behind it, like watching a home movie made by your friends. If you didn't like it then, you won't like it now. It's not perfect, but that's fine. But after that, there's no excuse. Like he could have stepped up your game and he never did. It was too much Doug and it became much more apparent as time went on. And his attitude only got worse too.
I have a little nostalgia (hur hur) for Kickassia, but I can't sit through the whole thing nowadays, then I never finished Suburban Knights or even started To Boldly Flee. I think there's still novelty in the fact that every primary Channel Awesome contributor got together to film some dumb home movies, like this was the good ol' days before Spoony got kicked off the site, before LordKat started openly harassing his former coworkers on his podcast, before Blistered Thumbs died, before Gamer Gate, before the Chez Apocalypse and JesuOtaku video game scams, before we knew just how terrible CA really was the whole time, and before the Mister Metokur retrospective. To Boldly Flee is the worst one. It's utterly unwatchable, because there's literally nothing original about it, but it kinda stands as the last hurrah before everything really fell apart. At least, that's how it all comes across to me as a former fan, now just a distant observer since childhood.
I used to have a fondness for these movies, not because I thought they were good, but because it appeared that it was a bunch of friends having a good time making something silly. However once it was revealed that these movies were hell to make and everyone got taken advantage of, any kind of appeal that they would have for me vanished.
Hello I'm the Rosstalgia Critic, I remembered these movies and now I long for the void.
Comfortably numb
Have you checked out 'A Voice From the Dark'? It's the former CA producers again, but they do it much better.
These movies are obviously horrible, but you're sighing, bitchy review style almost makes me want to defend them. Try to be less passive aggressive, or reserve it for emphasis so you don't come across as so grating. You sound like a girl going too far excoriating an ex-boyfriend.
I think Lindsay Ellis and cinema snob could make a way better movie, I guess Lindsay bus a better writer and I think Cinema snob use to work in B movies, but more importantly in a personal level they are more self aware. However even if it was impossible to make a good movie with all that creators, is Doug ego that fucked up everything.
@@robbyrobot3303 uuuh, what exactly is passive agressive about it? it's a full on attack and rightfully so.. so much that has come out of this channel awesome debacle is just unbareably annoying horseshit
"I used to like Channel Awesome, but boy was it garbage looking back" has become a whole new genre of TH-cam video and I'm here for it.
All it need is now is for the Nostalgia Critic to watch and make fun of his old video like he did to movies
@@romulusnuma116 His old vids are better than the new ones tho.
These movies are what the Avengers movies could have been if no thought or effort was put into them.
@@romulusnuma116 He did NCs on the trilogy in a DVD exclusive, so I think you might have already gotten your wish.
@@TheMemeRepository The monkey's paw curls
part of me wants to make a disaster artist style movie about the making of these movies, another part of me wants to make a dark gritty logan-esque fourth channel awesome movie where all the internet reviewers are all old and grizzled and have to come back together for a deep psychological journey that critics will describe as "confusing" and "bad." doug is not there.
I’d pay to see that
I would kill for the opportunity of that existing.
Linkara kind of did this with the audio play 'The Voice from the Dark' which has him and other former Channel Awesome producers investigate a haunted house and the whole reason Linkara did this was because he wanted to recapture the comradery of the anniversary films without actually reliving the horrors. It's actually pretty good. The story is interesting with a good mystery and the production is smaller but more effective. Plus there's no Doug to be found.
I picture an elaborate setup by Johnny Knoxville and the crew to put him and his ilk ln front of a parade long line up of sugared up third graders punching them in the nards.
@@joelmole3157 Apparently Linkara actually bothered to get input from the other producers to get their characters right.
Geee, respect for your collaborators, what a novel idea.
As someone who does watch Film Brain's videos, it's always noticeable in his crossovers with Doug that Doug has never watched a single one of his videos. Film Brain is a sarcastic, glass-half-empty snarker in his videos. He's insanely negative about everything. He never has that happy-go-lucky lap dog persona in his own videos. Doug just straight up gives him an entirely different character.
Sad thing is that personality transitioned into other crossovers like his The Spirit review with Linkara where he kidnapped the guy and acted like a complete nutcase and his crossover with Nash where he reviewed The Punisher and cane off as an overly innocent man child who doesn’t know any better
It's like Doug looked at Film Brain and said "You're from the UK, you're the Quirky Brit!"
@@mrcritical6751 At least the other crossovers are good enough. I really like the ones with Todd in the Shadows and Rap Critic
i just imagine them calling for a break and film brain just goes off to smoke and look forlornly into the suburban middle distance and wonder how his life turned out this way
He's not really overly negative now, mainly he reviews current films these days and he's genuinely a good critic and gives each movie a fair shot. I think he's benefited a lot from Channel Awesome being long in the rear view mirror of his film critic career, because let's face it, there was no room on CA for anyone who wanted to do actual film analysis who didn't also have some sort of gimmick, e.g. Lindsay Ellis managed it because she reviewed 'girly films', even Dan Olson was there for a while with his weird puppet 'persona' that he has long ago abandoned. (2 more creators who have benefited hugely from exiting CA and never looking back!) Otherwise on CA you could basically go through movies point by point riffing on them, negatively only of course, and pretend you hated everything, and that was all there was. Doug and Rob didn't know any of their creators' work but it was most obvious with Film Brain because of the super creepy persona they wrote for him.
You know what's funny? In his "Is parody dead?" editorial, Doug said that parodies should not just be references and that they all need to be a clear understanding of what you are spoofing. And yet here he is, making random pop culture references for the sake of making them.
The Channel Awesome movies portrayed the Nostalgia Critic as a terrible boss whom everyone hated. That was prophetic.
you fell for all that nonsense? Tell me exactly what he did wrong?
Doug has a huge ego people with egos usually don’t notice how shitty they are and just assume whatever they make is great.
@@wingwaabuddha Honestly, there are times where the apologists are worse than what he did, if that was possible.
They all chose their e fame over their dignity tbf
@@wingwaabuddha well for one thing he voted for their HR person to be let go because she took a day off after surgery
Every scene with Justin Carmichael (Jewwario) is "bruh" moment in hindsight now...especially in suburban knights.
At least he was courteous enough to off himself
@@georgekostaras dying is easy compared to coming clean and facing the consequences. He took the cowards way out...though his suicide makes a lot more sense in the context of someone who knew his "Mr Rogers of the internet" image was unraveled and he was going to be found out for what he was
I still can't believe he was outed all because channel awesome was incompetent enough to not blur out his name enough
I felt so fucking betrayed. He seemed like such a sweet, genuine guy. Then it was not only revealed he was a rapist but that the higher-ups at Channel Awesome kept it quiet.
@@BlackBeWhite2k7 I thought his suicide pertained to money issues? I think his widow mentioned it.
