Bischoff thought he was boring the listeners with his in-depth talk on story structures n characters. I appreciated every word. Many of us from that era share the same opinion as E. Matches, athletism etc are a foundation of the business. But captivating, intense well-told stories are just as and even more important to me. Wwe hit 6 to 7million viewers during the attitude era. I timed a few episodes back then. The average amount of time spent on matches from 9 to 11 o clock was 25 minutes. And they had millions of viewers who are non wrestling fans like my grandmother, hooked on the storylines while not giving a damn about wrestling.
They say the Sting NWO storyline in 97 was the best storyline of WCW. Hell to me that’s the best storyline of wrestling period. There will never be another one like it. I know everyone says Austin and McMahon, but in my opinion that was just a great feud. Sting turning dark in general was just a storyline and was relatable in many ways. A person who always carried the load of who was always there for others and he got taken for granted and once he loyalty was questioned, he drifted off on his own and hid in the shadows. Every week you felt that emotion and Steve Borden played that so well. It was like an ongoing movie and yeah that Starrcade ending was botched but it still was an amazing story. There’s not a storyline close to that at all.
I wanna live on some property like Bischoff has: Just walk out on the front of my porch or patio & look at the deer just running by,a lake showing a reflection of nature,a morning cup of coffee just enjoying nature
He sold his soul to the N W O for that property and ruined his reputation as a good guy. Is the money the fame and the smoking hot wife (google her playboy pics) worth it? #fuckyeah
WCW was Amazing Years in 1997 NWO Cool fraction Rey mysterio vs Eddie Guerrieo Halloween havoc 1997 best ever matches goldberg debut sting and hollywood hogan longest good build ups starrcade 1997 .
At about an hour in, Eric tells a great story. Then he goes on to say how the early morning shows are great because he has so much energy. Eric, as much as I love those shows, my favorites are the one's where half way through, you're loaded and slurring your words. That's when we get how Eric really feels. Love the show, guys.
The match should have been a 5 to 8 minute squash match with Sting going over with a clean win and have the Nwo interfere as well. Have a total squash match, with the seeds of an n.W.o split. That’s how they should have entered the year 1998 with but Hogan didn’t want to lose his spot and pretty much convinced Bischoff with another finish which only benefited Hogan. Sad that Bischoff still doesn’t realize that Hogan played him and is still playing him to this day.
@@vinnysoori4512 the end is always the best part of any story..... and is also the hardest thing to get right. Wcw had no end game for the nwo story, and part of it is due to politics and creative control
The dummy angle from December 8 was one of the most awesome angles I have seen in nearly thirty years of fandom. Unfortunately, due to the Owen Hart accident, we will never see anything like it again. WCW in the fall and winter of 1997 in general was probably my favourite wrestling programming of all time.
Closest thing we have had in recent modern history is the Okada/Omega feud that spanned two years. Omega failed several times before finally besting Okada at Dominion to end his 2 year reign, which also involved a lot of Bullet Club/The Elite inner turmoil and several other feuds.
Hey Mr. Bishop I’m watching world war 3 1996 I love how Piper was talk to u and you took it like man Merry Christmas I hope you’re blessed I pray that God gives what u want
@@Tony-fq5bn I don't know about the best story-line but some story-lines that were better were the formation of the corporation or Mcmahon-Helmsley era. Those stories were much more multilayered and complex than the NWO storyline.
@@blueblur2329 I def take nWo over any other storyline of all time, its scope was just SO huge, and it acted as a catalyst for all the things we love in wrestling like wrestlers jumping from promotion to promotion, shocking heel turns(BEFORE they lost control of the story) etc There were cool things about the McMahon Helmsley Era, but overall I thought it was pretty standard heel stuff, and only HHH really shined from it, not even the other DX member got a rub from it. nWo ended up burying the whole company eventually, but for the first two years it got the entire company over, and multiple people within the nWo had career rejuvenatons , like Hulk/6ixx/Buff Bagwell/Scoot Steiner/Konnan/The Outsiders/etc
@@Tony-fq5bn Well actually wrestlers were jumping from promotion to promotion before the NWO. Luger jumped from the WWF to WCW on Nitro's premier. In any case, the reasons you stated is why I said it was definitely the hottest story line angle because of the grand scale and impact it had. But I don't think it's the best because it's incredibly simple. Yea the Hulk turn was shocking but it eventually got to the point where they just kept turning people to the point where it wasn't shocking but annoying. By the time guys like Macho and Kurt joined it was like enough already. Also there was not much to the story other than the NWO coming down to beat up WCW wrestlers until Sting came and beat Hogan. After Sting beat Hogan the NWO just continued to do the same thing they were doing before as if Sting beating Hogan meant nothing. To sum it up, a simple story with a great beginning but horrible ending because it didn't know when to stop. The Austin and Mcmahon feuds, the Corporation storyline, the Mcmahon-Helsmley storyline had twist and turns throughout the story and most importantly knew when to stop.
i love the way bischoff bullshits it's a great skill. he talk until you forget what he;s talking about and then he laughs and jokes so you go alomg with it
Absolutely. When I was younger I always thought people called his character “the ‘crow’ Sting,” purely because he looks like The Crow. It wasn’t until much later that I learned it wasn’t just the look, like Sting became a “spirit of vengeance” against the NWO for taking over WCW and making the Fans and his friends doubt him and his integrity. Just like how The Crow in the movie becomes a spirit of vengeance against the mobsters that killed him and his wife. Once I learned Sting had that “spirit of vengeance,” aspect in that angle I was even more shocked WCW never got sued. 😂
I always been a wrestling fan but 1997 definetly made me watch religiously again. nWo and Sting was an amazing storyline. Also, Jeff Farmer looked so much like sting when he had the face paint on
Booking like 8-10 month arcs sound good but in reality, you don’t know who might get injured, who might get white hot and, especially with today’s marks, who they might turn on because he’s not doing a million dives.
