I use bluesound node 2021 in my second home and recently bought an adapter and a linear power supply from teddy pardon, the sound is not muddy anymore and big 3d sound stage. I have a $4000 DIY streamer in my main system and many other streamers. This one is very good contender.
Hi Simon, looking forward to your testing of the Pontus 2, which I love in my system with Innuos MK3 Zenith and Primaluna/SF combo. Just getting a switch right before the wifi, almost any switch is already a benefit to isolate from upstream interference, it s what i do, with an old metal nether switch, curious to see if you feel the Bonn will make a difference with the Pontus2....
It's weird (as an IT person). Streaming should be about packets properly timed going into a DAC from the network. Seems to me the best way is to just buffer for, say, 10-15 seconds, reorder the packets (when using TCP), and retime them to go into a DAC. Which seems pretty easy to do and really not that expensive. That should eliminate the need for equipment like this. But, as so many things in audio, logical things (easy ones) don't seem to apply... Pitty that... (even though I think PS Audio implemented a streamer/CD player like that). Anyway, I deliberately kept my system on a level where these things don't really make a big difference. Which is a pity.. Even though I will try simple vibration control with Ikea butcherboards and try better power cables and power filters (I use a DC filter already to reasonable result)... Still, thanks for being honest about it. That really does help!
Thanks Erwin, the way I understand from reading articles is digital data is still going in real time and needs to be clocked still, jitter is impossible to get rid of entirely to the extent it often can be still audible. The Steve Nugent article explains buffers create additional problems and jitter. I agree with you that applying one level of thinking in audio is often erroneous, which is why I always rely on my senses. I think this is a fair review that lets people get out of it what they want. 😀🎵
@@13thnotehifireviews7 Yep, I agree about the review. So it might be advantages to just connect a USB drive with the files to the streamer if possible... My network seems to have some problems, as my Naim ND5XS frequently throws hissy fits. Weirdly, the Squeezeboxes and Linn streamers never seemed to be bothered by it though. I'm quite happy I bought the fantastic clock from dCS as I think it might come in handy on multiple occasions in the future! :)
"Seems to me the best way is to just buffer for, say, 10-15 seconds, reorder the packets (when using TCP), and retime them to go into a DAC." Every streamer which receives data over TCP/IP has such a buffer. There is no way to stream music over Internet without such a buffer. And this buffer is readen by the clock of the streamer - it does not matter if the data from Internet has a "jitter"
Well done again Simon (2nd video in a week 👏🏻). I already own a Silent Angel Bonn N8 and a F1 PSU which are great in my set. I am considering a Silent Angel Rhein Z1 as a Roon Core. With a Forester F2 PSU the 12V output can be connected with it and the 5V output can be connected with my Bonn N8 (allthough this upgrade comes at a price…) . Did you try the different Bastei DC cables (each color is different)?
Hi Ron, thanks very much. I thought they were all similar but actually you are right, checking the packages they refer to different metals on the positive and negative terminals. But just as well as I didn’t review cables with my non cable review ethos atm. I’m trying the Holo Audio May KTE DAC at the moment, and it’s blowing me away.
@@13thnotehifireviews7 Hi Simon. Cables can do a lot with a system (in a positive and negative sense of course). Today I noticed the positive influence of a (granite) floor tile under my speakers on a wooden floor 😀. Holo DACs seem to be very good. I'm not up for a new DAC (love my integrated H590), but maybe you can test if it's better/different than the DAC in a H390 or the Denafrips? Looking forward to your review.
@@13thnotehifireviews7 yes thanks for the quick response. My concern about using a NAS would be a data bottleneck. I have recently moved and planning my layout. 👍🏻
Perfect timing for this video Simon. Have been thinking about getting a switch for my system to put before my Zenith Mk3. I was thinking about going cheap and getting a standard N8 Pro or 8Switch, only cause the Phoenix is bloody expensive. Any chance you can get a Phoenix Net in for review?
