Gravel bikes are cool and I love mine I’ve had it a couple years now but… I also just added a trail hard tail to my stable and find the gravel bike is best used on routes that take in a mixture of terrain where it’s simply fantastic and very, very fast ! but when it gets to rocky or technical sections gravel bikes are useless and suddenly start to feel a little fragile and become very uncomfortable and this is where the mountain bike really shines, there an absolute blast and far more comfortable. My only real gripe with the mountain bike is it’s weight as when climbing on anything mellow it feels painfully slow and far more of an effort when compared to my much lighter gravel bike.
@@bradsanders6954 I can confirm, I’m just about to finish my Scott Scale build. Only bits remaining are my rear mech and chain. Bike is sitting at exactly 9kg for the moment. I reckon it will be less than 22lbs when complete.
@@Cal-Mac I like suspension,ft and rear. I like it alot. Motorcycles havent been rigid rear end since the early 30's. I will make my new Intense sniper even lighter.
In my experience I will always own both. My gravel bike is setup more for ultra endurance road/gravel racing so most of my century's and long races are done on my gravel bike. I also ride road to all my gravel roads. And coming from mountain biking I like chunky mtb trails that the gravel bike could just never do. But I like fast and I always choose my hardtail over a full sus, most full sus takes the fun away from trail riding. And then I have my road bike purely set up for road racing. 3 bikes, with all 3 being aimed primarily for each discipline
On an XC bike the trick is,smaller lighter tires,use bar ends even though they arent hip. I use em alot....Strong riders can fly on an XC bike no matter the road or trail. Both have 29'er wheels. 700c is 29'r also.
Just for the record: the MTB can ride more kinds of terrain than anything else. It is therefore the more, maybe even most, versatile bike. The Gravelbike on the other hand is more efficient on non bumpy surfaces...unless you put fat knobby MTB tyres and superwide drop bars on it. Then the gravelmonster is just a bad mountainbike.
Its really about marketing. I know people who will ride nothing but a gravel bike,no matter what the ride is....Mt bike trails, serious roadbike rides, they are sold on the gravel platform.....it works but a 16 lb rd bike has a real advantage on road, and a mt bike flat rips on any real trail......for now the trend is pretty strong towards gravel, and gravel bikes becoming more like mt bikes,or more like road bikes.........."marketing".
Bad mountain bike in of itself is a relative term. A gravel bike with fat tyres on it may be a bad mountain bike in comparison to a mid to high end mountain bike. But compared to a low end mountain bike it could be seen as a very good mountain bike lol
Nice video! These reviews are always interesting, but never so surprising if you own both bikes. Where I live there are more than 1000sq.km. of gravel/dirt roads. I use the GB for smoother dirt, gravel trails(not so technical or rough) linking them up with road sections and enjoying the same POSITION as on my road bike allowing more comfort with the variety of hand positions,etc and adds a lot of variety to your road routes spicing them up. The speed aspect is more akin to a road feel, but without the bother of traffic. MTB is best on pure stuff(exploring routes is good as you can go anywhere comfortably) and good when it gets cold, seeking the shelter of woods, trails, etc and windchill is less of a factor....Enjoy the differences. BOTH are great 👍
I completely agree with this video. Even comparing a hardtail and gravel bike would give the same results. Gravel bike = fast suv Mtb bike = old school Land Rover defender
I’ve been riding a Scott gravel bike 4 years now. It’s replaced my road bike. A road bike has been obsolete for my uses since. A typical outing for me if riding in the city consists of smooth and rough paved roads, short stretches of gravel roads, sidewalks, low curbs, asphalt bike paths, gravel bike paths, cracked broken raised pieces of asphalt, construction zones, detours through sandy areas, single track trails with sandy spots. All kinds of conditions are necessary to contend with to do a 30km+ loop and end up where I started linking as much bike paths as possible. In rural riding it needs to do long distances on highway, loose deep chunky dirt roads, rough farmers track. All this is what is expected realistically from my bike that excels on asphalt as it’s primary focus. I bought my first mtb this summer with the intent of using it as my winter bike. So far I don’t enjoy it on asphalt or gravel bike paths. Your just too insulated from the surface your riding on. Feedback and responsiveness are NIL. It’s amazingly capable though. It excels on uneven surfaces, roots, rocks, curbs, obstacles, sandy spots, single track, mtb trails, high speed 🟦 descents. 3 areas of over lap between styles where I actually prefer the mtb is on the loose deep chunky rural dirt roads, short distance commuting, short distance errands. The fact it has a dropper, big tires, suspension, wide stable bars, upright position make it really comfy and easy to stop and go at intersections, hopping curbs and slow speed control. All ideal for running to the corner store. Mtb - avoid distance if not on proper trails. Rdb - avoid proper trails I really dig that Scott Spark. I bet that gravel bike excels at loose deep chunky dirt roads. NA has some really hard to ride dirt roads that are beyond your typical rigid gravel bike with 40mm tires. Doable but rattles the teeth out of your head. Great video.
Thing is, I don't want to feel every rock on the road. And also I don't want every small curb or rock to throw my front tire into the air at a fast speed. That's why I am happy with my MTB. Locking the front tire will meet your responsivity standard, but only if you like shaking on the road. Having a front suspension means you brake better, you can jump easily on curbs, and you can basically jump on or over anything. Much harder with a gravel bike.