As someone who worked on a short film partly shot out in the Moroccan desert, the idea that Walker expected people to work without food or water (especially in those conditions) is frankly insane.
ayyy no pasaran mate.
My username refers to a surrealist poet from the Bretonian core who fought against Franco in the Catalan Revolution with the POUM
You deserve a medal for sitting through these movies as an adult. Good video. Looking forward to part two.
I'm looking forward to part 2 as well. I liked NC and watched him quite a lot back in the day. However, once kickassia (or whatever the title was) hit, I was stunned how goofy and cringey it has become. It seemed like a bunch of disorganised fools making one bad joke after another. I was kinda glad that James Rolfe didn't play a big part in any of those shameless movies. Sometimes I still watch AVGN due to my video game nostalgia, but NC and TGWTG is dead to me.
@Doctor Trill Bread lol impaired enough
Phelous looks like he’s just absolutely done with it in every single scene he’s in. I don’t blame him.
I think Doug was trying to invoke the premise he brought up in his Top 11 Batman TAS Episodes: that putting a bunch of beloved characters in a scene together and letting them work off each other results in great comedy. Here are four reasons why he couldn't execute that premise properly:
1. The characters are only equally strong to an audience that knows them all well. Most TGWTG viewers never watched absolutely every show.
2. The characters are only strong in their own right if they're allowed to be themselves, instead of being forced into the mold of their shrieking half-witted director.
3. These characters aren't really characters at all. They're reviewers. They all have quirks, but quirks don't automatically make characters distinct from the people who perform them.
4. There are too many characters. The human brain can only get to know so many personalities on screen at once.
Also, Phelous and MarzGurl were the worst performers in these movies, other than Doug.
Yeeep. Like, here's the thing: The idea of just getting two or more comedians in a room and letting them play off each other CAN make for awesome comedy. It's literally the premise of a Comedians In Cars Getting Coffee: Just getting two or more funny people in the same location, and letting them play off each other. But, that only works with improv, not tightly-scripted productions like this. It could have worked if he'd, among other things, actually watched their shows to get an idea of their comedy and how it differs from his, and given them a LOT more to improv and come up with their own lines. The whole POINT of this sort of thing is to get a bunch of people that are understood as funny in a room, then let them work off each other, but that doesn't work when they're working from a script, written by someone who has only one comedic mold, and not given rom to improv.
I’m still bafflingly impressed to this day that “DanganRonpa V3: Killing Harmony” has 22 total characters and yet I can remember each of them by name. I consider that game, and the series as a whole as a damn good example of ensemble character writing. Lol
I can dismiss #1, 3, and 4 because I did keep up with most of the reviewers at the time and enjoyed their content. In other words, I was the target audience. I can't forgive #2, though, as it invalidates the whole point.
Yeah. When Batman TAS uses multiple characters, there's not too much. Or when there is too much, like the court episode, all the villains are still entertaining
I agree with you except for one thing : The appeal of these aniversary specials was the big crossover with everyone from the site. The huge problem is that they are all reducted to an often bad gimmick because he didn't watch any of the cast's work (except maybe Cinema Snob's).
I wish Doug was more devoted to his role as link and just not talked for the whole thing
But then it would be a film of him grunting, oh god
Doug grunting for 4 hours might just be better than ‘To Boldly Flee’.
well EXCUUUUUUSE MEEEEEE princess.
As Link 🤔
I feel it is important to add that these "movies", if you can even call them that, were all released episodically in 20 minute segments. This probably explains why the pace is so herky-jerky and why everything feels like a bad internet sketch.
I wouldn't even call the first two movies. They were extensions of the one year anniversary video: a novelty act where a bunch of people got together and acted silly. The stories were completely irrelevant, so it didn't matter if a single episode contained little to no plot progression. In fact, the narrative bits were usually the parts that I felt most tempted to skip. To Boldly Flee, on the other hand, seems to think of itself as a movie, which is one reason why it was unwatchable even when it first came out. The other reason, of course, is that it's one long session of Doug patting himself on the back.
I think I wouldn’t have liked these as much if I’d seen them in “movie” format. Definitely “better” in small doses.
But it is a bad internet sketch 😂
In a way, James Rolfe’s content was always more mature than Doug’s. Which is pretty astonishing when you think about it.
The guy that makes shit jokes is more mature than Doug. To think about it indeed.
James is angry as a gimmick but he’s personally a guy who loves his medium. That’s what really sets him apart from Doug
I mean James is actually a really competent filmmaker behind the camera and he actually knows how to tell a great story if you think about it, unlike Doug, since neither of those things I mentioned applies to him at all.
Doug is basically a random guy who blew up because he made mildly entertaining videos in an era where competition was scarce. James is more like a legit filmmaker who knows he isn't exactly Steven Spielberg or Alfred Hitchcock, but who is determined to make whatever he can make as good as he possibly can.
@@michaelvessel4604 it probably helps that James actually went to film school on top of making short films since he was an actual child, not to mention he's probably watched more movies than most of us ever will. in other words, he knows what he's doing.
You're right if this was just a bunch of friends making a dumb movie for fun it would feel kinda wrong to make fun of this but he takes himself so seriously and that behind the scenes drama ruins any wholsesomeness
He takes himself so seriously, yet doesn't have the skills to back it up!
-_-
I hate the way that *all* those involved talk about it like it was some professional movie shoot, rather than a load of dweebs fuckin around with costumes and camcorder. Doug is a dull-witted egomaniac but the others were also up their own asses about these projects.
@@videogamenostalgia If Doug is gonna pretend these are big movie shoots, he should act like they are and have taken proper care of his supposed friends. Forcing them to work long hours with minimal sleep and extremely abundant lack of care for their wellbeing is not someone who supposedly wants to be seen as a serious film maker does. A one off incident could be forgiven, when it became clear this was the norm and they HAD to do all this or risk losing their sole source of income, its not even a "hey everyone gets together and has fun!" thing
People look back and are embarrassed to have enjoyed these when they were young. You know what's more embarrassing? Doug Walker was a fully grown man when he wrote these and he must've thought they were genuinely good.
In fairness Internet humour was mostly on this kind of level between around 2007-2011.
Even more embarrassing, I was 21 when Kickassia came out and enjoyed it. Thankfully that was the end of Thatguywiththeglasses for me
Funny enough, for someone who loved to repeat the "Timing!" gag, NC really doesn't understand the structure to a joke, often dragging them out to the point of it being painful.
It's because he likes people to every response possible until there's nothing more to say.
I live in Chicago right now, and dragging those poor bastards out into what looks like late winter/early spring here wearing those outfits is criminal.
