Tommy knows his shit. Gutters is just one small part of his experience. He is very talented in all he does. You do it your way and he will do it his way and it is all good. Thanks for sharing...
Like you said and an additional observation Josh, I would have also installed the down-spout flange under the gutter to avoid a lip above and potential obstruction to water flow. Using color matching screws blend nicely as well. But what do I know, I'm an electrician, cheers.
something to keep in mind here is that Tom Silva is doing this from a homeowner's perspective, not a professional installer perspective. so it makes sense that the demonstrated method here would differ somewhat from a professional method.
I'm sticking with old school helping home owners who can't afford pros and so far most home owners 98% is very, very happy with old school we learn to count our blessings one by one.
His methods weren’t “old school” they were just incorrect. I’m not saying this gentleman isn’t knowledgeable but he’s gonna cause more problems down the road installing gutter incorrectly.
As a gutter guy for over 2 decades, closing in on 10k jobs done. Ol Tommy is gonna cost you more in the long run! I haven't watched that vid in a few years but can't recall anything that was done the way a pro would do it. Correction, he's using elastomeric geocel. That's what I use as well.
I used Tom's method today. Tom's method worked great. I purchased the gutters and materials at my local hardware store. I paid 213.10 for the materials. I installed in about five hours. I watched Tom's video before installing. The installation was easy and I saved a lot of money. No leaks. I would have preferred for some one to come and install for me but I did not have the money. Thanks Tom!!!!
I’m tackling my first gutter project this weekend, using Tom Silva’s methods. Start a Gutter business has great recommendations, but I prefer Silva’s positive attitude.
Wow. So much to say. He's showing a homeowner how to DIY. She most likely doesn't have the professional tools you have. Caulking all over everything? Looks pretty good to me. I had gutters professionally installed with to slight of a slope, and during a heavy rain the gutter would fill and spill over the edge. I had to increase the pitch, ever so slightly, so it would drain properly. Looks like extremely good instruction for the average homeowner. Just my opinion.
My main primary criteria is economical, functional and not look like crap. Meet all these 3 terms and it's good enough for me. The glue comment? Who cares. It's all on the inside anyway. You think a drywaller cares about how the other side of the drywall repair looks?
I couldn't even count the number of times that I have had to correct the work of the so called pro's. The sloppy roof and fascia board were probably installed by a "pro." The fact that a door is under a roof with no gutter is also the work of a "pro." I've been at this longer than most of you have been alive, and Tommy is the man.
I’m an admirer of ol’ Tommy. He comes along and gets things done in a manner that your typical homeowner can relate to. I suppose it would be easy to one up just about anybody, but gotta be a little forgiving as this is for a regular schmuck looking to correct a failed or non existing situation. Good to hear your takes, but ol’ Tommy is the man !
Tommy is a master carpenter and home builder. You are a professional gutter hanger. You gave it away when you said "we" would do it this way. This whole segment is designed to teach a homeowner to DIY.
Why not just do it right, what you said suggested is its OK to do a job wrong because its just DIY? Did you know DIY can also be done correctly? All these little details are important and are done based off of past problems that occurred in various applications.
Glad to have wandered onto your channel as I am in the process of figuring out how to fix the gutters I have. I enjoyed your critique of their gutter installation. I sometimes watch This Old House but just to dream about the tools they have and multiple ladders set up.
I am a union pipefitter and cringe at some of the stuff i have seen. Its easy to nit pick other peoples work. That being said, this job costs about $100 in material. A professional job would probably be about $1000. You do get what you pay for, but for most home owners this works just fine.
I'm sticking with Tom and don't care for the criticisms. But you got one thing right... the bracket hole. I always worry about being too low so I add sealant before I thread it through. About ice, remember it's a regional thing. Some areas, especially NE, do have more serious ice issues. Not an issue in SE, SW
Thank you for sharing your experience with hanging guitars. Really enjoyed the commentary. You mentioned the hangers cutting into the lower body of the "hull" and allowing water come up and leak into the screw hole is something I hadn't thought about! I couldn't agree more!