Fully agree with your conclusion. One extra option I have tried a few times is aero bars on my XC FS MTB. It works very well on those gravel or road sections and extends what kind of ride I'm prepared to look at. It also feels like a strong position to drive the pedals. It's all about the amount and type of off road versus road. One other thing is my Canyon Grail has mudguard mounts so not only is it super versatile but it is also my winter road bike.
David, you do a great job and are very fair and well-spoken. I agree with everything you said, but I'm wondering if whether or not a full suspension mountain bike could be a viable commuter would depend on the situation of the commuter. If a person, esp. an older person, had to course through a lot of rough roads, pots holes or cobble stones, it seems like the mountain bike would be more comfortable. Seems like the bigger knobby tires would also be better in snow. In the summer a person could fit it with narrower, smoother tires. Could also be fitted with more commuter friendly handle bars. Just an idea. Keep up the good work.
Now compare the gravel bike to a superlight race Xc hardtail...in previous decades that Scott 'XC' bikes capabilities would have been closer to a downhill bike, it's probably closer to 'trail' now. Having ridden lightweight hardtail on all terrains since the late 80's, I still find them the perfect bike for everything. My Xc hardtail will be lighter than that gravel bike (19lbs), I'll easily match its pace on the road (tyre dependant) but on proper offroad terrain the speed will be closer to that full-suss - so arguably an xc hardtail is a touch more versatile but very close to gravel bike performance with just hand position preference splitting the two.
there's a reason why xc winners like nino schuster ride the FS scott from this video - the rear suspension adds more grip and is overall faster than a hardtail so sure you could compare to a hardtail which should be cheaper for a given spec, but honestly if you have a gravel bike, then a hardtail MTB is not enough of a jump IMO and vice versa. If you can afford only one bike and don't ride very far at a time then a hardtail MTB is a pretty sensible choice. Likewise a gravel is a good choice if you don't ride a particularly technical terrain.
Roadies will always prefer the gravel bike. As a dirtbike rider and mt bike rider I like the light XC bike most of the time....there's always a big downhill on most rides and the XC bike just flies away from gravel bikes.
A hardtail is also more fun on technical terrain than a gravel bike. The gearing is lower so you can climb steep stuff longer. You can jump over logs and float over roots where you wouldn't be able to with drop bars. It's not even a good comparison - apples and oranges. The hardtail is the ultimate do-it-all machine in my opinion. I have a full carbon rigid fork if I'm doing gravel on the hard tail. The bike totally flies with that setup.
Those bikes are very different - I have them both and the mtb is nice for some trails and technical stuff. But for everything else the gravel bike is great - you can do longer distances, its fast on the road and gravel, you can close the stretches where the roads end. I use it to avoid busy roads and to explore new quiet roads which sometimes end in gravel where I would have to stop with the normal road bike. For climbing it is great, I can nearly do everything (even on slicks with low pressure), but technical downhills are for mtb and not fun on the gravel.
Over 1 year ago threw my legs over a gravel bike and still have no desire to ride my double suspended mtb. The few sections where the suspension would improve the ride are not enough to justify the complexity, weight, inefficient riding position and extra cost of the mtb. Mtbs numb the rinding experience, gravel bikes let you enjoy what you are riding over. Gravel bikes do require adaptation, putting attention to things which did not matter as much on the mtb such as tire pressure, and size. Because the body now will do the suspension, takes a while to adapt your body and riding style having no suspension, a shorter front end and wheelbase. Newer gravel bikes are lengthening the front end and adopting shorter stems.
Another solution to the equation is to fit some old aerobars to your mtb.I have a 10 year old Kona Kahuna 29er hardtail which I really like but the nearest trail is about 4km away.With the aerobars I can be comfortable and aero on any smooth section or road.Sometimes I do road training on this bike for extra resistance but pump tyres up hard. Most of the terrain here in New Zealand is steep to very steep so the mtb is better.apart from weight.
Sold my full suspension mtb and I never have the time (or can’t be arsed) to travel somewhere to ride. Gravel bike suits my limited time- ride straight from my door. Road bike is too restrictive.
I'd have that Scott Spark because it's so cool. Gravel is my choice it's more versatile and suits the terrain where I live. We have many many miles of gravel riding. I also use it to commute to work so it's a brilliant and quick all-rounder. Great Video :)
Great vid again David. I love my Topstone Lefty and also my Stumpjumper but I really think I am going to buy the Scott for places like Affan. I have sold both of my Tarmac’s including the S-Works because of the danger of cars and vans. It’s horses for courses really. I say “get one of each and have a stable. Happy riding everyone and stay safe.J
I'm debating between buying a 29" hardtail (Giant XTC SRL 29 1 or similar) and a gravel bike (Canyon Grizl AL or similar) and this is just the video I've been looking for. 😎👍🏼 The bikepacking part is making me lean towards the gravel bike as I'm hoping to do the Way of St. James via Portugal next year. Thanks. Keep up the great work. 😀👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼
goal achieved I would say: you answered the question whether a gravel bike is just a modern mountain bike and the answer is: no. Enthralling content, especially the steep section: that was unexpected!
I love my hardtail MTB. Litespeed owl hollow full xtr. It looks like a dinosaur next to todays bikes, but she rips the technical stuff and a light climber.
