The New Patriot: AC75 Launch
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 7 พ.ค. 2024
- Another challenger, another corner of the AC75 rule examined. But at what costs have Patriots obvious advantages come?
Recon video and photos credit to Recon Photographer / @America's Cup
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Only criticism of Mozzy.
We need more Mozzy.
Thank you from Aotearoa
The AC has become more of a competition as a result of Team NZ new rules. Firstly a design theory contest and now we will see a great boat race contest….brilliant
Very similar ideas for most part but, varied strategies. AM was a rocket last time but too finely tuned. Maybe the even the balance this time.
Tom, it’s a highlight of all AC coverage that’s out there, to view and digest your take on the designs. Awesome work.
Wow, thanks!
Hi Mossy..well with you observation that American magic design has gone ALL MINIMALIST.. It looks like they are still smarting over that they lost the Americans cup Australia 2...BEN LEXION the BRAINS behind ...the MINIMALIST MOVEMENT...if it dont break its to heavy. .Thomas V-M
Nobody panic. Nobody panic. He’s back
Tech geek's paradise, best AC ever!
Your channel is the one I follow the closest for the most detailed analysis of what's going on. Thanks very much for the work you put in.
I appreciate that, thanks
Looking forward to your mates Rob and Tom joining you to add their insights. Always a good show.
Cheers
Kudos to ETNS & Ineos for framing the rule to allow designers freedom to come up with such different designs, but still making them look like boats rather than airplanes. Thanks for the insights @MozzySails
Great analysis as always - I know you have a day job but keep it coming! In every comments section of the official footage that's posted people are saying 'we need Mozzy to give us analysis'. Would love to hear some more thoughts on Ineos now it's actually been out on the water...
Thanks for that! More coming on INEOS
Brilliant analysis thanks
Thanks, you continuously present the sharpest analysis!
My pleasure!
Been waiting on these detailed videos of the new boats.
Another great video Tom!
Thank you Mozzy. Can’t wait!
Great insight as always
Very impressed overall with your analysis and delivery of complex engineering and sailing insights. Go AmericanMagic!
Man this is going to be a cool cup!
Cheers Mozzy! You should consider a Patreon for those of us who can't get enough analysis as the cup heats up!
Thnk you for being so generous. I will take a look in to the patreon thing
www.patreon.com/MozzySails
Another great analysis, Tom. Loving the AC75 arms race.
Less power is never better than more power.
This is the "Jeremy Clarkson" rule, and it is universally true.
Power is defined as Torque times Revolutions Per Minute.
In other words, it is the rate at which work can be done.
And it is clear, that NZ can perform more work, and hence provide the helmsman with more options, more of the time.
Thanks, America! You made a boat with a bucking helm last time, that prevented one of our best Kiwi helmsman from actually turning the wheel when and how he wanted! So it's great to see your team limiting your options once again. :)
My sense is that LR and ETNZ are the two most similar concepts. Is that fair? If so, seems interesting that the two AC36 teams are going the same way while the also-rans head towards other less proven corners of the design course. Thanks again for your work Mozzy.
Great information and always a wonderful video. Thank you for sharing.
It's cool that on every AC video Mozzy is mentioned
😂
Great analysis. Thanks! The end of August is going to be fun to watch
Thanks for another great analysis - much appreciated!
Excellent and informative analysis.
Great analysis and extremely interesting, looking forward to hear more. Rgds
Thanks for what you do, Tom!
Thank you for your precious info… top
Thanks Mozzy
Always waiting for your videos of thinking about strategic teams built.... great analysis videos thanks mutch...
Sadly have waiting till next great mozzy video.... 🙏😀.
Excellent analysis, as usual. Thanks for uploading.
Thanks for the great analysis , learn something every video.
Greetings fro Oregon USA. Sailing on the Columbia River
Thanks for watching!