Eric says he appreciates good characters and storylines and that’s the area where current wrestling is lacking. I’m right there with him and I think that’s a really nice way of saying creative sucks these days 😂
I enjoyed listening to Bischoff's take on Starrcade '97 on this episode. The fact he wasn't as indignant as before made it much easier to see Eric's perspective more clearly. And I definitely buy his argument. Anyone who wants to criticize Bischoff's decision-making that night needs to concede that Sting's lack of preparedness is what precipitated that whole disaster. It really isn't fair to dump it all on Bischoff's head, because he was handed a bad situation at the last minute and I think a lot of folks would've botched it just as easily. That said, I wish Bischoff would just admit that he was the one who called for the fast three-count. I don't think anyone would judge him for that, especially after this episode.
Why would Bischoff not be monitoring Sting's shape heading into the PPV? And if it was that big of a deal then don't give Sting the belt. You don't book Hogan as a coward for a year then have him beat Sting up the whole match and pin him clean.
@@kevinlee9929 I don't know, except to say Sting's an adult and pro wrestlers are expected largely to take care of themselves. As Bischoff pointed out, "ring rust" wasn't the problem. The implication seems to be that Sting showing up unprepared came as a surprise to everyone on the day of Starrcade. I'm not excusing Bischoff's decision-making, but face it, that was a bad situation he was placed into and it all comes down to Sting not being prepared like he should've.
@@RightCenterBack321 But how did it not dawn on Bischoff to keep tabs on Sting's physical condition? At the end of the day he's the boss and blame falls on him no different than it does Vince.
@@kevinlee9929 Hindsight is 20/20. WCW is comprised of tens of performers. If Bischoff needs to literally babysit one of his top performers, is it really a top performer? If Bischoff is babysitting talent, then nobody would want to work for him anyway.
Eric makes me mad sometimes but he drops jewels every podcast... Thank you..... BTW he made me mad with this episode by not telling us the wrestler he planned on using in 97... WTF meanie 😂😂😂
To all my fellow diehard fans correct me if I'm wrong but I believe the first person to rappel down from the ceiling was actually Sgt. Craig Pittman at the Great American Bash 1995
And on the other program, Rocky Maivia turned heel and showed off impressive oratory skills, Shawn Michaels, Hunter Hearst Helmsley and Chyna began to mock everyone, Rockabilly and Jesse James changed their stupid gimmicks, Mick Foley told his life story, The Hart Foundation hated Americans and Steve Austin assaulted his bosses while cursing and drinking alcohol.
That all sounds great in hindsight or is interesting when you re-watch it but they werent famous back then. To the normal viewer it was just "some guy does...whatever, who gives a shit". All the big established names from the early 90s with a few exceptions were in WCW
There’s probably no bigger Surfer Sting fan than me and still love those years w Sting as the super white meat blonde babyface but it was time in 96 for a change and it all worked out.
I'm a huge fan of WCW with this being said what is Eric talking about. If the NWO wasn't a long-term plan, if Sting wasn't a long-term plan and if Goldberg wasn't a long-term plan then what was and where was this Incorporated in his storytelling?
I’m like Bischoff, I will always fall back on great story and characters. Whether that’s in TV, video games, movies, or books. If it doesn’t have characters and stories that I can enjoy, it doesn’t matter how good it looks, it’s inferior to something with a good story and characters. Everytime. Major budgets or smaller budget, story and characters you can care about and watch grow and develop is always more important than flashy hollowness. Kinda weird to bring up on a wrestling podcast but that’s why I play JRPG video games. They have very deep stories, with well fleshed out characters and character development and in-depth worlds that while they couldn’t be real in our world, do feel believable because of logical consistency. To me shit like Fortnite or CoD, they’re just hollow games appealing to the lowest common denominator. Give me a game with great characters, an in-depth story, and a fleshed out world that’s interesting, and I’m set. It doesn’t gotta be the prettiest most realistic game on the market, just give me something to care about and that all I need.
Sting during this era was the single reason why I started watching wrestling. And then they screwed him at Starrcade. It really is so messed up because after listening to all the events that went on to the match , Sting (Steve Borden) put on an epic performance that only he could do and put the company on the map. Not speaking for a year, flying down from the ceiling, propelling back up, zip lining across the arena etc etc etc... shame on them
Joe Whittle I was 12 during that time so I didn’t understand it. I just remembered not understanding why his belt was taken away. Now that I’m older it’s really messed up to see what really happened
Bischoff said that Sting didn’t take anyone in the air since DDP. Not true. In early 1998 he pulled Macho Man into the air as well when Macho vs Hogan feud started
I have much respect for bischoff however seems like he's better than us had then it is an actuality. TNA years WCW recently in WWE seems like he should have had much better outcomes if his planning was this good ☮️
@@bigbaba1491 Hogan could execute like 5 moves and his finisher was pathetic. He was the best at promos in early days of WWF, but I think Hogan was massively overrated.
