Narcissism and Grief with Dr. Ramani and David Kessler + Q&A
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Ordered book!!! You are the GOAT, Dr Ramani! And a huge THANKS also to your amazing team!!! ❤
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Dr Ramani, I want to support you but I can't really splurge on more than 1 copy (or to be caught reading it.) It's OK though, bc when i listen to you read, i feel like it's a session and your helping me personally! Thank you❤ I'm listening right now, and you just told me what topics we are about to explore together. I'm actually crying bc I know I'm going to be stronger after I listen. I wish I could have done matcha and chat with you, but hearing you read the whole book is going to change me, like the last one did, this making me strong and better as a parent. you've Help me get a grip On my sanity because you've helped me understand what Cards i'm playing with. Hopefully by the end of this book I'll be able to walk away from arguments with dignity instead of shame. Thank you for everything you do for me and everyone. We all need you ❤
P😊
My charming narc husband of 33 years passed away, I took care of him during what turned out to be his last 4 months. Right before he got really sick, he decided to “come clean” and tell our family about his transactionship with miss Amanda, (the wh0re of havasu ). So between his news, and him dying, I had to break the bonds, grieve the sham marriage and then the death. I almost didn’t make it, but almost 2 years now and I’m doing great!!!! I did a lot of listening to people like Dr Ramani, and others, found an amazing therapist and rebuilt my life that suits me, gives me pleasure and passion again. I’m free and gratefully so everyday!! To anyone suffering: be your own best friend and help yourself crawl out of the psychological prison. It CAN be done, it is Possible!!!
I'm so happy for you.
@@truthjunkie63 very kind, thank you
Congratulations
Mary Poppins is one of my anti-narcissist heroes: she never explained anything, didn't try to change clueless people, and just kept smiling that self-accepting, confident smile! She knew when to arrive, blew away the competition, and didn't let her caring feelings keep her in relationship when it was time to leave.
Ok, so now I have to go watch that again. I was like 5. What relationship she didn't belong in??? I just remember her and Dick Van Dyke's character having fun.
@justrosy5 At the end, she says it's the parent's job to parent, so she didn't overstay and take their place in the hearts of the children.
@@justrosy5 Enjoy!
“In every job that must be done, there is an element of fun. You find the fun and (snap) the job’s a game. Mary P. 😉🤣
I just quoted this to a good friend yesterday, dealing with a Narc sit. Laughed when I saw this comment!!! 🙌🏼 🤣
My narcissist husband did die, 2 yrs ago. The grief was not that he died, truthfully I good with that. It the crap you find out about after they die. Cheating, stealing money, the lies and all the stuff that comes out. I was releaved!! And moved on very quickly. His narc family cult attacked me, insulted me,questioned my character and integrity which motivated me to sell everything and move away. All was a blessing. And an eye opener. Grief is real, but life is more important to me. To all who have faced this, I pray for you All, and encourage you to move forward. Find you!!❤
My husband died 15 mos ago and the funeral was on our 45th anniversary. I been married to him since I was 17. I don’t know how to find me.
That's a good description all the enablers and people who make excuses for them they are like cult members
Same happened to me. 7 years ago... still in disbeleif... hurts terribly eventhough so much time passed. It's the betrayal....
Narcissists are a lot like computer viruses, as they are emotional viruses. They invade boundaries, hence causing emotional distress. They’re draining to be around, as their negative energy tends to rub off on you. Therefore, it is crucial to protect your well-being by establishing strong boundaries and having a strong support system.
So true. Once they break into your firewall, your system is completely taken over. 😮
Troubke is they know your 'back doors' and infect your mind
Once you refuse to engage defend or explain you will be told that their boundaries are in place against YOU.
@@ArtLoverScotland They scan for your vulnerabilities to find out where to break in. 😨
Well said!
The hardest of any of it is finding the motivation to get up and rebuild my life again. Sometimes it aeems hopeless after having rebuilt so many times before.
TimetoWondee222 I truly understand and feel bad for both of us. 😢
Same for me. It all feels completely pointless.
You can do. As you said, you have accomplished it before each time you will make it again.
God bless you ❤️ 🙏
Yep.. it's heartbreaking and frustrating. I'm starting over.. again.
I'm 49. I'm not going back to any of the toxic people.. including family. The next part of my life will be lived on my terms.
Oh wow me too!! I’ve rebuilt soooo many times from the destruction of my moms narcissism pushing me into wrong decisions , especially marriage to a horrible Narcisst man. But Jesus gives me SO MUCH RELIEF when I go to Him
What an incredible discussion. When we’re in an abusive relationship, often we feel alone, I certainly did. It’s comforting to know that there are truly good people who do care and fully understand the pain and betrayal we experience in narcissistic relationships.