I was a huge fan of Channel Awesome starting in 09. In their later years I was somewhat in denial about having outgrown most of them, particularly Doug himself. But that whole Change the Channel scandal snapped me right out of it. Covering for a sexual predator like that not only made never want to watch or even look at NC videos again, it tainted all of my fond memories. Honestly, these movies, bad as they are, don't bother me nearly as much as knowing what most of the producers had to endure behind the scenes.
Same. I kept watching Doug right up until Change the Channel even though I hadn't really enjoyed his work in a long time, it was some weird sense of loyalty I think. CTC snapped me out of it as well. I used to get kind of cranky at producers in the past who would let their disatisfacion with the site come through in their words and actions- now I just look back and think wow, the problems with CA were really in plain sight and I just ignored them! Ugh. I hope I am more critical of things like aggregate sites, networks and platforms these days and ask more questions about how their talent is treated and compensated. And I'm proud of people like Alison, Holly, Kaylyn and Lewis for speaking up the way they did, they took a lot of shit during CTC but consistently fought in the corner of the former CA producers despite it.
Inspiring! This TH-cam Reviewer Watched All the Channel Awesome Movies and Somehow Retained His Will to Live
Bold assumption
The funny thing is that Doug Walker would direct the other producers to just act like him when he was given them direction working on these movies. Listening to the producers talk about how horrible filming these movies and how bad Doug and Rob Walker treated them on set it is not surprising that many of the producers gave lacklustre performances.
The whole "everyone gets a line, so things drag" thing isn't even that everyone needs a line, it's that Doug, for some reason, LOVES to drag out jokes. I recall in a commentary for his review of Quest for Camelot, he said something along the lines of "he likes jokes that are funny and remain funny now matter how long they go on". He seems to be under the belief that anything he says or writes is funny, in that case, because SO MANY of his jokes drag out, even the ones (Hell, ESPECIALLY the ones) that weren't really funny to begin with.
Edit: same goes for his thoughts on shouting and screaming; apparently, to Doug, being loud and shrill automatically means your funny, to the point where he forces other contributors to act like that even when it's out of character for them to do so.
Edit2: I seem to recall during other commentaries that Doug would go out of his way to make his stuff look as crappy as possible, like he get really excited over getting a crappy Darth Vader mask for a skit. It makes me wonder, what is he even striving for? Does he want to make actually good content, or does he want to emulate bad content because he thinks that's inherently funny?
Edit3: I gotta stop doing this, but yeah, Doug is a bad writer, but he also seems to be under the impression that "misery/suffering = comedy", therefore he deliberately writers the characters in his productions to be either idiots or assholes, which is probably why a lot of the creators that showed up in these movies come off as unlikable. Also, yeah, Ma-Ti was a recurring character/gag, not that it changes anything.
The Nostalgia Critic's funniest moments (i.e. from Doug's performance, rather than just showing something funny from the movie he's reviewing) were little almost throwaway bits where he would enunciate a line with a particularly over-the-top degree of venom or something. I genuinely can't think of a single one of the recurring jokes that was remotely funny the first time around.
To be fair on the creators, Doug basically wrote the exact same character for them to play i.e. his character. Granted most of them were essentially copying his thing to begin with, but the fact they're all written and directed as Nostalgia Critic clones probably didn't do them any favours. Though on the flip side, yeah most of them just could not act. It's funny how Spoony originally wanted to be an actor, yet consistently turned in some pretty turgid performances.
The really funny thing with Spoony is that he could act if given proper direction and is something he’s passionate about. His counter monkey series, the ultima series, there’s a few moments scattered in those where he gets really into something and he feels really genuine and the entire review feels like a special experience because of the passion he musters up. If someone handled his life outside of whatever role he’s doing, he’d be great talent for a lot of projects, but due to various reasons he’s probably too volatile.
cute dog
In fairness Spoony's choice to be extremely over the top in these movies is clearly deliberate. In his own videos he's nothing like the way he is in the Channel Awesome movies. I assume he was the least embarrassed about doing the constant screaming stuff so Doug zeroed in on him as a good guy to give a lot of silly dialogue/moments to. As other people pointed out they're all just playing different versions of the Nostalgia Critic in the movies.
This is the closest I will get to seeing these movies and I think that's a good thing
Sad but very true.
I actually saw Kickassia twice. I still say that the general idea, a group of friends trying to take over and run a micro-nation, is not only unique, but also the right kind of stupid to still be entertaining.
Too bad these guys beat us to it.
Watch them
I wish I were this lucky.
Although I could never finish To Boldly Flee. Even in the height of my Nostalgia Critic fanatism, I could never finish this movie. It is _this_ bad.
FlyingFocs Family Guy did it already.
I stopped watching Doug after that letter came out. As a film student I felt insulted. We learned on DAY 1 of class that if you can’t pay your crew, you feed them. If you can pay them, then you still feed them. ALWAYS HAVE FOOD AND DRINK ON LOCATION WITH YOU OR GIVE THEM MONEY SO THEY CAN GET THIER OWN FOOD. These people are giving time out of their lives to help make something for you. You need to take care of them and treat them with the upmost respect and kindness.
Doug, I appreciate the laughs you gave me in middle school and high school but couldn’t watch you anymore noting that you put your cast and crew through hell, which should never be the case. It hurt to know someone I looked up to didn’t even have moral standards that many other people have when it came to productions. Having correct industry morals is something I’m glad I cherish and respect as I work my way through the industry. All the while treating everyone I work with the upmost dignity they deserve.
I hate how Doug just blames his audience for Kickassia's failure. The trailer made it look like an epic movie but then he says "No that was intentionally misleading to parody misleading trailers." NO! Satire only works if you convey to the audience that it's a comedy right from the start. That's the same equivalent of saying "I intentionally poisoned your food."
I remember being initially disappointed with Kickassia because I expected the tone of the opening credits and the melodramatic acting of Spoony's scenes to be consistent with the whole movie. But no, instead we got a bunch of little DW sketches strung together. Looking back, the movie I was expecting probably wouldn't have been much better.
Isn’t it always intentional if someone poisons your food?
I'm confused why would anyone expect kickassia to be an epic lmao come on guys, that's completely on you for expecting -that- from Doug Walker
Lmao who was expecting Kickassia to be a serious fantasy epic? I was a really dumb kid but even I knew it was basically going to be a Nostalgia Critic comedy movie. I don't remember any of the fans expecting a straight-faced movie at the time.
I do remember being disappointed by the fact that they were in a really visually interesting part of the country in a great location and decided to shoot 90% of their movie in some guy's kitchen and living room.
I really want to like Doug Walker. When he does vlogs, he seems like a genuinely good guy, very charitable, and overall down to earth.
But holy crap, every time I see in giant bold lettering “WRITTEN BY DOUG WALKER AND ROB WALKER!”, I can’t help but notice the man’s ego. He needed his name to be out there. He needs the world to see the truly brilliant mind behind his second-third rate work.