Hi….thanks for the video. I live in Durango, Co…not nearly as brutal winters as you have, but I still get considerable snow, and then melt off….repeat. I am in the process of completing a 2500 sq foot shop, with metal roof. Roof is 3:12 pitch with two rows of snow brake. I installed the roof with about 1.5 -2” overhang and the fascia is 8” tall. I am having gutters installed over the next few weeks, couldn’t get it done before winter unfortunately. I get what you are saying about having the gutter closer to the drip edge to better capture the run off. However, to allow the snow that does slide off below the lower snow brake to hopefully clear the gutter on way down….how far below do you recommend? I would like to use the simplest method of gutter de-ice by just laying a heat cable in the gutter and downspout, and not laying it on the roofing above the gutter. Also….my sub fascia is 2 x 6 with smart siding as the exposed fascia…is this enough “meat” to screw into if the truss ends are missed? How might you recommend an install like this? Thank you….Steve.
Thank you for saying what you did about the drip edge and getting the gutter under it!!!! That is bothering me right now, I just replaced the gutter over the garage and when you had to lower it at the down spout the gutter was no longer under the drip edge and I could see daylight between the gutter and the fascia. After just having to replace all the fascia on my storage room by myself, I can tell you that you do not want to have rotten water logged fascia to rip off and replace!!! I am thinking about getting some drip edge and sliding it under the existing and letting it hang over the gutter edge as a precautionary measure for my peace of mind. I am also getting ready to start installing 50 feet of gutter along the side of the house which has never had it before and we just had the house re roofed but they left no space behind the drip edge it is tight to the fascia. I am therefore thinking I an going to need more drip edge to slide under the existing and let it hang over into the gutter once again. If anyone has a better idea would you please let me know, I would appreciate any info you can provide. As a 70 year old female, I try to keep my parents home up but I am willing to hear any suggestions!
A roll of strip flashing will work just fine where it isn't behind the roof edge. On the new side best thing is to pry it away from the fascia just a touch. I do it by hand but can use a flat bar if needed. Just isnt as pretty after.
I noticed that he did not put the gutter under the drip edge, but his gutter had a lip on it to attach the bracket, I thought gutters were flat on the back side to go up and behind the drip edge and the one he put up would not fit behind the drip edge.
Hey, I didn't see anybody install a gutter on a flat roof & brick building on TH-cam. Can you tell me how to do it? Start with a gutter board. Should I use 1x8" or 2x8"? Which anchors to use & countersink the anchor or not? How to secure & install the gutter board? Then install the gutter.
Thank you for all your comments, they are very helpful not to make the same mistakes. I see all your points. I watch both videos and will use your advice. Will be putting gutters that constraction people took off and put away. Now we have disaster with tons of water running of the deck and roof in Seattle. Unbelievable unprofessional and damaging. 🙏
Great content! Where can I find the formulas for figuring the gutter size and downspout size in relation to roof area? I've heard people say they only ever install 5 inch gutters but always use 3x4 DS. Does that seem reasonable?
Really appreciate the critique, a lot of good tips. I am about to put all new gutters on a 2800 sq. ft. ranch style house, so quite a bit perimeter. In the past, I have applied caulk between top edge of gutter and facia, but that could be trying to solve a problem that doesn't actually exist.
ok Mr Silva was shooting a show while teaching a Homeowner how to do something that they never did , with the tools they might have at home. Also there are many ways to skin a cat. I will say both you and Mr Silva are right in your ways. But also never Question 50 plus yrs of experience that Silva family has.
This video was really helpful! We installed gutters this morning using TOH’s video (which was a great visual tool). But unfortunately when it rained this afternoon, rain poured behind our gutters because we didn’t install under the drip edge like you recommend. I wish we had seen this video before we started to have a different option!
Like you said and an additional observation Josh, I would have also installed the down-spout flange under the gutter to avoid a lip above and potential obstruction to water flow. Screwing upward with color matching screws blend nicely as well. But what do I know, I'm an electrician, cheers.
