Sorry about the terrible 360 cabin footage. We were on a time crunch and sometimes you gotta do what you gotta do to get the shot. Also, a few other budget roadsters that didn't make our cut were the Mustang Ecoboost Convertible, 370Z Roadster, and Mini Convertible S, mainly because they were too dang heavy.
I love your channel. Somewhere I was talking to someone on a facebook car group and they mentioned you were their friend. I love your channel especially the quality of the footage. We do motorcycle builds here at our channel "interstellar motors" but Rich drives a miata and his brother in law is a pro drifter. Y'all should chat!
Owned Miata’s on the past and went to a 124. Hands down the 124 is more fun in every way. The Monza exhaust makes you drool. I get so many people approach me at gas stations and restaurants about it. Not to mention when I valet park with the top down the kid always puts it up front with the Lambos lol
I own a 124 Abarth and it's such a great drivers car, it's different, relatively rare, I have the optional Monza exhaust, Brembos, it's a car that screams passion and fun.
Damn since i first saw this car a few years back i fell in love. Last year on vacation i rented the base Fiat 124 Spider and that already was a blast :D
As a S2000 owner I'm biased, but Mazda deserves a lot of credit for carrying on with the Miata. It represents one of the last of a dying breed of cars as fewer and fewer people are interested in driver's cars as time marches on, (especially in a roadster configuration as very few like soft tops these days). The Miata's sales figures reflect this as they were in a constant rate of decline until the pandemic came along and threw everything out of whack - just look what happened with motorcycle sales in general or S2000 prices in particular during the past year. Even with the pandemic boost, Miata sales were nowhere close to where they were years ago. The vast majority of people have no interest in driving, they just want to get from point A to point B safely. The bottom line is that in a couple of decades when everyone is driving EV's and no one will be building internal combustion engines any longer, those who have owned any of these cars will look back and realize just how fortunate they were to experience them.
This is the first time I have ever heard someone say the Miata has a harsh ride. Having owned both an S2K and an ND I can personally say the S2K was much harsher. It’s one of the reasons I gave it up. That and the gearbox was temperamental. I respect your driving ability but IMO I think saying the Miata is harsh is incorrect.
@@soilent9618 Looks tend to be subjective. I don’t think the fiat looks the best, especially in its base trim. In this trim it’s not bad, but I still prefer the Miata and S2K. My biggest issue is he chose an automatic over a manual. While the S2K has a nice snick snick feel, the Miata has more of a rifle bolt action. A little longer but still satisfying. And he’s also wrong about the clutch. It’s progressive and catches over a long period of travel. It’s very easy to live with. Now that I think on it everything he said about the Miata flies in the face of what everyone else has said. My thought it he went in with a bias against it. It won 3rd place in C&Ds best drivers car shootout, but no, it’s harsh and an automatic Fiat is better to drive.
Could be because it’s a gts (basically a gt with the club billstein shocks and springs). I heard the spring rate on the club was stiffer but can’t confirm if that’s true or not
@@fpaltenhoff86 They're different, but not THAT different to where you'd be complaining about it. The Miata in general has a pretty comfortable ride. I think the Fiat is just modded to feel the ay he wants it to feel.
@footballcoreano what were your precious euro manufacturers doing when they were getting thrashed around the circuit by nsx's and gtr's? i love porsche but i still remember them publicly throwing a tantrum when the gtr broke their nurburgring lap record. and ferrari? as passionate as they are about their products, doesn't change the reality that their offices are full of pretentious, elitist douchebags. in any case, racing is exactly what it sounds like-- a tug of war between teams/manufacturers. pretty much every brand has had numerous shining moments in motorsport at some point.
The amount of trust that small airport has in the people in this production is out of this world. Me looking at him driving through the taxiway corners…. 👀
Youre literally the 1st review that talks bad about the Mazda gearbox its literally one of the best, and why would anyone drag these cars?!🤯 the circuit time attack is a better way to measure.
@footballcoreano I love Abarth but this one doesn't really have anything Italian in it. The ND is rated as one of the most reliable cars currently sold in the world. You don't seems to have a clue what you're on about.
@footballcoreano I don't know where you get the impression that Japanese cars are bad. Do you have any personal experience with well-maintained Miata, S2000, MR2, old NSX, Civic TypeR, Integra TypeS?
Nah this dude disses the 6 speed in the miata way to much. I’ve only ever heard praise from it such as throttle house who drive super cars on the regular. Still think the miatas Manuel is amazing.
Maybe because it’s a girls car at the end of the day 😂 Has new sky active technology that gives the 2.0 engine a compression ratio of 14.0.1 But still makes poop 💩 power 😂 And no, power isn’t everything.. but compression of 14 and you can’t even get 1990s honda Dohc vtec power out of it is hilarious 😆
@@AdAstra78 You think I’ve never driven a $2000 lady’s car ? Ok buddy Even the 1994 generation is a great platform, but not a great car out the factory , this one is absolutely trash my sisters automatic base model civic LX with wrong wheel drive is more fun to drive
@@anthonyjanelle12 I don't think you've ever driven a 4th gen Miata, no. If you had you wouldn't be making such silly comments based on a spec sheet alone. Plus, if you'd driven one you'd know that calling it a 'lady's car' is simply not applicable. I appreciate you cutting down on the emojis though. Makes it easier to believe you're an adult. Just about.
@@AdAstra78 So because im stating facts and not kissing the Miata’s butt that to you means I haven’t driven one ? Ok 🤡 Maybe feminine looking cars with under 200hp isn’t really my thing? I didnt mean to offend you and the LGBT 🏳️🌈 community with real facts and like you said even quoting a spec shit that Mazda themselves wrote up 🤣 Please tell me you bought the over priced Abarth Spider because of a badge change
I've had 2 of the 3 and I've driven all of them. I prefer the 124. My experience with the S2K ride was different than his...I thought it was harshest. Not sure if I had a different year or package. But the biggest drawback of the S2K, by a mile, is the steering. It was one of the earliest applications of electric power steering and it had all the feedback of my dad's Oldsmobile. The Miata/Fiata have dramatically better steering feel.