That's awesome bro, I have a unicoi from 1999 and I still use it often. Had full xtr but sadly the derailleur finally broke last year, not bad after 20 years. I have a regular dore now but works great. Litespeed made amazing bikes!
I bought a gravel bike, but now I realize a cross country bike would've been a better choice for me. I just don't enjoy riding on roads at all, and in the woods gravel bike is not comfortable for me.
A 90's mtb with say conti Crosscountrys or Specialized hardback tyres in a 1.5 vs gravel would be closer off road I guess. I have also seen some research that suggests that lock outs on mtb's make little difference even on road so should they ditch them to save weight which potentially would be more beneficial on climbs.
V.Nice comparison with real world analysis. Now, it would be interesting too see a company approach crossover from the other end of the spectrum I.e., a modified MTB with some road DNA. Has anyone done that? High drop bars on a slack MTB frame, with 'semi' suspension, etc.
I’ve got both a gravel bike and 130mm trail bike. For the terrain in my area, the trail bike is better suited for my ability level (not great) since everything here is dry, rocky, and steep.
My main bike is a gravel bike (Cannondale Topstone Carbon), and at the moment I'm waiting for my trail hardtail to arrive (9 months and counting). My bike feels boring if I don't ride for at least 3 hours, so during the lockdowns I decided I needed something more fun and less serious... But I'm still waiting for it to arrive.
Greetings. Thanks for this video. Can anyone recommend what tire I could use on my 29’r hard tail mountain bike so I can keep with my friends on their gravel bikes? Also, where can I find some inexpensive aero bars for the mountain bike? Here in Colorado there are miles and miles of well groomed gravel roads that are no problem on the Mtb. The issue is when we reach pavement and I can’t keep up …any advice or recommendations appreciated.
How is a full suspension faster than a hard tail? With each peddle a percentage of the energy is absorbed into the suspension rather then being converted to the peddles.
So much discussion on this. Bikes are just tools so one should design the tool for the job at hand. As we progress the categories blur and they become just bikes again. Some smart company will let us just pick it all some day. Multi wheel sets and bars would be nice too.
35 years of continual mtb experience here and I'm not sure its so clear cut. I own all types of bikes and the Xc race hardtail is the only one I wouldn't ever be without. Full suss is great for making things easier but comes with a significant maintenance cost, and the bikes are so capable now they can be quite dull unless the rider is pushing for some dynamic heroics...which most aren't. In my opinion most UK mtbers have normalised being well over-biked for the terrain which has led many on to e-bikes as a conclusion...when the other alternative is a more efficient true all-terrain allrounder...
I have both a gravel bike and a full sus mtn bike. I can ride my gravel bike on mtn bike trails but I feel I'm in survival mode and it's not very comfortable. I feel it's best to have both types of bikes but if I could only choose one I'd pick the gravel bike cause of it's versatility and I like to ride fast.
That Scott is drool worthy. Your conclusion doesn’t account for the fact that in total time, the Spark was faster summed over all segments. However, the more relevant point is whether the bike you choose is based upon the most difficult segment, or the average. The Scott takes trails that would be scary for a gravel. But, the Cotswolds are not the Sierras. I suspect that a Scott Spark plus a Scott Addict Gravel would cover everything from gnarly trails to your local Crit…
My main issue now with gravel bikes is the hidden in plain sight ripoff prices. For example, I can buy a carbon full sus 29er xc bike with all the toys for 5 or 6 grand. Something like a Scott Gravel, a new shape Crux, etc, are more than that in medium price builds. That's a real issue I think.
Reallly relevent vid! As a long time road rider, I’m loving my 3T Exploro RaceMax for the new places its taken me including several gravel races. We have alot of rocky, root strewn trail in my area so a hard tail may be in my future. That terrain is too sketchy on my gravel bike even with 650Bs and 47mm tires.
Shouldn’t you include the ride it took to get those bikes to the trailhead? Which bike was best at getting to the trailhead from your home? Or do you expect to use your motor vehicle whenever you ride? I might travel by car to a trailhead once every 2 or 3 weeks but I ride 5 times a week out my front door.
So, based on the total times, the mountain bike is faster. It is also more versatile. The choice of bikes is interesting. How much of difference would it make if the Gravel had no dropper and shock. Would it have been less comfortable, but much faster on section 2 and 3. And what about using a hard tail XC bike? Do you really need that rear suspension for the techy bit? This is a 10 minute ride. How about stretching it out to a hour course. Then the comfort and security of the MTB might make deciding a no-brainer. I think for the average rider, the correct MTB with fast rolling tires is going to perform just as well or better in most conditions when compared to a gravel bike, while offering more comfort and security.
To me, a bike is the vehicle, if I am going off roading, I would cycle there. I can imagine taking a full suspension 3 inch tyred beast off the back of a car when I get to the trails, but I wouldn't want to ride the mixed terrain that travel gives you.
Gravel bike is like a rocket compared to any MTB, even compared to ebike it still is better for almost anything except some technical trails which well, this Scott with limited travel cannot do as well.
