A recent interview with ETNZ indicated they did over 50kts on one of their training days after Te Rehutai was back on the water. This yacht is such a marvel of modern sailing technology. I can never get enough of watching her fly.
@@faamanatumaka1950 Didn't sound like he is jealous. He is obviously a fan of the NZ team as am I. I really wish that Australia would of had a entry but that doesn't look like it's going to happen anytime soon so I support the Kiwis. I loved watching them come from behind to beat the Italians. Kiwis are born sailors just like us Australians. Can't wait for the cup to start. It's going to be another NZ domination. Sailing has come a long way since I raced 125,s in the 1980,s. I would give my left testicle to have a go on the helm of one of these AC75,s.🇳🇿👍
Really nice touch in the edit with all the random Blurs! I had great fun catching them all. Actually had to watch the video twice because I zoned out spotting the blurrs.
This was a great touch! At first I was thinking whats so special about hte model thats being blured, then I realised it was the picture and then the lines etc haha. Well done. Love your work mate! Thanks for keep us noobs informed.
Thanks so much for these! I really wish you were around back in the day! (I grew up in RI and watched the cup in '77, '80, and was there when Australia won in '83.)
Bring on the gas-feed super-cavitating Turbo Button! If enough excess power can be harvested by the cyclors, then an additional high-pressure reservoir of air can be built up over time. That gas can then be vented through tiny holes at the leading edge, placed so that the foil is completely surrounded by a super-cavitation bubble of air, which would temporarily drop drag by an order of magnitude, effectively giving the boat a Turbo boost effect when used.
@@isaack2274 Possibly when they exceed a threshold speed it's better to supercavitate and lose lift by a constant and predictable amount (which they could compensate with flap angle), than cavitate unpredictably, intermittently losing most of their lift every time it happened. Over about 50 knots, cavitation is unavoidable. I'm not sure whether Chris's specific proposal would be practicable but I'm sure the teams are considering all options.
Actuators are the movement engine, but what happens after that is open. Levers, cables, lines, sheaves, balloons, slave cylinders, ramps, flexible forms etc. Off course the ultimate I'd to build a self regulating foil that flexs appropriately in response to changes in realtime. This opens the possiblity that the energy comes from one part of the foil and hydraulically transferred to another. Only small movements are required to effect big changes in trim. So it could be simple of complex, but so far is a very elegant solution that seems to work well.
Great update Tom. I don't understand why raising the jib tack up is optimal on this size of boat. Surely you would want uninterrupted flow along the foot on a sleek deck, not allowing the pressure to equalise I.e. using the deck as a seal. It's a big chunk of sail with low moment to lose. Also, on "hydraulic" actuation (I may well be way off) NZ may be remoting the motor to the arm, so to power the hydraulic system independently. It avoids some plumbing issues.
Tom did cover this. He pointed out that raising the sail (to tighten the leach) is often only a short term measure. It's also possible the kiwis may add extra roach to the foot of the sail which folds over when the sail is hauled fully down. The aero and weight implications of a 3D car path (as being trialed by Ineos) are not insignificant.
Good work, mate. Well based speculation, dots are connected coherently. As a non-sailor I am riveted to the upcoming competition. Can't wait. I hope Emirates Team NZ manage to pull it off again, either way I am sure the racing will be dramatic and enthralling.
Pronounciation for English accents: Tear Reh-hu-tie, with Rehutai run together quickly. For bonus points, you can roll the R sound like in a Glaswegian accent.
Another great story Mozzy; your analysis of what the teams are doing design wise is fascinating and fills in a lot of gaps with info (propaganda) we get from the teams. I was out on Auckland harbour last week and saw Te Rehutai in action; she certainly looks quicker than she was in the last cup, but didn’t see quite as “nimble” in the tacks/gybes. I believe that at some stage they will take her out into the outer harbour to get into the swells; that will be a good test to watch. I’m a bit nervous as to how she’ll cope with the conditions in the Med.
Interesting vid as always. Love the elegance of the simple etnz foil design and looks like Ineos are trying to decouple the various forces generated by the foil, assuming based on the predicted sea state and better maneuverability. If possible could you do a vid on the rudders and to see if these are evolving? As a guess I'd say etnz are are thinking foil lift/drag is king and using the rudder/other methods to control ride height, heal etc. Looks like ineos think best boat control / maneuverability is key. Interesting to see who is right but ac history does suggest the fastest boat in a straight line wins but maybe its a boat for Ben to win starts and errrrr be Ben Ainslie....
ETNZ, I think, have grasped - maybe more than any other team with the possible exception of LR - that the foils are the most important thing when it comes to performance. It's reflected in the cleanliness and simplicity of their designs - and the outstanding implementation of those designs into a physical structure
not completely. there are set sizes for the openings for each crew position (with slightly larger openings for cyclors). What you see on this boat seems to be what the rule says (except they have 10 crew pods, rather than minimum of 8).
The first word of Te Rehutai does emphatically NOT rhyme with tea, for two reasons One: in Maori (as in Spanish and Japanese) the "e" sound is the e in "egg". This is true for all words, and so it applies to the "e" in Rehutai as well Two: unless there is a horizontal bar (macron) above it, a vowel in Maori is clipped short, not held long like the vowel in "tea". Sometimes the way you said it sounded spot on, and good on you for taking an interest in getting it right!
Have a look at electro hydrostatic actuators, an electric motor directly driving a hydraulic motor. Allows electric power transmission but hydraulic actuation. The foil actuator could be one of those? Can require some quite hefty currents. Usually the electric motor reverses direction to reverse the hydraulic flow, but that can happen quickly. How often are the foil flaps adjusted?
