Bitcoin can't be killed | Niall Ferguson and Lex Fridman
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 8 พ.ย. 2021
- Lex Fridman Podcast full episode: • Niall Ferguson: Histor...
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GUEST BIO:
Niall Ferguson is a historian at Hoover Institution, Stanford University. He is the author of 16 books on the history of money, war, power, and catastrophe.
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Yeah lets get rid of BTC and start using the "elite" or "government" backed crypto, that sounds like a great idea, sign me right up.
What could go wrong? /s
no need for an s there buddy, anyone who cant get this without is a kid
Imagine the dystopia that would be if our financial systems ran on the blockchain. You would be able to see your neighbor buying hentai, your friend's parents million dolllars in debt, every transaction would be public for the world, your friends, and family to see
@@anon7891 Yeah, transparency is a hell of a thing when you have shit to hide lol .
@@Primal_Primat3 Forget hiding anything, don't you want privacy?
If there's anything I've learned from watching movies and playing video games, is that when the world goes to shit the only currency worth having is cigarettes. There I said it. Stock up everyone. Marlboro light will be worth millions when the bombs start dropping
Facts
It's gold and silver, cigarettes are in jail
I’d give up my cigarrettes for one of those salt nicotine vapes the kids are raging about
In the uk of youd bought n held tobacco n cigarettes n alcohol 5/10 years ago you would be saving yourself a fortune in current prices after recent taxes n inflation
Bottle caps
1) Fiat makes war cheap.
2) Cryptocurrencies are popular in South America, because the United States doesn't control it's distribution or supply.
Let me tell you a secret my friend to save you a lot of time and money. “Crypto” in general are controlled by small groups of developers, backers, early investors unless they are truly decentralized. Just cause you have a blockchain doesn’t make you decentralized, got it?? So there is only one decentralized blockchain. It is Bitcoin, and it is a competition to be MONEY not some fast payment system.
Inflation in Argentina is over 50% for the year so far. Yeah they have to figure something out.
US Gov got a ton of BTC.
Chancellor on brink of second bailout for banks :D
Well said. The message embedded into the first block says it all!
Yes, but to be fair to Ferguson, the white paper was written quite a while before that first block
@@johnhauber6458 Agreed. Fair point. Satoshi had to have been working on Bitcoin during the 2008 crisis and the first round of bank bailouts, so IMO I think it's reasonable to conclude it would have been at least been on his mind to some level.
My thoughts after 50 seconds in too. Glad to see it mentioned.
If you create an alternate system that is better it doesn’t take a giga brain to realise game theory suggests potential debasement if previous system as everyone runs to the exit hatch.
Does he not know? WTF
looking forward to the whole episode.
@Hurty18 I’m also looking forward to your comment once you’ve watched this clip
Thank you Lex and Niall. Shared!
Such a professional and poetic speaker!
You should have Niall on every few months. He's the GOAT.
This cant be cancelled or killed , government "hold my beer"
Government must be drinking moonshine not beer these days.
The problem with that is if a government does go down that road there is still the rest of world using crypto... and continuing to reap the booming rewards off it.. so that country will be left behind economically as the rest of the world moves ahead.. it could only work if say all the G7 plus a few others got together and banned it.. and going by how long international diplomacy and agreements take it will be years before they can all get on the same page... and by then i think it'll be so entrenched in mainstream society they won't be able to do it... that's my take on it anyway but who knows?
Did the government ban bitcoin?😂😂😂😂
"The central bank must be trusted not to debase the currency, but the history of fiat currencies is full of breaches of that trust."
Satoshi Nakamoto
This guy knows nothing of Satoshis vision.
Right? and his accent is annoying
This guys combination of knowledge and ignorance is kinda baffling
@@scottwhite8960 lol exactly! I said the same thing almost word for word on a Michael Saylor bitcoin video the other day. It is so hard to listen to people who filter everything they say in order to always sound smart.
ESPECIALLY with an english accent. combine the two and it'll make me throw up a little bit. Unless its david attenborough or the british top gear guys.
“As long as we pay our taxes” is the crux of the matter, both economically, politically, morally and technically.
From which perspective, government or people?
@@justincase4812 Any.
Most do not pay taxes. Wealth is stolen from us...or else!
