I have so much love for this game, it was my first MMO when I was like 12 or 13. I remember the Valkurm Dunes, pulling lizards and the occasional Gobby then moving to the Crabs, then finishing at around level 18 with the Pugils, ah man good times.
Yardef Finnagan it had a great community along with the adventure it was the only game I remember playing and being like I’m bored let’s do something and a group of us would go camp a nm or do some bcnms etc etc
I always thought THF was a really solid job in the 75 cap days. They did pretty good damage, they could pull, and they didn't require much healing. I remember being THF/NIN and feeling so ballin having a scorpion harness and strider boots ha
In the 75 days, it kinda fell off 60+. SATA wasn't unique anymore, tanks could hold hate and the other DD's damage was catching up that the spike dmg didn't keep them above. Even after the nerf, a RNG, and especially a COR, were considered better picks. Then so many classes had methods of pulling. Don't feel bad. DRG, PUP & SMN have always been my all-time favorites. What bugs me about the DRG bashing is people always consider when things are going horribly. Not bad, but HORRIBLY. Oh no! I can't keep my wyvern alive!! That's like complaining that you cant keep hp above zero. Get good. Also, it was genuinely never a problem for me past Qufim. He even tried to downplay Angon here. Like... wut? Angon led to people looking for drg in particular for merits and end game stuff. Having piercing damage on every auto attack, and putting out big numbers was big. "But what about skeletons?!" But what about the stuff resistant to slashing, blunt or physical as a whole? How often did people really fight a lot of skeletons in 75? KRT was more of a backup camp area. People didn't just rush there. Then the DRG's personal dmg was hitting like the other DD. The wyvern pushed me over, and I was also a taru in the 75 era. It's just weird that people only look at what can go wrong when trying to downplay a job. I even personally liked THF in the 75 era. Why? My dmg started to fall off as a PUP. Then I realized I could make automaton full heal(yes, as soon as the job came out). So I made parties with a lot of the "leftover" classes. Between evasion, guard and automaton checking me before party members, I was tank, dd and healer all in one, especially against Eruca. A thf/nin could get that SATA on me and we just unleashed. Then I taught my gf how go use it and made a static. I was DRG/BLU, she was PUP/WAR and we had a THF/NIN, RDM/BLM, SAM/WAR, PLD/WAR. RDM weren't getting love back then with brd and cor. Then we didn't need him to be a gimped healer or just refresh battery. He played as a full rdm. PLD were ignored for nin. So he wanted that. SAM was a good buddy. THF could play to her heart's content. THF pulled. SAM voke. SATA PLD. Enfeebles go flying. THF pull at 50%. I Jump that one and hold it off. Why not SAM? That voke was for SATA setups mid fight. I also had Cocoon to take much less dmg and on demand healing. So I'd fight that one, they finish off the last. If SATA was ready, PLD and THF just moved into position and fired off. If it wasn't, PLD just provoke, I'd shed hate with High and/or Super. Rinse and repeat. Pop a WS to deal with status effects so automaton could keep the Regens and heals flowing. Was good times. Back when I thought Chain 5 was the highest you can go, then we regularly started getting double digits lol.
@@Theinen84 But DRG was boring. Almost all of the useful abilities came from sub jobs. It's a good job if you want to passively play the game because auto attack was DRG's best ability
@@Mortified42 boring is subjective. You could also say the same about MNK, WAR, DRK, SAM, etc. DRG was designed that way on purpose. It's not a job with a subjob. The subjob completes it. FFXI was great in that all classes were actually unique, not each doing the same thing in different colors. The wyvern, and how you played, changed entirely based on your subjob pick. DRG was the first truly adaptable job of the game. If it was boring and just auto-attacking, it's because you chose to not explore and push the class to its fullest. That issue is with you, not the class.
A note for people watching this in 2024... this video is now six years old and predates the addition of the master levels system and a host of other additions and changes. This video, and others on this channel regarding FFXI, are outdated information. Please refer instead to BGWiki, FFXIClopedia, or FFXIAH for more current information and resources.
Nowadays if someone moves when I SATA, I just insta disband, same thing when someone asks me to re-sing on Bard after they walked away from me singing.
Simple answer…. Thief and Dragoon suffered the most….. Thief had spurts when they were wanted…. I don’t understand why Dragoon was so hated….. all the ones I ever played with could definitely hold their own.
Also, i'm surprised that SMN isn't on this list, because MY GOD. like... people saw you as White Mage -1. which was already worse than Red Mage. The range of buffs that your summoned pets gave didn't really impress and were on too high of a cooldown to make up for the sub-par enfeebling and divine skill which the job lacked. I don't even think you got any form of haste at 75. the summoned pet didn't leech EXP, but it DID feed the mobs TP with it's mostly ineffectual attacks and the occasional offensive blood pact from Garuda. Which left... Soloing. the most ass-backwards soloing. using Carbuncle to kite shit around all day soloing. the window of stuff you could solo with your pet was INCREDIBLY small because the Summoner attached to the pet was useless. sure, you could build up some TP and maybe spirit taker some MP back, but like... then what?!? it's not like you could use that MP to heal your pet. it was just more fuel for their costly blood pacts or perpetuation costs. No, you had to sit there and kite mobs and let a cheap avatar like Carbuncle feed certain things TP until they'd kill themselves. you'd never participate in fights because you didn't want your resummoned pet to have to take Emnity off of you like... ever, so what you were left with was summoning Carbuncle and running away to a spot where you have enough room to resummon and let carbuncle get hate again, but close enough to where you're still in range to get EXP when the bomb or bee you're fighting eventually self-destructs from all the TP you've fed them. Missions ironically are where Summoner probably shined the most, given it's 'backup healer but also half decent DD that doesn't have to stand in AoE range' status. particularly, things that would do charm/like things or do something funky to player characters were the ideal applications for Summoner's very disposable pets. Obviously, people towards the end of 75 era discovered those SMN Burn level synch parties where you'd blow your load with a bunch of 2 hrs on every mob in a zone and rake in a booty load of EXP and some really fringe cases where SMN was good, but... uugh. :C I loved the job and all it's quirkiness, but it felt like the community just lacked the imagination to see SMN for what it was worth.I know 99 era brought with it essentially the abolishment of Avatar perpetuation costs and insane levels of refresh in Abyssea to kite stuff all the live long day, but I kinda was sickened by how much the game changed and stopped playing.
at 119+ SMN is regarded as one of the best endgame jobs. 2 smn can make light SC from avatars and MB their own SC for insane damage. 119+ content 3 jobs really stand out. BLU SMN BLM. They take all the rest of the jobs along for the ride.
I remember once leveling out in the mire at 70; had this entire party screaming at me because I would let Garuda out to Predator Claws every other mob. Said it was taking away from my healing MP, even though my MP was never an issue lol people really hated the idea of SMN being anything other than a heal-bot back then. Disgusting to see how much it's soloing the game now.
Even at 75 cap SMN is one of the best jobs. Spike damage with 0 enmity and insane support abilities. Hell, Rolling Thunder alone can do more damage than even the strongest DD's if you have a couple dual wielders in the party. End game it also shines in the HNM scene and it is bar none the best job for missions and it can solo like a boss too.
its wild because private 75 era servers are getting like 600-1200 logged in daily as well. I wish SE would make an XI-2 that embodied everything that made classic xi the joy that it was.
I mained PUP when it was brand new, and it was my favourite! I remember leveling it, and some monk with parser thought it was funny how I was doing 60% the damage he was doing. I had a parser running too... I asked him how much it said my puppet was doing, because it's the one that does most of the damage. He got quiet. Overall, because he wasn't adding them together, I was doing 1.5x what he was doing. PUP was always complex, and back in the day most people had no idea how it worked. People regularly didn't even realize when parsers split master damage from the puppet's.
One thing that THF was sold short on frequently was its strengths in some mission battlefields. Pre-ToAU, THF had one of the highest survivability ratings in the game. I used an EVA/RACC build on CoP 2-5 Mammets. My job was to keep 1 mammet occupied while the party managed the other two. Well, "keep distracted" meant soloing the hell out of it with bloody bolts and leaving it at 10% by the time the other two went down.
I played PUP at 75 back in the day and it was a soloing monster. Sub PLD for Flash and you and your automaton could trade off flashes and almost never be hit. You could combine the Valor body with the Harlequin head (or was it the valor head and the harlequin body? its been a while) for a tanking automaton that could still heal. Equip the provoke attachment, have a healthy supply of healing oils for your automaton, and you were basically invincible. I had an echo macro that would show me my automaton's TP () and I would use that to help skillchain with party members. You could leave the automaton out of the engagement until you were ready to skillchain, as long as you weren't waiting too long. It was an extra layer of management, but the whole management aspect was what was so appealing about that job in the first place.
sorry but thf with capped archery/markmenship was an absolute godsend in some pts. Acid bolts + sata with a party who could play with the mechanics. I was mnk myself, but seeing professional thfs in action..always was an inspiring thing lol.
*A new private server is coming out in December called HORIZON XI, there's a great dev team working on it (75 cap BUT with expansions) Check out the discord!*
I loved playing THF so much! I remember rocking a sirocco kukri/kraken club setup that was hillllarrious, TP everywhere! Me and a RDM friend could 2-man a lot of content that was definitely not meant for 2. It was a really demanding job in order to play well, but I think that's what made it feel very rewarding, too.
BST was my first 75 with PLD up to 70 at that time. I started leveling it when I didn't have time to lfg for extended time. It was an awesome experience and still a favorite.
Hey, a fellow ex-loldrg here. I do have to say that I think you missed a crucial part about dnc and how they build up tp. My wife mained dnc and with her, it was all about the reverse flourish to get that tp up. If you keep finishing moves on you, you can go into battle with tp. Also, after, I think 3 finishing moves, you'll get a positive gain for tp vs tp spent getting the finishing moves. As per my wife, it's all about managing steps and finishing moves more than hitting to get tp. Lastly, (since my first main was bard to help out my ls), it was my understanding that dnc was made to help with the lack of bards around and the large demand for march, paeon and madrigal (or mambo and ballad). It use to be that I couldn't walk about of my mog house without people asking of I wanted to do dynamis or party or something. After dnc, there were less of those. lastly, I actually solo'ed drg from 50 to 75 (finished it when TOAU came out. Took a long time). before drachen armet, soloing wasn't too had if you understood that there's a lag between you casting, the cast going off and the pet wyvern casting. What I did was I got a good average of what the mob in dmg per hit. Before the mob hit that would bring me below a certain HP (1/3 since I /whm in those days) I would start casting the spell. The check for wyvern using healing breath only happens when the spell goes off. So I start casting, I get hit, hp goes to < 1/3, spell goes off, I get healed. Can it get hairy sometimes? Yes, but you're generally good if you know what you're doing. On second thought, people also thought I was a masochist because I would have 30~45 min solo fights with abyssea ironclads and Hrosshvalur when I was level 90.
Maybe the game has changed since I left, but I played pre-75 break up to 99 cap. Took a break and came back for 119 gear stuffs era...many many many jobs 99/full merit/cap pts etc...DNC was my main and I consistently was a top DPS in my EGLS. Have 95 Ukon and everything...still cant touch a beast DNC. DNC was one of, what, one of three or so jobs that can both solo light and dark SC? On top of full healing...and debuffing, and healing and tanking.
Lvling DRG and also at lvl75 I macroed in HP gear to cast my spell so I could have my wyvern cast when I actually had higher HP than I did with my normal gear on, following that I macroed in Wyvern HP and the Relic Helm to increase the amount they healed. I also went /BLU for Cocoon....that DEF.... and for head butt as it was a quick cast. I also did DNC and it was a powerful job for those who knew how to play it, but not many people actually figured out it's role since it wasn't really ever clearly defined. I could solo Darkness spam extremely easy, and at times you could do 3 WS's in a row.
Ahh yes, the end game macros. And that wyrm armet, good times. Though I always used foot kick when possible to set off healing breath. It has the lowest recast timer and mp cost with the same amount of casting time as head butt. Especially if I'm saving the stun to interrupt casting. Glad to hear from another drg/blu fan. Most people were like "drg/sam or nothing!" I actually stopped when around the time they introduced item levels. By the time I stopped, I had a ethereal earring, twilight mail and helm. Yep... at the end I was walking around with auto reraise, auto regen +2, auto refresh and converts taken damage to mp. As long as my wyvern is alive, I could self heal indefinitely... It was around that time I was like "I think I'm satisfied. I think I can quit with no regrets."
sleepingkirby that may have been what I used with head butt to stun stuff. I never leveled DRG past 75. And I used those type of macros before 75 and before 60 :P
Cheerleaders have been around since the days of jousting, everyone has a hype man in their corner, or hype woman. Dancer has relevance to the lore of fighting in general.
Ehhh, I played FFXI during the lvl75 days, and was a THF main... the only true downside of the job was how difficult and long it would take to actually GET an exp party. I never had any issues with playing THF or the positioning (though I was an Elvaan so maybe something about that was easier than your Taru?). Good THFs did good damage, were often great at getting around without aggroing everything in sight, and understood hate/enmity management very well. These were things I took a lot of pride in. ...We were also really useful for Dynamis pulling, as masochistic as being a deathpuller was, lol...
DNC was actually one of the best jobs for merit parties due to Haste Samba and the fact that you generally couldn't cap delay reduction back then without it.
Ya I have to disagree about it being one of the best merit party jobs. A healer with haste(preferably rdm for Dia3 when they got it), 3-4 DD, and 1-2 Bard/or 1 Cor with your 1 Bard was was basically best. With relic Bard, and relic/kclub DD you'd be running into killing stuff too fast for even 2 bards to be pulling and I remember having to help pull as rdm or do double/triple pulls on BRD and go all -cast time with that low hp activated minstrels ring. Dnc's haste on the 2 other DD for example wouldn't compensate enough for the loss of damage, especially for 2h DD if I remember correctly. Also for example if you had a RNG or Cor in the group.
I'm sure it was a good alternative when BRDs were few and far in-between, but everyone back in the day focused primarily on BRD + WHM/RDM + SAMx4 for the most optimal meriting.
