Hi Daniel, Great video that tackles the main issue with insomnia in my opinion. Years of misleading information regarding the importance of sleep, made many of us putting so much pressure on sleep, that we cant sleep. I am working on the education part, and this video really helps. I hope that I will be able to convince my brain, it is hard, but I think it is working. Thanks for the knowledge
Thanks Sagi!! And on the convincing part, check out 399. And 100%, the amount of misleading information, it’s like brain washing. Hope this will change!
sounds like me, that's why I had a bout of insomnia. Too much tracking of everything relating to health. But since I've overcome insomnia, I have been letting go of many things and tell myself that it's not important how much I sleep or how far I walked etc....I am convinced that many insomniacs are health obsessed! Excellent video!
Pat! Thanks for sharing and the support. And yes, I think the sort of mindless pursuit of “health” often makes us have struggles like insomnia. Glad to hear about the benefits of letting go, it’s really always the way!
Hi Daniel I wake up really early and I can confirm my energy levels are getting better and better I feel extremely productive and adjusting very well last couple of days my sleep has gotten better and more consistent. The only thing that helped me adjusting is getting out of bed I think when u don’t have a consistent out of bed time your body is confused and will send sleep signals throughout the day I’m doing better now I have embraced my new wake up routine
Sometimes an simple change of getting up pretty consistently is all it takes! And you know, to me it’s not just that your body clock is a bit more adjusted, but also that there’s no more chasing sleep, there’s freedom and also no self criticism! All these things make life easier and we have more energy! Be in touch now and thanks a bunch for sharing!!
@@thesleepcoachschool8192 Here’s what I mean, Daniel, by ‘food for thought’. Until your teachings about how to regard sleep, I was one of those persons who listened to Mathew Walker and took his views very seriously and who was genuinely afraid that I was at risk of dementia should I get less than 7 to 9 hours of sleep. He was very persuasive, as are so many others who often appear as guests on shows such as Joe Rogan and the like. But with what you have said about really examining one’s motivation for other “life improving” activities, and implying that the same almost ‘obsession’ with ‘self improvement’ is a bit like other more obviously destructive tendencies like over eating or drinking too much, you made me realize that all of this “grasping” for self improvement can be as frustrating and useless as any other harmful activity. My conclusion: just as you always say that there is no one thing a person can do to improve his/her sleep, similarly, there is probably no amount of yoga, or walking or carb cutting or broccoli eating or meditation to live longer or healthier.
100%. I have nothing to add but to say I believe this to be true, and of course a big thanks for sharing this. I think this path of doing things like exercise and yoga and choosing food we like without attaching much or anything to these choices… this is the peaceful way. Loved reading this 😊
Hi MA, You know, we have the perfect video to review this exact question, or the answer rather. Check out Insomnia insight 346. Hope it clarifies this!
Hi Daniel, I'd appreciate your opinion on my situation. It took 3 weeks of experimenting a strict sleep window (2am - 7:30 am) and consistent wake up times before I had 1 really good week of sleep. It didn't take long to fall asleep either. It was glorious after months of fragmented insomnia! But in order for this to work, I'd always first fall asleep in the living room floor or sofa while watching TV. Inevitably, I'd wake up after a few minutes and walk to my room to lay on my bedroom floor, then get into bed. If not sleepy enough in bed, I'd get out of bed and lay on the floor next to my bed until sleep conditions were right. But how can I transition to my bed immediately instead of first laying on the floor when sleepy? I feel like I'm conditioning myself to believe I need to lay on the floor when sleepy before getting into bed: sofa > bedroom floor > bed. This past week I feel like I've regressed. I'm trying to implement the timeless sleep window (not actively paying attention to time after 11pm). Again, I lay down on the bedroom floor first. But once in bed I feel hyperaroused and not sleepy, so it doesn't feel good and I'm back laying on the floor next to my bed. Only this time I'm not falling sleep anymore once in bed. I'm trying to be optimistic and not form any kind of positive or negative relationship with sleep, but it seems like I'm doing something wrong even though my sleep drive is strong. I'm starting to get anxious again when crawling into bed, worried if I'll sleep or not.