You got that right I. Fill the way you said it one 100% of what you said thanks
Feeling alone especially when siblings say spouse is so kind as he's throwing away my exercise equipment while I'm away 😭😮
Hands down for me,the grief was and still is my number one nightmare
I feel for yhou. I am still in the midst of the grief from all the betrayal
Drains your brain.
Grinds your mind.
Constricts your heart.
Cages your rage.
Bewilders your vision.
And your optimism..
Me too
I agree. It washes over me suddenly with little triggers or reminders. I’ve coined it my cycle of feelings. Happily I return to my center, my base camp and feel happy again. ❤
What you said about seeing clients being insulted and blaming themselves is exactly some of the first things I noticed when I realized I and some of my friends were raised by narcissists
I for one, was almost apologising for living, l always felt 'it' was me...when the reaql abuser or culprit was out there.
I miss and grieve what I thought I had but figured out that love shouldn’t HURT.
I'm blown away by Dr. Ramani's authenticity, strength, willingness to share to, and to provide much needed guidance for very difficult situations.
Yes. I love n appreciate her compassion.
This discussion is great. My mother is a full blown narcissist. I have learned that I absolutely have to limit my time with her. Or I will be sick. I’m almost 70 and have been the bad scapegoat daughter my whole life. Nothing makes her happy, ever. And I realize that she will never love me. My dad is gone, but he enabled her; she finally got him to dislike me also. I’ve been left out of the will, it is all so painful.
Oh, despite what she has told me, i fully expect to be "left out" of her will. After YEARS+YEARS of the BS! So grateful that Dr.Ramani has this website and that she does what she does.
Before I walked away from my narc mother at 27, I told her, “fuck you and your will!” I hope that hurt. I’ve been stalked ever since, and told to “let it go,” but I will never reopen the door! To hell with the bitch!
You're not alone! It's going to happen to me also and I know that there are others in this room who have gone through being "disenfranchised."
You just said exactly what I have done for 50 years - anticipating, knowing what they all need, making my needs small, being very flexible- and the way you said it "throwing your life away in this way" - that's exactly how I feel right now, like I threw my life away. And here I am now at 50 years old, finally seeing all this abuse I have just allowed and I am devastated. How do I recover from this? How do I move my life forward? How do I not be fearful of everyone?
One day at a time. You are still young enough to have many years of joy. Get some therapy and escape from it if at all possible.
If you have the physical ability and good health and financial means get away from these people and never have contact with them again.. get far away ..the farther away you are physically the more you will forget about them
I’d have means if I wasn’t wiretapped
This is so helpful! My dad is the narcissist that I have been caring for the past 14 years and only did so because I dearly loved my mother and promised her I would care for him when she was gone. He has been horrid and manipulative for the past twelve years and now he is finally dying. I feel such relief and will be glad when this is over. I feel guilty for saying that but it is where I am.
You will both be free.
You have nothing to feel guilty about, I understand exactly what u r saying. You are not alone.
When you learn (thanks Dr. Ramani!!) and figure it all out and become educated on the game that was ran on you, it does get better. When you begin to make sense of the, seemingly senseless, you can start to heal. You will go through the shell-shock phase of awakening, you will go through anger, you will go through grief. But in my opinion, you’ll know that you are beginning to heal when the guilt and shame subsides.. Their whole game the entire time was to offload their guilt and shame on to you and have you carry it for them. To me, losing the guilt and shame is key to all.
I sure hope you’re right. I hope it’ll get better.
Thank you I just learned about letting go of shame
On point. It's a tough ride ✌✋
So helpful! Never having time, being too busy, always late. Over committed. Leaving me to pick up the dropped balls they didn't want. Raising their kids, going to social events, and forever on the phone. Never available, but available to strangers, customers. Anyone but me. I was trained by Mom to do this. Help! I need to learn how to take care of me.
Yes you have got to take care of yourself is very important
Know when to forgive yourself
Love yourself! I am learning to do it at 81 after putting everyone first.
God is always there 😊
God bless you ❤️ 🙏
Been there.
#1- the is no law insisting that you answer every phone call.
#2- "No" is a complete sentence.
😊
Omg so true
My late husband was obviously a narcissist. I really didnt see it. That hurts. The husband beforethat was a malignant narcissist. I knew he was an jealous psycho alcoholic but didnt know about narcissism. Before that my parents. Inbetween times siblings and my own daughter.
Since these occasions spanning over 64 years of my life...I met another male narc and didnt last with him. Why? I was so done with punishment. He took me for all i was worth, mentally, psychologically and financially. Meanwhile....after many losses - many homes, much money, a lot of social identity, loss of environments (knowledge, fitting in and sense of locality) self identity, family members - who betrayed me. I am now alone after being made homeless. I was lucky. I was rehoused by the council. I cannot stand it where I am and as soon as I save enough I am moving. I so need to be near the sea, as it calms me.