I kinda had to object to DNC too. I was able to solo stuff like Adamantoise as DNC75/NIN, and Daggers were pretty good on colibri burns back in the day.
I think the biggest problem with a "Worst Jobs" list is player know how. In almost all the jobs you listed, if you were good at that job, you could run circles around other jobs, but getting good was a steep climb. The other problem was perception. The only way I could party on my BST was with others in my ls and even then, not too often. Never got beyond a 75 cap, but during those days, BST was villanized and admired at the same time. Nothing like duoing Xolotl on BST and there was a guy on my server that soloed Byakko on BST. Fun, fun, fun. Then again I watched an RDM solo Byakko, so maybe that last feat isn't as amazing. But, for the video you had to pick 5 jobs and in varying degrees, you're right about the ones you picked, especially PUP and DRG.
I was a PUP main (and I hope someday they give us a similar version of the class on FFXIV) it was great for getting my school work done though, nothing like smashing out two term papers while waiting 6 hours for a colibri merit party XD. I did my best though and earned a spot in an endgame manaburn linkshell by outnuking some black mages and earning my place. :) Love love love this job.
People didn't understand PUP because many didn't bother learning what the attachments could do and what maneuvers were needed to make the Automaton do what was needed. Back then, people just bum rushed jobs to cap and asked questions later. If it was too complicated for them, they call the job "gimp" and move on.
Worst rep PUP got was that SOOO many people got power-leveled up to 75 in a day or so, did NOT learn a thing about the attachments, and said "omg lolpup" and everyone believed them. So PUP's bad rep was from players who didn't even know how to USE the job. ... while I was soloing Raja in AF3+2 gear just fine on it "back in the day", and still got laughed at as a lolpup.
I tune into your vids every once in a while as I used to play ff11 back in the day (granted I was young and a huge noob) I play14 now but love just to see whats going on in 11. You have a great voice and I love your vids!
Pup 75 was my first and only main for a long time. Learned a lot of tricks. Like disengaging 1 hit before 100% tp to get time the limit break for when you want it. Double spells with deactivating/activating on full hp. Agro, deactivate to stun high level mobs while walking by. Bunch of other stuff
Fun video. Had been wondering when you were going to put one like this out since you had made a top 5 jobs video... can't really say i disagree with any points you made. What makes a list like this a tough call, is like you noted already, many of the jobs that were epic fails during the 75 era became some of the most OP jobs in the 119 era, and vice versa; for instance red mage.
i have 2 jobs on this list and have kinda wanted to level another 2. i have THF and BST and love them both. my BST DPS is very comparable to any solo non skillchaining player easly. sadly skillchains and magic bursts take the advantage there. and as for THF. having a job that can make some money or just farm that one stuipid item needed for the quest. is VERY nice to have!
Great video! I wonder what’s your setup for the game to run so smoothly, I’ve heard about the 60 fps thingy, but urs looks even smoother for some reason
Bst was my favorite job. Remembering duo despot while whole alliances got wiped. Bst was hands down most fun job for me. Aso made a killing while leveling in the tree. I had no craft skills. All money was made on my bst either selling Despot drop,Dynamis money, lumber,tree cuttings, moss from goobues, soloing nms for people. Then really made killing soloing nms in Abyssea for Empyrian items.
MR SLEEPS spent days in the tree selling wisteria lumber and saplings also used to farm like 8-10 clusters a time for O Hats and iolites sold well also miss bst best job best part was being in a spot for like 3-5 days and a party show up and tell you to move
a quick comment on 75 Era Beastmaster only parties. I was a member of a Linkshell called "Wolves in Sheepskin'(Seraph server, now merged with Bismark), the only requirement for membership was to have BST unlocked. Members would always be forming BST only parties, running BCNM's, KSNM's, Promy's. Missions, NM farming, even particular crafting material farming. Back before the R/EX version of Peacock Charm was indroduced, 3 BST could easily beat Under Observation BCNM40 with 1 tiger jug, 2 courier carrie, and some biscuits, get a Peacock Charm drop and that was a 333,333 gil per person reward! Even the BCNM20 Wings of Fury could easily be beaten with 3 BST with the hopes an Astral Ring would drop. BST was my first job to 75 and also to 99, it is my favorite job in FFXI. I love the complexity and strategy of the solo combat and the pure insanity of a 3-6 BST only party tearing through a zone leaving nothing in their wake (I'm talking to you Yuhtunga Jungle!)
I think you really downplayed the thief's evasion here...the amount of ludicrous stuff you could survive as thief was unreal. Seriously, if I'd had a gil for the amount of times I heard "How are you still alive?" I would have been able to fully fund several relic weapons XD Also I ended up soloing many a NM fight for friends after the rest of the party completely wiped. Was like: *rolls up sleeves* "Time to go to work and show you kids how it's done!" :D That aside, totally agree...leveling thief sucked early on...though I don't think any other job gave such a rush when soloing.
RoninXDarknight oh man I was thf back in 02 and I feel you mate I can not count the amount of times in sky I was left kiting kirin till the party could recover lmao good times
Me and my friend would duo tons of nm's because of game mechanics like that. Just go Thf/Nin and Brd/whm and use eva songs. Elegys slow and super eva would be crazy strong. But Thf would have issues because of it's lack of subtle blow which made it a bad choice to duo some nm's. Nin/Drk and Brd/whm or Rdm/whm or Whm/Drk would make much more sense. Was pretty nice when bst got a jug pet with high level treasure hunter later on though lol.
Interesting list. Well written! lots of valid points. Gotta leave some DRG shoutouts though! DRG shoutout 1 of 2 Shoutouts to max HP+ gear in healing breath macro! It's been years but if I remember correctly I could trigger healing breath at something like 80% max health by having the Armet in the head slot and max HP+ gear in every single other slot. I oughta look it up but off the top of my head i remember things like bomb queen ring, bloodscale mail, cassie earring, some NM gigas bracelets. All that together in your Armet macro made self healing a dream. I'm gonna assume people understand how this works, but if not I'm happy to explain it!
Worst job post Abyssea era was Black Mage. Not because the job itself but because as a Pup/Sch I was able to AoE sleepga, and Black Mages weren't because those gimpy people had no skill, so they were effectively useless until they skilled up. I solo'd my way up on Pup/Dnc and could even kill an IT Colibri in ShadowReign near San d'Oria. Though I had to use my little companion, my puppet, and would just barely survive the encounter and I think get 600 Exp.... but soloing IT mobs? Man talk about epic rush back then. But most of the time I just went around killing stuff for Koppernickel Ore and getting invited to parties by people who only wanted me to use my Ranged Automaton but I didn't have the skill level for that, because I was too busy using DNC TP and Light Manuevers in order to get heals. FFXI was a crazy game. Stupid esoteric, and entirely 100% reliant on you knowing your job to get the most out of a situation. Pup/Sch was a terrible damage combination, but when lowmanning content being able to cast images on someone, or sleeping mobs you didn't want bothering you... There was just a lot of versatility.
As a DRG back in the day, Penta Thrust was pretty OP and should have stayed OP since DRG was so bad. Before the first nerf you could literally get 90% of your TP back if all 5 of your Penta Thrusts hit.
I never got why people used dagger on THF at low levels when you could just go sword, deal comparable damage per swing, and scale Fast Blade with SA nicely with your Leaping/Bounding boots.
I think bst is one of those you can't really list in any traditional sense. If you wanted time to yourself, didn't have hours to play at a time or wanted something more intimate to play with a close friend or partner it was a real different experience you couldn't get anywhere else (or if you wanted to cheap out a bit and make lots of passive Gil levelling). It's a shame there probably won't be any open world game or MMO like FF11 any more (perhaps when VR is mainstream?). FF12 had some elements that seemed influenced by 11 for a single player title, but then you have XIV, which, whilst a good MMO, isn't exactly going against the curve or innovating (hopefully in endwalker though) unlike XI. If I ever get the patience and time to play a private server again I'd probably try BST properly.
A new private server is coming out in December called HORIZON XI, there's a great dev team working on it (75 cap BUT with expansions) Check out the discord!
@@jordanaloken2466 thanks for this, shall check it out in the morning. XIV got boring pretty quickly with Endwalker once the story dry and the endgame dull AF. Nostalgic for a 75 Xi server, especially if it's new!!
Be sure to click the discord link, the team is active on there and are about to do the th dev blog on twitch! Find info n ask your burning questions to the team!
@Havok @Havok It definitely could have been worse, and you made some good points. I found their HNM use unfulfilling. Yes, the alliance wanted at least 1 thief to apply TH, but they could have been naked besides armlets and a knife. At least they were wanted though. Solo-ability was pretty good. Though everything looked poor next to what RDM or BLM could do. Bloody bolts often didnt drain fully (or at all) against high level enemies. And to hit required a lot of Racc gear. I found THF could really shine in a duo or trio. I cant complain about the farming. Loved having TH for any item hunt. Anything /nin could pull dynamis. Bard was probably the best (buffs/sleep) THF was good if you had to PD tank a large group for some reason (I didnt do a whole lot of dynamis.) The reasons why I say it drew a short stick: Leveling was awful. All DD jobs had a longer party wait, but THF was lumped into the "lol" crowd. And pre 60, I can understand people not wanting to deal with SATA. This extended to merit parties. Even during ToAU, where most parties targeted flying birds. At least on Phoenix, the hot jobs for merits were the 2handers. The dagger update was a massive boost to THF DPS (20% or so, a huge increase for xi.) But that was SE finally admitting: "alright, thf is dealing much less damage than intended. It's getting a giant buff." I don't think it was in demand for any hard missions. Maybe a kite during divine might. CoP did not want THFs. I didnt finish all the ToAU or WotG missions so idk about the hard fights. Most endgame content that relied on drop rate (admittedly lots) only wanted one THF, and it was only for the TH. At least it had that. Otherwise it would have been in the upper echelons of "lol" jobs. THF could do a lot in the right hands. But as far as game content went, I resented that the main draw to have a THF was often accomplished by somebody's mule account with 1 dagger and armlets.
Interesting list. Well written! lots of valid points. Gotta leave some DRG shoutouts though! DRG shoutout 2 of 2 Shoutouts to DRG/mage main heal merit burn parties! Back in the Aht Urhgan day finding an OPEN camp was half the battle. Best merit parties I can remember were MNK MNK MNK MNK DRG/mage DRG/mage fighting trolls (trolls!) out in Mt Zayolm. There was NEVER anyone out there fighting! While other parties were basically waiting in line and puling Colibris out from under eachother, we were getting the same or better exp/hour on trolls. The MNKs shredded the trolls and the DRGs kept the MNKs in the pink while adding a bit of damage themselves. I don't remember how I came across this idea. Pretty sure I was recruited by another senior DRG while I was in the DRG's natural state (LFP while soloing). Of course the biggest downside to this PT from then on was that I had to set them all up myself and convince the MNKs (and even the DRGs) that it would work. Almost always the initial reaction was, "seriously?" but once we got out there it was all butter.
FF 11 will always be my only mmo regret for never playing it. I wish I had from what some friends told me and seeing many retro videos on the game it looked like a true fun experience I wish I could of enjoyed when it was current.
Drg was one of my favorite jobs to level... I feel like I was the only person who did this but I remember getting sata'd a lot and using high jump and super jump to reset to the tank... But I feel like no one did that with drg... It was awesome
Former Taru PLD & DRG here. Loved THF being in the party and always had fun partying with BST. Never really got into stigmas, you know, since originally one of the first Tarutaru WAR on my server :) The only thing I agree on is PUP and DNC. But then again, I left a few months after they got released, and just could never get back in.
i remember the struggles with thf or /thf when the setup failed and the sata was not done propperly or had gotten killed. i also knew a few thf's that would " accidently sata the healer , or sata some one that they weren't a fan of.
While Mnk always holds a special place in my heart my thf/nin was a total badass. I loved pulling, snk/trk and nothing was cooler than getting that boomerang skill way the hell up and farming for hours by one shotting crawlers for silk.
My BST dominated content @99 before SoA came out. I was able to just farm Abyssea with minimal interactions. Could just send Falcorr, Yuly, or Gerard at a boss, /sit, and come back to loot. Loved taking it to Dynamis too. My list would have been: 5. THF - Top of my list because I actually needed them as a NIN levelling to 75. 4. RNG - too expensive to maintain. 3. SMN - Just a WHM in parties. Otherwise only good for it's Astral Flow 2. MNK - Ask yourself how many of your friends were MNK - you didn't have many until Delve. 1. lolPUP - No explanation needed.
DNC 75 Era was a beast... if you were GOOD at it. It was defiantly one of those jobs you had to prove yourself with. I found success in aiming for pure support let a healer heal but use dancer aoe heal to negate mob aoe's, and top ups between fights along with covering healers resting. Once you got into a grove you'd have almost no down time. Always be stepping and for gods sakes LEVEL YOUR THROWING!, being able to semi-reliably land a frisbee throw on incoming pulls was a solid TP boost. You needed to merit in Saber Dance, Fan Dance and max out Haste Samba. I loved dancer, and having recently returned to FFXI. I've been avoiding it because I know once I start I wont be able to stop. It was the only job I got to 99 before I quit. Overall though in 75 days I would put Dancer over Samurai on the list (sam isn't even on the list). Sam has this brutal period around 35-40 where its just kind of useless since its weapon skills drop off. It's was like Oh.. theirs literally no one else available guess well take the Sam that's LFG. Then once you get around 50 and unlock Jinpu and more tp+ gear starts to become available then its like "Oh yeah.. get the SAM... get the SAM".
you forgot the fact that the update to try and fix people from training mobs for Mass Player Kills also effectively broke the charm/release thing and that until they started fixing Jug Pets that BST was an unplayable mess.
I never had an issue with Dragoons. As a Paladin party leader, when i was scouting for DDs and all the Sams and Wars would be taken, i snagged many a Dragoon and PentaThrust was deadly.