Tena koe, the following may help with pronunciation - Vowel sound phonetics A (car) E (red) I (ski) O (or) U (you) Roll the “R” Te Re-hu ta-i Many, like myself, appreciate your willingness to at least try. We don’t expect you to get it right however, we’re here to offer assistance. Very informative breakdown of the rules and possibility of maximising opportunities to push the boundaries within the wording of the rule. Your homework, if you choose to accept it, find the English translation of Te Rehutai or Te Rehu Tai? Kia kaha me noho ora mai no Aotearoa (All the best from NZ).
I almost don't understand a word, been sailing as a teenager a bit, windsurfing afterwards for several years, that's about my water experience 😉 - and English is not even my first language, so your accent doesn't make it easier 🤣. But I still enjoy your explanations, trying to follow the main line, and especially all the "politics" surrounding the AC. And beeing Swiss we had a lot of that 20 years ago and makes me of course more excited about this AC! BTW: seeing you sail yourself was much fun too! Thanks for your efforts!
interesting !! Now that you've "outed this, it makes me think that the flap actuators could be horizontal arms with articulated attachment joints on to electrically powered screwjacks.
I heard on the TV coverage that only sail trim had to be hydrolic/spinners and that the ship controls can be electric. If that's true, using some sort electronic, maybe electromechanical, actuation would be within the rules. Could be automated to optimally adjust foil angle bases on speed relative to the water, measured pressure on the foil, etc., reducing brain bandwith required.
It's all hydraulic actuators, but the power to fill those actuators comes from cyclors for sails and batteries for sails. The control system which tells those actuators valves when to open is electronic but the power is signal rather than doing meaningful work.
Comparing this to Ineos W, with its lumpy actuators hard not to wonder/worry: is the Ineos W foil actually a clever way of testing multiple foil 'strategies' in one? (As with their failed towing mast tactic, developed a clever approach to beating the rules for development restrictions.)
Maybe ineos is using 4 flaps actuators on te W foil for testing and eventually only use 2 when they figure out which is best ie inner or outer flap control
It’s a slow build up to the racing next year, but thankfully you make it interesting. It’s very interesting that the designs are so different from each other. Do you know which foil is expected to work better in which sea/wind state?
Choosing to blur some areas of interest in photos but hiding nothing when launching or relaunching could be great strategy also haha. I’m not saying they are not hiding something. Only that it can become mind games between teams…
I think ETNZ, having the upper hand, made the best choice for development. Using the old AC75 which is still already the boat to beat, and then the double AC40 for a/b testing, put everyone else in the corner. LR, knowing that its AC40 would come too late, had no choice but to develop the LQ12. But they did it in the best way: by making a scaled-down version of Te Rehutai, as LR AC36 was not adaptable to the new design vision. The new ETNZ AC75 will probably be an evolution of the earlier design. And in that sense, having already installed on-board cyclors, they are a piece ahead of everyone else.
Bear in mind that if Robs theory about ETNZ's 'banana' foil is correct they might not have to house an actuator at all, or at least one that is to small to actually move the flap and doesn't impact the size. Great video as always Mozzy, keep up the good work 👍
Amazing intuition and investigation as always Mozzy! Question: You say it is all hydraulics this AC. Are any electrical systems allowed? If the Kiwis have cyclors controlling flying height like they did in 2017, will they need to manipulate hydraulic rather than electrical control buttons?
Newby question: “Where does the electricity ‘come from’?” So, this question is about generation, ‘quantity’ and storage. I’m assuming a big battery isn’t allowed. Do the grinders have to generate all the power with that being stored in various ways (electricity in a battery, electricity in an electrical capacitor, hydraulic pressure/capacitor, pressurised air capacitor)? Thank you 🎉
All the power for foil adjustment comes from batteries, then converted to hydraulic pressure. All the power for sail adjustments comes from pedal power and then converted to hydraulic pressure.
Crazy/stupid question; could ETNZ be using skinned’ foils? Foils that have some sort of skin or whatever, pseudo malleable coating over the entire foil covering the hinge mechanism/flap? There is only one slit in the centre separating the two flaps either side and every other surface seems to be covered.
So... Glen ashny and his (And TNZ's) new land sailing speed record!! Is this simply TNZ exploring new ways to experiment wings and loadings without needing a boat or limited to just one mast for testing? How much do you think they can take from this and contribute to the Americas Cup Campaign?? It is even impressive?? Is the record sought after??
The tabs on the main foils are for controlling lift (gross changes to overall angle of attack via camber) rather than trim of the entire boat (which does affect angle of attack of the main foils, but only at the fine tuning level). Otherwise the main foils would always need enough camber (ie lots) for low speed takeoffs in light airs, and the drag penalty at high speeds would be massive.
Yes, I don't think it will cause them any issues, but it's interesting to reveal where they found an advantage in the last cup, and that they're still protecting that technology, possibly with an eye on future cups
Sailing may seem like a world of jargon, but when you get down to brass tacks, it’s really just smooth sailing. Sure, some terms might sound like you're three sheets to the wind, but once you get your sea legs, it’s clear sailing ahead. It's all about knowing the ropes and keeping an even keel. Whether you're on the right tack or the wrong one, you’ll soon find yourself navigating like an old salt. There's no need to be left high and dry, as every sailor eventually learns to trim their sails to the wind. You don’t have to be a captain to stay on course; just go with the flow and keep a weather eye on the horizon. Sailing isn't about getting caught between the devil and the deep blue sea-it's about enjoying the journey and knowing when to batten down the hatches. Before you know it, you’ll be able to take the helm without feeling like a fish out of water. So, throw caution to the wind, get your feet wet, and remember: every sailor worth their salt knows that the real fun is in the adventure, not the vocabulary.