A gravel bike is a road bike with fat tires and nothing else. and a way to rake in even more money from consumers. The advantage of the rise of the gravel bike is that it is wonderfully quiet on the roads in the Netherlands. hardly encounters Roda cyclists anymore. 🤙🤙
Salsa Warbird not really a typical gravel bike. I have a Scott Spark (2021), but have 36 crank which really increases speed for getting to MTB runs. You should have put a 36 on the Spark, but it still would not have beaten the gravel bike on gravel unless it was proper grade 3 gravel. My gravel bike is a Moots 45 which doesn't need the fakery of a small travel fork. Answer, get both bikes!
Total time difference only 8 seconds. I got a roadbike and mtb already but planning to get a gravelbike as well. For me that because of the longer bike (packing) trips where the mtb lacks versatility
A mountain bike can do everything, but not as fast or efficiently as a gravel bike on packed dirt or roads. Not everyone cares about speed. Those with unlimited funds can have both ( and an enduro bike, downhill bike, down country bike, trail bike, cross country bike and probably a few more categories created to make us unhappy with what we have to spend more) but most of us should just be happy riding what we have. The cost of new bikes is a little crazy.
Most gravel bikes have no suspension so far,when the road turns rough they will knock your teeth loose and bruise your spine,even standing on the bike you still take a hard hard beating,like any bike with no suspension. Ive got caught out a few times on 15 miles of deep washboard that cant be avoided on my gravel bike.........I just ordered a light Intense XC bike and will be using it in place of the gravel bike a lot. Drop bars are anything but an advantage on trail type conditions.....mt bike WAY faster on any rough downhill.
The gravel bike is a better off-season bike as it exercise the same muscles as the road bike. Btw fast isn't fun. To the limit, is fun. Riding a gravel to the limit on a blue MTB trail is much more fun than pedaling a overly capable MTB around the same.
Well yes, but riding a red/black on a full sus mountain bike is more fun than doing the same on a gravel bike… ultimately, fun is different for different people. A gravel bike could never be my only bike but a mountain bike could, for others the reverse would be true; there is no correct answer/solution. Well… owning one of each would technically be correct but you get my point.
naaa i can't agree about the commuting thing. An MTB is very good as a commuter. Wen the snow comes you have a more secure ride than a gravel/racer. That said i own a CAAD12 and love my training/race ride to work : P
if you ride trails, like real trails, a gravel bike is not even a consideration unless you just want to slam the sh*t out of your body. not really comparable imo. If I'm riding chunky trails and wanna go 20+ miles, I even need to choose my FS over my hardtail just so I can continue longer. but, to each their own. gravel just serves a completely different purpose.
Think it was a lot closer than that, overall the MTB was 2 seconds quicker. I guess you could call it a dead heat but as the man says performance isn't everything.
Why would you own a gravel bike OR a mountain bike, when you could own a gravel bike AND a mountain bike? And a road bike and a TT bike and another road bike and...
I really don't see the point in a comparison like this, why? My HT and gravel bike have nothing in common, apart from they are both bikes! Most mountain bikers wouldn't dream of using their gravel bike on most of their regular trails! Find something that's actual worth while to make a video of!
So in summary: A gravel bike is faster for gravel trails and a mountain bike is faster for mountain bike trails. Brilliant! But only the mountain bike can actually handle both terrains.
@@monty2078 I have no idea what that is and honestly don't care. My comment was specifically about what happened in this specific video that we're commenting on. Which was that the mountain bike was able to do all of the three segments but the gravel bike wasn't.
@@WaterFrequently Because that is what I would enjoy more. Have serious shoulder issues and with flat bar handlebars, it's painful quite quickly and I find myself thinking that I must, I absolutely must put my hands somewhere else on the handlebars. Can get really distressed about it. Mountain bikes having wide handlebars doesn't help either.
Gravel bikes are cool and I love mine I’ve had it a couple years now but… I also just added a trail hard tail to my stable and find the gravel bike is best used on routes that take in a mixture of terrain where it’s simply fantastic and very, very fast ! but when it gets to rocky or technical sections gravel bikes are useless and suddenly start to feel a little fragile and become very uncomfortable and this is where the mountain bike really shines, there an absolute blast and far more comfortable. My only real gripe with the mountain bike is it’s weight as when climbing on anything mellow it feels painfully slow and far more of an effort when compared to my much lighter gravel bike.
XC bikes can be had as light as 23 lbs.
@@bradsanders6954 I can confirm, I’m just about to finish my Scott Scale build. Only bits remaining are my rear mech and chain. Bike is sitting at exactly 9kg for the moment. I reckon it will be less than 22lbs when complete.
@@Cal-Mac I like suspension,ft and rear. I like it alot. Motorcycles havent been rigid rear end since the early 30's. I will make my new Intense sniper even lighter.
@Led Zeppelin Dafuq you on about?
@@bradsanders6954 I have my 19 Specialized Chisel down to 22lbs on the nose. Great bike, weight is perfect. Light but not too light.
In my experience I will always own both. My gravel bike is setup more for ultra endurance road/gravel racing so most of my century's and long races are done on my gravel bike. I also ride road to all my gravel roads. And coming from mountain biking I like chunky mtb trails that the gravel bike could just never do. But I like fast and I always choose my hardtail over a full sus, most full sus takes the fun away from trail riding. And then I have my road bike purely set up for road racing. 3 bikes, with all 3 being aimed primarily for each discipline
On an XC bike the trick is,smaller lighter tires,use bar ends even though they arent hip. I use em alot....Strong riders can fly on an XC bike no matter the road or trail. Both have 29'er wheels. 700c is 29'r also.