I loved pup. I parsed equal to most dd in merit parties, could main heal when the whm left. Then swap to boom mode to join the blms in dynamis. I couldn't sleepga, but I could spam tier five nukes with no downtime.
Back in the 75 levelcap days, i played thf/bst and duo'd optical hat with another bst/whm. I saw complete linkshells fail on that, but duo bst could pull it off
A suggestion; Top 5 Most CHANGED/Altered Jobs. What jobs got the most additions, alterations, buffs and nerfs over the course of the games history. Starting with original launch, to "peak" 75 cap to now. And don't forget to put NIN at the top of that list lol
Nin wasnt altered much in the 75 era, people just figured out how usefull its abilitys/spells were. What changed the meta was some nerfes to Nin and the 2Hand update that made SAM a god The biggest changes got PLD SCH, PLD tanking back then without how archaic shield blocks worked... you had to sub NIN as a PLD!!!! well it didnt matter much because the meta switched towards melee tanking anyway! (as in NIN/DRK tanking)
When I first leveled thf through Valkurm (pre-CoP days) I subbed mnk, used fist weapons, and relied on Sneak Attack -> Combo. Lower HtH skill cap at that level was negligible and SA Combo tore through enemies to the point where if it didn't die I was tanking the rest of the fight. Switched to swords once I could dual wield with /nin and went with that until Viper Bite. ...Of course that only worked because I'd already leveled daggers on Rdm (my main) so I didn't have to worry about skill level. Because yeah... Wasp Sting hit like a wet noodle back then. And what even were we leveling thf for??? Treasure Hunter, oh and to suicide pull in Dynamis... yay. Definitely a 'bad' job that had some brilliant moments.
Summoner back then your Bp for attack and defensive was tied, normally if u got a lvling party u had to sacrifice your dps to use BP's for healing. Once they split summoner BP's off to Rage and Ward its use got very good. During 75 cap days though id would have put Summoner over Dnc on this list simply because unless group that u got thought u could keep up solo healing with Cure III or had friends, you prolly found yourself soloing bombs and praying they blew themselves up to get exp from Carbuncle Tp feeding. (It was looked at as a last resort Rdm/Whm replacement IF they couldn't find one after like an hour of looking....)
I had all the solo jobs leveled. And also me and my best friend had all the best duo and low man jobs leveled like duo bst, nin brd whm rdm thf and so on. We also had some of the best gear in the game I had kclub and he had mythic and great gear. I have to say I got sooooo much use out of smn. I used it consistently all the time. And holy shit later on when Abyssea came out smn was insane with the damage reduction atma's stacking or however that worked. You could literally solo/duo basically anything in Abyssea with 1-2 smn for the most part lol. Then there was that level 30 smn 2hr leveling thing in the tunnel and smn's alexander 2hr that was used for many events. Smn was also great on many nm's due to it's fairly reliable huge spike damage with zero hate and no tp feeding on the nm or resist issues to really worry about. pup drg thf dnc was basically a joke for long periods they were around. Bst is kinda hard to talk about or include because it was always it's own unique thing in the game honestly.
(4/7/2020) My main was BST for years. Working over night at the time, forced to play during Japanese prime time, I missed out on a lot of parties with my 15 other RL friends who played the game with me. I always got teased for it. My friends calling me "Fuggin' Beastmaster" lul. Even though it was basically worthless in a party by comparison (during the ToAH prime). I prided myself on being able to solo mostly what I wanted, whenever I wanted. Chaining Colibri's just as fast or faster than a regular party. I also bought the best level 40 gear I could find so I could farm Codex's in the Phomiuna Aqueducts, easily making a million gil a day. Because at the time they sold instantly, and went for 50k a pop. MAN I miss those good old days...
I gotta say that I disagree with most of your list, but I mostly played 75 era content. BST wasn't a wanted job for endgame content, but BST community knew that, and they had huge advantages in the content they enjoyed. Thf was a powerhouse for low manning things, and could solo incredibly well as thf/nin. Dnc/nin was another "not good for endgame, but excellent at low man content" type job. I would say my version of the list was: - Drg - after the ws tp nerf it was a 2nd class citizen. It missed the dual wield era because bad skill ratings outside of polearm, and it was the bottom of the barrel in the 2 hand era unless you were fighting something weak to piercing - Smn - the job wasn't never really very good, and it was flat out terribad when it only had the single blood pact timer. - Pup - the attachments were rare and/or hard to get, and it took years for them to add useful ones. The master had a really bad hand to hand rating (b- I think) which meant it was at a pretty severe deficit in attack and accuracy, which it couldn't make up with food and gear. This job was bottom of the barrel in group content, and it struggled in solo content. - Sch - it had an identity crisis. It lacked haste so it was a bad healer, and blm was much better at nuking. The game didn't reward swapping between arts, and swapping between addendums was strictly terrible. Better to bring a whm or a blm. The best it could be is a weather whore. - Cor - it was like bard, which made it really good, except it lacked haste, which made it really bad. It was too RNG based, and the gun was underwhelming for the cost if you were trying to add damage. It was completely bodied by bard as a consistent buffer.
I find this list entertaining, and especially like the caveat of "it's ridiculous, why are you still watching this?" Though, for experience sake, I feel I need to speak up for pup. True enough, pup has been turned into a massive powerhouse. I returned to the game about two months ago after leaving right after the release of WotG and I still can't get over how much love pup's gotten. It's insane. I'm just at 125 JP and Comedie is friggin immortal while tanking, unless I'm ignoring him too much on Apex Efts while chatting in ls or tabbing out and poison ticks him down after about 20 fights lol. That being said, I'm aware of how they've boosted both the pup and the automaton. No more C rank H2H, better attachments, etc. I'd say the biggest boost is, honestly, more people are just starting to understand the job. Back during it's release, strategies and information were a more valuable currency than gil. You had people joining LS on mules just to learn their secrets and give to their LS. Not many understood pup and those that did, kept it secret because it was just MONSTROUS. I was a taru then (started fresh as an elvaan on return. Ramuh Server forever! lol) and I'd had some reputation as being a solid DD in melee from my drg, mnk and sam. So people gave me a chance or responded when I was making parties. The trick to pup was adjusting for the situation and the party, not the other way around. The Valoredge frame fell short because, even now, it's a tank that can't be directly healed consistently. Bad for business. The raw dmg the Sharpshot was putting out from Accruballista and Daze (with that awesome stun on Daze) was amazing on anything resistant to piercing. In that colibri era, it would pull dmg off even a pld. All it took was doing a pet tp check in echo, then if it had enough, pop the macro letting people know it was about to WS soon. Bam it went off, got SC'd with, or they waited and did their own. The biggest draw for it, in my experience anyway, was the severe lack of healers in those days. SMN had become fed up with being a gimped healer. I was one and I actually healed through avatars more than /whm lol. RDM were becoming more defined in their roles and competing with rising supports. Then, with the three new jobs all being DD, there were even more of them out lfp. Doesn't matter to me though. I stay PUP/WAR. Setup the SoulSoother. Boom, get a tank and 4 DD, OR, myself as tank, get SATA'd by a THF and just get 5 DD. Not only was it more killing power than usual, if you knew how to position your auto, and it stayed back, or if you were on the Puks/Colibri, it wasn't really taking dmg (Shock Absorbers ftw) so whenever it DID run out mp? "Hold on guys, I have to rest for mp." Deactivate. Activate. "Okay. I'm good pull." They were always surprised at first, some hesitant, but I made friends after every party. 60-75 was a breeze. Merits even moreso. My understanding of the job then has made me all the better now, with me doing stuff even mastered PUPs are amazed by, not thinking it'd be possible for me.
1. BST, 2. SMN, 3. RUN, 4. DNC, 5. DRG - even as a DRG main, I can 100% say it's the overall worst of the dedicated DD jobs. So, let's go over these. BST - Next to no viability against VT/IT mobs for the majority of the game's lifespan. Needlessly expensive. Straight up worse than a WAR or DRK in almost every endgame scenario. Worse than SMN and PUP for the few scenarios it was otherwise viable for. SMN. While it's gained some decent viability in recent days, it's still BY FAR the most railroaded job in the game. Nothing benefits them. Half the time you were just a worse rdm healer. RUN - So, hear me out here. PLD is the better tank for pretty much all content. So.... why does RUN exist? - I consider RUN a "bad" job simply because it has literally no reason to exist. It's supposed to be a magic tank, but there's almost no content that ACTUALLY does exclusively magic damage, and even IF there was, PLD STILL competes with it. Like, WHY does RUN exist? PLD can even DD! DNC - SImilar to RUN, DNC is just... overall worse than the other options. It's an AMAZING sub job, but as a main, it just feels like they released thf 2.0 without TH. I legit don't actually remember even once having a DNC in an endgame event until well into 119 when I ended up in a static with a mythic dnc. DRG - ...yeah. Life-long DRG main, and while yeah, EVERY update pretty much buffed DRG, the fact it's only NOW arguably a top-tier job is uh... yeah. - Yes, Drakesbane gave it a short period of amazingness. But it really wasn't until Trishula that DRG started becoming amazing. Honorable mention: Monk. While often great, it's just as often been so broken by game mechanics it's utterly useless. It went from arguably the most broken DD in the game (relic knuckles asuran fists) to one of the worst DDs, to one of the best tanks, to one of the worst jobs, to one of the best DDs, to... yeah. Whether or not MNK is at all useful is entirely dependent on when you play MNK.
THF? Hey man..... as a 75PLD I absolutely adored them. So I leveled mine to 75 and realized (I had that ultra rare Attowha Chasm that I can never remember the name of) that when it came to soloing in Al'Taieu, it was a no brainer. It was the easiest way to get all that ultra expensive armor in Al Zhabi. My Warrior, Dark Knight, and PLD were tricked out so easily because my THF could completely own almost everything in Al'Taieu, aside from the jellyfish (Yovra?) things.
Unless you played near release you'd never know the fun of THF trick attack .. you use to be able to use trick attack on non party members .. which was useful when fighting for mobs in qufim and some party's healer was afk or resting 👍
I miss those days. Launch FFXI trolling was on a whole other level than pretty much any other game ever. BST just killing everyone in-zone, thf TAing your mobs onto enemy parties, ah... and then the ridiculousness of relic knuckles asuran fists mnk. (999 delay tp gain with full tp returns per ws hit... yeah.)
Hmm, you neglected to mention that DRG was insanely strong in the early days of FF11 prior to the mutli-hit WS nerf, when Penta Thrust would return nearly enough TP to fire it again. Yes both Warrior and Samurai could use it decently as well, but DRG's A+ ranking meant they got it earlier and had much more accuracy and attack with it. I still think one of the biggest crimes SE ever pulled on DRG was not allowing it to wear the Haubergeon or other similar plate armors - SERIOUSLY WHAT THE FUCK?! DRG could use heavy armor just fine in FF3 (11 was based heavily on 1-3) could use most of the heavy armors in 5, and Kain could wear crystal armor in 4 the same as Cecil so really, wtf? I love 11 dearly, it'll always be my favorite and I doubt SE will ever recapture that magic (especially with Tanaka gone) but there are still so many things I wish they'd done differently. If only they could take 11 and modernize it a bit - take the good parts of 14 and apply it to 11's systems. Sadly, we nearly had that with 1.17~1.21 but then YP decided to throw that out the window with 2.0 ... EDIT: Also what about the era of lolDRK or lolRNG? I mean RNG was basically unplayable for nearly 3 years.
that's a great point, one of the biggest failures (i.e. this video is stupid haha) of this vid was that I'm trying to rank jobs over the entire lifespan of FFXI. I almost consider that entire era to be a bug in how tp worked because that change so drastically affected any multi hit weapon skill. But dude you nailed it with the gear. I TOTALLY failed to properly convey that part of the issue wasn't even in the jobs strengths with omgDaBestGear but just what was available. DRG not having hauby access? THFs having like no pants at all available? Then you get jobs like WAR that can wear absolutely everything. Just made certain jobs way easier to get to "sort of above average" output, and jobs like THF or DRG would have to spend as much as possible just to catch up. Haha I struggled with DRK and RNG, because both had periods of utter uselessness, and omg they're amazing. I probably should have just gone through every job in the game and gone through some of the ups and downs haha, breaking it down to 5 was dumb
Like it just seriously never made a lick of sense to me that NINJA, THE GODDAMN SNEAKY STEALTH JOB, could wear a haubergeon but a Dragon KNIGHT couldn't - OK then SE, whatevs. I miss 11, I quit it after the 95 cap raise because Voidwatch just really put me off something fierce after loving Abyssea to tears (mainly they ramped the grind right back up to unreasonable levels, Abyssea was the one and only break in my 9.5 years of playing where it felt like the game even tried to respect player time investment). Also 14 was just starting to get good, with Yoshida adding in the job system it was feeling like an evolved FF11 (which he promptly threw right out the window with 2.0.... I know 14 is going strong but I liked where it was near the end of 1.0 better sue me.). That reminds me though, speaking of the multi-hit nerf that's also what crippled DRK for a good while, since pre-nerf Guillotine was just obscene. I mean it was still a strong WS for a very long time but it was even crazier prior to the nerf, ans MNK was practically a GOD with Asuran Fists. I miss 11 ; ; (oh that reminds me, did you know that elemental magic used to not be resisted at all? I think they changed that just prior to NA release, so we never got to try out BLM in its full glory)
At first I was outraged that thf was 2 on your list, but then.. yea.. yea youre right. THF was my first 75, loooove that job. But youre right. It was burst dps that relied on situational placement that nooo one wanted to do. I wish SE would have balanced its dps better, or gave us ways to setup a decoy to sneak attack the decoy kind of like how assassin did later where you could separate sa and ta. idk, It was such a strange job. It was so RA focused but its RA stats were garbage.. And before Viper bite it was better to either use h2h or swords.