Hi! Thanks for sharing this and I will say that whenever we are looking for something to make us sleep, even sleep drive, there’s some struggle. This is why I’m glad you’re going towards a place of less control and more freedom. Now what I think can help here is to review sleeping outside the bed to escape fear! Although the below was written for someone sleeping on a couch, it applies to spared bed or floor… common places where people sleep when there’s that fear of being awake. - Sleeping on a couch in itself is totally fine, but the problem with sleeping there or spare bed happens when there is a conflict. If someone sleeps on a couch and has no problem with that whatsoever, they are ok with sleeping there until further notice, great! 0 conflict. When someone is sleeping on a couch but rather wouldn’t, that’s where we have conflict. We have two conflicting interests of sleeping well and not sleeping on a couch. And this is where things get tricky. Because the tension and preoccupation that comes from the conflict makes it harder to sleep well and build sleep confidence. So what to do? When you have this conflict there are two good options. You can change how you think about sleeping on a couch. When you’re ok with it, there’s no conflict! You can start sleeping in bed, then there’s also no conflict! Now most people don’t want to sleep on the floor, whereby it helps to just sleep where you want to sleep indefinitely. - Now a few pointers “in order for this to work”, “experimenting”, “even though my sleep drive is strong” - these reveal an idea that there’s something we can do to achieve sleep… which IS the idea that creates insomnia! Awareness of this can be super helpful 😊 Hope this made sense and do stay in touch!!
@@thesleepcoachschool8192 Thank you for the reply! Do you suggest I continue with the sleepless time window or revert back to a more strict version of sleep consolidation? Perhaps I got a bit over confident with the one week of good sleep? It's a fine line, because I have to relinquish control, sleep effort and sleep hygiene but also be aware of how certain actions can impact my sleep positively or negatively. Yes, the problem is I'd rather not sleep on the couch, floor, or spare bed, but only on my own bed. Falling asleep on the couch with TV on isn't hard. More than anything I want to start associating bed = sleep.
Anytime! I would say if allotting less time for sleep is an act of freedom, like you feel some excitement about having more time to do things you like, it can help! On the other hand if the intent is to sleep more or sleep better… then it’s just really good to be aware of this. It actually doesn’t matter much when you go to bed or get up, as long as there’s not an intent to achieve something. So I think it helps most to pick something you can do forever. Let’s review in some detail! - The timeless sleep window is really there simply as a nudge towards less attachment. It is a way to sort of make yourself try less and let go of attempts at controlling sleep. There is often confusion about the main purpose. In traditional CBT there’s a lot of emphasis on making yourself stay awake for a long time so you feel sleepy. It is true that sleep drive is important, but anything you do to make yourself sleep becomes an effort! This includes making yourself stay up late! Remember, insomnia is not a problem of not being sleepy, it is a problem of trying too much to sleep. So the way to think of the sleep window is that it is simply a nudge in the direction of trying less. When you give yourself less time for sleep, and you no longer know the time at night, these again are important psychological steps towards trying less, being willing to have less control. What exact time you get up or what exact time you go to bed doesn’t really matter! What does matter is not focusing too much on the time. It’s also important to set it and forget it. Decide upon sometime and then don’t question it. This will free your mind to think about more pleasant things! In fact what also helps a lot is not knowing the time at night. Deciding what time to get up in the morning and then making a decision to stop checking the time at a certain time in the evening. Not knowing the time is a very powerful way of letting go of control! Finally, I think it’s important to be generous and to go a gentle path of no pressure. Is very tempting to say that you will have a very narrow sleep window so that you feel really sleepy and then you reach your goal faster. But that’s a way of pressure! Think about when people try to lose weight. The reason most people don’t do well is because they choose an extreme diet that they can’t stick to for more than a few weeks. It’s the same with sleep windows. Many people choose a really tight window and then they become frustrated and pressured because it’s not something they can do forever. If someone decides not to do a diet but rather change their lifestyle to something they can do forever, then there’s no pressure! Then they lose weight easily. If you choose a sleep window that’s for example 7 or 8 hours, that’s pretty close to what most people do anyway so you can do that indefinitely. That’s the way! - “It’s a fine line” - I think this definitely applies to intentions and