Are $1700 carbon MTB wheels really worth it? High Low Ep 6
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 20 เม.ย. 2022
- Are carbon wheels really that much better?
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Credit to Donut Media & Pinkbike for the inspiration behind this mega series.
Links to the parts seen in this video (affiliate links):
Polygon Siskiu D5 (red one) - bikesonline-usa.sjv.io/7m64dQ
Polygon Siskiu D7 (yellow bike, my main) - bikesonline-usa.sjv.io/b3Bv3k
DT Swiss Competition Spokes - amzn.to/3EyvENW
DT Swiss Black Nipples - amzn.to/3MlKM3Q
Park Tool Nipple Driver - amzn.to/3xFPJR9
Nipple Holding Box with Driver - amzn.to/3vAPN1M
Stan's Rim Tape - amzn.to/3jWCMuf
Stan's Sealant - amzn.to/3rFFlFk
Tools:Park Tool Truing Stand - amzn.to/3CXI5lG
Park Tool Spoke Wrenches - amzn.to/3vBpLvt
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For business inquiries: evansmtbsaga@gmail.com
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Evan's MTB Saga PO Box 6498 Goodyear, AZ 85338 - กีฬา
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Hi Evan I was work at a bike shop I’d recommend you get a new helmet. Because helmets expires after 3 to 5 years it it looks old. Otherwise great series
@@andrewlevine3364 Thanks Andrew. I got it the start of 2021, still works great! I'm holding out for a gear sponsor tbh
@@EvansMTBSaga That’s a good idea
Loving the content! Though I think channel should really be called “Evan’s wheel spoking saga.”
Totally agreed! That job is annoying, I might ask him to lace some
Lol. If he didn’t lace up a wheel during a vid at this point I’d be disappointed.
I wish he trued my wheels but to late now that I bent my wheel trying to true it🥲
@@m.m_cutzz oh no!
Not only do the carbon wheels have the lifetime warranty, they'll actually stay straight, unlike the alluminium wheels... 😬
With how much experience he has with wheel building at this point, he would be able easily true his wheels up. Especially since his trails don't really have that many obstacles that would dent his hoops.
Does the lifetime warranty cover a foreign object poking a hole or chipping/cracking the carbon? I've seen stories where a frame got perforated by a rock and Santa Cruz wouldn't cover it. Is that story bogus? How do the hoops differ from how frames are made with the layers, etc?
I can't wait to use them long term! And I'm glad you came across my videos. Your storytelling is a huge inspiration for me. Thanks Eric!
My FR2020s have never needed adjusting from factory, 3 years old now 😁 (they're alloy)
@@jeremywatts2768 the warranty will cover any damage caused while riding no questions asked. That’s the NOBL guarantee!
This is a low/high bike done right really been enjoying the series.
The Problem is, pinkbike Just picked the Most expensive and cheapest parts they could find. Not upgrades, heck, they downgraded the low bike sooo much
Evan is doing exactly what they should've done. Upgrades. Not Just change parts for the cheapest available stuff that is nowhere near an upgrade
@@RandomDudeOnTH-cam I agree there series was fun but not helpful for beginners in the slightest
On the contrary, this comparison doesn't actually make sense. I just picked this video up and have not watched the prior ones so comments below apply to this one specifically.
What's happening is that the "HIGH" bike is getting upgraded exponentially, while the "LOW" bike is getting upgraded incrementally. So in this case, you have carbon wheels + Fox Fork + whatever else has been done to it (I see a coil shock in one of the frames), which is going to hands-down outperform the Marz + alloy wheelset in terms of something like "precision" and "lateral rigidity".
If you want a fair test, both bikes need to be outfitted with the same things, and only the wheels as the variable.
It's like dumping $10 each week into one savings account, and then $3 each week in another, then saying "oh yea the one getting $10 each week has a higher balance!"
@@whatshubdoc4793 i know what you mean, but this isnt about testing which parts make the Biggest difference
Congrats on 30k Evan! This series has exploded your channel! 👍🏼 Well done. How long does it take you to spoke wheels now?