I guess I am a masochist haha. I originally went THF... I solod a lot as THF/NIN in the 20-30s haha. Got pretty good in parties though and that was fun. I was only about 52 when PUP released. Switched to that. First job to 75... solo'd all the way. Loved when DNC released also. PUP/DNC solo was actually super strong. I stopped playing before I really got to any party required kind of stuff though. Now back for the 20th... Still love PUP. :)
Randomly found this. Glad I did. I stopped playing FF11 in the middle of Aht Urghan, and still have fond memories. MNK was my first job that I just enjoyed and loved. :p
I remember when DRG got TP replenished from penta thrust. It was a damage BEAST.. (Jump>hit > hit > high jump penta thrust. Jump hit penta thrust. High jump hit penta thrust ) it was a never ending pents storm lol but then we got nerfed shortly after drg release..
I just don't agree that DNC should be judged as if it's a main healer when it clearly isn't meant to be a main healer. It's definitely a support. Like, yes, it does have the Waltzes. Waltzes were held back by the atrocious CDs for a heal and the shared CD they all had, even between AoE, ST, and status removal. They aren't shared now, but they used to fall under the same umbrella that is "waltzes". All of it led to being unable to main heal. DNC also has a provoke, doesn't really seem like an ability a main healer would have to me.
I disagree on the thief job being one of the worst, in fact its one of the only melee classes that is required at end game to get treasure hunter, the reason you couldn't get parties as one is because everyone had to level a thief at one point because of this game's need for farming unless you could make money with crafting, but most people farmed monsters so everyone had thief leveled, also it was one of the best pullers in the game, bard being the best, having flee and hide if they messed up a pull. Yea it sucked before level 15 and then before Viper Bite but then eventually if you partied with a Samurai or Dragoon, you could close Light Skillchain on the tank with trick attack Shark Bite which made their job much easier and the healers. In general, end game was all about mages, some tank classes, and a thief, any other classes were pretty much useless.
I quit FFXI a couple months ago, but I was a PUP main. PUP is far from a worthless job, and before I left, PUP was gaining in popularity big time primarily as a tank job using the Valoredge frame. My Automaton easily tanked some of the biggest endgame NMs in the game before I hung up the Animator for good. The ONLY reason why PUP is considered the worst job in FFXI is because the majority of the playerbase either didn't have the proper intelligence level to play it, or they didn't have the patience to skill up the Automaton.
Probably the one job that were in everyone’s top 3 best job of all time was Samurai. It looked cool, kicked ass and it’s strength were flashy weapon skills.
When I started playing a long time ago, Mnk was a god and everyone liked him and thought he had the coolest 2 hour. It's sad since here I am playing MHW thinking back on some of the good things about FFXI.
Even in Abyssea, MNK was incredible. He became the tank of choice and a MNK + WHM could duo anything and everything at 99. Post-99 on the other hand... Glad I didn't actually go for MNK emp in the end.
james conklin yeah it's sad. Not really because there is anything wrong with the job is just H2H weapon skills are simply garbage. SE did however completely ruin the ability Boost. It now gives no attack bonus or str+. It simply makes your delay 3x longer and does a single punch for extra damage and more TP. The sad part is that your better off just never using it. You end up with more TP and more DPS just swinging normally. If you try and use it before you engage it just won't let you attack until it wears off. Really lame SE.
SMN had its fair share of problems in the 75 era. I'm surprised it didn't make the list. In party play, /WHM was the only option as SMN was treated as a weak healer with pets. Perpetuation costs were a drag unless you camped Skikigami Weapon and had a ton of cash to blow on HQ elemental staves, and a shared one minute timer on Ward and Rage Bloodpacts left SMN with few options. I remember trying to solo snolls(?) in Uleguerand Range with our best buddy Carbuncle and having a hell of a time managing the enmity slowly creeping upward with no way to shed it while I patiently waited for them to explode, while repeatedly resummoning Carby in order to reap big XP. I understand it to be in a great position nowadays.
I think you underrate how nice it was to be able to easily solo. This is what I think the worst 5 jobs were (based purely off of 75 cap content): 5 corsair - kinda like a bard, except it never had access to a relic horn or elegy 4 monk - Unless you knew you were fighting bones there were other, better choices. 3 scholar - not good at being white mages, and lacked the tools of a blackmage. Their unique spells were meh until the 2 hour rework. 2 summoner - no place in standard endgame, and before summoner burning tunnel they were reduced to playing like fake white mages. 1 Pup - pup really struggled with gear and attachments at 75 Beasts were really good for certain content, and could duo/trio things that would otherwise require a full party+.
sch had great magic dps output with helix, and low cost of spells with inflated damage due to the 30%+ extra damage from weather bonuses. Sch could keep up damage without having to worry about mp management unlike blm, frankly was better aside from not having stun much of the time.
I don't think thf belongs here. Sure it was one of the weaker DD's, but it was the most versatile and soloable DD, and Treasure Hunter was very desirable in so many situations. It was the nr 1 farming job and very useful in most situations. Your party had to adjust a bit, and thf just didn't mesh well with certain jobs, but I had a good experience with them with my sam. I would add Summoner. They were pretty much always subpar, except for very situational stuff. Maybe Corsair as well. They always seemed underwhelming to me. Dark Knight also had issues with TP gain and hate gain, with their slow chunky hits and high dmg ws's, and they would often get killed because of their buffs that gave -defense. But I don't really think any of the DD's were bad per se. In my experience, skill and gear and was more important. Remember Ranger before the range nerf? They were absolutely insane.
Pup 75 was amazing but that depend on the player. I always brought pup to dynamas to nuke and everyone was surprised how effective it was. Pup can heal quite effective in small group /whm and there were so many things they can do like assaults and using pet to do dirty trick to save your ass etc. 75 bst was really lonely man job. BST needs a big group them to do some cool things with like Hakutaku pet style etc. and they were one of the few jobs that could solo or duo Up in Arms. There are per LS back then and it was a blast. That why I love 75 era where people did amazing things you would not know
I dunno, thf was heavily gear dependent which is why I agree with you when you put thf on a worst jobs list but really if you had the gear you could keep up with DDs in the traditional role, tank just as well (if not sometimes better) than ninjas, and could pull off some cool solo's as well. For instance, I soloed Serket at 75 cap (ok so I used my npc too sue me XD), tanked Simurgh for my Strider boots and Kreutzet for my sirocco kukri with only a rdm friend assisting me etc. I can't even tell you how many people said to me "thf is bad" or something along those lines only for them to follow up later with a "i didn't know thf could do that" when all things were said and done over the course of the 8 years I played this game with thf as my only 75. I left the game shortly before they rose the level cap to 99 and I often wonder what even cooler things I could have done with thf at 99 but I suppose I'll never know.
Drg was so op at bird camp. Did a lot of pt's where we ran 6 drgs. 5 of them where drg/sam and 1 was drg/rdm or drg/blu. granted the healer drg had to have the proper gear. need ares body for refresh then swap a low hp and max hp set to trick the system in to thinking your hp was low enough to fire off healing breath. We would have to always pull birds from the lower camp because respawn times where not fast enough. granted this is after 2 hander up date and everyone needed Drakesbane. aww the glory days. I always wished I would of got Valkyrie's Fork but we didn't get that many to drop at all
at 119 there is some severe balancing issues. Crap jobs are MNK THF DRG DRK PUP RNG DNC (mostly because they either act like a crappy version of SAM or pale in comparison to a similar job) They are still playable however. Only 1 job i would consider to be OP and thats BLU. By far the best solo job (40k+AoE) and still amazing in parties for 119+ content being that you can make your own SC's (most jobs can do this) but also do a powerful MB off them.The 119 meta is making SC's and MB. No other job compares to the damage output from a well geared and mastered BLU. They just excel at too much of everything. Great DD magic and melee. Great Healers, Great Tanks. They are the only job to be excellent at the entire trinity of how mmorpg roles are built upon. (I realize they can't be all of those things at once because of the whole setting spells mechanic) The rest of the jobs not mentioned do catch up to BLU somewhat when Mastered and with a Ultimate Weapon of some kind but still no other job is so good at everything the game has to offer. BLU does need a hard Nerf or buffing to most of the other jobs.
I think this has been my Favorite Video you have done. So true about all of it. I think guys like us are just attracted to the "underdog job", but with knowledge and tenacity, those jobs ended up being so unique and fun.
mhm, that list is very situational depending on when you've actually played.it also depends on the level range and type of enemies you were fighting / grinding.DRG for example was a huge benefit to colibri merit farm parties when ToAU came around and with /whm could hold his own pretty damn well, i often went DRG/WHM when i was solo farming, especially when farming Campaign Battles.THF became a great asset to groups after unlocking Trick Attack and was used in pretty much on any occassion, it was my main class next to NIN and DRK before WotG came out and i started playing DNC more.can't say much about BST pre 99, i only ever encountered them in their solo or duo parties while i was in exp parties, but it became my main with 119 unlock and it's my only job i finished my job points on actually.PUP, i guess i can agree.they had some neat tools to them, but i've neither often encountered them in grind groups nor endgame activities alot. i've been playing FFXI on and off since 2004, i've seen every Job struggle somewhere down the road (besides WHMs during early years), but never saw any of them really getting left out.
Its crazy because everyone would say "dnc broke ffxi" but man thats bs, dnc just wasnt that great. Dont get me wrong, its fun. But its not the game breaking job that everyone used to say it was. However, as a sub for mnk or well anything it was dope af. DNC just feels like ffxi wanted to make an all around jack of all trades, master of non, kind of job, and for that I love it. :D But for most things there is a better option.
I had 75BLM, 75WAR, 75DRK, and 70BST. Looking back on it, I wish I had never leveled BST. The only reason I did was because my adaman hauberk was WAR/DRK/BST and I already had 2 of the 3. BST is what burnt me out and made me rage quit. I loved the main/sub combos DRK/THF, WAR/NIN, and BLM/RDM. Wish I still had that character.
@@cj5273It worked well during the RotZ / CoP era when EXP parties were more balanced and did a proper skillchain with magic burst. Creating a Light skillchain with SATA Spinning Slash behind the tank did a lot of damage and gave the tank a lot of enmity, which allowed the BLM to not get hit after their magic burst. And a lot of BLM's were taru, which have low HP, so it's good to not let them get smacked. Once ToAU came though, that essentially killed the traditional party makeup in favor of min/max burn parties in Baflau/Wojaom. I didn't sub THF in those parties
That comment about Monk not being useful. Wow. Sad to hear it's not gotten better. Monk becoming useless is part of the reason I left the game for FFXIV like a year and a half ago. I was getting tired of basically only being able to come Scholar to things.
It's weird. On FFXI I started THF but moved to MNK pretty quickly and it became my main. On FFXIV I started with Pugilist but moved to Rouge->Ninja and it's my main. I still miss my old FFXI days but I know that the days I long for are long over.
I'm surprised 75 era Summoner didn't make the list. Yeah, Leviathan, Garuda, and Fenrir could deal out massive damage... but only once a minute. ~52 seconds if you had -the absolute best gear-. Great for kiting with Kirin and sky gods, but still really, really niche and not really effective in a party for much more than marginal buffs. Even then you'd be a cure battery, and long summoning times plus the charge for the avatar's ability made it dangerous if you were the main healer (or even backup healer)
If you want to talk about historical relevance with Dancer and Bard, remember that Final Fantasy came out of Dungeons and Dragons. D&D Bards didn't only have to use music/ They could do Oratory or yes, even Dance.
THF was my first and will always be my favorite.. the positional attacking made party THF more interesting. if you were a good THF, you were praised. Unless you were a known THF on the server, you likely didn't get many invites, especially for endgame parties. However I enjoyed THF/NIN for solo farming and THF/RNG for farming certain NMs back before the item drops became EX.
![30 ชั่วโมงคนเดียว บนรถไฟชั้น 3 โซเวียต [Around The World Ep. 2]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/MlE9boAVqDA/mqdefault.jpg)
I have so much love for this game, it was my first MMO when I was like 12 or 13. I remember the Valkurm Dunes, pulling lizards and the occasional Gobby then moving to the Crabs, then finishing at around level 18 with the Pugils, ah man good times.
Haven’t found another MMO as good
@@charlesmathews1633 sadly that's because there are no MMOs that can bring out the feelings this game could.
Yardef Finnagan it had a great community along with the adventure it was the only game I remember playing and being like I’m bored let’s do something and a group of us would go camp a nm or do some bcnms etc etc
@DP enduro same something crazy about that Mog House music could sleep to it
I always thought THF was a really solid job in the 75 cap days. They did pretty good damage, they could pull, and they didn't require much healing. I remember being THF/NIN and feeling so ballin having a scorpion harness and strider boots ha
It was, I even tanked as THF/NIN in caedarva mire exp party.
In the 75 days, it kinda fell off 60+. SATA wasn't unique anymore, tanks could hold hate and the other DD's damage was catching up that the spike dmg didn't keep them above. Even after the nerf, a RNG, and especially a COR, were considered better picks. Then so many classes had methods of pulling.
Don't feel bad. DRG, PUP & SMN have always been my all-time favorites. What bugs me about the DRG bashing is people always consider when things are going horribly. Not bad, but HORRIBLY. Oh no! I can't keep my wyvern alive!! That's like complaining that you cant keep hp above zero. Get good. Also, it was genuinely never a problem for me past Qufim. He even tried to downplay Angon here. Like... wut? Angon led to people looking for drg in particular for merits and end game stuff. Having piercing damage on every auto attack, and putting out big numbers was big. "But what about skeletons?!" But what about the stuff resistant to slashing, blunt or physical as a whole? How often did people really fight a lot of skeletons in 75? KRT was more of a backup camp area. People didn't just rush there. Then the DRG's personal dmg was hitting like the other DD. The wyvern pushed me over, and I was also a taru in the 75 era.
It's just weird that people only look at what can go wrong when trying to downplay a job. I even personally liked THF in the 75 era. Why? My dmg started to fall off as a PUP. Then I realized I could make automaton full heal(yes, as soon as the job came out). So I made parties with a lot of the "leftover" classes. Between evasion, guard and automaton checking me before party members, I was tank, dd and healer all in one, especially against Eruca. A thf/nin could get that SATA on me and we just unleashed. Then I taught my gf how go use it and made a static. I was DRG/BLU, she was PUP/WAR and we had a THF/NIN, RDM/BLM, SAM/WAR, PLD/WAR. RDM weren't getting love back then with brd and cor. Then we didn't need him to be a gimped healer or just refresh battery. He played as a full rdm. PLD were ignored for nin. So he wanted that. SAM was a good buddy. THF could play to her heart's content.
