Red Like Roses Part 2 Summer: "You're not the only one who needed me, I thought you understood" Ruby: You were the one I needed, And you left me as I always feared you would" S: "Would I change it if I could?" R: It doesn't matter how, The petals scatter now Every nightmare just discloses It's your blood that's red like roses And no matter what I do Nothing ever takes the place of you
It's the discovery that every child eventually makes about their mother and father. As we're growing up, we view our parents as larger than life, giants, heroes. Even idolize them. Eventually, we learn things that we didn't know, about who they really are outside of being "mom and dad". About the PEOPLE that they were, not the parents they were. Sometimes, it can hurt learning that stuff. That your heroes really are just people, for better or worse. But by learning those truths, we step outside of them and become someone that is completely our own, again, for better or worse. I very much look forward to seeing who Ruby becomes.
I do like the idea of having Summer not being the best model to follow. It would nice to show the parallels that Ruby and Summer have, maybe even show that Summer also had the idea of being a hero and taking on everything by herself until it led to her death and have Ruby take that and change how her mindset is. Show that you can't always put everything else first. You need to value yourself too.
I like the idea of Ruby becoming herself instead of a second Summer. It could be a really heavy, but inspirational episode. While technically they could have Ruby reach this revelation without Summer being the one to talk to her, I can't think of any other way that would be remotely as satisfying. I really hope we get to see Summer during Ruby's Ascension. I think the Female Voice from the first line of Vol9 Ep1 will end up being revealed as Summer before this season concludes...
@@marvinvasquez9437 Voice actress was credited as Morgan Laure. She has not done any other work in RWBY, so... She was hired to deliver that single line? Not likely...
Well considering that little bit with her in the last episode, she might turn out to be suspect. I keep wondering if she might turn out to be some kind of devoted agent of the brothers. That this whole war is the brothers’ ideal “balance” and they have agents who manipulate things to make sure no one side actually wins. Maybe that’s what the silver eye warriors are really meant to be. Servants of the “eternal balance”. Honestly that whole theory just came to me on a whim one day when I realized we don’t really know Much of anything about Summer.
I mean, Red Like Roses Part 2 has summer tell Ruby to "please don't do what I did" as she doesn't want her to waste her life. If we get a Red Like Roses Part 3 I swear to god. . .
I like the idea of Ruby giving up her hood, slowly transitioning into more of maybe the Wizard of Oz inspirations like the ruby/silver slippers and Dorothy
There is a really great fanfic out there called "how it feels" that does a good job briefly exploring it. Ruby has idealization of her mom because her family only ever told her the good stories. That idealization leads her to start developing some self destructive habbits and so they are forced to break it by telling about a time she messed up and basically got people killed. Good read for those who like that kind of thing.
Also, just gonna drop this here instead of waiting for the next video. My prediction/fear for the end of the show: the relics are brought together, the brothers are summoned, and Ruby makes some sort of self sacrifice to unite everyone and convince the brothers to spare humanity. It has that bittersweet ending that alot of anime uses and matches well with the "victory not in strength" line from the beginning of the show. I don't want that ending, but I can see it happening.
Oh, oh, oh. I literally just thought of an ending I think I could really like. The relics are brought together, the gods are summoned, but -instead of passing judgment themselves - ask the spirits of the relics. "We gave you to mankind to better themsleves. How have they used your power?" The spirits start by talking about how they were abused for power and wealth, then were locked away out of fear. But then they talk about a small, simple soul that only ever used them to help others. Using the last question, not to learn how to vanquish her enemies, but to save a city. Using the power to build anything, not to make the ultimate weapon, but to protect innocent lives. And, when faced with the choice of laying down her burdens and abandoning her loved ones, ultimately chose to keep pushing forwards. Humanity is deemed flawed but redeemable (in keeping with the theme you mentioned). The world is saved. Happy ending.
I appreciate this video so much A few days ago I wrote a short mini rewrite where Summer talks to Ruby and convinces her not to switch places with her in the tree, and it includes several points made in this video (i hadn't seen it yet) and I was excited to share it with RWBY fans. I got hate-voted by a handful of awful people and told that because my rewrite didn't get rid of Ruby drinking the tea in the first place I was supporting suicide, etc. I wish I had encountered better fans.
She could TEMPORARILY become a “Summer Huntress” and get dragged back to remnant and brought to her mom’s grave because the heart never forgets. Jog her memory through the places they go to. The people she sees. Bring back their Ruby and get a glimpse at who Summer was in a sense at the same time.
as much as i like the idea of changing ruby's design drastically as she steps out of summer's shadow, marketing and the basic rules of character design would not allow that to happen. like imagine if you took naruto, put him in a grey and red cyberpunk clothes and then have the man a different cut. you would loss both brand and character recignizability.
"You are right. You are not me, nor should you be me. You are Tenzin." -Avatar Aang, Legend of Korra Book 2 Spirits. Single best part of the worst season of Avatar.
