Dropper Tag Knot Q and A Follow Up
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 17 ม.ค. 2024
- I had a lot of comments and questions on our last video about the Figure of 8 Dropper Tag knot. Many of those comments were pretty similar so instead of replying with the same answers I figured a follow up video would best. In this video I address what is a dropper tag and why I use them. I talk about which tag end to use, dropper tag twist, why I don't use blood knots or tippet rings for dropper tags, and more.
Here are some links I mentioned in the video.
Figure of 8 Dropper Tag video that prompted this follow up • How to Tie a Dropper T...
16/20 knot video • My Favorite Tippet to ...
Cleaning your rig with the San Juan slap • Cleaning Junk Off Your...
Loon Micro Swivels on our site tacticalflyfisher.com/product... - กีฬา
I’ve been following Devin for about 7 years and he’s helped me to catch big nasty trout on the Upper Delaware. Listen and learn.
Glad I’ve been able to help you on the water.
Original blowtorch and quilldigon never fails 👍
I absolutely love the 16/20. Super strong and easy to tie.
Oh how I need to practice it...almost there but still using a clinch knot wasting zero tag.
Great analysis as usual Devin! I used to struggle very badly with dropper tag twist (while using mostly surgeons or orvis tippet knot) until about 4 years back I saw a video from Kelly Galloup about how he rigs his upper fly 6 inch tags for a 2-fly drop-shot indicator nymphing setup. He does a mainline blood knot to join the 2 sections of tippet but trims those tags off - then for his upper tag fly he uses a small perfection loop (separate piece of tippet) that wraps around the main line above the blood knot through the small loop and it pulls mostly inline w blood knot when pressure is applied. The stiffness of the very small section of perfection loop helps prevent tangle in the first place and the tag fly pivots very nicely on the main line to help easily remedy a twist or tangle when they happen. I understand your points about surface area micro drag and extra knots - I'm sure those downsides would apply to the Galloup rigging too - but his method actually works very well to significantly lessen the twist problem itself - which is something I can't practically say for any of the other alternatives that I have seen/tried personally (as a non competition average guy) - including all those discussed in this video. Best wishes!
Perfect. No misunderstanding at all. Been an avid subscriber since the beginning. I have shown this method to all my co- workers in the fly fishing department at Al’s sporting goods in Logan Utah We all use it now. Thanks very very much. All your videos are great
Hi Devin
I've been using the figure 8 dropper for a long time now. I use it for wet fly and Euro and rarely have I had a break off at the knot. I tie it slightly different to you in that I have the main line straight to the point fly and tie the droppers on using the figure 8. If I need to tie another dropper in I normally tie it just below the old dropper knot and keep fishing.
I haven't tested the different methods for strength as you may have done, but plenty of fish have tested the knots for me and I have not had any issues.
The figure 8 is quick to tie and has heaps of strength.
I just though I would share this with you.
Love the videos, keep them coming
Cheers
Craig
Thanks for the follow up, Devin. Great info as always.
Very informative! Thank you so much for sharing.
Devin thanks for sharing all of your techniques and technical knowledge and explaining it so well!!!
Excellent work “nicely done “ your verbal and demonstrated explanation is very helpful. I have moved to a micro system finally and have of course noticed a big difference in strike detection especially in slow winter water. Maybe a video showing all how the micro system vs heavy tippets similar to the modern nymphing OG would have good traction
Appreciate the follow up and being willing to interact with so many of us who are all trying to learn and improve our craft. Grateful to have people like you who share your wealth of knowledge and experience.
Enjoy your trip south. dont pack your waders, be a man.
Glad you enjoyed the video and I hope it helped.
And I didn’t pack waders last time nor do I plan on it this time. 😊
Good to see a new post, love this channel!
Thanks
Devin you answered a lot of my questions I like the figure 8 knot and the 16/20 just starting Euro thanks for the info looks like I need to practice to get the swing a lot of different techniques thanks again 👍
Great stuff, Devin.
Thanks 🙏
Good video. Thanks for posting.
Thanks for putting this video together Devin. So much great information was included.
Glad it was helpful.
Excellent as usual.
Thanks
Wonderful tutorial! Thank you. This helps very much. I will put into practice, in the next few days, when we get outa single digit temps here in Western North Carolina. Have fun down south & safe travels!🎏
Thank you Devin, learned a lot!
Glad it was helpful
Hi Devin, I have tied a number of droppers today and by far the figure eight tag from the mainline is the strongest. It’s also so quick to tie. Thank you!
Glad you’ve put it to the test. Happy fishing!
Excellent! Thank you.
Great follow up Devin! Lots of very good insights. I have struggled with the Uni knot to tie my second tag on with marginal success. I think I like your approach better, just retie and remove the damaged tippet in the process. Thanks!
Glad it was helpful
Devin, as always you provide very thoughtful instruction. Do you have have an opinion about using a double surgeons knot for a dropper?
I have encountered and landed some very large fish that required 4X tippet, do you ever go that heavy?
Devin, great video, as usual. Question: Do you ever use a loop knot to attach your nymph and/or dry fly, in order to give it more action?? thanks for your great work.
I don’t. They use a lot more tippet and tend to be weaker. I haven’t found them to be a critical necessity especially with fine tippet.
going to try micro swivels again. I experience all sorts of line/dropper tag twist. I fish primarily 5x and size 14-16 nymphs. But I hate euro fishing. I find it to be a very picky, overly complicated, and pain in the ass way to fish, full of half truths about how it works.