He doesn’t want his art to speak for him.
He wants to speak for his art.
I get the impression that Doug may suffer from delusions of grandeur, and the "success" of Channel Awesome probably only made it worse. He obviously thought the Nostalgia Critic was going to be a temporary thing he could use as a stepping stone to a legitimate film career, but every time he tries to branch out it becomes increasingly clear that he doesn't have the talent or knowledge to do any better.
He's a jerk.
@Gary Hall I've read up on change the channel and the most I can find Doug guilty of is incompetence. He just has no clue how to run a professional shoot, but he thinks that he does so he never bothers to learn from his faults. The major problems with channel awesome seem to have been from others and just general incompetence overall.
The guy is a prick.
Self obsessed, delusional, narcissistic and a horrible boss.
@@lanceturley7745 I can, to be honest, kinda relate, to the idea of having done the same thing for years, and wanting to move on...Only to learn, when you try, that people only like you when you're being that original character.
i remember back in the day how i used to love these channel awesome movies because of getting to see all these content creators come together and seem to have fun. I got a real family vibe of seeing all these creators together. Of course in the following years, with many of these content creators gradually cutting ties with the group with their own stories, and the all not so awesome documents, we now know things were different behind the scenes, making these movies harder to swallow
This guy wanted to be an actual film maker and he still insisted on making 4 hour movies with ONE camera...I don’t know shit about film but I know that’s not how you do it
As a former film student, I can tell you that 3 cameras minimum is the industry standard. Doug and Rob took film classes, and how they failed to retain this basic basic fact is beyond me.
@gamewizard I One in the middle and one on each side. They form a triangular pattern. The middle one is ideal for wide and medium shots. The other two capture closeups and side angles. This can be utilized not just in movies, but also tv shows like news and sports. When filming a live show for example, Camera 1 (in the middle) can stay put to capture the wideshot that shows everything going on. Then the producer can cut between the other two cameras to get different angles. And when they cut back to camera 1, the other cameras are free to move about and get different shots for the next cut.
In movies, several cameras are best to make editing simple. Even if you have the most detailed storyboards imaginable, you're still going to make a lot of new decisions in post. Since editing is really what gives the movie its feel, its best to have several angles and several takes of each scene to create the best effect. And it's because of three or more cameras than a director can use shots from multiple takes without the audience knowing.
There's more to it than that, and I know I didn't explain it using the correct terminology, but that's basically it. I hope that answers your question.
So for example, when you watch Doug reading all of his lines in the exposition scene in SK with Rob pointing the camera upward from his crotch, you can see why it's amateur hour. The same shot of Doug talking from that one angle is boring. But with at least three cameras, that one scene could have been very different.
I used to work as a camera assistant, cinematographer and in a rental house and one camera doesn't have to be bad, at least on some smaller films, it can be the norm - mainly due to budget constraints. For movies shot mainly on location (not sound-stages) it can also end up being the case, as fitting multiple cameras (and camera crews) is sometimes frankly not possible. And on films with a lot of camera movement, one camera can be more common, as blocking a scene for two cameras flat out wouldn't work (either "oner-shots", but also stuff like Spielberg's moving masters, blocked for one camera). One camera can also allow for more creative lighting, as each shot is lit specifically, instead of just having to use the Master shots lighting (you might want to add some extra fill on the close-up). In the same vein, it can also differ from scene to scene - big action scenes or scenes with lots of extras tend to be shot with multiple cameras from lots of angles, for very obvious reasons, while they might stick to single camera for dialogue. At the same time, some films will use multiple cameras from different angles during dialogue to allow actors to improvise or play off each other (comedies being the prime example, but also scenes like the diner in Heat).
Cameras are tools - and (unless dictated by budget), sometimes you need more or less for the job. Saying someone is unprofessional because they use one camera is frankly a lie… as long as they know why they would use one camera.
Doug (and Rob) never did. Hearing the breakneck speed they had to work at, the huge amount of people and not great production values (nor artistic ambition) means that these were shows that would have benefited GREATLY from multiple cameras.
@@aaronsarchive82 Because they're greedy fucksticks. They didn't want to buy more cameras, food/drinks, permits, hotel rooms, plane tickets for their foreign reviewers or more crew member salaries. They have a few whales like mobile gaming has so they pocket as much money as possible while making sure they do just the bare minimum to keep them. All you have to do is look at their "game show" which supposedly has a budget of $100,000 but looks like it was made for $1,000. What do you expect though? I also love the story where Doug argued with Lindsey about shot 180 shot. Doug didn't know what that was and said it doesn't matter. I think Doug suffers from double think and cognitive dissonance, simultaneously.
@@gabrielledebourg2487 I wasn't "lying" about what I said. I was trained by professional cameraman, and I was just explaining what I was taught. This was nearly 15 years ago at this point though, so the technology used has changed dramatically, and that means the methods used would be different too. I imagine with the right equipment, it would be possible to pull off an entire movie with one camera, but with a cast the size of the CA crew, it would involve a lot if them standing around with nothing to do while the Walkers set up a shot several times, change batteries and usb drives, etc. It would still be cumbersome b/c they didn't plan everything out.
And that's really the main issue, the lack of planning and tact that went into these. Online videos or not, you basically have two film school rejects directing 15-20ish people hoping they can just work out any mistakes in post or explain anything that goes wrong with the term "plot hole."
I appreciate your modern perspective, Gabrielle. A lot has changed in the digital world.
Honestly, from what I’ve heard regarding these films, I think the biggest problem they have is the fact that the people behind the film’s production didn’t really seem open to taking advice or suggestions.
Another issue is the fact that every contributor was encouraged to basically ‘Act like Doug’ despite the fact their characters were far different than the Nostalgia Critic.
Also, I’m pretty sure Doug and Rob don’t really know much about directing a movie.
Edit: In retrospect, a lot of what's happened, and a lot of what I've said, has been because I got caught up in the rage and anger stemming from the controversy, so much so that I wanted to see Channel Awesome's reputation completely fall apart. That was uncalled for.
Yeah, just looking back on the Good Witch gag in this video feels so surreal because Linkara isn't the type of reviewer whose character mocks being 'good' as a weakness. The guy's a Star Trek fan who has gone on several tangents about how we need to bring hope back to comic books and about how there's a purpose to showing things ideolistically even if they're not 'realistic' enough, because he's seen where creators trying to go dark for the sake of going dark goes and it's very clear that 'compassion is not weakness' is an idea he genuinely believes in.
Hard cut to Doug writing his character into the circle to mock the Good Witch for not being threatening enough. Instead, shouldn't this gag be something like Linkara tries to give a big speech about the nature of heroism and then after the Good Witch shoots him down, THEN Doug or someone tries to attack and it leads to the fight scene or whatever? Like something actually focused on these characters doing things they're known for?