About an hour per wheel, I still make mistakes haha
Ai
This is what pink bike should have done! You have done a great job!
For real, pinkbike is going for the clickbait with the garbage ebay stuff. This guy is actually doing some research and buying decent lower priced components from name brands. Low cost builds are totally possible if you don't just buy the cheapest knockoff thing on Amazon and actually look for quality low cost components.
This is the best mtb series rn on youtube
Yes it is
Thanks guys!
Holy crap Evan. You've gained 10k subs since I started watching you, about a month and a half ago. Props to you, your series is definitely the obvious choice for quality and entertainment.
Great video and series! Informative, entertaining and well done. I upgraded my bike with a set of NOBL wheels with ONYX vesper hubs last year and I love them. If you can afford it, I highly recommend.
The high bike is 5% faster but costs nearly 373% more. Good value!
Nice way of explaining that the expensive boost hubs can be converted with only a little headache.
Even your 'cheap' option is out of my price range but I love what you do man. Keep it up.
You can just get a pin thing that goes through the 148x12mm bore. You don't need new end caps. Far cheaper option. You just need that and a quick release skewer long enough to go through which you should already have off the old wheel.
@@chairmanmeow8388 Excellant point, but it is good to show the manufacturer already thought of the problem ahead of time.
@@singletona082 I agree. I've bought a few sets of fulcrum wheels. They come with caps and plugs so you can run them on either. I only know about the pin because I bought one before I found out I didn't need to because of supplied plug things.
honestly the best option is just to get a frame that accepts boost 148x12 in the first place.
Hope Hubs, my friend. You can get a Hope in almost any configuration you need and you can get adapters for nearly anything. Their rims are excellent too. All made in Yorkshire so you know the quality is second to only the Germans.
I really appreciate your commitment to staying under budget on the low bike. 👍
OMG YESSSS, Killing it once again, i swear i was obsessing abou the Nobl TR32s. this is legit the only video on youtube reviewing them properly. ABSOLUTE FIRE AS USUAL!!
Your content is amazing bro, Im a fan of yours from the Philippines!!
Gotta say I love your Chanel man got all the great content I need
loving the inspiration from donut media with high low,ive really been thinking about this ideea
You came a long way but damm congrats on your 30K subs, your low vs high series is going great keep up the good work.
Evan your videos never disappoint they make me want to keep watching and I think I've watched a couple of them like ten times. Keep up the great work.
Just not nice that some of his older videos are comment botted to get more views
You really helped me for my journey from a newbie to experienced. Thank you
I love to hear that!
Great job man, keep up the good work :)
How fitting, I ordered a set of NOBL TR32 sine curve carbon rims on Industry 9 Hydra's early this month. They're getting built soon so I look forward to this upgrade. Your review made the purchase even more reassuring. High bike wins again!
These vids are really well made, even without considering you do everything yourself.
Just what the bike community content we need. Been living these vids Cheers
Cool vid. I think the Tires should be "controlled" - i.e. the same - and not change because now you have two variables adding up.
It would be more interesting if you were to "redo" the loops, this time with the DC tires on the Nobls and the 3C tires one the "DIY" Spanks, to see what % of that initial run difference was - perhaps - because of the tires. The $ difference between DC/3C is perhaps the smallest in this test so far, and most likely even "low-end" spenders that can justify $70 for DC tires , most likely can do $85 for 3C tires.
congrats 30k subs 🤯✨🥳. this channel is growing so fast
Thanks man! You're an OG
i have both. i chose carbon for my local trails that require a lot of pedaling and has lots of short punchy climbs. If there were more downhill runs the alloy wheels would've been fine. The carbon wheels were also the best upgrade over anything else on my bike. it didn't feel that significant in a driveway test at first, but on the trail it's just completely mindblowing how different it feels. I went with the newer roval control carbon with dt350 hubs - awesome wheels (although no lifetime warranty, 2 years only).
congrats on 30k evan! you deserve it
Best one yet! 29er conversion was awesome!
very nice, impressed by the weight difference considering it's a coil on the highbike !