Devin - what’s your go to method to quickly adjust the depth of the nymph(s) when fishing the dry-dropper system ? I’m not convinced there is a perfect system for this, curious of your take (not that any rigs are perfect). Thanks for all the great content and fly tying supplies, your tungsten beads are the best!
Hello. Devin is on holiday and it may be a couple days before he's able to reply.
Suggested topic: if I wasn't comp fisherman and following/practicing for fips mouche rules here is what I would do different, here are techniques I would likely use, flies, equipment, etc. as recreational fisherman. Thanks for considering!
Peter, thanks for the suggestion. Unfortunately, I don't think it would make much of a video because I honestly wouldn't change much. I might fish a Euro leader that was a foot or two longer, I might occasionally fish an indicator in large rivers, and I wouldn't worry about knot spacing or empty dropper tags but that's about it.
This video is as good, if not better, than the video it's intended to supplement. Thank you for taking the time to answer question posed by your audience. One question, however, that apparently wasn't asked is about the advisability, in general, of using tags. The first reason for a tag that you adduce, that the dropper has more mobility and freedom of movement if attached to the leader by a tag, comes at a cost. Specifically, the freedom of the tag impedes the freedom of the point fly if they're moving in different current flows. As I understand it, this is the reason why many comp anglers are now moving to fishing a single fly. What are you thoughts on the matter?
Alex,
It isn't the tag that is the issue with drag. It's simply that you have two flies that are spaced a distance apart. Anytime that is the case, they can be in different current speeds/directions and the further apart they are the more likely that is to happen. Going with or without the tag won't solve that issue though..
@@tacticalflyfisher3817 You're right, of course. I meant to say using a second fly on a tag (or not). So, let me try again. In general, what are your thoughts about the effectiveness of using a single nymph as opposed to two (or three)?
@@alexargyros7186 They all have their place. In shallow broken water I typically use 1 fly for the best drift and strike detection. In less complicated water with wider areas of similar current, or in water that is deep and fast enough to need it, 2 flies are normally better. In the deepest and fastest water, I occasionally use three flies. As always, it's an iterative guess and check process.
Great stuff - @Devin can you recommend a knot for re-tying a dropper, let's say it has been reduced to only 4 inches long and we want it 6 or 8 inches?
I just retie as I explain in the video. I haven’t found a shortcut that is strong enough for me to trust it.
Awesome video Devin. I have gone from tippet rings to micro perfection loop at the leader-tippet junction. Then I double the tippet and tie a clinch to the loop (maybe an Arcay trick). What knot are you using here?
I use what I call a stopper knot there. I also have a video coming for it. The micro perfection loop is technically illegal in competition if it is further than 10 cm from the fly line (dumb rule). I've tried it there in the past but found that it broke fairly easily in finer micro leader materials.
@@tacticalflyfisher3817 Looking at some stopper knots, I see how they can be very linear/straight and tie by laying tippet over leader. Looking forward to your version.
Looking forward to this video and if you are using 13’ of Adams mono to your tippet section what do you have ahead of the Adams 4.5x mono?
Likely FIPS fly line, a leader+tippet is limited to 2x length of rod.@@philfitzsimmons616
@@philfitzsimmons616 I'm not sure what you mean by "ahead of". Here is a video with the formula. The leader is attached to a Euro nymphing line. th-cam.com/video/3xlLbnvnsfc/w-d-xo.htmlsi=pK7Wrw8ZNC33gGhB&t=130
I have another question, if you don' t mind. I don't think you've addressed this, but if you have, could you just point me to where in the video it's discussed. Let's say you want a six foot tippet with a dropper two feet up from the point. There are two ways of doing this: 1. Cut off a six foot length of tippet and then tie on a tippet about two feet from the end. 2. Cut off 4' 7" of tippet, and then tie in a two foot section leaving about six inches for the dropper. In #1, the dropper is formed from a separate piece of tippet; in #2, the dropper tag is formed from the initial length of tippet. The question is: is there any difference between these two methods in terms of strength, or anything else?
It’s quicker/easier for me to maintain the measurements to be legal in competition with method 2. I’ve tried method one briefly but not enough to test whether it is stronger or weaker. As long as everything is still set up in the same direction with the same knots, I doubt there would be much difference in strength.
Hi a newbe Question? Would that be a good dropper knot, for simple Stillwater fishing? Like dry dropper ect. Two flies or both wet flies? Thanks for your help. Good info 👍
Yes. I use it for stillwater fishing as well.
People need to practice their knots. This is a simple knot. Also Old Dominion trout bum has a video on the 1620 knot
Very simple peace
Piece not peace, we’re not at war.
peace meaning goodbye✌️
Say you’re using a dry and a single point fly. You want to fish deeper still dry dropper . Tippet and knots in good shape. How to make this change? At 21:50 or so? Cut off dry tag completely. New fig 8 further away from point. Correct?
That's one possibility or you could just add tippet where the nymph is.
Up tag knot opens
didnt we call it a hopper dropper rig in the 80's?
I’ll leave that up to you. I wasn’t born till 85
You're not making it clear going on about nothing no point lost no point
your knot Fowles up and wraps around the main line. A dropper knot should be 90 DEGREES FROM THE MAIN LINE . It doesn't fowl up !
Foul,not fowl. It’s a tangle not a bird.
I cover that pretty explicitly in the video. As I say, if you don't agree with me, that's certainly fine.
First off, foul, not fowl; next he has shown the inline knot is stronger, which is more important when using light lines. Shorter tags minimizes fouling.