I bought a 124 spider abarth for less than $30,000 brand spanking new. It’s a heck of a bargain! It’s a 2019 never been sold. I got 10,000 of msrp because they are discontinued. Pearl white and stock record monza exhaust. Insanely good
@@RK1FX The S2000 in 1999 was competing against a Porsche Boxster 986, not the MX-5 NB. Totally different price range. If Honda made the S2000 today, it would cost $20k more than the Abarth and Mazda so DUH of course it better be better, as its more expensive.
I mean the first generation mx-5 also scales there. And that's 30 years old. Also says a lot. The thing is: by this type of cars age doesn't really matter. The first generation mx-5 also puts smile on your face when you drive it. All these cars were built for that.
@@johnmitchell2269 Slower than the S2000 priced at a different bracket which competes with the Boxster of the time. So what? Straight line speed gets boring
I’d probably go with the ND2 because it is much newer, under warranty, has modern safety and technology, weighs 400lbs less, has more low end torque which makes it feel quicker 90% of the time, has better steering feel, stronger brakes, and a stiffer chassis. With a good set of suspension and tires the ND demolishes the S2000 in auto X due to less weight and a more predictable chassis. BUT that S2000 engine is just so legendary lol. So hard to choose.
I have to disagree, especially from someone who came from owning a miata. Honda S2000 just dominates. What tech and safety does the ND2 have anyways? lol!
@@ap2.v1 stock for stock yes the S2000 dominates but prepped for auto x the ND2 is dominating right now. Like I said 400lbs less weight, low end torque, and a more predictable chassis is what is helping the ND2 best the S2000. Look at the times. The ND2 has tech like back up camera, blind spot monitors, adaptive cruise control, keyless entry, push button start, and Apple CarPlay.
@@jjchockey Oh I see, yes auto x ND2 may be the clear winner due to its wheel base. For me I prefer S2000 on track way more fun imo and desirable to listen when high revving. I've driven both back to back also me being a previous Miata owner, for me S2000 is the better car overall.
@@ap2.v1I own an AP2 that I used to autoX in the SCCA. You are mistaken, the ND2 beats the S2000 handily in autoX. They compete in C-Street (only mods allowed are essentially a single sway bar and shocks) where the ND2 wipes the floor with the S2000 and they also compete in STR (essentially full normal bolt-ons) where the ND2 absolutely mauls the S2000- it’s not even close in STR. The F22C is a joy to wring out, but for a daily the ND has a better powerband. The ND has a better chassis hands down. Hard to make up for 500 lbs of extra weight.
Thanks for your vid, I appreciate including the S2000 even though it is so old by comparison. I'm growing fond of the Abarth 124, may have to drive one soon. Thanks!
as a previous s2000 owner i disagree. S2000 is a fun car and i loved it, \ but parts even 10 years ago were expensive for it. I owned a 92 gen 2 MR2 t-bar in the mid 90s and that car was amazing. Better than the s2000. Right now the Cayman s/ boxster is one of the best cars for the money and power with no mods.people saying the s2000 end all be all are usually fan boys that never have driven one.
I love reviews like this that aren't just $100k+ rides. The 1/2 mile run was a little comical. Spent 8 years in an S2000 and loved it almost as much as the FD RX-7 (better shifting too)
@footballcoreano Said exactly as someone who has never driven an S2000 or FD, go look at touge races the S2000 and FD are always at the top, they beat new BMW's, the new GTR nismo and every other car, all while having way less HP, because they handle so much better than pretty much anything else. and unreliable? Japanese cars are the most reliable in the world, there is no comparison to Japanese and German reliability.
S2000s (2.2 L) are very reliable little motors. The rotary can be as well if tuned properly and fed pre-mix oil (I never trusted the oil injection system). You sound like a BMW or Audi fanboi
Great video guys. Personally I'm not a fan of the Honda, it performs well, but is getting on in years, so I would not put it on my shopping list, I don't to worry about nursing such an old car that probably has had a very hard life. The 'Fiata' is now out of production due to poor sales, and just doesn't look as good as the real Miata. But the Fiata would be a great car to pick up second-hand. The Mazda is not about straight line speed or power, it a very competent lightweight and modern convertible, it's very trackable and can be easily be upgraded with all sorts of mods. Also lots of safety and comfort features, and unlike it's Fiat cousin, it's still in production! The MX-5 gets my vote.
Awesome review. Thanks for the comparison. The new miata I test drove definitely had a similar feeling to my S2K, but lacked HP. I do feel that the drag race was a bit botched in the video. 6000rpm+ is where the power is. Same goes for the lap time. The S2000's Advantage is the 8000 rpm rev limiter, later shifts etc. You did mention confidence in driving the mistake and s2000 vs your own Abarth so that is a big * where I feel the S2k would still come out on top. Again thanks for the comparison.
Miata - hands down. It’s got a better torque curve for daily driving than the s2k and it’s still fun to ring out. I owned an ND1 and the gear shift was awesome - don’t understand the complaint at all. In fact I probably like it more than my 2019 Type R’s transmission. I wouldn’t spend the extra money on the hard top though - I would stick with the soft top.