Very good installation and assumption about the amount of water that can be collected from this big space of the roof and i liked that way of measurment of how low you presume to put the gutter of the drain edge of the roof thinking about the snow falling and charge the gutter with big weight of ice and or snow ...thank you very much and I will make my own calculation and add extra materials to stop the snow and pass the water but after all thank you very much.
One question I still have is do you need to gutter all exterior walls or only the walls with that type of roof pitch? I want to do my Mom’s to help her out but want to make sure ik what I’m doing first
Agree with most your takes, as far as the caulk I use to do it all afterwards except for splices and miters. We used silicone and would smooth out with fingers. Pop rivet outlets, downspouts, and joints, just caulk and crimp end caps. Outlets just hammer. awl, and tin snips to cut. Pitch is needed but you don't have to go crazy with it. Don't care for the hidden hangers with the hard downward angle either.
That last comment is on point - atleast here in California the rain isn't as heavy, water tension is something to be mindful of, so getting the gutter right up to the drip edge is preferable. My current home has the gutter too low and the gutter is vinyl, which is infective because it does not sit flush with the fascia board.
Actually in other shows Tom says don't put thedrip edge against the facia board. Leave about a 1/4 inch so the water doesn't siphon back and go behind the gutter.
Yes, I searched TH-cam for DIY gutter info to answer this exact question, whether the gutter should be behind the drip edge or not. I have not yet found that explicit answer, but for this "reaction" video.
Easy to criticize , he's demonstrating to a customer how it could be done if she wanted to do others herself , perhaps you could take this opportunity to be invited onto This Old House and show them how it's done . Worked with TOH once years ago and they were a fine bunch of guys , friendly , helpful and grateful . You'd never see them criticizing another directly in a video , they are more professional than that !!!
Go read some of the professionals' comments on the original video. Some seem to have a very high opinion of themselves, and were quite insulting. This video was more of a review of the procedure, which I found valuable, and his tone was measured and reasonable.
I don’t think he criticized just shared where he would have done it differently and the reasons as to why and also went further to suggest the possibility of that different approach might be because he lives in Montana. Also gave the guy props at certain points as well when he shared he would had used a different method as in using tin snippers or whatever vs a chisel (said still looked good) and at the very end said he does a decent job. Just gave his honest opinion good or bad nothing personal. I took it as a learning opportunity video. And even if let’s say this guy did it all backwards there was still the potential to learn the skill of how to speak to a client and I think he does 10/10 job. With that all said I am not telling you are wrong or don’t have a right to share your opinion/ just that someone else thinks differently and that’s the beauty of this platform to learn from one another weather good or bad it’s just different. And hopefully the guy who made this video won’t feel the need to change his own personal thoughts and feelings and the way he honestly would critique a method in the hopes to not hurt someone’s feelings. At the end of the day it’s all about code and the reasons why those codes or whatever were put in place to begin with. This Old House family could be the nicest people in the world but that ain’t gonna prevent some flimsy gutters being blown apart from ice in the winter. IMO
So is it just those particular brand of hangers that you don't like or do you not like the hidden hangers in general? I'm actually getting ready to do a gutter job and I was searching for information on how long of a run I could do, which is how I got to this video. I do have about 60 ft, so I'll have to think about how to break that up. Our side yards are virtually nonexistent so it's not as easy as one might think to have one in the middle
Good emphasis on screws showing, pitch of run, square feet of roof per down spout, gutter under drip edge, and direction of flow for down spouts, the small details are significant. Thank you!
I'm in Florida. The roofers nailed a 1x2 horizontally along the top of the facia. And then they put the drip edge over the 1x2. And the facia is angled inward about 20 degrees. So there is a 3/4 inch gap (the width of the 1x2) from the bottom edge of the drip edge to the angled facia. What would you use to fill that angled gap so that the rain gutter lays perpendicular to the ground?
Maybe the roof was done by others, but that is a drip edge not an apron that should be used at the gutter. Downspouts number and sizes can be calculated for your location based on the roof size.
Very interested his process on the gutter system and Seem not right to get gutter to lower from edge shingles it will get spillover the gutter missed when the rain getting heavy pours it will take problem the hight also should have upper almost touch against to drip edge what if they put the leaves filter installing it will great fit with no problems...
