I don't know how accurate this is, but I remember being told the って言う formation is paraphrasing what someone said. Not an exact quote, but a rough approximation. That does kind of fit conceptually with combining a hearsay particle with the to say verb, but language is rarely that logical.
A very praise-worthy idea for a channel, likely doomed to not be too popular due to the fact that, for the most part, the English-speaking fans of Hololive are split into: 1. More recent fans who mostly care about the EN branch and barely care about the JP one or the JP language for that matter 2. More recent fans who mostly care about the EN branch and only care about the JP one enough to watch translated clips of them every now and then and not much else than that 3. More recent fans who do care about the JP branch to an extent, but are not invested enough into this to really go beyond "I just like to watch translated clips of them" 4. Older fans who used to just watch translated clips of the JP branch, but then switched to EN once it came out entirely 5. Older fans who used to just watch translated clips of the JP branch, switched to watching EN, and still just watch clips of JP and nothing beyond that 6. Older fans who started off just watching clips of the JP branch and actually got invested enough to want to learn JP to understand them better and... basically already succeeded at this point , so they wouldn't need this type of content at this point anyway. 7. The fringe "actually just a Japanese person who knows English" fans, who don't need this type of content for obvious reasons. The non-listed examples, from my experience in this community throughout the years, just don't seem numerous enough to even mention here.
I want to invite you into my discord server. discord.gg/uNeG5m3e I created a channel for Japanese learning. If there is an interest in the community and if it's possible I would like to create a place for people who want to learn Japanese (any level). A place to ask questions, share information like helpful sides etc. and helping each others to improve our Japanese. Sources: tte-particle Overview video th-cam.com/video/LjVn1Mo7DBU/w-d-xo.html souda/soudesu hearsay jlptsensei.com/learn-japanese-grammar/%E3%81%9D%E3%81%86%E3%81%A0-sou-da-i-heard-that/ souda/soudesu It seems/ it looks like jlptsensei.com/learn-japanese-grammar/%E3%81%9D%E3%81%86%E3%81%A0-sou-da-looks-like/
Thanks for your explanations. Seeing your clips have furigana have rekindled my interest in learning Japanese, and these in-depth explanations are greatly appreciated.
I learned about "it seems" = そう(だ) a couple days ago, and of course there's an additional meaning to it :D Japanese is so different, it makes learning frustrating but also very interesting. thanks for your efforts, very much appreciated!
So this is me going out a bit on a limb here, I am by no means authoritative on this matter, but I think you might have missed a point worth noting here. I think it might be easier to spot and remember the って for hearsay by considering that it is probably simply serving it's role as a quote here, the short version of と言う. Since no speaker is specified, the attribution gets assigned to the "they" of "they say" thus indicating hearsay. It's not so much simply a case of って being a marker for hearsay in and of itself and this is why it does not work as a replacement for そうだ in terms of how things seem, assumptions made from your own impressions.
Souda with the meaning hearsay can definitely be replaced with tte. In the video I linked from a native speaker she also uses souda. th-cam.com/video/LjVn1Mo7DBU/w-d-xo.html Timestamp: 4:46 I didn't go for toiu because I don't think it's a quote or indirect speech more a generalisation for what the people say. It's possible that toiu and souda can both be used for hearsay similarly though. But I have to look into that more. www.tofugu.com/japanese-grammar/toiu/ In this source toiu seems to be used similarly as souda and also in the example seems to follow the same grammar rules. Maybe she used souda instead because there are so many more uses for toiu that can be replaced with tte and the two are interchangeable as hearsay. But again I have to look more into it. Thanks for your input
@@MurasakiRingoJPlearning Sorry I fear you may have misunderstood me. そうだ and って certainly both serve to indicate hearsay, this we agree on. But そうだ is used to both indicate hearsay and a personal impression of something, to seem. The latter of these is where って wont serve as a replacement, and my theory as to why is because it is not exactly a particle but simply the abbreviation of と言う.
って is a so called quoting particle. Another quoting particle is the と in と言う. The って replaces the と to って言う. と言う is used for writing and polite speech and って for casual speech, where the 言う can be left out. So to me it would be more precise to say the って is the abbreviation of って言う after the って replaced と
!["Crazy Korone" Tries to Trick Her English Viewers (Inugami Korone/Hololive) [ENG SUB]](/img/n.gif)
I don't know how accurate this is, but I remember being told the って言う formation is paraphrasing what someone said. Not an exact quote, but a rough approximation. That does kind of fit conceptually with combining a hearsay particle with the to say verb, but language is rarely that logical.