1997 sting was the fucking SHIT! KING SHIT! OF FUCKING AWESOME MOUNTAIN! And sadly the pay off was a dud...but I fucking live for that build up! And the career that followed is still amazing!
Oh let me clarify : His point to Sting, it's like coming to work not wanting to be bothered like almost in a foul mood, performance needs to be positive and they need to be engaged and really excited..they were about to give the biggest Belt to him and Sting was like whatever
I can point to a wrestling story that lasted more than a month that was close to as good as the Sting vs Hogan build. Taker vs Kane and Austin vs McMahon.
The match wasn't that bad, but the finish being botched is pretty inexcusable for a multi million dollar corporation. Bischoff seems to be a truthful person overall.
I am confused. He is talking about mean gene coming over from WWF and how they are crafting their great storylines or whatever....where did he come from? The future? What great storylines did they plan a year in advance? How the pirate stole bret harts leather jacket or the race car driver fighting with the evil clown? WWF was the shits in the early 90s and they didnt have real storytelling going on. All of that came later when mean gene was already at WCW. And quite frankly, i hated that overscripted shit from later WWE where everything is written like a soap opera and follows some stupid story, i liked WCW spontaneous style because it felt more organic and spontaneous, WWE felt like a TV show while WCW felt like a sports broadcast most of the time. Fuck all these "you burned my parents house down now we feud for 6 months" like some stupid TV series. In WCW it was mostly about somebody wanting that belt and win that championship. Before the belt was devalued on purpouse by Vince russo
Sting was my favorite as a kid. Even over Hogan. Even over Warrior. It was sad to see him get old and slow down. The WWE tried to kill off the man they call Sting. To bring him in so late in his run and squash him like that was BS. He probably didn't care too much by that point. Surely he got 6 figures for Wrestlemania.
Yeah but having the NWO come rescue him from DX when they had so many old young gen wrestlers from WCW they could havw done a whole civil war angle. The NWO saving him made ZERO sense. Thats when I stopped watching as i knew thry werent going to let him win id have accepted NWO coming to beat him down but not saving him.
I have a contrarian take on this whole angle...It was too long and drawn out and by early summer, I went back to WWE to see what was going on with Austin and the Hart Foundation. By the time the payoff happened, it was barely a blip on the radar. I think I wasn't the only one, as look how fast the WWE gained momentum going into 1998 (spearheaded by the Tyson angle)
I agree it was too long but mostly because they could have done a better job on filling out the story getting there. However to say by the time the payoff happened it was a blip on the radar is just incorrect. That Starrcade was the highest profiting ppv in WCW history because of that storyline. Also The WWF didn't beat WCW in the ratings in 98 until April. So it wasn't exactly fast considering they went into the Attiude Era in Dec. 97.
@@blueblur2329 It was a blip if you had gone to the other wrestling company that was giving you their best talent night after night. Watching Austin blossom (among other things) was better than endless foreshadowing of Sting getting his (eventual) payoff. The endless NWO run-ins also wore thin.
@@hitmangfx7162 I have the network and have recently watched both companies in 97. The WWF's talent in 97 was seriously lacking compared to WCW's talent. Which made the WWF harder to watch considering there were only a few characters you were invested in even though the actual story telling was slightly better. WCW had tons of great characters/talent in Hogan, Scott Hall, Kevin Nash, Sting, DDP, Lex Luger, Macho Man, Roddy Piper, Ric Flair, Arn Anderson, the Giant, the Steiners, Harlem Heat, Rey Mysterio, Eddie Guerrero, Chris Jericho, Chris Benoit, Dean Malenko, Raven and an upcoming Goldberg compared to the WWF who really only had Austin, Undertaker, Bret Hart, Shawn Michaels, Mankind, and Kane. So yea having recently rewatched that entire year I would take WCW over the WWF.
@@blueblur2329 WCW had talent, they were either underutilized or overexposed. Much of the talent in WWE was either new or repackaged in ways that were fresh/unusual. You left out the Rock (and the rest of the Nation), Ken Shamrock, HHH, Owen and Bulldog (and Vader). In 1996, yes, WCW won on talent and storylines. In 1997, I felt WCW had the edge in talent but they were coasting and this Sting angle is what allowed WWE to rally and start building momentum with a less-deep roster. It set up WWE's monster 1998 and by the end of that year, it was over. Imagine if Goldberg hadn't burst onto the scene. Also, I don't need the Network...I LIVED this era in highschool. In 1996, NWO shirts all over the schoolyard, everyone was "NWO 4 lyfe". 1997 and well beyond? Austin 3:16 shirts, people "stunning" each other during gym class. The ratings lagged the WWE's momentum by a good six months before the 83 weeks proper was up.