THF pulled. SAM voke. SATA PLD. Enfeebles go flying. THF pull at 50%. I Jump that one and hold it off. Why not SAM? That voke was for SATA setups mid fight. I also had Cocoon to take much less dmg and on demand healing. So I'd fight that one, they finish off the last. If SATA was ready, PLD and THF just moved into position and fired off. If it wasn't, PLD just provoke, I'd shed hate with High and/or Super. Rinse and repeat. Pop a WS to deal with status effects so automaton could keep the Regens and heals flowing. Was good times. Back when I thought Chain 5 was the highest you can go, then we regularly started getting double digits lol.
@@Theinen84 But DRG was boring. Almost all of the useful abilities came from sub jobs. It's a good job if you want to passively play the game because auto attack was DRG's best ability
@@Mortified42 boring is subjective. You could also say the same about MNK, WAR, DRK, SAM, etc.
DRG was designed that way on purpose. It's not a job with a subjob. The subjob completes it. FFXI was great in that all classes were actually unique, not each doing the same thing in different colors. The wyvern, and how you played, changed entirely based on your subjob pick. DRG was the first truly adaptable job of the game. If it was boring and just auto-attacking, it's because you chose to not explore and push the class to its fullest. That issue is with you, not the class.
A note for people watching this in 2024... this video is now six years old and predates the addition of the master levels system and a host of other additions and changes. This video, and others on this channel regarding FFXI, are outdated information. Please refer instead to BGWiki, FFXIClopedia, or FFXIAH for more current information and resources.
I remember soloing BST up to 75 back in the day. It was one of the achievements I was most proud of.
Nowadays if someone moves when I SATA, I just insta disband, same thing when someone asks me to re-sing on Bard after they walked away from me singing.
I remember THF was mostly a big deal during the reign of the NIN tank, that hate management helped them a lot.
Simple answer…. Thief and Dragoon suffered the most….. Thief had spurts when they were wanted…. I don’t understand why Dragoon was so hated….. all the ones I ever played with could definitely hold their own.
Also, i'm surprised that SMN isn't on this list, because MY GOD. like... people saw you as White Mage -1. which was already worse than Red Mage. The range of buffs that your summoned pets gave didn't really impress and were on too high of a cooldown to make up for the sub-par enfeebling and divine skill which the job lacked. I don't even think you got any form of haste at 75. the summoned pet didn't leech EXP, but it DID feed the mobs TP with it's mostly ineffectual attacks and the occasional offensive blood pact from Garuda.
Which left... Soloing. the most ass-backwards soloing. using Carbuncle to kite shit around all day soloing. the window of stuff you could solo with your pet was INCREDIBLY small because the Summoner attached to the pet was useless. sure, you could build up some TP and maybe spirit taker some MP back, but like... then what?!? it's not like you could use that MP to heal your pet. it was just more fuel for their costly blood pacts or perpetuation costs. No, you had to sit there and kite mobs and let a cheap avatar like Carbuncle feed certain things TP until they'd kill themselves. you'd never participate in fights because you didn't want your resummoned pet to have to take Emnity off of you like... ever, so what you were left with was summoning Carbuncle and running away to a spot where you have enough room to resummon and let carbuncle get hate again, but close enough to where you're still in range to get EXP when the bomb or bee you're fighting eventually self-destructs from all the TP you've fed them.
Missions ironically are where Summoner probably shined the most, given it's 'backup healer but also half decent DD that doesn't have to stand in AoE range' status. particularly, things that would do charm/like things or do something funky to player characters were the ideal applications for Summoner's very disposable pets.
Obviously, people towards the end of 75 era discovered those SMN Burn level synch parties where you'd blow your load with a bunch of 2 hrs on every mob in a zone and rake in a booty load of EXP and some really fringe cases where SMN was good, but... uugh. :C I loved the job and all it's quirkiness, but it felt like the community just lacked the imagination to see SMN for what it was worth.I know 99 era brought with it essentially the abolishment of Avatar perpetuation costs and insane levels of refresh in Abyssea to kite stuff all the live long day, but I kinda was sickened by how much the game changed and stopped playing.
at 119+ SMN is regarded as one of the best endgame jobs. 2 smn can make light SC from avatars and MB their own SC for insane damage. 119+ content 3 jobs really stand out. BLU SMN BLM. They take all the rest of the jobs along for the ride.
shperax well. Shame I stopped before that became the reality of the game.
Some HNMs were only possible with SMNs (i.e tiamat, jormungand, etc.) You needed a lot of SMNs in an HNMls, just like you did BLMs.
I remember once leveling out in the mire at 70; had this entire party screaming at me because I would let Garuda out to Predator Claws every other mob. Said it was taking away from my healing MP, even though my MP was never an issue lol people really hated the idea of SMN being anything other than a heal-bot back then. Disgusting to see how much it's soloing the game now.
Even at 75 cap SMN is one of the best jobs. Spike damage with 0 enmity and insane support abilities.
Hell, Rolling Thunder alone can do more damage than even the strongest DD's if you have a couple dual wielders in the party. End game it also shines in the HNM scene and it is bar none the best job for missions and it can solo like a boss too.
And today Jan 22 2020 the game still getting 4-6k people logged on daily and they just rolled out a patch to rework most jobs.
more then that
its wild because private 75 era servers are getting like 600-1200 logged in daily as well. I wish SE would make an XI-2 that embodied everything that made classic xi the joy that it was.
I played a THF in '04. The nostalgia is strong.
I mained PUP when it was brand new, and it was my favourite! I remember leveling it, and some monk with parser thought it was funny how I was doing 60% the damage he was doing. I had a parser running too... I asked him how much it said my puppet was doing, because it's the one that does most of the damage. He got quiet. Overall, because he wasn't adding them together, I was doing 1.5x what he was doing.
PUP was always complex, and back in the day most people had no idea how it worked. People regularly didn't even realize when parsers split master damage from the puppet's.
Elmer the pointy's pup videos were so much fun to watch
One thing that THF was sold short on frequently was its strengths in some mission battlefields. Pre-ToAU, THF had one of the highest survivability ratings in the game. I used an EVA/RACC build on CoP 2-5 Mammets. My job was to keep 1 mammet occupied while the party managed the other two. Well, "keep distracted" meant soloing the hell out of it with bloody bolts and leaving it at 10% by the time the other two went down.
I played PUP at 75 back in the day and it was a soloing monster. Sub PLD for Flash and you and your automaton could trade off flashes and almost never be hit. You could combine the Valor body with the Harlequin head (or was it the valor head and the harlequin body? its been a while) for a tanking automaton that could still heal. Equip the provoke attachment, have a healthy supply of healing oils for your automaton, and you were basically invincible.
I had an echo macro that would show me my automaton's TP () and I would use that to help skillchain with party members. You could leave the automaton out of the engagement until you were ready to skillchain, as long as you weren't waiting too long. It was an extra layer of management, but the whole management aspect was what was so appealing about that job in the first place.
sorry but thf with capped archery/markmenship was an absolute godsend in some pts. Acid bolts + sata with a party who could play with the mechanics. I was mnk myself, but seeing professional thfs in action..always was an inspiring thing lol.
*A new private server is coming out in December called HORIZON XI, there's a great dev team working on it (75 cap BUT with expansions) Check out the discord!*
I loved playing THF so much! I remember rocking a sirocco kukri/kraken club setup that was hillllarrious, TP everywhere! Me and a RDM friend could 2-man a lot of content that was definitely not meant for 2. It was a really demanding job in order to play well, but I think that's what made it feel very rewarding, too.
BST was my first 75 with PLD up to 70 at that time. I started leveling it when I didn't have time to lfg for extended time. It was an awesome experience and still a favorite.
Hey, a fellow ex-loldrg here. I do have to say that I think you missed a crucial part about dnc and how they build up tp. My wife mained dnc and with her, it was all about the reverse flourish to get that tp up. If you keep finishing moves on you, you can go into battle with tp. Also, after, I think 3 finishing moves, you'll get a positive gain for tp vs tp spent getting the finishing moves. As per my wife, it's all about managing steps and finishing moves more than hitting to get tp. Lastly, (since my first main was bard to help out my ls), it was my understanding that dnc was made to help with the lack of bards around and the large demand for march, paeon and madrigal (or mambo and ballad). It use to be that I couldn't walk about of my mog house without people asking of I wanted to do dynamis or party or something. After dnc, there were less of those.
lastly, I actually solo'ed drg from 50 to 75 (finished it when TOAU came out. Took a long time). before drachen armet, soloing wasn't too had if you understood that there's a lag between you casting, the cast going off and the pet wyvern casting. What I did was I got a good average of what the mob in dmg per hit. Before the mob hit that would bring me below a certain HP (1/3 since I /whm in those days) I would start casting the spell. The check for wyvern using healing breath only happens when the spell goes off. So I start casting, I get hit, hp goes to < 1/3, spell goes off, I get healed. Can it get hairy sometimes? Yes, but you're generally good if you know what you're doing.
On second thought, people also thought I was a masochist because I would have 30~45 min solo fights with abyssea ironclads and Hrosshvalur when I was level 90.
Maybe the game has changed since I left, but I played pre-75 break up to 99 cap. Took a break and came back for 119 gear stuffs era...many many many jobs 99/full merit/cap pts etc...DNC was my main and I consistently was a top DPS in my EGLS. Have 95 Ukon and everything...still cant touch a beast DNC. DNC was one of, what, one of three or so jobs that can both solo light and dark SC? On top of full healing...and debuffing, and healing and tanking.
#galkadnc4lyfe
Lvling DRG and also at lvl75 I macroed in HP gear to cast my spell so I could have my wyvern cast when I actually had higher HP than I did with my normal gear on, following that I macroed in Wyvern HP and the Relic Helm to increase the amount they healed. I also went /BLU for Cocoon....that DEF.... and for head butt as it was a quick cast.
I also did DNC and it was a powerful job for those who knew how to play it, but not many people actually figured out it's role since it wasn't really ever clearly defined. I could solo Darkness spam extremely easy, and at times you could do 3 WS's in a row.
Ahh yes, the end game macros. And that wyrm armet, good times. Though I always used foot kick when possible to set off healing breath. It has the lowest recast timer and mp cost with the same amount of casting time as head butt. Especially if I'm saving the stun to interrupt casting. Glad to hear from another drg/blu fan. Most people were like "drg/sam or nothing!"
I actually stopped when around the time they introduced item levels. By the time I stopped, I had a ethereal earring, twilight mail and helm.
Yep... at the end I was walking around with auto reraise, auto regen +2, auto refresh and converts taken damage to mp. As long as my wyvern is alive, I could self heal indefinitely... It was around that time I was like "I think I'm satisfied. I think I can quit with no regrets."
sleepingkirby that may have been what I used with head butt to stun stuff. I never leveled DRG past 75. And I used those type of macros before 75 and before 60 :P
Cheerleaders have been around since the days of jousting, everyone has a hype man in their corner, or hype woman. Dancer has relevance to the lore of fighting in general.
Ehhh, I played FFXI during the lvl75 days, and was a THF main... the only true downside of the job was how difficult and long it would take to actually GET an exp party. I never had any issues with playing THF or the positioning (though I was an Elvaan so maybe something about that was easier than your Taru?). Good THFs did good damage, were often great at getting around without aggroing everything in sight, and understood hate/enmity management very well. These were things I took a lot of pride in.
...We were also really useful for Dynamis pulling, as masochistic as being a deathpuller was, lol...
I totally agree, the issue was more with getting other players to go along with THF, the job itself is amazing lol
DNC was actually one of the best jobs for merit parties due to Haste Samba and the fact that you generally couldn't cap delay reduction back then without it.
LordofCicadas dnc was good in a leveling party.. i disagree hard that it’s top in merit back when
Ya I have to disagree about it being one of the best merit party jobs. A healer with haste(preferably rdm for Dia3 when they got it), 3-4 DD, and 1-2 Bard/or 1 Cor with your 1 Bard was was basically best. With relic Bard, and relic/kclub DD you'd be running into killing stuff too fast for even 2 bards to be pulling and I remember having to help pull as rdm or do double/triple pulls on BRD and go all -cast time with that low hp activated minstrels ring. Dnc's haste on the 2 other DD for example wouldn't compensate enough for the loss of damage, especially for 2h DD if I remember correctly. Also for example if you had a RNG or Cor in the group.
I'm sure it was a good alternative when BRDs were few and far in-between, but everyone back in the day focused primarily on BRD + WHM/RDM + SAMx4 for the most optimal meriting.
I kinda had to object to DNC too. I was able to solo stuff like Adamantoise as DNC75/NIN, and Daggers were pretty good on colibri burns back in the day.
I think the biggest problem with a "Worst Jobs" list is player know how. In almost all the jobs you listed, if you were good at that job, you could run circles around other jobs, but getting good was a steep climb. The other problem was perception. The only way I could party on my BST was with others in my ls and even then, not too often. Never got beyond a 75 cap, but during those days, BST was villanized and admired at the same time. Nothing like duoing Xolotl on BST and there was a guy on my server that soloed Byakko on BST. Fun, fun, fun. Then again I watched an RDM solo Byakko, so maybe that last feat isn't as amazing. But, for the video you had to pick 5 jobs and in varying degrees, you're right about the ones you picked, especially PUP and DRG.
The biggest issues with PUP was people didn't understand it, the gear choices made no sense (mage gear?!), and it was a worse MNK for years.
Ya SE didn't offer PUP the opportunity early in, it just handicapped it all over the place
I was a PUP main (and I hope someday they give us a similar version of the class on FFXIV) it was great for getting my school work done though, nothing like smashing out two term papers while waiting 6 hours for a colibri merit party XD. I did my best though and earned a spot in an endgame manaburn linkshell by outnuking some black mages and earning my place. :) Love love love this job.
