Surprising Trebia Wargame
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 24 ก.ย. 2018
- In this episode, Chal plays a devious trick on the Roman players to recreate Hannibal's surprise trap along the banks of the Trebia River in December 218 BC. Before the game, Chal and Greg discuss the context of the battle and debate the strengths and weaknesses of the republican Roman legionary system. Was the Roman army sent to face Hannibal fatally flawed?
For the wargame, four of our players refight this battle on a stunning, custom-crafted 6'x4' tabletop with thousands of 6mm miniatures, playing the new rules "Age of Hannibal." Can Sempronius Longus avoid a humiliating defeat at the hands of Hannibal and Mago Barca? Find out this week on Little Wars TV!
To learn more about "Age of Hannibal," visit us at www.littlewarstv.com/age-of-ha...
And if you enjoy the video and want to support some history geeks, please subscribe, click "like," and leave us a comment below! And share this video with fellow Punic War history fans! Check back next week for our in-depth review of "Age of Hannibal," as well as a terrain tutorial on how we made the custom table seen in this video. For the best wargaming videos on the web, visit us at www.LittleWarsTV.com - เกม
Some of the stuff on this channel really opens my eyes to the advantage of having an umpire, by tricking the players you can achieve a very historical sense of surprise without special rules needed to simulate it.
Great vid and cleverly designed game. I once played in a multi-player ancients game at a big convention where I was commanding a unit on a hill in the centre of the line. A small enemy unit approached, attacked up the hill, was defeated and ran away towards a swamp. I started to pursue and then stopped because everyone on the enemy team seemed to be watching me. So I did an about face and went back up on the hill and resumed my original defensive position. It turned out there was a "secret" trail through the swamp - including an old farmer figure on the board who "told" the enemy about the trail - and there was a huge force ready to counter attack me if I had chased further. It was an awesome moment in the game.
Oh yeah dude, I played my first couple games this weekend, and I'd go so far to say it's my favorite rule system I've played so far
The surprises and twists and information hold-outs and all these little things you guys use to spice things up are a big reason this is the best wargaming channel that has ever existed
Great stuff again, guys. I generally find battle reports and watching other people play games pretty boring, but you keep it moving with a good mix of humor and showing the important game events.
When I run WWII historical battles, I love to throw in actual Fog of War moments, and the players love the added challenges. But calling it one battle and changing it a few turns in is brilliant. Definitely going to borrow it. Great video by the way.
"People use decimated wrongly to mean annialated all the time".
20:45 - used wrongly to mean annialated hahaha.
Loved the video, keep it up!
Loved it, great subterfuge.... Those Gallic warriors earned their pay that battle... Moral; Always have Breakfast....
First rate AAR. I'm putting this on the Society of Ancients Facebook page.
Keep 'em coming!
Thank you! We are constantly hunting for ways to reach more people and find other history geeks, so if you're able to spread the good word that is very much appreciated!
OK, you're on.
Here: facebook.com/thesocietyofancients/
and here: soa.org.uk/joomla/news
It's pretty fun to watch this video now with the benefit of 4 years of Little Wars content. When this channel debuted I was very impressed with the quality. Nothing even remotely came close at the time on TH-cam. And now four years later, Little Wars is eons beyond that high mark where it started. Y'all have become so comfortable in front of the camera since this first aired.
Brilliant idea to charge forward, offense sets the pace. Celts for the win tho. Like real battles, fate balances on a razor edge...
Charging right into the heart of the Carthaginian line when all hope seemed lost almost turned the entire tide of the game. Honestly, if it hadn't been for that one crazy base of Celts (and Josh's die rolling for them), Hannibal might have found himself in quite the pickle....
A similar circumstance at Cannae had the Roman infantry broken Hannibal's center.
While the Roman players may not have liked the trick, I thought it was a great idea to mislead them into thinking it was another battle. It is difficult to re-fight certain well known battles without imposing "gamey" restrictions or other tinkering so that a side that historically benefited from elements of surprise and fog of war (literal fog in some cases) can pull off a win in a game. This deception wasn't too overpowering and the Roman team still had god chance of pulling out a win. I've lost count of how many Waterloo games I've played that were won by the French because the French players avoided all of the same mistakes made historically.
Historical background, wargame, cooking show! You guys do the lot.
Well done.