A very praise-worthy idea for a channel, likely doomed to not be too popular due to the fact that, for the most part, the English-speaking fans of Hololive are split into:
1. More recent fans who mostly care about the EN branch and barely care about the JP one or the JP language for that matter
2. More recent fans who mostly care about the EN branch and only care about the JP one enough to watch translated clips of them every now and then and not much else than that
3. More recent fans who do care about the JP branch to an extent, but are not invested enough into this to really go beyond "I just like to watch translated clips of them"
4. Older fans who used to just watch translated clips of the JP branch, but then switched to EN once it came out entirely
5. Older fans who used to just watch translated clips of the JP branch, switched to watching EN, and still just watch clips of JP and nothing beyond that
6. Older fans who started off just watching clips of the JP branch and actually got invested enough to want to learn JP to understand them better and... basically already succeeded at this point , so they wouldn't need this type of content at this point anyway.
7. The fringe "actually just a Japanese person who knows English" fans, who don't need this type of content for obvious reasons.
The non-listed examples, from my experience in this community throughout the years, just don't seem numerous enough to even mention here.
I want to invite you into my discord server.
discord.gg/uNeG5m3e
I created a channel for Japanese learning. If there is an interest in the community and if it's possible I would like to create a place for people who want to learn Japanese (any level). A place to ask questions, share information like helpful sides etc. and helping each others to improve our Japanese.
Sources:
tte-particle Overview video
th-cam.com/video/LjVn1Mo7DBU/w-d-xo.html
souda/soudesu hearsay
jlptsensei.com/learn-japanese-grammar/%E3%81%9D%E3%81%86%E3%81%A0-sou-da-i-heard-that/
souda/soudesu It seems/ it looks like
jlptsensei.com/learn-japanese-grammar/%E3%81%9D%E3%81%86%E3%81%A0-sou-da-looks-like/
This seems advanced for me, but I'll keep it to study and get familiar with it. Thanks for the lesson!
I will do some basic stuff soon
Please keep these going as they are extremely useful and great for actual use. 10/10!
Some how this particle came up for a test for my uni work just after I found this video xD
Super helpful timing!
This is very interesting! Right now I don't have a place in my life for actual japanese learning but this seems like a good way to start!
Thanks for your explanations.
Seeing your clips have furigana have rekindled my interest in learning Japanese, and these in-depth explanations are greatly appreciated.
I learned about "it seems" = そう(だ) a couple days ago, and of course there's an additional meaning to it :D Japanese is so different, it makes learning frustrating but also very interesting.
thanks for your efforts, very much appreciated!
mybrain exploded at 3:50
So this is me going out a bit on a limb here, I am by no means authoritative on this matter, but I think you might have missed a point worth noting here. I think it might be easier to spot and remember the って for hearsay by considering that it is probably simply serving it's role as a quote here, the short version of と言う. Since no speaker is specified, the attribution gets assigned to the "they" of "they say" thus indicating hearsay. It's not so much simply a case of って being a marker for hearsay in and of itself and this is why it does not work as a replacement for そうだ in terms of how things seem, assumptions made from your own impressions.
Souda with the meaning hearsay can definitely be replaced with tte. In the video I linked from a native speaker she also uses souda.
th-cam.com/video/LjVn1Mo7DBU/w-d-xo.html Timestamp: 4:46
I didn't go for toiu because I don't think it's a quote or indirect speech more a generalisation for what the people say.
It's possible that toiu and souda can both be used for hearsay similarly though. But I have to look into that more.
www.tofugu.com/japanese-grammar/toiu/
In this source toiu seems to be used similarly as souda and also in the example seems to follow the same grammar rules. Maybe she used souda instead because there are so many more uses for toiu that can be replaced with tte and the two are interchangeable as hearsay. But again I have to look more into it.
Thanks for your input
@@MurasakiRingoJPlearning Sorry I fear you may have misunderstood me. そうだ and って certainly both serve to indicate hearsay, this we agree on. But そうだ is used to both indicate hearsay and a personal impression of something, to seem. The latter of these is where って wont serve as a replacement, and my theory as to why is because it is not exactly a particle but simply the abbreviation of と言う.
って is a so called quoting particle. Another quoting particle is the と in と言う. The って replaces the と to って言う. と言う is used for writing and polite speech and って for casual speech, where the 言う can be left out. So to me it would be more precise to say the って is the abbreviation of って言う after the って replaced と