It would have been very nice to see some discussion/commentary about the use of these in a vehicle, and how well they match with the function of the alternator etc without modifying the car. There is a lot of information missing here.
I would love to have a 1 on 1 with jehu asking these questions. I really want a couple of these powering my amplifier for sub system in my truck. But I'm unsure of the amperage and watts and charging system if it were tied into my lead acid under the hood
Great video and like how you broke every dollar down at the end. I bought 4 headway cells from battery hook up for my integra was going to just use copper bus bars into the screws and hook it up. But I heard the alternator will constantly charge them making for a very short life. So maybe I should look into a bms
@@dannyw7662 Hey thank you. Was just a couple weeks ago I seen a video about a r enology dc to dc. I’ll have too see how they charge up now I have a bmax charger. I’m guessing I still will want a bms on them.? I’d love to use them as a aux battery in the trunk. Wanted to completely replace but would need more cells.
I think I would want to relocate the internal connections from the individual cell posts and put them directly onto the bus bars. The way you have it set up is going to stress those 2 cells where the connections currently are.
I would like to build an electric motorcycle using as many golf cart parts as possible. I already have a 48v 3.5hp motor, a 450amp programmable controller, and plenty of cable. With 4 batteries like this and gearing for a top speed of 65mph how far could I potentially travel? 10 miles? 100 miles?
This is super cool for a from-scratch DIY. From a pure value standpoint though, it looks like you're on the same $/wH curve as retail Battle Borns or equivalent. Am I reading that right?
Cardboard is a no-no in electronics, it absorbs humidity (removing its sole purpose here), can be de-integrated by molds, and of course spreads fire if it would even start as smoldering in a corner. He should have used hard plastic plates (just like the material of the box) padded with inflammable, non-static foam on both sides. Imho the sides of the enclosure should have been padded as well to prevent wear from vibrations. Also are the cells just resting on their screws on the bottom??? That would certainly damage the bottom of the box in the long run. Cardboard wouldn't help there, they would sink through it in days. The example is fine for a 12V power source in your lab or stationary set up, but not really suitable for a car or some other vehicle. You also risk liability when a fire would spread from this, as it doesn't quite meet any safety standards.
Yup, I use plastic from cheap dollar store school folders. To make it even better, but non-servicable, is to pour casting resin to hold everything in place inside the battery box since vibration from engine will rattle and even unscrew the joints.
@@1FishinAddict resin for the bottom yes, like maybe 1 or 2 cm high, preferably with an already solidified bottom layer before putting in the batteries. But not the entire box as it isolates heat too, and if one cell would emit gasses which then can't escape, you made yourself a little bomb.
Due to the current being limited to 200 A by the bms, I'd say this would be unsuitable for use on a car. My puny little car uses a battery with a CCA about double the capacity of the BMS on this. Problem 2 with using it in a car is that the charging system on a car is optimised for lead acid, it will stress a lithium based battery. Problem 3, I would be very vary about putting a battery like this in the engine bay of a car lots of heat and vibration at the very least it would cause the screw connections to work loose in short order. Lithium shines in long deep charge discharge cycles which doesn't happen in ICE cars. A car wants several hundred amps for a few seconds to start it, once started the alternator will have it back fully charged within a minute and then the alternator runs all the electrical stuff itself. A car battery in a car will last for years, using a car battery in a deep charge discharge like for solar storage will fook it in a very few weeks. Horses for courses.
@Alex Fiet I suspect that the BMS can take care of the Alternator current for charging. As for the cold cranking amps. Jehu mentioned that one of these in dead short should do 200Amps, and he's got 8 cells in parallel, from a CCA standpoint you'd be seeing something like 1600A less any inefficiencies and any 'used battery wear'.
Thanks Jehu. I too have been waiting for an episode like this. I have been wanting to build a starter batter for my cars and this is it! I appreciate the fact that you are doing the R&D for me because I just can't find the time. This will allow me to focus on other projects that use this technology. Well worth my Patreon membership!
I think it can suffer from temperature elevation due to no ventilation in the box. When new no problem but by aging cells may increase their internal resistance and generate more heat. How do you prevent from that?
Thanks, man. Great video! The problem is we can now purchase brand new commercial 1C 12V LiFePO4 batteries, including BMS and warranty at 40AH for $400 and 100AH for $730. This DIY solution is great for a hobbyist but not very cost effective. Thanks again!
@Lola Uro The $500 40AH battery in the video is equivalent to the $400 40AH commercial unit. For $700, you get 150% additional capacity for 57% additional cost.
Great stuff. I have built a 3s house battery with 600 x 18650 cells for my small motorhome , and also a cranking battery using 8 x headway cells, backing up super-capacitors . The cranking battery weighs 7kg and is now almost 2 years in service. Cranks a 5 cylinder engine much better than the old style lead-acid. The house battery, 12v, powers an induction stove through 4000/8000w inverter. Now 12 months old and doing very well for fridge and lights too. Here's what might help with battery builds... cork floor tiles make excellent insulation and shock absorbing layers. Cork chars but doesn't burn! Also, silicone sheets (place mats from ebay) also doesn't burn, is fairly thin, and acts as a good separation between cells if needed. Cheers from Oz, JohnT
I am a member of a K9 Search and Rescue team who need several smaller amp hour 12v batteries to power our communication equipment. I was thinking of 4s 2p. I wonder if you might give our Search team some pointers on BMS and charging units for a smaller Ah pack. Our team hikes these batteries and comm gear to mountaintops to extend the range of radios, thus the reason for smaller Ah packs. Great channel and can't wait to see what you're up to next. Any help would be massively appreciated. Dave N2KTO
At 200am x 12v is that 2400 watt hours? Not an expert on batteries but for $544 that is a good deal for DIY right? That should be enough juice to power a microwave or stove cooktop after you get some solar panels as well to charge it.