Just for the record: the MTB can ride more kinds of terrain than anything else. It is therefore the more, maybe even most, versatile bike. The Gravelbike on the other hand is more efficient on non bumpy surfaces...unless you put fat knobby MTB tyres and superwide drop bars on it. Then the gravelmonster is just a bad mountainbike.
Its really about marketing. I know people who will ride nothing but a gravel bike,no matter what the ride is....Mt bike trails, serious roadbike rides, they are sold on the gravel platform.....it works but a 16 lb rd bike has a real advantage on road, and a mt bike flat rips on any real trail......for now the trend is pretty strong towards gravel, and gravel bikes becoming more like mt bikes,or more like road bikes.........."marketing".
Bad mountain bike in of itself is a relative term. A gravel bike with fat tyres on it may be a bad mountain bike in comparison to a mid to high end mountain bike. But compared to a low end mountain bike it could be seen as a very good mountain bike lol
By that logic a tracor is more versatile than a car. Then why dont everyone just get a tractor mate?
@@MysticMac000 Because versatility is not the most relevant criterium.
Nice video! These reviews are always interesting, but never so surprising if you own both bikes. Where I live there are more than 1000sq.km. of gravel/dirt roads. I use the GB for smoother dirt, gravel trails(not so technical or rough) linking them up with road sections and enjoying the same POSITION as on my road bike allowing more comfort with the variety of hand positions,etc and adds a lot of variety to your road routes spicing them up. The speed aspect is more akin to a road feel, but without the bother of traffic.
MTB is best on pure stuff(exploring routes is good as you can go anywhere comfortably) and good when it gets cold, seeking the shelter of woods, trails, etc and windchill is less of a factor....Enjoy the differences. BOTH are great 👍
I completely agree with this video.
Even comparing a hardtail and gravel bike would give the same results.
Gravel bike = fast suv
Mtb bike = old school Land Rover defender
So to summarise the mountain bike is better at mountain biking and the gavel bike is better at gravel tracks 🤪
Not rocket science is it. No surprises there then.
Who would of thought it 🤣
Define better. Faster or?
I’ve been riding a Scott gravel bike 4 years now. It’s replaced my road bike. A road bike has been obsolete for my uses since. A typical outing for me if riding in the city consists of smooth and rough paved roads, short stretches of gravel roads, sidewalks, low curbs, asphalt bike paths, gravel bike paths, cracked broken raised pieces of asphalt, construction zones, detours through sandy areas, single track trails with sandy spots. All kinds of conditions are necessary to contend with to do a 30km+ loop and end up where I started linking as much bike paths as possible. In rural riding it needs to do long distances on highway, loose deep chunky dirt roads, rough farmers track. All this is what is expected realistically from my bike that excels on asphalt as it’s primary focus.
I bought my first mtb this summer with the intent of using it as my winter bike. So far I don’t enjoy it on asphalt or gravel bike paths. Your just too insulated from the surface your riding on. Feedback and responsiveness are NIL. It’s amazingly capable though. It excels on uneven surfaces, roots, rocks, curbs, obstacles, sandy spots, single track, mtb trails, high speed 🟦 descents.
3 areas of over lap between styles where I actually prefer the mtb is on the loose deep chunky rural dirt roads, short distance commuting, short distance errands. The fact it has a dropper, big tires, suspension, wide stable bars, upright position make it really comfy and easy to stop and go at intersections, hopping curbs and slow speed control. All ideal for running to the corner store.
Mtb - avoid distance if not on proper trails.
Rdb - avoid proper trails
I really dig that Scott Spark. I bet that gravel bike excels at loose deep chunky dirt roads. NA has some really hard to ride dirt roads that are beyond your typical rigid gravel bike with 40mm tires. Doable but rattles the teeth out of your head. Great video.
Thing is, I don't want to feel every rock on the road. And also I don't want every small curb or rock to throw my front tire into the air at a fast speed. That's why I am happy with my MTB. Locking the front tire will meet your responsivity standard, but only if you like shaking on the road. Having a front suspension means you brake better, you can jump easily on curbs, and you can basically jump on or over anything. Much harder with a gravel bike.
Fully agree with your conclusion. One extra option I have tried a few times is aero bars on my XC FS MTB. It works very well on those gravel or road sections and extends what kind of ride I'm prepared to look at. It also feels like a strong position to drive the pedals. It's all about the amount and type of off road versus road. One other thing is my Canyon Grail has mudguard mounts so not only is it super versatile but it is also my winter road bike.
David, you do a great job and are very fair and well-spoken. I agree with everything you said, but I'm wondering if whether or not a full suspension mountain bike could be a viable commuter would depend on the situation of the commuter. If a person, esp. an older person, had to course through a lot of rough roads, pots holes or cobble stones, it seems like the mountain bike would be more comfortable. Seems like the bigger knobby tires would also be better in snow. In the summer a person could fit it with narrower, smoother tires. Could also be fitted with more commuter friendly handle bars.
Just an idea. Keep up the good work.
