Everyone knows what happened. “Kathleen Kennedy”…….okay everybody ……Disney needs to make a lot of money off Star Wars. So give me some ideas. “Disney story group”………How about we make the movies really bad. Then write a bunch of books to explain everything and get even more money from the fans while we explain what should have been in the movie in the first place. “Kathleen Kennedy”…….Brilliant !!!!
@@LeftJoystick I mean it's way easier to ignore because the fans of Tolkien have considered the books as the defacto media and everything else is secondary fiction. It helps that the books were the only storyline to follow for decades before anything else ever came about.
@@LeftJoystick There is. Just read the Tolkien lore. Tolkien’s books by him or edited by his son is the only things that are canon. Everything else is just interpretations.
I swear, the more they try to fix the sequel trilogy's problems by making things up, the worst they get. The Sith dagger is easily one of the dumbest plot devices I have ever seen.
@@kamixakadio2441 I havent watched GoT, but I can agree. No series/movie franshise has ever seen such a random drop in quality/creativity from the prequels & OT to the sequels. Star wars is special in my opinion, because the best movie ever (in my opinion) is a star wars movie, but the worst movie ever (in my opinion) is also a star wars movie.
I totally agree with you on that book. The author really had a difficult job and made the best of it. I really loved how he characterized Luke and Lando and their friendship, it felt like their adventures in the old EU days - even including the drinking of hot chocolate. But I just cannot forgive that characters make decisions that are beyond stupid (e.g. Rey's parents giving her to Unkar Plutt because it's apparently a good thing he only takes care of her for the money (It obviously isn't. If someone with more money comes along, Unkar will sell Rey!)). Also, if you really think about it, Lando should have been able to put 2 and 2 together in Episode IX: He should have realized Rey is the girl they followed years earlier and whose parents were murdered by Ochi.
You are absolutely right! This whole story is kinda of ridiculous. I mean if Rey's parents knew or were in contact Luke and Lando why couldn't they leave Rey with one of them or any of Luke's allies in the New Republic. Or better yet why couldn't they all hide with Luke or ask for help from the New Republic? Why leave Rey at Jakku at all? I'm so confused.
Again, this is not that hard... Let them leave Rey with unka plot's wife, brother, father, relative, rival, but they died and if it's unka plot's rival, he killed himself and Rey got transferred to him as a slave... And if you say Rey said her parent's left her with unka plot, you can say she was an unreliable narrator because she was a kid then and couldn't tell the difference between are original guardian and unka because they're the same species... Adults in real life can't tell the difference between Asians except Asians themselves, it would be very far from a stretch that little Rey couldn't tell the difference between her guardian and unka plot... This is not that hard... Or perhaps unka plot and Rey lived in a different part of jakku but he had to leave his old home and business to hide Rey and became bitter overtime about it and planned to work Rey to death for his lost wealth... You just have to know how to write so stop giving excuses to hacks because they tried a little... That wouldn't help them improve and you have no reason to feel bad for them... They got paid a whole lot than you so it's not like they're destitute writers trying their best... You'll just allow them to be nonchalant about their writings because little good work is enough to get a little clap from critics and that's enough for them... They've gotten paid... You should save that pity and goodwill for japanese mangaka who get paid shit after their manga releases and starts getting cash... And that's why their stories and lengths and breadths better than western comics, because their livelihoods depends on their comics succeeding... So stop pitying pathetic writers just because... It makes stories worse not better...
There was a time when people would write novels because they were inspired by a great story and wanted to expand the world in which this story takes place. Now is the time when people HAVE TO write novels to try to fix all the plot holes a shitty story left behind it...
Not being explained events that take place in a time period outside the scope of the film does not make these plot holes. If I write a book about an elderly wizard fighting a dragon, his childhood and birth aren't plot holes just because the book follows him at the end of his life....
Exactly. You can't make sense of senselessness. Mystery boxes within mystery boxes...that got prematurely burned in the middle of their making. Hence, why I want NOTHING TO DO with a scenario where creative collaborators like Dave Filoni, Jon Favreau, George Lucas, Jon Watts, and Chris Ford, to name just a handful, have to contort their minds, trying to "fix" what should never have been in the first place. I have made a near-absolute vow to not read or watch ANYTHING that tasks itself with trying to rationalize the shit show that was The Sequel Trilogy. Just forget its existence. If it can't (or, probably won't) be erased from official (Lucas-verse) canon, then avoid much of its legacy, through alternative stories that focus on their own unique epic characters, histories, events, and situations that don't involve or include themselves with the major aspects of The ST. Honestly, I'm more interested in reading the unreleased The Mandalorian original novel, that Adam Christopher wrote over a year ago, for The Mandalorian Publishing Initiative (which, interestingly enough, DID publish and recently release issue #4 of the comic adaptation of The Mandalorian, which features the introduction of Carasynthia Dune...a character that Kennedy & Co. determined would never be depicted or acknowledged again in The SWU...is there hope for a return of both Gina and Cara in the works?), which sounds way more interesting than this wanna-fix-it-all novel...
Agreed Anthony. Filoni, Favreau, and Lucas adding their takents and helping fix Sequel Trilogy SW won't work. It's like mixing poop and ice cream: you won't mess up the poop, but you'll ruin the ice cream.
I just follow the original EU (aka Legends), baring the Legacy Era, when it comes to post-RotJ continuity. Sure it got wonky at times *cough*CrystalStar*cough*, had far too many pyrrhic victory stories, and wasn't exactly the most well-constructed narrative, but at least it didn't make the entire damn Original Trilogy pointless and cause you to lose brain cells trying to make sense of it.
@@joaopedrorosa6198 dozens of stories have been jettisoned from canon in one fell swoop. they could do the same to the sequel trilogy down the line. it is not popular enough and too canon breaking to stand the test of time
Exactly. It's absolutely ridiculous. Sadly it's symptomatic of the disrespectful way Disney have treated not only Star Wars itself, but especially Star Wars fans. What a joke.
That's sadly characteristic of Abrams' movies. There was a four comic book mini-series that functioned as a set up for the events of the 2009 Star Trek movie, which laid out the biggest WTF of that movie: how a "mining ship" got the tech to take out a dozen starships without so much as flinching. There's a similar mini-series for Star Trek Into Darkness, though the only real question about that movie is how a guy who looked like Ricardo Montalban ended up looking like Benedict Cumberbatch!
You know the sequels failed when 3rd party media is used to fix it rather than expand upon it. Honestly, the only thing that could draw me into the sequel era is if they re-canonized the Yuuzhan Vong (with a few tweaks of course). After all, it would make perfect sense for them to invade the galaxy now that the First Order is in ruins and the Resistance is too weak to restore the Republic.
The First Order is in ruins? 2 or 3 ships of theirs were destroyed, out of their endless fleet, while the resistance is literally a couple of people. It doesn't seem to me like anything changed in the powers, maybe that the resistance managed to decimate themselves. I might be wrong about the specifics, I only watched TROS once, and I am not willing to watch it again. But for me the message was nothing really has changed, other than they lost the resistance and Luke and Leia, and Rey is out as well (buried the ligtsaber).
@@buskergirl It's suggested that the First Order is stretched too thin across the galaxy and the galaxy is rising against them. That's why they needed the death star destroyer fleet.
@@vetarlittorf1807 didn't First Order have ton of infrastructure in Unknown Regions, can't they just replenish from there? They really only defeated Final Order in the movie
Serious question: why do so many of the Disney-era featured aliens -- e.g. Maz, Ochi, the four-arm doc in 'Andor' -- look like (typically orange-ish) lemonheads? And Rey's mother's name -- Mir-mir (?) --is the joke-name of Thor's hammer Mjolnir?
Q: How exactly did Palpatine come back? A: He didn‘t. This is a new Palpatine in a remake/reboot. He also dies in much the same way, through his own lightning. His plotline is written to appear as if there is a continuity, but there obviously is none. Q: Why did Rey’s parents leave her on Jakku? A: They didn’t. This is just a remake/reboot. Jakku is Tattooine, also used the old McQuarrie art for Tatttooine. Rey’s parents serve as mystery box and plot twist, because that was an important part of the original formula that is rebooted.