Thank you so much for the update 👍
You bet
This cup is going to be so epic! Cheers Mozzy. I was just about to say how sleek she looks and then you said it. lol.
This is very cool. Your thoughts make sense to me. Small improvements are important but don't amount to anything if the crew can't consistently control it - will be interesting. Love these development wars as it does move technology forward and at the same time strategy and team work are still critical.
Wonderful commentary Mozzy! Thanks for all the effort you put in.
My pleasure!
Brilliant clear comparison information as always
Magic thank you Mozzy!!
One thing about Team NZ they always have something up their sleeves. You haven't seen their foils yet or their final sail design. I am picking they have plenty instore for everyone. They will definitely be very fast their design team is amazing
ETNZ are always 2 steps ahead of the game.
Think NZ are in trouble this defence their design concept has been surpassed
thanks Mozzy amazing video as usual
Glad you enjoyed it
That sure is a nice looking hull. Cannot wait for racing to start!
Last time they had the best looking hull too.
I only wish they had made the deck teak colour. That would have been a kickass "Aquamarine Riva" look!
Love the design concept direction of American Magic. Minimalism is a very worthy focus, Luna Rossa also looks sleek as hell. It looks good and looks fast! But the proof will be in the pudding!
Looks very aerodynamic. Looking forward to the races.
Very very nice looking boat!
Stopped looking at anything else: superb and engaging analysis🎉🎉🎉 Thank you 😊
How highly passionate you are, that's inspiring indeed 👍👍👍
As a lowracer recumbent cyclist I've seen believable amateur experiments confirming 10% loss in peak power. I haven't seen the same done at FTP and since the boats can store power and races are 20 mins the cyclors will be spending the majority of their efforts around FTP. I'd be very interested in American Magic's data on the topic because there isn't that much in the way of recumbent studies at all. We're a niche branch of cycling for amateurs but doing 30mph under your own power at a couple inches off the ground is awesome.
The interesting thing about recumbent bikes is they are faster, on the flat or descent, due to their reduced frontal area irrespective of a 10% loss of output.
thanks, please more videos
👍 similar thoughts to mine.. great to hear your thoughts again.
Don't you think that the position of the crew can damage the air flow over the deck? The holes would create turbolences while other boats have a real smooth channel
Thanks for your valuable input. Also feel the excitement building. I love how invested each team is in there boats. There seems to be a genuine belief across the board that they are in with a chance. BUT and it’s a capital BUT, it’s the foils that will win this race. And there’s a bit of nail biting still to come. Asked how fast Taihoro has been sailing out here on the gulf, Dalton answered it’s irrelevant till they line up against there opponent. You just have to be a bit faster than them.
Foils for sure will be important but I think in a straight line the boats will be almost identical. I reckon it will be the moding and speed in the manoeuvres will be the difference and that comes down to the full package.
@@jasonpickens9839 you’re right, it is balancing the total package, however foils that slow you a knot or two will make manoeuvres rare
That's a great looking boat, hard to believe it's that time again already
Super exciting to see the different approaches taken. Well, visually right now but...What's under the skin? Its going to be an epic AC. Thanks Mozzy!
Superb!!!
Well,presented , just subscribed
Welcome aboard!
I am a Brit fan but i fancy this boat as the one design that looks fast.
Thanks.
Really excited to see how they all go
This challenger series is really heating up! super looking forward to this kicking off.
Tom, many thanks and a comment: I noticed while rewatching SailGP races yesterday that on same tack, head to head identical boats, speed correlates very noticeably to height from water. Any time you see some F50 outpacing the others, if you take a peek at the height from water numbers, you almost invariably see them riding a bit higher. I think drag from foils is definitely a big factor in top speed, and although it seems like it makes sense having a skeg that "blocks" wind underneath, if it comes at the cost of extra drag from foils, its, imho, probably not going to pay off. Well have to wait and see. Thanks for the excellent coverage so far!