Now compare the gravel bike to a superlight race Xc hardtail...in previous decades that Scott 'XC' bikes capabilities would have been closer to a downhill bike, it's probably closer to 'trail' now. Having ridden lightweight hardtail on all terrains since the late 80's, I still find them the perfect bike for everything. My Xc hardtail will be lighter than that gravel bike (19lbs), I'll easily match its pace on the road (tyre dependant) but on proper offroad terrain the speed will be closer to that full-suss - so arguably an xc hardtail is a touch more versatile but very close to gravel bike performance with just hand position preference splitting the two.
there's a reason why xc winners like nino schuster ride the FS scott from this video - the rear suspension adds more grip and is overall faster than a hardtail so sure you could compare to a hardtail which should be cheaper for a given spec, but honestly if you have a gravel bike, then a hardtail MTB is not enough of a jump IMO and vice versa. If you can afford only one bike and don't ride very far at a time then a hardtail MTB is a pretty sensible choice. Likewise a gravel is a good choice if you don't ride a particularly technical terrain.
Roadies will always prefer the gravel bike. As a dirtbike rider and mt bike rider I like the light XC bike most of the time....there's always a big downhill on most rides and the XC bike just flies away from gravel bikes.
A hardtail is also more fun on technical terrain than a gravel bike. The gearing is lower so you can climb steep stuff longer. You can jump over logs and float over roots where you wouldn't be able to with drop bars. It's not even a good comparison - apples and oranges. The hardtail is the ultimate do-it-all machine in my opinion. I have a full carbon rigid fork if I'm doing gravel on the hard tail. The bike totally flies with that setup.
Those bikes are very different - I have them both and the mtb is nice for some trails and technical stuff.
But for everything else the gravel bike is great - you can do longer distances, its fast on the road and gravel, you can close the stretches where the roads end. I use it to avoid busy roads and to explore new quiet roads which sometimes end in gravel where I would have to stop with the normal road bike. For climbing it is great, I can nearly do everything (even on slicks with low pressure), but technical downhills are for mtb and not fun on the gravel.
This was a great video but I think your comment has got to be the most concise exposition of what a gravel bike is and isn't. Thanks.
Over 1 year ago threw my legs over a gravel bike and still have no desire to ride my double suspended mtb. The few sections where the suspension would improve the ride are not enough to justify the complexity, weight, inefficient riding position and extra cost of the mtb. Mtbs numb the rinding experience, gravel bikes let you enjoy what you are riding over. Gravel bikes do require adaptation, putting attention to things which did not matter as much on the mtb such as tire pressure, and size. Because the body now will do the suspension, takes a while to adapt your body and riding style having no suspension, a shorter front end and wheelbase. Newer gravel bikes are lengthening the front end and adopting shorter stems.
Enjoyed the video but you’ve missed the number one rule…..have one of each !
That’s the dream
Another solution to the equation is to fit some old aerobars to your mtb.I have a 10 year old Kona Kahuna 29er hardtail which I really like but the nearest trail is about 4km away.With the aerobars I can be comfortable and aero on any smooth section or road.Sometimes I do road training on this bike for extra resistance but pump tyres up hard. Most of the terrain here in New Zealand is steep to very steep so the mtb is better.apart from weight.
Sold my full suspension mtb and I never have the time (or can’t be arsed) to travel somewhere to ride.
Gravel bike suits my limited time- ride straight from my door.
Road bike is too restrictive.
nice review David! 🤘
I'd have that Scott Spark because it's so cool. Gravel is my choice it's more versatile and suits the terrain where I live. We have many many miles of gravel riding. I also use it to commute to work so it's a brilliant and quick all-rounder. Great Video :)
Great vid again David. I love my Topstone Lefty and also my Stumpjumper but I really think I am going to buy the Scott for places like Affan. I have sold both of my Tarmac’s including the S-Works because of the danger of cars and vans. It’s horses for courses really. I say “get one of each and have a stable. Happy riding everyone and stay safe.J
I'm debating between buying a 29" hardtail (Giant XTC SRL 29 1 or similar) and a gravel bike (Canyon Grizl AL or similar) and this is just the video I've been looking for. 😎👍🏼
The bikepacking part is making me lean towards the gravel bike as I'm hoping to do the Way of St. James via Portugal next year.
Thanks. Keep up the great work. 😀👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼
So which one will u choose?
Mountain bike all day long Enjoyable video David keep um coming.
Inner bar ends on the MTB make a huge difference on gravel/tarmac. SQ Lab on point on mine
goal achieved I would say: you answered the question whether a gravel bike is just a modern mountain bike and the answer is: no. Enthralling content, especially the steep section: that was unexpected!
I love my hardtail MTB. Litespeed owl hollow full xtr. It looks like a dinosaur next to todays bikes, but she rips the technical stuff and a light climber.
That's awesome bro, I have a unicoi from 1999 and I still use it often. Had full xtr but sadly the derailleur finally broke last year, not bad after 20 years. I have a regular dore now but works great. Litespeed made amazing bikes!
I bought a gravel bike, but now I realize a cross country bike would've been a better choice for me. I just don't enjoy riding on roads at all, and in the woods gravel bike is not comfortable for me.
A 90's mtb with say conti Crosscountrys or Specialized hardback tyres in a 1.5 vs gravel would be closer off road I guess. I have also seen some research that suggests that lock outs on mtb's make little difference even on road so should they ditch them to save weight which potentially would be more beneficial on climbs.