A lot of people say can a clone wars like show fix the sequels? To that I say we kinda already have one that being resistance but given that nobody talks about that show that really proves how ineffective it was. Damn after years of asking for an episode 7 not only do we finally have it we have 8 and 9 and most people I talk to don’t like them and to somewhat quote C-3PO “I don’t like them either”.
True. Having said that, and knowing nothing will ever make this mess beloved, or even 'really good', a six or seven year show incorporating things like the book 'Bloodline', and given time to at least give some explanation to the countless things unexplained or nonsensical, seems like the only way forward if they want to fix things. But yea, still a mess.
The biggest problem with that argument is that there was nothing wrong with the story of the prequels. Their biggest issue was in the dialogue department and, to some extent, the pacing of the stories. But the overall story was an excellent one and there are numerous subtleties that The Clone Wars was able to build on. One of the frequently cited reasons for The Clone Wars being great was how it made Anakin into a genuine hero. Part of Anakin's negative portrayal in the sequel movies is that we are seeing him during arguably the two lowest points in his life (when he begins his turn towards evil and when he completes it), but The Clone Wars was able to show Anakin at his high point of being a hero. It showed him as courageous, caring, charismatic, and so many positive aspects of him that couldn't really be fleshed out as much in the films because of the focus on his flaws. I'd say the prequels just needed another draft or two and we'd have only a scattering of complaints about them. By contrast, the sequels completely fall apart when it comes to story-telling, be it as individual movies, an overall narrative, and especially as part of a greater whole. They aren't something that can be fixed through expansion like the sequels because they are broken on a basic level.
Nothing is going to fix those movies or make them make sense in any way. Nothing against those who enjoy them, I am glad they do, but honestly, it's just bonkers.
I agree to me its like trying to fix a mirror. It’s better to leave it broken and discard it rather than hurting yourself (and/or possibly others) trying to fix it.
The sheer level of incompetence involved in these movies is honestly mind-boggling. I will never understand how any of this got approved, honestly. That is the most amazing thing about these movies. I can't even pretend to be understanding of those who enjoy these movies. I know tastes differ and all that, be tolerant and accepting etc. etc. - but if someone says they love these movies, I question the way they look at things. I question their intelligence, even. It's insane that these turned out the way they did, it's a completely new category of bad.
I know at least one very smart person who thought TLJ was the greatest thing since sliced bread. iunno man. I just don't know. but there it is. (TLJ was the lowest point in my SW "life" and I've never truly felt insulted watching a movie until I saw Luke Skywalker slurping freshly milked lizard juice).
Because if your not a Star Wars fan and don’t really care about the saga then rise of skywalker wasn’t bad at all. Not saying it was amazing or anything but definitely isn’t unwatchable in the eyes of non Star Wars fans
@@honcore1443 that's an unusual take. I would have said that point of view was more fitting for *The Last Jedi* than *Rise of Skywalker* There were illogical plot aspects in both movies, but from a technical and basic plot logic perspective, RoS was inept and nonsensical whereas the general reactions to TLJ (from ppl who hated it) were visceral and emotional (as in "Rian Johnson just shit on my childhood hero!" sort of stuff). Iunno how else to explain it. RoS was just a bunch of sketches pasted together with little or no connection to each other. It felt like a movie that started filming and wrote the plot around the scenes rather than the scenes around a plot.
@@honcore1443 Have to disagree. As lore-breaking as The Last Jedi is, it is followable as a story, though I can't call it good. Unless the only thing you're looking for is flashiness, the Rise of Skywalker is just a messy series of "and this happened, and then this happened" over and over again.
Even a well written book, trying to fix a mishandled story, is still just a mess. You can polish a story as best as you can, but if the main support of the story is trash. Well, rot starts at the core.
That's right. It's like taking two turds and whittling them down into fecal chopsticks so you can pick up three turds all the while you tell everyone you make the chopsticks out of turds so you don't get crap on your hands when you were hired to move the three turds. It's all about turds. And the SUCK-QUEL TRILOGY is a trio of turds.
Exactly! A gilded turd may shine like gold, but it doesn't stink any less at the end of the day, and you still want to wash your hands if you have the misfortune of touching it...
I started to read this book but now... dunno. I've never understood how the story of the OT characters after the OT was not made into an animated show or expanded upon in some way in the new cannon. I think almost all Star Wars fans love the OT (despite the division around the other trilogies) and everyone wants to see what they did next. And the only glimpse we get, Luke in the Mando show, is one of the most talked about moments in Star Wars.
And even then they pissed on the OT characters. In the Boba Fett show they made Luke give Grogu the choice between his connection to Mando and the Jedi. When it goes against everything Luke went though becoming a Jedi and redeeming his father.
There is no way they were ever be able to explain the Sith dagger. The entirety of that concert - from how it exists in the first place to it marching up with the Death Star ruins - literally makes zero sense as it is.
Someone in another comments section said something along the lines of "uh... They make a point that the ocean is too turbulent for folks to safely get to the death star ruins. Nobody could have scavenged it" as if this isn't a franchise with hovercraft and spaceships lmao even if you make the argument that the ruins might be considered too unstable for peeps to poke around there's still droids they could send in. Surely Empire artifacts (especially from a death star) would fetch more than enough credits to cover any loss of life, droids, or damaged equipment
And if that is the case that doesn't match what we see in the movie as the characters get there no problem and if the ocean was that turbulent, the protractor feature wouldn't work because the ruins would move.
Also... Hold on That's a really Good point... Luke started a jedi school but didn't think to go over the death star wreckage and at least try and find all the sith items to try and stop anyone from Turing to the dark side
Morbid curiosity brought me here... I'm pretty sure I felt my braincells dying while listening to that recap. I can only imagine what has happened to you while trying to make sense of that nonsense. I appreciate your sacrifice.
I’ll never forgive Disney for having years and years worth of content to draw from and tweak here and there and just completely ignoring it. I think I speak for quite a few people when I say we don’t care if old stories got put on the big screen. That’s actually what we want lol
The greater paradox is that people that say they love the sequels tend to also love every last thing Marvel; which just is condensed stories being retold on the big screen.
When your story takes years of supplemental material just to explain how the basic plot could even happen, you wrote a bad story. JJ and Rian wrote a bad story.
And wasn't just any franchise they screwed up. It was STAR WARS. Shame on them. And there's nothing anyone can say that will make me like these two clowns.
The way Abrams treated the Kobayashi Maru in his Star Trek reboot series told me long ago that he really doesn't understand storytelling. For him he thinks a story is member-berries and mystery boxes so he shoves things in that don't fit the narrative or make any sense. In the original story, Kobayashi Maru fit the story as it was a no-win situation which was later reflected in the climax with Wrath of Khan. It also reflected that Kirk had avoided it by cheating but found himself in a real no-win situation losing his best friend in the process. With Abrams it was just pointlessly shoved in for member-berries but it didn't serve the story or the character in the slightest. The Sith Dagger was just shoved in like an Indiana Jones' relic - a thing to lead to a thing but with his story these are ancient things long buried and forgotten not a huge technological thing that would have attracted scavengers much like Rey was at the beginning of the series! Why would an assassin need such a map to find another rmacguffin to point to some planet. The goal was the planet and everyone just ended up there anyway rendering the whole quest pointless.
Also don’t forget that the Darth Vader comics shows Ochi getting his eyes burned by looking at the limitless power of the kyber crystals. He then gets the eye implants afterward. So now it seems his eyes were damaged twice in his lifetime.
"Cloning, secrets only the Sith knew about." So only the Sith knew about cloning, you say? Well Jar Jar Abrams, let me introduce you to this creature known as a Kaminoan.
My big issue is why did he have a language he wasn't programmed to translate in his databanks? Shouldn't it not be there so he can't translate it at all and it just brings up an error 404 screen? It reminds of that joke of someone asking if you know what it is they say yes and walk away.
@@Ruylopez778 No he didn't period. That is what he sent the droids. He is not stupid even on Tatooine a red and black and dude with yellow eyes and dressed in all black would stick out. And he had three potiential towns to search.
I’ve said it before and i’ll say it again! When you need a book to explain the storyline, or sections of, in a film/franchise then the writers of film/franchise have failed. If other media needs to explain and expand upon other media so it makes sense then that’s a massive failure in my book.
There's only one way to fix this plot. Luke wakes up, turns to his wife "I just had a horrible nightmare" he says. "Go back to sleep Skywalker" Mara responds. -There fixed. And I didn't need 3 books and 20 blogs to do it.