Do not let your 'life' stop. Keep doing what makes YOU happy for a change. I am 72 now!
Yep! You sure have been through the ringer, they are everywhere and unfortunately for the unwise( before awakening) narcs as cunning as they are sliver in and do what they do best! Destroy everything that is good! Fortunately they are not always successful, and because of the abuse we grow and know what to look out for in following relationships! The best gift my x narc gave me is awareness strength and better strategies for self love, respect, and boundaries. The lesson is golden. The grief is huge but I know Im healing. I salute your positive outlook, may the latter years of your life bring you many new blessings, filled with peace, happiness, and fulfilment in all areas, you deserve it! God bless you ALS❤️🙏🕊
Bless your years ...now for you, and those still who are decent in your life.
Your story resonates, although likely lots of different details.
Amazing how we put up with it , or view that treatment as normal to a degree..
Empathetic people work hard, waiting for the reciprocal, that rarely comes.
I'm.68, life has challenges, I'm not sure how far I got, but my younger daughter is at that phase of having another baby, has a 4 year old..a good husband, who works frequently in the city...so I focus on helping...them. Sadly older daughter estranged..
I aided so many family and dealt with many losses over the years.
But, same as you, My heart is by the Sea.
Fortunately, will live by the sea again this fall.
May you soon have your wee place by the Sea! Its a true balm for the soul! ❤
So much love and respect for your tremendous work ❤
Grief after narcissistic abused is very different than grief after a loved one dies. Also, the abuse often involves several people, compared to a death of one person
Thank you. This is vy true.
Thank you so much. I now feel seen and heard. I am exiled by my adult daughter who admits she is a narcissist and is proud of it. The grief of loosing my only child and grandchildren has been excruciating. Now thanks to you Dr. Ramani and Mr. Kessler clarifying that “It’s Not You” has enlightened my path to healing with vast knowledge. As a sixty nine year old woman that felt useless and alone I now feel like I’m getting the old me back that didn’t take shit off of anyone!!
I missed the book deadline but I did find it on Amazon.
Dr. Ramani I found you two years ago when I was told to get out
of my daughters house at night. God was the divine guide that led me to you. Your videos literally saved my life and sanity.
I can’t say thank you enough. I keep you in my prayers.
Peggy Rider
It's so good to have found Dr. R and this community, it's been a Godsend. I've prayed for my husband for years and it was devastIng to have the veil removed and to see the truth of the matter. However, I'm trusting in The Most High for the healing that I need after a 46 year relationship of pain and confusion. I've left with very little in terms of material resources, and I'm in God's hands now, and I know I'm loved.
Its so sad, sorrowful to lose a child, who is alive, and the grandchildren. Never thought it would happen to me.
Im fortunate i do have younger daughter, and have an hones5, not perfect, relationship with her and am very close to her son. Another on the way.
But the ache is always there for my ekdester and 3 grandchildren, who really needed a grandma!
I just order your book the hard back...I have a difficult time recalling information...so having your book where I know where it is will be great!.
I'm 61 divorced for nearly 6 years and have gone through the trenches for to many years.
I need healing and will be able to turn the pages to freedom of my soul.
Thank you ❤️
Hold in there! Trenches are the correct analogy.
“Don’t go to the hardware store for a loaf of bread”. AlAnon slogan. Lifetime with N. 11 years free/NC divorced. Married in’72. Practicing Gratitude this diagnosis/knowledge is now available. Let there be light!
Excuse me BUT it is fucking INSANE the hell I went through dealing with my narc ex and that I gave birth to our daughter five months ago. The torture I went through tho was exactly what I needed for my growth but I never thought a devil could enter my world and hijack my soul and all for entertainment!!!!! And once I went no contact it was then that I realized that my mother is also a narc!! And it made everything in my life make sense. How growing up I was so lost and depressed never had energy because of the abuse that I had no idea that was going on. We all just thought she was just a negative person but NOOO my joke today is when my mom tries her nasty games with me I call her my abusers name. My pregnancy was hell because she made sure it was. Omfg the storm I went through and had no one to reach out too. You have literally saved my soul shedding light on wtf had been going on!!!
Wow.. you've been through a lot. I swear there is some kind of awakening going on ha
So many people, including me seem to have open eyes suddenly to everyone around them.
It's like getting hit with a train but when you realise who is who EVERYTHING just suddenly makes sense!!!
It's very very hard to go through BUT it is so good for us.
Like you I never had any energy, always over emotional...now I'm onto a few people all of a sudden the last 6 months.
I felt horrible but now I feel so much better.
Present, motivated, more confidence, enough energy for the whole day ha.