I do like this idea of Summer not being the model person everyone says she was, esspecially given thats all we are told about Summer is she was this model people looked up to shes a bit to perfect and usually in shows when your told someones perfect, they are usually far from it (And the resverse is also true to). For example from another show i'm watching "Witch from Mercury" the main character in the first few episodes says how wonderful her mum is only when we see the mom she gives off more evil vibes then Darth Vader, now this is an extream example but it's still true that idolized figures often aren't perfect in media. Also as an idea if this is true, but i would wonder if Yang knew more then she let on like she saw glimpses of Summer not being all sunshine and rainbows but tricked herself after Summer died that Summer was perfect.
I was just thinking about this yesterday. My thoughts were that the loss of Summer is the seed of pain that has been the root of her drive from the jump, but also the biggest thing holding her back in several ways. It is a piece of unaddressed trauma and until it is handled, she'll still be bottling up her problems. It is also the source she attempts to use to fuel her Silver Eyes, but as a memory that is not just inspiring but also painful, it'll always be contaminated by that association with the pain of loss. We've seen the result of that: the use of her Silver Eyes is unreliable and inconsistent. She has to let go of any sense of inherited responsibility (even if it is partially unescapable due to her birth traits), but take on a responsibility that she chooses, and chooses the reasons for. Everyone is flawed, so even if Summer doesn't turn out to be overtly flawed, it would be immensely helpful to Ruby if there were a way she could be led to understanding that and applying it to her mother as well. Even if Summer isn't overtly flawed, she cannot rely on the memory of the dead, and a painful one at that, to inspire her to protect the living; doing so is relying on the fear of loss, but what she truly needs to rely on is the strength of what she has. One thing that has concerned me is how things will wrap up in only two more episodes. I've assuaged my concern with the thought that even if Ruby decides on a new direction for herself, a new way of living, and a new drive...that sort of change does not come about instantaneously, at least not realistically. It takes practice, continued effort, possible slip-ups and regressions in thought processes. Her change is something that can and should unfold over the following Volumes. I would hate to see her growth process entirely handwaved via magic. 5:20 Well, another part of the problem with telling Summer's story instead is, assuming for a moment that STRK was the team that was present in this time to take on Salem, the team was unstable, in at least a significant part due to Raven's loyalty to the tribe. Team RWBY is seemingly managing to pull itself together much better than STRK could, which is why we're watching them and not STRK. It's as much about the team composition as it is about Ruby. 6:35 Silver Eyes are powered by the desire to protect, and you can't protect the dead. 11:30 I have my own theory that is grounded in both the mechanics and themes of the show, but I'll be curious to hear your thoughts. 13:50 It is worth noting that the Maidens as a concept didn't exist in the narrative until between Volumes 2 and 3. While it is entirely possible that they could've changed their mind on where the girls end up at the end of the show, there was something they found satisfying that did not rely on them becoming Maidens to achieve. 17:30 I do wonder if this is the reason for the line "Nothing. No one is ever truly lost."
I never seen the series in full just tidbits, but it seems like Summer is being set up like a Pink Diamond scenario like in Steven Universe, How everyone idolized Rose, but ya know...
I would argue that probably is the lesson she has to learn, to quit chasing the shadows of the dead. They're dead for a reason. Especially for this kind of story. Also, on the tangent regarding Summer not being a saint and actually maybe was someone who may have gotten too full of themselves and that Raven was not only right but has good reason not to like Summer? That actually would not only humanize but add some characterization to a character that isn't in play.
I debated one concept with a friend. Regarding her fair tail. Ruby is going through a rebirth from little red to someone who succeeds in being a protector. But it dosent change ruby's fair tail. So she goes from little red who couldn't defeat the wolf. And change her to the lumberjack who could. It would fit with the new weapon the blacksmith had as well as her adapting in a mature way.
Ruby could combine Summer’s style with her own unique style. After Ruby finds out the truth and realises that Summer wasn’t perfect, she can then learn from her mother’s mistakes and finally become RUBY. She can still keep the red cape as a tribute to Summer, but branch out and discover who she really is. Ditch the corset and the skirt like you said, but keep the cape and other red accents as a way to honour Summer without becoming a clone of her and going down the same path that she did. As for Salem being defeated, I don’t think she will. I do think they’ll find a way to stop her from being a threat, but I don’t think there’s any demise waiting for her. Maybe the cat will possess Salem and take all 4 relics in order to summon the Gods, destroying Salem in the process (not physically, but essentially brainwashing her). Perhaps if possession doesn’t leave any lasting impacts, the cat might somehow (I don’t know how) convince the Gods to remove Salem’s immortality. It’s a bit of a stretch, but it’s interesting to see how you would theoretically take down a villain who isn’t capable of dying.