1: Why does the wreckage exist when the station was atomised in ROTJ? 2: Why is the wreckage on another planet & not Endor? (its like our moon exploding & the debris falling on Mars) 3: What are the odds on the Emperor's spire surviving & landing in such a convenient location? 4: Why is the interior of the throne room upright when the exterior lies on its side? 5: Why is there even power to open doors? 6: Why is JJ so successful?
Even if you can fix stupid in books, it won’t change the movies, unless they re film them to match. The sequels are the perfect example of (purposely)wasted opportunity.
Thanks for the review of Christopher Adam's Shadow of the Sith. I have read the book and enjoyed it. Even wrote up the Wookieepedia plot summary. I think Adam did a good job given the plot holes and problems plaguing the Sequel Trilogy. Ochi comes across as a evil narcissist who doesn’t think straight and acts on impulse most of the time. While I liked how the novel explored Luke and Lando’s friendship, I find it hard to believe that two adults would be unable to find Rey. Much as I liked how the novel developed Rey’s parents Dathan and Miramir as characters, I didn’t like how the plot was written to keep them one step ahead of meeting Luke and Lando. By the way, Miramir is the name of a suburb in the Nea Zealand city of Wellington. Christopher is a Kiwi who lives in the UK so he must have picked Miramir as a name that is both exotic to fans and familiar for him. I liked how the novel drew upon other Canon and Legends elements like Exim Panshard and Kiza from Chuck Wendig’s Aftermath trilogy and the Corporate Sector Authority. Panshard and Kiza were good villains and diversions who prevented Skywalker from uncovering the true threat of Palpatine. Would appreciate a video on Panshard and Kiza as villains.
Like I said before their isnt really a reason to buy star wars books anymore since it's just used material to fill in plot holes only to be later retconned.
@@АлексейМомот-щ7о Mostly it was the media not hardcore fans. It was a vocal minority. And they raised criticisms that ignored the facts given in the movies. For example complaining about how Obi-Wan knows R2-D2 in the Prequels by claiming the Original Trilogy he never meet him ingoring that Ben only said he never recalled owning a droid and nothing more. Or saying the Midiclorians created the force which isn't what The Phantom Menace said only they allowed Jedi to communicate with it.
@@АлексейМомот-щ7о We could argue about the quality of the prequels, I think they are great, albeit with flaws, but they are NOT canon breaking. As opposed to the sequels, which ARE canon breaking. The prequels dont need patching. The sequels cant be patched.
I'm actually writing my own story that largely explains the logic in the Sequels & it's difficult I'll tell ya. But I have some interesting politics about Palpatine's successors, who Snoke is, & eventually including stuff about Rey's past & grumpy Luke. Wish me luck! ✌️
@BK Beatty And that's the semi-beautiful thing about this backstory story, it'll take years to make any one Sequel thing logical so I'll always have something to busy myself, plus I love story writing
I used to love your videos, I now don't even save them in Playlists to watch later like I used to, and it's no fault of your own. Star Wars was my favorite franchise and because of Disney destroying it, I just dont care to hear about it anymore even though I'd spend hours and days watching videos on it before. I was about to put this video in a Playlist for later and didn't even feel the want to do that so much, so felt I should st least share a comment to lament for this once great franchise.
I’ve tried to think up reasons for the dagger before, but you can’t get around the plot holes that pop up over and over, but that doesn’t mean you shouldn’t try. I would have had a cult among the sith that is dedicated to foreseeing the future just as their master Sidious had done, but not being a master as he was they were only ever partly successful and not entirely stable, the plots they create from their visions twisted and convoluted. One see’s the child they will need finding the waypoint using the dagger as a marker so they reshape the dagger to be as their vision showed and send it out into the galaxy, one of many plots set in motion, many becoming nothing as the thread of time is severed before it can happen, but this one playing out as foreseen. Of course this idea opens up the ‘Just as I planned’ plot trap, where any nonsense can be explained away by the villain saying this was the plan all along, and sometimes that works for the story, like in ROTJ with Palpatine foreseeing Luke’s coming before him but not how it would ultimately end or die hard with Hans needing the FBI to cut the power to get into the vault. But there are countless films where this really doesn’t work, go on, let your mind wander, yep, there’s one. A well written story can make most things work, building a well written story from a foundation of sand, that really sounds like an uphill battle all the way.
Honestly the fact that they're *still* persistent in their attempt to just do all this damage control after all this time is insane. First they let the audience (AKA the fanaticals from Twitter) do the work for them when it comes to discussing why some stupid actions "aCtUalLy MaKe SeNsE bEcAuSe It'S rEaLisTiC" to now all these writers trying to do their work for them. Piecing together each and every puzzles only for every puzzle to remain incomplete or pieces placed in sections that aren't right at all. In other words, they either fail to answer all of our questions or bring rise to more problems.
It hit me as I was listening to this: imagine if they ironed out the details of this book and instead, converted it into a screenplay and made this story Episode VII? You've done a few things then: - Luke is still the main character and you've set up his quest for this trilogy. Or at least the first two films, maybe - You've set up that Palpatine is coming back and they need to stop his return, only to fail and he does indeed come back in IX - There are high stakes cos we know that there is a lot at stake in this race against time to stop the return of the Sith and there is loads of room for drama and tension I dunno. What do you think?
Yes, I suffered from delirium due to high fevers when I was a child but never I could have believed that one would get paid to write anything like the script to TRoS. However, even if the script writers for the Sequals did do "drugs" that incapacitated any logical thought or story line... Even then most of the plot still made not sense!
Yeah you would think there'd be organizations from corporations to the new Republic to Pirates who would salivate over what they could find in the wreckage of the Death Star
eBay listing: "Only used once. Genuine Death Star part. No reserve." Nobody would simply ignore a giant piece of the Death Star sitting on a planet without scavenging it. Nobody.
that is the ONE scene i could never even bother to try to rationalize or find logic to.... like.... really? it just happens to match the remains of a blown up death star? she just happens to line it up correctly... no weather shifting? scav's? .... there's a lot of stuff disney did that i can at least see what they were trying.... this scene tho, makes no gawd dwamn sense.
Oh well... Why? Just... Why? 🙄 They need to forget about the sequels. It's how I already said: as more you mess with sh*t, the worse is going to be the smell.
The biggest issue I have is that Anakin should know where the wayfinders are and should've led Luke to one at least. Especially the one Kylo gets. Like, come on it's dumb to give Vader this knowledge and then forget, hey, he became a Force Ghost that can speak to anyone any time he wants. Especially his SON. This shit just gets worse and worse over time.
I thoroughly enjoyed this book, mostly the Luke/Sith stuff. Yes, well-written overall, but trying to fully patch up the sequels is like trying to patch up a boat with too many holes before you get to port. The sequels are not like the prequels in that supplemental material will enhance them further. With how much work there is to make them make more sense, the amount of convoluted content needed might just make it worse.
The Critical Drinker did a brilliant video where he described how badly TRS was written with the Sith Dagger as nothing more than a MacGuffin and the plot more like a series side quests of a video game rather than a feature film.
This is why I think that they need to retcon that trilogy, and that I could run Star Wars better. Like, let's be real, I have zero qualifications. I'm not a writer, I don't know how to edit or even film good or anything, I have no management experience... like I have no knowledge or skills relevant to running Star Wars... but I DO know that PLANNING your trilogy makes it SO MUCH BETTER. and they supposedly have that whole Continuity Group... definitely shouldn't be hard to just find someone competent, sit ten down and say, "Alright, plan this trilogy with your team. We'll find competent directors after." Because you don't necessarily just want to hire directors like Michael Bay or Spielberg or whatever... even if they have some sort of "Vision" and WANT to make a Star Wars movie... You need to make sure they can fit within your plans... if it's for the trilogy. But you CAN just find some "brilliant auteur" or whatever and be like, "Alright, your movie will be set 4,000 years before the Original Trilogy. Make up new characters. It'll be fine." or "Oh, you want to do something after Episode 9? Okay, your movie is 10 years later. Let me know what characters you need." or whatever. Like, it was SO incompetently run, even I could run it better. And the books can't fix it, because it was just that bad.