Freakin awesome content, Evan!
When this one ends, do another one!!
I plan on doing one and posting all videos in December
Man I love this series
my favuorite mtb series on youtube atm!
Love these videos keep the good content up
Awesome video series! Such an underrated channel!
Best series! Love every episode
I love this has a long time donut media fan and mountain biker this is great i used to think up to speed on mtb would work great !
Just keeps gettin better Evan! Thanks for keeping us entertained.
As an AZ rider I laughed about the berms or lack there of lol!
Yeah I think berms get built and just decay with the sun!
maybe I just found my new favorite mtb channel. keep up the good content mr. :))
Hey, you mentioned that double butted spokes are thinner in the middle to save weight. This is true to some extent but the weight savings are miniscule and only part of the reason to use these spokes. The most important difference is in their compliance. A wheel with double butted spokes has slightly more give on hard hits so it retains tension better. That being said straight gauge 2mm spokes are perfectly good for any application if you don't want to spend too much. And standard stainless is about a third of the price of colored spokes.
Your content is really fun to watch. Did you have a bike mechanic background? I really appreciate this series of upgrade videos and the cost to performance ratios.
No. I had a set of wheels built for my trek rail ebike. Spank 359 vibrocore rims and industry 9 hydra hubs. I could of done carbon but I’m very happy with the spank. I did have carbon wheelset on my old ebike but the spank just so much more comfortable to ride. Really liking this series. Good work.👍
Some parts I like:
Michelin Wild Enduro, great transition, especially on 30mm rims, but work really good on 23mm too, but 30 it's great, fakies get a lot smoother, great mud clearance, side knobs are like a mud tyre, mid rolls fast.
There are two compounds for both version, for both front and rear. Gum-X3D is less sticky, MagiX- 2 is super sticky. These tyres have a much more stable feeling than High Roller 2, Shorty, I know I had 2.3, and these are 2.40 but that a lone is not the reason for it. the side knobs, great thread pattern, great combo with the transitioning knobs, and the side knobs, the side knobs are supportive, squirm less.
Just by looking and feeling them by hand you it might look like it could do much difference, but I see the knobs have a very different design. all of it shows really well while riding. track stands got a lot easier, due the great thread pattern and well engineered knobs.
There is a new version of the Wild Enduro that is an addition, not an replacement, it's meant to be the competition tyre, it has the yellow and blue Michelin logo.
Brakes:
I have Formula Cura 4, I've only had one ride on them so far, but I like them, I would put them on both a low budget build and pricy build, if I had I went for hydraulic on both. it can be serviced, all parts are aluminium. lever blade feels like Shimano.
Mineral oil, so not DOT toxic corrosive, paint eating.
Cheap upgrades for any bike:
STZY tubeless valves: can use a mini ratchet to tighten from the bottom of the valve, you can clean it with poking something through, so you don't need a sealant eating solvent.
There are several colours, and you can buy the caps in different colours too, so you can customize it well. They come n 44mm or 60mm, I went for 44mm, works well with most rims, for example DT Swiss FR560 and H552. The valve cover has a valve core tool.
30k subscribers! Wow congratulations!
i love all the upgrades for the bikes. it tell me more about upgrades
Nice content bro, we all need this!
NOBL wheels are great. I just got a new set of them last week for my gravel bike. They're the HR35 rims with BERD spokes and i9 1/1 hubs. I have a set of BERD TR30 wheels with i9 1/1 hubs on my mountain bike and despite being a 29er, it's so much more flickable than my previous bike with 27.5" wheels was because of the huge drop in weight. BERD spokes are expensive as hell but they're price competitive with other carbon wheelsets. The full set of TR30 wheels I bought cost me $1600 and they're way stronger and lighter than the NOBL wheels you bought for this video but they don't have a lifetime warranty or silent Onyx hubs.
I wouldn't necessarily say that the low bike has "cheap" components. To me, cheap has a connotation of garbage/low quality. The products that you put on the low bike are quality products. I would say that the low bike has "less expensive" components. Keep up the good work!!!!