I'm just re-watching all the wargame videos, and I've gotta say, the valiant all or nothing effort by Zach and Tony was inspired. Most Roman generals would not have had the presence of mind to go all in like that with the shock on the flanks like that.
first historical battlereport I've ever seen, and WOW this was awesome. Amazing job guys you definitely got me to subscribe and look into this more!
The Romans were using the Maniple system at the time of the Second Punic War and not the Legionary system as described. The Legionary system was not in place until almost a century later when Gaius Marius was trying to quickly recruit troops on his own dime.
During this time, the Roman army had to replace four distinct types of units to fill an army, and balance these together so as to not be overburdened with the lesser-used Triarii or having too little Principes to replace the tired Hastati in battle. And it is this that set the stage for Cannae when the majority of the army was made up of the lighter-armored Hastati as not many could afford to be heavy infantry Principes. Since they could not rotate their forces as they normally would, strength-in-force seemed tantalizing.
All this said, great video and an awesome battle!
Gorgeous table!
Thanks Greg and crew! I will be looking forward to next week's rules review!
Thanks chaps, a very enjoyable video! Have just ordered Age of Hannibal and so am very much looking forward to next weeks tutorials!!
great video, looking forward to next weeks vids.
Great video 6mm is my main scale to use for big battles on a small table Greetings from Scotland enjoy your next Dram of Whisky
I’m new to the channel and i love it!
It’s my first go to on youtube. The mix of gaming, humour and drinking (and cooking) make me want to hangout and play a game with you all. The next best thing is watching your videos.
I’m heavily invested into Rapid Fire! WW2 wargaming at 1/150 scale. But seeing all the different scales, periods and rulesets has got me thinking.
Keep up the great work. Thanks.
Welcome, Nick! We haven't tried Rapid Fire as a game system yet but maybe we need to look into it!
Very entertaining and historicallly informative guys!
These are superb do some more i have just binge watched the lot
Fantastic as always Gents
Gentleman its a pleasure to watch your videos. Thank you.
Really well done production.
Tremendous series!
That was a great video. Not too long, interesting, great terrain and figures. What's more to ask? Thank you.
really great job. Ilove watching you guyts.
This video is pure genius. I love so much your channel.
Really enjoyed this guys. Was watching whilst putting some Age of Sigmar figs together. The decision to charge forward by the Romans was gutsy and nearly paid off. Well done all. I'm off to get some pizza now.
Hi, came to this late, but one thought about the discussion at the beginning of the tape. Please don't confuse the Roman legion of the Empire and Post-Marian reforms with the Roman legions of the Roman Republic. The Imperial legions were professional soldiers, loyal to their commanders and had uniform equipment/training. The legions of the Republic were organized by age and gear: velites, hastati, principes, triarii, they swore allegiance to the nation and recruits had to meet some personal wealth requirements. The Republican armies did vary more than the Imperial armies.
f12mnb plus the “weird duel leadership” was intensional by the Romans as part of the republican values of no giving a single man too much power. Something changed after the reforms.
Vae Roma! Great video guys! Inspires me to run this scenario this weekend!
8:48 'thats right' lmao
Brilliant guys, thank you. Great to watch and paint to!
Yes its becoming my regular viewing at the painting table
hello friends. Greatest video...whose company are the miniatures used in the game?
I would argue the reason Rome came out on top was not due to the legion system, but rather a lack of symmetry between Carthage’s strategic objectives and Hanibals tactics.
Interesting point!! Love this time period, so many interesting factors playing into each battle and campaign.
Amazing video
Shamfur Dispray!
Very nice. I am new to the channel, is 6mm your go to scale for your games? I really enjoyed your production style by the way.
We probably play more 6mm than any other scale, but it really depends on the era/genre. We used to do almost exclusively 28mm, then we went through a long 15mm phase, and for the last few years we've been gaming in all scales (2mm and 10mm, too!). I'd say over a third of the games we run in the club are 6mm, though.
Great video. I see Greg is as good a cook as I am. I am a mean bartender, though. :)
lmfao at someone eating chips @ 14:03
Excellent game
What's the size of those bases if i may ask. Rly thinking of getting the Baccus Romans vs Carthagens match set and ur guyses armies looks superb, cheers guys dope video even after watching it the 5th time xD
My kind of guys. If I lived anywhere near you I would join your club tomorrow! If I was allowed
Beautiful! Romanus eunt domus!