You got this awakening just in time for your little one. Protect her at all costs and good luck
I’m not sure what to say about your pain and anger only that my situation was in someway very similar to yours. I am 73 years old, and divorced the narc over 30 years ago.
In the beginning stages of the break up, I realized my mother was a narc. I was so overwhelmed. I had nobody to turn to for support. I had five children by my narcissistic husband. I had no idea what narcissism was never even heard of it until 18 years after my divorce from him .
To this day, I still feel sorrow and loneliness,
despite having overcome so much in my life. The most heartbreaking thing for me was that he didn’t want to change for the sake of my children. He had many opportunities.
I have a sister who passed away a few years ago. She took the brunt of my mother‘s narcissistic abuse. We all got it, but mom dished it out even more to her. My heart still grieves for the pain my mother put her through.
Be thankful that you now see the truth. As painful as it’s going to be, do separate from those who harm you, to protect yourself and your child. It will be intensely lonely, and it will be hard to not fall for someone coming into your life only to do the same to you as before with the person you got away from and your mother.
The pain will always be there. You just learn how to better deal with it overtime. Keep your child as the focus as you must be sane and well for the child’s well-being. Work on safely protecting your child and yourself so that you can grow and be strong against the evil people .
I'm going through the same. Was my parents caretaker till they cruelty kicked me out blaming all their problems on me
I am mind blown on how my whole family are narcissist.
I've gone no contact with my family since 1st week of November. I'm grieving so much. It totally suck. I send hugs to you. You are not alone.
So so true..grief and anger is almost unbearable
Dr. Ramani you are saying it all exactly like it is with a Narcissist. I’ve been married to one for 54 yrs. I gave my all and more to try to make him happy and keep him happy but he made me think I was the problem” but I knew inside it wasn’t me it was him. When he was diagnosed with being Narcissist and Paranoia when he was diagnosed with Alzheimer’s 8 years ago it was such a wonderful confirmation that it truly was not me it was him all those years. I’m glad you have written your book so people can learn early on in there life that there are Narcissistic people out there.
Best wishes to you and thanks for sharing your story
Thank You Dr Ramani❤, your exeptional work is helping me heal at 51, being raised by a narc mother and experiencing horrible trauma with my eldest sibling, and told to let go and move on😢Keep up the Great Work, #narcsurvivor
Living my whole life with this pain, it was like having a knife in my heart, when i saw the interview about your book and identified with everything it felt like you just removed the knife from my heart with your words.
Thank you your book was eye opening and gave me hope.
📖 Matthew 5:4 KJV
_Blessed are they that mourn:_
_for they shall be comforted._
Good people get stuck suffering between narcissists and enablers. I want protective, value-based people to say, “Right is right and wrong is wrong, period.” Brave, good, Godly people that stand up to injustice really are rare.🙏
Um, hello, narcissists can be ‘godly’ too!
Well said.
Living with a narcissist is like living on quicksand, every move you make you sink a little more; if you are with them long enough the quicksand will swallow you up.
My narc husband never showed any emotion when he lost one brother, then his mother and then another brother and finally his dad. He also never showed emotion when my son was killed (his stepson) even though he lived with him for 13 years. I'm still trying to wrap my head around the fact that he did not, does not and can not love us.
Thank you for this discussion of grief and narcissistic abuse.
I’m overwhelmed with how bystanders empower violence. Bystanders’ responsibility must be addressed and we require all professionals speaking up to help reduce violence. Allowing elective and unnecessary harm to happen is inexcusable.
The therapists can do damage as well. Individual and couples.
Yes you are the Light ahead of us and showing us the way 🌞 - I am crying, it has been a long time coming
Lost my Dad. At the funeral home my ex sat in one of the sitting rooms & communicated with no one. My Father was so good to him through relapse/recovery. He treated him with kindness & forgiveness.
I look back over the yrs now bring one yr out & marvel @ what I did not know
TY for this, it is an affirmation to me everyday. I’m blessed to be out of that life
you’re right, the narcissist takes the joy out of everything good! They rain on your parade all they can and they retaliate if they feel you got something they didn’t.
Yes you are right. They never change and that when we start seeing the truth about them. As they get worse and you do grief
1:02:08 man I did this just the other day and felt like an ant on the ground as soon as I opened my mouth. His face was like this 😕😕 it’s crazy how it was a knee jerk reaction to want to share even tho I KNEW BETTER 😤 ugh idk what I was thinking… it was a wild feeling the confirmation that he really does not care like that. The don’t go deep with anything is so real and such great advice. 💖
“Shame for a narcissistic person is volcanic”
So. True. The most violent, harrowing parts of my childhood are all rooted in the audacity that I, as a child, had to expose (often unwittingly) something they were ashamed of.