Fixing a story is different than explaining it more in depth. Contribution can be healthy (ex. Clone Wars) but trying to excessively "fix" a bad story will only make the story and the universe surrounding it worse.
You know what. I'm happy that the Disney Squeals exist, because they got me into the original Sequel Trilogy (to me at least) Star Wars Fate of the Jedi. On book 7 and its LEAGUES better than anything Disney can think up
BOOOOM- someone finally nailed it thank you-first person outside myself-tie do not have hyperdrives, it was a big upgrade in first order tie's and the tie striker
3:47 - the worst reason to write a novel EVER. 19:05 - a hallmark of contemporary bad sci-fi/fantasy writing. Characters suddenly become morons because the author needs it to happen.
It makes me so sad to just not care about new Star Wars books. I used to watch those release dates like a hawk. Now, it takes your video breaking through my apathy to hear the news of a new book that I just don’t care about. Star Wars used to be such a big part of my life. It’s like a divorce almost.
After reading 40-50 or more EU books, I’ve given up. Whatever that book was in between 8 and 9 was where they tried to steal a few fighters to rebuild their “fleet” was the breaking point. I listened to the audio book and it seriously put me to sleep a dozen times. Every book in this time period since the Aftermath trilogy is complete garbage. It seems like nobody at Disney cares so why should I.
I wouldn't give the time of day to a book which came out over 2 and a half years after the sequels ended, trying to 'fix' and explain story threads and plot points that should have been planned, made sense and been competently written in the first place.
Ocean not a convienet location? They have ships that fly across the galaxy and can hover.... Anywhere is convienet to get to in the sw universe if you have a ship!
If they insisted on a dagger map it should have lead to a secret city of sith younglings palpatine was raising. Just a massive dark side city of angry moody teenagers held in check by the most adept among them. And maybe.... a clone of luke Skywalker instructing, and punishing them, grown from his severed hand.
The book is like an analogy my history teacher gave me. If a football player gets a major injury and is bleeding heavily you need heavy stitches after a big operation. But instead they only applied a band aide
Lesser franchises have direct to video sequels that are better and more coherent than the Disney trilogy. Trying to make sense of their stupid writing just makes things even stupider.
I read it a couple of months ago. I agree with much of what was said in this video article. Well written. I don't think anyone could come up with anything better to explain the sequel trilogy. Yes, there are dumb decisions made at the end. Yes it is incredibly improbably that Luke and 6 year old Rey were so close to meeting but didn't. Now I imagine this.... In episode VIII when Luke asks Rey "Who ARE you?" it makes a little sence because he has a sense of her from this book. (Rey didn't know she was supposed to say "I was the little girl in that ship from 13 years ago." lol)
I almost feel sorry for these poor writers who have to figure out how to piece this thing together in retrospect. Literally none of this BS makes any sense.
A great example of trying to fix a mess by adding more trash to it. It's impossible to fix ROS or the sequels in general, there's just too much broken that cannot be rationalized. In trying to make it better, the best they can do is make it worse. The only way to fix a catastrophic mess is to throw it all out.
Thanks for keeping up with the books Thor. It’s a dirty job but someone has got to do it. Since the beginning Disney Star Wars has used books, comics and cartoons as a crutch to explain the world so they can just focus on lightsabers ans explosions. I’ve watched a lot of SW video essays and some of the questions people ask I know the answers to because I read this or that book. That is not how things should go. One day I hope Star Wars has a comeback like Game of Thrones and Westeros has had thanks to the superb House of the Dragon. Maybe Andor is getting the ball rolling but I don’t see things changing till most of the creative team gets replaced
I stopped giving a damn about the Disney trilogy, and all books connected to it after TLJ. Aside from the Ashoka book, I refuse to buy anything except some "Legends" books that I'm missing.
Unkar Plutt must have been a great father and a good choice to leave Rey with. He raised Rey who ended up with unshakable good morals, is an amazingly combatant, and great mechanic & electrician.
![[MV] A leap of faith...ความเชื่อใจครั้งสุดท้าย (From "Petrichor the series")](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/U1piZH2CNXA/mqdefault.jpg)
The fact this script got to the filming stage shows how little they cared about SW
I wonder if there is a book that can fix Rings of Power
🤔
Everyone knows what happened.
“Kathleen Kennedy”…….okay everybody ……Disney needs to make a lot of money off Star Wars. So give me some ideas.
“Disney story group”………How about we make the movies really bad. Then write a bunch of books to explain everything and get even more money from the fans while we explain what should have been in the movie in the first place.
“Kathleen Kennedy”…….Brilliant !!!!
@@LeftJoystick I mean it's way easier to ignore because the fans of Tolkien have considered the books as the defacto media and everything else is secondary fiction.
It helps that the books were the only storyline to follow for decades before anything else ever came about.
I'm going to operate under the impression that they started filming before they started "writing."
@@LeftJoystick There is. Just read the Tolkien lore. Tolkien’s books by him or edited by his son is the only things that are canon. Everything else is just interpretations.
I do with the sequels what Disney did with the expanded universe. I just ignore it as if it did not exist.
That's the right thing to do
Do unto others....I like it.
I can pretend, but it doesn’t stop me from thinking about Palpatine surviving whenever I rewatch ROTJ 😆😆
I swear, the more they try to fix the sequel trilogy's problems by making things up, the worst they get.
The Sith dagger is easily one of the dumbest plot devices I have ever seen.
Remember despite all the great Star Wars content like Mando and Andor, all roads still lead to the Sequels like in GoT all roads lead to season 8 🤢
@@jibril2473 GoT season 8 compared to the other seasons is still better than the sequels compared to the Prequels and OT.
@@kamixakadio2441 I havent watched GoT, but I can agree. No series/movie franshise has ever seen such a random drop in quality/creativity from the prequels & OT to the sequels.
Star wars is special in my opinion, because the best movie ever (in my opinion) is a star wars movie, but the worst movie ever (in my opinion) is also a star wars movie.
Agreed
@Jibril
If by “great“ you mean barely acceptably mediocre, then sure.
I totally agree with you on that book. The author really had a difficult job and made the best of it. I really loved how he characterized Luke and Lando and their friendship, it felt like their adventures in the old EU days - even including the drinking of hot chocolate. But I just cannot forgive that characters make decisions that are beyond stupid (e.g. Rey's parents giving her to Unkar Plutt because it's apparently a good thing he only takes care of her for the money (It obviously isn't. If someone with more money comes along, Unkar will sell Rey!)). Also, if you really think about it, Lando should have been able to put 2 and 2 together in Episode IX: He should have realized Rey is the girl they followed years earlier and whose parents were murdered by Ochi.
You are absolutely right!
This whole story is kinda of ridiculous. I mean if Rey's parents knew or were in contact Luke and Lando why couldn't they leave Rey with one of them or any of Luke's allies in the New Republic. Or better yet why couldn't they all hide with Luke or ask for help from the New Republic? Why leave Rey at Jakku at all? I'm so confused.
I couldn't imagine having to go in there and fix any mess made by Jar Jar Abrams Cinematic Antichrist.
@@jkdbuck7670 for real
Again, this is not that hard... Let them leave Rey with unka plot's wife, brother, father, relative, rival, but they died and if it's unka plot's rival, he killed himself and Rey got transferred to him as a slave... And if you say Rey said her parent's left her with unka plot, you can say she was an unreliable narrator because she was a kid then and couldn't tell the difference between are original guardian and unka because they're the same species... Adults in real life can't tell the difference between Asians except Asians themselves, it would be very far from a stretch that little Rey couldn't tell the difference between her guardian and unka plot... This is not that hard... Or perhaps unka plot and Rey lived in a different part of jakku but he had to leave his old home and business to hide Rey and became bitter overtime about it and planned to work Rey to death for his lost wealth... You just have to know how to write so stop giving excuses to hacks because they tried a little... That wouldn't help them improve and you have no reason to feel bad for them... They got paid a whole lot than you so it's not like they're destitute writers trying their best... You'll just allow them to be nonchalant about their writings because little good work is enough to get a little clap from critics and that's enough for them... They've gotten paid... You should save that pity and goodwill for japanese mangaka who get paid shit after their manga releases and starts getting cash... And that's why their stories and lengths and breadths better than western comics, because their livelihoods depends on their comics succeeding... So stop pitying pathetic writers just because... It makes stories worse not better...