5:15 Look up "fish paper" for use in telecom DC power plants. It's cheap, thin and very effective as an insulator. Really enjoy the build video, thanks for sharing.
Your normal 12 volt Battleborn is only 100 ah, the battery that Jehu made is 200 ah -- if I'm not mistaken. So actually the price of $544 includes the BMS and twice the Amps as the Battleborn which is $950 (Amazon) at almost half the price,
@@iKingRPG I now have 105 ah of headways, got em for $8 a piece from bathookup and the majority test @ 8ah! Its been a fun build but on to the next. Prismatic are my current addiction though the headways are great for 12v high current use.
Hi, I've seen your detailed video & I liked it, however I am always battery-overheating-phobic, wouldn't it be better if you make some ventilation halls on top & bottom of the plastic battery body to allow air circulation, or even better add an electronically controlled fan! this should keep the temperature under control & extend the battery life time, nevertheless Good Job, thumbs up.
How many Amp Hours was the battery you built in this video? Please..if i missed it anyone answer. I thought i heard 50? If that is the case i can buy one for under $400 pre-made by Battleborn or another reputable company. If we are talking about 100 or even 200 then that is probably worth it. Usually the case is that when you build your own you save at least 50%.
ok getting it now this is an 8 AH battery and four parallel gives 32 and this 200 AH is not the battery amperage, dont be confused. This is the discharge rate given by battery hookup and isnt the battery capacity at all. This battery is a 32 AH capacity (4 times 8) storage battery and nowhere near a 200 AH battery you will see sold at much higher cost.
I wouldn't recommend buying these seconds 38120' batteries. Why! I bought 8 units from Battery hookup @ AU$189.23 (8XAU$ 23.65ea) includes DHL transport The batteries are very old, manufactured 2016 or 2017. Nothing in web ad that mentions cell AGE & insulation damage. Have one dud battery that's under spec @ 3.14v Clearly shows overheating or cooked damage history @ + end. Not like the others. The rest are either 3.288v or 3.4v with surface insulation damage. As price comparison, I've since discovered, from China, GEB brand NEW GEB 38120 @ US$12.92PCS + transport for the 38120 battery.
Yep battery hookups is overpriced. The battery he builds in this video would be around the $400 range once you add hardware, box, bms and cells. Definitely not worth the 35AH rating.
I was really contemplating purchasing these cells from Battery hookup until I read your post. Getting duds is what I am afraid because they are used, even though their description says all tested something like 95% and up. I was going to make a 4S10P pack, so 40 cells. Now I don't think I will be ordering any.
we need the exact rating of the cells in order to shop around as these become available in various sources. This link is expired. Okay many others also building with these headways and other cells to different AH ratings 100 to 300 and more!
plz make a video on 18650 battery pack cooling solution for electric car, here in Pakistan temperature is hot, if car is parked outside, battery pack will get heatup , what could be best cooling solution for custom made 18650 packs, Air or liquid cooled, both ... anyone every tried ?
Good stuff... is there smaller 12V LiFEP04 batteries you can make? like a in a formfactor of a 12V 7A VSLA? that would be quite a practical portable battery... to be used as UPS replacement or alarm backup batteries
4 of these in series will be 12V 8Ah. They will be significantly smaller than a 12V 7Ah VSLA (about half size), and be able to deliver significantly higher power (2000w vs ~400w?). They will be lighter and more reliable. But it will be more expensive. I would not choose these cells for UPS though, as there are other cells suited for UPS which is high energy/low power.
Hello from the high desert of New Mexico USA 🇺🇸. I really need to win that battery because I live in my old bus in the desert and my old AGM batteries won't hold a charge so now I don't have any power when the sun goes down and I am too poor to buy cells. Also I have a great idea for your TH-cam channel, how about converting my 1967 GM TDH-4519 city transit bus into a EV. Keep up the good work and stay safe and charged
Contemplated using the headway cells on my electric chopper build. Spacing them around the inner diameter of my rear wheel. But I already had a bunch of 18650’s so I used your 1/8th watt resistor idea and built my own pack. Keep at it man. Chopper build seen here th-cam.com/video/IL0hkSwfTFM/w-d-xo.html
It's a little small for a car battery, I think he said 35-50ah...that's a lawn mower size battery. A car battery is generally 100+ ah. If you wired 4+ in parallel yes, it would work. That's basically what a Tesla car battery is about 1500 or so 18650 batteries wired in parallel.
@@MichaelCook1981 I planned to make my own lithium battery for my Cressida. But the BMS that can handle 70Amp++ is expensive in my place (70A to crank from cold start, inline-6 2.0L engine)
After one year this build has entered the territory of purely educational. A 100Ah Battleborn would actually be cheaper than two of these even if you could still source the cells at the stated price. These cells are $88 new. Still a great build.
That's where I started. They are just OK,so far. I'm very glad that I didn't start with flooded ones!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I would have blown up my shed by now. Those batteries are not good for anything that moves at all. My AGM ones are way safer,but not as good as the ones that are the...best. Lithium or the ...other ones. I'm too tired to look it up,now. LI FE So 4's?
@@jehugarcia I would think it is getting a lot more common.. now that isn't surplus tesla module type pricing (out of wrecked Teslas) -- is a tad high, but a LOT less prone to having things like fires and the like. A much safer chemistry than the regular Lithium cells, which can do miracles of light and sound if the BMS fails... Looks like the LiFEpo was doing very nicely in your testing.... going with 48v would make the current 1/4 to get the same power out... which means less heating and the like.. Just a bit more $
Jehu, I hope you see this comment. I was wondering if you had any thoughts or ideas on a DIY Prius battery replacement that is not thousands of dollars. Specifically 2010 battery. Really appreciate and input. Love the videos thanks
Check out Will Prowse's channel. he goes over a lot of basics about working with this battery technology with a lot of great products and real world applications that you'll be able to relate to
instead of the cardboard you should make rigid plastic plates. and drill 4 holes in it and screw them like if u wanted to make a short with metal ones. that way they stay without movement. @jehugarcia
I think in the near future lithium batteries will become obsolete. They will be replaced with graphene batteries which are lighter and more dense with power. Care to comment?