Also I would add the creature comforts the Mazda have really make a huge difference in daily driving - car play, heated seats, better materials and less NVH….oh and it weighs less than the s2k.
nice video. nice to see that an s2000 with 200k km is still faster than the turbocharged, modified, lighter Abarth. It s the driving experience which made me pick the s2000 though. I was considering an alfa 4C also but decided to settle with the little Honda. Stick OEM sized A052 on it, it will roll a bit but damn it's fast middle corner with those relatively small (and therefore less costly) tires. I'm tempted to do a few little mods to enhance it. Great car
Thanks for this - I've been jumping back and forth between the S2k and Abarth 124...sounds like a decent set of coilovers will bring the S2k up to 'modern' standards 👍
I have a 2007 S-2000 AP2 that I love, bought it about 10 years ago for slightly over $23,000 with only 23K miles on it, and I've only put about an extra 20k miles on it since I bought it.
Been waiting for another 124 Abarth video on your channel! And what better way than to mix in a S2000 and Miata 😁Great job Dan! I also have a 124 Spider Abarth and I’ve done some 40-100mph testing when I was Phase 1. Surprisingly my Phase 1 numbers were extremely similar to your Phase 2 40-100mph numbers. Now I’m Phase 2 and haven’t done this test again yet. I believe I’m pretty local to you, would love to meet up! I’ll let you take my 124 for spin of course (it’s manual 😉). Maybe we can get some automatic vs manual testing done since we have the same car and tune. Let me know the best way to reach you 👍
s2000 is an amazing car. everytime someone does a comparison on youtube with modern cars it at least comes second haha. Just dont make hondas like that anymore huh
Tires were definitely a factor in this test. Try it again running the same brand/model/age tires across all vehicles. My guess is the gap between the S2k and the other cars become bigger if tires were equal.
Miss my s2k. But 15 years later with 3 kids and a family my Trackhawk still keeps those days alive. @trackday need a trackhawk I wouldn’t mind letting guys borrow it 😆 for an episode!
The S2K is perfect but it’s so expensive. Couldn’t bring myself to pay $30k-$35k for a truly good condition S2K vs. ND2/Fiata at $20k-$26k (but usually closer to 20k)
Very strange that the MX5 is last in some of your tests here, in many tests in Europe and in the US, the MX5 ND2 ST 184HP is faster than the Fiama and the S2000, maybe because you used the RF which is 100 pounds heavier than the ST! Here are a couple tests in Italy and one in the US. th-cam.com/video/4Vp8VuaSpAc/w-d-xo.html th-cam.com/video/1MEBlnLFvlw/w-d-xo.html
He clearly has a bias towards the Fiat and even admitted it has been tuned. He said he turned the tune off, but something tells me that may not be the case.
@@soilent9618 right, not really fair then, heavier MX5 because it's the RF version and the Fiata is tuned up for more power ha ha! And the MX5 and the S2000 will last twice as long as the Fiata!
I've done roll races with my buddy who has an AP1. ND2 walks it every time. Don't really understand why the S2000 was so much faster in this race. Driving both, the ND2 feels significantly faster in more areas of the rev range.
I love my S2000 and have done since I've been 33 year's old. I'm now 48 and it's always been a daily runner. Still makes me smile to this day but she's getting old now at 18 year's old she needs more TLC especially on the body work and rear wheel arches which unfortunately always rust from the inside out.
Yeah exactly. My ND1 has a cheap Cobalt exhaust and the thing just howls at high rpm. The Abarth sounds like it has a broken exhaust. Horrible. The MX-5 here would have been hobbled by that reedonkulous Raceseng knob which weighs twice what the already weighed stock knob weighs. Would take all the feel out of the gear change.
@@boffam00 💯 agree! I personally always hated that Fiat. A lot of ppl compare it just because they came from the same factory and have identical interior design but it does not compare. I currently own a ND2 and after a Good-Win Racing axle-back and a flash tune I couldn’t be happier.
I'm sorry... but no one drives around in the 124 out of sport mode and the auto is known to be more laggy than the manual. 4k-5k rpm to move... yeah not in sport mode (stock) it comes to life.
Thank you for the review! I don't want to be rude or anything but did you keep the S2k constantly in VTEC? below VTEC it drives like a standard civic so if you want to be fast, you have to keep it constantly over 5k revs and rev it out to the limiter. Just how Tsuchya drove in Best Motoring. As an owner i think the S2K can do much better but yes, it is a car you have to spend time with and practice which is not easy to drive.
@@smilepermile8165 yea, and honda and toyota are winning everything in Motorsports rights now like F1 / motoGP / indycar / Ralley / LeMans etc. can't remember Fiat winning anything motorsport related ^^
What rock did you climb out from under. Japanese vehicles are the most reliable cars in the world and Italian cars, especially Fiats are the least. Do some research. I could never understand why someone would want a Miata with a Fiat drivetrain.
The s2000’s steer wheel is not too big. It’s actually very small for a stock wheel. Popular aftermarket steering wheels for these cars are the 350mm the stock one in the s2000 is 360mm. 🤷🏻♂️
Enjoyed this. Having driven the S2K and Miata, not surprised at the results. I would have added my old 2002 Toyota MR2-S to the comparison as well. The late lamented Lotus Elise would also fit- used ones are in the 30's but creeping up. And because they used a modified Toyota 2ZZ engine.
I've wanted a Miata since the first came out. Finally got an ND a few years ago and loved it. Unfortunately it got totaled and I replaced it with a Fiata. As to looks? In two years with the MX5, no one said anything to me (they're kinda common). 18 months with the 124, and I can't tell you how man strangers have come up to me & commented on it's looks. Of course once they find out it's a Fiat Spider, I have to hear about their brother/uncle/relative who had a '60s version, when Fix It Again Tony was really a thing.
Good video. I found the information useful. I noticed you were using the Pbox from your last video. The Miata would be my third choice based on look or style.
Nice comparison. I like both the miata and the s2000. Your driving looked pretty good but please dont let your arms cross while turning. The video was very educational and fun to watch.
Just wanted to say very high quality video production quality. I appreciate your work, snaked the like button and would buy some merch if I come across anything that I may need. I have 7 cars, the s2k ap2 being one of them. Would you be reviewing any vintage Porsches in the future? 911 or 944 turbo S?