Here's my thing about it. Ruby doesn't know summer that's true. But she knows enough that her mother was a good person and I can imagine she and yang especially know that she wasn't the perfect mom. A super mom sure but perfect? It's never been implied and was perfect. Hell Qrow straight up calls her a brat but that he liked that about her. Plus we need to remember Ruby doesn't exactly know what summer did or what her thought process was though judging by the lyrics of red like roses? Summer wanted to united others against Salem but everyone had given up and she was likely the only one who could hope to try and stop her. So she went to fight and never came back. I think for Ruby that summer serves as a symbol of hope. A vision of something ideal that she can look to because I imagine deep down Ruby blames herself for her mother leaving in this sense. "She left to protect me. She didn't want me to walk to path but I am anyway, I have to make her proud. I can't let her have died for nothing." I don't think it's necessary to destroy or tear down the image of summer in ruby's mind. More so give her clarity and closure, have someone; preferably a vision of summer; tell her that it's okay to just be yourself. You aren't summer rose. You are Ruby Rose. I see it the same way I see Deku and All Might. Yeah they have the same powers and all that but Deku eventually learns to stop copying all might in everything he does and he's better off for it but it isnt like he stops admiring all might.
If ascending means she can come back as anything or anyone, and we are limiting the stories to common legends, then she could come back as princess Kaguya from the Tail of the bamboo cutter. She could go to the moon and fight the gods and “Ruby” could mean the gown of the fire rat that she wears. And yes, I realize that’s probably not what they were going to do, but in the classic sprit of Rooster Teeth’s rule of cool, I think it would be awesome to see.
I don’t see this fully happening. While I can see Ruby coming to understand that Summer did have hew own flaws like everyone else AND learning to care for herself while helping others at the same, I feel she will see admire her in a way
Bit of a correction. Not all hero stories follow the Hero's Journey, nor do they have to follow such a structure to succeed as a story. It's one of many structures. That said, I don't disagree that this is what's going on. Within the Hero's Journey, the living must die to their illusions and enter into the land of the dead in order to discover the truth which restores life to the land of the living. It's the whole "the night is always darkest just before the dawn" manifested in literary structure. You must be willing to sacrifice your illusions to discover truth, after all.
I didn't mean to imply that "all" heroes journey's follow that structure because that would be ridiculous, simply that it's a very popular well known and proven structure with a heavy dominance in fiction over time. A common structure that many recognisable classic narratives are built off of.
@@YouAllWrite Ah, I misunderstood you then. Thank you for clarifying. I have seen people genuinely say that the Hero's Journey structure is the basis of all hero stories and that they should conform to it, so I'm glad that is not the case here.
Well there is a saying (sorry-older person) that a person never realizes their true potential until they surpass their parents. And the saying comes from the culture that Monty hails from. Just saying. As for the how to defeat Salem, I think if the cat makes it to Remnant, another creature if real magic, that may have something to do with it.
Just to vent. I hate Summer's new clothes because it throws out the previous image we had of her Summer was sometimes completely erased by the story, Yang said she was a perfect mom but then completely forgot about her for 2 volumes and then suddenly remembers her. No one talked about her ever so we had to grab the little we had for her. The picture, the flashbacks and thats it. And in those she seemed to be very shy, characters that cover themselves tend to show they don't want attention. Summer was not only that she scrunched over herself and with shy manners and then in the new volume not only is her clothes not carrying her main color which is white. Ruby is a red rose and Summer is a white one, her cloak is almost not seen Yes yes she is an adult now, but so was she on her first flashback where she turns around. I feel like once again they erased the previous image of her to glue on their new vision. At least established how that change came, from shy to what we see but all we know about her is told by other people and never shown from her Team STRQ really needed a flashback episode or arc
I’ve been hoping for a revelation that Summer wasn’t the perfect goal to aspire towards for Ruby for a long while, because honestly, she’s not. Don’t get me wrong, I don’t think she was awful as Rigger Jokingly theorized, but she’s probably far, FAR from perfect. She’s human, just as Rigger said, or at least should be. Raven is a good case study of this. If Summer had been perfect, she would’ve gotten through to Raven, not left her hating Summer and everyone else for that matter. Imagine it from Raven’s perspective, of seeing her friend always pushing to be better and her team to be better, to be the heroes, when Raven knew in her heart, that she wasn’t a hero, and never wanted to be one. Imagine how trying that would be, to constantly be shown this almost cartoonish version of what it means to be a Huntress. A version that Raven likely knows is a fallacy by the way, probably having seen her share of her own Bandit clan lose more than a few people to Hunters/Huntresses who just didn’t care about bringing in prisoners. And while struggling with the idea that Raven has to go back to her clan, only to realize far to late that Crow drank Summer’s Kool-aid