@@hitmangfx7162Clearly you do need the network because you're wrong. You can't be seriously gauging how hot the NWO was based on how many kids were wearing NWO and Austin shirts in your class. 😑 C'mon let's be realistic here. Your class is just 1 out of how many in the world? Let's deal with the actual facts now shall we. NWO and Sting merchandise outsold Austin 3:16 merch in 97. Stings merch outsold NWO merch going into Starrcade 97 which shows that this notion that people were tired of the Sting storyline just flat out untrue. So clearly you're remembering things wrong. If the Sting angle allowed the WWF to come back then why was the Sting and NWO merchandise the highest selling merch by the end of the year? Why is it when you watched an episode of Nitro towards the end of 97 was the arena packed with everyone wearing Sting masks? Why was Starrcade 97 the highest selling ppv in the history of WCW's ppv? That's because in reality the angle wasn't the reason the WWF came back and there is plenty of evidence to prove that. There were no other shirts outside of Austin 3:16 that were selling huge for the WWF. Meanwhile WCW was selling Sting, NWO, the 4 Horsemen, The Outsiders, DDP and Syxxball shirts like crazy. So much for underutilized or overexposed. Ratings were still higher than the WWF and they were selling tons more merch than the WWF.
The downfall of WCW started at Starrcade When instead of letting Sting win clean, Hogan make sure the count was slow and deliberate so everybody knew he won because his ego couldn’t handle it. The hottest angle in modern wrestling and ego ruined it.
Sooooo....is Conrad like the main pro wrestling accountant or something lol, and hes really good??? Is this why like 10 wrestling HOF'ers have chosen him to basically grill them on podcasts lol
Scott Hall’s “genius” is just ripping gimmicks from popular movies... Razor was based on Scarface and Sting was based on The Crow... Not saying it’s a bad thing... two great characters came out of it.
Bischoff thought he was boring the listeners with his in-depth talk on story structures n characters. I appreciated every word. Many of us from that era share the same opinion as E. Matches, athletism etc are a foundation of the business. But captivating, intense well-told stories are just as and even more important to me. Wwe hit 6 to 7million viewers during the attitude era. I timed a few episodes back then. The average amount of time spent on matches from 9 to 11 o clock was 25 minutes. And they had millions of viewers who are non wrestling fans like my grandmother, hooked on the storylines while not giving a damn about wrestling.
I always considered myself a die hard WWF mark during the Monday Night Wars, but Crow Sting was my favorite wrestling angle of all time.
Starts at 4:00.
The cover art for this show is hands down the best of the Conrad series of shows!
You know what this video needs, another 70 or 80 commercials.
It would be cool if they showed 80’s-90’s-00’s wrestling commercials…..lol
@@secondbest2877 how would that make Conrad and Eric money 🤡
"Hey, hey, it's Conrad Thompson, and you're listening to 83 COMMERCIALS with Eric Bischoff!"
1997 was the peak of the tail end of the Golden age of human civilization. Everything changed with the internet.
Sting is was and always will be THE MAN.
Vickie Ross surfer sting all day
But to be the man you have to be tan
Meh
@@SSJ2Phenom especially a gothic crow character. makes sense. lol.
Tell that to the 'Lass-Kicker'
They say the Sting NWO storyline in 97 was the best storyline of WCW. Hell to me that’s the best storyline of wrestling period. There will never be another one like it. I know everyone says Austin and McMahon, but in my opinion that was just a great feud. Sting turning dark in general was just a storyline and was relatable in many ways. A person who always carried the load of who was always there for others and he got taken for granted and once he loyalty was questioned, he drifted off on his own and hid in the shadows. Every week you felt that emotion and Steve Borden played that so well. It was like an ongoing movie and yeah that Starrcade ending was botched but it still was an amazing story. There’s not a storyline close to that at all.
The emotion on his face when he won at starrcade. Clinging on to Lex. That was real emotion right there!!!
the thing that puts this over Austin McMahon is that Sting and Hogan were both wrestlers. it was building towards a match. Vince wasnt a wrestler.
I love watching the 1997 Sting vs nWo content.
I wanna live on some property like Bischoff has: Just walk out on the front of my porch or patio & look at the deer just running by,a lake showing a reflection of nature,a morning cup of coffee just enjoying nature
I hear you brother
He sold his soul to the N W O for that property and ruined his reputation as a good guy. Is the money the fame and the smoking hot wife (google her playboy pics) worth it? #fuckyeah
Everybody can go out and enjoy nature, vegetation and animals,you dont necessarily have to own it and have it on your property
@@babaed5760 but I want to wake up in the morning coming outside with my underwear on watching the deer run by 😔😢
Make a couple of million bucks and you can have it, brother. xD Believe me, I'd love it too.
Dude 83Weeks rocks man! Absolutely love these podcasts. Thank you so much!
Sting's 1996 was a superb episode. I expect this one to be even better!
WCW was Amazing Years in 1997 NWO Cool fraction Rey mysterio vs Eddie Guerrieo Halloween havoc 1997 best ever matches goldberg debut sting and hollywood hogan longest good build ups starrcade 1997 .
Or are you having a stroke
Nice attempt at English
Built sting up for 18 months that was absolutely masterful, BUT then you messed it all up at Starrcade so it almost doesn’t even matter.
At about an hour in, Eric tells a great story. Then he goes on to say how the early morning shows are great because he has so much energy. Eric, as much as I love those shows, my favorites are the one's where half way through, you're loaded and slurring your words. That's when we get how Eric really feels. Love the show, guys.
97 was the year I fell in love with wrestling. Went as Crow Sting for 97 and 98 Halloween.
98 Halloween was mine. Still the reason I wear a trenchcoat.
Sting 97 was Masterfully crafted too bad the match was a letdown.