Issue is that though you may be able to put elbows "A/B" on oval to rectangler or vice versa ,dropouts,you increase chances of downspout leaks (obviously from size differences? Improper pitching due to overcompensaion of gutter seating under drip edge ( gutter ser to high or low behind dripedge. Remember,it's a gutter "system" not just a gutter. Disregarding any symmetric aspects of the system by like using 2 different styles of dropouts no matter D/S size or shape will eventually render the entire system as flawed and ineffective which could leave the home itself vulnerable to foundation damage as well as walls/siding of house becoming mold infested and toxic. Stay with consistency and same style gutters with properly fitting (seamless) gutter pieces and D/S
Im happy with this video! Not that anyone cares. This Old House doing a good Job and the Pro sharing some expert Tips that would have made it a bit more polished. But honestly that's the difference in price.
I didn't get that the video showed the guy ordering up the correct length of gutter, and then showed him hacksawing a hunk of it off? Did he mis-measure?
This video reeks of salesmanship. I am in my mid eighties now. Last month I changed all the gutters on my house. Just me. All by myself. It was easy. In a couple of places I had to replace short sections of the facia boards due to age and rot. It's an older home. I scraped and repainted before installing the new gutters. I used the vinal type. I used stainless stell screws at each junction point, except for the straight "union" connectors which are strong enough on their own, to prevent separation due to water or snow loading. I set a gradient of about .8% for drainage. It was easy to do... No biggie. I will admit that mine is a single storey house with a low angel roof. No special tools needed. I did all the work using a ladder. I've never been allergic to work but I am always allergic to paying labor charges.
A little critical of Tom who was doiing this 30 years before you were even born. So dont be so critical of someone who has is own TV show and has to expalian how to do things, make repairs, usiung things a home owner can do them selves, not hiring a professional. They also have to do it in a way where it works nearly nationa wide not just in MT. Dont be so critical of the Old man
This old house folks know a thing or two about construction work, but don't trust everything they say, one day that old man was demonstrating how to install shingles on a roof and the first thing i noticed was he installed the starter shingle upside down 😂 i had to take a screen shot of that.
@lesliebrew4789 nope, shingle manufacturers make starter shingles with a sealant strip that goes down not up, if you install an upside-down shingle as starter shingle the sealant strip will be in the middle not at the bottom as manufacturers recommend, you're not even supposed to use the same field shingles as starter shingles in the first place and if you do you're not a real roofer, or professional roofer, and jeopardize the manufacturers warranty.
Oh man I totally forgot ya can't add pic in the comments... I worked for a long time friend doing soffit, fascia, asphalt shingles & rain gutters, however with latter of the bunch I only helped hang em couple times or go out hang some downspouts that we was short etc... now my buddy lives half block from my dad's where I'm doing in and he calls someone who comes looks at it then never even called em back nor gave em a bid (after wk thus far cutting back every single rafter board too make it plumb because he wants soffit/faciia next yr now I know he didn't bid it cause he didn't want headache from my pops cause I know he's been on my behind the entire time but he's getting it done right for darn near nothing so he can't complain too much or I'd atleast think so... lol
Yeah, I wouldn’t advise drinking rain water running off Asphalt Shingles that normally have an Algicide component on the Shingles. An aged metal roof would be fine though.
Because you asked us to let you know what we thought of your critique: Respectfully and foremost, Josh, learn humility. The smirk doesn't serve you well. Anyone can, and a certain element of contractor typically does, stand back and point out the flaws of another contractor's work. Presumably, they do that to make themselves look superior and to steer customers to them with their smug know-it-all tactic. "Pushers get pushed, Donny Beals," and know-it-alls eventually realize that the more they know, the more they realize they don't know and they need to rely on the help and friendship of their peers. One might learn from Socrates: "I know that I know nothing." In reality, a savvy customer believes one's smugness will be used against them if ever they disagree with that contractor or point out a problem. In time, one may learn that fine people like Tommy Silva have a far greater depth of knowledge and experience well beyond fifteen years and can stand there in front of someone's work, buddies by his side, with arms folded and smirking that grin. He could even make a video critiquing you to the world. It's doubtful you'll see that from a true professional, however. In conclusion, Josh, there's a way to tell people your methods without sardonically picking apart those of another contractor. There's food for thought and also the feedback you requested.