Was planning on getting an ND2 but had no idea the 124 was putting those kinds of numbers down with a tune! Definitely going to check those out, though it looks like telescoping steering wheel has to be added after the fact.
Both chassis have such sky-high handling ceilings, that a poorly setup s2k will feel like garbage compared to a pro-level setup ND and vice versa. Most people don’t study setup-theory enough to really unlock the blissful limit handling characteristics that both chassis are capable of. My advice to the vast majority of people is seek out setup advice or pay for someone to setup the car for you. Most aspects of comparison from one car to the other can be changed, so really just go for the one you like more :)
One of my favorite episodes so far. I love all three of these, but feel like the need to add aftermarket rollover protection (for most events) limit the appeal of these for track usage. Other than something like a BRZ/86, is there a better option for an affordable fun/occasional track car?
E46 330, although a 325 like mine will match the slowness of a BRZ. But really, these cars run forever (186k on my autox car, 220 on my daily), handle very well, look good, sound good, easy to work on, can be sedan, coupe, convertible, market value rising, huge aftermarket.
I've been in the market for the Fiat 124 spider and was wondering what type of fuel you put in it. I know the owner manual states that the car should receive premium, but can it take regular. Furthermore, I think the car has a knock sensor which changes the timing of the ignition caused by the difference in the fuel quality. Still, I would like to eliminate knocking altogether to preserve the engine.
![BOWKYLION - วิงวอน (ex-change) [Official MV]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/cLdnZWDaO-w/mqdefault.jpg)
Sorry about the terrible 360 cabin footage. We were on a time crunch and sometimes you gotta do what you gotta do to get the shot. Also, a few other budget roadsters that didn't make our cut were the Mustang Ecoboost Convertible, 370Z Roadster, and Mini Convertible S, mainly because they were too dang heavy.
Also they are S as convertibles. The 3 chosen were built to be topless.
I love your channel. Somewhere I was talking to someone on a facebook car group and they mentioned you were their friend. I love your channel especially the quality of the footage. We do motorcycle builds here at our channel "interstellar motors" but Rich drives a miata and his brother in law is a pro drifter. Y'all should chat!
Boxster!
Should've thrown in a 13 jcw mini Cooper roadster
There's a reason why every new roadster is always compared to the S2000
Because the segment is small…
Ya the one they don't build anymore
Funny way of spelling Miata considering it's compared to a lot more
Owned Miata’s on the past and went to a 124. Hands down the 124 is more fun in every way. The Monza exhaust makes you drool. I get so many people approach me at gas stations and restaurants about it. Not to mention when I valet park with the top down the kid always puts it up front with the Lambos lol
I own a 124 Abarth and it's such a great drivers car, it's different, relatively rare, I have the optional Monza exhaust, Brembos, it's a car that screams passion and fun.
Same here, love mine
124 club lol
Been wanting one since they first came out might get one by the end of the year I'm so excited 😆
Damn since i first saw this car a few years back i fell in love. Last year on vacation i rented the base Fiat 124 Spider and that already was a blast :D
Do you know if the fiat version 124 spyder worth getting atm and/or is it likely to last a while or do they have many problems ?
Everyone I see who have tested both say the MX-5 feels quicker, but the one twentyfour IS quicker. Nice video.
As a S2000 owner I'm biased, but Mazda deserves a lot of credit for carrying on with the Miata. It represents one of the last of a dying breed of cars as fewer and fewer people are interested in driver's cars as time marches on, (especially in a roadster configuration as very few like soft tops these days). The Miata's sales figures reflect this as they were in a constant rate of decline until the pandemic came along and threw everything out of whack - just look what happened with motorcycle sales in general or S2000 prices in particular during the past year. Even with the pandemic boost, Miata sales were nowhere close to where they were years ago. The vast majority of people have no interest in driving, they just want to get from point A to point B safely. The bottom line is that in a couple of decades when everyone is driving EV's and no one will be building internal combustion engines any longer, those who have owned any of these cars will look back and realize just how fortunate they were to experience them.
Perfectly said!
This is the first time I have ever heard someone say the Miata has a harsh ride. Having owned both an S2K and an ND I can personally say the S2K was much harsher. It’s one of the reasons I gave it up. That and the gearbox was temperamental. I respect your driving ability but IMO I think saying the Miata is harsh is incorrect.
He also thinks the Fiat looks the best... I am very much questioning this guy's opinions at this point.
@@soilent9618 Looks tend to be subjective. I don’t think the fiat looks the best, especially in its base trim. In this trim it’s not bad, but I still prefer the Miata and S2K. My biggest issue is he chose an automatic over a manual. While the S2K has a nice snick snick feel, the Miata has more of a rifle bolt action. A little longer but still satisfying. And he’s also wrong about the clutch. It’s progressive and catches over a long period of travel. It’s very easy to live with. Now that I think on it everything he said about the Miata flies in the face of what everyone else has said. My thought it he went in with a bias against it. It won 3rd place in C&Ds best drivers car shootout, but no, it’s harsh and an automatic Fiat is better to drive.
Could be because it’s a gts (basically a gt with the club billstein shocks and springs). I heard the spring rate on the club was stiffer but can’t confirm if that’s true or not
@@fpaltenhoff86 I know it’s now the base. I had a club and people still complained the club was too soft compared to something like the BRZ.
@@fpaltenhoff86 They're different, but not THAT different to where you'd be complaining about it. The Miata in general has a pretty comfortable ride. I think the Fiat is just modded to feel the ay he wants it to feel.
It’s bad when you own an F80 M3 Comp and still miss driving an S2000….
@footballcoreano Honda and unreliable? Tf is wrong with you? xD
@footballcoreano i have 319,000 miles on my s2000, original motor and transmission... unreliable eh?