The match should have been a 5 to 8 minute squash match with Sting going over with a clean win and have the Nwo interfere as well. Have a total squash match, with the seeds of an n.W.o split. That’s how they should have entered the year 1998 with but Hogan didn’t want to lose his spot and pretty much convinced Bischoff with another finish which only benefited Hogan. Sad that Bischoff still doesn’t realize that Hogan played him and is still playing him to this day.
@@vinnysoori4512 the end is always the best part of any story..... and is also the hardest thing to get right. Wcw had no end game for the nwo story, and part of it is due to politics and creative control
@@vinnysoori4512 sting wasn't big enough and he wasn't tan per bischoff/hogan
Didn't show up with a tan SMH
@@LongHuynh-bx5ll that's a bs excuse...... one he's the crow sting, so he's not going tanning and 2 he looked just fine
Last thing I expected was to fall for Eric and Conrad’s chemistry. Great shows guys.
COVID19 Drinking Game: Drink every time Bischoff says "mystique"! :)
The dummy angle from December 8 was one of the most awesome angles I have seen in nearly thirty years of fandom.
Unfortunately, due to the Owen Hart accident, we will never see anything like it again. WCW in the fall and winter of 1997 in general was probably my favourite wrestling programming of all time.
Yep. WCW was just gold in 97.
I was at that show.my first ever wrestling event. EPIC
It was (and still is) an unheard of concept in wrestling: an 18-month storyline.
Savage and Hogan 88-89 says hello .....
@@kevinlee9929 The exception that proves the rule
Closest thing we have had in recent modern history is the Okada/Omega feud that spanned two years. Omega failed several times before finally besting Okada at Dominion to end his 2 year reign, which also involved a lot of Bullet Club/The Elite inner turmoil and several other feuds.
"........." Sting's quotes in 1997
Mamacita
Eazy E preached the word about that toilet paper at 57:38. I Thank Him for saying that #FACTSHAVENOFEELINGS
I was with you until that dorky ass hashtag.
@@GodTheBear
About facts having no feelings? It's the truth
Sting was the most entertaining and original wrestlers ever!!!! The Legend. The Icon...The man they call.....STING!!!!
96/97 was my favorite WCW time period
Hey Mr. Bishop I’m watching world war 3 1996 I love how Piper was talk to u and you took it like man Merry Christmas I hope you’re blessed I pray that God gives what u want
I love hearing Eric talk about the foundation of what makes a great story.
What character is he talking about at 1hour 8 minute mark? Warrior? Probably not..Flair? idk :/
If I'm remembering correctly, it was Steve's idea about the bat from the movie Warriors.
glad scott hall pitched the idea of crow to sting
Say what you will, but Easy E gave us the best storyline(s) in wrestling history.
Best storyline? No. Hottest angle? Yes
@@blueblur2329 What would you call the best storyline?
@@Tony-fq5bn I don't know about the best story-line but some story-lines that were better were the formation of the corporation or Mcmahon-Helmsley era. Those stories were much more multilayered and complex than the NWO storyline.
@@blueblur2329 I def take nWo over any other storyline of all time, its scope was just SO huge, and it acted as a catalyst for all the things we love in wrestling like wrestlers jumping from promotion to promotion, shocking heel turns(BEFORE they lost control of the story) etc
There were cool things about the McMahon Helmsley Era, but overall I thought it was pretty standard heel stuff, and only HHH really shined from it, not even the other DX member got a rub from it. nWo ended up burying the whole company eventually, but for the first two years it got the entire company over, and multiple people within the nWo had career rejuvenatons , like Hulk/6ixx/Buff Bagwell/Scoot Steiner/Konnan/The Outsiders/etc
@@Tony-fq5bn Well actually wrestlers were jumping from promotion to promotion before the NWO. Luger jumped from the WWF to WCW on Nitro's premier. In any case, the reasons you stated is why I said it was definitely the hottest story line angle because of the grand scale and impact it had. But I don't think it's the best because it's incredibly simple. Yea the Hulk turn was shocking but it eventually got to the point where they just kept turning people to the point where it wasn't shocking but annoying. By the time guys like Macho and Kurt joined it was like enough already. Also there was not much to the story other than the NWO coming down to beat up WCW wrestlers until Sting came and beat Hogan. After Sting beat Hogan the NWO just continued to do the same thing they were doing before as if Sting beating Hogan meant nothing. To sum it up, a simple story with a great beginning but horrible ending because it didn't know when to stop. The Austin and Mcmahon feuds, the Corporation storyline, the Mcmahon-Helsmley storyline had twist and turns throughout the story and most importantly knew when to stop.
i love the way bischoff bullshits it's a great skill. he talk until you forget what he;s talking about and then he laughs and jokes so you go alomg with it
Just turned 37 (may 4,2024), I still have my VCR tapes, I used to record bunch stuff from 96-99 wrestling,,
this dark avenger angle sting took around this time, was the greatest television for me growing up!
Absolutely. When I was younger I always thought people called his character “the ‘crow’ Sting,” purely because he looks like The Crow. It wasn’t until much later that I learned it wasn’t just the look, like Sting became a “spirit of vengeance” against the NWO for taking over WCW and making the Fans and his friends doubt him and his integrity. Just like how The Crow in the movie becomes a spirit of vengeance against the mobsters that killed him and his wife. Once I learned Sting had that “spirit of vengeance,” aspect in that angle I was even more shocked WCW never got sued. 😂
I always been a wrestling fan but 1997 definetly made me watch religiously again. nWo and Sting was an amazing storyline. Also, Jeff Farmer looked so much like sting when he had the face paint on
Bischoff is thinking of the book Hero with A Thousand Faces at 1:08:35
Good book for anyone into creative writing.