Nialls first sentence in this clip are evidence of his lack of knowledge in this area
The dude called Ethereum the grater innovation and then throws around the term “smart contracts” as if they are actually a proven thing.
My thoughts exactly... Knows nothing of Satoshis vision.
Wasn't he aware that the Taproot upgrade was being implemented the same week as this interview?
@@edawg654 do smart contracts not exist?
@@zSnipebot looks to Andreas Antenopolous, the term smart contracts is mostly a marketing scam. There is nothing smart nor really contractual about these blind, dumb bits of code. Aside from simple locks and unlocks of fees, based on time, the concept of smart contracts as generally used is flawed for a number of reasons:
1) the Oracle problem - not solved and a huge weakness
2) complexity of human interactions cannot be comprehensively coded
3) a blockchain does not enforce contracts in the real world - nor would we want them to
The best use case of so called smart contracts is the lightning network, but these are not smart contracts in that they are only simple lock and unlock based contracts, they are not “smart”. Dao hacks, Ethereum smart contracts hve little to no use cases except for facilitating casino like gambling. They also suffer from bugs.
These guys make me feel like an idiot
At least I know I'm watching the right videos
We meet again, Mr Bond.
@@danrayson Small w̶o̶r̶l̶d̶ internet. Remind me where we met?
Niall is talking out his ass so don't feel bad.
meh, there are better episodes
“I’m on the side of humor but it is a dangerous activity these days.”
LOL Genesis block (0) LITERALLY has message: "The Times 03/Jan/2009 Chancellor on brink of second bailout for banks" and this guy says Satoshi didn't think there would be inflation. 😆
Niall's NGMI
How could he not know that
Niall’s dishonest in this and other points; how could be bring up Gary Gensler’s comments on what a security is without mentioning that Gensler has drawn a distinction between bitcoin and all others? And that other crypto currencies include trusted third parties in a way that is not the case with bitcoin.
The random Hodler tends to know more than the so called "Experts" about Bitcoin...
Having a grudge against banks isn't quite the same thing as being concerned about inflation.
If you know the FIAT system then you know "a wave of inflation is always coming". I am pretty sure Satoshi knew that all FIAT eventually goes to zero.
No mention of Layer 2, No Country/State adoption, No pristine collateralization of property, insurance, or debts 🤔👍If you're not continuously learning about it your pontifications are utterly useless.
He doesn't know the history or nuance but gets the macro environment
On an unrelated note, Comcast just had a national outage...
Chancellor on the brink of second bailout for banks
Thorough
Niall king of eye contact
everytime somone talk abut BTC on this channel. It goes up :)
Is there any way to introduce artificial contraints in order to reduce energy used by proof of work?
No. And that’s a good thing. The inability to manipulate money is a great use of stranded or otherwise wasted energy. When no one can manipulate money to get more of it people have to actually work and provide real value to get money. I would argue the large use of energy in proof of work is indeed incredibly effective at incentivizing humans to do real work for each other instead of manipulating currency. I sincerely hope we use more energy in mining bitcoin in the future.
I wish there is a way to make those PoW into something that's useful, for example maybe instead of calculating hashes, we can instead solve protein folding, like Folding@Home. That way the work is not completely useless.
When there is a Loan and Mortgage system for BC, then and only then will Crypto replace banking. There will never be a time when credit and loans are not needed.
already exists
Dude.. there's already a lot of players doing this in the space..i'm not sure even banks know how close they are to becoming obsolete... maybe they do.. but they have to put a lot of energy into running good businesses and it doesn't leave a lot of resources for trying to understand and combat the rising disruption tsunami of crypto... anyways guess we'll see
Hmmm. I am not sure you can rightfully say that Satoshi didn't create BTC for fear of breakdown of fiat currencies. The Hash in the Genesis Block clearly refers to a headline that gives a clear indication of intent, asides a timestamp.
If you think Bitcoin is digital gold solely because it has a finite supply of 21 million, then you don't understand cryptocurrency and the layers of decentralization that protect the consensus rules of Bitcoin. The rules of Ethereum are immutable until the next dev meeting decides it's time to hard fork again. Every other cryptocurrency is a wolf in sheep's clothing: decentralized in name only. When Ethereum implemented EIP 1559, how is that any different from a central bank deciding what the monetary issuance is? The answer is that it's not. Even if Ethereum eventually becomes deflationary, it will never be able to call itself digital gold because the culture of the Ethereum network is and has been deferential to the developers.
dont get fooled the meta vers is an alternate alias of Fed Coin which is equal to Central bnk digital currency
No mention on power consumption? It's like building a ship in the desert ignoring that there is no water.