@footballcoreano
Abarth Cabrio !
Understandable, sold my M2Competition for a good S2000 and a GR Yaris, don't miss the M2 at all! ... But F80's are really great cars, keep it! =D
@footballcoreano what were your precious euro manufacturers doing when they were getting thrashed around the circuit by nsx's and gtr's? i love porsche but i still remember them publicly throwing a tantrum when the gtr broke their nurburgring lap record. and ferrari? as passionate as they are about their products, doesn't change the reality that their offices are full of pretentious, elitist douchebags. in any case, racing is exactly what it sounds like-- a tug of war between teams/manufacturers. pretty much every brand has had numerous shining moments in motorsport at some point.
The amount of trust that small airport has in the people in this production is out of this world. Me looking at him driving through the taxiway corners…. 👀
Yeah; it looked like they were a blown tire away from a $500k accident.
Not surprised the S2K is becoming legendary. It’s in a league of 1.
As a presenter you have a very clear and easy to listen to voice and the production quality is good. Keep up the good work.
I like that all three have their own proud ownership group/audience.
Youre literally the 1st review that talks bad about the Mazda gearbox its literally one of the best, and why would anyone drag these cars?!🤯 the circuit time attack is a better way to measure.
Agree, and saying the throw is 'long' is ridiculous!
This review is biased without a doubt.
Totally agree
Lol yeah I just bought a miata it have the best manual gearbox I've ever driven
Nothing beats an s2k in this department, but they are becoming pricey if memory serves me well
where i live you are gonna have to pay a minimum of 18k euros
You get what you pay for and it’s worth every penny.
Yes it's pricey and yes it's worth the price
Right and you have to have the cash, you cant finance!
I have a 2008 s2000 😁
But he has to change gears at 8500 and not at 6000. Vtec starts at 6000
Mazda rf just looks awesome
@cookiemonster9 he’s trolling. Ignore him
@@razorworks111 He's a right-wing Korean, so he would automatically hate anything that has association from Japan.
@footballcoreano imagine saying japanese cars are unreliable lol
@footballcoreano I love Abarth but this one doesn't really have anything Italian in it. The ND is rated as one of the most reliable cars currently sold in the world. You don't seems to have a clue what you're on about.
I just bought an 02 s2k and I couldn’t be happier! It shows it age in some aspects but even after 20 years it’s still an amazing summer car!
As an S2000 owner, I approve of this msg. Great job with the vid & channel. You are destined for a million subs.
You'd think. He has to be doing something wrong cause he has made a ton of amazing videos and just doesn't have the subs I can't figure it out.
As an owner of Miata, I agree - s2k is the most fun of them. But only RF gives you foldable hard top and all year around usability.
And a car less than 11-20 years old
@footballcoreano abarths are definitively more unreliable than a Honda
@footballcoreano I don't know where you get the impression that Japanese cars are bad. Do you have any personal experience with well-maintained Miata, S2000, MR2, old NSX, Civic TypeR, Integra TypeS?
@Monday, Tuesday Is My Weekend aren't they the same car as the mx5 nd under the skin, even same production line I've heard
@@drivingpsyche The low iq guy is spamming his disinformation because he's a biased badgesnob
I own both mx5 and abarth but i enjoy the mx 5 more
Nah this dude disses the 6 speed in the miata way to much. I’ve only ever heard praise from it such as throttle house who drive super cars on the regular. Still think the miatas Manuel is amazing.
Maybe because it’s a girls car at the end of the day 😂
Has new sky active technology that gives the 2.0 engine a compression ratio of 14.0.1
But still makes poop 💩 power 😂
And no, power isn’t everything.. but compression of 14 and you can’t even get 1990s honda Dohc vtec power out of it is hilarious 😆
@@anthonyjanelle12 Given how many emojis you use I'm surprised you're actually old enough to drive.
You've clearly never driven a Miata.
@@AdAstra78
You think I’ve never driven a $2000 lady’s car ? Ok buddy
Even the 1994 generation is a great platform, but not a great car out the factory , this one is absolutely trash my sisters automatic base model civic LX with wrong wheel drive is more fun to drive
@@anthonyjanelle12 I don't think you've ever driven a 4th gen Miata, no. If you had you wouldn't be making such silly comments based on a spec sheet alone. Plus, if you'd driven one you'd know that calling it a 'lady's car' is simply not applicable.
I appreciate you cutting down on the emojis though. Makes it easier to believe you're an adult. Just about.
@@AdAstra78
So because im stating facts and not kissing the Miata’s butt that to you means I haven’t driven one ? Ok 🤡
Maybe feminine looking cars with under 200hp isn’t really my thing? I didnt mean to offend you and the LGBT 🏳️🌈 community with real facts and like you said even quoting a spec shit that Mazda themselves wrote up 🤣
Please tell me you bought the over priced Abarth Spider because of a badge change
I've had 2 of the 3 and I've driven all of them. I prefer the 124. My experience with the S2K ride was different than his...I thought it was harshest. Not sure if I had a different year or package. But the biggest drawback of the S2K, by a mile, is the steering. It was one of the earliest applications of electric power steering and it had all the feedback of my dad's Oldsmobile. The Miata/Fiata have dramatically better steering feel.
I bought a 124 spider abarth for less than $30,000 brand spanking new. It’s a heck of a bargain! It’s a 2019 never been sold. I got 10,000 of msrp because they are discontinued. Pearl white and stock record monza exhaust. Insanely good
The fact that a car which first came out in 1999 can go toe to toe with two new/modern cars says a lot.
Yes, it says that Honda was bad ass back in the days and now it's meh
@@RK1FX The S2000 in 1999 was competing against a Porsche Boxster 986, not the MX-5 NB. Totally different price range. If Honda made the S2000 today, it would cost $20k more than the Abarth and Mazda so DUH of course it better be better, as its more expensive.