So why would you assume any actuator hydraulic or electric would need to be placed on the control surface itself meaning down in the water creating drag and turbulence? It says controlled by not placed onto.
@@MozzySails I'm referring to @04:24 where you say each flap is a control surface and you had to put the actuators either in the bulb or down in the wing close to the foil and I just said why would anyone assume putting the actuator itself down there.
@@ipanzerschrecku4732 yes, in the old rules you had to have two flaps, one either side of the symmetry line. I guess you could have put actuators higher up than either the wing or the bulb, but then you would have needed far more complicated linkages that a simple linkage direct to both flaps simultaneously. The more linkages the more play in the system.
Vowel sounds in Maori. A - ah E - air, but with no hint of the r. I - ee O - or, again without any r U - oo When vowels come together they are always treated as diphthongs. So, try sounding them, one after the other, then doing it faster and faster until they merge. Example: ai. Say ah-ee faster and faster. When you hear a new sound emerge that sounds almost (but not exactly) like the Aye in “aye-aye Captain” you’ll be pretty close. Same with all the other vowel combinations. Good luck, Mozzie, we’ll make an honorary Kiwi of you yet!
I don't think hanging in to the Cup with a death grip by defensive means is where today's TNZ culture is focused. It's more fruitful, and satisfying to try to keep ahead of the pack on creativity than it is to try and slow down the pack's adoption of your recent improvements. If you keep innovating, they are forever chasing a moving target. An early clue to this radical change in culture was bringing the spies in from the cold (so to speak) by not only legalising espionage between teams, but by formalising it as recon, with one agency doing it and providing the Intel to all teams openly (and to the public). Genius! (and eliminates a whole heap of wasted effort, unhelpful distraction, needless antagonism and bad faith)
I don’t believe replacing hydraulic actuators instead of electric is a big deal . ( If indeed electric was fitted to start with ) . They have more than enough mussel power onboard to compensate. Great spot by you 👍. Noticed an access plate above the water line on the arm , a clue ?. Great video, thanks for sharing.
I think Mozzie's point was that the way the previous iteration of the rule was drafted, it seems maybe they could use a single actuator (if electric) rather than two. Not about saving muscle power (the forces to actuate the flaps being minimal), but about reducing drag.
Why are they all of a sudden able to test with the old boat? I thought the old boats had to stay pretty much as they were? Or was there a date that changed?
the old boats have to stay as they are below the waterline. But the crew area, sail controls and internal systems can be played with. Hence the changes with a self tacking jib etc.
@@Gottenhimfella when they launch they're new AC75 (next year) that will have new foils. Until then they can only use new foils on their LEQ12 or thier old foils on this 'legacy' AC75
Yes etnz are doing the extraordinary. Just what it looks like is .....interesting definitely be legit tho.the way of thinking keeps moving forward as you're seen. Am thinking they have come in with few options we haven't seen yet .wont use them if dont nd to .good explanation for if they start to get intimidated we'll see .
On the actuators - if it's above the waterline does it matter whether it's hydraulic or electrical? Your animation shows linkages to a lever in/behind the bulb which then controls the flaps. And another question - does the amount of flap actuation (degrees up and down) important to the issue? Fewer degrees, easier to manage the linkages. If Team NZ can live with lower ranges then they can keep everything smaller?
I think either can be waterproofed. Whether it is electronic or hydraulic only really matters in terms of what is allowed in the rules. This cup they are not allowed electric, it has to be hydraulic. My theory is last cup they used electric as a means to install less actuators, and therefore reduce mechanics within the foil.
From 6.42 "The new rule clearly says."... " definition of that it's a Hydraulic actuator"... Yes, but 11.32 actually says "A hydraulic actuator... In combination with zero or more TRANSMISSION ACTUATORS used to adjust a control surface." What is a transmission actuator? It seems to me in ETNZ's foil arm flange you could have a Hydraulic actuator that then feeds into an electronic transmission actuator, and then feed the signal electronically down to the flap?
I'm a kiwi and I have no association with our America's cup team but I've wind surfed, kite surfed and now I've wingsurfed for the last couple of years. I don't see what's complicated about this, in my own foil construction of my own designs, there's a point in high performance at which making a wing thinner only results in unacceptable flex. (I am talking about carbon fibre here and I'M HEAVY so I flex things.) So you don't build ultra thin because it's counter productive. And the core of any wing is dead space, compression, tension and twisting loads are at their extremes by the skin and at a minimum in the inner core. So the answer is that if you are clever with what you fit in the core, you are only limited by your imagination and material properties.
Some of your 'Te's we're beaut! ...keep it up Mozzy :) oh btw, nice insights into the evolution and design concepts, and IMO the elegance of simplicity. I'm sure Ineos will ditch those foil warts once they decide W is really worth pursuing .
If they decide to keep the W-foil, those actuator housings will definitely go. Whatever benefits the W-foil is supposed to grant having so much extra drag will negate it.
Just an update now the Cup is over and Team NZ have retained the trophy. Apparently there were a few things that completely escaped your attention about the Kiwi boat.
I know things all over Ineos W are for testing and stuff but bloody hell I just can't see that foil working even remotely near optimal with all that hardware stuck all over the outside of it.
Those boats sure have changed since the last time I watched it. That was back when the US lost the cup for the first time. It is like it is not even the same kind of race anymore. It would be like a classic NASCAR race, and then later the NASCAR cars look like F1 cars. Completely changes the race.