Booking like 8-10 month arcs sound good but in reality, you don’t know who might get injured, who might get white hot and, especially with today’s marks, who they might turn on because he’s not doing a million dives.
My mother is not a wrestling fan by any means. However, she loved the crow Sting gimmick; she loved how quiet he was. This created mystique.
Eric says he appreciates good characters and storylines and that’s the area where current wrestling is lacking. I’m right there with him and I think that’s a really nice way of saying creative sucks these days 😂
I enjoyed listening to Bischoff's take on Starrcade '97 on this episode. The fact he wasn't as indignant as before made it much easier to see Eric's perspective more clearly. And I definitely buy his argument. Anyone who wants to criticize Bischoff's decision-making that night needs to concede that Sting's lack of preparedness is what precipitated that whole disaster. It really isn't fair to dump it all on Bischoff's head, because he was handed a bad situation at the last minute and I think a lot of folks would've botched it just as easily.
That said, I wish Bischoff would just admit that he was the one who called for the fast three-count. I don't think anyone would judge him for that, especially after this episode.
Why would Bischoff not be monitoring Sting's shape heading into the PPV? And if it was that big of a deal then don't give Sting the belt. You don't book Hogan as a coward for a year then have him beat Sting up the whole match and pin him clean.
@@kevinlee9929 I don't know, except to say Sting's an adult and pro wrestlers are expected largely to take care of themselves. As Bischoff pointed out, "ring rust" wasn't the problem. The implication seems to be that Sting showing up unprepared came as a surprise to everyone on the day of Starrcade.
I'm not excusing Bischoff's decision-making, but face it, that was a bad situation he was placed into and it all comes down to Sting not being prepared like he should've.
@@RightCenterBack321 But how did it not dawn on Bischoff to keep tabs on Sting's physical condition? At the end of the day he's the boss and blame falls on him no different than it does Vince.
@@kevinlee9929 Hindsight is 20/20. WCW is comprised of tens of performers. If Bischoff needs to literally babysit one of his top performers, is it really a top performer?
If Bischoff is babysitting talent, then nobody would want to work for him anyway.
Why are u doing long comment that no probably won’t read lol
Eric makes me mad sometimes but he drops jewels every podcast... Thank you..... BTW he made me mad with this episode by not telling us the wrestler he planned on using in 97... WTF meanie 😂😂😂
I've been waiting on this one 🤘
Conrad and Bischoff can have this podcast forever and still not cover everything 👀
Probably the best storyline ever in wrestling
I'd love to know what happened to Steve during this time. I haven't been able to find him discussing
Sting was dealing with drug problems I believe at this time. Eventually becoming a Christian and getting clean by 99
To all my fellow diehard fans correct me if I'm wrong but I believe the first person to rappel down from the ceiling was actually Sgt. Craig Pittman at the Great American Bash 1995
I've never heard someone talk so much and not say a word
Incredible🙂
And on the other program, Rocky Maivia turned heel and showed off impressive oratory skills, Shawn Michaels, Hunter Hearst Helmsley and Chyna began to mock everyone, Rockabilly and Jesse James changed their stupid gimmicks, Mick Foley told his life story, The Hart Foundation hated Americans and Steve Austin assaulted his bosses while cursing and drinking alcohol.
That all sounds great in hindsight or is interesting when you re-watch it but they werent famous back then. To the normal viewer it was just "some guy does...whatever, who gives a shit". All the big established names from the early 90s with a few exceptions were in WCW
98' was the best year in wrestling period
Holy Crap, Conrad looks like Junior Gorg!
Bischoff is right WCW in 1997 was the hottest thing in Pro Wrestling history.
There’s probably no bigger Surfer Sting fan than me and still love those years w Sting as the super white meat blonde babyface but it was time in 96 for a change and it all worked out.
God bischoff saying that hey can i stop you rite there oh but i cant remember Any of this!!!
He's right AEW is missing big stories and big characters ....the lady of great storytelling on both sides
1:46 More or less life as usual, adapting to this bizarre time
1997 Was A HUGELY IMPORTANT YEAR in Wrestling
Well they hardly talked about STING. was looking forward to this but same as starrcade 1997 bischoff had no clue!
Kamran Aziz I thought it was a great podcast
Sad even Nick Patrick the referee knows more than Eric bischoff
They still should've put the belt on Sting clean and figured all the other stuff out later.
Nice cover Eric. Did you paint it recently?
I'm a huge fan of WCW with this being said what is Eric talking about. If the NWO wasn't a long-term plan, if Sting wasn't a long-term plan and if Goldberg wasn't a long-term plan then what was and where was this Incorporated in his storytelling?
I’m like Bischoff, I will always fall back on great story and characters. Whether that’s in TV, video games, movies, or books. If it doesn’t have characters and stories that I can enjoy, it doesn’t matter how good it looks, it’s inferior to something with a good story and characters. Everytime. Major budgets or smaller budget, story and characters you can care about and watch grow and develop is always more important than flashy hollowness. Kinda weird to bring up on a wrestling podcast but that’s why I play JRPG video games. They have very deep stories, with well fleshed out characters and character development and in-depth worlds that while they couldn’t be real in our world, do feel believable because of logical consistency. To me shit like Fortnite or CoD, they’re just hollow games appealing to the lowest common denominator. Give me a game with great characters, an in-depth story, and a fleshed out world that’s interesting, and I’m set. It doesn’t gotta be the prettiest most realistic game on the market, just give me something to care about and that all I need.