too, and so had Tai who knows how long ago. I mean think about how many crazy dangerous plans/choices Summer may have made for her team if, after having a daughter, she decided to go fight the seemingly eternal villain all on her own. Additionally, I know there is a lot of talk of Ruby and Summer getting some face-to-face time. I for one dislike this idea. Never mind that it’s a bit cliché, especially given that Summer is dead or worse, but more than that, it invalidates the growth Ruby has to endure after the talk. Big talks almost always don’t solve the problem in real life, they’re the first steps towards it maybe, but just as often they are just that, talks. Even if it does help, if it solves all of Ruby’s issues instantly, it won’t really feel earned. Change is never instant. Especially with people. Plus, a face to face robs Ruby of making the choice on her own. Of realizing her mother failed and as a result abandoned Ruby. Obviously not intentionally, but still, it’s what happened. And if you follow that chain long enough, it’s also why Ruby wants to stop being herself. She can still love her mom, find inspiration in her, but like Rigger suggested, grow beyond what Summer was. Long story short, Ruby shouldn’t be told that Summer was wrong. Maybe she can see scenes of her mother that show that her idolized picture of her was wrong, but still, I don’t want a big talk. Ruby has to come to it herself or it’s just handing her the answer. In my opinion anyway. She should, as Rigger said, abandon trying to become Summer, and be herself instead, whoever that is. It’ll also be how they end up ‘defeating’ Salem. It won’t be with violence or magic or anything. I suspect it’ll be the single small soul reaching out to the monster, and somehow getting through to Salem. Also also, I find Rigger’s cynicism of creators stringing along, also cute. Don’t get me wrong, he’s absolutely right. Like RT could pull the rug out at us at any point because, why wouldn’t they? But just your (Rigger) deadpan of that fact was brilliant.
What if roosterteeth decided to make a Deus ex Machina move where team WBY and Jaune decided to go back in time using that clock tree before the Paper Pleasers death and confront Ruby before she lashes out.
Look everyone wiss Blake yang and jaune are going to go save ruby rose and neo and help get ruby rose back on her feet she not giving up her self help her and she not giving up her cloak her weapon crescent rose and her emblem her moms emblem she getting back up again she has friends an connection
While I very appreciate the writers finally getting around to deal with the emotional complex that Ruby has towards her mother that was described in Red Like Roses Pt 2, I have VERY mixed feelings about it. To me, it almost feels like they are doing it as a response to the outcry from the FNDM for there not being ANY Summer related plot in the first 6 seasons, despite Summer being implied to have played a major role in the events prior to the show itself. And then in Vol 7, we out of nowhere get Salem's comment about Summer as a way to break Ruby's spirit. And them couple more pieces in Vol 8. And now in Vol 9, we're finally attempting to deal with the topic of depression stemming from multiple fronts, but not in forefront, but as a secondary plot to service the main plot. To me, it feels all sorts of wrong and improper. Maybe tomorrow's episode will correct and finally do the character Ruby justice in actually making her emotional trauma the main focus of the episode while pushing the man plot of the show to the background.
@@YouAllWrite I'm really hopin Ruby doesn't become her mom PHYSICALLY, and with this new episode that seems like almost exactly what she is about to do
@@YouAllWrite haha im going thru a bit of a ruff patch so this kinda messed with me. this has been on my mind thru this volume and having it acknowledged kind of hit a bit harder then I like to admit. thanks for making the vid dude.
Red Like Roses Part 2
Summer: "You're not the only one who needed me, I thought you understood"
Ruby: You were the one I needed, And you left me as I always feared you would"
S: "Would I change it if I could?"
R: It doesn't matter how,
The petals scatter now
Every nightmare just discloses
It's your blood that's red like roses
And no matter what I do
Nothing ever takes the place of you
It's the discovery that every child eventually makes about their mother and father. As we're growing up, we view our parents as larger than life, giants, heroes. Even idolize them. Eventually, we learn things that we didn't know, about who they really are outside of being "mom and dad". About the PEOPLE that they were, not the parents they were. Sometimes, it can hurt learning that stuff. That your heroes really are just people, for better or worse. But by learning those truths, we step outside of them and become someone that is completely our own, again, for better or worse. I very much look forward to seeing who Ruby becomes.
I do like the idea of having Summer not being the best model to follow. It would nice to show the parallels that Ruby and Summer have, maybe even show that Summer also had the idea of being a hero and taking on everything by herself until it led to her death and have Ruby take that and change how her mindset is. Show that you can't always put everything else first. You need to value yourself too.
Dude, we don’t know if she’s dead yet and all I know she survived from her fight from Salem
I hope she's alive but if she is based on what we saw with the hound it could get Grim.
I like the idea of Ruby becoming herself instead of a second Summer. It could be a really heavy, but inspirational episode. While technically they could have Ruby reach this revelation without Summer being the one to talk to her, I can't think of any other way that would be remotely as satisfying. I really hope we get to see Summer during Ruby's Ascension.