Bitcoin mining doesn’t waste energy, it exploits wasted energy! Bitcoin solves the problem of electricity grid stability.
Wow this guy has some knowledge!🙌
This guy just has a posh voice and doesn’t know shit about Bitcoin.
@@edawg654 Well as soon as anyone discusses crypto currencies in any way the enthusiasts don't 100% agree on the answer is always "xx doesn't understand xxxcoin" and then nothing. That says more than anything
@@gammal586 he doesn’t articulate the difference between different Cryptos, for instance, he doesn’t explain true decentralization vs centralised (POS). He doesn’t explain Proof of Work. He has zero technical understanding of cryptography and elliptical curve cryptography specifically. He talks about blockchain and smart contracts which is a massive fallacy. He mentions nothing about economic incentives combined with software, to provide the first (i repeat) THE FIRST(!!!!) digital scarcity ever by solving the Bazyntines general problem. There you go
Lex, you are a Leader……of the Thought Leaders.
Despite some gaps in his knowledge - _you can't know everything about everything_ . Niall always makes me think he's one the MI6 characters in a Bond movie.
It can if the Internet is killed, watch this space.
The Metaverse will have extra and intranets to avoid this.
Even if the internet is shutdown temporarily the valuable thing with bitcoin is the ledger itself. To destroy it you’d have to either shut down the internet forever or destroy every copy of the ledger in existence. With each passing day the probability of either of those things happening is going down.
My bed can't be killed either. Not because it is so amazing - it is simply not alive.
(Some bed bugs in it might be but not the bed itself)
Isn't the vast majority of BTC owned by only but so many people? IF that is in fact true, then how is it decentralized and how is that better?
Lol it’s decentralised in a point that even if you have majority of the coins you can’t influence consensus of a distributed system. It happened during the bitcoin civil war where big exchanges and whales lost on that war!
What about the encrypted message he included?
Devs have too much power, the exchanges are a weak link, and hackers are a huge problem.
The world doesn't need digital currencies unless it also decides it doesn't need sovereign governments. Bitcoin doesn't have to be the only "digital currency" (misnomer) and in fact the higher the price goes the worse it is for the world as a whole.
No, Boomer. Sit down and be quiet until you know better
Except by a solar flare.. of course
It’s also Oasis Rose Crypto. They’ve been working with BMW and Meta regarding financial privacy and AI processes.
This guy is a cartoon character. Ethereum is an insider oligarchy. Bitcoin IS digital scarcity. It cant be invented twice. Everything ETH does, bitcoin will do it better on layers 2 and 3.
Taproot upgrade!
He must be an adviser to the Brandon admin. HFSP listening to his views on Bitcoin.
Famous last words
Revised to hit 7,000 and may go below that, especially if the Fed decides to get involved, which they may given the best time is at its weakest.
One thing not to forget. When the infrastructure fails. And you have no internet. You have nothing. Yes I am nuts.
Bit coin is great and all. But if you have no network you have no coin. History has taught us over the ages. that networks come and go.
Did the internet come and go? 😂😂😂
The balls of steel
It can and it will
If there is a world war financial status will not matter what will matter is food water and shelter and being able to understand nature deeply so that you can survive through its abundance.
Electrical grid? Emp
ok I dont understand the Bitcoin is finite "feature" that seems to be a selling point because not selling bitcoins as wholes effectively increased the number a 1000 fold. As an example if there where only 100 bitcoin but the lowest amount you can trade is a 1/100th of a coin then you really have 10,000 tradable units not 100. Isnt the ability to fragment the coin make it not finite?
Bitcoina are divisible down to the Satoshi level...there are 100 million Satoshis per a single Bitcoin.
fragmenting cannot decrease the value of the coins. For example, suppose persons A and B have 1 coin each. Each of them has half of the total supply. If these coins are fragmented, each of them would still have half of the supply. If a new coin was generated for person C, then A and B would now have only 1/3 of the total supply, so in practice this would devalue their coins.