Pretty much my thoughts on the whole thing
@@dracocrusher I'm curious why you brought up his Star Trek fandom. Is that connected to the rest of what you were talking about, like you think Trek taught him to value heroism?
@@adamdavis1648 Because Star Trek is clearly something he's passionate about and TNG might actually be one of the most insanely optimistic shows I've ever seen. Sure, conflict still exists and there's death and screwed up situations, but the entire run is very much all about how talking through problems with diplomacy and dignity is the best solution. I don't think the show necessarily taught him to value heroism, but I really do think it has had a big impact on him overall.
Like maybe I'm reaching, but I feel like that type of situation where Picard walks into a room and is able to sit people down and work through things is like the height of badassery for him because when he makes his own content it feels like that's the type of situation he tries to replicate, right? A lot of his stories end with situations like that where he's able to shut someone down and give a big dramatic speech that gets to the heart of things and solves the matter. Because that's like the height of good-ness in a sense, right? Being able to end things without even having to fight.
Just pure speculation on my part, but I think it does make a lot of sense overall. So it's just super bizarre to see him be like "Oh, you can't use force? Guess you can't stop us, you dummy dum good witch!" because that kind-of feels like the exact opposite of what this type of stuff would make me think he believes, right?
"His default Joke is Screaming" - how to perfectly sum up what it's like to watch any of Doug's videos
Know what I just realized? The plot to Kickassia is also how Channel Awesome was made and destroyed.
JewWario even says "think of the children!" at one point in the movie #foreshadowing
"Erosion of good will"
That phrase nailed it. When all that faded away in 2018, fans began to view these films in a new light, and that left them to stand on their own merits.
There are none.
Quinton Reviews said that this is what he called a “lore movie”, in which the only appeal of it is playing to a small group of hyper fans with lots of fan service and references that the writing and production quality are far less important. Movies like this work ONLY because of the novelty and fun of the setup and not the execution. If you take that away or taint it, you are left with NOTHING.
It's honestly really sad that Spoony considers himself a "professional actor" due to these awful movies.
One thing I think bears mentioning is how poorly designed the original TGWTG website was. Like to find anything you had to navigate this ever branching maze of dropdown menus, and if your mouse cursor slipped at any time you'd have to start all over again. So they had all these producers come to do these movies working for "exposure", but unless they were in the top tiers already they were almost impossible to find on the site. Like I remember quite a few times seeing producers doing cameos in other people's videos and thinking "They look pretty cool, I should check their stuff out," and then being utterly baffled as to were to even start to look for their content.
That was one of the many complaints in the infamous document, until the rebranding TGWTG was a stock website layout.
I know right? aside from cameos it’s amazing I ever watched anyone else’s content at all
The Channel Awesome website layout I’d argue was worse.
Mm. I remember YEARS ago asking Marzgurl on twitter if she’d gotten accidentally kicked off the site because I couldn’t find her near as I could tell. Turned out she was still on there at the time, just buried in a dropdown somewhere. Meanwhile, NC stuff was relatively easy to find, always front and centre. (which from later stuff we know, was probably 100% intentional)
"Why would Film Brain and Spoony intentionally act badly?"
It seems pretty clear that they're intentionally hamming it up as a joke because it's a comedy. Just look at the guy next to Film Brain, it's obviously a bit.
Dracocrusher As a Spoony Fan (or as much as one can be nowadays since all he does anymore is livestream due to his physical and mental health combined with apathy) he would definitely ham it up, it's part of his character. Even the times he's legit overreacted or gotten angry irl were incorporated into said character to make it hammier, such as his "BETRAYAL" joke that originated from actual anger.
@@Tundra0stalker It's not really that uncommon at all, honestly. If you want to be funny then you need to act exaggerated, and most Channel Awesome reviewers were trying to follow the trend Doug set, so a lot of them acted exaggerated for comedic effect while still rooting their thoughts in their actual opinions. Even people like Linkara, who aren't as loud or crazy, ham it up a lot in how they perform to make their jokes work better.
Spoony definitely had talent, but boy did he fall hard. Hasn't made an edited review in 5 years, now just spends his time on Twitter complaining how depressed he is, then telling everyone who tries to help to fuck off. His house in in the middle of being repossessed and he still complains almost daily that turning on a camera and streaming is too difficult.
Yeah it's a shame that screaming in a weird way and contorting your face like you're suffering from a severe disability is just annoying rather than funny.
@@videogamenostalgia You can't deny it's a way to do comedy, not everybody's going to try to hit that subtle well-timed rhythmic sweet spot of insults like George Carlin or something, sometimes you just have to get excited and act big. It's fine if you hate it, but not everyone can pull off the super calm dry wit angle, but it's not always the best approach, either.
It always made me roll my eyes to see Doug Walker complain about Christopher Nolan. Say what you want about Nolan and his films, but the man's got critical praise, Oscars, a member of the Order of the British Empire, and directed a trilogy of game changing superhero movies, one of which got put in the Library of Congress last year.
All Doug Walker's got as a filmmaker is a trilogy of progressively more embarrassing vanity projects that most of his cast hated working on. Congrats, Doug, you're a less self aware Tommy Wiseau.
The world might be shitty and unfair but I’m forever happy that Lindsay Ellis is doing way better, both in terms of numbers but also respect (not to mention being a published author and working with PBS)
I would even argue she’s doing better than Doug (certainly in the respect department) but of course Doug will always have a large fanbase and my feelings aside it is a bit like comparing apples and oranges
Didn't she have an abortion?
Who cares if she did?
@@MyratheDunmer Her dead son.
@@SiegeBallista Yeah. She didn't want to have a child. That's why abortion exists.
@@SiegeBallista He's dead, he can't care about anything.
honestly, there are people from channel awesome that i still watch like linkara, bennett the sage, angryjoe and sf debris. i think each of them are great content creators in their on right, outside of the LPers like woolie vs they're the ones i watch constantly.
Yea angry Joe is pretty good but Doug made him very cringy.
I watch Film Brain, Todd and Lindsey all the time. Everyone's so much better not under Doug's thumb.
Lindsay Ellis' content post-CA is honestly better than any of her Nostalgia Chick stuff. She is easily my favorite video essayist on TH-cam. And Todd in the Shadows is easily my favorite music reviewer.
Say what you want about Doug and CA, it seems like they had a decent eye for talent. His own stuff has aged terribly but a lot of the people around him have gone on to be pretty good content creators. I guess I'm glad Doug's early success was around to give them that boost, I certainly wouldn't know who any of them are if not for the NC. But given all the drama behind the scenes I'd imagine they probably have mixed opinions on whether he was a net positive or negative influence on their lives/careers.
It would be best if Doug did an impression of Link in suburban knights
So we wouldn’t hear his voice.