Danny Healer i was pup main too loved the job myself too.
People didn't understand PUP because many didn't bother learning what the attachments could do and what maneuvers were needed to make the Automaton do what was needed. Back then, people just bum rushed jobs to cap and asked questions later. If it was too complicated for them, they call the job "gimp" and move on.
Worst rep PUP got was that SOOO many people got power-leveled up to 75 in a day or so, did NOT learn a thing about the attachments, and said "omg lolpup" and everyone believed them. So PUP's bad rep was from players who didn't even know how to USE the job. ... while I was soloing Raja in AF3+2 gear just fine on it "back in the day", and still got laughed at as a lolpup.
During the first few years of PUPs release I knew a guy who made his license plate say “LOLPUP”.
I swear I've seen that license plate.
I tune into your vids every once in a while as I used to play ff11 back in the day (granted I was young and a huge noob) I play14 now but love just to see whats going on in 11. You have a great voice and I love your vids!
Pup 75 was my first and only main for a long time. Learned a lot of tricks. Like disengaging 1 hit before 100% tp to get time the limit break for when you want it. Double spells with deactivating/activating on full hp. Agro, deactivate to stun high level mobs while walking by. Bunch of other stuff
Fun video. Had been wondering when you were going to put one like this out since you had made a top 5 jobs video... can't really say i disagree with any points you made. What makes a list like this a tough call, is like you noted already, many of the jobs that were epic fails during the 75 era became some of the most OP jobs in the 119 era, and vice versa; for instance red mage.
i have 2 jobs on this list and have kinda wanted to level another 2. i have THF and BST and love them both. my BST DPS is very comparable to any solo non skillchaining player easly. sadly skillchains and magic bursts take the advantage there. and as for THF. having a job that can make some money or just farm that one stuipid item needed for the quest. is VERY nice to have!
Great video! I wonder what’s your setup for the game to run so smoothly, I’ve heard about the 60 fps thingy, but urs looks even smoother for some reason
Bst was my favorite job. Remembering duo despot while whole alliances got wiped. Bst was hands down most fun job for me. Aso made a killing while leveling in the tree. I had no craft skills. All money was made on my bst either selling Despot drop,Dynamis money, lumber,tree cuttings, moss from goobues, soloing nms for people. Then really made killing soloing nms in Abyssea for Empyrian items.
MR SLEEPS spent days in the tree selling wisteria lumber and saplings also used to farm like 8-10 clusters a time for O Hats and iolites sold well also miss bst best job best part was being in a spot for like 3-5 days and a party show up and tell you to move
a quick comment on 75 Era Beastmaster only parties. I was a member of a Linkshell called "Wolves in Sheepskin'(Seraph server, now merged with Bismark), the only requirement for membership was to have BST unlocked. Members would always be forming BST only parties, running BCNM's, KSNM's, Promy's. Missions, NM farming, even particular crafting material farming. Back before the R/EX version of Peacock Charm was indroduced, 3 BST could easily beat Under Observation BCNM40 with 1 tiger jug, 2 courier carrie, and some biscuits, get a Peacock Charm drop and that was a 333,333 gil per person reward! Even the BCNM20 Wings of Fury could easily be beaten with 3 BST with the hopes an Astral Ring would drop. BST was my first job to 75 and also to 99, it is my favorite job in FFXI. I love the complexity and strategy of the solo combat and the pure insanity of a 3-6 BST only party tearing through a zone leaving nothing in their wake (I'm talking to you Yuhtunga Jungle!)
I think you really downplayed the thief's evasion here...the amount of ludicrous stuff you could survive as thief was unreal.
Seriously, if I'd had a gil for the amount of times I heard "How are you still alive?" I would have been able to fully fund several relic weapons XD
Also I ended up soloing many a NM fight for friends after the rest of the party completely wiped. Was like: *rolls up sleeves* "Time to go to work and show you kids how it's done!" :D
That aside, totally agree...leveling thief sucked early on...though I don't think any other job gave such a rush when soloing.
THF in ff11 in my favorite mmo class of all time ..
thf?? survival?? u kidding?
RoninXDarknight oh man I was thf back in 02 and I feel you mate I can not count the amount of times in sky I was left kiting kirin till the party could recover lmao good times
RoninXDarknight I could tank any thing in abyss back in the day on thf easy.
Me and my friend would duo tons of nm's because of game mechanics like that. Just go Thf/Nin and Brd/whm and use eva songs. Elegys slow and super eva would be crazy strong. But Thf would have issues because of it's lack of subtle blow which made it a bad choice to duo some nm's. Nin/Drk and Brd/whm or Rdm/whm or Whm/Drk would make much more sense. Was pretty nice when bst got a jug pet with high level treasure hunter later on though lol.
Interesting list. Well written! lots of valid points. Gotta leave some DRG shoutouts though!
DRG shoutout 1 of 2
Shoutouts to max HP+ gear in healing breath macro!
It's been years but if I remember correctly I could trigger healing breath at something like 80% max health by having the Armet in the head slot and max HP+ gear in every single other slot. I oughta look it up but off the top of my head i remember things like bomb queen ring, bloodscale mail, cassie earring, some NM gigas bracelets. All that together in your Armet macro made self healing a dream. I'm gonna assume people understand how this works, but if not I'm happy to explain it!
Worst job post Abyssea era was Black Mage. Not because the job itself but because as a Pup/Sch I was able to AoE sleepga, and Black Mages weren't because those gimpy people had no skill, so they were effectively useless until they skilled up. I solo'd my way up on Pup/Dnc and could even kill an IT Colibri in ShadowReign near San d'Oria. Though I had to use my little companion, my puppet, and would just barely survive the encounter and I think get 600 Exp.... but soloing IT mobs? Man talk about epic rush back then.
But most of the time I just went around killing stuff for Koppernickel Ore and getting invited to parties by people who only wanted me to use my Ranged Automaton but I didn't have the skill level for that, because I was too busy using DNC TP and Light Manuevers in order to get heals. FFXI was a crazy game. Stupid esoteric, and entirely 100% reliant on you knowing your job to get the most out of a situation. Pup/Sch was a terrible damage combination, but when lowmanning content being able to cast images on someone, or sleeping mobs you didn't want bothering you... There was just a lot of versatility.
As a DRG back in the day, Penta Thrust was pretty OP and should have stayed OP since DRG was so bad. Before the first nerf you could literally get 90% of your TP back if all 5 of your Penta Thrusts hit.
I never got why people used dagger on THF at low levels when you could just go sword, deal comparable damage per swing, and scale Fast Blade with SA nicely with your Leaping/Bounding boots.
skill ups.
I think bst is one of those you can't really list in any traditional sense. If you wanted time to yourself, didn't have hours to play at a time or wanted something more intimate to play with a close friend or partner it was a real different experience you couldn't get anywhere else (or if you wanted to cheap out a bit and make lots of passive Gil levelling). It's a shame there probably won't be any open world game or MMO like FF11 any more (perhaps when VR is mainstream?).
FF12 had some elements that seemed influenced by 11 for a single player title, but then you have XIV, which, whilst a good MMO, isn't exactly going against the curve or innovating (hopefully in endwalker though) unlike XI.
If I ever get the patience and time to play a private server again I'd probably try BST properly.
A new private server is coming out in December called HORIZON XI, there's a great dev team working on it (75 cap BUT with expansions) Check out the discord!
@@jordanaloken2466 thanks for this, shall check it out in the morning. XIV got boring pretty quickly with Endwalker once the story dry and the endgame dull AF. Nostalgic for a 75 Xi server, especially if it's new!!
Be sure to click the discord link, the team is active on there and are about to do the th dev blog on twitch! Find info n ask your burning questions to the team!
nice video , im looking to get back into this game my self hard getting used to playing on pc when i was so used to playing on console.
Thief was my first love and favorite job of all time, but it sure drew one of the short sticks for most of the 75 era
Being able to farm
#1 for HNM
A really good solo job with /nin high evasion and blood bolts
Good for dynamis pulls
Idk man it could be worse
@Havok @Havok It definitely could have been worse, and you made some good points.
I found their HNM use unfulfilling. Yes, the alliance wanted at least 1 thief to apply TH, but they could have been naked besides armlets and a knife. At least they were wanted though.
Solo-ability was pretty good. Though everything looked poor next to what RDM or BLM could do. Bloody bolts often didnt drain fully (or at all) against high level enemies. And to hit required a lot of Racc gear. I found THF could really shine in a duo or trio.
I cant complain about the farming. Loved having TH for any item hunt.
Anything /nin could pull dynamis. Bard was probably the best (buffs/sleep) THF was good if you had to PD tank a large group for some reason (I didnt do a whole lot of dynamis.)
The reasons why I say it drew a short stick:
Leveling was awful. All DD jobs had a longer party wait, but THF was lumped into the "lol" crowd. And pre 60, I can understand people not wanting to deal with SATA.
This extended to merit parties. Even during ToAU, where most parties targeted flying birds. At least on Phoenix, the hot jobs for merits were the 2handers.
The dagger update was a massive boost to THF DPS (20% or so, a huge increase for xi.) But that was SE finally admitting: "alright, thf is dealing much less damage than intended. It's getting a giant buff."
I don't think it was in demand for any hard missions. Maybe a kite during divine might. CoP did not want THFs. I didnt finish all the ToAU or WotG missions so idk about the hard fights.
Most endgame content that relied on drop rate (admittedly lots) only wanted one THF, and it was only for the TH. At least it had that. Otherwise it would have been in the upper echelons of "lol" jobs.
THF could do a lot in the right hands. But as far as game content went, I resented that the main draw to have a THF was often accomplished by somebody's mule account with 1 dagger and armlets.
Interesting list. Well written! lots of valid points. Gotta leave some DRG shoutouts though!
DRG shoutout 2 of 2
Shoutouts to DRG/mage main heal merit burn parties!
Back in the Aht Urhgan day finding an OPEN camp was half the battle. Best merit parties I can remember were MNK MNK MNK MNK DRG/mage DRG/mage fighting trolls (trolls!) out in Mt Zayolm. There was NEVER anyone out there fighting! While other parties were basically waiting in line and puling Colibris out from under eachother, we were getting the same or better exp/hour on trolls. The MNKs shredded the trolls and the DRGs kept the MNKs in the pink while adding a bit of damage themselves.
I don't remember how I came across this idea. Pretty sure I was recruited by another senior DRG while I was in the DRG's natural state (LFP while soloing). Of course the biggest downside to this PT from then on was that I had to set them all up myself and convince the MNKs (and even the DRGs) that it would work. Almost always the initial reaction was, "seriously?" but once we got out there it was all butter.
I used to TP burn out there on Trolls too, even on Thief, it was pretty good exp, never had to share camps or spawns
i miss this game so much.. used to play it back in 2008 :(
FF 11 will always be my only mmo regret for never playing it. I wish I had from what some friends told me and seeing many retro videos on the game it looked like a true fun experience I wish I could of enjoyed when it was current.
A few private servers exist that attempt to emulate that experience, I like the game so much better now than I did back then though.
Drg was one of my favorite jobs to level... I feel like I was the only person who did this but I remember getting sata'd a lot and using high jump and super jump to reset to the tank... But I feel like no one did that with drg... It was awesome
Former Taru PLD & DRG here.
Loved THF being in the party and always had fun partying with BST. Never really got into stigmas, you know, since originally one of the first Tarutaru WAR on my server :)
The only thing I agree on is PUP and DNC. But then again, I left a few months after they got released, and just could never get back in.
i remember the struggles with thf or /thf when the setup failed and the sata was not done propperly or had gotten killed. i also knew a few thf's that would " accidently sata the healer , or sata some one that they weren't a fan of.
2hr? Back in the day that shit was 24hr lol
While Mnk always holds a special place in my heart my thf/nin was a total badass. I loved pulling, snk/trk and nothing was cooler than getting that boomerang skill way the hell up and farming for hours by one shotting crawlers for silk.
My BST dominated content @99 before SoA came out. I was able to just farm Abyssea with minimal interactions. Could just send Falcorr, Yuly, or Gerard at a boss, /sit, and come back to loot. Loved taking it to Dynamis too.
My list would have been:
5. THF - Top of my list because I actually needed them as a NIN levelling to 75.
4. RNG - too expensive to maintain.
3. SMN - Just a WHM in parties. Otherwise only good for it's Astral Flow
2. MNK - Ask yourself how many of your friends were MNK - you didn't have many until Delve.
1. lolPUP - No explanation needed.
DNC 75 Era was a beast... if you were GOOD at it. It was defiantly one of those jobs you had to prove yourself with. I found success in aiming for pure support let a healer heal but use dancer aoe heal to negate mob aoe's, and top ups between fights along with covering healers resting. Once you got into a grove you'd have almost no down time. Always be stepping and for gods sakes LEVEL YOUR THROWING!, being able to semi-reliably land a frisbee throw on incoming pulls was a solid TP boost. You needed to merit in Saber Dance, Fan Dance and max out Haste Samba.
I loved dancer, and having recently returned to FFXI. I've been avoiding it because I know once I start I wont be able to stop. It was the only job I got to 99 before I quit.
Overall though in 75 days I would put Dancer over Samurai on the list (sam isn't even on the list). Sam has this brutal period around 35-40 where its just kind of useless since its weapon skills drop off. It's was like Oh.. theirs literally no one else available guess well take the Sam that's LFG. Then once you get around 50 and unlock Jinpu and more tp+ gear starts to become available then its like "Oh yeah.. get the SAM... get the SAM".
you forgot the fact that the update to try and fix people from training mobs for Mass Player Kills also effectively broke the charm/release thing and that until they started fixing Jug Pets that BST was an unplayable mess.
mpk ftw in kuftal tunnel! heck yeah.. and that doesn't even take into account screen shaking Guivre behind you!
THFs were make or break for almost all content that needed TH. Which was most content back in the day. I think you nailed the experience of THF.
I never had an issue with Dragoons.