I think the Female Voice from the first line of Vol9 Ep1 will end up being revealed as Summer before this season concludes...
Do you who the voice actress is?
@@marvinvasquez9437 Voice actress was credited as Morgan Laure. She has not done any other work in RWBY, so... She was hired to deliver that single line? Not likely...
If Ruby does give up her cloak I hope she gets a red scarf instead.
She can borrow Weiss' she randomly had for volume 6.
No way ruby rose is not giving up her cloak she like the cloak
But she's Red Riding Hood
Better yet Dishwasher910's drape Ruby design
@@irkenpony17
Then replace the cloak with a hoodie.
Problem solved!
Well considering that little bit with her in the last episode, she might turn out to be suspect.
I keep wondering if she might turn out to be some kind of devoted agent of the brothers. That this whole war is the brothers’ ideal “balance” and they have agents who manipulate things to make sure no one side actually wins. Maybe that’s what the silver eye warriors are really meant to be. Servants of the “eternal balance”.
Honestly that whole theory just came to me on a whim one day when I realized we don’t really know
Much of anything about Summer.
I mean, Red Like Roses Part 2 has summer tell Ruby to "please don't do what I did" as she doesn't want her to waste her life.
If we get a Red Like Roses Part 3 I swear to god. . .
I will be a bawling mess
I like the idea of Ruby giving up her hood, slowly transitioning into more of maybe the Wizard of Oz inspirations like the ruby/silver slippers and Dorothy
If that happens hearing Red Like Roses-Final Part would be cathartic.
“I am not a reflection of my mother . I am ruby. I am ruby!”
We are so getting a red like roses part 3!
There is a really great fanfic out there called "how it feels" that does a good job briefly exploring it. Ruby has idealization of her mom because her family only ever told her the good stories. That idealization leads her to start developing some self destructive habbits and so they are forced to break it by telling about a time she messed up and basically got people killed. Good read for those who like that kind of thing.
Also, just gonna drop this here instead of waiting for the next video. My prediction/fear for the end of the show: the relics are brought together, the brothers are summoned, and Ruby makes some sort of self sacrifice to unite everyone and convince the brothers to spare humanity. It has that bittersweet ending that alot of anime uses and matches well with the "victory not in strength" line from the beginning of the show. I don't want that ending, but I can see it happening.
Oh, oh, oh. I literally just thought of an ending I think I could really like. The relics are brought together, the gods are summoned, but -instead of passing judgment themselves - ask the spirits of the relics. "We gave you to mankind to better themsleves. How have they used your power?" The spirits start by talking about how they were abused for power and wealth, then were locked away out of fear. But then they talk about a small, simple soul that only ever used them to help others. Using the last question, not to learn how to vanquish her enemies, but to save a city. Using the power to build anything, not to make the ultimate weapon, but to protect innocent lives. And, when faced with the choice of laying down her burdens and abandoning her loved ones, ultimately chose to keep pushing forwards. Humanity is deemed flawed but redeemable (in keeping with the theme you mentioned). The world is saved. Happy ending.
I appreciate this video so much
A few days ago I wrote a short mini rewrite where Summer talks to Ruby and convinces her not to switch places with her in the tree, and it includes several points made in this video (i hadn't seen it yet) and I was excited to share it with RWBY fans. I got hate-voted by a handful of awful people and told that because my rewrite didn't get rid of Ruby drinking the tea in the first place I was supporting suicide, etc. I wish I had encountered better fans.
She could TEMPORARILY become a “Summer Huntress” and get dragged back to remnant and brought to her mom’s grave because the heart never forgets. Jog her memory through the places they go to. The people she sees. Bring back their Ruby and get a glimpse at who Summer was in a sense at the same time.
as much as i like the idea of changing ruby's design drastically as she steps out of summer's shadow, marketing and the basic rules of character design would not allow that to happen. like imagine if you took naruto, put him in a grey and red cyberpunk clothes and then have the man a different cut. you would loss both brand and character recignizability.
Red and green would be great for ruby
We will finally get our scene to go with Red like roses part ii.
I’m glad red like roses part II was discussed bc I was actually thinking abt that song in relation to Ruby’s ascension
"You are right. You are not me, nor should you be me. You are Tenzin." -Avatar Aang, Legend of Korra Book 2 Spirits. Single best part of the worst season of Avatar.
I do like this idea of Summer not being the model person everyone says she was, esspecially given thats all we are told about Summer is she was this model people looked up to shes a bit to perfect and usually in shows when your told someones perfect, they are usually far from it (And the resverse is also true to).
For example from another show i'm watching "Witch from Mercury" the main character in the first few episodes says how wonderful her mum is only when we see the mom she gives off more evil vibes then Darth Vader, now this is an extream example but it's still true that idolized figures often aren't perfect in media.