I would love to see you and the crew have a chat with Elise BEAVIS for a few mins Mozzy
as ever the clearest 'enlightenment' raised around...
Team NZ head of design has said all the teams hulls will be within a few seconds of each other. The speed difference will be in sail design foil design and operating systems
He is being disengenuous the hull design is the crucial key to the outcome
Bring it on!
AM must have determined the boundary layer of the flow on and around the main is still inside of their trimmer/cyclor positions. Love their unique approach (even if I do think these boats are about as far from sailing as one can get with a mast and sails).
The furthest from conventional sailing are the speed record boats. Unlike the AC yachts, they barely resemble sailboats.
This is the absolute extreme of sailing (in the water) as has been imagined so far... But so was the catamaran foil at the time.
I do take your point in relatability, however, ultra high performance motorsport, such as F1, Indycar, NASCAR, WRC, WEC etc etc, are no different to ultra high performance sailing and seamanship.
Good point.
@@timbetts7377 Agreed except that there is an expectation of sailboats going upwind AND downwind and humans being required to maneuver the boats...at least that was the traditional paradigm. All of that is out the door (or overboard I should say) with these boats. Nothing of that kind happened with F1, Indy or any other car series...humans have, largely, had the same role(s) and the cars, largely, do the same things....with these "boats" they do less and humans are involved less. I think they are cool boats (you should see one of these in person if you want to be really impressed - I saw Defiant in Narragansett Bay, RI in 2021)...it just stinks watching them go upwind pretty much constantly. That said, Go Patriot!
The sail configuration powers the boat the hull keeps the water out
More mozzy 🍻🍺🚀
I was slagging American Magic for being plain and boring until I saw it from the rear. This is all very exciting design stuff from all the teams.
Great technical analysis. As a Kiwi I've got no finger nails left and the racing hasn't even started
I'm hoping it will be a close AC finial and our 2 Olympic Gold medalist at the helm will be the difference, but it always comes down to speed and moding and he who makes the least amount of mistakes. GO ETNZ !!
Given how fast they are upwind in SailGP they have something figured out something tactically for sure. The starts are ghastly though. Burling really needs to work on that for AC37. Although match racing is a very different game.
@@jasonpickens9839 Burling's starts seemed better in the past to me. I distinctly recall his start tactics in the rear at the
Yeah but he over did it and the other teams caught on and shut them out. For whatever their time on distance has been really bad. Either too early or too late. Some of that comes down to other teams sailing well to their credit.
The AC becomes more transparent thanks to Mozzy's sharp analysis's. Thx. I am following closely from Hamburg, Germany. Sadly, no German entry.....anyway, I will be online till the very end. bDiificult to come up with a bet so soon, but the brits look very competitive to me as do the Americans. One thing for sure: this will not be another easy homerun for the kiwis! Great stuff.
The physiological requirements for the crew (power generation) must be very interesting. There’s only so many watts any particular human can produce for a certain period. So it gets down to training, crew selection, and execution (performing in competition) but the coaching and selection would be interesting to hear about. For example, is it watts per kilo that matters most (as it does with climbing) or just big watts (as in flats since no aerodynamic element here)? If the former, you pick very light “climber” types. If the latter, big athletes with big wattage numbers. Does it require 1 hour power or repeated VO2 max efforts? All would require different athletes and training. I’m not a sailor so apologize if you’ve already covered this, but I love the America’s Cup every time it rolls around. 😊
Looks sleek and fast.......I just hope that we have very competitive racing, sure makes it more enjoyable to watch.
Great analysis Tom, thanks for your updates. Huge fan of disruptive designs, not a fan of Magic design particularly around the cyclors position and aero thinking, and hope to be proven wrong. Power won’t hurt them too much upwind perhaps? Maybe in the manoeuvres.
Looking forward to the drag races off the start, upwind speed and angle may be different based on these designs.
It is better having wheigt of crew and tech more inside near sail?
Looking good this deck also.... nice different boats now we see.