I mean the first generation mx-5 also scales there. And that's 30 years old. Also says a lot. The thing is: by this type of cars age doesn't really matter. The first generation mx-5 also puts smile on your face when you drive it. All these cars were built for that.
@@Stolas9 MX5's are slow though. And Imo a little too basic (although I know that's what people like about them)
@@johnmitchell2269 Slower than the S2000 priced at a different bracket which competes with the Boxster of the time. So what? Straight line speed gets boring
S2000 ftw! Reaffirmed my choice of picking up an s2000 a year ago before the price spiked even higher.
I’d probably go with the ND2 because it is much newer, under warranty, has modern safety and technology, weighs 400lbs less, has more low end torque which makes it feel quicker 90% of the time, has better steering feel, stronger brakes, and a stiffer chassis. With a good set of suspension and tires the ND demolishes the S2000 in auto X due to less weight and a more predictable chassis. BUT that S2000 engine is just so legendary lol. So hard to choose.
I have to disagree, especially from someone who came from owning a miata. Honda S2000 just dominates. What tech and safety does the ND2 have anyways? lol!
@@ap2.v1 stock for stock yes the S2000 dominates but prepped for auto x the ND2 is dominating right now. Like I said 400lbs less weight, low end torque, and a more predictable chassis is what is helping the ND2 best the S2000. Look at the times. The ND2 has tech like back up camera, blind spot monitors, adaptive cruise control, keyless entry, push button start, and Apple CarPlay.
@@jjchockey Oh I see, yes auto x ND2 may be the clear winner due to its wheel base. For me I prefer S2000 on track way more fun imo and desirable to listen when high revving. I've driven both back to back also me being a previous Miata owner, for me S2000 is the better car overall.
@@ap2.v1I own an AP2 that I used to autoX in the SCCA. You are mistaken, the ND2 beats the S2000 handily in autoX. They compete in C-Street (only mods allowed are essentially a single sway bar and shocks) where the ND2 wipes the floor with the S2000 and they also compete in STR (essentially full normal bolt-ons) where the ND2 absolutely mauls the S2000- it’s not even close in STR.
The F22C is a joy to wring out, but for a daily the ND has a better powerband. The ND has a better chassis hands down. Hard to make up for 500 lbs of extra weight.
Thanks for your vid, I appreciate including the S2000 even though it is so old by comparison. I'm growing fond of the Abarth 124, may have to drive one soon. Thanks!
I’ll go for miata.
S2K will remain unrivaled for eternity 💪
as a previous s2000 owner i disagree. S2000 is a fun car and i loved it, \ but parts even 10 years ago were expensive for it. I owned a 92 gen 2 MR2 t-bar in the mid 90s and that car was amazing. Better than the s2000. Right now the Cayman s/ boxster is one of the best cars for the money and power with no mods.people saying the s2000 end all be all are usually fan boys that never have driven one.
The intro “initiating screen” always fires me up!
Its a no brainer the S2000 is the most engaging of the 3 with the most character. If you can find a clean example buy one before its too late.
Nice take on these fine automobiles. I'm taking my AP1 S2K to the grave. The car is just so timeless, but it's nice to see some variety in this space.
Considering it has like 1 airbag, be careful what you ask for…
I love reviews like this that aren't just $100k+ rides. The 1/2 mile run was a little comical. Spent 8 years in an S2000 and loved it almost as much as the FD RX-7 (better shifting too)
@footballcoreano yo you gonna post this below every guy’s comment? If abarth is so much better then why do the sales suck
@footballcoreano Said exactly as someone who has never driven an S2000 or FD, go look at touge races the S2000 and FD are always at the top, they beat new BMW's, the new GTR nismo and every other car, all while having way less HP, because they handle so much better than pretty much anything else. and unreliable? Japanese cars are the most reliable in the world, there is no comparison to Japanese and German reliability.
S2000s (2.2 L) are very reliable little motors. The rotary can be as well if tuned properly and fed pre-mix oil (I never trusted the oil injection system). You sound like a BMW or Audi fanboi
@footballcoreano Abarth is built in Japan
I found the RF the most attractive but the Fiata sounds the best and it's looks are starting to grow on me.
Fiata lol that's gonna stick in my head now living rent free
Sounded like short shifting in the s2000 on the track test... not making accusations, but did not sound like full send to me
Great video guys. Personally I'm not a fan of the Honda, it performs well, but is getting on in years, so I would not put it on my shopping list, I don't to worry about nursing such an old car that probably has had a very hard life. The 'Fiata' is now out of production due to poor sales, and just doesn't look as good as the real Miata. But the Fiata would be a great car to pick up second-hand. The Mazda is not about straight line speed or power, it a very competent lightweight and modern convertible, it's very trackable and can be easily be upgraded with all sorts of mods. Also lots of safety and comfort features, and unlike it's Fiat cousin, it's still in production! The MX-5 gets my vote.
You should be bloody proud of this review mate! Cinematic and interview like masterpiece, 5*
Awesome review. Thanks for the comparison. The new miata I test drove definitely had a similar feeling to my S2K, but lacked HP.
I do feel that the drag race was a bit botched in the video. 6000rpm+ is where the power is. Same goes for the lap time. The S2000's Advantage is the 8000 rpm rev limiter, later shifts etc. You did mention confidence in driving the mistake and s2000 vs your own Abarth so that is a big * where I feel the S2k would still come out on top.
Again thanks for the comparison.
The 0-60 launch of the s2k was botched. It would have won in that category as well.
Miata - hands down. It’s got a better torque curve for daily driving than the s2k and it’s still fun to ring out. I owned an ND1 and the gear shift was awesome - don’t understand the complaint at all. In fact I probably like it more than my 2019 Type R’s transmission. I wouldn’t spend the extra money on the hard top though - I would stick with the soft top.