Also as an idea if this is true, but i would wonder if Yang knew more then she let on like she saw glimpses of Summer not being all sunshine and rainbows but tricked herself after Summer died that Summer was perfect.
I was just thinking about this yesterday. My thoughts were that the loss of Summer is the seed of pain that has been the root of her drive from the jump, but also the biggest thing holding her back in several ways. It is a piece of unaddressed trauma and until it is handled, she'll still be bottling up her problems. It is also the source she attempts to use to fuel her Silver Eyes, but as a memory that is not just inspiring but also painful, it'll always be contaminated by that association with the pain of loss. We've seen the result of that: the use of her Silver Eyes is unreliable and inconsistent. She has to let go of any sense of inherited responsibility (even if it is partially unescapable due to her birth traits), but take on a responsibility that she chooses, and chooses the reasons for.
Everyone is flawed, so even if Summer doesn't turn out to be overtly flawed, it would be immensely helpful to Ruby if there were a way she could be led to understanding that and applying it to her mother as well. Even if Summer isn't overtly flawed, she cannot rely on the memory of the dead, and a painful one at that, to inspire her to protect the living; doing so is relying on the fear of loss, but what she truly needs to rely on is the strength of what she has.
One thing that has concerned me is how things will wrap up in only two more episodes. I've assuaged my concern with the thought that even if Ruby decides on a new direction for herself, a new way of living, and a new drive...that sort of change does not come about instantaneously, at least not realistically. It takes practice, continued effort, possible slip-ups and regressions in thought processes. Her change is something that can and should unfold over the following Volumes. I would hate to see her growth process entirely handwaved via magic.
5:20 Well, another part of the problem with telling Summer's story instead is, assuming for a moment that STRK was the team that was present in this time to take on Salem, the team was unstable, in at least a significant part due to Raven's loyalty to the tribe. Team RWBY is seemingly managing to pull itself together much better than STRK could, which is why we're watching them and not STRK. It's as much about the team composition as it is about Ruby.
6:35 Silver Eyes are powered by the desire to protect, and you can't protect the dead.
11:30 I have my own theory that is grounded in both the mechanics and themes of the show, but I'll be curious to hear your thoughts.
13:50 It is worth noting that the Maidens as a concept didn't exist in the narrative until between Volumes 2 and 3. While it is entirely possible that they could've changed their mind on where the girls end up at the end of the show, there was something they found satisfying that did not rely on them becoming Maidens to achieve.
17:30 I do wonder if this is the reason for the line "Nothing. No one is ever truly lost."
Thank you! I agree Ruby needs to figure herself out and who she is.
Will she keep her cloak crescent rose
I never seen the series in full just tidbits, but it seems like Summer is being set up like a Pink Diamond scenario like in Steven Universe, How everyone idolized Rose, but ya know...
True to that
I would argue that probably is the lesson she has to learn, to quit chasing the shadows of the dead. They're dead for a reason. Especially for this kind of story.
Also, on the tangent regarding Summer not being a saint and actually maybe was someone who may have gotten too full of themselves and that Raven was not only right but has good reason not to like Summer? That actually would not only humanize but add some characterization to a character that isn't in play.
Very thoughtful as always. Thank you.
Cheers!
I debated one concept with a friend. Regarding her fair tail. Ruby is going through a rebirth from little red to someone who succeeds in being a protector. But it dosent change ruby's fair tail. So she goes from little red who couldn't defeat the wolf. And change her to the lumberjack who could. It would fit with the new weapon the blacksmith had as well as her adapting in a mature way.
Ruby could combine Summer’s style with her own unique style. After Ruby finds out the truth and realises that Summer wasn’t perfect, she can then learn from her mother’s mistakes and finally become RUBY. She can still keep the red cape as a tribute to Summer, but branch out and discover who she really is. Ditch the corset and the skirt like you said, but keep the cape and other red accents as a way to honour Summer without becoming a clone of her and going down the same path that she did.
As for Salem being defeated, I don’t think she will. I do think they’ll find a way to stop her from being a threat, but I don’t think there’s any demise waiting for her. Maybe the cat will possess Salem and take all 4 relics in order to summon the Gods, destroying Salem in the process (not physically, but essentially brainwashing her). Perhaps if possession doesn’t leave any lasting impacts, the cat might somehow (I don’t know how) convince the Gods to remove Salem’s immortality. It’s a bit of a stretch, but it’s interesting to see how you would theoretically take down a villain who isn’t capable of dying.
Raven knew the truth, Friendship is not magic.
Magic is magic
A maiden would indeed know the realities of magic. She's speaking from an informed position.
Here's my thing about it. Ruby doesn't know summer that's true. But she knows enough that her mother was a good person and I can imagine she and yang especially know that she wasn't the perfect mom. A super mom sure but perfect? It's never been implied and was perfect.