I feel this. As a kid I was neglected a lot but entertained myself reading everything I could get my hands on. If I corrected or contradicted any adults, it was seen as disrespectful and rude, all the worse for being in a very hierarchical and shame-based Asian culture
After almost 40! Years of marriage I finally became aware of this Emotional Abuse. And it did happen when I became very ill. I was bedridden with Lyme Disease plus other chronics (which I now understand more clearly about the Root Cause) and he told everyone including himself how wonderful he was at helping me. And yes, he was there for me when I rang my bell when I could not get up but that didn’t even feel good… there was always something off about that. Like I was bothering him during his working hours.
I still can’t believe how dissociated I was for all the years.
Thankyou for this. After coming out of a abusive, Narcissistic relationship 6 months ago, I thought I had started moving forward/ healed. But I have felt very tired, hard to talk to others, friends and family who were also affected by him often make comments, I have found myself keeping myself away from people and struggle in normal situations around people. I went to the Doctors and I have been told that I am grieving and processing whats happened. Didn't realise this and feel in a rut. Hope you can help please. Thankyou
Your videos have been an integral part of me understanding and healing from my relationship with my covert narc mother and also a covert narc previous partner. I had no idea what was happening for so long. As soon as I get paid I'm ordering your book! Thank you for all you do.
It was a great live, thank you Dr. Ramani for spending your time with us
The confusion and the hope that what could have or blaming yourself brings tremendous fog , grief, and fatigue if you are still getting hoovered by them...the urge to stop yourself from going back is a real challenge...
When my controlling narcissistic husband died the amount of grief I was dealing with was unbearable! I was not only grieving his sudden death and everything that unfolded that morning, but all the years of abuse came to a head and shortly after he died the final betrayal was uncovered, which was the missing puzzle piece that made all of these other things that I suspected but had no proof of until after his death make sense. I think one reason I had such a hard time coming out of it was because I felt there was no justice and never would be because I couldn't confront him and all his lies since he died and I grieved a confrontation that could never be. It took me over three years before I was able to even begin living again
Such an important topic. Thank you for covering it Dr. Ramani and David . I've known both of you for years via different life experiences. Brutal divorce from diagnosed sociopath, estranged from narcissistic family, and lost a traumatized son to a drug overdose. This is a topic I know all too well.. Just bought the book today.❤. Disagree with the statement that addiction is a disease but that is a topic for another day.
I'm a therapiest and has defined the grief process in chockphase (the relatiknship) 1. Reactionphase -strong emotions 2. Aggressionphase -pure rage 3. The shame phase 4. The guiltphase 5. The emptiness phase 6. The (true) grief phase 7 Reorienrationphase
Definitely in the guilt phase. Why I am back listening to the Dr.
I can’t wait to get to reorientation phase🙏🙏🙏
Thank you for this. I'm sick of being blamed!
Life brought me to you, Dr. Ramani. I'm so thankful for this! I was in a narcissistic relationship without even knowing! I opened up my eyes and suddenly all your videos (that I started watching just out of curiosity) clicked, and I suddenly see everything extremely clear. It's been a hard process but I'm so ready to move on. Thank you for existing and sharing your knowledge with us!
Ditto. When the girlfriend broke my rose colored glasses I realized something was up but had no clue the confusion was the narcissistic relationship. Then I found Dr Ramani. Thank you God!
Once getting out of a narcissistic and abusive relationship the grief was the hardest. Therapy, friend and time were the healing tools that helped me to get to today.
Dr. Jerry Wise talks about “getting the family out of us”, which is basically what you’re talking about.❤❤
How true it is the reaction of our nervous system. I lived years with panic attacks now after I let, earthquake last year did not challenge my heart to trumble. I am sooo relaxed, proud and happy
How long were you in the relationship?
@@crystalH30 29 years
Dr . Ramani videos saved my life. I was looking for help thinking it was me losing my mind until I saw her videos. The book is great and perfect title
Dr Ramani, I can’t tell you how grateful I am for you! This video is like sitting in on a personal therapy session. The therapy sessions I did attend were not useful as I was advised to stay in my marriage due to finances. I am only seeing the video now so I will be purchasing your book. Thank you for all of the wonderful work you are doing and all of the many people you are helping💝🙏❌⭕️
God love Dr and her team, they've been grinding!
33:00 I had exactly that "penny drop" moment when my mother passed away and my spouse literally never showed any compassion or sympathy. He questioned why I was so emotional and never hugged, touched, or stood near me during the whole process. This solidified my sense that he was incapable of being the safe and loving partner I deserved...and that it wasn't my fault.
Thank you for confirming I'm not crazy I'm actual to loyal to abusers user greedy sneaky personality disorder narcs 😘
Thank you so much Doctor Ramani discovering your podcast is an eye opening for me. Am beginning to see and understand the cruel and manipulative schemes of the narcissistic people in my life pretending to be nice.