Very nice video! Great job on that build! My one and only "issue" however is using 'combustable' cardboard as spacing material. It could also attract & hold moisture. As I said however in your 300k video, I'd love to have that for my ham radio gear! Wow! That thing would probably power my 100W radio for nearly a week without recharging. (Avg. radio power usage much less than 100W...) great for emergency communication; like during earthquakes, fires, etc. Remember, when all else fails (including cell towers!) - ham radio is there! (During the Paradise fire last year; amateur radio operators were attached to the various command units & fire/emt/equipment trucks to provide communications after all of the local cell towers & CalFire comm. towers failed/burned!)
Swine radio stations haha! Dude why the hell would you listen to pigs during an earthquake? I think ur high af this video is about batteries not imaginary radio stations ran by pigs, TAKE UR MEDS
Been a viewer from the start, never commented. I enjoy watching someone as interested in these batteries as I am. Have built many lithium projects and driven five of my conversions. I am a geek. Cannot help it!
@@Sr_iRL it depends on energy density you want and cost and how much labor you want to do. Now if going to use the 18650 chemistry it would be more energy dense to use the 21700 cells and if you dont need to cool prismatic or pouch cells may be better. You have to define what your goals for cost labor size energy density whether or not cooling will be needed amp draw etc among other things like the shape of the space they need to fit in etc first.
Actually i don't see the point. Yes that thing can power up something very power-hungry, but it's only 35Ah you won't last very long with that. In 12V ( automotive especially) applications you need something capable to give some burst of current ( something near 400A or near that). if you need to power up something very powerfull you will probably end up connecting some battaeries together. That battery is roughly about the same size of a normal lead acid battery .... and is way more expensive
Different batteries for different applications - this is not a replacement cranking car battery. It's less than half the weight of a LA battery, and can be discharged to 0% over 4000 times. You can't use all the energy in a car battery - it would be very lucky to last a hundred cycles at that depth.
Love wathing your projects and I love this build :) About half the price of a Battleborn (battlebornbatteries.com/shop/12v-lifepo4-deep-cycle-battery/). How do you think it stacks up against yours?
wow ... this is 450% x the price of a normal new heavy duty car battery. Good Video... but that is just a rediculous no brainer. Lead is here to stay LOL. no would be able to justify the cost increase to "SAVE THE PLANET". who cares if you can get more than 5 years out of it. Such a shame! Summary - not worth it!
Not if you need a lot of power at 1/4 the weight, Everyone needs different things just because you have no use for this doesn’t mean these batteries are not super popular
I do not care about no free battery. You are doing a good job there young man. With Isaac Arthur, Fraser Cain , Elon Musk , Will Prowse and you of course All of you are doing a good job at enlightenment to us not so savvy folks. Thank You
Hay I bought 500$ worth of these batteries and so far only half of the shipment is come in and the other and the half that did come in are some rusted some of old glue on them and they're below the safety cut off and somewhere above the safety cut off too so does this happen all the time because I don't want to buy more if this does
They are used cells, but I think they sell a few thousand of these a month and I don’t see a lot of complaints, maybe this does not happen often, Email then they care of problems
Finally! A thorough video compare to other videos on the web regarding the headway cells. Thermal vid and explanation definitely helps boost confidence when building a high amperage battery pack. Look forward to build a couple. Thanks Jehu!
Thanks for the Video clip! Excuse me for butting in, I am interested in your opinion. Have you ever tried - Rozardner Powerful Battery Reality (erm, check it on google should be there)? It is a smashing one of a kind product for learning how to recondition an old battery minus the hard work. Ive heard some extraordinary things about it and my mate after many years got great results with it.
You caught me with your GO AHEAD AND CLICK THE BOTTON I fill like you’re talking to me because have watched several videos from you without subscribing but finally that words caught me. 🤣🤣🤣🤣
Your understanding of LiFePO4 is off. Capacity doesn’t increase at 50% load. Please make a correction to your video so you don’t mislead people. Lead acid at lower amp draws vs higher amp draws is a different story. This is why I choose LiFePO4...... because of its capacity is its rated capacity. I’ve tested and used those 8amp/hr red headway cells. You have 8 CELL’s parallel and 4 cells series which is 64amp hours @ 12.8v nominal ..... your watt hours should be in the 700’s regardless of draw not to exceed the 25C rating. If you understand “C rating” then you would know that each cell can give 200 amps. You have 8 in parallel which means 1600amps at 12.8v. Most of these C ratings are over rated. If you only got 300-400 watt hours then these cells are no good. I’m happy to see you put up lots of videos, but your understanding of building and testing lacks understanding. Each cell should be tested individually for capacity and C rating before they ever get assembled in a battery form.
I tested it on my bench and that’s what i got so I don’t care what you think you know. As a 12v battery at those power levels that’s you can expect to get.
So sorry to tell you that I do know a thing or two, but in your test video you put a 1000w load on that small battery you made. Each one of those 3.3v or 3.2v nominal headway are called “Cells” once assembled, it’s a battery. So you are getting the simple terms incorrect too. A single cell will possibly give at its terminals a burst of 5 seconds an extremely high discharge current, with the down side being an immense voltage drop. Always size the battery to perform the work with no voltage sag. The higher the voltage sag, the more the IR(internal resistance) increases and the cell with heat/short internally/damaged. I’ve been working with many different lithium chemistries for many years. I’m trying to be helpful. There was only 96w/hrs of energy in those 4cells in your other video. Your 1000watt draw was around 83amps which is 10c. Those headway cells are not designed to do that kind of constant load without damaging the cells. (Maybe 5-10 sec burst) Also, once you add bus bars into the mix, there is something called “C rise” which will limit what draw you can constantly pull from a cell. There are many variables, but trust in what I’ve wrote here. You’ve got lots of cool videos, I’d like to see you have a better understanding of the products you use and use them within their usable range taking in consideration: How many “C” is useable with no voltage sag and sizing bus bars for their “C rise” as well as sizing a battery pack to perform the work you need it to do. Understanding the specs of individual cells, and understanding when building a pack changes how the cells operate in a group will serve you well. Again, here to be helpful. But if your job on TH-cam is to destroy and incorrectly test items..... you are doing this very well. I love lithium cells and what they can do. You just need to understand how to size a pack correctly as well as test individual cells prior to the assembly of a pack/battery. The Pack/battery is only as good as its weakest cell, but that is just the very short answer on having a weak or a few weak cells in a pack. If you have any questions, I’d be happy to help your understanding of lithium cells and battery pack sizing. Take care......