Also I would add the creature comforts the Mazda have really make a huge difference in daily driving - car play, heated seats, better materials and less NVH….oh and it weighs less than the s2k.
Had a 2010 mx5 and a 2018 mustang gt. Sold the mustang gt to buy a c8 and kept the mx5 love that little car.
nice video. nice to see that an s2000 with 200k km is still faster than the turbocharged, modified, lighter Abarth. It s the driving experience which made me pick the s2000 though. I was considering an alfa 4C also but decided to settle with the little Honda. Stick OEM sized A052 on it, it will roll a bit but damn it's fast middle corner with those relatively small (and therefore less costly) tires. I'm tempted to do a few little mods to enhance it. Great car
Thanks for this - I've been jumping back and forth between the S2k and Abarth 124...sounds like a decent set of coilovers will bring the S2k up to 'modern' standards 👍
Really interesting to hear the Miata GT-S is so harsh. When I was cross-shopping that against the s2000, found the non-GTS pretty soft.
GT-S has the same sport suspension as Club trim. 2020MY and up has that suspension as a standard feature.
@footballcoreano I can’t tell if you’re joking or not. The Abarth is made in Japan with a Japanese designed chassis
He’s a troll. Ignore him.
Love the video the most, the Honda S2000 and everything else!
I have a 2007 S-2000 AP2 that I love, bought it about 10 years ago for slightly over $23,000 with only 23K miles on it, and I've only put about an extra 20k miles on it since I bought it.
I have an 07 too! Yours is probably worth more than you paid now !
I like the cinematic intro🔥
Been waiting for another 124 Abarth video on your channel! And what better way than to mix in a S2000 and Miata 😁Great job Dan! I also have a 124 Spider Abarth and I’ve done some 40-100mph testing when I was Phase 1. Surprisingly my Phase 1 numbers were extremely similar to your Phase 2 40-100mph numbers. Now I’m Phase 2 and haven’t done this test again yet. I believe I’m pretty local to you, would love to meet up! I’ll let you take my 124 for spin of course (it’s manual 😉). Maybe we can get some automatic vs manual testing done since we have the same car and tune. Let me know the best way to reach you 👍
Yes
If this happens it will be great 👍
s2000 is an amazing car. everytime someone does a comparison on youtube with modern cars it at least comes second haha. Just dont make hondas like that anymore huh
Get a life troll
Troll that likes his own comments 😂. Love my supercharged AP2
Great video. Love the Abarth. Italian emotion with Japanese build quality.
except the drivetrain!
Fiata might become a future classic. Kind of like the mazdaspeed NB2. Might never gain value though, just depreciate a little slower.
I think I figured it out: you can’t drive a stick.
S2000 all day long, had my AP1 for a couple years now super happy and will be in my garage for many years to come.
That start on the s2000 from a dig …
Tires were definitely a factor in this test. Try it again running the same brand/model/age tires across all vehicles. My guess is the gap between the S2k and the other cars become bigger if tires were equal.
Miss my s2k. But 15 years later with 3 kids and a family my Trackhawk still keeps those days alive. @trackday need a trackhawk I wouldn’t mind letting guys borrow it 😆 for an episode!
The S2K is perfect but it’s so expensive. Couldn’t bring myself to pay $30k-$35k for a truly good condition S2K vs. ND2/Fiata at $20k-$26k (but usually closer to 20k)
Very strange that the MX5 is last in some of your tests here, in many tests in Europe and in the US, the MX5 ND2 ST 184HP is faster than the Fiama and the S2000, maybe because you used the RF which is 100 pounds heavier than the ST! Here are a couple tests in Italy and one in the US. th-cam.com/video/4Vp8VuaSpAc/w-d-xo.html th-cam.com/video/1MEBlnLFvlw/w-d-xo.html
He clearly has a bias towards the Fiat and even admitted it has been tuned. He said he turned the tune off, but something tells me that may not be the case.
@@soilent9618 right, not really fair then, heavier MX5 because it's the RF version and the Fiata is tuned up for more power ha ha! And the MX5 and the S2000 will last twice as long as the Fiata!
I've done roll races with my buddy who has an AP1. ND2 walks it every time. Don't really understand why the S2000 was so much faster in this race. Driving both, the ND2 feels significantly faster in more areas of the rev range.
I love my S2000 and have done since I've been 33 year's old. I'm now 48 and it's always been a daily runner. Still makes me smile to this day but she's getting old now at 18 year's old she needs more TLC especially on the body work and rear wheel arches which unfortunately always rust from the inside out.
The S2000 was a marvel of mechanical and engineering design when it debuted and it's STILL a marvel that's tough to beat 20 years after the fact.
had 2 s2000 and mx5 rf stick which was also a powerful car. love both
I really enjoyed the video. I was waiting for some s2k comparison with modern cars. Thank you!
Nice vid man !!! Great testing
Like the Honda! I own a 1990 Mazda Miata! Love the car. Really fun to drive. We look at it as a go kart that goes 130mph! Lol
S 2000... enough said
Awesome video as usual
The MX-5 has one of the greatest gear boxes in general. You throw a catback or axle back on it like the s2k in this video and it will sounds purrrty.
Yeah exactly. My ND1 has a cheap Cobalt exhaust and the thing just howls at high rpm. The Abarth sounds like it has a broken exhaust. Horrible. The MX-5 here would have been hobbled by that reedonkulous Raceseng knob which weighs twice what the already weighed stock knob weighs. Would take all the feel out of the gear change.
@@boffam00 💯 agree! I personally always hated that Fiat. A lot of ppl compare it just because they came from the same factory and have identical interior design but it does not compare. I currently own a ND2 and after a Good-Win Racing axle-back and a flash tune I couldn’t be happier.