HI David, It would be useful to do a comparison between this short travel front shock and the redshift stem.
Okay I can do that
Scott spark is awesome bike...
V.Nice comparison with real world analysis.
Now, it would be interesting too see a company approach crossover from the other end of the spectrum I.e., a modified MTB with some road DNA.
Has anyone done that? High drop bars on a slack MTB frame, with 'semi' suspension, etc.
I’ve got both a gravel bike and 130mm trail bike. For the terrain in my area, the trail bike is better suited for my ability level (not great) since everything here is dry, rocky, and steep.
My main bike is a gravel bike (Cannondale Topstone Carbon), and at the moment I'm waiting for my trail hardtail to arrive (9 months and counting). My bike feels boring if I don't ride for at least 3 hours, so during the lockdowns I decided I needed something more fun and less serious... But I'm still waiting for it to arrive.
Greetings. Thanks for this video. Can anyone recommend what tire I could use on my 29’r hard tail mountain bike so I can keep with my friends on their gravel bikes? Also, where can I find some inexpensive aero bars for the mountain bike? Here in Colorado there are miles and miles of well groomed gravel roads that are no problem on the Mtb. The issue is when we reach pavement and I can’t keep up …any advice or recommendations appreciated.
Bit late, but Continental RaceKings roll fast as heck.
How is a full suspension faster than a hard tail? With each peddle a percentage of the energy is absorbed into the suspension rather then being converted to the peddles.
So much discussion on this. Bikes are just tools so one should design the tool for the job at hand. As we progress the categories blur and they become just bikes again. Some smart company will let us just pick it all some day. Multi wheel sets and bars would be nice too.
Which saddle bag is that on the mountain bike?
Shouldn't the comparison be with a hardtail!
I discussed the reason for that in the video. If you’re going to have a mountain bike you’re better with a full susser imo
35 years of continual mtb experience here and I'm not sure its so clear cut. I own all types of bikes and the Xc race hardtail is the only one I wouldn't ever be without. Full suss is great for making things easier but comes with a significant maintenance cost, and the bikes are so capable now they can be quite dull unless the rider is pushing for some dynamic heroics...which most aren't. In my opinion most UK mtbers have normalised being well over-biked for the terrain which has led many on to e-bikes as a conclusion...when the other alternative is a more efficient true all-terrain allrounder...
I have both a gravel bike and a full sus mtn bike. I can ride my gravel bike on mtn bike trails but I feel I'm in survival mode and it's not very comfortable. I feel it's best to have both types of bikes but if I could only choose one I'd pick the gravel bike cause of it's versatility and I like to ride fast.
outstanding review
👍
That Scott is drool worthy. Your conclusion doesn’t account for the fact that in total time, the Spark was faster summed over all segments. However, the more relevant point is whether the bike you choose is based upon the most difficult segment, or the average. The Scott takes trails that would be scary for a gravel. But, the Cotswolds are not the Sierras. I suspect that a Scott Spark plus a Scott Addict Gravel would cover everything from gnarly trails to your local Crit…
Both bikes have probably the same weight. 😉. Both nice bikes. If I could choose I would go for the nice Spark.
That techy downhill section looks like pure misery on the gravel bike
My main issue now with gravel bikes is the hidden in plain sight ripoff prices. For example, I can buy a carbon full sus 29er xc bike with all the toys for 5 or 6 grand. Something like a Scott Gravel, a new shape Crux, etc, are more than that in medium price builds. That's a real issue I think.
Reallly relevent vid! As a long time road rider, I’m loving my 3T Exploro RaceMax for the new places its taken me including several gravel races. We have alot of rocky, root strewn trail in my area so a hard tail may be in my future. That terrain is too sketchy on my gravel bike even with 650Bs and 47mm tires.
Shouldn’t you include the ride it took to get those bikes to the trailhead? Which bike was best at getting to the trailhead from your home? Or do you expect to use your motor vehicle whenever you ride? I might travel by car to a trailhead once every 2 or 3 weeks but I ride 5 times a week out my front door.
So, based on the total times, the mountain bike is faster. It is also more versatile. The choice of bikes is interesting. How much of difference would it make if the Gravel had no dropper and shock. Would it have been less comfortable, but much faster on section 2 and 3. And what about using a hard tail XC bike? Do you really need that rear suspension for the techy bit? This is a 10 minute ride. How about stretching it out to a hour course. Then the comfort and security of the MTB might make deciding a no-brainer. I think for the average rider, the correct MTB with fast rolling tires is going to perform just as well or better in most conditions when compared to a gravel bike, while offering more comfort and security.
What glasses are you using.?thanks
Looks like Oakley Jawbreaker
To me, a bike is the vehicle, if I am going off roading, I would cycle there. I can imagine taking a full suspension 3 inch tyred beast off the back of a car when I get to the trails, but I wouldn't want to ride the mixed terrain that travel gives you.
Gravel bike is like a rocket compared to any MTB, even compared to ebike it still is better for almost anything except some technical trails which well, this Scott with limited travel cannot do as well.
Works Great !