@@cdkipp Thank you! I'm not a troll to slam people, but I've seen some of his cool videos of the past year. I was fortunate to have an electronics and math background along with having some amazing Electronics Engineering friends who have worked the electronic propulsion industry for over 15 years.... My understanding and use of the various types of Lithium cells is well above average to say the least. I know the efforts it takes to make videos and post them. I prefer to watch accurate informational vids.
Great video! But I wish to crave your indulgence for an observation Sir. Some of us subscribed to your channel ‘cause we can learn everything learn-able under the sun from you about the lithium battery DIY projects. But something baffles me here Sir. You seem to mystify some essential aspects of your projects. For example, in this video, you were kind enough to show us the parts you put together, but we didn’t know how you did most of the connections and all your wiring. But of course, if it is a trade secret then you may forget it. Otherwise, you would be doing me a lot of invaluable favors if you let us into some of the tips and tricks. OK. May be I am just too dumb to see.
Awesome battery build and an ultra capacitor version would be cool as a starter battery.
To recreate this project almost two years after this video, batteries and shipping (US) are costing nearly $800 from your link.
3 years is showing about $400 - used (like he said), but tested cells. Even at $800 it's a pretty awesome setup using 38120HPs
It would have been very nice to see some discussion/commentary about the use of these in a vehicle, and how well they match with the function of the alternator etc without modifying the car. There is a lot of information missing here.
I would love to have a 1 on 1 with jehu asking these questions. I really want a couple of these powering my amplifier for sub system in my truck. But I'm unsure of the amperage and watts and charging system if it were tied into my lead acid under the hood
Great video and like how you broke every dollar down at the end. I bought 4 headway cells from battery hook up for my integra was going to just use copper bus bars into the screws and hook it up. But I heard the alternator will constantly charge them making for a very short life. So maybe I should look into a bms
Why would the alternator make a very short life when the regulator takes care of that?
I hear it’s because the difference between lead acid and lithium has different charging methods. Cc cv for lithium
You need dc to dc charger for them
@@dannyw7662 Hey thank you. Was just a couple weeks ago I seen a video about a r enology dc to dc. I’ll have too see how they charge up now I have a bmax charger. I’m guessing I still will want a bms on them.? I’d love to use them as a aux battery in the trunk. Wanted to completely replace but would need more cells.
How do you hook it up to your car to charge the battery so you don’t have to take it out to charge
Please tell in detail about charging battery packs.
In the video, it is shown, but the details are interesting.
Please show us how to build the charger. I live i a Hurricane area and am want to build a pack like this for emergency back up.
@@01wildcardjeff Google Server power supply and DC to DC buck converter... easier to buy than build.
I think I would want to relocate the internal connections from the individual cell posts and put them directly onto the bus bars. The
way you have it set up is going to stress those 2 cells where the connections currently are.
Thank you for posting this informative video
I would like to build an electric motorcycle using as many golf cart parts as possible. I already have a 48v 3.5hp motor, a 450amp programmable controller, and plenty of cable. With 4 batteries like this and gearing for a top speed of 65mph how far could I potentially travel? 10 miles? 100 miles?
This is super cool for a from-scratch DIY. From a pure value standpoint though, it looks like you're on the same $/wH curve as retail Battle Borns or equivalent. Am I reading that right?
it would be awesome to have an EU seller for all the batteryhookup goodies, please :)
So this is a 64Ah battery, is it rigth ? have you leasure thesse 64Ah
can´t get into the link for the Buss bars
Kit.com is so unreliable I will change it soon
Sir Jehu please make a video of a 12V 32650 battery pack
Use plastic isolation. Cardboard can take on moisture...and moisture conducts.
Cardboard is a no-no in electronics, it absorbs humidity (removing its sole purpose here), can be de-integrated by molds, and of course spreads fire if it would even start as smoldering in a corner. He should have used hard plastic plates (just like the material of the box) padded with inflammable, non-static foam on both sides. Imho the sides of the enclosure should have been padded as well to prevent wear from vibrations. Also are the cells just resting on their screws on the bottom??? That would certainly damage the bottom of the box in the long run. Cardboard wouldn't help there, they would sink through it in days.
The example is fine for a 12V power source in your lab or stationary set up, but not really suitable for a car or some other vehicle. You also risk liability when a fire would spread from this, as it doesn't quite meet any safety standards.
Rubber mats bettee optiona
Yup, I use plastic from cheap dollar store school folders. To make it even better, but non-servicable, is to pour casting resin to hold everything in place inside the battery box since vibration from engine will rattle and even unscrew the joints.
@@1FishinAddict resin for the bottom yes, like maybe 1 or 2 cm high, preferably with an already solidified bottom layer before putting in the batteries. But not the entire box as it isolates heat too, and if one cell would emit gasses which then can't escape, you made yourself a little bomb.