Well, thats the point. Thing is, its about upgrades, and not about cheap or expensive parts
New subscriber here man. Very informative!
love your work mate
Thanks Darth!
Kudos for giving props to Doughnut that creates the Hi Lo concept
I got the tr32’s with dt180 Hubs on my v10. Love ‘em!
great video ,i love your channel
Great series Evan, saw bikesonline at sea otter and had to let them know too
Great vid! The biggest upgrade though may have been the Minions.
Cant wait for the handlebars! hahaha i recently upgrade a not so expensive deity bars and stem on my budget bike.
Love the “I feel like Jeff Kendall Weed” at the top of the climb.
Haha I know right 😂
Really nice video and great editing
This series is pure fun keep going man 🤙🏼
Ps: I appreciate the lbs/kg conversion for us non US people, I’d just suggest that 30,4 lbs is more 13,6 kg unless there is some dark magic there that I don’t understand 🧐
I forgot to change that part! I'll fix it next video
@@EvansMTBSaga I really appreciate you adding imperial and metric systems, most TH-camrs are too lazy and then I am just confused!
Nice video again been following you a long time now.
Fellow rider here in the Phoenix area (Mesa). Hope to see you out at Hawes some day! Your content is really good.
Oh cool man! I'm going out there this Saturday
Hi 😊
very nice video man 🤜
I have a question, for the rear you change original wheel with 9x135mm hub with new wheel with boost hub with conversion kit that reduce hub to 9x141mm. My question is the rear rotor has problem with rear brake? No rubber problem of rotor touch the pads o anything?
I LOVE u're content!!!
I have both carbon and aluminum rim wheels. I agree carbon is lighter and aluminum is more shock absorbency. In either application I would not ever have mountain bike rims so narrow. Minimum is i30mm internal width. This alone and especially when paired with good tires an tire inserts. I especially like how much better my gravel bike feels with i27mm rims. Being full rigid makes you notice the ride qualifies imprisonments and subtle deferences between carbon and aluminum and the different tires.
Yeah I've only ridden carbon rims once and it was on a Santa Cruz V10 at Whistler Bike Park and they felt like garbage because they were so stiff that the bike felt skittish and definitely transmitted more of the bumps through to my hands. That said, the low weight of them definitely did have some performance benefits.
@@rubbersidedown5620 it’s also related to your body weight. I’m only 155# and what is too stiff for me might flex more under heavier rides plus heavier rides might bend aluminum rims easier.
Noice he is giving credit to donut media! Benn watching both channels for a long time! Great progress
Alloy Rims (Halo Tornado, I challenge you to find a stronger rim) laced to Hope Pro4 hubs with Halo double butted stainless spokes. When the nuclear apocalypse occurs, those wheels will be the only survivors. Front cost me £110, the rear is on order. It'll wind up about £220 all in for the rear. Not easy putting a 26 together but worth it.
man yo vids are awesome!
Great content, I'm amazed at the difference from the rims! Is it possible to isolate this by swapping the wheels across and rerunning? I just can't believe that's the single reason for the time improvement
Maybe I'll do it as a short, but the Shimano cassette has to be compatible
@@EvansMTBSaga do you think it's singularly from the rims? Is there an easier way to cross check it?
As primarily road cyclist with a 15k carbon everything sWorks, I chuckle whenever I see anything carbon on a trail mtb.
Haha why is that!! I'm curious to hear your perspective
love the content
There's never a more classic combo than Arizona and No Berms, haha. It's really hard to build a berm out of sand, cholla pods, and rock.
i thought you will go for a mullet set up but i remember that big clearance in the rear so i think the bikes was meant to upgrade for a 29er
Just recently (over winter) bought my first mtb. At 63 it has been a good ten or so yrs. I picked up a fsr sport. It has carbon wheels, I know nothing about... so trying to learn a bit
Wow, great video, you are like the michael vsauce of mountain biking
Okay, Chad was slick with the boost hub fix
Not taking the opportunity to clean up and repaint the spanks with all the spokes off is killing me! The weight reduction even on the low bike is nice! Food for thought, I think that upgrade alone would actually get the Siskiu D-series comfortably clear of the 32/34lb suggested max on a lot of car roof racks.