thoughts… for example the idea of going to bed when sleepy is reasonable, except when we start monitoring for sleepiness to find the ideal moment to sleep! On the other hand, if we think it’s a fine line as in “I have to get it right so that my fragile sleep isn’t disturbed”, then this idea does produce some struggle! In fact sleep happens when we aren’t trying to protect or preserve or shield it! Rather when we do things we like regardless of how it may influence sleep, then that helps much! - And you know, associations, they are like so many other things sleep related… they are passive! When you think of someone who sleeps well, you would think they associate sleep with something positive. And you may think that’s why they sleep so well, but it actually isn’t! Because if someone had a “positive association” that would mean they placed some emotional value to sleeping a certain amount. And if they did, they’d end up struggling with sleep pretty soon. Because when they slept less (which everyone does, everyone’s sleep varies!) they would feel like they lost something and then they’d try to get more sleep again. As you can see, this is a path towards struggling with sleep! So in fact people who sleep well do so because they have no particular association with sleep. It’s like breathing, something that just happens that you don’t have to think about. And here’s the thing, if you try to make yourself have a positive association, you’ll end up frustrated and with more struggle! Because one cannot control thoughts or emotions. In fact it is when we try to control those that they get “out of control”. Rather it is best to move towards non attachment. When you sleep well, you attribute this to the fact that you were more willing to be awake, and that sleep then happened by itself because you were not doing anything in particular. When you sleep little, you attribute this to your desire to sleep. When you do this, you become less and less attached. Sleep becomes associated with nothing in particular. And then, with no effort to sleep, and no effort to try to produce any association - nice things come your way! - Hope this helps!!
@@thesleepcoachschool8192 Moving forward I'll try try to remember non-attachment. What happens in the case where I am can recognize sleep cues and am ready to sleep, but then cannot sleep once in bed? Let's say I don't pressure myself, or watch the clock, I don't make any attachments to my bed, am willing to be awake, accept whether I sleep or not, but then don't sleep? I'm not trying to solve the sleep problem in the moment and yet sleeplessness persists? Do I just have faith it'll sort itself out if I continue to detach my worth from sleep? Thank you again! Very much enjoyed your latest live session as it gave me a lot of insight!
Glad this session was helpful! And you know, the thing is that when being awake isn’t waiting for sleep, it’s a time to rest or enjoy a podcast or what not… then it’s not a problem! And so when the question is “what if I do this and I still don’t sleep”, then this is basically like asking “what if I stop looking at this as a problem and the problem persists?”! You see, then there’s still the idea that there exists a problem! And yes, when we no longer are attached, when we have faith in “nothing” (faith in not doing anything to control things we can’t control), then yes everything resolves by itself!
Well I wouldn't say I'm super healthy but I'm not unhealthy I Have Diabetes Type 2 I have high blood pressure and I have sleep apnea which are all being treated and they're all stable and I have been sleeping okay since I stumbled upon this channel cuz I have learned a lot I know that sometimes I don't get all the hours that I would like to but that's okay that's something else that I'm learning from your program... its been teaching me that it's okay sometimes you don't get the full amount but sometimes when I'm at home I take little cat naps and I think that's alright too.. like I said I've really learned a lot since I stumbled onto your Channel
This all makes so much sense Rudy, the part about not pressuring yourself to sleep… or to be awake either, the gentle path. So glad to hear the channel has helped, and thanks for sharing this 🙏
i always slept well till april 2020 and ever since i suffer from insomnia, i either take hours to fall asleep or i have disturbed sleep. i got health checks done and nothings wrong so it must be my mental health. i dont know if i can ever go back to sleeping normal again, its been over a year and no changes despite changing diet, sleep hygiene etc.. :(
Hi PK, Sorry to hear this but glad you’re here. You know sleep is actually not as complicated as they make it sound. The less you try, the better you sleep. So when you change diet, sleep hygiene, no wonder there’s trouble sleeping! Just spend a little time here learning and you’ll see things clear up.
Hi Daniel,
Great video that tackles the main issue with insomnia in my opinion.
Years of misleading information regarding the importance of sleep, made many of us putting so much pressure on sleep, that we cant sleep.
I am working on the education part, and this video really helps.
I hope that I will be able to convince my brain, it is hard, but I think it is working.