Finally a voice of sanity. No, it's not at all the same race, meaning it's not really the AC. It's a blind pursuit of technical speed, egged on by a vague nationalistic hubris that holds it there, with no observable, residual regard for the essence of the Race. Sad, because there are half a dozen superior sail classes who still race real boats on real courses engaging real dynamics and seamanship, and not this banging off the out-of-bounds in bicycled, flatwater, inland Moths run by a peculiarly narrow interpretation of both tech and class. It's killing the Cup. Judged by the want of replies to your observation - and anticipating the thumbs-down due mine, apparently this is fine.
I will always enjoy the Americas Cup “cat and mouse” games with the “I’ve got a secret” boat design games. This makes for a good size fan base and is true to the whole premise of the contest. Otherwise we would all be riding personal watercraft.
Te - it's not an 'eeee' it's more of a hard 'a' like an ā as in apple Re - roll your r - short e Who Tie Keep up the good work. Most of your videos are too technical for me but I'm learning slowly. Cheers 🙂
Great video, it's Te (kind of nasally think Michael MacIntyre northern Irish accent mouth open) Re (tongue to the roof of your mouth make a split second car sound by vibrating your tongue) hutai Who Tai as it sounds. Blair pronounces it correctly being from Northland, shot Blair.
Regarding pronuciation: phonetically it would be - Teh-dehootai. In our Te Reo Maori, the R is rolled so you can pronounce it like a softened and shortened D sound. Te = The Rehutai = Sea spray
@@miiblenkarn6650 a lot of Westerners can't roll the R and a soft D is indistinguishable! This is how we teach people to speak our language phonetically here in Aotearoa.
5:59 - am I the only one who thinks this foil looks incredibly ugly? And in aeronautic terms, ugly usually means bad. When things are designed correctly, they always look correct. This looks straight-up wrong.
Nothings simple in the AC , Might on the surface BUT there's many people working on it so its not That sir is what the AC is so interesting > Just when you think you got it ?
I don't understand ... Why can't a hydraulic actuator be in the foil arm doing the same job and maintaining the sleek foil format? Sleek has got to be a lot better
I think Mozzie's point was that the way the previous iteration of the rule was drafted, they could use a single actuator (if electric) rather than two.
If they must use two separate actuators, the same system could be used effectively cut in half with separate actuators in the arm. Would only need a dog leg at the top to provide enough separation to fit two actuators which could be smaller as they only need half the power.
Te RE who Tie, short e sound. There is no long or short in Maori just one phonic unless two vowels together. Meanwhile, etnz is obviously seeing how basic changes impact with adding foil changes as well. The real question is what's up their sleeve for foils over all? We know there will be innovations and they know not to let too much out of the bag.
A recent interview with ETNZ indicated they did over 50kts on one of their training days after Te Rehutai was back on the water. This yacht is such a marvel of modern sailing technology. I can never get enough of watching her fly.
I was hoping for 50 knots plus. Cheers for the info.
Being on a sailing boat going over 50kts would honestly scare me shytless.
I vote we just take AC to hard ice and skates.
Are you jealous of rehutai being flying so fast, leave etnz alone my
@@faamanatumaka1950 Didn't sound like he is jealous. He is obviously a fan of the NZ team as am I. I really wish that Australia would of had a entry but that doesn't look like it's going to happen anytime soon so I support the Kiwis. I loved watching them come from behind to beat the Italians. Kiwis are born sailors just like us Australians. Can't wait for the cup to start. It's going to be another NZ domination. Sailing has come a long way since I raced 125,s in the 1980,s. I would give my left testicle to have a go on the helm of one of these AC75,s.🇳🇿👍
Really nice touch in the edit with all the random Blurs! I had great fun catching them all. Actually had to watch the video twice because I zoned out spotting the blurrs.
😁
This was a great touch! At first I was thinking whats so special about hte model thats being blured, then I realised it was the picture and then the lines etc haha. Well done. Love your work mate! Thanks for keep us noobs informed.
I had exactly the same thing. Brilliant way of upping audience engagement 😉
Love your Super In-depth Discussions, Great work Fellas, From Expat Kiwi Sailor in Perth WA
Thanks so much for these! I really wish you were around back in the day! (I grew up in RI and watched the cup in '77, '80, and was there when Australia won in '83.)
Informative as always, love ur observations, well done, your my favorite uk person i think
Bring on the gas-feed super-cavitating Turbo Button!
If enough excess power can be harvested by the cyclors, then an additional high-pressure reservoir of air can be built up over time. That gas can then be vented through tiny holes at the leading edge, placed so that the foil is completely surrounded by a super-cavitation bubble of air, which would temporarily drop drag by an order of magnitude, effectively giving the boat a Turbo boost effect when used.
soundz a good idea
I could understand this for lifting the foils during turns when they lift the foils but air over the foils would mean they would lose lift.
@@isaack2274 Possibly when they exceed a threshold speed it's better to supercavitate and lose lift by a constant and predictable amount (which they could compensate with flap angle), than cavitate unpredictably, intermittently losing most of their lift every time it happened. Over about 50 knots, cavitation is unavoidable.
I'm not sure whether Chris's specific proposal would be practicable but I'm sure the teams are considering all options.
Or you could give them Indian takeaway before.
simply not going fast enough i dont think.
Actuators are the movement engine, but what happens after that is open. Levers, cables, lines, sheaves, balloons, slave cylinders, ramps, flexible forms etc. Off course the ultimate I'd to build a self regulating foil that flexs appropriately in response to changes in realtime. This opens the possiblity that the energy comes from one part of the foil and hydraulically transferred to another. Only small movements are required to effect big changes in trim.