Thank you for your all amazing work. Each and every time you bring so much help. When do you sleep?
Thank you Dr. Ramani, enjoy your well deserved break! My copy arrives tomorrow and I ordered a copy for my sister too. She's still married to a narcissist, 30 plus years. I divorced mine after 16 years. We both have immense empathy for them, each having their "good" aspects.
I'm working through facing what I put my son through by staying for so long and being so unhealthy while I stayed.
God brought me through more than I realized at the time. He still is. I'm enjoying peace and calmness now. Excited for the next chapter for both my son and myself. My son is 16, he has his own understanding of his dad and their relationship. It takes as long as it takes. Next chapter please ❤
Enjoy your rest time Dr Ramani! ❤
OK here’s a crazy story. I had a cardiac arrest (not a heart attack. A cardiac arrest) at home. My ex narc knew about my family heart history (dad died of HA at 49 yo). Though he called 911, he did not do CPR. I also had a million dollar life insurance policy. This has always bothered me. How could he leave me dead on the sofa?
Spending the weekend with coffee, "It's Not You". 😎♥
With transactional empathy, and any other situation dealing with Narcissist. The “icky” feeling comes because in your head the red flag 🚩 goes up, but since they are being “empathetic” or nice, probably after saying manipulative things like “nobody appreciates the things I do” etc. You don’t want to be negative or point out how it’s probably not even that big of an empathetic gesture. So you just accept it, and it just grows worse from there. If you do say something you better believe it will be used as a justification during the discard. Thanks for all the work you both do. #narcsurvivor
This is the most powerful interview yet..❤ ty🙏
I think there's a syntaxical issues around the idea of forgiveness. You can’t decide to ''forgive'' the way you decide to walk, talk, eat, drive etc. Your motor system isn't implicated.
You can only get to a point in life where you feel forgiveness: the anger has abated, you feel more understanding (to some degree), you feel you have the choice of keeping that relationship going (and may still chose not to)... and then you may chose to say ''I forgive'', but really when you get to that point, it's done already.
It's a specific process of grieving in itself. You don't ''do'' it, you do life, and that may allow forgiveness to happen. You actually ''feel you are experiencing forgiveness''... but that's a mouthful!
''You're not taken care of in your grief...''
Yes... that's how my truth-seer sister turned into an enabler.
She had known and stopped expecting much from my mother since early childhood. And when I started seeing and grieving, it was very validating to finally compare and agree on our experiences of our mom.
But my sister also very quickly said things like ''why are you so surprised? Let's all just remain polite and keep getting along''. Which I cannot do. And neither can my narc mother of course, she's throwing tantrums left and right these days, to get me to come out of my grey-rocky fire-wally distancing.
I feel so much better now though!
Thank you for your time with these!
Dr Ramani, I hope you see this because I need help ….& clarification. What about the ‘nice guy’ narcissist? There’s rarely rage, or obvious lies. Or obvious anything. But I feel like I’ve slowly given up every part of myself, my hopes & dreams, my belief in myself & my belief that I deserve to be heard & supported .
In place of all of that…..my “role” is….I’m here to serve & support his purposes, & there’s anger when my wants clash with his. My attempt at being heard (when my viewpoint might put his ‘wants’ in jeopardy) results in my voice being completely shut down & disregarded, even treated as though I’m an annoyance.
It seems like a low-grade narcissism resulting in & a death by a thousand cuts.
….but he’s so nice…& selfless….& attentive ….to everyone else.
it’s so confusing.
Thank you for all you do.
I hope you can speak to this situation. I’m finding it hard to fully accept & move on, because my situation doesn’t seem to be as “cut & dried” as others. I’m so confused. I want to create a better life for myself (even if I stay married) & hope that all is not yet lost. I still have a few dreams (I just feel like I have to keep them to myself, or else they will be disregarded & minimized.
How can one thrive in this situation???
I think I need a few of those ‘teas w Dr Ramani”. Much appreciation!!!! ~K
Learn about the different types of narcissism. Mine is a cerebral narcissist and it took me 20+ years to figure it out!
I decided to go no contact recently with my 43 year old son. I am feeling much less stressed, altho I fear he will retaliate with violence at some point. Keeping fingers crossed that he's too lazy. I also recently lost my daughter at age 40 during childbirth. The baby lived. Am lost without her & lay awake nights going over memories we'd had together 😢. She really had her life together. Miss her terribly. 9:00
Leave if you can. Best way to find peace especially if you can do no contact. God bless you.
@@lorijohnson2098 My goodness that's just heartbreaking. My heart goes out to you
I remember an uncle that was my neighbor as a child growing up who died. I had to ask the man I was married to to attend the funeral with me. All he said was "I don't go to funerals".