As a Paladin party leader, when i was scouting for DDs and all the Sams and Wars would be taken, i snagged many a Dragoon and PentaThrust was deadly.
I loved pup. I parsed equal to most dd in merit parties, could main heal when the whm left. Then swap to boom mode to join the blms in dynamis. I couldn't sleepga, but I could spam tier five nukes with no downtime.
I am pup main 4 life
Back in the 75 levelcap days, i played thf/bst and duo'd optical hat with another bst/whm. I saw complete linkshells fail on that, but duo bst could pull it off
annnnd you could fight the bst mobs for the harpe and p.harpe :D
Me: looks up thief guide.
H4g: WORST JOBS OF ALL TIME
me: ._. Ok
Lmao that is kinda random
I played thf/nin for years. Was my favorite
A suggestion; Top 5 Most CHANGED/Altered Jobs. What jobs got the most additions, alterations, buffs and nerfs over the course of the games history. Starting with original launch, to "peak" 75 cap to now. And don't forget to put NIN at the top of that list lol
oooooh actually that's a really solid idea, thanks!
Why wouldn't I run into my LS leader here of all places :p
Nin wasnt altered much in the 75 era, people just figured out how usefull its abilitys/spells were. What changed the meta was some nerfes to Nin and the 2Hand update that made SAM a god
The biggest changes got PLD SCH, PLD tanking back then without how archaic shield blocks worked... you had to sub NIN as a PLD!!!! well it didnt matter much because the meta switched towards melee tanking anyway! (as in NIN/DRK tanking)
In total number, probably RNG... For like two years straight, every few weeks RNG got a nerf or patch.
When I first leveled thf through Valkurm (pre-CoP days) I subbed mnk, used fist weapons, and relied on Sneak Attack -> Combo. Lower HtH skill cap at that level was negligible and SA Combo tore through enemies to the point where if it didn't die I was tanking the rest of the fight. Switched to swords once I could dual wield with /nin and went with that until Viper Bite. ...Of course that only worked because I'd already leveled daggers on Rdm (my main) so I didn't have to worry about skill level. Because yeah... Wasp Sting hit like a wet noodle back then. And what even were we leveling thf for??? Treasure Hunter, oh and to suicide pull in Dynamis... yay. Definitely a 'bad' job that had some brilliant moments.
Somewhat surprised SMN didn't make the list. One of my favorite jobs, but I don't think it ever functioned quite the way SE intended.
Haha it almost did, but it was so valuable for end game stuff (even if unusually) and was a solid soloer
MTD lots of ppl preferred smn
Summoner back then your Bp for attack and defensive was tied, normally if u got a lvling party u had to sacrifice your dps to use BP's for healing. Once they split summoner BP's off to Rage and Ward its use got very good. During 75 cap days though id would have put Summoner over Dnc on this list simply because unless group that u got thought u could keep up solo healing with Cure III or had friends, you prolly found yourself soloing bombs and praying they blew themselves up to get exp from Carbuncle Tp feeding. (It was looked at as a last resort Rdm/Whm replacement IF they couldn't find one after like an hour of looking....)
I had all the solo jobs leveled. And also me and my best friend had all the best duo and low man jobs leveled like duo bst, nin brd whm rdm thf and so on. We also had some of the best gear in the game I had kclub and he had mythic and great gear. I have to say I got sooooo much use out of smn. I used it consistently all the time. And holy shit later on when Abyssea came out smn was insane with the damage reduction atma's stacking or however that worked. You could literally solo/duo basically anything in Abyssea with 1-2 smn for the most part lol. Then there was that level 30 smn 2hr leveling thing in the tunnel and smn's alexander 2hr that was used for many events. Smn was also great on many nm's due to it's fairly reliable huge spike damage with zero hate and no tp feeding on the nm or resist issues to really worry about. pup drg thf dnc was basically a joke for long periods they were around. Bst is kinda hard to talk about or include because it was always it's own unique thing in the game honestly.
SAM struggled pretty hard to get parties in the 75 days, despite being able to toss 5 or 6 sidewinders as /RNG.
(4/7/2020) My main was BST for years. Working over night at the time, forced to play during Japanese prime time, I missed out on a lot of parties with my 15 other RL friends who played the game with me. I always got teased for it. My friends calling me "Fuggin' Beastmaster" lul. Even though it was basically worthless in a party by comparison (during the ToAH prime). I prided myself on being able to solo mostly what I wanted, whenever I wanted. Chaining Colibri's just as fast or faster than a regular party. I also bought the best level 40 gear I could find so I could farm Codex's in the Phomiuna Aqueducts, easily making a million gil a day. Because at the time they sold instantly, and went for 50k a pop. MAN I miss those good old days...
I gotta say that I disagree with most of your list, but I mostly played 75 era content. BST wasn't a wanted job for endgame content, but BST community knew that, and they had huge advantages in the content they enjoyed. Thf was a powerhouse for low manning things, and could solo incredibly well as thf/nin. Dnc/nin was another "not good for endgame, but excellent at low man content" type job.
I would say my version of the list was:
- Drg - after the ws tp nerf it was a 2nd class citizen. It missed the dual wield era because bad skill ratings outside of polearm, and it was the bottom of the barrel in the 2 hand era unless you were fighting something weak to piercing
- Smn - the job wasn't never really very good, and it was flat out terribad when it only had the single blood pact timer.
- Pup - the attachments were rare and/or hard to get, and it took years for them to add useful ones. The master had a really bad hand to hand rating (b- I think) which meant it was at a pretty severe deficit in attack and accuracy, which it couldn't make up with food and gear. This job was bottom of the barrel in group content, and it struggled in solo content.
- Sch - it had an identity crisis. It lacked haste so it was a bad healer, and blm was much better at nuking. The game didn't reward swapping between arts, and swapping between addendums was strictly terrible. Better to bring a whm or a blm. The best it could be is a weather whore.
- Cor - it was like bard, which made it really good, except it lacked haste, which made it really bad. It was too RNG based, and the gun was underwhelming for the cost if you were trying to add damage. It was completely bodied by bard as a consistent buffer.
I find this list entertaining, and especially like the caveat of "it's ridiculous, why are you still watching this?"
Though, for experience sake, I feel I need to speak up for pup. True enough, pup has been turned into a massive powerhouse. I returned to the game about two months ago after leaving right after the release of WotG and I still can't get over how much love pup's gotten. It's insane. I'm just at 125 JP and Comedie is friggin immortal while tanking, unless I'm ignoring him too much on Apex Efts while chatting in ls or tabbing out and poison ticks him down after about 20 fights lol.
That being said, I'm aware of how they've boosted both the pup and the automaton. No more C rank H2H, better attachments, etc. I'd say the biggest boost is, honestly, more people are just starting to understand the job. Back during it's release, strategies and information were a more valuable currency than gil. You had people joining LS on mules just to learn their secrets and give to their LS. Not many understood pup and those that did, kept it secret because it was just MONSTROUS. I was a taru then (started fresh as an elvaan on return. Ramuh Server forever! lol) and I'd had some reputation as being a solid DD in melee from my drg, mnk and sam. So people gave me a chance or responded when I was making parties.
The trick to pup was adjusting for the situation and the party, not the other way around. The Valoredge frame fell short because, even now, it's a tank that can't be directly healed consistently. Bad for business. The raw dmg the Sharpshot was putting out from Accruballista and Daze (with that awesome stun on Daze) was amazing on anything resistant to piercing. In that colibri era, it would pull dmg off even a pld. All it took was doing a pet tp check in echo, then if it had enough, pop the macro letting people know it was about to WS soon. Bam it went off, got SC'd with, or they waited and did their own. The biggest draw for it, in my experience anyway, was the severe lack of healers in those days. SMN had become fed up with being a gimped healer. I was one and I actually healed through avatars more than /whm lol. RDM were becoming more defined in their roles and competing with rising supports. Then, with the three new jobs all being DD, there were even more of them out lfp. Doesn't matter to me though. I stay PUP/WAR. Setup the SoulSoother. Boom, get a tank and 4 DD, OR, myself as tank, get SATA'd by a THF and just get 5 DD. Not only was it more killing power than usual, if you knew how to position your auto, and it stayed back, or if you were on the Puks/Colibri, it wasn't really taking dmg (Shock Absorbers ftw) so whenever it DID run out mp? "Hold on guys, I have to rest for mp." Deactivate. Activate. "Okay. I'm good pull." They were always surprised at first, some hesitant, but I made friends after every party. 60-75 was a breeze. Merits even moreso. My understanding of the job then has made me all the better now, with me doing stuff even mastered PUPs are amazed by, not thinking it'd be possible for me.
1. BST, 2. SMN, 3. RUN, 4. DNC, 5. DRG - even as a DRG main, I can 100% say it's the overall worst of the dedicated DD jobs.
So, let's go over these.
BST - Next to no viability against VT/IT mobs for the majority of the game's lifespan. Needlessly expensive. Straight up worse than a WAR or DRK in almost every endgame scenario. Worse than SMN and PUP for the few scenarios it was otherwise viable for.
SMN. While it's gained some decent viability in recent days, it's still BY FAR the most railroaded job in the game. Nothing benefits them. Half the time you were just a worse rdm healer.
RUN - So, hear me out here. PLD is the better tank for pretty much all content. So.... why does RUN exist? - I consider RUN a "bad" job simply because it has literally no reason to exist. It's supposed to be a magic tank, but there's almost no content that ACTUALLY does exclusively magic damage, and even IF there was, PLD STILL competes with it. Like, WHY does RUN exist? PLD can even DD!
DNC - SImilar to RUN, DNC is just... overall worse than the other options. It's an AMAZING sub job, but as a main, it just feels like they released thf 2.0 without TH. I legit don't actually remember even once having a DNC in an endgame event until well into 119 when I ended up in a static with a mythic dnc.
DRG - ...yeah. Life-long DRG main, and while yeah, EVERY update pretty much buffed DRG, the fact it's only NOW arguably a top-tier job is uh... yeah. - Yes, Drakesbane gave it a short period of amazingness. But it really wasn't until Trishula that DRG started becoming amazing.
Honorable mention: Monk. While often great, it's just as often been so broken by game mechanics it's utterly useless.
It went from arguably the most broken DD in the game (relic knuckles asuran fists) to one of the worst DDs, to one of the best tanks, to one of the worst jobs, to one of the best DDs, to... yeah.
Whether or not MNK is at all useful is entirely dependent on when you play MNK.
THF? Hey man..... as a 75PLD I absolutely adored them. So I leveled mine to 75 and realized (I had that ultra rare Attowha Chasm that I can never remember the name of) that when it came to soloing in Al'Taieu, it was a no brainer. It was the easiest way to get all that ultra expensive armor in Al Zhabi. My Warrior, Dark Knight, and PLD were tricked out so easily because my THF could completely own almost everything in Al'Taieu, aside from the jellyfish (Yovra?) things.
I played in CoP. My favorite classes were BST and THF. I played a tarutaru on Ramuh in the linkshell OldFarts
Nice videos. Been playing XI on the Nasomi ToAU era private server and I'm loving it
Unless you played near release you'd never know the fun of THF trick attack .. you use to be able to use trick attack on non party members .. which was useful when fighting for mobs in qufim and some party's healer was afk or resting 👍
I miss those days.
Launch FFXI trolling was on a whole other level than pretty much any other game ever.
BST just killing everyone in-zone, thf TAing your mobs onto enemy parties, ah... and then the ridiculousness of relic knuckles asuran fists mnk. (999 delay tp gain with full tp returns per ws hit... yeah.)
lol you meanie
Ummm also THF/DNC I was mainly a solo /duo player thanks to sub DNC 😅
SAM. I flip out when I can break 10k with Fudo or Shoha. Meanwhile the COR is hitting 20k Savage Blades, and the BLU is hitting 30k CDC's.
Hmm, you neglected to mention that DRG was insanely strong in the early days of FF11 prior to the mutli-hit WS nerf, when Penta Thrust would return nearly enough TP to fire it again. Yes both Warrior and Samurai could use it decently as well, but DRG's A+ ranking meant they got it earlier and had much more accuracy and attack with it. I still think one of the biggest crimes SE ever pulled on DRG was not allowing it to wear the Haubergeon or other similar plate armors - SERIOUSLY WHAT THE FUCK?! DRG could use heavy armor just fine in FF3 (11 was based heavily on 1-3) could use most of the heavy armors in 5, and Kain could wear crystal armor in 4 the same as Cecil so really, wtf? I love 11 dearly, it'll always be my favorite and I doubt SE will ever recapture that magic (especially with Tanaka gone) but there are still so many things I wish they'd done differently. If only they could take 11 and modernize it a bit - take the good parts of 14 and apply it to 11's systems. Sadly, we nearly had that with 1.17~1.21 but then YP decided to throw that out the window with 2.0 ...
EDIT: Also what about the era of lolDRK or lolRNG? I mean RNG was basically unplayable for nearly 3 years.
that's a great point, one of the biggest failures (i.e. this video is stupid haha) of this vid was that I'm trying to rank jobs over the entire lifespan of FFXI.
I almost consider that entire era to be a bug in how tp worked because that change so drastically affected any multi hit weapon skill.
But dude you nailed it with the gear. I TOTALLY failed to properly convey that part of the issue wasn't even in the jobs strengths with omgDaBestGear but just what was available. DRG not having hauby access? THFs having like no pants at all available? Then you get jobs like WAR that can wear absolutely everything.
Just made certain jobs way easier to get to "sort of above average" output, and jobs like THF or DRG would have to spend as much as possible just to catch up.