Maybe there could be a follow up t explain it more.
There was a time when people would write novels because they were inspired by a great story and wanted to expand the world in which this story takes place. Now is the time when people HAVE TO write novels to try to fix all the plot holes a shitty story left behind it...
If you have to make additional Content and Context that expand on certain holes for a Stand Alone story then that Prior Story has FAILED as a Story.
Not being explained events that take place in a time period outside the scope of the film does not make these plot holes. If I write a book about an elderly wizard fighting a dragon, his childhood and birth aren't plot holes just because the book follows him at the end of his life....
The line, "somehow Palpatine returned," should clue you into how much thought was put into any of the plot elements in "The Rise of Skywalker."
Exactly. You can't make sense of senselessness. Mystery boxes within mystery boxes...that got prematurely burned in the middle of their making. Hence, why I want NOTHING TO DO with a scenario where creative collaborators like Dave Filoni, Jon Favreau, George Lucas, Jon Watts, and Chris Ford, to name just a handful, have to contort their minds, trying to "fix" what should never have been in the first place. I have made a near-absolute vow to not read or watch ANYTHING that tasks itself with trying to rationalize the shit show that was The Sequel Trilogy. Just forget its existence. If it can't (or, probably won't) be erased from official (Lucas-verse) canon, then avoid much of its legacy, through alternative stories that focus on their own unique epic characters, histories, events, and situations that don't involve or include themselves with the major aspects of The ST. Honestly, I'm more interested in reading the unreleased The Mandalorian original novel, that Adam Christopher wrote over a year ago, for The Mandalorian Publishing Initiative (which, interestingly enough, DID publish and recently release issue #4 of the comic adaptation of The Mandalorian, which features the introduction of Carasynthia Dune...a character that Kennedy & Co. determined would never be depicted or acknowledged again in The SWU...is there hope for a return of both Gina and Cara in the works?), which sounds way more interesting than this wanna-fix-it-all novel...
Well said
From a company point of view they have to try. It's not like they can erase the sequels anymore. I don't envy the one who needs to patch this mess up
Agreed Anthony. Filoni, Favreau, and Lucas adding their takents and helping fix Sequel Trilogy SW won't work. It's like mixing poop and ice cream: you won't mess up the poop, but you'll ruin the ice cream.
I just follow the original EU (aka Legends), baring the Legacy Era, when it comes to post-RotJ continuity. Sure it got wonky at times *cough*CrystalStar*cough*, had far too many pyrrhic victory stories, and wasn't exactly the most well-constructed narrative, but at least it didn't make the entire damn Original Trilogy pointless and cause you to lose brain cells trying to make sense of it.
@@joaopedrorosa6198 dozens of stories have been jettisoned from canon in one fell swoop. they could do the same to the sequel trilogy down the line. it is not popular enough and too canon breaking to stand the test of time
I shouldn’t need to spend money on a book to make sense of a movie I paid to see.
Exactly. It's absolutely ridiculous.
Sadly it's symptomatic of the disrespectful way Disney have treated not only Star Wars itself, but especially Star Wars fans. What a joke.
That's sadly characteristic of Abrams' movies. There was a four comic book mini-series that functioned as a set up for the events of the 2009 Star Trek movie, which laid out the biggest WTF of that movie: how a "mining ship" got the tech to take out a dozen starships without so much as flinching. There's a similar mini-series for Star Trek Into Darkness, though the only real question about that movie is how a guy who looked like Ricardo Montalban ended up looking like Benedict Cumberbatch!
@@NightHawke Yeah...Abrams...don't get me started on Abrams...
He has the rare distinction of being the person who ruined Star Wars AND Star Trek
@@reznik232 and also Abrams protégés worked on Rings of Power
@@АлексейМомот-щ7о Really? I didn't know that.
Haven't seen it myself yet, but can't help notice it's reviews aren't exactly glowing.
How many DLCs do they need to make until they realize that the Disney Trilogy is unfixable?
Enough to sink Star Wars even further.
lol
They really ought to just quietly phase out the sequel films so that they won't be beholden to that silliness.
You know the sequels failed when 3rd party media is used to fix it rather than expand upon it. Honestly, the only thing that could draw me into the sequel era is if they re-canonized the Yuuzhan Vong (with a few tweaks of course). After all, it would make perfect sense for them to invade the galaxy now that the First Order is in ruins and the Resistance is too weak to restore the Republic.
The First Order is in ruins? 2 or 3 ships of theirs were destroyed, out of their endless fleet, while the resistance is literally a couple of people. It doesn't seem to me like anything changed in the powers, maybe that the resistance managed to decimate themselves. I might be wrong about the specifics, I only watched TROS once, and I am not willing to watch it again. But for me the message was nothing really has changed, other than they lost the resistance and Luke and Leia, and Rey is out as well (buried the ligtsaber).
@@buskergirl It's suggested that the First Order is stretched too thin across the galaxy and the galaxy is rising against them. That's why they needed the death star destroyer fleet.
@@vetarlittorf1807 Oh I guess I should rewatch it to bring myself up to date, but I'm not gonna... 😬
@@buskergirl Eh. Just read the Wookieepedia entry instead of watching the movie.
@@vetarlittorf1807 didn't First Order have ton of infrastructure in Unknown Regions, can't they just replenish from there? They really only defeated Final Order in the movie
Serious question: why do so many of the Disney-era featured aliens -- e.g. Maz, Ochi, the four-arm doc in 'Andor' -- look like (typically orange-ish) lemonheads? And Rey's mother's name -- Mir-mir (?) --is the joke-name of Thor's hammer Mjolnir?
Miramir. I couldn't help thinking "Miramax" as I read it.
5:10 i just love how she says that while holding anakin's saber
Yeah, the famed Younglingslayer 9000.
Q: How exactly did Palpatine come back?
A: He didn‘t. This is a new Palpatine in a remake/reboot. He also dies in much the same way, through his own lightning. His plotline is written to appear as if there is a continuity, but there obviously is none.
Q: Why did Rey’s parents leave her on Jakku?
A: They didn’t. This is just a remake/reboot. Jakku is Tattooine, also used the old McQuarrie art for Tatttooine. Rey’s parents serve as mystery box and plot twist, because that was an important part of the original formula that is rebooted.
A lot of people say can a clone wars like show fix the sequels? To that I say we kinda already have one that being resistance but given that nobody talks about that show that really proves how ineffective it was. Damn after years of asking for an episode 7 not only do we finally have it we have 8 and 9 and most people I talk to don’t like them and to somewhat quote C-3PO “I don’t like them either”.
True. Having said that, and knowing nothing will ever make this mess beloved, or even 'really good', a six or seven year show incorporating things like the book 'Bloodline', and given time to at least give some explanation to the countless things unexplained or nonsensical, seems like the only way forward if they want to fix things. But yea, still a mess.
theres no way you can do that
@@Ruylopez778 expanding on the prequels was one of the clone wars’ greatest strengths I agree
Can you make a coherent plot out of a dream?
The biggest problem with that argument is that there was nothing wrong with the story of the prequels. Their biggest issue was in the dialogue department and, to some extent, the pacing of the stories. But the overall story was an excellent one and there are numerous subtleties that The Clone Wars was able to build on. One of the frequently cited reasons for The Clone Wars being great was how it made Anakin into a genuine hero. Part of Anakin's negative portrayal in the sequel movies is that we are seeing him during arguably the two lowest points in his life (when he begins his turn towards evil and when he completes it), but The Clone Wars was able to show Anakin at his high point of being a hero. It showed him as courageous, caring, charismatic, and so many positive aspects of him that couldn't really be fleshed out as much in the films because of the focus on his flaws. I'd say the prequels just needed another draft or two and we'd have only a scattering of complaints about them. By contrast, the sequels completely fall apart when it comes to story-telling, be it as individual movies, an overall narrative, and especially as part of a greater whole. They aren't something that can be fixed through expansion like the sequels because they are broken on a basic level.
As a great man once said, “You can’t fix stupid.” 😜
Nothing is going to fix those movies or make them make sense in any way. Nothing against those who enjoy them, I am glad they do, but honestly, it's just bonkers.
I agree to me its like trying to fix a mirror. It’s better to leave it broken and discard it rather than hurting yourself (and/or possibly others) trying to fix it.