So it could be simple of complex, but so far is a very elegant solution that seems to work well.
Wouldn't surprise me,they are pretty crafty.
Great video
Thaaaaank youuuuuu🎉 perfect upload!
Now I have to watch it. Thumbnail was spot on
Is there another TH-cam channel with less resources that offers greater value? I haven't seen one. 👏👏👏
Great update Tom.
I don't understand why raising the jib tack up is optimal on this size of boat. Surely you would want uninterrupted flow along the foot on a sleek deck, not allowing the pressure to equalise I.e. using the deck as a seal. It's a big chunk of sail with low moment to lose.
Also, on "hydraulic" actuation (I may well be way off) NZ may be remoting the motor to the arm, so to power the hydraulic system independently. It avoids some plumbing issues.
Tom did cover this. He pointed out that raising the sail (to tighten the leach) is often only a short term measure. It's also possible the kiwis may add extra roach to the foot of the sail which folds over when the sail is hauled fully down. The aero and weight implications of a 3D car path (as being trialed by Ineos) are not insignificant.
Good work, mate. Well based speculation, dots are connected coherently. As a non-sailor I am riveted to the upcoming competition. Can't wait. I hope Emirates Team NZ manage to pull it off again, either way I am sure the racing will be dramatic and enthralling.
Great stuff! Thank you Mozzy.
Glad you find it interesting!
Great insight as always.
Glad you enjoyed it!
Great video again! Love your insights and thoughts 👍🏻
thanks! Hopefully it adds something to the AC for people
@@MozzySailsit does very very much, a must watch😅
Thanks
Pronounciation for English accents: Tear Reh-hu-tie, with Rehutai run together quickly. For bonus points, you can roll the R sound like in a Glaswegian accent.
Another great story Mozzy; your analysis of what the teams are doing design wise is fascinating and fills in a lot of gaps with info (propaganda) we get from the teams.
I was out on Auckland harbour last week and saw Te Rehutai in action; she certainly looks quicker than she was in the last cup, but didn’t see quite as “nimble” in the tacks/gybes. I believe that at some stage they will take her out into the outer harbour to get into the swells; that will be a good test to watch. I’m a bit nervous as to how she’ll cope with the conditions in the Med.
Interesting vid as always. Love the elegance of the simple etnz foil design and looks like Ineos are trying to decouple the various forces generated by the foil, assuming based on the predicted sea state and better maneuverability. If possible could you do a vid on the rudders and to see if these are evolving? As a guess I'd say etnz are are thinking foil lift/drag is king and using the rudder/other methods to control ride height, heal etc. Looks like ineos think best boat control / maneuverability is key. Interesting to see who is right but ac history does suggest the fastest boat in a straight line wins but maybe its a boat for Ben to win starts and errrrr be Ben Ainslie....
ETNZ, I think, have grasped - maybe more than any other team with the possible exception of LR - that the foils are the most important thing when it comes to performance.
It's reflected in the cleanliness and simplicity of their designs - and the outstanding implementation of those designs into a physical structure
Great stuff! Love all your coverage of these new cup boats. Are the crew pods allowed to be completely covered?? Can't wait for the next ...
not completely. there are set sizes for the openings for each crew position (with slightly larger openings for cyclors). What you see on this boat seems to be what the rule says (except they have 10 crew pods, rather than minimum of 8).
The first word of Te Rehutai does emphatically NOT rhyme with tea, for two reasons
One: in Maori (as in Spanish and Japanese) the "e" sound is the e in "egg". This is true for all words, and so it applies to the "e" in Rehutai as well
Two: unless there is a horizontal bar (macron) above it, a vowel in Maori is clipped short, not held long like the vowel in "tea".
Sometimes the way you said it sounded spot on, and good on you for taking an interest in getting it right!
He says Terra Who Tie.
@@rusty7720 when he does say it like that, it's exactly right. And I've noticed that in recent videos he always uses that pronunciation.
Who cares
@@rippedup1931 People
@@listeningto8371 most of nz don’t 😂
Seems like an obvious move to move the actuation above water if possible. Aero and hydrodynamics surely are top priority
Have a look at electro hydrostatic actuators, an electric motor directly driving a hydraulic motor. Allows electric power transmission but hydraulic actuation. The foil actuator could be one of those? Can require some quite hefty currents. Usually the electric motor reverses direction to reverse the hydraulic flow, but that can happen quickly. How often are the foil flaps adjusted?
Tena koe, the following may help with pronunciation -
Vowel sound phonetics
A (car) E (red) I (ski) O (or) U (you)
Roll the “R”
Te
Re-hu
ta-i
Many, like myself, appreciate your willingness to at least try. We don’t expect you to get it right however, we’re here to offer assistance. Very informative breakdown of the rules and possibility of maximising opportunities to push the boundaries within the wording of the rule. Your homework, if you choose to accept it, find the English translation of Te Rehutai or Te Rehu Tai?
Kia kaha me noho ora mai no Aotearoa (All the best from NZ).
Loosing the back stays is no surprise, it's no good second guessing ETNZ, they have a history of innovation and shapeshifting within the rules.
I almost don't understand a word, been sailing as a teenager a bit, windsurfing afterwards for several years, that's about my water experience 😉 - and English is not even my first language, so your accent doesn't make it easier 🤣. But I still enjoy your explanations, trying to follow the main line, and especially all the "politics" surrounding the AC. And beeing Swiss we had a lot of that 20 years ago and makes me of course more excited about this AC! BTW: seeing you sail yourself was much fun too! Thanks for your efforts!
Thanks for watching despite my accent!