I went to the bedroom and cried and didn't attend the funeral. I now believe he did that for no other reason than to hurt me.
I give myself a loving, empathetic hug 🫂
You are wonderful. I love you too Dr Ramani
Love your thoughts bubbles in your "Mound of Mush". 😂😊Thank you, Dr. Ramani. If your mind is mush- mine is sludge. Thank you for all you do!!🎉
10:37 the twilight zone.
I used this phrase when i was a teen living at home, as a young adult still dealiing with them even living abroad
I went NC about 10 years ago.
I then found myself using it again a couple of years ago about my marriage.. and when i realised that, it opened my eyes that i was still living it for the same reasons
This makes me think of the Bob Dlyan song "Everything's broken" A Narcissistic relationship is broken from the word go
Thank you Dr Ramani. You help me articulate a long process of abuse. I have been in therapy since 2009, when I started I didn't know what I was going to say, I just knew I needed help. I thought there was definitely something wrong with me "because of the way you are". I am lucky, I think, because I separated a couple of years ago after 25 years of marriage, 5 of dating + previous friendship, it was psychological/power/money abuse from a very quiet, shy-looking person who was very manipulative. I consider myself an intelligent and intuitive person, yet, I don't how I got that deep down, how I missed all the red flags!
Distance (separation) helped me to get perspective and open my eyes, I now have the words to describe what happened to me, nobody would have believed me. Time and our own actions speak for themselves and open people's eyes. It is very damaging, rips your soul, it takes time.
I have your book, an addition to my collection of referrals, I am eager to read it! Thank you for putting words to such a devastating thing.
Thank you both for confirming everything I have learnt over the last 2years and what is now helping to heal within a toxic relationship until I strong enough to move on.
Your book "It's Not You" is amazing. It has helped me tremendously. Thank you for writing this book.
Dr. Ramani thank U Soo VERY MUCH for ALL the work U r doing & in Soo MANY different ways to shine a spotlight on these awful horrible cockroaches that our culture & community systems to expose them for exactly who & what exactly they REALLY are! Keep it up!
i have been in the grieving process in finally distancing and in a way cutting ties with my father who is a narcissist. i finally put myself into therapy because i felt like i was delusional and going crazy and thank goodness i did because it opened the path for me to grow the strength to finally say enough is enough. this has been so difficult to me as i tried for so many years (really my whole life) to gain his love and a healthy relationship with him. Not only is it difficult because he is my father but he was also my boss and mentor in my line of work. he has spent my whole life putting me down in so many way. i thought for so long that i was the problem. the past few months have been so difficult for me especially since i have just recently had a daughter myself and would never in a million years would i ever want her to feel the way i do now and did growing up. luckily my husband is supportive and truly amazing. also finding you and your work has been helping me a lot. it really helps me feel less crazy for knowing the reality of my relationship with my father.
Yeah amazing to hear.
Thank you Dr. Ramani. When you talk about being new to your career, well. It resonates. 😢😮😊
You are a gift from the Goddess. Thank you!
Dr. Ramani is the Camina Drummer of the world of survivors! Thank you both, grief and abuse survival are cousins. You're a perfect pairing!
Thank you, thank you, THANK YOU for this life affirming video broadcast, Dr. Ramani!! Grief over the death of a narcissistic loved one is tricky business, for SURE, especially when you have the dysfunctional family belief system stalking you from behind the bushes; like a lion on the hunt, waiting for the perfect opportunity to pounce on its prey. I was amply groomed into submission well into my late 50's by these surprise gas lighting, shame inducing ambushes, and when my elderly Mother died 2 years ago, all HELL broke loose once my 2 surviving brothers saw that I had no intensions of continuing to adhere to The Family, "Blood is thicker than water" Creed.
My brothers were both livid over my decision to practice healthy boundaries with them, and my poorly misguided extended family didn’t help matters, which gave my siblings the enabling excuse to turn up the heat once they saw my resolve to put an end to their toxic verbal attacks. They were like 2 head-strong bullies determined to dismantle the new peaceful sense of well being their sister had discovered; so much so that I nearly had to put out a restraining order on them both. As a result of their invasion of my privacy, and my newfound peaceful state of mind, I put a more vigilant watch over my recently instated healthy boundaries. It hasn’t been an easy task to maintain this uncharted territory of stability, to say the least! I still cannot bring myself to delete the alarms that go off on my cell phone, reminding me to call my Mom after the nurses completed their shift changes at the nursing home where she lived; but now I am able to say, "I love you, and I miss you Mom, but I don't miss the chaos".