Great game chaps. Really looking forward to hearing more about the new ruleset. Will it be available to buy or will we need a copy of the Chipco Fantasy rules? Cheers Richard P
Thanks, Richard! Age of Hannibal is a stand alone set with nothing else required. We'll be gradually building out a lot more supporting content for it, but we did set up a new section of our website to serve as the official home for the rules, scenarios, support, etc. You can find it at www.littlewarstv.com/age-of-hannibal.html
Fantastic thanks 👍
Just ordered the PDF 👍
I can't beleave it I tried that once and failed but you guys held whit one unit of kelts
I am a Napoleonic wargame zelot, but this is my favorite video!
What kind of rules do you use? Where I can get them?
I find you guys to be not only wargamers but inspiried historians too. I especially like your comments on Manstein in another video. Not the average drooling-over-German wargamer that I know.
Really appreciate this channel and you guys, indeed, have the best wargaming club on the planet. I have purchase everything possible, and have also placed a nice size order with Baccus. I just wished I lived close to York Pa. KC to York would be a long commute. Hope to emulate to a much lesser extent, what you guys have created with a group of my buddies. I see that Days of Knights got a 'meh' review. Wondered what else you play or would recommend for dark age and middle age wargaming. Have you tried 'To the Strongest', or Mortem et Gloriam?
Thanks, David! And we hope you and your friends can put together a new club in KC! It only takes a few committed players to get started and you'll grow from there as the word gets out. "To the Strongest" is on our radar. We played SAGA in the early days and I wouldn't mind breaking that out again.
I agree. Best wargaming club around. We have few real wargamers here in Oregon.
*looks up the battle of Trebia, see it occurred on the Winter Solstice*
Oh the year-office of the consul had nothing to do with the Roman general’s impatience.
nice guys
There was once a dream….a dream called Rome
Rome was one of the very few ancient civilizations that could take a punch. They got beat, got up, learned. And then won. Remind me, what ended up happening to Hannibal? 😆
Cavalry. Cavalry.
Hi there. I have a question about 'Age of Hannibal' rules, which I have just purchased and downloaded this weekend. I've also asked this question on your website, as I'm not sure where is the best place to to post it. haven’t played yet, so the answer to my question may be answered when I do, but form reading the rules I am unclear on something.
On page 12 of the rules it describes how you keep a record of the demoralized or destroyed enemy units in order to determine who won or lost that half turn. Is this total cumulative over several turns, or is the count reset to '0' each half-turn?
Example: This half turn I had 3 units DMZ and 1 unit destroyed, giving me a total of 5 points. My enemy had only 3 points arising from 3 demoralized units. This means I lost this half turn, and lower my morale clock by 1.
In the next half-turn I score 2 DMZ against my enemy and receive 1 DMZ from him. This means I have won this half turn, but over the two turns my total is 6 against his total of 5. Which one of us lowers our morale clock on this second turn?
I hope this makes sense!
Roger
Roger--the points you earn toward the morale clock reset every half of the turn! So in your example, you have lost the first half the turn and lower your clock by 1 (your opponent scored 5 points and you scored only 3 points). In the next half of the turn, your opponent has lost and must lower his clock by 1 (your opponent earned 1 point and you scored 2). The damage you inflict each half of the turn is not cumulative.
@@LittleWarsTV Thank you - I thought it might be the case, but until I play I wasn't sure. I thought it possible that you might be trying to set up a 'cascade' affect with the rules so that once things start going wrong, it is hard to turn them around! However, resetting the count would make sense for game play balance,
Will this ruleset be playable with any scale or is it for 6mm only?
Designed to be playable in any scale, with any basing! We like to use 6mm with 40mm bases, but years ago we used to play in 28mm with 3" bases! You could even use bases of different shapes, so long as the opposing armies have the same basing system.
Little Wars TV Seriously looking forward to a system that can use 6mm, where 1 base = 1 Unit, all my favourite games use this (like Altar of Freedom :-) )
Legion shortcomings: 1. Too small amount of a cavalry attachment, which leads to/contributes to 2. piss-poor scouting.
You should do a battle of Stalingrad
About the Triarii, is it true that they were notorious for just sitting down at the back of the line during battles? Or is that just a story?