Ditto I use scrap Lexan or Plexiglas
Due to the current being limited to 200 A by the bms, I'd say this would be unsuitable for use on a car. My puny little car uses a battery with a CCA about double the capacity of the BMS on this. Problem 2 with using it in a car is that the charging system on a car is optimised for lead acid, it will stress a lithium based battery. Problem 3, I would be very vary about putting a battery like this in the engine bay of a car lots of heat and vibration at the very least it would cause the screw connections to work loose in short order. Lithium shines in long deep charge discharge cycles which doesn't happen in ICE cars. A car wants several hundred amps for a few seconds to start it, once started the alternator will have it back fully charged within a minute and then the alternator runs all the electrical stuff itself. A car battery in a car will last for years, using a car battery in a deep charge discharge like for solar storage will fook it in a very few weeks. Horses for courses.
Nice build. I like the thermal vid. I wonder how it equates in Cold Cranking amps of a car battery?
@Alex Fiet I suspect that the BMS can take care of the Alternator current for charging. As for the cold cranking amps. Jehu mentioned that one of these in dead short should do 200Amps, and he's got 8 cells in parallel, from a CCA standpoint you'd be seeing something like 1600A less any inefficiencies and any 'used battery wear'.
You can't use it to crank some cars. The BMS will shut it down.
put two bms and u would get 400a out. enough for a small engine .
idk but 4 can start a car motor cold. look it up
It's limited by the BMS. 200CCA. If you remove the bms and go straight which I don't recommend, 2400CCA.
did you really drill into the box while batteries were inside? brave man.
Thanks Jehu. I too have been waiting for an episode like this. I have been wanting to build a starter batter for my cars and this is it! I appreciate the fact that you are doing the R&D for me because I just can't find the time. This will allow me to focus on other projects that use this technology. Well worth my Patreon membership!
I think it can suffer from temperature elevation due to no ventilation in the box. When new no problem but by aging cells may increase their internal resistance and generate more heat. How do you prevent from that?
just add fan...
It is possible that your weight the battery? Thanks cool project.
11.5kg in battery's plus bms case ect. 360g per cell.
Thanks, man. Great video! The problem is we can now purchase brand new commercial 1C 12V LiFePO4 batteries, including BMS and warranty at 40AH for $400 and 100AH for $730. This DIY solution is great for a hobbyist but not very cost effective. Thanks again!
Alden Fulcomer where do you purchase those batteries ?
You are gonna pay $730 to replace your car battery!!! Hahahahah you call that cost effective?!! Lmfao!!
IT has nothing to do with the cars. These are drop-in replacements for RV 12v house batteries/solar systems.
@@aldenfulcomer7837 well $500 still cheaper than $700...
@Lola Uro The $500 40AH battery in the video is equivalent to the $400 40AH commercial unit. For $700, you get 150% additional capacity for 57% additional cost.
I'm glad you broke down the cost. Helps explain the WHOLE process of building DIY.
Great stuff. I have built a 3s house battery with 600 x 18650 cells for my small motorhome , and also a cranking battery using 8 x headway cells, backing up super-capacitors .
The cranking battery weighs 7kg and is now almost 2 years in service. Cranks a 5 cylinder engine much better than the old style lead-acid.
The house battery, 12v, powers an induction stove through 4000/8000w inverter. Now 12 months old and doing very well for fridge and lights too.
Here's what might help with battery builds... cork floor tiles make excellent insulation and shock absorbing layers. Cork chars but doesn't burn! Also, silicone sheets (place mats from ebay) also doesn't burn, is fairly thin, and acts as a good separation between cells if needed.
Cheers from Oz, JohnT
Thank for that silicon place mat idea!
genius
we are waiting for YOUR video, John. Thanks!
John please make a video. Or maybe post a parts list so we can try to replicate your success.
Please how did you connect those starter battery with BMW circa 400A or more ? Where did you order it? And passive or active balancing?
My man what's that beat at 8:31? It really rocked he hard, very awesome project by the way, big ups!
Powercap Supercaps (12×500F )×3 Accu Battery 2,7V Farad ➡️ th-cam.com/video/ihSc7Bj_oQk/w-d-xo.html
Solar PV Limiter Inverter
I am a member of a K9 Search and Rescue team who need several smaller amp hour 12v batteries to power our communication equipment. I was thinking of 4s 2p. I wonder if you might give our Search team some pointers on BMS and charging units for a smaller Ah pack. Our team hikes these batteries and comm gear to mountaintops to extend the range of radios, thus the reason for smaller Ah packs.
Great channel and can't wait to see what you're up to next. Any help would be massively appreciated. Dave N2KTO
At 200am x 12v is that 2400 watt hours? Not an expert on batteries but for $544 that is a good deal for DIY right? That should be enough juice to power a microwave or stove cooktop after you get some solar panels as well to charge it.
5:15 Look up "fish paper" for use in telecom DC power plants. It's cheap, thin and very effective as an insulator. Really enjoy the build video, thanks for sharing.
Your normal 12 volt Battleborn is only 100 ah, the battery that Jehu made is 200 ah -- if I'm not mistaken. So actually the price of $544 includes the BMS and twice the Amps as the Battleborn which is $950 (Amazon) at almost half the price,
I jst wish i can be blessed with batteries like this, this is the type of things i like spending my time on, are u recruiting?
Fyi you can buy these from Battery Hookup and then make your own
@@iKingRPG I now have 105 ah of headways, got em for $8 a piece from bathookup and the majority test @ 8ah! Its been a fun build but on to the next. Prismatic are my current addiction though the headways are great for 12v high current use.
Hi, I've seen your detailed video & I liked it, however I am always battery-overheating-phobic, wouldn't it be better if you make some ventilation halls on top & bottom of the plastic battery body to allow air circulation, or even better add an electronically controlled fan! this should keep the temperature under control & extend the battery life time, nevertheless Good Job, thumbs up.
Yes, my question exactly.