My experience with Nostalgia Critic and Channel Awesome was similar to a lot of folks.
I first heard about his videos back in 2012 and binged his work even, the 3 anniversary movies, and I loved them; Doug was funny to me, he had a neat personality, and I was hooked.
From 2012 on up I was a fan of nostalgia critic and while I knew of the websites he had and the other content creators, I never bothered to check them out and only knew of them through his crossovers.
However it was around 2016 to 2017 when my interests in Dougs material as the Critic began to wane, his skits were fun in most parts but it felt like he wasn't hitting the mark and any attempts he had at those skits felt like a miss more than a hit.
I soon stopped watching his videos altogether because he began reviewing movies that felt less "Nostalgic" and more modern and one of the videos that turned me away from Doug was when he celebrated his 10th anniversary episode.
I assumed he would try to do some skit with the other content creators (mind you I was unaware of the mass exodus that happened on the channel) or that he would probably do something like have a skit where he goes down memory lane to see how far he came, maybe even review a transformers movie since that was the subject that started his career, alas nothing happened and he reviewed a bad movie that felt more like another cog in the wheel of production instead of a celebration.
After learning about the Not So Awesome Document and what went on behind the scenes, that was another blow that turned me further away and seeing how far things were going and how BAD it was getting, I have sworn off Nostalgia Critic altogether and haven't watched an episode of his since 2017-2018
Instead I watch Linkara and i'm much more entertained and feel like i'm getting what I subscribed for.
Ps. Lewis does a better job at doing storylines and making a small budget story work, case in point. Linkara's storylines + the 10th anniversary movie
Don't forget A Voice From The Dark.
WOW, honestly, that's more or less how i was introduced to NC and CA. And it ended the same way as it did for you too, you pretty much hit the nail on the head for my experences. XD I actually did meet Doug and Brad... kinda regret it in hindsight. But jokes on Brad, i gave him my VHS copy of "Grim Prairie Tales", so he has to suffer knowing he owns it. XD I did also meet Doug's dad too, he's the only one i don't regret meeting.
My one regret is originally creating one of my own characters in my videos being more or less a Alt. Universe version of the Cinema Snob, only he covers Anime. Though i decided to make him his own character (Who gets REALLY pissed whenever CA, Brad, Cinema Snob, or just the whole thing is brought up), so least there's that.
I was also introduced to the Nostalgia Critic back in 2012, and kept on watching his content all the way up to 2017 or 2018.
Linkara? The one who wanted to bang the green m&m and made a comic depicting a guy running away instead of saving a woman?
@@RileyWritey ) what is the comic?
And what is the context?
Just curious....
Nostalgia Critic: "I made these AWESOME movies."
Angry Video Game Nerd: "Hold my Rolling Rock!"
It’s crazy watching the behind the scenes stuff from James Rolfe and just seeing how much effort he personally puts in.
remember when doug walker thought he was so clever and funny for thinking up "what if it's a wonderful life, but people's lives really ARE better" only to find out the god damn fairly oddparents beat him to it
I would say Beavis and Butthead beat them to it. There were around long before Fairly Odd Parents and it was during a christmas episode where everyone's lives were better without Butt-Head.
@@Yabuturtle I'd forgotten that one, it's even older than I thought!
@@vt_973 Most tropes are older than we think. Odds are that when you subvert a trope or cliche, somebody at some point has already done it. The only thing to do is add your own spin to it.
Calling yourself old when you were 14 in 2013... damn... I’m a dinosaur.
I'm like a dinosaurs dinosaur bruv
I was 26 when this came out, I enjoyed it back then -- when I assumed the cast were having fun -- I'm the dinosaur.
At this point I should be called an internet grandma...
Admittedly I still love that joke
Not helping by saying I was 12 in 2013.,….
Good lord I didnt realize that audio aged so badly
Imagine a 30something year old guy in a Link costume saying: "Go somewhere else for your walk!"
Oof, I found out about Nostalgia Critic when I was first starting college around 2010 and loved him. You were 14 and five years later you cringe at the same age I discovered him... What was my excuse?
We all go through these things, man. I think the 2017 Power Rangers movie slaps, and I don't want to be 50 and still thinking that
@@RossMcIntyre I'm not gunna lie, I loved it too. Me and the roomate have a theatrical poster of the pink ranger in our living room. Now we just need Ivan Ooze or something...
Lol, I was 29.
@@freakystyley4000 Maybe everyone collectively had bad taste back then.
@@RossMcIntyre As long as you're not hurting anyone and no one's being hurt to make what you like, you should feel free to like anything at any age. It's too bad that second prerequisite wasn't true of these movies or Channel Awful in general.
TLDR: Linkara did a much better job respecting the producers who he worked with in ‘A Voice From The Dark’.
No, seriously, look it up. It’s on Linkara’s channel. It’s fantastic!
Edit: In retrospect, a lot of what's happened, and a lot of what I've said, has been because I got caught up in the rage and anger stemming from the controversy, so much so that I wanted to see Channel Awesome's reputation completely fall apart. That was uncalled for. I shouldn't have said that.
Yep. I mean, it being audio, he didn't have to deal with lots of the issues that Doug fucked up on, but he still did better. He watched episodes of everyone's shows, in order to get their styles down, he gave heavy freedom to improv or come up with their own jokes if they thought the ones he'd written didn't fit, and he even changed the script on a couple occasions to better suit someone's comedic style, whereas Doug was infamous for forcing everyone into HIS one mold. That's important, because the whole appeal of these crossover movies should be ""Here's a bunch of people who are funny (to a certain audience) together, watch them play off each other", but that doesn't work without room to improv. The whole appeal should be in watching these different comedic minds play off each other, but when they have a tight script, it can't work.
I remember ERod (aka Blockbuster Buster) describing his experience working with Linkara on A Voice From the Dark VS working with Doug for the ultimately cancelled 10th anniversary movie.
With Doug it was literally three messages. 1: "Hey do you want to be in the anniversary?" 2: "Okay cool here's the script." 3: "The movie has been cancelled."
Meanwhile Linkara kept him actively involved all the way through, was *regularly* asking for feedback on how he was handling ERod's character, like, was he in character? Did he have his own ideas for what he would like to do? He also apparently invited every producer who was involved with the project to a group chat so that *everyone* could work out what best to do.
So in short, whereas Doug basically just wrote a thing and had everyone do the thing he wrote while taking basically no input from his actors, Linkara genuinely did try to make it a collaborative effort that would represent everyone in it well.
I've seen several videos where people mention that Linkara was always a really good coworker and friend. That's nice to hear.
The difference between Doug and James Rolfe is that Doug lacks self awareness. James Rolfe is completely aware that he's famous for saying fuck loudly over video games and in all his other content he's an extremely humble and knowledgeable person
Whenever I see Doug all I see is the Nostalgia Critic. He's like a living cartoon character who's content hasn't evolved in over 15 years. Which is honestly impressive.