Nice different design solutions teams try.
Team NZ,luna rossa and American magic boat till now i finding nicely.
Great coverage. I check to see if you dropped a new video several times a day... Lol. Keep them coming.
Could you address the appendages between the cant arms and the foils? I see a lot of different solutions. American Magic has two different ones with the same foils. Luna Rossa has one with a spear. There seems to be a big difference in how the water sprays upward behind the arm. Does it makes a big difference?
Is there any rule against covering the openings? American Magic appeared to have some type of tarp over the cyclors.
Look forward these videos, you are doing a fantastic job….maybe one of the teams should have hired you 😂
Maybe one day!
i cant wait tks
Was gonna say they must be recumbent
Recumbent bikes are quicker over a distance because of lower aero drag. Drag is going to be a big factor.
Geez. Hope Patriot doesn't take a wave over the bow! Thinking ETNZ might have met their match. No home water advantage and multiple designs to content with. Also seems like the Kiwi's have the most conventual of the designs.
Maybe less radical, but NZ also appears to be the fastest and most skilled on the water currently. The team sailed in 30kt conditions not too long ago. LR also looks solid but as of this writing, my bets are still on NZ.
Designs become convention for a reason. ETNZ will be the furthest from final configuration out of all the teams. ETNZ also get a slight advantage of only having to target the October conditions. Comparing speeds at this stage is meaningless. They aren't even in the same waters.
You can be sure no team has come up with anything new . Hundreds of designers have looked at every conceivable configuration. It’s all going to be up the who does it right on the day
Gonna disagree. You have six different boats and one or two will end up being the way to go. That said, on race day it will also come down to skill and luck.
@@garylewis7729. And it’s a combination of all the design nuisances and how it’s put together. The experience of TNZ will be a big advantage. I don’t see a nightmare scenario whatsoever for TNZ. The chances are high that TNZ will know how they stand compared to the challenges.
Is there/would there be any issues around the bounce’ that the foils have at the end of their lift? Reminds of a Bumper Stop’ on shock absorbers. There seems to be a lot of wobble (crude terminology) as they come to rest. Would not this energy transfer be dissipated throughout the hull after each tack & gybe? It’s interesting to watch each boat as they go through a manoeuvre and see the foil arm finish. Would this have cause the hull and opposing foil to shudder slowing down the speed coming out of the turn?
Here we gooooo
A couple of thoughts on this. With the least internal volume do they have more challenges fitting / accessing all the internal control components. I'd love to see whats under the skin of these machines, I bet they're all incredible. 2nd, smaller vol hull in high wave state might be more swampable? (Better keep it flying). And 3rd, do they give away any structural stiffness/strength? But I do agree it looks very sleek. Excited for some race track faceoffs!
Complimenti! I tuoi servizi sono sempre i migliori rispetto agli altri perché spieghi ogni cosa in modo semplice e intuitivo. Bravo
Della barca americana che dire? Concettualmente molto diversa dalle barche concorrenti e vedremo con quali risultati.
Spero tu faccia un servizio intero anche su Luna Rossa dato che ha introdotto da qualche giorno novità, presentando un nuovo foil e arm, e l'albero; mentre restano quelli della scorsa edizione, l'altro foil e il timone. Cosa ne pensi?
Do you think they have enough volume in the bow to avoid nose dive? Visions of them stuffing the bow down wind.
I liked the days when sailboat racing was about strategy and they had to fly a spinnaker downwind this new racing is quick and done 15 minute races.
It's an interesting point that having more diversity in the challenges makes it harder for the defender but the opposite could also be true. If the defender is confident that they are close to the global optimum then opening up the rules just causes the challengers to try more variations and get themselves stuck into a local optimum. One hull might be better but unless they have the foils and everything else to go with it then it will be suboptimal. Given everything that ETNZ have been doing with the land speed record and the AC40 I'm picking that they still have the advantage and that all these variations plays to their strength.