How many Amp Hours was the battery you built in this video? Please..if i missed it anyone answer. I thought i heard 50? If that is the case i can buy one for under $400 pre-made by Battleborn or another reputable company. If we are talking about 100 or even 200 then that is probably worth it. Usually the case is that when you build your own you save at least 50%.
ok getting it now this is an 8 AH battery and four parallel gives 32 and this 200 AH is not the battery amperage, dont be confused. This is the discharge rate given by battery hookup and isnt the battery capacity at all. This battery is a 32 AH capacity (4 times 8) storage battery and nowhere near a 200 AH battery you will see sold at much higher cost.
I wouldn't recommend buying these seconds 38120' batteries.
Why!
I bought 8 units from Battery hookup @
AU$189.23 (8XAU$ 23.65ea) includes DHL transport
The batteries are very old, manufactured 2016 or 2017.
Nothing in web ad that mentions cell AGE & insulation damage.
Have one dud battery that's under spec @ 3.14v Clearly shows overheating or cooked damage history @ + end.
Not like the others.
The rest are either 3.288v or 3.4v with surface insulation damage.
As price comparison,
I've since discovered, from China, GEB brand NEW
GEB 38120 @ US$12.92PCS + transport for the 38120 battery.
Yep battery hookups is overpriced. The battery he builds in this video would be around the $400 range once you add hardware, box, bms and cells. Definitely not worth the 35AH rating.
I was really contemplating purchasing these cells from Battery hookup until I read your post. Getting duds is what I am afraid because they are used, even though their description says all tested something like 95% and up. I was going to make a 4S10P pack, so 40 cells. Now I don't think I will be ordering any.
we need the exact rating of the cells in order to shop around as these become available in various sources. This link is expired. Okay many others also building with these headways and other cells to different AH ratings 100 to 300 and more!
plz make a video on 18650 battery pack cooling solution for electric car, here in Pakistan temperature is hot, if car is parked outside, battery pack will get heatup , what could be best cooling solution for custom made 18650 packs, Air or liquid cooled, both ... anyone every tried ?
Hi Jawad, are you into these batteries. I am happy to discuss in more details.
Looking to replace 36 volt golf cart batteries, currently 6 six volt lead acid. Would 3 of these work for me.
My Sprinter Van will be so happy... My 3 yr old batts are dying.
Many Blessings , SMR
how did u get on this is new tech n alot of duds
Get some Calb lifepo4 Cells theyll last like 10+ years .... Thats what you see at 1:38
What about a heater plate for charging below 32°F? Or will BMS stop charging at 32?
Imagine a powerwall made of 10-20 of these batteries......Great Content as alway jehu!!
Was thinking the same thing
Great video. I'm the one who asked you about Headways and the BMS model in the chatroom. Now it's time to see it in action!
Currently the price of just one battery is 88$, which puts the cost of 32 batteries: 2816$.
You used 32 cells, not 36. Thanks.
Using 12 of these pack in car audio how many volts can I charge them at off dual 370 amp alternator?
Good stuff... is there smaller 12V LiFEP04 batteries you can make? like a in a formfactor of a 12V 7A VSLA? that would be quite a practical portable battery... to be used as UPS replacement or alarm backup batteries
dazza3g just use less cells, still have the same voltage. I don't think it would be very effective tho due to there being alot of wasted space
4 of these in series will be 12V 8Ah. They will be significantly smaller than a 12V 7Ah VSLA (about half size), and be able to deliver significantly higher power (2000w vs ~400w?). They will be lighter and more reliable. But it will be more expensive. I would not choose these cells for UPS though, as there are other cells suited for UPS which is high energy/low power.
Dump the cardboard, use FR4... far better suited to insulation between batteries.
Thank you for building this battery and videoing it and the results.
Hello from the high desert of New Mexico USA 🇺🇸. I really need to win that battery because I live in my old bus in the desert and my old AGM batteries won't hold a charge so now I don't have any power when the sun goes down and I am too poor to buy cells. Also I have a great idea for your TH-cam channel, how about converting my 1967 GM TDH-4519 city transit bus into a EV. Keep up the good work and stay safe and charged
When are you going to have more of those aluminum busbar plate available?
Looking for a 72v headway battery with a 200amp bms...
Do you make batteries also?
Contemplated using the headway cells on my electric chopper build. Spacing them around the inner diameter of my rear wheel. But I already had a bunch of 18650’s so I used your 1/8th watt resistor idea and built my own pack. Keep at it man. Chopper build seen here th-cam.com/video/IL0hkSwfTFM/w-d-xo.html
Is there any place I can purchase your batteries? Would I be saving money?
Nice project, but for $150 more, lion energy has a substantially more powerful battery that weighs 22 lbs.
Will Prouse tested that battery recently and it's not a true 1200Wh unit - only
@@PhilipLengden Yup. But the watt/per dollar is still great.
can I win the battery please, I just finished watching the video.
Can your assembled battery replace the traditional car battery?
It's a little small for a car battery, I think he said 35-50ah...that's a lawn mower size battery. A car battery is generally 100+ ah. If you wired 4+ in parallel yes, it would work. That's basically what a Tesla car battery is about 1500 or so 18650 batteries wired in parallel.
@@MichaelCook1981 I planned to make my own lithium battery for my Cressida. But the BMS that can handle 70Amp++ is expensive in my place (70A to crank from cold start, inline-6 2.0L engine)
This is some great stuff but unfortunately Jehu is not answering the many questions posed here, I have a few too.
After one year this build has entered the territory of purely educational. A 100Ah Battleborn would actually be cheaper than two of these even if you could still source the cells at the stated price. These cells are $88 new.
Still a great build.
Battleborn is that a brand?
I wanna use for audio system how much do I really need lets for for at least 8k watts.? thanks :)
Dude i waited for battery management system, where is it?
Lol under the top cover
I can just buy a dakota 54ah lithium battery for 400$
The best video I have watched in years. Very informative.
Not sure if I missed it, but were the total Amp Hours identified?