Did the people that built Palpatines fleet need a sith weigh finders to get to work? How about the supply ships and factory workers.
So then why do we see in games and in media mirrors actually getting fixed? Clearly if they can do that in fantasy, why not in real life?
Isn’t it funny that the sith spent 1000 planning to only rule the galaxy for 27 years? The Jedi were living like fat cats the entire time
@@COACHWARBLE No the Jedi were living loke stoic monks.
The sheer level of incompetence involved in these movies is honestly mind-boggling. I will never understand how any of this got approved, honestly. That is the most amazing thing about these movies. I can't even pretend to be understanding of those who enjoy these movies. I know tastes differ and all that, be tolerant and accepting etc. etc. - but if someone says they love these movies, I question the way they look at things. I question their intelligence, even. It's insane that these turned out the way they did, it's a completely new category of bad.
I know at least one very smart person who thought TLJ was the greatest thing since sliced bread. iunno man. I just don't know. but there it is. (TLJ was the lowest point in my SW "life" and I've never truly felt insulted watching a movie until I saw Luke Skywalker slurping freshly milked lizard juice).
Because if your not a Star Wars fan and don’t really care about the saga then rise of skywalker wasn’t bad at all. Not saying it was amazing or anything but definitely isn’t unwatchable in the eyes of non Star Wars fans
@@honcore1443 that's an unusual take. I would have said that point of view was more fitting for *The Last Jedi* than *Rise of Skywalker* There were illogical plot aspects in both movies, but from a technical and basic plot logic perspective, RoS was inept and nonsensical whereas the general reactions to TLJ (from ppl who hated it) were visceral and emotional (as in "Rian Johnson just shit on my childhood hero!" sort of stuff). Iunno how else to explain it. RoS was just a bunch of sketches pasted together with little or no connection to each other. It felt like a movie that started filming and wrote the plot around the scenes rather than the scenes around a plot.
@@honcore1443 Have to disagree. As lore-breaking as The Last Jedi is, it is followable as a story, though I can't call it good. Unless the only thing you're looking for is flashiness, the Rise of Skywalker is just a messy series of "and this happened, and then this happened" over and over again.
@@John-fk2ky ya so pretty much most movies.
Even a well written book, trying to fix a mishandled story, is still just a mess. You can polish a story as best as you can, but if the main support of the story is trash. Well, rot starts at the core.
That's right. It's like taking two turds and whittling them down into fecal chopsticks so you can pick up three turds all the while you tell everyone you make the chopsticks out of turds so you don't get crap on your hands when you were hired to move the three turds.
It's all about turds. And the SUCK-QUEL TRILOGY is a trio of turds.
Exactly! A gilded turd may shine like gold, but it doesn't stink any less at the end of the day, and you still want to wash your hands if you have the misfortune of touching it...
The sequels and anything that touches upon them are an ABSOLUTE dumpster fire. It's incredible in just how broken they are.
I started to read this book but now... dunno. I've never understood how the story of the OT characters after the OT was not made into an animated show or expanded upon in some way in the new cannon. I think almost all Star Wars fans love the OT (despite the division around the other trilogies) and everyone wants to see what they did next. And the only glimpse we get, Luke in the Mando show, is one of the most talked about moments in Star Wars.
Because they know all they could show would be OT characters failing to make sequels happen
And even then they pissed on the OT characters. In the Boba Fett show they made Luke give Grogu the choice between his connection to Mando and the Jedi. When it goes against everything Luke went though becoming a Jedi and redeeming his father.
There is no way they were ever be able to explain the Sith dagger. The entirety of that concert - from how it exists in the first place to it marching up with the Death Star ruins - literally makes zero sense as it is.
Good questions.... FOR ANOTHER TIME *never answers them ever again on screen*
Someone in another comments section said something along the lines of "uh... They make a point that the ocean is too turbulent for folks to safely get to the death star ruins. Nobody could have scavenged it" as if this isn't a franchise with hovercraft and spaceships lmao even if you make the argument that the ruins might be considered too unstable for peeps to poke around there's still droids they could send in. Surely Empire artifacts (especially from a death star) would fetch more than enough credits to cover any loss of life, droids, or damaged equipment
And if that is the case that doesn't match what we see in the movie as the characters get there no problem and if the ocean was that turbulent, the protractor feature wouldn't work because the ruins would move.
Also...
Hold on
That's a really Good point...
Luke started a jedi school but didn't think to go over the death star wreckage and at least try and find all the sith items to try and stop anyone from Turing to the dark side
Morbid curiosity brought me here... I'm pretty sure I felt my braincells dying while listening to that recap. I can only imagine what has happened to you while trying to make sense of that nonsense. I appreciate your sacrifice.
I’ll never forgive Disney for having years and years worth of content to draw from and tweak here and there and just completely ignoring it. I think I speak for quite a few people when I say we don’t care if old stories got put on the big screen. That’s actually what we want lol
The greater paradox is that people that say they love the sequels tend to also love every last thing Marvel; which just is condensed stories being retold on the big screen.
@@dondoesdoodles9726 don’t listen to us tho, we’re just the fans. What do we know???
Oh they didn’t completely ignore it. They simply took stories and revamped it to make their shitty stories
Digging dirt out to fill a plot hole only to leave another hole from where the dirt came from...
Textbook example of a Voodoo Shark.
When your story takes years of supplemental material just to explain how the basic plot could even happen, you wrote a bad story. JJ and Rian wrote a bad story.
And wasn't just any franchise they screwed up. It was STAR WARS. Shame on them. And there's nothing anyone can say that will make me like these two clowns.
The way Abrams treated the Kobayashi Maru in his Star Trek reboot series told me long ago that he really doesn't understand storytelling. For him he thinks a story is member-berries and mystery boxes so he shoves things in that don't fit the narrative or make any sense. In the original story, Kobayashi Maru fit the story as it was a no-win situation which was later reflected in the climax with Wrath of Khan. It also reflected that Kirk had avoided it by cheating but found himself in a real no-win situation losing his best friend in the process. With Abrams it was just pointlessly shoved in for member-berries but it didn't serve the story or the character in the slightest.
The Sith Dagger was just shoved in like an Indiana Jones' relic - a thing to lead to a thing but with his story these are ancient things long buried and forgotten not a huge technological thing that would have attracted scavengers much like Rey was at the beginning of the series! Why would an assassin need such a map to find another rmacguffin to point to some planet. The goal was the planet and everyone just ended up there anyway rendering the whole quest pointless.
From what I've heard, even this doesn't actually fix anything.
"This blade has done terrible things". In Rey's other hand is the lightsaber used to slay younglings.
Am I the only one that thought of the goonies when Mary Sue lined up the dagger with the death star ?
I was thinking National Treasure with the clocktower on the dollar bill.
Also don’t forget that the Darth Vader comics shows Ochi getting his eyes burned by looking at the limitless power of the kyber crystals. He then gets the eye implants afterward. So now it seems his eyes were damaged twice in his lifetime.
Disney contradicted themselves again.
No see that’s comic book canon not book canon
I was just going to make that point. I'm also pretty sure that the Darth Vader comics are canon.
“How exactly did Palpatine comeback?”
Somehow.
He logged into Fortnite.
😏
His spirit transferred into an incomplete clone body. That’s literally the only answer.
@@Bingo_the_Pug While that is more fleshed out, I prefer the explanation: _"Somehow Palpatine returned"_
"Cloning, secrets only the Sith knew about." So only the Sith knew about cloning, you say? Well Jar Jar Abrams, let me introduce you to this creature known as a Kaminoan.
C-3PO had the Sith language in his databanks? He was made by little Anakin from a bunch of scraps. I doubt any Sith language could've been installed.
@@Ruylopez778 I doubt as Darth Maul never set foot in Mos Espa.
My big issue is why did he have a language he wasn't programmed to translate in his databanks? Shouldn't it not be there so he can't translate it at all and it just brings up an error 404 screen? It reminds of that joke of someone asking if you know what it is they say yes and walk away.
If anything, R2-D2 should have been the one to have some sort of Sith library/database in storage. He’s always sticking his probe into things.
@@Ruylopez778 No he didn't period. That is what he sent the droids. He is not stupid even on Tatooine a red and black and dude with yellow eyes and dressed in all black would stick out. And he had three potiential towns to search.