Whoever at Honda who thought it was a good idea to kill the S2000 needs to be brought up on charges.
Great review, love the S2000 hard to beat considering its age
I'm sorry... but no one drives around in the 124 out of sport mode and the auto is known to be more laggy than the manual. 4k-5k rpm to move... yeah not in sport mode (stock) it comes to life.
Great video as always !
Thank you for the review! I don't want to be rude or anything but did you keep the S2k constantly in VTEC? below VTEC it drives like a standard civic so if you want to be fast, you have to keep it constantly over 5k revs and rev it out to the limiter. Just how Tsuchya drove in Best Motoring. As an owner i think the S2K can do much better but yes, it is a car you have to spend time with and practice which is not easy to drive.
@footballcoreano "you english speaking people" lol
@footballcoreano The Abarth certainly appears to be a good car
@@binskee677 That idiot doesn't know that the Abarth 124 Spyder was built in Hiroshima, Japan, by Mazda employees lol
@@smilepermile8165 yea, and honda and toyota are winning everything in Motorsports rights now like F1 / motoGP / indycar / Ralley / LeMans etc. can't remember Fiat winning anything motorsport related ^^
What rock did you climb out from under. Japanese vehicles are the most reliable cars in the world and Italian cars, especially Fiats are the least. Do some research.
I could never understand why someone would want a Miata with a Fiat drivetrain.
Even though not exactly a "budget" car a Lotus Elise would fit in nicely with the rest of the pack
Great video as always! Was there a car meet in the background?😂
What an awesome Video
Blessed with another one. Always wanted an mxt my dad had one and my grandad had one and both of them loved theirs. I'll get one eventually!
Great content and I am looking at a 124 for a fun car
Mazdaspeed would've been fun to compare.
Awesome video
Nice video, Nice Camera work John & Dan
The s2000’s steer wheel is not too big. It’s actually very small for a stock wheel. Popular aftermarket steering wheels for these cars are the 350mm the stock one in the s2000 is 360mm. 🤷🏻♂️
I find it to be exactly 10mm too big; 350mm would be ideal.
Awesome video, I Love my 2020 Abarth 124 Spider
Enjoyed this. Having driven the S2K and Miata, not surprised at the results. I would have added my old 2002 Toyota MR2-S to the comparison as well. The late lamented Lotus Elise would also fit- used ones are in the 30's but creeping up. And because they used a modified Toyota 2ZZ engine.
I've wanted a Miata since the first came out. Finally got an ND a few years ago and loved it. Unfortunately it got totaled and I replaced it with a Fiata. As to looks? In two years with the MX5, no one said anything to me (they're kinda common). 18 months with the 124, and I can't tell you how man strangers have come up to me & commented on it's looks. Of course once they find out it's a Fiat Spider, I have to hear about their brother/uncle/relative who had a '60s version, when Fix It Again Tony was really a thing.
good review but I imo the RF is the most attractive car. not the least. Ive owned both as well
Good video. I found the information useful. I noticed you were using the Pbox from your last video. The Miata would be my third choice based on look or style.
@footballcoreano You're a right wing Korean, of course you're racist towards anything japanese lol
Love my 124 takin it out today
Would you buy a 2013 NC Miata Club PRHT or a 2017 Fiat 124 Classica? They are the same money.
Nice comparison. I like both the miata and the s2000. Your driving looked pretty good but please dont let your arms cross while turning. The video was very educational and fun to watch.
This is one of the best, most well-thought-out videos of its kind. Great job, you inspire me!
The Honda S2000 ROCK'S and looks the sexiest and I believe one sold at auction last week for a record 128k. Of course it was a 2002 with 900 miles.
This looks like “The Grand Tour” test track.
Just wanted to say very high quality video production quality. I appreciate your work, snaked the like button and would buy some merch if I come across anything that I may need.
I have 7 cars, the s2k ap2 being one of them.
Would you be reviewing any vintage Porsches in the future? 911 or 944 turbo S?
Love this comparison!
Great review.
Was planning on getting an ND2 but had no idea the 124 was putting those kinds of numbers down with a tune! Definitely going to check those out, though it looks like telescoping steering wheel has to be added after the fact.
The track kinda looks like an old top gear track.. I miss the 3 dude..
And across the line!
Both chassis have such sky-high handling ceilings, that a poorly setup s2k will feel like garbage compared to a pro-level setup ND and vice versa. Most people don’t study setup-theory enough to really unlock the blissful limit handling characteristics that both chassis are capable of.
My advice to the vast majority of people is seek out setup advice or pay for someone to setup the car for you. Most aspects of comparison from one car to the other can be changed, so really just go for the one you like more :)
Thumbs up every time 👍
One of my favorite episodes so far. I love all three of these, but feel like the need to add aftermarket rollover protection (for most events) limit the appeal of these for track usage. Other than something like a BRZ/86, is there a better option for an affordable fun/occasional track car?
A stock 6th gen camaro is the most underrated track star
E46 330, although a 325 like mine will match the slowness of a BRZ. But really, these cars run forever (186k on my autox car, 220 on my daily), handle very well, look good, sound good, easy to work on, can be sedan, coupe, convertible, market value rising, huge aftermarket.
Yes the BRZ is better imo. Much better steering feel, stiffer chassis, and lower center of gravity then the miata or S2000. Phenomenal platform.
I've been in the market for the Fiat 124 spider and was wondering what type of fuel you put in it. I know the owner manual states that the car should receive premium, but can it take regular. Furthermore, I think the car has a knock sensor which changes the timing of the ignition caused by the difference in the fuel quality. Still, I would like to eliminate knocking altogether to preserve the engine.
@CHAD I always put 93 octane in it. If I am racing I might mix a little bit of extra octane to be safe but I wouldn't go under 91 octane.
What's the problem with putting dress tires on all cars?