Haha I scrubbed them with every chemical I had, they were super stained by old sealant
Maybe an slightly inaccurate test for the rims, tires have a very big difference specially when it comes to compounds, would be great if the tire high and low swap was for another video
I can't find any info on that cassette, do you have any links?
Hey i noticed that you have the deore 12speed cassette
I also have one but i destroyed the 10 teeth cog. Can i only buy that? If yes where? I live in Italy so cant rely on us shops
i personally think that since you went with an air shock on the low bike you should’ve gone air on the high bike, to make it more even im a certain matter, if you went air, you could have gone with the fox x2 since its their highest spec shock
I don't want carbon rims on my bike - not because of the price, but because they are unrecycleable landfill when they're done (for whatever reason). I love lacing up a fresh pair of hoops every now and then. Maybe to try a new width, or because the old ones are just used up and dead.
That costs me merely 100-200 euros including spokes, and the old rims can be recycled. With carbon you're pretty much fixed to the rims you're having - if you don't earn like a mogul.
@0510 it is an XDR or XD driver? If XDR, do you have 4 or 6 pawls?
Love the vid
I knew I’ve heard the intro song from somewhere then when you said donut media it made sense😂
I wonder if they have a converter from boost 141qr to through axle.
Dat low bike be looking sharp
you're doing a really great job on this series! MT7 HC3's for the high bike coming up?
More expensive brakes!
Trickstuff direttissima brakes? Those brakes cost around 1000 euros per brake
@@thomasjanssen3643 Pretty good guess!
will there be a hub upgrade for the low bike?
I am glad your channel is exploxing cause wew your spending some serious cash. 😄
i love these videos
What is this? How much did you spend?! 😂😂😂 Definitely the best of your series. Thanks a lot for your content and greets from 🇩🇪
This makes me curious what the difference is between the frame and forks that are designed for 27.5", and for 29" Especially the fork. It looks like the Z2 is available as separate models for the different wheel sizes, but... why?
LOL the jeff kendall weed thing was super funny the dude is just popping wheelies for an entire video
Good video
I don't think I will go for the Vesper hubs, despite it meaning Wasps in Norwegian 😁 I don't know if that was intentionally ironic. I've read a Norwegian dude broke it, but Onyx replied him and did not reccomend them for Norwegian trail riding. So he went for the classic hubs, which are beefier and heavier. I've also seen vid where Hardtail Party mentioned he tried Vesper but broke them too. But he had great success with the classic hubs. But it will be interesting to see whay your experience will be.
I have spank oozy 395+ wheels on I9 hydra hubs. To me, that's of good as a wheelset id ever strive to have. Id try some carbon hoops, but not at the cost of some of these on the market.
Hey even I think it would be a great idea if you invested into a park tool, internal cable routing tool to make builds Easy when the bike has internal cable routing like your polygon t7
A mountain biker who also likes Donut?
finally!
Bicycles are crazy expensive, even the low bike is more than I'm willing to spend. But I also ride a 2018 specialized rockhopper I picked up used for $200. It's crazy that bicycle wheels cost as much or more than building new wheels for my dirtbikes.
What did you think about the Garbaruk cassette? Did it shift as good as Shimano or SRAM? What chain did you use?
It was okay, I ultimately switched it to a SRAM cassette because the AXS derailleur and XX1 SRAM chain didn't get along well.
My alloy wheels with inserts seemed to brush off a lot of abuse I gave them last year and I only ride bike parks and bmx.
Nukeproof HZN V2's, coming from bmx where we only ride 4130 chromoly, carbon has me a bit nervous nevermind the price. Maybe I need to have a rethink :)
I actually sold 4 year old Syntace carbon wheels for quite some money (they were straight like new). Probably wouldn't even have been able to do so with aluminium wheels, if they hold up that long anyway…