Phelous is still one of my favorite reviewers, he's still been consistently making good videos since 2009.
"loud and obnoxious" is quite the accurate description for everything doug walker does....
Not gonna lie, maybe it's because I'm still only 20, but the Inigo Montoya joke still gives me a little chuckle
I'm almost 30, and I definitely chuckled too.
Honestly i can't help but laugh that joke as well
THANK YOU. Jesus I know these movies are bad. But still whenever I think about that Amigo Toyota line I smile to myself. :)
Right? Joe never fails to make me laugh
What's funny about it? It's 100% pure cringe.
Imagine Daffy Duck cloned out 30 different ways and stretched out from 7 minutes to well over 2 hours. That's Doug's "plots".
You say that as if 30 Daffy Ducks arguing for two hours doesn't sound infinitely more entertaining than anything Doug has ever written.
Back of the box quote
“How quickly do you move to protect your children?” that was pretty hilarious.
if one more person calls 2010 "early internet" I'm gonna just die of premature old age
It's relative. the time you were online as a teen is gonna be the "early internet" to you- for example someone who came of age in the early 00s probably thinks of that time as early internet. But the generation who came of age in the 2010s are gonna be too young to remember the internet back then so the 2010s is now their early internet, etc etc
@@eyeballjay I mean early to me means early, as in, the early years of the internet. Not "the internet when I was 12 years old"
I think "early internet video era" is a more accurate term. Around when the NC got started is also around when it first became a feasible career uploading fairly lengthy videos - reviews, vlogs, Let's Plays, whatever - to the Internet. (Things like TH-cam getting rid of the 10-minute limit are milestones along the way). Internet culture, even Internet video culture (with stuff like flash animation) goes back much further than that but we didn't really see "facecam" video content like this start catching on until around like 2007-2008.
man we got dialup at my dads house in 97 and that ain't even that old in the whole entire history of the internet.
It's like calling music of the 90's classic vs music of of the 70's
If you overlook the inaccuracies like Brad Jones siding with the other content creators and Rob Walker making things better in the end, then Kickassia is a great meta commentary on the Walkers' management of Channel Awesome.
My favorite thing about 'Kickassia' is that it made me discover The Cinema Snob. Brad Jones' acting really stood up from the rest and I was immediately intrigued. He gradually became my favorite person on the internet after that. That ended in 2019 unfortunately, the elephant in the room just became too unbearable for me. I'm not going to lie, that was a bummer...
This video is surprisingly a good video to inform future filmmakers. I have seen these movies but your points about the basic story and technical issues are right. It’s a good showing for future filmmakers
I kind of enjoy both 'Surburban Knights' and 'To Boldly Flee' in the same way that I enjoy 'The Room', they're complete garbage but it's fascinating to see how someone as egotistical as the Walker brothers or Tommy Wiseau genuinely believing they've made their magnum opus, and yet it falters in almost everyway humanly possible.
(Though I'll give To Boldly Flee some credit, I quite like I'm a Distraction as a pardoy song.)
I completely agree. I don’t know why so many people can’t stand these movies? I put them on all the time as background noise.
Suburban Knights was the only one that I kinda liked at the time, and even it was interminable. It was enjoyable enough for its central conceit: "Watch your favorite content creators LARPing really badly in the woods!" That said, its enjoyment factor is completely ruined by the revelations from the document. The fun of it was imagining that they were all a group of friends hanging out and goofing off for a few days--a vacation disguised as a miniseries project. Now we know for certain that this wasn't even close to the case. To Boldly Flee is still the worst, since it had the pretense of being a story with something to say rather than simply being an overlong sketch comedy strung together with a dubious premise.
Wow this takes me back. I had just graduated High School when I started watching these guys. They used to be so funny, and there are a few episodes I still go back to that make me laugh. But you're right. This format would NOT work now.
Kind of makes you wonder what made it work at the time for people.
You'd think Doug dressing as Link, he'd ya know keep his mouth shut. Since Link only speaks with grunts.
In Doug’s case “grunts” along with basically everything else translates to over the top screaming.
I never heard of the Room before Nostalgia Critic and I will credit him with introducing me to that long before James Franco. However now I only remember the movie and none of his review of it.
And I’m willing to bet that you also remember “Disaster Artist”
I could gladly go forever without ever hearing "Well on the other hand it looks like they're having a good time making it, at least" again. With "movies" this horrible, it doesn't make it any less of a waste of time for me knowing that the actors had fun making them. If anything I think they should've had less fun and instead put more effort into making the movies good. I mean look at the "fight" scenes in Suburban Knights: it's literally just a bunch of manchildren and womanchildren having fun, instead of working to make good fight scenes.
If you heard the CA allegations from past members, there was likely less fun, especially Kickassia, than effort
"If you drive through your neighborhood, and you see this (Doug & Co.), you should think about how quickly I should move my kids away from them" Now THAT made me laugh.
Your intro hit home hard. Well spoken. I always used to think why do I don't like young adult films and books anymore and it's true our brains grow up. Things we liked younger we don't connect with anymore.
I think the most telling elements of people's distaste for the Kickassia project was Nostalgia Chick, who at all times looked blazed out of her mind or at best, that she couldn't give less of a shit what was going on and Phelous, who's usual brand of sarcasm and condescending joke seemed like they were coming from an all too real place, as opposed to a style of humor. I remember noticing this when I first saw the movie and thought it was kind of odd but upon learning about all the behind the scenes issues, it makes too much sense... and admittedly, kinda makes it funnier.
As someone who was in high school back when this whole thing started, Channel Awesome's rise and fall feels like a perfect parallel to growing up and becoming a jaded adult. That being said, after Kickassia, I didn't even bother with Suburban Knights and To Boldly Flee.
if doug didn't treat his fellow creators so poorly, i could watch these movies as well as nostagia critic's regular content with the mindset that it's not good, but i like it anyway. but knowing the mistreatment people suffered at the hands of people who thought they knew what they were doing and became complacent because of that makes this whole thing actually unwatchable.
The films are pretty comparable to like a low budget version of the Friedberg/Seltzer trilogy. I don’t know, they share a ton of similarities in structure.
Okay...I'm going to have to call bullcrap on that. Even if there's a comparison to be made with the referential ethos, they're NOTHING alike in structure or storytelling.
Altho...the poor souls in Seltzer/berg crap _probably_ were actually paid...
To be fair, Joe repeats his line because that's what Inigo Montoya does in Princess Bride.
Not that it makes it better, but that's the joke.
Indigo says other things in the movie, he only repeats it in the one scene and there is a dramatic necessity to doing so
Doug really shows how hard it is to write good comedy.