Quality as always
interesting !! Now that you've "outed this, it makes me think that the flap actuators could be horizontal arms with articulated attachment joints on to electrically powered screwjacks.
I heard on the TV coverage that only sail trim had to be hydrolic/spinners and that the ship controls can be electric. If that's true, using some sort electronic, maybe electromechanical, actuation would be within the rules. Could be automated to optimally adjust foil angle bases on speed relative to the water, measured pressure on the foil, etc., reducing brain bandwith required.
It's all hydraulic actuators, but the power to fill those actuators comes from cyclors for sails and batteries for sails. The control system which tells those actuators valves when to open is electronic but the power is signal rather than doing meaningful work.
Comparing this to Ineos W, with its lumpy actuators hard not to wonder/worry: is the Ineos W foil actually a clever way of testing multiple foil 'strategies' in one? (As with their failed towing mast tactic, developed a clever approach to beating the rules for development restrictions.)
Another great video Moz, very insightful.
Just happy to share my enthusiasm for the competition we see
Maybe ineos is using 4 flaps actuators on te W foil for testing and eventually only use 2 when they figure out which is best ie inner or outer flap control
It’s a slow build up to the racing next year, but thankfully you make it interesting. It’s very interesting that the designs are so different from each other. Do you know which foil is expected to work better in which sea/wind state?
There's certainly some sort of bolted on access cover in the area you believe the actuator is located.
Choosing to blur some areas of interest in photos but hiding nothing when launching or relaunching could be great strategy also haha.
I’m not saying they are not hiding something. Only that it can become mind games between teams…
What if team NZ's flaps adjusted in and out rather then up and down,out for lift of in at full speed ?
wotz your feeling on the increased salinity of the med ...denser water. on foil design
Another great analysis, Tom.
Mozzy you are the greatest
Nice salute to the viewers @1:31
Cheers from Auckland New Zealand 😂😂😂
Electrohydrostatic actuators? Very high pressure hydraulics?
I think ETNZ, having the upper hand, made the best choice for development. Using the old AC75 which is still already the boat to beat, and then the double AC40 for a/b testing, put everyone else in the corner. LR, knowing that its AC40 would come too late, had no choice but to develop the LQ12. But they did it in the best way: by making a scaled-down version of Te Rehutai, as LR AC36 was not adaptable to the new design vision. The new ETNZ AC75 will probably be an evolution of the earlier design. And in that sense, having already installed on-board cyclors, they are a piece ahead of everyone else.
Simplicity often is the best solution
Bear in mind that if Robs theory about ETNZ's 'banana' foil is correct they might not have to house an actuator at all, or at least one that is to small to actually move the flap and doesn't impact the size. Great video as always Mozzy, keep up the good work 👍
Could be
This fits with how I see it, integrated and independent actuation on each arm.
Amazing intuition and investigation as always Mozzy!
Question: You say it is all hydraulics this AC. Are any electrical systems allowed? If the Kiwis have cyclors controlling flying height like they did in 2017, will they need to manipulate hydraulic rather than electrical control buttons?
Electric is allowed, but only to move valves and clutches
Are they even sailboats anymore?
Hey Mozzy, Maori vowels are "ah, ay, ee, ohh, uuu" - like in Japanese or Slavic or Romantic languages.
Newby question: “Where does the electricity ‘come from’?” So, this question is about generation, ‘quantity’ and storage. I’m assuming a big battery isn’t allowed. Do the grinders have to generate all the power with that being stored in various ways (electricity in a battery, electricity in an electrical capacitor, hydraulic pressure/capacitor, pressurised air capacitor)? Thank you 🎉
All the power for foil adjustment comes from batteries, then converted to hydraulic pressure.
All the power for sail adjustments comes from pedal power and then converted to hydraulic pressure.
The crew know how to fly boats. Everyone knows how to build one. NZ know how to fly one.
Crazy/stupid question; could ETNZ be using skinned’ foils? Foils that have some sort of skin or whatever, pseudo malleable coating over the entire foil covering the hinge mechanism/flap?
There is only one slit in the centre separating the two flaps either side and every other surface seems to be covered.
So... Glen ashny and his (And TNZ's) new land sailing speed record!! Is this simply TNZ exploring new ways to experiment wings and loadings without needing a boat or limited to just one mast for testing? How much do you think they can take from this and contribute to the Americas Cup Campaign?? It is even impressive?? Is the record sought after??
My guess is ETNZ will use the rudder for trim and have no moving parts on the foils.
The tabs on the main foils are for controlling lift (gross changes to overall angle of attack via camber) rather than trim of the entire boat (which does affect angle of attack of the main foils, but only at the fine tuning level). Otherwise the main foils would always need enough camber (ie lots) for low speed takeoffs in light airs, and the drag penalty at high speeds would be massive.
With cyclors wont they have more oil? They could replace the electric motor with a hydraulic version doing the "same" task in the "same" way ?
Yes, I don't think it will cause them any issues, but it's interesting to reveal where they found an advantage in the last cup, and that they're still protecting that technology, possibly with an eye on future cups
What if they have powerful hydraulic pump(s) doing the hard work unobtrusively?
Thinner foils =less cavitation? Does it make that much difference?
I don't know how to measure the "density" of jargon in a particular pusuit, but whatever it is, sailing must be near the top.