Hell Qrow straight up calls her a brat but that he liked that about her. Plus we need to remember Ruby doesn't exactly know what summer did or what her thought process was though judging by the lyrics of red like roses? Summer wanted to united others against Salem but everyone had given up and she was likely the only one who could hope to try and stop her.
So she went to fight and never came back. I think for Ruby that summer serves as a symbol of hope. A vision of something ideal that she can look to because I imagine deep down Ruby blames herself for her mother leaving in this sense.
"She left to protect me. She didn't want me to walk to path but I am anyway, I have to make her proud. I can't let her have died for nothing."
I don't think it's necessary to destroy or tear down the image of summer in ruby's mind. More so give her clarity and closure, have someone; preferably a vision of summer; tell her that it's okay to just be yourself. You aren't summer rose. You are Ruby Rose.
I see it the same way I see Deku and All Might. Yeah they have the same powers and all that but Deku eventually learns to stop copying all might in everything he does and he's better off for it but it isnt like he stops admiring all might.
If ascending means she can come back as anything or anyone, and we are limiting the stories to common legends, then she could come back as princess Kaguya from the Tail of the bamboo cutter. She could go to the moon and fight the gods and “Ruby” could mean the gown of the fire rat that she wears. And yes, I realize that’s probably not what they were going to do, but in the classic sprit of Rooster Teeth’s rule of cool, I think it would be awesome to see.
I don’t see this fully happening. While I can see Ruby coming to understand that Summer did have hew own flaws like everyone else AND learning to care for herself while helping others at the same, I feel she will see admire her in a way
Fucked up idea: Ruby gets over her idolization of Summer by having the ascension remove all her memories of Summer she had.
Summer being evil would've been CRWBY going all Rose Quartz/Pink Diamond on everyone.
Bit of a correction. Not all hero stories follow the Hero's Journey, nor do they have to follow such a structure to succeed as a story. It's one of many structures. That said, I don't disagree that this is what's going on.
Within the Hero's Journey, the living must die to their illusions and enter into the land of the dead in order to discover the truth which restores life to the land of the living. It's the whole "the night is always darkest just before the dawn" manifested in literary structure. You must be willing to sacrifice your illusions to discover truth, after all.
I didn't mean to imply that "all" heroes journey's follow that structure because that would be ridiculous, simply that it's a very popular well known and proven structure with a heavy dominance in fiction over time. A common structure that many recognisable classic narratives are built off of.
@@YouAllWrite Ah, I misunderstood you then. Thank you for clarifying.
I have seen people genuinely say that the Hero's Journey structure is the basis of all hero stories and that they should conform to it, so I'm glad that is not the case here.
listen to the first 20 seconds of the volume 2 opening
Well there is a saying (sorry-older person) that a person never realizes their true potential until they surpass their parents. And the saying comes from the culture that Monty hails from. Just saying.
As for the how to defeat Salem, I think if the cat makes it to Remnant, another creature if real magic, that may have something to do with it.
Most things don't last* forever but especially not idealism, escapism
Just to vent. I hate Summer's new clothes because it throws out the previous image we had of her
Summer was sometimes completely erased by the story, Yang said she was a perfect mom but then completely forgot about her for 2 volumes and then suddenly remembers her. No one talked about her ever so we had to grab the little we had for her.
The picture, the flashbacks and thats it. And in those she seemed to be very shy, characters that cover themselves tend to show they don't want attention. Summer was not only that she scrunched over herself and with shy manners and then in the new volume not only is her clothes not carrying her main color which is white. Ruby is a red rose and Summer is a white one, her cloak is almost not seen
Yes yes she is an adult now, but so was she on her first flashback where she turns around. I feel like once again they erased the previous image of her to glue on their new vision. At least established how that change came, from shy to what we see but all we know about her is told by other people and never shown from her
Team STRQ really needed a flashback episode or arc
Ruby was getting the Steven Universe treatment.
to be honest, the ascension theory on ruby rose makes me uncomfortable, because i'm afraid i don't recognize it anymore After.
I wonder if this means Ruby will get a new weapon or change her semblance.
You meant to type evolved
@@marvinvasquez9437 Maybe, it was 12 hours ago and today was a odd one. i'm not sure anymore
"no more skirts"
me: how dare you?
I’ve been hoping for a revelation that Summer wasn’t the perfect goal to aspire towards for Ruby for a long while, because honestly, she’s not.
Don’t get me wrong, I don’t think she was awful as Rigger Jokingly theorized, but she’s probably far, FAR from perfect. She’s human, just as Rigger said, or at least should be.