I’ve said it before and i’ll say it again! When you need a book to explain the storyline, or sections of, in a film/franchise then the writers of film/franchise have failed. If other media needs to explain and expand upon other media so it makes sense then that’s a massive failure in my book.
There's only one way to fix this plot.
Luke wakes up, turns to his wife
"I just had a horrible nightmare" he says.
"Go back to sleep Skywalker" Mara responds.
-There fixed. And I didn't need 3 books and 20 blogs to do it.
“I keep telling you not to eat cheese right before bed, but do you listen? Nooooo.”
_"I gotta lay off the blue milk."_
Or just use the world between worlds to correct it.
@@sebastiannatera777 It was destroyed though by that point in time
Or time travel.
Trying to find logic in the sequel trilogy, is akin to finding a living unicorn LOL
1: Why does the wreckage exist when the station was atomised in ROTJ?
2: Why is the wreckage on another planet & not Endor? (its like our moon exploding & the debris falling on Mars)
3: What are the odds on the Emperor's spire surviving & landing in such a convenient location?
4: Why is the interior of the throne room upright when the exterior lies on its side?
5: Why is there even power to open doors?
6: Why is JJ so successful?
“New book tries to patch the plot holes of Disney Wars sequels”
😆 oh wait, you’re serious, let me laugh even harder 😂
Nothing but a retcon/redo could save the sequals (wrote "prequals" before...).
Sequal you mean ?
@@Hanoua2 oh, yes! Most definitely. My bad. Will correct
Even if you can fix stupid in books, it won’t change the movies, unless they re film them to match. The sequels are the perfect example of (purposely)wasted opportunity.
Thanks for the review of Christopher Adam's Shadow of the Sith. I have read the book and enjoyed it. Even wrote up the Wookieepedia plot summary. I think Adam did a good job given the plot holes and problems plaguing the Sequel Trilogy. Ochi comes across as a evil narcissist who doesn’t think straight and acts on impulse most of the time. While I liked how the novel explored Luke and Lando’s friendship, I find it hard to believe that two adults would be unable to find Rey. Much as I liked how the novel developed Rey’s parents Dathan and Miramir as characters, I didn’t like how the plot was written to keep them one step ahead of meeting Luke and Lando. By the way, Miramir is the name of a suburb in the Nea Zealand city of Wellington. Christopher is a Kiwi who lives in the UK so he must have picked Miramir as a name that is both exotic to fans and familiar for him.
I liked how the novel drew upon other Canon and Legends elements like Exim Panshard and Kiza from Chuck Wendig’s Aftermath trilogy and the Corporate Sector Authority. Panshard and Kiza were good villains and diversions who prevented Skywalker from uncovering the true threat of Palpatine. Would appreciate a video on Panshard and Kiza as villains.
Its really hard to take this seriously because Oatchi is the name of the dog in Pikmin 4 lol.
Like I said before their isnt really a reason to buy star wars books anymore since it's just used material to fill in plot holes only to be later retconned.
In software engineering, we have a saying that's applicable here: Garbage in - garbage out.
Then how they managed to fix the prequels?
@@АлексейМомот-щ7о They weren't broken to begin with.
@@emberfist8347 then why fans complained?
@@АлексейМомот-щ7о Mostly it was the media not hardcore fans. It was a vocal minority. And they raised criticisms that ignored the facts given in the movies. For example complaining about how Obi-Wan knows R2-D2 in the Prequels by claiming the Original Trilogy he never meet him ingoring that Ben only said he never recalled owning a droid and nothing more. Or saying the Midiclorians created the force which isn't what The Phantom Menace said only they allowed Jedi to communicate with it.
@@АлексейМомот-щ7о We could argue about the quality of the prequels, I think they are great, albeit with flaws, but they are NOT canon breaking. As opposed to the sequels, which ARE canon breaking. The prequels dont need patching. The sequels cant be patched.
Only one thing can fix the sequels, and that's the temple on Lothal. Yes, erase them.
The world building of the sequel triology is worse than in rings of power
Ironically, there is no world building in the sequel trilogy. It's always Forest and Desert planets, that's about it.
I'm actually writing my own story that largely explains the logic in the Sequels & it's difficult I'll tell ya. But I have some interesting politics about Palpatine's successors, who Snoke is, & eventually including stuff about Rey's past & grumpy Luke. Wish me luck! ✌️
@BK Beatty And that's the semi-beautiful thing about this backstory story, it'll take years to make any one Sequel thing logical so I'll always have something to busy myself, plus I love story writing
I used to love your videos, I now don't even save them in Playlists to watch later like I used to, and it's no fault of your own. Star Wars was my favorite franchise and because of Disney destroying it, I just dont care to hear about it anymore even though I'd spend hours and days watching videos on it before. I was about to put this video in a Playlist for later and didn't even feel the want to do that so much, so felt I should st least share a comment to lament for this once great franchise.
I’ve tried to think up reasons for the dagger before, but you can’t get around the plot holes that pop up over and over, but that doesn’t mean you shouldn’t try. I would have had a cult among the sith that is dedicated to foreseeing the future just as their master Sidious had done, but not being a master as he was they were only ever partly successful and not entirely stable, the plots they create from their visions twisted and convoluted. One see’s the child they will need finding the waypoint using the dagger as a marker so they reshape the dagger to be as their vision showed and send it out into the galaxy, one of many plots set in motion, many becoming nothing as the thread of time is severed before it can happen, but this one playing out as foreseen.
Of course this idea opens up the ‘Just as I planned’ plot trap, where any nonsense can be explained away by the villain saying this was the plan all along, and sometimes that works for the story, like in ROTJ with Palpatine foreseeing Luke’s coming before him but not how it would ultimately end or die hard with Hans needing the FBI to cut the power to get into the vault. But there are countless films where this really doesn’t work, go on, let your mind wander, yep, there’s one. A well written story can make most things work, building a well written story from a foundation of sand, that really sounds like an uphill battle all the way.
Honestly the fact that they're *still* persistent in their attempt to just do all this damage control after all this time is insane. First they let the audience (AKA the fanaticals from Twitter) do the work for them when it comes to discussing why some stupid actions "aCtUalLy MaKe SeNsE bEcAuSe It'S rEaLisTiC" to now all these writers trying to do their work for them. Piecing together each and every puzzles only for every puzzle to remain incomplete or pieces placed in sections that aren't right at all. In other words, they either fail to answer all of our questions or bring rise to more problems.
It hit me as I was listening to this: imagine if they ironed out the details of this book and instead, converted it into a screenplay and made this story Episode VII? You've done a few things then:
- Luke is still the main character and you've set up his quest for this trilogy. Or at least the first two films, maybe
- You've set up that Palpatine is coming back and they need to stop his return, only to fail and he does indeed come back in IX
- There are high stakes cos we know that there is a lot at stake in this race against time to stop the return of the Sith and there is loads of room for drama and tension
I dunno. What do you think?
Yes, I suffered from delirium due to high fevers when I was a child but never I could have believed that one would get paid to write anything like the script to TRoS.
However, even if the script writers for the Sequals did do "drugs" that incapacitated any logical thought or story line... Even then most of the plot still made not sense!
Honestly if the movies were made on drugs it would probably more coherent.
Damn I wish the expanded universe didn't get shafted. It is so much better.
Yeah you would think there'd be organizations from corporations to the new Republic to Pirates who would salivate over what they could find in the wreckage of the Death Star
eBay listing: "Only used once. Genuine Death Star part. No reserve." Nobody would simply ignore a giant piece of the Death Star sitting on a planet without scavenging it. Nobody.
Wow. I'm more confused now than ever.
that is the ONE scene i could never even bother to try to rationalize or find logic to.... like.... really? it just happens to match the remains of a blown up death star?
she just happens to line it up correctly... no weather shifting? scav's? .... there's a lot of stuff disney did that i can at least see what they were trying.... this scene tho, makes no gawd dwamn sense.
And the ruins are on a completely different moon from the one it orbited?
What's the difference between a wayfinder and a Holocron?
Wayfinder is a space GPS. Holocron is a space USB.
@@vetarlittorf1807 loud and clear
Thor, you can't polish a turd.
Yes you can!
It's still a turd, although a shiny one
When I saw that dagger scene my eyes damn near rolled out of my skull.