Channel Awesome is such a cautionary tale. Thank goodness Blip died when it did, since now most of my old stuff is lost. Never forget that content on the internet is like pee in a swimming pool - once it's in there, it's in there. I wish everyone the best in their endeavors, but the past won't ever be forgotten now.
Glad my knee is ok tho
Ah the 2010s, the decade where we reveal that no, your childhood idols were horrible people
I'm seeing why the main villain of Coco was who he was
I've never thought of how Doug was the only person dressed up as a video game character in that movie. That's really strange.
I think that’s only a coincidence. Several other characters were considered during the script writing. Paw was originally going to be King Graham from the King’s Quest series.
I'm going to be honest, I had fond memories of Kickassia and Suburban Knights. They were badly made, but they were entertaining and it was fun imagining these reviewers as a big happy family having fun together. The "Not So Awesome" document pretty much ruined that rosy mindset for me, and it's impossible for me to look back at these films without that tainting the experience for me.
20:30 I can just feel Obscurus Lupa's pain
Frightening Volleyball Yeah you just know she locked herself in a bathroom crying for several hours.
. . . Shit, that joke is distasteful as that is true.
Dougs little comdey sketches need to come with a health advisory for the induced seizures and aneurysms.
I'm very glad that I outgrew Channel Awesome stuff early on. There were a lot of things he got wrong in reviews and it annoyed me, and eventually it dawned on teenage me that a lot of people who disliked things had no reason why beyond 'Doug said it's bad'. It made me realize that reviewers are unreliable and people often don't form their own opinions, just echo other people's, which in turn made me more likely to give things a chance that were critically panned because I didn't want to be unfair to media.
Through sheer incompetence, CA instilled basic media literacy in me.
I agree. I also used to enjoy NC. However, about a year before #ChangeTheChannel, I began to lose interest. Also, I watch videos like this to remind myself why I outgrew NC in the first place.
Hindsight's a funny thing. It's easy to forget but there was another anniversary special Doug made before he started making these movies. The "TGWTG Year One Brawl". A goofy little video that was only 20 minutes long! I really think that if Doug tempered his ambitions and just made anniversary movies that were like, 40 minutes long at most. They would have turned out so much better.
...Also a smaller scale project would have likely put less stress on its staff and crew and would have made things less... *controversial.*
If I were writing the screenplay, I would have designed the characters to match their distinct personae on the website. I would have had Phelous be just plain odd, Cinema Snob be a snob, etc.
So would I, but that would require watching their material, respecting your colleagues, and being able to write multiple kinds of humor or at least take input from other people. Things Walker cannot do.
Whenever I revisit late 2000s/early 2010s era of the internet, I feel another crows feet grow on my face. These movies do that.
To me this was the beginning of the end for the Nostalgia Critic being tolerable, it's when he first truly embraced that all he wants to do is play dress-up.
It was a painful fever dream.
I genuinely felt sick to my stomach when I heard about someone's knee being "bashed in" and how they couldn't get medical attention until after they signed some form, which knowing Doug was probably a misspelled note saying "don't sue us" written on a ketchup stained napkin
Imagine being held hostage like that while you're in pain, and unable to walk away.
Oh no, if it's contractual stuff you know it was Michaud drafting up disturbingly air-tight documents to make them as unaccountable as possible. This is the man who owns the Critic brand after all.
It never ceases to amaze me how so many people with professed love for film and filmmaking all, universally, can demonstrate any knowledge or skill of the actual craft on almost any level
Oh god I forget how bad these movies were and how shallow my tastes were in high school.
Ahh seeing Spoony, Linkara, and Doug together in the video really gives me the feels. Such wasted potential.
20:25
I remember multiple instances of Linkara talking about how much he fucking hated doing this scene just off the top of my head, and I feel like that says something considering he was one of the "better treated" producers...
Absolutely wild that Lindsay Ellis got her start on channel awesome
A good antidote to all this is Linkara's audio play A Voice From The Dark. It's a much more thoughtful look at... yes, really. It's _thoughtful_. It has a lot of subtext about how jaded the former producers are, how much abuse there was behind the scenes, and how despite everything they do miss getting to hang out together.
Plus, it's a much better story. Not that it's _hard_.
Suburban Knights was my introduction to Channel Awesome, and by extension everyone associated with that site. I used to think it was a “so bad it’s good” kinda deal. Like, I thought they all knew full well it was bad and that was the joke. Yes they made a bad product but they had fun making it. Again, that’s what I thought. But after all the #ChangeTheChannel drama, hearing how nobody had a particularly fun experience (and even less so for To Boldly Flee), knowing that Doug honestly thinks he made a good product... it just soured the whole thing for me.
What's always fascinated me about Doug Walker is that he is so unbelievably blind to his hypocrisy when he reviews things it's almost like he's talking about himself and his failures as a Movie Maker in one of the biggest forms of ironic coping I've ever seen from somebody.
I went from watching strangers ripping apart movies to watching strangers rip apart strangers ripping apart movies. Is this me?
Kickassia was merely the "based on true events" movie adaptation that will be made of the "Not So Awesome" docs sent back through time.
2:00 Hey why isn’t he in the Shadows.
That would have required some sort of thought in regards of cinematography and shot composition.
To be 100% honest, Kickassia never bothered me and it still kind of doesn't. There's a sense of ammeter, early internet fun behind it, like watching a home movie made by your friends. If you didn't like it then, you won't like it now. It's not perfect, but that's fine. But after that, there's no excuse. Like he could have stepped up your game and he never did. It was too much Doug and it became much more apparent as time went on. And his attitude only got worse too.
I have a little nostalgia (hur hur) for Kickassia, but I can't sit through the whole thing nowadays, then I never finished Suburban Knights or even started To Boldly Flee. I think there's still novelty in the fact that every primary Channel Awesome contributor got together to film some dumb home movies, like this was the good ol' days before Spoony got kicked off the site, before LordKat started openly harassing his former coworkers on his podcast, before Blistered Thumbs died, before Gamer Gate, before the Chez Apocalypse and JesuOtaku video game scams, before we knew just how terrible CA really was the whole time, and before the Mister Metokur retrospective.
To Boldly Flee is the worst one. It's utterly unwatchable, because there's literally nothing original about it, but it kinda stands as the last hurrah before everything really fell apart. At least, that's how it all comes across to me as a former fan, now just a distant observer since childhood.
This was the best review of these movies, and I've seen a lot of videos on this. Well done sir!
I’m glad you mentioned Todd, after seeing these movies and hearing his thoughts on being in them, it’s so sad to watch
I used to have a fondness for these movies, not because I thought they were good, but because it appeared that it was a bunch of friends having a good time making something silly. However once it was revealed that these movies were hell to make and everyone got taken advantage of, any kind of appeal that they would have for me vanished.