Thanks for the knowledge
Thanks Sagi!! And on the convincing part, check out 399. And 100%, the amount of misleading information, it’s like brain washing. Hope this will change!
sounds like me, that's why I had a bout of insomnia. Too much tracking of everything relating to health. But since I've overcome insomnia, I have been letting go of many things and tell myself that it's not important how much I sleep or how far I walked etc....I am convinced that many insomniacs are health obsessed! Excellent video!
Pat! Thanks for sharing and the support. And yes, I think the sort of mindless pursuit of “health” often makes us have struggles like insomnia. Glad to hear about the benefits of letting go, it’s really always the way!
VERY TRUE 💯
Hi Daniel I wake up really early and I can confirm my energy levels are getting better and better I feel extremely productive and adjusting very well last couple of days my sleep has gotten better and more consistent.
The only thing that helped me adjusting is getting out of bed I think when u don’t have a consistent out of bed time your body is confused and will send sleep signals throughout the day I’m doing better now I have embraced my new wake up routine
Sometimes an simple change of getting up pretty consistently is all it takes! And you know, to me it’s not just that your body clock is a bit more adjusted, but also that there’s no more chasing sleep, there’s freedom and also no self criticism! All these things make life easier and we have more energy! Be in touch now and thanks a bunch for sharing!!
Great video Daniel as usual. 👏
Thanks Daniel 🤗!
MAKES SO MUCH SENSE 💯💯
So glad to hear 😊
For me, this video was great food for thought. Thanks.
Glad to hear Joseph… let us know where your pondering takes you 😊
@@thesleepcoachschool8192 Here’s what I mean, Daniel, by ‘food for thought’. Until your teachings about how to regard sleep, I was one of those persons who listened to Mathew Walker and took his views very seriously and who was genuinely afraid that I was at risk of dementia should I get less than 7 to 9 hours of sleep. He was very persuasive, as are so many others who often appear as guests on shows such as Joe Rogan and the like. But with what you have said about really examining one’s motivation for other “life improving” activities, and implying that the same almost ‘obsession’ with ‘self improvement’ is a bit like other more obviously destructive tendencies like over eating or drinking too much, you made me realize that all of this “grasping” for self improvement can be as frustrating and useless as any other harmful activity. My conclusion: just as you always say that there is no one thing a person can do to improve his/her sleep, similarly, there is probably no amount of yoga, or walking or carb cutting or broccoli eating or meditation to live longer or healthier.
100%. I have nothing to add but to say I believe this to be true, and of course a big thanks for sharing this. I think this path of doing things like exercise and yoga and choosing food we like without attaching much or anything to these choices… this is the peaceful way. Loved reading this 😊
Thanks Daniel!I was the one who requested for this video😁
Oh yes there you are!! It resonated with many many in the community I can see, thanks so much for the suggestion 😊!
If chronic insomnia isn't bad for your health, why do I feel so horrific?
Hi MA,
You know, we have the perfect video to review this exact question, or the answer rather. Check out Insomnia insight 346. Hope it clarifies this!
Hi Daniel, I'd appreciate your opinion on my situation. It took 3 weeks of experimenting a strict sleep window (2am - 7:30 am) and consistent wake up times before I had 1 really good week of sleep. It didn't take long to fall asleep either. It was glorious after months of fragmented insomnia! But in order for this to work, I'd always first fall asleep in the living room floor or sofa while watching TV. Inevitably, I'd wake up after a few minutes and walk to my room to lay on my bedroom floor, then get into bed. If not sleepy enough in bed, I'd get out of bed and lay on the floor next to my bed until sleep conditions were right.
But how can I transition to my bed immediately instead of first laying on the floor when sleepy? I feel like I'm conditioning myself to believe I need to lay on the floor when sleepy before getting into bed: sofa > bedroom floor > bed.
This past week I feel like I've regressed. I'm trying to implement the timeless sleep window (not actively paying attention to time after 11pm). Again, I lay down on the bedroom floor first. But once in bed I feel hyperaroused and not sleepy, so it doesn't feel good and I'm back laying on the floor next to my bed. Only this time I'm not falling sleep anymore once in bed. I'm trying to be optimistic and not form any kind of positive or negative relationship with sleep, but it seems like I'm doing something wrong even though my sleep drive is strong. I'm starting to get anxious again when crawling into bed, worried if I'll sleep or not.