Sailing may seem like a world of jargon, but when you get down to brass tacks, it’s really just smooth sailing. Sure, some terms might sound like you're three sheets to the wind, but once you get your sea legs, it’s clear sailing ahead. It's all about knowing the ropes and keeping an even keel. Whether you're on the right tack or the wrong one, you’ll soon find yourself navigating like an old salt. There's no need to be left high and dry, as every sailor eventually learns to trim their sails to the wind. You don’t have to be a captain to stay on course; just go with the flow and keep a weather eye on the horizon. Sailing isn't about getting caught between the devil and the deep blue sea-it's about enjoying the journey and knowing when to batten down the hatches. Before you know it, you’ll be able to take the helm without feeling like a fish out of water. So, throw caution to the wind, get your feet wet, and remember: every sailor worth their salt knows that the real fun is in the adventure, not the vocabulary.
At the very beginning of the video, did I hear you say 'everythink'?
So why would you assume any actuator hydraulic or electric would need to be placed on the control surface itself meaning down in the water creating drag and turbulence? It says controlled by not placed onto.
I'm not assuming that. In fact the opposite, I am saying etnz placed the actuators in the arm away from flap and the control went via a linkage
@@MozzySails I'm referring to @04:24 where you say each flap is a control surface and you had to put the actuators either in the bulb or down in the wing close to the foil and I just said why would anyone assume putting the actuator itself down there.
@@ipanzerschrecku4732 yes, in the old rules you had to have two flaps, one either side of the symmetry line. I guess you could have put actuators higher up than either the wing or the bulb, but then you would have needed far more complicated linkages that a simple linkage direct to both flaps simultaneously. The more linkages the more play in the system.
Vowel sounds in Maori.
A - ah
E - air, but with no hint of the r.
I - ee
O - or, again without any r
U - oo
When vowels come together they are always treated as diphthongs. So, try sounding them, one after the other, then doing it faster and faster until they merge.
Example: ai. Say ah-ee faster and faster. When you hear a new sound emerge that sounds almost (but not exactly) like the Aye in “aye-aye Captain” you’ll be pretty close.
Same with all the other vowel combinations.
Good luck, Mozzie, we’ll make an honorary Kiwi of you yet!
were you using a second Mozzie behind the blur for testing purposes?
😆
I think you’ll find your answers on the Grassy Knoll 😮
Your spoiling it for new zealand
I don't think hanging in to the Cup with a death grip by defensive means is where today's TNZ culture is focused. It's more fruitful, and satisfying to try to keep ahead of the pack on creativity than it is to try and slow down the pack's adoption of your recent improvements. If you keep innovating, they are forever chasing a moving target.
An early clue to this radical change in culture was bringing the spies in from the cold (so to speak) by not only legalising espionage between teams, but by formalising it as recon, with one agency doing it and providing the Intel to all teams openly (and to the public). Genius! (and eliminates a whole heap of wasted effort, unhelpful distraction, needless antagonism and bad faith)
Looks very very thin....huge stress on thin foils. Will they hold up on full trot?
Those thin foils are currently unchanged from when they won the last Cup, according to Mozzie
I don’t believe replacing hydraulic actuators instead of electric is a big deal . ( If indeed electric was fitted to start with ) . They have more than enough mussel power onboard to compensate. Great spot by you 👍. Noticed an access plate above the water line on the arm , a clue ?. Great video, thanks for sharing.
Just watched Team NZ daily summary, definitely a split flap on RH side Foil .
I think Mozzie's point was that the way the previous iteration of the rule was drafted, it seems maybe they could use a single actuator (if electric) rather than two. Not about saving muscle power (the forces to actuate the flaps being minimal), but about reducing drag.
@@Gottenhimfella agreed , however the physical size of the arms hasn’t changed. So no disadvantage using hydraulic instead of electric.
Why are they all of a sudden able to test with the old boat? I thought the old boats had to stay pretty much as they were? Or was there a date that changed?
Ineos’ actuators look so draggy!
the old boats have to stay as they are below the waterline. But the crew area, sail controls and internal systems can be played with. Hence the changes with a self tacking jib etc.
@@MozzySails But they're changing the foils, are they not?
@@Gottenhimfella when they launch they're new AC75 (next year) that will have new foils. Until then they can only use new foils on their LEQ12 or thier old foils on this 'legacy' AC75
Yes etnz are doing the extraordinary. Just what it looks like is .....interesting definitely be legit tho.the way of thinking keeps moving forward as you're seen. Am thinking they have come in with few options we haven't seen yet .wont use them if dont nd to .good explanation for if they start to get intimidated we'll see .
On the actuators - if it's above the waterline does it matter whether it's hydraulic or electrical? Your animation shows linkages to a lever in/behind the bulb which then controls the flaps.
And another question - does the amount of flap actuation (degrees up and down) important to the issue? Fewer degrees, easier to manage the linkages. If Team NZ can live with lower ranges then they can keep everything smaller?
I think either can be waterproofed. Whether it is electronic or hydraulic only really matters in terms of what is allowed in the rules. This cup they are not allowed electric, it has to be hydraulic. My theory is last cup they used electric as a means to install less actuators, and therefore reduce mechanics within the foil.
From 6.42 "The new rule clearly says."... " definition of that it's a Hydraulic actuator"... Yes, but 11.32 actually says "A hydraulic actuator... In combination with zero or more TRANSMISSION ACTUATORS used to adjust a control surface."
What is a transmission actuator?
It seems to me in ETNZ's foil arm flange you could have a Hydraulic actuator that then feeds into an electronic transmission actuator, and then feed the signal electronically down to the flap?
Transmission actuators are define and move clutches and valves, but can't directly bear on a control surface
@@MozzySails Thanks.
That slick foil makes the W foil look like a Christmas tree. It's gotta be faster...