At some point, no new bitcoins will be prodcued. Thus, the ammount of Bitcoin is finite. The ability to divide into subunits... I see as more a question of discrete vs continuous /smoothness.
@@dilsonlucaspereira8947 O ok because the increase comes from within the system and not external, the total percentage of ownership doesnt change with increasing the subunits inside that system. Ok it is making sense now thanks for taking the time.
It's hilarious that people think Bitcoins bug, it's finite nature, is actually a feature.
Anything finite such as gold could never function as a usable currency foundation for a planet with exponential human growth unless the goal is for 1% of the population to eventually accumulate the majority of coins, thus leaving the masses with either an extremely unstable inflated currency of crumbs to fight over or just the end of anything resembling a modern functional economic system.
Modern money is a unit to exchange between real economic activity and as such needs to be extremely liquid and abundant so that everyone can participate and live a good life. It's makes no difference and doesn't cause inflation if the fed allows banks to print more and traders use to trade with each other as long as regulation keep a firewall between speculators and items deemed necessary for the broader economy, real things we all need.
The idea that the finite nature is a feature is ignorance which is why we got off the gold standard in the 1st place, something right wingers and Libertarians have been objecting to ever since because it took the control of the economy from moralists and the greedy, kings and queens, away and turned modern economics into a mathematical problem divorced from social control....
whereas with a finite currency, the control of the economy rests in the hands and idelogy of the minority who eventually will buy it all up and use it to control you via setting the rules under which they release enough to you to buy food, housing, etc.
Huh.. so war is a miscalculation .
they could make it illegal
If they seek to regulate data they will have to regulate all data
How do you say fiat is dead when people are valuing crypto for what they can get for it back in fiat?
The core of why a currency is good is not for its quantitative speculation, but the capacity it can be used for exchange to create sustainably. That's the bottom line. What side a person takes in regards to this is whether they are still taking about currencies as commodities, or what the money is for. Happy to discuss, LF, if you want to interview someone who isn't famous. If it all about cachet, well, then, I am not your man. buxxb ...
Bitcoin will kill not the opposite. 1 BTC = 1 Kg Gold = checkmate
1 btc = 1 btc
@@seanc06791 need time for that, firstly you need a fixed asset comparison
1 btc = 1 btc
Bitcoin and Ethereum will take a dive when the equity markets crash, since relatively “uncorrelated” positions are used for margin calls. The same is true for paper gold. Quantum cryptography will decide the next money regime.
Total BS, market crash will cause a shift to a more robust store of value. That is Bitcoin. Quantum cryptography is simply a fancy word salad until it's put into practice if ever.
Anyone who says that last sentence doesn't understand quantum mechanics nor do they understand cryptography.
solar flares hello?
"I come from Glasgow" - you're trying to hide it
So it can't be killed, but it can die and be used as a weapon.
When the market corrects, Bitcoin will be the first asset sold off to pay for bills. It's only then do we know the true value.
i don't see conflict and war, easy over.
because no other way...
It’s all fun and games until there’s negative effects from cryptos usage within a government’s jurisdiction as judged by the government. At that point, government will want to regulate crypto
15:42 neither, you'd want guns, food and shelter.
The Genesis Block (first block) of bitcoin contains the newspaper headline, "Chancellor on Brink of Second Bailout". Satoshi himself put that there, both as proof of the time bitcoin started as well as commentary on WHY bitcoin was created: as an alternative solution to a fatally flawed fiat banking monetary system. So how can Ferguson miss that Satoshi most definitely was farsighted, and seriously expect us to think Bitcoin was just "internet money"?
Gave it 60 seconds. Heard enough.
So bullish! I just love his comments. Smart guy
Once this man said, "banks create money, not central banks" he became instantly credible.
Once he said eth was the greater innovation he lost his credibility.
It is annoying that he was using metaverse in every sentence !
Richard Heart ❤️ is the crypto guy you need to interview
When has DEFLATION ever been a problem? WTF is Niall Ferguson talking about why was he worried about deflation in 2008???? Can anyone explain?
The more people that have “the balls of steel” you speak of will determine the level of financial freedom we attain
Several states accept Bitcoin to pay for taxes
Pyramid shadow distance pillar direction gravity fruit sold
ZERO!
Niall’s NGMI
A U.S. dollar backed stable coin will be the next evolution of digital fiat currencies and BTC is and will be the dominant digital asset
Why's he bashi g the sec and regulators. He should know very well, why they exist and why we (including him and lex) WANT them to exist.