Raven is a good case study of this. If Summer had been perfect, she would’ve gotten through to Raven, not left her hating Summer and everyone else for that matter. Imagine it from Raven’s perspective, of seeing her friend always pushing to be better and her team to be better, to be the heroes, when Raven knew in her heart, that she wasn’t a hero, and never wanted to be one. Imagine how trying that would be, to constantly be shown this almost cartoonish version of what it means to be a Huntress. A version that Raven likely knows is a fallacy by the way, probably having seen her share of her own Bandit clan lose more than a few people to Hunters/Huntresses who just didn’t care about bringing in prisoners. And while struggling with the idea that Raven has to go back to her clan, only to realize far to late that Crow drank Summer’s Kool-aid too, and so had Tai who knows how long ago. I mean think about how many crazy dangerous plans/choices Summer may have made for her team if, after having a daughter, she decided to go fight the seemingly eternal villain all on her own.
Additionally, I know there is a lot of talk of Ruby and Summer getting some face-to-face time. I for one dislike this idea. Never mind that it’s a bit cliché, especially given that Summer is dead or worse, but more than that, it invalidates the growth Ruby has to endure after the talk. Big talks almost always don’t solve the problem in real life, they’re the first steps towards it maybe, but just as often they are just that, talks. Even if it does help, if it solves all of Ruby’s issues instantly, it won’t really feel earned. Change is never instant. Especially with people. Plus, a face to face robs Ruby of making the choice on her own. Of realizing her mother failed and as a result abandoned Ruby. Obviously not intentionally, but still, it’s what happened. And if you follow that chain long enough, it’s also why Ruby wants to stop being herself. She can still love her mom, find inspiration in her, but like Rigger suggested, grow beyond what Summer was.
Long story short, Ruby shouldn’t be told that Summer was wrong. Maybe she can see scenes of her mother that show that her idolized picture of her was wrong, but still, I don’t want a big talk. Ruby has to come to it herself or it’s just handing her the answer. In my opinion anyway. She should, as Rigger said, abandon trying to become Summer, and be herself instead, whoever that is. It’ll also be how they end up ‘defeating’ Salem. It won’t be with violence or magic or anything. I suspect it’ll be the single small soul reaching out to the monster, and somehow getting through to Salem.
Also also, I find Rigger’s cynicism of creators stringing along, also cute. Don’t get me wrong, he’s absolutely right. Like RT could pull the rug out at us at any point because, why wouldn’t they? But just your (Rigger) deadpan of that fact was brilliant.
rather have her talking with mom for closure.
I’d like if Ruby comes back as a Dorothy from the Wizard of Oz instead of Red Riding Hood. Her name can be a reference to the ruby slippers 👀
@16:40 GAMORA D:< i was so mad.
Every time I think of this, I just think that it would be too much like Steven universe. Idk it could work but my brain is just stuck like that.
Can you do analysis on jaune arc development what purpose is he trying to find himself please he has to have something.
10/10 Thumbnail
What if roosterteeth decided to make a Deus ex Machina move where team WBY and Jaune decided to go back in time using that clock tree before the Paper Pleasers death and confront Ruby before she lashes out.
Red queen ruby ?
.... well you were kinda right?
Look everyone wiss Blake yang and jaune are going to go save ruby rose and neo and help get ruby rose back on her feet she not giving up her self help her and she not giving up her cloak her weapon crescent rose and her emblem her moms emblem she getting back up again she has friends an connection
What mean this?
While I very appreciate the writers finally getting around to deal with the emotional complex that Ruby has towards her mother that was described in Red Like Roses Pt 2, I have VERY mixed feelings about it. To me, it almost feels like they are doing it as a response to the outcry from the FNDM for there not being ANY Summer related plot in the first 6 seasons, despite Summer being implied to have played a major role in the events prior to the show itself. And then in Vol 7, we out of nowhere get Salem's comment about Summer as a way to break Ruby's spirit. And them couple more pieces in Vol 8. And now in Vol 9, we're finally attempting to deal with the topic of depression stemming from multiple fronts, but not in forefront, but as a secondary plot to service the main plot. To me, it feels all sorts of wrong and improper. Maybe tomorrow's episode will correct and finally do the character Ruby justice in actually making her emotional trauma the main focus of the episode while pushing the man plot of the show to the background.
Hello
Hi
@@YouAllWrite bonjour
Okay I know this is a little but bear with.. what if little was actually rubys mom ascended?
This didn’t age well
Why? It still seems like it's exactly what might path we might be going on
@@YouAllWrite I'm really hopin Ruby doesn't become her mom PHYSICALLY, and with this new episode that seems like almost exactly what she is about to do
@@dantethefan9654 which is the dumbest thing ever
@@arkdragon222 Agreed. There is so many weird things that come from that that are just icky
shit this almost made me cry. lol
That's honestly my favourite compliment I can get on any video.
@@YouAllWrite haha im going thru a bit of a ruff patch so this kinda messed with me. this has been on my mind thru this volume and having it acknowledged kind of hit a bit harder then I like to admit. thanks for making the vid dude.
@@cthulhu_zf7635 No problem at all mate and I hope you feel better soon. Best of luck with whatever you're going through, I'm rooting for you!
@@YouAllWrite thanks.