I'm a kiwi and I have no association with our America's cup team but I've wind surfed, kite surfed and now I've wingsurfed for the last couple of years. I don't see what's complicated about this, in my own foil construction of my own designs, there's a point in high performance at which making a wing thinner only results in unacceptable flex. (I am talking about carbon fibre here and I'M HEAVY so I flex things.) So you don't build ultra thin because it's counter productive. And the core of any wing is dead space, compression, tension and twisting loads are at their extremes by the skin and at a minimum in the inner core. So the answer is that if you are clever with what you fit in the core, you are only limited by your imagination and material properties.
The proof is in the pudding. Last cup was super thin.
Te Rehutai = Tare RARE-hoo-tie with the same stresses as saying "the waterfall".
Some of your 'Te's we're beaut! ...keep it up Mozzy :) oh btw, nice insights into the evolution and design concepts, and IMO the elegance of simplicity. I'm sure Ineos will ditch those foil warts once they decide W is really worth pursuing .
If they decide to keep the W-foil, those actuator housings will definitely go. Whatever benefits the W-foil is supposed to grant having so much extra drag will negate it.
The māori vowels are the same as German, if that helps.
In NZ Mozzy, we call you Te Man
Just an update now the Cup is over and Team NZ have retained the trophy. Apparently there were a few things that completely escaped your attention about the Kiwi boat.
This was the boat from 2021...
Eat your hearts out Pomms 😂🔥😂😂😂??
I know things all over Ineos W are for testing and stuff but bloody hell I just can't see that foil working even remotely near optimal with all that hardware stuck all over the outside of it.
te (teh) - re (reh) hu (who) tai (tie) ,,,,, or where the essence of the ocean invigorates our strength & determination
This is the best way to teach people how to pronounce MĀORI correctly. Phonetically. Perfect jackweta
Those boats sure have changed since the last time I watched it. That was back when the US lost the cup for the first time. It is like it is not even the same kind of race anymore. It would be like a classic NASCAR race, and then later the NASCAR cars look like F1 cars. Completely changes the race.
Finally a voice of sanity. No, it's not at all the same race, meaning it's not really the AC. It's a blind pursuit of technical speed, egged on by a vague nationalistic hubris that holds it there, with no observable, residual regard for the essence of the Race.
Sad, because there are half a dozen superior sail classes who still race real boats on real courses engaging real dynamics and seamanship, and not this banging off the out-of-bounds in bicycled, flatwater, inland Moths run by a peculiarly narrow interpretation of both tech and class. It's killing the Cup.
Judged by the want of replies to your observation - and anticipating the thumbs-down due mine, apparently this is fine.
I will always enjoy the Americas Cup “cat and mouse” games with the “I’ve got a secret” boat design games. This makes for a good size fan base and is true to the whole premise of the contest. Otherwise we would all be riding personal watercraft.
Albatross foils! Awesome.....
Te - it's not an 'eeee' it's more of a hard 'a' like an ā as in apple
Re - roll your r - short e
Who
Tie
Keep up the good work. Most of your videos are too technical for me but I'm learning slowly.
Cheers 🙂
You needed more blurring. :)
😁
Couldve used some more bluring of bowman who appears to be one finger saluting the recon team? 1:32
@@kitinnz 😄... Good spot!
Who and what is Te Rehutai?
I would just blur something random just to mess with the competition :D
If we gave Mozzy the Zabruder tape he'd have a suspect in short order 🤣
😆
For everybody that says there is no way nature can power something beyond current norms, has never seen the new America's Cup.
Great video, it's Te (kind of nasally think Michael MacIntyre northern Irish accent mouth open) Re (tongue to the roof of your mouth make a split second car sound by vibrating your tongue) hutai Who Tai as it sounds. Blair pronounces it correctly being from Northland, shot Blair.
Regarding pronuciation: phonetically it would be - Teh-dehootai.
In our Te Reo Maori, the R is rolled so you can pronounce it like a softened and shortened D sound.
Te = The
Rehutai = Sea spray
Teh-rehootai.
@@miiblenkarn6650 a lot of Westerners can't roll the R and a soft D is indistinguishable!
This is how we teach people to speak our language phonetically here in Aotearoa.
Just go sailing!
5:59 - am I the only one who thinks this foil looks incredibly ugly?
And in aeronautic terms, ugly usually means bad.
When things are designed correctly, they always look correct. This looks straight-up wrong.
You're not the only one
It’s a red hearing, don’t worry about it.
Nothings simple in the AC , Might on the surface BUT there's many people working on it so its not That sir is what the AC is so interesting > Just when you think you got it ?
Can Kiwi fly they do over 50knots ....
Random blurring 😂
Make them use mono hulls and get back to sailing a yacht.
I don't understand ... Why can't a hydraulic actuator be in the foil arm doing the same job and maintaining the sleek foil format? Sleek has got to be a lot better
I think Mozzie's point was that the way the previous iteration of the rule was drafted, they could use a single actuator (if electric) rather than two.
If they must use two separate actuators, the same system could be used effectively cut in half with separate actuators in the arm. Would only need a dog leg at the top to provide enough separation to fit two actuators which could be smaller as they only need half the power.
Well, that was underwhelming. Thanks for the PowerPont presentation.
lol 1:32 dude is flipping the bird
as soon as I saw that clip I knew I had to include it in the video :)
Kiwis can fly❤
Te RE who Tie, short e sound. There is no long or short in Maori just one phonic unless two vowels together.
Meanwhile, etnz is obviously seeing how basic changes impact with adding foil changes as well. The real question is what's up their sleeve for foils over all? We know there will be innovations and they know not to let too much out of the bag.
Where have you Gone?? Are you on Holiday. So much happening and looking for your comments. ETNZ @ 55knots!? W foils? Prada Hiding HULA?
I had a really busy month with work... back on it now!