A gravel bike is a road bike with fat tires and nothing else. and a way to rake in even more money from consumers. The advantage of the rise of the gravel bike is that it is wonderfully quiet on the roads in the Netherlands. hardly encounters Roda cyclists anymore. 🤙🤙
Salsa Warbird not really a typical gravel bike. I have a Scott Spark (2021), but have 36 crank which really increases speed for getting to MTB runs. You should have put a 36 on the Spark, but it still would not have beaten the gravel bike on gravel unless it was proper grade 3 gravel. My gravel bike is a Moots 45 which doesn't need the fakery of a small travel fork.
Answer, get both bikes!
Total time difference only 8 seconds. I got a roadbike and mtb already but planning to get a gravelbike as well. For me that because of the longer bike (packing) trips where the mtb lacks versatility
Wouldn't take the Scott bike packing. GB definitely better option for All Terrain touring adventures.
A mountain bike can do everything, but not as fast or efficiently as a gravel bike on packed dirt or roads. Not everyone cares about speed. Those with unlimited funds can have both ( and an enduro bike, downhill bike, down country bike, trail bike, cross country bike and probably a few more categories created to make us unhappy with what we have to spend more) but most of us should just be happy riding what we have. The cost of new bikes is a little crazy.
Most gravel bikes have no suspension so far,when the road turns rough they will knock your teeth loose and bruise your spine,even standing on the bike you still take a hard hard beating,like any bike with no suspension. Ive got caught out a few times on 15 miles of deep washboard that cant be avoided on my gravel bike.........I just ordered a light Intense XC bike and will be using it in place of
the gravel bike a lot. Drop bars are anything but an advantage on trail type conditions.....mt bike WAY faster on any rough downhill.
Does the World needs another MTB vs Gravel video? Probably yes...
Complaint: "Just a single handlebar position on the MTB". 5 sec later invents a new hand position :)
The gravel bike is a better off-season bike as it exercise the same muscles as the road bike.
Btw fast isn't fun. To the limit, is fun. Riding a gravel to the limit on a blue MTB trail is much more fun than pedaling a overly capable MTB around the same.
Well yes, but riding a red/black on a full sus mountain bike is more fun than doing the same on a gravel bike… ultimately, fun is different for different people. A gravel bike could never be my only bike but a mountain bike could, for others the reverse would be true; there is no correct answer/solution. Well… owning one of each would technically be correct but you get my point.
naaa i can't agree about the commuting thing. An MTB is very good as a commuter. Wen the snow comes you have a more secure ride than a gravel/racer. That said i own a CAAD12 and love my training/race ride to work : P
Gravel bikes=Good for rural country bike trails and road. Roadbikes=Urban/suburban road settings
Gravel bike is old xc hardtail with 3x
I don't see a mountain bike working out for my needs at this stage of my cycling journey. I went with a gravel bike.
If im going to town its on the gravel bike , but if im going on a trailride its the mtb
😊
if you ride trails, like real trails, a gravel bike is not even a consideration unless you just want to slam the sh*t out of your body. not really comparable imo. If I'm riding chunky trails and wanna go 20+ miles, I even need to choose my FS over my hardtail just so I can continue longer. but, to each their own. gravel just serves a completely different purpose.
2 to 1 for the Gravel Bike? On this track, on overall times, the Mountain bike was 42 seconds quicker.
Think it was a lot closer than that, overall the MTB was 2 seconds quicker. I guess you could call it a dead heat but as the man says performance isn't everything.
The fact that the gravel bike couldn’t even complete one of the sections though…
Why would you own a gravel bike OR a mountain bike, when you could own a gravel bike AND a mountain bike? And a road bike and a TT bike and another road bike and...
It’s as as simple as the N+1 system
removabe front wheel hub
this is all wrong, you should compare gravel with some 2x xc mtb, 1x on mtb is too slow. 42T vs 32T crankset....
I really don't see the point in a comparison like this, why? My HT and gravel bike have nothing in common, apart from they are both bikes! Most mountain bikers wouldn't dream of using their gravel bike on most of their regular trails! Find something that's actual worth while to make a video of!
You missed the intro where I explained the reason for making this video then
Suspension forks on a gravel is blaspheme ...
Shocks on a gravel bike. No way. Removes your genuine skill from the ride.
mountain bike: "look at what they need to mimic a FRACTION of our power"
first. Great choice of bikes to compare
I mean my man, use bikes that at least people can afford when you're doing a comparison! Lol.
And how much is that then?
Scott Spark would be nice if you could actually buy one
So in summary: A gravel bike is faster for gravel trails and a mountain bike is faster for mountain bike trails. Brilliant! But only the mountain bike can actually handle both terrains.
not really, try and take your mountain bike up Mt Ventoux
@@monty2078 I have no idea what that is and honestly don't care. My comment was specifically about what happened in this specific video that we're commenting on. Which was that the mountain bike was able to do all of the three segments but the gravel bike wasn't.
Full sus is way different to a hardtail. Quite an irritating comparison all things considered.
The gravel bike has more range the mountain bike is ugly.
The gravel bike is the winner for me.
Because it could do 2/3 of the terrain in this test?
@@WaterFrequently Because that is what I would enjoy more. Have serious shoulder issues and with flat bar handlebars, it's painful quite quickly and I find myself thinking that I must, I absolutely must put my hands somewhere else on the handlebars. Can get really distressed about it.
Mountain bikes having wide handlebars doesn't help either.