The traditional Roman deployment in this period was three lines of infantry, and typically (but not always) the Triarii were the last rank. The best fighters in their prime years were actually the Princepes, who often deployed in the second line. The older veterans, the Triarii did develop a reputation for being the last line of defense, hence the popular Roman line, "It's come to the Triarii." But that doesn't mean they weren't engaged in battle--they often had to fight. Sometimes it's because the battle was going poorly, and sometimes the commander would employ them as a reserve or send them out to extend a flank (Scipio Africanus is said to have done this in Spain).
Little Wars TV Ok, thank you for clearing that up for me, if its not too much to ask, were the most inexperienced soldiers in the roman army typically the Velites and the Hastati?
Kolby S. Yes, generally the Hastati were the youngest and least experienced citizen soldiers. The Velites (skirmishers) were not necessarily inexperienced--in fact, some of them were veterans. The reason you were a Velite had less to do with age or experience and more to do with money. Men who could not afford to buy other equipment often wound up serving as Velites. This is why the Equites (cavalry) typically included the upper to upper-middle class men--they could afford to buy horses and the required gear!
Little Wars TV Is it also true that under republican Rome troops served 20 consecutive years and that the troops often had time off during the spring and summer to harvest crops? I’ve heard another thing that the romans practices with equipment heavier than what would be used in combat as well.
Will the curse of Gregianus strike again 🤣
*All right that tears it . I've got to find a tabletop club of my own locally .
I mean the best DMs have to be a little bit of a bastard. Otherwise where's the fun 🤣
There actually is a magician named Hannibal!
Check out this very interesting video on the battle th-cam.com/video/RI2j_Z57e1s/w-d-xo.html
from now on with their wargames they should just do 15mm blue moon miniatures.
Greg really needs to work on himself 😂😂
Ok i have a question: does anyone else think Zach looks like a young Pickett?
That awkward moment when someone says Rome sucks, but you can't scream at them because your on tape
HEAD GAMES!
I really hope chewing into the mic isn't common on this channel...
There is a difference, quite Major really, between CALVARY (think Christ on the cross) and CAVALRY (armed men on horses).
Wargamers and alcohol, ooooh yeah!!!!
Great job guys. Only one thing - please, don't say "Skippy" for Scipo Africanus (Scipone l'Africano) cause is unacceptable 😆 🙉 The pronunciation is completely different.
Lies and tricks........ sneaky!!!!!
lol
I can agree the the Roman legion aren't unbeatable. The 14 legion got destroyed 2times
While this is interesting, its less wargaming and more reenacting.
Reenacting is a cool hobby and if you're interested in it, you may want to look up what that is, Mat. There's an entire industry centered around wearing period uniforms, camping in fields, and gathering with other period reenactors. But it has very little to do with historical wargaming or what we do here. There's no reenacting on this channel...aside from some us wearing funny hats on occasion!
@@LittleWarsTV Firstly, let me say I think what you lads do is great. My point is just that with the conditions that were put on the game seem to force a result. This is always an issue in historical wargaming, a hobby I adore. In the end if the players all agree and are happy, then game on!
Before the Marian reforms the Roman army was rather rubbish, afterwards they were efficient military machines
yeah, rather rubbish but managed to conquer half the Mediterranean, performing on average very well against opponents as diverse as they could be, ranging from celtic warbands to hellenistic phalanxes... smh
@@HellSound94 well, I meant in comparison to what they evolved into.
@@GavinTheFifer still wouldn't call it rubbish but I agree to that
Carthage did not sacrifice their children, Carthage cremated their dead and Only children were worthy of burial Markers. The crematoriums on the Italian peninsula that date back to the punic wars are carthagenian crematoriums not Roman.
Hit the gym, Greg
SHAMEFULL DISPLAYYY!
Too much talking. More game shots
We do like to talk around here, it's true!
humor is wack lol. what is this? history jokes? i see why my history teacher was a weirdo
Trite response to what is truly a valuable and entertaining video by a set of passionate/bona fide wargamers. Perhaps, you can return to your parents for lessons in respect and humility.
'Calvary' is where Jesus supposedly died. 'Cavalry' are soldiers who ride into battle.
Cavalry
@@josesoria2072 Good catch. Thanks. :)