The price is very expensive
So better to using gel battery
That's where I started. They are just OK,so far. I'm very glad that I didn't start with flooded ones!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I would have blown up my shed by now.
Those batteries are not good for anything that moves at all.
My AGM ones are way safer,but not as good as the ones that are the...best.
Lithium or the ...other ones. I'm too tired to look it up,now. LI FE So 4's?
How much does a lifepo4 battery cost 48 volt 20 AH
I would use a thick plastic plate in between the cells.
Do you mean 'perspex'?
@@johnmcdougall4149 Anything that does the job.
Thanks for using Watt hour, very useful.
How about a 48 volt version of that??? would be VERY interesting as part of a home backup...
Billblom easier, the 12 is the only one that requires this kind of rare and expensive chemistry
@@jehugarcia 4x12=48 you can use lipos
@@jehugarcia I would think it is getting a lot more common.. now that isn't surplus tesla module type pricing (out of wrecked Teslas) -- is a tad high, but a LOT less prone to having things like fires and the like. A much safer chemistry than the regular Lithium cells, which can do miracles of light and sound if the BMS fails... Looks like the LiFEpo was doing very nicely in your testing.... going with 48v would make the current 1/4 to get the same power out... which means less heating and the like.. Just a bit more $
Jehu, I hope you see this comment. I was wondering if you had any thoughts or ideas on a DIY Prius battery replacement that is not thousands of dollars. Specifically 2010 battery. Really appreciate and input. Love the videos thanks
Sorry I don’t have any experience doing this but I hear a is a fairly common procedure done by many
I am new to this and this is complex I must say.
Check out Will Prowse's channel. he goes over a lot of basics about working with this battery technology with a lot of great products and real world applications that you'll be able to relate to
@@nunyabiz2016 will is NOT this thorough
300 thousand subscriber video not found in search of your page
Amazing videos and projects. Both very impressive technically and impressive filming
instead of the cardboard you should make rigid plastic plates. and drill 4 holes in it and screw them like if u wanted to make a short with metal ones. that way they stay without movement. @jehugarcia
exactly, he said this will last many years, cardboard won't hold up to the condensation in the air
Very well explained first time I understand how to do it in a simple way. VA2SOB - 73
Do you have to do a battery delete before installing a lithium bank
I think in the near future lithium batteries will become obsolete. They will be replaced with graphene batteries which are lighter and more dense with power. Care to comment?
What are graphene battery
how much would you charge to build one for a car audio guy?
Very nice video! Great job on that build!
My one and only "issue" however is using 'combustable' cardboard as spacing material.
It could also attract & hold moisture.
As I said however in your 300k video, I'd love to have that for my ham radio gear! Wow! That thing would probably power my 100W radio for nearly a week without recharging. (Avg. radio power usage much less than 100W...) great for emergency communication; like during earthquakes, fires, etc.
Remember, when all else fails (including cell towers!) - ham radio is there!
(During the Paradise fire last year; amateur radio operators were attached to the various command units & fire/emt/equipment trucks to provide communications after all of the local cell towers & CalFire comm. towers failed/burned!)
Swine radio stations haha! Dude why the hell would you listen to pigs during an earthquake? I think ur high af this video is about batteries not imaginary radio stations ran by pigs, TAKE UR MEDS
@@ContentCalvin good luck when your house burns to the ground.
@@mrgeraldbrent mafukka I live in a van down by the river
@@ContentCalvin good luck when the river banks flood over and you are trying to escape but get stuck in the mud...
@@lolouro2266 My van doubles as a pontoon
Insurance companies didn't like that
Been a viewer from the start, never commented. I enjoy watching someone as interested in these batteries as I am. Have built many lithium projects and driven five of my conversions. I am a geek. Cannot help it!
That's interesting Philip, did you build one for your car?
Would it be ideal to make a power bank with these, 38120, batteries or with 18650 batteries?
@@Sr_iRL it depends on energy density you want and cost and how much labor you want to do. Now if going to use the 18650 chemistry it would be more energy dense to use the 21700 cells and if you dont need to cool prismatic or pouch cells may be better. You have to define what your goals for cost labor size energy density whether or not cooling will be needed amp draw etc among other things like the shape of the space they need to fit in etc first.
Actually i don't see the point.
Yes that thing can power up something very power-hungry, but it's only 35Ah you won't last very long with that.
In 12V ( automotive especially) applications you need something capable to give some burst of current ( something near 400A or near that). if you need to power up something very powerfull you will probably end up connecting some battaeries together.
That battery is roughly about the same size of a normal lead acid battery .... and is way more expensive
Different batteries for different applications - this is not a replacement cranking car battery.
It's less than half the weight of a LA battery, and can be discharged to 0% over 4000 times.
You can't use all the energy in a car battery - it would be very lucky to last a hundred cycles at that depth.
@@ahaveland fair enough
Love wathing your projects and I love this build :) About half the price of a Battleborn (battlebornbatteries.com/shop/12v-lifepo4-deep-cycle-battery/). How do you think it stacks up against yours?
he has about 2.5x Ah rating in his battery. and it cost him close to half that battery you listed. thats about how they stack up.
@@wesleymagill4993 And yet I would still rather have the Battle Born, not that this isn't a neat hack
This has twice the capacity of a Battleborn, so it 75% cheaper than two Battleborns
wow ... this is 450% x the price of a normal new heavy duty car battery. Good Video... but that is just a rediculous no brainer. Lead is here to stay LOL. no would be able to justify the cost increase to "SAVE THE PLANET". who cares if you can get more than 5 years out of it. Such a shame! Summary - not worth it!
Not if you need a lot of power at 1/4 the weight, Everyone needs different things just because you have no use for this doesn’t mean these batteries are not super popular
ridiculous*
I do not care about no free battery. You are doing a good job there young man.
With Isaac Arthur, Fraser Cain , Elon Musk , Will Prowse and you of course
All of you are doing a good job at enlightenment to us not so savvy folks.