I use the SA Bonn N8 with a SA F1 power supply and that’s working great and is, IMO and with my set, worth the money. But always trust your own ears when considering buying.
Making a very good sounding DIY ultra low noise linear power supply is very easy. I have tried out quite a few boards from the biggest Chinese online shop, A..E…ss, and I can highly recommend Jung Super Regulator boards, especially the oversized one from Nvarcher, about £35, feeded by a R-core transformer. Improvement in sound quality is remarkable, also compared to f.i. studer900, sigma11/22 regulated power supply boards. I used one for each (!!) of: Fritz!Box modem/router, Meraki MS220 switch, RaspberryPi streamer with Pi2AES HAT (separated power supply!), R2R DAC board, SparkoS preamp module.
Cat7 cables are useless unless you have cat7 running through your freaking home and WHO HAS THAT?!? 🤣🤣Most people have Cat5e installed in their home unless they've had it upgraded upon build.
Most people don’t even need wires round a house, just use network extenders with local lan ports, then you can run whatever cabling you want in connection with the lan/streamer etc.
I gave a fair review of this product and no I didn’t succumb to expectation bias, also lots of testing goes into it. I think this is a honest review which lets smart people read it as they want to. Cheers.
Jitter can still pervade Wi-Fi , also conventional wisdom is if it’s unreliable and the TCP protocol keeps trying to resend then it can overburden the processor adding emi noise which affects SQ. Also drop outs on weak Wi-Fi and less ability to then handle hi res formats.
Nice work on a highly subjective category of gear. I’ve played with a few and I’m yet to be convinced that ethernet switches have a sonic signature.
I liked your little jab at ASR 😂👍
I use bluesound node 2021 in my second home and recently bought an adapter and a linear power supply from teddy pardon, the sound is not muddy anymore and big 3d sound stage. I have a $4000 DIY streamer in my main system and many other streamers. This one is very good contender.
Have a bluenode as well. Hearing it often, though i have no issues myself. I will look for a better streamer some day. Too many options atm...
Very well edited video, again.
No fuss, no flapjack. I’m in.
Great video Simon!
Hi Simon, looking forward to your testing of the Pontus 2, which I love in my system with Innuos MK3 Zenith and Primaluna/SF combo. Just getting a switch right before the wifi, almost any switch is already a benefit to isolate from upstream interference, it s what i do, with an old metal nether switch, curious to see if you feel the Bonn will make a difference with the Pontus2....
Thanks Bert. I’ve been modelling the Pontus 2 in 3d today. Good shape to practise on.
Totally agree IME that this kind of package works best in higher end systems. Don't bother if you are into midfi.
It's weird (as an IT person). Streaming should be about packets properly timed going into a DAC from the network. Seems to me the best way is to just buffer for, say, 10-15 seconds, reorder the packets (when using TCP), and retime them to go into a DAC. Which seems pretty easy to do and really not that expensive. That should eliminate the need for equipment like this. But, as so many things in audio, logical things (easy ones) don't seem to apply... Pitty that... (even though I think PS Audio implemented a streamer/CD player like that).
Anyway, I deliberately kept my system on a level where these things don't really make a big difference. Which is a pity.. Even though I will try simple vibration control with Ikea butcherboards and try better power cables and power filters (I use a DC filter already to reasonable result)...
Still, thanks for being honest about it. That really does help!
Thanks Erwin, the way I understand from reading articles is digital data is still going in real time and needs to be clocked still, jitter is impossible to get rid of entirely to the extent it often can be still audible. The Steve Nugent article explains buffers create additional problems and jitter. I agree with you that applying one level of thinking in audio is often erroneous, which is why I always rely on my senses. I think this is a fair review that lets people get out of it what they want. 😀🎵
@@13thnotehifireviews7 Yep, I agree about the review. So it might be advantages to just connect a USB drive with the files to the streamer if possible... My network seems to have some problems, as my Naim ND5XS frequently throws hissy fits. Weirdly, the Squeezeboxes and Linn streamers never seemed to be bothered by it though.