Bischoff (3 weeks ago)- "keep living life, go watch a marathon in LA, the virus is being overblown by the media"
Add to comments that DO NOT age well
😂😂😂
Sting during this era was the single reason why I started watching wrestling. And then they screwed him at Starrcade. It really is so messed up because after listening to all the events that went on to the match , Sting (Steve Borden) put on an epic performance that only he could do and put the company on the map. Not speaking for a year, flying down from the ceiling, propelling back up, zip lining across the arena etc etc etc... shame on them
It's because he wasn't tanned. 😂🤦♂️
Joe Whittle lol they really messed up here
@@c6blackvette17 I know. I was so disappointed at the time.
Joe Whittle I was 12 during that time so I didn’t understand it. I just remembered not understanding why his belt was taken away. Now that I’m older it’s really messed up to see what really happened
Bischoff said that Sting didn’t take anyone in the air since DDP. Not true. In early 1998 he pulled Macho Man into the air as well when Macho vs Hogan feud started
Such a cool graphic
Was Conrad even in this podcast?? Damn, Eric is a rambling man.
Glad I'm not the only one who noticed.
This was Stings most profitable year in the business and he didn’t say one god damn word. Lol
I have much respect for bischoff however seems like he's better than us had then it is an actuality. TNA years WCW recently in WWE seems like he should have had much better outcomes if his planning was this good ☮️
Was Eric talking about the Undertaker?
I'm gonna assume it was Rey Mysterio.
Lol I remember thinking back then why wasn't WCW coming down to save Sting.
WCW rarely came down. It made them look dumb smh.
Sting on his worst day could work circles around hogan
Yes he would. Sting is the greatest all around wrestler of all times
@@animefan9329 Hogan could work too i dont see that much of a difference. Hogan is a way better in-ring storyteller
@@bigbaba1491 Hogan could execute like 5 moves and his finisher was pathetic. He was the best at promos in early days of WWF, but I think Hogan was massively overrated.
I wonder if people have ever seen Hogan's matches in Japan before simply saying that he couldn't work.
Hogans 5 moves:
1. Racism
2. Weight belt thing
3. Baldness
4. Hulking up
5. Steroids
1997 sting was the fucking SHIT! KING SHIT! OF FUCKING AWESOME MOUNTAIN! And sadly the pay off was a dud...but I fucking live for that build up! And the career that followed is still amazing!
Still life....
No selling powerbomb and deathdrop
I get Bischoff point though if you can to work and half did it they don't want..your a performer bring your A game
No idea what you're saying.
Oh let me clarify : His point to Sting, it's like coming to work not wanting to be bothered like almost in a foul mood, performance needs to be positive and they need to be engaged and really excited..they were about to give the biggest Belt to him and Sting was like whatever
I can point to a wrestling story that lasted more than a month that was close to as good as the Sting vs Hogan build. Taker vs Kane and Austin vs McMahon.
Hogan and Savage 88-89.
Batista-HHH leading into WrestleMania 21
@@kevinlee9929 That's a good one.
Crow sting was an Amazing gimmick
The match wasn't that bad, but the finish being botched is pretty inexcusable for a multi million dollar corporation. Bischoff seems to be a truthful person overall.
I am confused. He is talking about mean gene coming over from WWF and how they are crafting their great storylines or whatever....where did he come from? The future? What great storylines did they plan a year in advance? How the pirate stole bret harts leather jacket or the race car driver fighting with the evil clown? WWF was the shits in the early 90s and they didnt have real storytelling going on. All of that came later when mean gene was already at WCW. And quite frankly, i hated that overscripted shit from later WWE where everything is written like a soap opera and follows some stupid story, i liked WCW spontaneous style because it felt more organic and spontaneous, WWE felt like a TV show while WCW felt like a sports broadcast most of the time. Fuck all these "you burned my parents house down now we feud for 6 months" like some stupid TV series. In WCW it was mostly about somebody wanting that belt and win that championship. Before the belt was devalued on purpouse by Vince russo
Eric is either a master story teller or a complete bullsht artist... been listening to 83 Weeks for 2 years and I'm still not sure.
I'd say he's both 😆
Does anyone know where I can get that poster art pic of sting with the vigilante get up?
Sting was my favorite as a kid. Even over Hogan. Even over Warrior. It was sad to see him get old and slow down. The WWE tried to kill off the man they call Sting. To bring him in so late in his run and squash him like that was BS. He probably didn't care too much by that point. Surely he got 6 figures for Wrestlemania.
Yeah but having the NWO come rescue him from DX when they had so many old young gen wrestlers from WCW they could havw done a whole civil war angle. The NWO saving him made ZERO sense. Thats when I stopped watching as i knew thry werent going to let him win id have accepted NWO coming to beat him down but not saving him.