Hi!
Thanks for sharing this and I will say that whenever we are looking for something to make us sleep, even sleep drive, there’s some struggle.
This is why I’m glad you’re going towards a place of less control and more freedom.
Now what I think can help here is to review sleeping outside the bed to escape fear! Although the below was written for someone sleeping on a couch, it applies to spared bed or floor… common places where people sleep when there’s that fear of being awake.
-
Sleeping on a couch in itself is totally fine, but the problem with sleeping there or spare bed happens when there is a conflict.
If someone sleeps on a couch and has no problem with that whatsoever, they are ok with sleeping there until further notice, great! 0 conflict.
When someone is sleeping on a couch but rather wouldn’t, that’s where we have conflict.
We have two conflicting interests of sleeping well and not sleeping on a couch. And this is where things get tricky. Because the tension and preoccupation that comes from the conflict makes it harder to sleep well and build sleep confidence.
So what to do?
When you have this conflict there are two good options.
You can change how you think about sleeping on a couch. When you’re ok with it, there’s no conflict!
You can start sleeping in bed, then there’s also no conflict!
Now most people don’t want to sleep on the floor, whereby it helps to just sleep where you want to sleep indefinitely.
-
Now a few pointers “in order for this to work”, “experimenting”, “even though my sleep drive is strong” - these reveal an idea that there’s something we can do to achieve sleep… which IS the idea that creates insomnia!
Awareness of this can be super helpful 😊
Hope this made sense and do stay in touch!!
@@thesleepcoachschool8192 Thank you for the reply! Do you suggest I continue with the sleepless time window or revert back to a more strict version of sleep consolidation? Perhaps I got a bit over confident with the one week of good sleep? It's a fine line, because I have to relinquish control, sleep effort and sleep hygiene but also be aware of how certain actions can impact my sleep positively or negatively.
Yes, the problem is I'd rather not sleep on the couch, floor, or spare bed, but only on my own bed. Falling asleep on the couch with TV on isn't hard. More than anything I want to start associating bed = sleep.
Anytime!
I would say if allotting less time for sleep is an act of freedom, like you feel some excitement about having more time to do things you like, it can help! On the other hand if the intent is to sleep more or sleep better… then it’s just really good to be aware of this. It actually doesn’t matter much when you go to bed or get up, as long as there’s not an intent to achieve something. So I think it helps most to pick something you can do forever.
Let’s review in some detail!
-
The timeless sleep window is really there simply as a nudge towards less attachment. It is a way to sort of make yourself try less and let go of attempts at controlling sleep.
There is often confusion about the main purpose. In traditional CBT there’s a lot of emphasis on making yourself stay awake for a long time so you feel sleepy. It is true that sleep drive is important, but anything you do to make yourself sleep becomes an effort! This includes making yourself stay up late!
Remember, insomnia is not a problem of not being sleepy, it is a problem of trying too much to sleep.
So the way to think of the sleep window is that it is simply a nudge in the direction of trying less.
When you give yourself less time for sleep, and you no longer know the time at night, these again are important psychological steps towards trying less, being willing to have less control.
What exact time you get up or what exact time you go to bed doesn’t really matter! What does matter is not focusing too much on the time.
It’s also important to set it and forget it. Decide upon sometime and then don’t question it. This will free your mind to think about more pleasant things!
In fact what also helps a lot is not knowing the time at night. Deciding what time to get up in the morning and then making a decision to stop checking the time at a certain time in the evening.
Not knowing the time is a very powerful way of letting go of control!
Finally, I think it’s important to be generous and to go a gentle path of no pressure.
Is very tempting to say that you will have a very narrow sleep window so that you feel really sleepy and then you reach your goal faster. But that’s a way of pressure!
Think about when people try to lose weight. The reason most people don’t do well is because they choose an extreme diet that they can’t stick to for more than a few weeks.
It’s the same with sleep windows. Many people choose a really tight window and then they become frustrated and pressured because it’s not something they can do forever.
If someone decides not to do a diet but rather change their lifestyle to something they can do forever, then there’s no pressure! Then they lose weight easily.