Mozzy, this data is interesting ( at 5:10 "Patriot's watertight bulkhead enclosing= 35 m3") : and regarding this aspect, what about Luna Rossa and the other boats you have analysed ?
Thx 🙂
I do believe Mozzy is quoting the rule, and did not calculate the enclosed volume in American Magic.
@@WhatAboutTheBee All right 👍
Then a first visual estimate could be drawn aligning boat profiles (plus front & rear views) , like Mozzy did in that part of his video 👍
@@sezione-m-paul Hello Paul 👋. It would be interesting to see how AC competitors measure the volume and enforce the rules for others.
That said, I computed the volume of the hull I designed by parts. I took the area within a cross sectional plane, like a cat scan of the vessel. Multiplied that area by 1 mm elevation to get a volume. Moved the cross section by 1 mm. Repeat and add. Fundamentally an integration approximation. For it to be precise, the 1 mm elevation needs to approach 0.0 mm, but I didn't need 6 places of decimal accuracy.
Good to see you back. I thought you might have been abducted by aliens.
When you think about it its pretty impressive really for a little country like
NZ that doesn't have anywhere near the resources or $$$$$ of the challengers it has more cows than people and are world leaders in boat building and design.
Tom - Question for you regarding the Rule: Do all the crew position HAVE to be aft of that bulkhead (yellow line) ??
Yes, which is defined as being 9m infront of the transom.
The bulkhead needs to be infront of 9m and enclose 35m3. So it could be further forward still.
@@MozzySails
Interesting, thanks.
It strikes me that there could have been some merit in terms of visibility etc, by having your helm just forward of the mast (but behind the Jib car track)
Any video coming up soon regarding Ineos?
Sure is. Loads more to their boat than I had appreciated in my initial impression. But we do still have a few more months to colour in the detail
@@MozzySails Great to hear that. Keep up the good work 👍
how much of the old patriot is in the new one? After all, patriot 1 was probably the fastest challenger and maybe even faster then te rehutai before the crash
Looks like Patriot has put the volume sideways, rather than vertical.
My 1st impression was it looked like a Platapus
Спасибо за вашу речь гораздо лучше восприятие ....
Sail (mechanical) engineer explains portfolio theory the challengers have embraced and the defenders must combat.
He must be a technical and math genius. Would like to know his education level and emphasis.
I’d say that the 10% power loss has been measured and quantified in laboratory conditions. A recumbent position will be more stable while sailing. An upright position is less stable for the cyclist while sailing. There’s going to be a power loss for them if they are using energy to help stabilize themselves through the handlebars. Especially during tacks and jibes. I’m betting that given this. The recumbents will be equal in power when done. Maybe even more.
It's usually more than 10%. The figures I hear are close to double that. There's a big difference physiologically between the two positions and a lot more is going on internally than simply moving the crank forward of the rider would suggest.
Does the recumbent position obtain less power due to less power input from the legs and might that give more endurance ?
@@paulmcneil9971 It's a combination of different factors. One of them is oxygen delivery and another is perfusion. Recumbent cyclists experience a considerably lower average heart rate, which could be advantageous for some people. This is a very long and complex subject. I wish I could give a more complete answer.
I find it sad that we will no longer see the crew crossing and be able to view them at work , I hope that the larger opening needed do not pose a danger if they capsize again .
Well, to be fair internal crews are becoming more common in other high-level racing series. In offshore racing, the newest IMOCA 60 yachts offer more protection from the elements with some being entirely enclosed for this reason and aerodynamics. The Ultim trimarans have been nearly enclosed for several years. It's a natural progression as speeds increase and drag reduction as well as greater protection is mandated. As I've stated in the past, _nothing ever significant is gained without losing something significant to attain it._
@@jamesaron1967 yes it’s true , gone are the days when a spinnaker set could win or loose a race . And they are a sight to behold , I hope they keep some of it in the FC 50 series .