Oh well... Why? Just... Why? 🙄
They need to forget about the sequels. It's how I already said: as more you mess with sh*t, the worse is going to be the smell.
The biggest issue I have is that Anakin should know where the wayfinders are and should've led Luke to one at least. Especially the one Kylo gets. Like, come on it's dumb to give Vader this knowledge and then forget, hey, he became a Force Ghost that can speak to anyone any time he wants. Especially his SON. This shit just gets worse and worse over time.
Greg Pak should have never written that Vader comic, bruh, why Charles Soule stopped writing Vader?
I imagine that Anakin, Obi, and Qui-Gon were busy pursuing tacos made entirely out of doritos. After all, it's only for a limited time.
I thoroughly enjoyed this book, mostly the Luke/Sith stuff. Yes, well-written overall, but trying to fully patch up the sequels is like trying to patch up a boat with too many holes before you get to port.
The sequels are not like the prequels in that supplemental material will enhance them further. With how much work there is to make them make more sense, the amount of convoluted content needed might just make it worse.
More like trying to patch up a boat with a screen door on the bottom when the water is already up to your waist.
Worst line ever in Star Wars: "Palpatine. Somehow he came back."
The Critical Drinker did a brilliant video where he described how badly TRS was written with the Sith Dagger as nothing more than a MacGuffin and the plot more like a series side quests of a video game rather than a feature film.
Palpatine's return message _did_ only appear in Fortnite.
@@hellacoorinna9995 so TROS is Fortnite DLC
This is why I think that they need to retcon that trilogy, and that I could run Star Wars better. Like, let's be real, I have zero qualifications. I'm not a writer, I don't know how to edit or even film good or anything, I have no management experience... like I have no knowledge or skills relevant to running Star Wars... but I DO know that PLANNING your trilogy makes it SO MUCH BETTER. and they supposedly have that whole Continuity Group... definitely shouldn't be hard to just find someone competent, sit ten down and say, "Alright, plan this trilogy with your team. We'll find competent directors after."
Because you don't necessarily just want to hire directors like Michael Bay or Spielberg or whatever... even if they have some sort of "Vision" and WANT to make a Star Wars movie... You need to make sure they can fit within your plans... if it's for the trilogy. But you CAN just find some "brilliant auteur" or whatever and be like, "Alright, your movie will be set 4,000 years before the Original Trilogy. Make up new characters. It'll be fine." or "Oh, you want to do something after Episode 9? Okay, your movie is 10 years later. Let me know what characters you need." or whatever.
Like, it was SO incompetently run, even I could run it better. And the books can't fix it, because it was just that bad.
In the words of the great Ron White: No, you can't fix stupid.
Expanded Universe > Disneys Sequels
It really underlines how little thought went into this. Haste makes waste.
Fixing a story is different than explaining it more in depth. Contribution can be healthy (ex. Clone Wars) but trying to excessively "fix" a bad story will only make the story and the universe surrounding it worse.
Maybe the author is one of us and his goal is to spotlight the utter folly that is the sequel trilogy?
@@jkdbuck7670 That sounds more like a documentary on how bad the movies are, rather than a contributing novel.
You know what. I'm happy that the Disney Squeals exist, because they got me into the original Sequel Trilogy (to me at least) Star Wars Fate of the Jedi. On book 7 and its LEAGUES better than anything Disney can think up
BOOOOM- someone finally nailed it thank you-first person outside myself-tie do not have hyperdrives, it was a big upgrade in first order tie's and the tie striker
3:47 - the worst reason to write a novel EVER.
19:05 - a hallmark of contemporary bad sci-fi/fantasy writing. Characters suddenly become morons because the author needs it to happen.
This was a nice vid, well done vid. Thank you.
I really like your critical view of things. Please keep it them coming.
I don't think these films could have been worse, sheer vandalism
It makes me so sad to just not care about new Star Wars books. I used to watch those release dates like a hawk. Now, it takes your video breaking through my apathy to hear the news of a new book that I just don’t care about. Star Wars used to be such a big part of my life. It’s like a divorce almost.
After reading 40-50 or more EU books, I’ve given up. Whatever that book was in between 8 and 9 was where they tried to steal a few fighters to rebuild their “fleet” was the breaking point. I listened to the audio book and it seriously put me to sleep a dozen times. Every book in this time period since the Aftermath trilogy is complete garbage. It seems like nobody at Disney cares so why should I.
To borrow from a familiar quote, the more they tighten their grip, the more fans slip through their fingers.
Square peg meets round hole is all I can say about this mess.
I wouldn't give the time of day to a book which came out over 2 and a half years after the sequels ended, trying to 'fix' and explain story threads and plot points that should have been planned, made sense and been competently written in the first place.
Ocean not a convienet location?
They have ships that fly across the galaxy and can hover.... Anywhere is convienet to get to in the sw universe if you have a ship!
You cannot really fix those movies... for more explanation, it is 120% senseless
If they insisted on a dagger map it should have lead to a secret city of sith younglings palpatine was raising. Just a massive dark side city of angry moody teenagers held in check by the most adept among them. And maybe.... a clone of luke Skywalker instructing, and punishing them, grown from his severed hand.
There is no making scripts of JJ Abrams movies not be stupid.They suck, period.
Not that Ruin Johnson is any better.
The book is like an analogy my history teacher gave me. If a football player gets a major injury and is bleeding heavily you need heavy stitches after a big operation. But instead they only applied a band aide
Lesser franchises have direct to video sequels that are better and more coherent than the Disney trilogy.
Trying to make sense of their stupid writing just makes things even stupider.
My question is: who is reading and paying for that garbage?
Answer:
Disney fan girls and casuals.
Not me. I’ll keep the old EU warts and all, and if I want to read sci-fi there are far better books out there.
Thor, apparently 😉
@@rudegarami6738 when you find a brother…..
Not me, I'm reading the Thrawn trilogy ( Legends ) by Timothy Zahn. The real sequel trilogy.
I read it a couple of months ago. I agree with much of what was said in this video article. Well written. I don't think anyone could come up with anything better to explain the sequel trilogy. Yes, there are dumb decisions made at the end. Yes it is incredibly improbably that Luke and 6 year old Rey were so close to meeting but didn't.
Now I imagine this.... In episode VIII when Luke asks Rey "Who ARE you?" it makes a little sence because he has a sense of her from this book. (Rey didn't know she was supposed to say "I was the little girl in that ship from 13 years ago." lol)
I love that Disney is so bad at making movies that people can criticize them professionally for 5 years after every movie.
The Rise of Skywalker left us all with more questions than answers.. that movie was Awful
I almost feel sorry for these poor writers who have to figure out how to piece this thing together in retrospect. Literally none of this BS makes any sense.
5:58 what? Didn't Palpatine blind him in the comics with giant kyber mountain?
You're right. I think I kind of mixed some things up there trying to give a brief explanation of everything.
@@thorskywalker ohh, I thought they're already contradicting things that came out months apart
A great example of trying to fix a mess by adding more trash to it. It's impossible to fix ROS or the sequels in general, there's just too much broken that cannot be rationalized. In trying to make it better, the best they can do is make it worse.
The only way to fix a catastrophic mess is to throw it all out.
Thanks for keeping up with the books Thor. It’s a dirty job but someone has got to do it. Since the beginning Disney Star Wars has used books, comics and cartoons as a crutch to explain the world so they can just focus on lightsabers ans explosions. I’ve watched a lot of SW video essays and some of the questions people ask I know the answers to because I read this or that book. That is not how things should go. One day I hope Star Wars has a comeback like Game of Thrones and Westeros has had thanks to the superb House of the Dragon. Maybe Andor is getting the ball rolling but I don’t see things changing till most of the creative team gets replaced
Even duct tape can’t fix stupid, but it does muffle the sound
And when was there a chamber next to the Throne Room we have a cross-section of it and there isn't such as room
Darth Jar Jar being Rey's father would have been a better story twist.
I agree about that stupid sith dagger….how ridiculous.
I stopped giving a damn about the Disney trilogy, and all books connected to it after TLJ.
Aside from the Ashoka book, I refuse to buy anything except some "Legends" books that I'm missing.
So much questions.
Unkar Plutt must have been a great father and a good choice to leave Rey with. He raised Rey who ended up with unshakable good morals, is an amazingly combatant, and great mechanic & electrician.
A deal's a deal, I guess.