With the energy it requires to farm bitcoin makes me think it wont last. its not feasible for the long term
Bitcoin is the only thing that is judged that way. How much energy is used by video gamers around the world? How much recharging cellphones? How much does google use? Perhaps an asset that can revolutionize financial markets and give people a safe haven from inflation, government theft, and ridiculous fees from 3rd party services is worth the energy expenditure.
It's an interesting argument.. although i think that renewable energy/battery storage will improve alongside the increasing energy needs of crypto so it may well just even out and be all good
"The Times 03/Jan/2009 Chancellor on brink of second bailout for banks."
Middle men “taking a cut” and his example is “taking out a mortgage?” 😆 My lord I need to break my silence and start speaking out.
This guy needs to read the BTC white paper first.
Niall, i think you mean Terra Lunas UST as the perfect stablecoin.
Luna all day
Oof! This didn't age well.
Ofc they can kill it. Compel credit card companies to cancel the accounts of exchanges.
Research bisq.
Bitcoin is great but it can be tracked. Central bank digital currencies are more private. Monero is the solution
4 months is a long time in crypto life. It aint doing so well at the moment.
~ "Typing your credit card number into a random website is not a way to pay over the Internet"
Sorry sir, but that is precisely the fastest, the cheapest, the best way to pay over the Internet. No cryptocurrency comes close currently. Also, from the UX perspective, there is very little difference between paying via a credit card and using a crypto wallet.
"It can't be killed" Sure you're right. But it sure as hell can get dumped ill tell ya that brother, also can get pumped
Dump is a strong word when referring to btc correction
US developing post-quantum crypto algorithms... From whom? Im guessing. China and Russia. Those two bums have nothing better to do.
i just sent £5 of eth between 2 of my own wallet addresses. gas fee £30. there are better blockchains than ethereum now that scale to be inclusive all people to be able to use it and not exclude through usage costs being obscene
Why were you making that transaction in the first place
This is why im not a great fan of ETH, I own some which I bought for "cheap", but I only own it because I see alot of people seem to like it and talk about it alot, however as a way to pay for things, gas fees just kill it.
If im honest I could almost say the same thing about BTC, however it isnt as bad, tho one crypto that blows me away when it comes to paying for things or moving money about is DOGE.
Its "similar" to BTC in a way, but the main thing that I often see with doge is people can send hundred of thousands or even millions of dollars worth of doge for sometimes the cost of a doge.
I see a world in the future where BTC is the digital gold that backs up other forms of crypto that are used as cash.
I havent quite worked out all the kinks, but I really do see it as the future in some shape or form.
@@Primal_Primat3 We’re either going to a digital future or not. Previous wealth will go to gold because they don’t understand the first thing about btc or blockchain so can’t comprehend that there is a much better version of gold now. Seriously if we’re going back to gold we’re fucked..
Its either a digital future blockchain systems generating value or nothing as far as i can see but maybe the 70+ have a vision without tech that we all yet to understand 😉
@@roykeane1922 ironically to fund gas fees on a decentralised exchange
@@adamski4678 Some of the old dogs cant be taught new tricks, however everyday they are fewer and fewer.
Slowly their money will leave gold and the new blood that inherits it, changes it into new things.
Lol. I guess I have balls of steel.
This guy NGMI.
Can't be killed or CAN BE TAXED TO DEATH ?
Doesn't know the difference between Bit and Shit.
Ethereum an innovation of Bitcoin? This guy is a scammer.
Bitcoin already is the Global Reserve Asset of the world. Transact in fiat and save in Bitcoin.
I see a day we save in BTC and trade in DOGE.
Like listening to Ferguson and he is brilliant, but he's obviously at the mercy of other people's narratives about BTC and ETH.
So the Government won't be able to see my day to day Crypto transactions but every Corporation I transact with will.
These guys do not understand Bitcoin.
bitcoin can be killed is very easy just closed down the exchange from country origin.... this clips made me think from this channel :(
Paper money is backed by governments. Crypto is backed by…..?
Private individuals, which are more reliable then governments. The next time, don’t use Amazon and Apple. Use your government.
@ Sure they are.
Did he disclose how much btc he owns? Just a guess but there is bias here lol