Thank You
32 batteries @ $88 per battery? Might be cheaper to build a hydro electric dam. Wow.
there actually 10 usd per battery on batteryhookup website
Would love to win that build just built a 14 cell s,6p my self love watching builds like this
Hay I bought 500$ worth of these batteries and so far only half of the shipment is come in and the other and the half that did come in are some rusted some of old glue on them and they're below the safety cut off and somewhere above the safety cut off too so does this happen all the time because I don't want to buy more if this does
They are used cells, but I think they sell a few thousand of these a month and I don’t see a lot of complaints, maybe this does not happen often, Email then they care of problems
Finally! I think as little as a year ago I was looking for a DIY solution and could not find a proper BMS. Thank You Jehu
The sticker is the only thing made in US
Finally! A thorough video compare to other videos on the web regarding the headway cells. Thermal vid and explanation definitely helps boost confidence when building a high amperage battery pack. Look forward to build a couple. Thanks Jehu!
Thanks for the Video clip! Excuse me for butting in, I am interested in your opinion. Have you ever tried - Rozardner Powerful Battery Reality (erm, check it on google should be there)? It is a smashing one of a kind product for learning how to recondition an old battery minus the hard work. Ive heard some extraordinary things about it and my mate after many years got great results with it.
What ah is this battery
You caught me with your GO AHEAD AND CLICK THE BOTTON
I fill like you’re talking to me because have watched several videos from you without subscribing but finally that words caught me.
🤣🤣🤣🤣
Love the vid,s. Could I use that as a car battery.?
Very good project 👍
Need to double up your buss bar, needs to be thicker and it will keep it cooler
tankdog03 buss bar never heated up
@@jehugarcia for it's full potential thicker buss bars are good
@@tankdog03ify More surface area for dissipation is key
im 3 years late for the give away hahahaha
Finaly I’ve been waiting so long!!!
Your understanding of LiFePO4 is off. Capacity doesn’t increase at 50% load. Please make a correction to your video so you don’t mislead people. Lead acid at lower amp draws vs higher amp draws is a different story. This is why I choose LiFePO4...... because of its capacity is its rated capacity. I’ve tested and used those 8amp/hr red headway cells. You have 8 CELL’s parallel and 4 cells series which is 64amp hours @ 12.8v nominal ..... your watt hours should be in the 700’s regardless of draw not to exceed the 25C rating. If you understand “C rating” then you would know that each cell can give 200 amps. You have 8 in parallel which means 1600amps at 12.8v. Most of these C ratings are over rated. If you only got 300-400 watt hours then these cells are no good. I’m happy to see you put up lots of videos, but your understanding of building and testing lacks understanding. Each cell should be tested individually for capacity and C rating before they ever get assembled in a battery form.
I tested it on my bench and that’s what i got so I don’t care what you think you know. As a 12v battery at those power levels that’s you can expect to get.
Here are my individual cell tests th-cam.com/video/MdhyOFeOqyE/w-d-xo.html
So sorry to tell you that I do know a thing or two, but in your test video you put a 1000w load on that small battery you made. Each one of those 3.3v or 3.2v nominal headway are called “Cells” once assembled, it’s a battery. So you are getting the simple terms incorrect too. A single cell will possibly give at its terminals a burst of 5 seconds an extremely high discharge current, with the down side being an immense voltage drop. Always size the battery to perform the work with no voltage sag. The higher the voltage sag, the more the IR(internal resistance) increases and the cell with heat/short internally/damaged. I’ve been working with many different lithium chemistries for many years.
I’m trying to be helpful. There was only 96w/hrs of energy in those 4cells in your other video. Your 1000watt draw was around 83amps which is 10c. Those headway cells are not designed to do that kind of constant load without damaging the cells. (Maybe 5-10 sec burst) Also, once you add bus bars into the mix, there is something called “C rise” which will limit what draw you can constantly pull from a cell. There are many variables, but trust in what I’ve wrote here. You’ve got lots of cool videos, I’d like to see you have a better understanding of the products you use and use them within their usable range taking in consideration:
How many “C” is useable with no voltage sag and sizing bus bars for their “C rise” as well as sizing a battery pack to perform the work you need it to do. Understanding the specs of individual cells, and understanding when building a pack changes how the cells operate in a group will serve you well. Again, here to be helpful. But if your job on TH-cam is to destroy and incorrectly test items..... you are doing this very well. I love lithium cells and what they can do. You just need to understand how to size a pack correctly as well as test individual cells prior to the assembly of a pack/battery. The Pack/battery is only as good as its weakest cell, but that is just the very short answer on having a weak or a few weak cells in a pack.
If you have any questions, I’d be happy to help your understanding of lithium cells and battery pack sizing.
Take care......
@@TommyLuptak Agreed. I caught that right away too. Do not take offense jehu but you are misstating the properties of LiFePo4.
@@cdkipp Thank you! I'm not a troll to slam people, but I've seen some of his cool videos of the past year. I was fortunate to have an electronics and math background along with having some amazing Electronics Engineering friends who have worked the electronic propulsion industry for over 15 years.... My understanding and use of the various types of Lithium cells is well above average to say the least. I know the efforts it takes to make videos and post them. I prefer to watch accurate informational vids.
Did you do any prep with the headways? I have a set and they arent very close in capacities... 5k-7k
Chris Smith I didn’t, but for anyone out there building these you should
Great video!
But I wish to crave your indulgence for an observation Sir.
Some of us subscribed to your channel ‘cause we can learn everything learn-able under the sun from you about the lithium battery DIY projects. But something baffles me here Sir. You seem to mystify some essential aspects of your projects. For example, in this video, you were kind enough to show us the parts you put together, but we didn’t know how you did most of the connections and all your wiring.
But of course, if it is a trade secret then you may forget it. Otherwise, you would be doing me a lot of invaluable favors if you let us into some of the tips and tricks. OK. May be I am just too dumb to see.