Haha I struggled with DRK and RNG, because both had periods of utter uselessness, and omg they're amazing. I probably should have just gone through every job in the game and gone through some of the ups and downs haha, breaking it down to 5 was dumb
Like it just seriously never made a lick of sense to me that NINJA, THE GODDAMN SNEAKY STEALTH JOB, could wear a haubergeon but a Dragon KNIGHT couldn't - OK then SE, whatevs. I miss 11, I quit it after the 95 cap raise because Voidwatch just really put me off something fierce after loving Abyssea to tears (mainly they ramped the grind right back up to unreasonable levels, Abyssea was the one and only break in my 9.5 years of playing where it felt like the game even tried to respect player time investment). Also 14 was just starting to get good, with Yoshida adding in the job system it was feeling like an evolved FF11 (which he promptly threw right out the window with 2.0.... I know 14 is going strong but I liked where it was near the end of 1.0 better sue me.). That reminds me though, speaking of the multi-hit nerf that's also what crippled DRK for a good while, since pre-nerf Guillotine was just obscene. I mean it was still a strong WS for a very long time but it was even crazier prior to the nerf, ans MNK was practically a GOD with Asuran Fists. I miss 11 ; ; (oh that reminds me, did you know that elemental magic used to not be resisted at all? I think they changed that just prior to NA release, so we never got to try out BLM in its full glory)
At first I was outraged that thf was 2 on your list, but then.. yea.. yea youre right. THF was my first 75, loooove that job. But youre right. It was burst dps that relied on situational placement that nooo one wanted to do. I wish SE would have balanced its dps better, or gave us ways to setup a decoy to sneak attack the decoy kind of like how assassin did later where you could separate sa and ta. idk, It was such a strange job. It was so RA focused but its RA stats were garbage.. And before Viper bite it was better to either use h2h or swords.
I guess I am a masochist haha. I originally went THF... I solod a lot as THF/NIN in the 20-30s haha. Got pretty good in parties though and that was fun. I was only about 52 when PUP released. Switched to that. First job to 75... solo'd all the way. Loved when DNC released also. PUP/DNC solo was actually super strong. I stopped playing before I really got to any party required kind of stuff though. Now back for the 20th... Still love PUP. :)
Randomly found this. Glad I did. I stopped playing FF11 in the middle of Aht Urghan, and still have fond memories. MNK was my first job that I just enjoyed and loved. :p
I remember when DRG got TP replenished from penta thrust. It was a damage BEAST.. (Jump>hit > hit > high jump penta thrust. Jump hit penta thrust. High jump hit penta thrust ) it was a never ending pents storm lol but then we got nerfed shortly after drg release..
blame mnk for that nerf ;)
I just don't agree that DNC should be judged as if it's a main healer when it clearly isn't meant to be a main healer. It's definitely a support. Like, yes, it does have the Waltzes. Waltzes were held back by the atrocious CDs for a heal and the shared CD they all had, even between AoE, ST, and status removal. They aren't shared now, but they used to fall under the same umbrella that is "waltzes". All of it led to being unable to main heal. DNC also has a provoke, doesn't really seem like an ability a main healer would have to me.
I disagree on the thief job being one of the worst, in fact its one of the only melee classes that is required at end game to get treasure hunter, the reason you couldn't get parties as one is because everyone had to level a thief at one point because of this game's need for farming unless you could make money with crafting, but most people farmed monsters so everyone had thief leveled, also it was one of the best pullers in the game, bard being the best, having flee and hide if they messed up a pull. Yea it sucked before level 15 and then before Viper Bite but then eventually if you partied with a Samurai or Dragoon, you could close Light Skillchain on the tank with trick attack Shark Bite which made their job much easier and the healers. In general, end game was all about mages, some tank classes, and a thief, any other classes were pretty much useless.
I quit FFXI a couple months ago, but I was a PUP main. PUP is far from a worthless job, and before I left, PUP was gaining in popularity big time primarily as a tank job using the Valoredge frame.
My Automaton easily tanked some of the biggest endgame NMs in the game before I hung up the Animator for good.
The ONLY reason why PUP is considered the worst job in FFXI is because the majority of the playerbase either didn't have the proper intelligence level to play it, or they didn't have the patience to skill up the Automaton.
Probably the one job that were in everyone’s top 3 best job of all time was Samurai. It looked cool, kicked ass and it’s strength were flashy weapon skills.
2018 mnk is a pup with no pet....ouch LOL. sad but true
It's a total 180 from the 75 era
When I started playing a long time ago, Mnk was a god and everyone liked him and thought he had the coolest 2 hour. It's sad since here I am playing MHW thinking back on some of the good things about FFXI.
When I stopped playing, MNK was basically a way to run tombs for xp and a way to /NIN and solo Genbu by boosting Chi Blast a lot.
Even in Abyssea, MNK was incredible. He became the tank of choice and a MNK + WHM could duo anything and everything at 99. Post-99 on the other hand... Glad I didn't actually go for MNK emp in the end.
james conklin yeah it's sad. Not really because there is anything wrong with the job is just H2H weapon skills are simply garbage. SE did however completely ruin the ability Boost. It now gives no attack bonus or str+. It simply makes your delay 3x longer and does a single punch for extra damage and more TP. The sad part is that your better off just never using it. You end up with more TP and more DPS just swinging normally. If you try and use it before you engage it just won't let you attack until it wears off. Really lame SE.
SMN had its fair share of problems in the 75 era. I'm surprised it didn't make the list. In party play, /WHM was the only option as SMN was treated as a weak healer with pets. Perpetuation costs were a drag unless you camped Skikigami Weapon and had a ton of cash to blow on HQ elemental staves, and a shared one minute timer on Ward and Rage Bloodpacts left SMN with few options. I remember trying to solo snolls(?) in Uleguerand Range with our best buddy Carbuncle and having a hell of a time managing the enmity slowly creeping upward with no way to shed it while I patiently waited for them to explode, while repeatedly resummoning Carby in order to reap big XP. I understand it to be in a great position nowadays.
I think you underrate how nice it was to be able to easily solo. This is what I think the worst 5 jobs were (based purely off of 75 cap content):
5 corsair - kinda like a bard, except it never had access to a relic horn or elegy
4 monk - Unless you knew you were fighting bones there were other, better choices.
3 scholar - not good at being white mages, and lacked the tools of a blackmage. Their unique spells were meh until the 2 hour rework.
2 summoner - no place in standard endgame, and before summoner burning tunnel they were reduced to playing like fake white mages.
1 Pup - pup really struggled with gear and attachments at 75
Beasts were really good for certain content, and could duo/trio things that would otherwise require a full party+.
sch had great magic dps output with helix, and low cost of spells with inflated damage due to the 30%+ extra damage from weather bonuses. Sch could keep up damage without having to worry about mp management unlike blm, frankly was better aside from not having stun much of the time.
I don't think thf belongs here. Sure it was one of the weaker DD's, but it was the most versatile and soloable DD, and Treasure Hunter was very desirable in so many situations. It was the nr 1 farming job and very useful in most situations. Your party had to adjust a bit, and thf just didn't mesh well with certain jobs, but I had a good experience with them with my sam.
I would add Summoner. They were pretty much always subpar, except for very situational stuff.
Maybe Corsair as well. They always seemed underwhelming to me. Dark Knight also had issues with TP gain and hate gain, with their slow chunky hits and high dmg ws's, and they would often get killed because of their buffs that gave -defense. But I don't really think any of the DD's were bad per se. In my experience, skill and gear and was more important.
Remember Ranger before the range nerf? They were absolutely insane.
Pup 75 was amazing but that depend on the player. I always brought pup to dynamas to nuke and everyone was surprised how effective it was. Pup can heal quite effective in small group /whm and there were so many things they can do like assaults and using pet to do dirty trick to save your ass etc. 75 bst was really lonely man job. BST needs a big group them to do some cool things with like Hakutaku pet style etc. and they were one of the few jobs that could solo or duo Up in Arms. There are per LS back then and it was a blast. That why I love 75 era where people did amazing things you would not know
I dunno, thf was heavily gear dependent which is why I agree with you when you put thf on a worst jobs list but really if you had the gear you could keep up with DDs in the traditional role, tank just as well (if not sometimes better) than ninjas, and could pull off some cool solo's as well. For instance, I soloed Serket at 75 cap (ok so I used my npc too sue me XD), tanked Simurgh for my Strider boots and Kreutzet for my sirocco kukri with only a rdm friend assisting me etc. I can't even tell you how many people said to me "thf is bad" or something along those lines only for them to follow up later with a "i didn't know thf could do that" when all things were said and done over the course of the 8 years I played this game with thf as my only 75. I left the game shortly before they rose the level cap to 99 and I often wonder what even cooler things I could have done with thf at 99 but I suppose I'll never know.
The 50 era meta was the one I never understood - DRG was the best job because of penta-poke giving back to on all 5 hits...
Drg was so op at bird camp. Did a lot of pt's where we ran 6 drgs. 5 of them where drg/sam and 1 was drg/rdm or drg/blu. granted the healer drg had to have the proper gear. need ares body for refresh then swap a low hp and max hp set to trick the system in to thinking your hp was low enough to fire off healing breath.
We would have to always pull birds from the lower camp because respawn times where not fast enough. granted this is after 2 hander up date and everyone needed Drakesbane. aww the glory days. I always wished I would of got Valkyrie's Fork but we didn't get that many to drop at all
at 119 there is some severe balancing issues. Crap jobs are MNK THF DRG DRK PUP RNG DNC (mostly because they either act like a crappy version of SAM or pale in comparison to a similar job) They are still playable however. Only 1 job i would consider to be OP and thats BLU. By far the best solo job (40k+AoE) and still amazing in parties for 119+ content being that you can make your own SC's (most jobs can do this) but also do a powerful MB off them.The 119 meta is making SC's and MB. No other job compares to the damage output from a well geared and mastered BLU. They just excel at too much of everything. Great DD magic and melee. Great Healers, Great Tanks. They are the only job to be excellent at the entire trinity of how mmorpg roles are built upon. (I realize they can't be all of those things at once because of the whole setting spells mechanic) The rest of the jobs not mentioned do catch up to BLU somewhat when Mastered and with a Ultimate Weapon of some kind but still no other job is so good at everything the game has to offer. BLU does need a hard Nerf or buffing to most of the other jobs.
Moral of story ffxi players like simple characters they can figure out and easily put into a party. Complicated characters can’t be bothered with.
I think this has been my Favorite Video you have done. So true about all of it.
I think guys like us are just attracted to the "underdog job", but with knowledge and tenacity, those jobs ended up being so unique and fun.
Dragoons were my last choice to consider when I used to make a party.
There's a reason why "LOLDRG" was a meme for awhile.
Nightweaver1 let’s hope the mobile version delivers and not in a pay to win way like mobius final fantasy
I don't think is the job that is the problem, but a player that plays the job
mhm, that list is very situational depending on when you've actually played.it also depends on the level range and type of enemies you were fighting / grinding.DRG for example was a huge benefit to colibri merit farm parties when ToAU came around and with /whm could hold his own pretty damn well, i often went DRG/WHM when i was solo farming, especially when farming Campaign Battles.THF became a great asset to groups after unlocking Trick Attack and was used in pretty much on any occassion, it was my main class next to NIN and DRK before WotG came out and i started playing DNC more.can't say much about BST pre 99, i only ever encountered them in their solo or duo parties while i was in exp parties, but it became my main with 119 unlock and it's my only job i finished my job points on actually.PUP, i guess i can agree.they had some neat tools to them, but i've neither often encountered them in grind groups nor endgame activities alot.
i've been playing FFXI on and off since 2004, i've seen every Job struggle somewhere down the road (besides WHMs during early years), but never saw any of them really getting left out.
Its crazy because everyone would say "dnc broke ffxi" but man thats bs, dnc just wasnt that great. Dont get me wrong, its fun. But its not the game breaking job that everyone used to say it was. However, as a sub for mnk or well anything it was dope af. DNC just feels like ffxi wanted to make an all around jack of all trades, master of non, kind of job, and for that I love it. :D But for most things there is a better option.
I had 75BLM, 75WAR, 75DRK, and 70BST. Looking back on it, I wish I had never leveled BST. The only reason I did was because my adaman hauberk was WAR/DRK/BST and I already had 2 of the 3. BST is what burnt me out and made me rage quit. I loved the main/sub combos DRK/THF, WAR/NIN, and BLM/RDM. Wish I still had that character.
DRK/THF is a noob combo
@@cj5273It worked well during the RotZ / CoP era when EXP parties were more balanced and did a proper skillchain with magic burst. Creating a Light skillchain with SATA Spinning Slash behind the tank did a lot of damage and gave the tank a lot of enmity, which allowed the BLM to not get hit after their magic burst. And a lot of BLM's were taru, which have low HP, so it's good to not let them get smacked. Once ToAU came though, that essentially killed the traditional party makeup in favor of min/max burn parties in Baflau/Wojaom. I didn't sub THF in those parties
That comment about Monk not being useful. Wow. Sad to hear it's not gotten better. Monk becoming useless is part of the reason I left the game for FFXIV like a year and a half ago. I was getting tired of basically only being able to come Scholar to things.
Ya I hear ya :\ while I was always sad that my MNK was more sought after than PUP at 75, the total reversal wasn't really what I wanted at 99 haha
It's weird. On FFXI I started THF but moved to MNK pretty quickly and it became my main. On FFXIV I started with Pugilist but moved to Rouge->Ninja and it's my main.
I still miss my old FFXI days but I know that the days I long for are long over.
I was curious about class balance at end game. Are all classes just solid by then?
I'm surprised 75 era Summoner didn't make the list. Yeah, Leviathan, Garuda, and Fenrir could deal out massive damage... but only once a minute. ~52 seconds if you had -the absolute best gear-. Great for kiting with Kirin and sky gods, but still really, really niche and not really effective in a party for much more than marginal buffs. Even then you'd be a cure battery, and long summoning times plus the charge for the avatar's ability made it dangerous if you were the main healer (or even backup healer)
Ranger should be #2 lol, Thief is so useful xD.
If you want to talk about historical relevance with Dancer and Bard, remember that Final Fantasy came out of Dungeons and Dragons. D&D Bards didn't only have to use music/ They could do Oratory or yes, even Dance.
THF was my first and will always be my favorite.. the positional attacking made party THF more interesting. if you were a good THF, you were praised. Unless you were a known THF on the server, you likely didn't get many invites, especially for endgame parties. However I enjoyed THF/NIN for solo farming and THF/RNG for farming certain NMs back before the item drops became EX.