I have a contrarian take on this whole angle...It was too long and drawn out and by early summer, I went back to WWE to see what was going on with Austin and the Hart Foundation. By the time the payoff happened, it was barely a blip on the radar. I think I wasn't the only one, as look how fast the WWE gained momentum going into 1998 (spearheaded by the Tyson angle)
I agree it was too long but mostly because they could have done a better job on filling out the story getting there. However to say by the time the payoff happened it was a blip on the radar is just incorrect. That Starrcade was the highest profiting ppv in WCW history because of that storyline. Also The WWF didn't beat WCW in the ratings in 98 until April. So it wasn't exactly fast considering they went into the Attiude Era in Dec. 97.
@@blueblur2329 It was a blip if you had gone to the other wrestling company that was giving you their best talent night after night. Watching Austin blossom (among other things) was better than endless foreshadowing of Sting getting his (eventual) payoff. The endless NWO run-ins also wore thin.
@@hitmangfx7162 I have the network and have recently watched both companies in 97. The WWF's talent in 97 was seriously lacking compared to WCW's talent. Which made the WWF harder to watch considering there were only a few characters you were invested in even though the actual story telling was slightly better. WCW had tons of great characters/talent in Hogan, Scott Hall, Kevin Nash, Sting, DDP, Lex Luger, Macho Man, Roddy Piper, Ric Flair, Arn Anderson, the Giant, the Steiners, Harlem Heat, Rey Mysterio, Eddie Guerrero, Chris Jericho, Chris Benoit, Dean Malenko, Raven and an upcoming Goldberg compared to the WWF who really only had Austin, Undertaker, Bret Hart, Shawn Michaels, Mankind, and Kane. So yea having recently rewatched that entire year I would take WCW over the WWF.
@@blueblur2329 WCW had talent, they were either underutilized or overexposed. Much of the talent in WWE was either new or repackaged in ways that were fresh/unusual. You left out the Rock (and the rest of the Nation), Ken Shamrock, HHH, Owen and Bulldog (and Vader). In 1996, yes, WCW won on talent and storylines. In 1997, I felt WCW had the edge in talent but they were coasting and this Sting angle is what allowed WWE to rally and start building momentum with a less-deep roster. It set up WWE's monster 1998 and by the end of that year, it was over. Imagine if Goldberg hadn't burst onto the scene.
Also, I don't need the Network...I LIVED this era in highschool. In 1996, NWO shirts all over the schoolyard, everyone was "NWO 4 lyfe". 1997 and well beyond? Austin 3:16 shirts, people "stunning" each other during gym class. The ratings lagged the WWE's momentum by a good six months before the 83 weeks proper was up.
@@hitmangfx7162Clearly you do need the network because you're wrong. You can't be seriously gauging how hot the NWO was based on how many kids were wearing NWO and Austin shirts in your class. 😑 C'mon let's be realistic here. Your class is just 1 out of how many in the world? Let's deal with the actual facts now shall we. NWO and Sting merchandise outsold Austin 3:16 merch in 97. Stings merch outsold NWO merch going into Starrcade 97 which shows that this notion that people were tired of the Sting storyline just flat out untrue. So clearly you're remembering things wrong. If the Sting angle allowed the WWF to come back then why was the Sting and NWO merchandise the highest selling merch by the end of the year? Why is it when you watched an episode of Nitro towards the end of 97 was the arena packed with everyone wearing Sting masks? Why was Starrcade 97 the highest selling ppv in the history of WCW's ppv? That's because in reality the angle wasn't the reason the WWF came back and there is plenty of evidence to prove that. There were no other shirts outside of Austin 3:16 that were selling huge for the WWF. Meanwhile WCW was selling Sting, NWO, the 4 Horsemen, The Outsiders, DDP and Syxxball shirts like crazy. So much for underutilized or overexposed. Ratings were still higher than the WWF and they were selling tons more merch than the WWF.
I always learn something from Eric, as far as psychology and business principles in action.
The guy who made the head was an undertaker fan? As it's a taker move to show someone their own self dead or whatever from 90s lol
"go listen to bully ray"
lol bully was getting the push. of course he's gonna be the only one who loved aces and eights lmao.
Arnold something... oh my GOD........these eyes😮
🔥🔥🔥
Where can I get that picture ?
That's what I wanna know too.
@@charlesfoster9530 screen shot it Charles !!!!! Damn
That artwork is awesome, where can I get it?
love sting but after the nwo angle, he wasn't interesting. Wolfpack and joker sting was the worst
I'm trying to take a shit and Conrad is in my face telling me to take out my calculator smh
The downfall of WCW started at Starrcade When instead of letting Sting win clean, Hogan make sure the count was slow and deliberate so everybody knew he won because his ego couldn’t handle it. The hottest angle in modern wrestling and ego ruined it.
The hero overcomes all odds unless it's a bad tan.........
Has Eric every heard of WCCW ?
Sooooo....is Conrad like the main pro wrestling accountant or something lol, and hes really good??? Is this why like 10 wrestling HOF'ers have chosen him to basically grill them on podcasts lol
Nepotism, he's married in the business
Eazy-E shops at Walmart
And he bought all the toilet paper
Penny bought all the toilet paper
1:55:31 eric sound like jim carey
Scott Hall’s “genius” is just ripping gimmicks from popular movies... Razor was based on Scarface and Sting was based on The Crow...
Not saying it’s a bad thing... two great characters came out of it.
dwayne cox that’s what the entertainment business is.
Q-Storm taking an idea and twisting it into something similar, yet unique.... Crow Sting and The Bad Guy were just blatant copy and paste...
Interesting
Easy e your welcome at my work anyday it walmart too