Although, I have not grown faint in my resolve to continue on this path of healing and restoration, I still struggle with the guilt of “leaving family behind”. I know in my heart that I didn’t walk away to teach my abusive brothers a lesson, but that I have finally learned mine. Learning to navigate the muddy waters of a dysfunctional family is sticky business at best! All I know to do is to surrender, one day… one step at a time; and thanks to insightful nuggets of wisdom from "Teachers of The Trade", I am well on my way to discovering the authenticity of a more meaningful way of life! THANK YOU!!
I have been watching your videos and have realized I'm in a relationship with a cheating narcissist and now I see how he is the one that had issues resulting from his childhood and also he was in Afghanistan. I thought there was something wrong with me but now I see it's him . Thank you for all your info on narcisissm.
Thankyou so much to you both, i really felt heard with so much here.hugged! David wonderful, Dr Ramani i got the book, .
Thank you for your words and support
I am only 36:47 into the conversation and I just want to stop and say thank you for this conversation on narcissism and grief.
I went through my lowest moments last year with daily panic attacks that turned into an anxiety disorder. During this time I needed to go to hospital and my partner refused to take me said he had more important things to do.. only later to tell me he did that intentionally to try to prove a point that my family didn’t care about me, that I wouldn’t have help without him.
He was very mad at me for believing my family loved and cared about me.
It was a lot to take in and has taken me months to process that feeling of grief of being at my lowest, most scared moments and he was more focused on hurting me then supporting me.
Has been a painful understanding and an extremely traumatic separation.
Thank you for talking about this.
Wow. You are talking about my life. In 2020, thanks to Dr. Ramani, I started realizing that one of my parents is a covert narcissist. This has been tough to navigate, process, and grieve.
My dad just passed away suddenly in May 2023. The next morning my grandma (his mom) passed too. I waited for my best friend to show up for me as I endured this tremendous shock and loss. She didn’t (she made it about her and didn’t even so much as send me a card). I ended the friendship. The pain of dealing with all of this at once has been earth shattering. A therapist had helped me navigate through the acute loss/shock, and ending the friendship, but she wasn’t the right therapist to help me beyond that. Now, I’m basically trying to heal my own CPTSD, codependency, and grief by reading books and listening to experts like you. I hope to find the right therapist soon (I also have adhd and both of my kids are on the autism spectrum which further complicates my finding the right therapist).
Thank you for simply validating this complicated issue of grief and narcissistic relationships. I am grateful and feel hopeful.
You have to make yourself really small and read their minds. Oh yes. That is what they need that I can’t give. And there is GRIEF. THIs particular convo means so much to me.
Loved this, Dr. Ramani. Hope I can buy your book.
I appreciate you so much, Dr Ramani...sending love to you
Your insight is helping me through the period of "going home" to help family care for a parent dying. I can feel my strength from knowledge of "radical acceptance"". And i know there will be some relief for everyone through the transition and grief. Thanks for putting into words what so many of us know.
Really enjoyed the questions & answers & your guest speaker
You answered some of my own questions which were so good to hear
I had wondered why some people are not ok with me going no contact or doing yellow rock
Its reassuring to know why as it was a tough call to know what was an appropriate reply
Rest up Dr.Ramini and team
You have all done amazing work over the past few weeks
Thank you , Thank you , Thank YOU
Thank you !! Please educate people about Grief ❤
Narcissistic mothers set you up to let other narcissistic people come into and wreak havoc in your life. It's literal misery. For me, it's so much more difficult to go no contact with my narc mother because the one time I made up my mind to finally go no contact with her she legit had a massive heart attack and almost died later that night. So now I have this overwhelming sense of fear and guilt that if I go no contact, she will die. I feel so trapped and lost😢
I've had this for years too. Practically her whole life she has been playing the i may not be here tomorrow card. When we were kids they used to give us instructions what to do if they died in an accident. There was never a safe place. I think even as a kid i started emotionally distancing from that. It is as much manipulation as everything else they do. We struggle becasue we care for them but we start to learn to care for ourselves.
@xltl7642 @xltl7642 This made me cry😭 I am so so sorry that you and your siblings had to go through the same kind of abuse. It's so emotionally taxing. I'm so glad that you've learned to care for yourself, and I truly hope that one day I'll get there, too. Thank you so much for the comment! It helps a lot to know you're not the only one, and that you're not always alone. Sending you all the prayers and good vibes🙏🏻💞
I am so sorry for your bad luck ( she survived).... It doesn't matter if she dies. Save yourself.
The part that I'm still grieving 30 years after divorcing my narcissistic husband is my lost potential. It breaks my heart to think of all I could've been had I not been worrying about outshining his lazy ass. Dr Ramani did a TH-cam talk on this,& I cried for days.😢😭
What an invaluable blessing you are 🎉
OWN IT!
I could never thank you enough for all your help! You've been my biggest gift from God.