I'm quite happy I bought the fantastic clock from dCS as I think it might come in handy on multiple occasions in the future! :)
"Seems to me the best way is to just buffer for, say, 10-15 seconds, reorder the packets (when using TCP), and retime them to go into a DAC."
Every streamer which receives data over TCP/IP has such a buffer. There is no way to stream music over Internet without such a buffer.
And this buffer is readen by the clock of the streamer - it does not matter if the data from Internet has a "jitter"
Thanks for putting this so well in the context of " The Rising Curve" of diminishing returns......
Thanks for the artist focus. Now on my playlist 👍
Well done again Simon (2nd video in a week 👏🏻). I already own a Silent Angel Bonn N8 and a F1 PSU which are great in my set. I am considering a Silent Angel Rhein Z1 as a Roon Core. With a Forester F2 PSU the 12V output can be connected with it and the 5V output can be connected with my Bonn N8 (allthough this upgrade comes at a price…) . Did you try the different Bastei DC cables (each color is different)?
Hi Ron, thanks very much. I thought they were all similar but actually you are right, checking the packages they refer to different metals on the positive and negative terminals. But just as well as I didn’t review cables with my non cable review ethos atm. I’m trying the Holo Audio May KTE DAC at the moment, and it’s blowing me away.
@@13thnotehifireviews7 Hi Simon. Cables can do a lot with a system (in a positive and negative sense of course). Today I noticed the positive influence of a (granite) floor tile under my speakers on a wooden floor 😀.
Holo DACs seem to be very good. I'm not up for a new DAC (love my integrated H590), but maybe you can test if it's better/different than the DAC in a H390 or the Denafrips? Looking forward to your review.
Late to the channel. Have you done NAS?
as in NAS as a music drive? That’s fairly standard - I use a qnap and western digital but I use my innuos as it’s got a ssd (not 3.5 Sata) hard drive.
@@13thnotehifireviews7 yes thanks for the quick response. My concern about using a NAS would be a data bottleneck. I have recently moved and planning my layout. 👍🏻
Perfect timing for this video Simon. Have been thinking about getting a switch for my system to put before my Zenith Mk3. I was thinking about going cheap and getting a standard N8 Pro or 8Switch, only cause the Phoenix is bloody expensive. Any chance you can get a Phoenix Net in for review?
Probably not re Phoenix but my advice would always try first as I said. 😀🔉🎼
I use the SA Bonn N8 with a SA F1 power supply and that’s working great and is, IMO and with my set, worth the money. But always trust your own ears when considering buying.
Making a very good sounding DIY ultra low noise linear power supply is very easy. I have tried out quite a few boards from the biggest Chinese online shop, A..E…ss, and I can highly recommend Jung Super Regulator boards, especially the oversized one from Nvarcher, about £35, feeded by a R-core transformer.
Improvement in sound quality is remarkable, also compared to f.i. studer900, sigma11/22 regulated power supply boards.
I used one for each (!!) of: Fritz!Box modem/router, Meraki MS220 switch, RaspberryPi streamer with Pi2AES HAT (separated power supply!), R2R DAC board, SparkoS preamp module.
Cat7 cables are useless unless you have cat7 running through your freaking home and WHO HAS THAT?!? 🤣🤣Most people have Cat5e installed in their home unless they've had it upgraded upon build.
Most people don’t even need wires round a house, just use network extenders with local lan ports, then you can run whatever cabling you want in connection with the lan/streamer etc.
Expectation bias. Don'tcha just love it? 😂
I gave a fair review of this product and no I didn’t succumb to expectation bias, also lots of testing goes into it. I think this is a honest review which lets smart people read it as they want to. Cheers.
Or just use wifi 😂
Jitter can still pervade Wi-Fi , also conventional wisdom is if it’s unreliable and the TCP protocol keeps trying to resend then it can overburden the processor adding emi noise which affects SQ. Also drop outs on weak Wi-Fi and less ability to then handle hi res formats.