If you choose a sleep window that’s for example 7 or 8 hours, that’s pretty close to what most people do anyway so you can do that indefinitely. That’s the way!
-
“It’s a fine line” - I think this definitely applies to intentions and thoughts… for example the idea of going to bed when sleepy is reasonable, except when we start monitoring for sleepiness to find the ideal moment to sleep!
On the other hand, if we think it’s a fine line as in “I have to get it right so that my fragile sleep isn’t disturbed”, then this idea does produce some struggle! In fact sleep happens when we aren’t trying to protect or preserve or shield it! Rather when we do things we like regardless of how it may influence sleep, then that helps much!
-
And you know, associations, they are like so many other things sleep related… they are passive!
When you think of someone who sleeps well, you would think they associate sleep with something positive. And you may think that’s why they sleep so well, but it actually isn’t!
Because if someone had a “positive association” that would mean they placed some emotional value to sleeping a certain amount. And if they did, they’d end up struggling with sleep pretty soon. Because when they slept less (which everyone does, everyone’s sleep varies!) they would feel like they lost something and then they’d try to get more sleep again.
As you can see, this is a path towards struggling with sleep!
So in fact people who sleep well do so because they have no particular association with sleep. It’s like breathing, something that just happens that you don’t have to think about.
And here’s the thing, if you try to make yourself have a positive association, you’ll end up frustrated and with more struggle!
Because one cannot control thoughts or emotions. In fact it is when we try to control those that they get “out of control”.
Rather it is best to move towards non attachment.
When you sleep well, you attribute this to the fact that you were more willing to be awake, and that sleep then happened by itself because you were not doing anything in particular. When you sleep little, you attribute this to your desire to sleep.
When you do this, you become less and less attached. Sleep becomes associated with nothing in particular.
And then, with no effort to sleep, and no effort to try to produce any association - nice things come your way!
-
Hope this helps!!
@@thesleepcoachschool8192 Moving forward I'll try try to remember non-attachment. What happens in the case where I am can recognize sleep cues and am ready to sleep, but then cannot sleep once in bed? Let's say I don't pressure myself, or watch the clock, I don't make any attachments to my bed, am willing to be awake, accept whether I sleep or not, but then don't sleep? I'm not trying to solve the sleep problem in the moment and yet sleeplessness persists? Do I just have faith it'll sort itself out if I continue to detach my worth from sleep? Thank you again! Very much enjoyed your latest live session as it gave me a lot of insight!
Glad this session was helpful! And you know, the thing is that when being awake isn’t waiting for sleep, it’s a time to rest or enjoy a podcast or what not… then it’s not a problem! And so when the question is “what if I do this and I still don’t sleep”, then this is basically like asking “what if I stop looking at this as a problem and the problem persists?”!
You see, then there’s still the idea that there exists a problem!
And yes, when we no longer are attached, when we have faith in “nothing” (faith in not doing anything to control things we can’t control), then yes everything resolves by itself!
Well I wouldn't say I'm super healthy but I'm not unhealthy I Have Diabetes Type 2 I have high blood pressure and I have sleep apnea which are all being treated and they're all stable and I have been sleeping okay since I stumbled upon this channel cuz I have learned a lot I know that sometimes I don't get all the hours that I would like to but that's okay that's something else that I'm learning from your program... its been teaching me that it's okay sometimes you don't get the full amount but sometimes when I'm at home I take little cat naps and I think that's alright too.. like I said I've really learned a lot since I stumbled onto your Channel
This all makes so much sense Rudy, the part about not pressuring yourself to sleep… or to be awake either, the gentle path. So glad to hear the channel has helped, and thanks for sharing this 🙏
i always slept well till april 2020 and ever since i suffer from insomnia, i either take hours to fall asleep or i have disturbed sleep. i got health checks done and nothings wrong so it must be my mental health. i dont know if i can ever go back to sleeping normal again, its been over a year and no changes despite changing diet, sleep hygiene etc.. :(
Hi PK,
Sorry to hear this but glad you’re here. You know sleep is actually not as complicated as they make it sound. The less you try, the better you sleep. So when you change diet, sleep hygiene, no wonder there’s trouble sleeping! Just spend a little time here learning and you’ll see things clear up.