I kind of agree with the host here that I would be worried about water coming up under the drip-edge. That is the most important thing. I would have installed flashing. That said, I would have liked to hear what the host would recommend, as I probably wouldn't know how to resolve the issue. Water will get behind it, especially in the winter with ice. Also, I agree again with the host regarding the pronounced angle of the run, which I had on a previous home and it looked terrible. The technique of temporarily screwing in the gutter seemed convoluted and put additional holes in the back of the gu tter (leaking) - I thought this would be resolved by simply installing the brackets when on the ground. As far as Tommy goes, he's awesome in many things, but nobody is excellent in everything; I didn't see where the host was disrespectful - I thought it was an honest review.
Reading a lot of the comments here, people seem to think that a DIY video should *not* be professional. I guess, as a DIYer, I want my work to end up as professional-quality as possible, maybe even better (noting that a lot of pro's are sloppy or cut corners).
I found it amazing that neither Tommy S or Josh indicated what they recommend for an average slope to allow the gutter to drain properly. I suspect the slope is around 1/2" fall for every 10'.
@@StartARainGutterBusiness thanks for clarifying that... I have a 63 foot run on the side of my house and a half inch every ten feet would mean id be off the facia at the end lol
I do an 1/8 of a pitch every 2 ft but depends on the run an number of downspouts it’s not a bad idea to start your gutter perfectly level and then pitch it remember how water flows
There is absolutely no reason to slope a gutter. Gutters should ALWAYS be installed level, sunce water in a closed system will drain at the same rate at all points in that system. In other words, the water can never accumulate in a level gutter because the opening for the downspout is at the same elevation as the rest of the bottom of the gutter.
Spec in my area is 1 inch every 40 feet. I have been reported for failing a home inspection for having less. I think that is a bit picky since I always water test when I install. The recommendation is that a 2x3 down will handle about 600 sq. ft. while a 3x4 will handle 1200.
Absoluely agree about drip edge. Water has a tendency to do weird things due to surface tension. Always tuck under drip edge. Also agree with slope critisism. Just make sure no low spots. I can tell TOH is teaching something they have done, maybe twice. Thanks for video.
I can do without this simpering, condescending guy. The gutter Tommy at Ask TOH was hanging was pretty simple, but this is a DIY homeowner show. Based on my recent (9/20/2022) quote for gutter along 45 feet of my house in Northern Virginia, the price difference was 500% between parts from a big box store and the installed gutters by a contractor. Mine was a straight run with two downspouts, but up about 25 feet. If I had one like the TOH video I would do it in a minute rather than hire a contractor who would charge 5 times materials and be finished in two hours.
Most of these critiques seem like non issues. Especially the showing screws. I can't fathom caring about something like that as s home buyer or seller.
I agree: something is wrong here that might be generational: woods are no longer durable and typical low cost modern fascia will NOT withstand the water it will be exposed to if the drip edge doesn't reach into the gutters. Modern materials have no margin for error.
Hey my friend, thanks for the videos. Is there any chance I could get in contact with guys by phone!? I’m planning to start my business soon and I need some more specific information if you can help me. Mateus.
Lol. Got love the fact Tom did not watch any TH-cam installs before he went over there woth his Old house crest stuck out and just totally winged it, using his chisel to cut the outlet hole, lol, spreading caulk like cake icing, lol. Thumbs up.
Yeah he's a much better carpenter than gutter installer. The only useful fact here is practiced more in commercial applications. I.E. the front nose of gutter shall remain no more than 1/4 below drip point of roofing system. Not to argue but it's written if you don't know where we'll then your more of a seamless installer than a metal fabricator and that's OK. I'm with you drip-edge is intended to keep moisture in a gutter or at the very least keep it on the outside of the fascia.
Got about 5 mins in. I had watched This Old House's video first. It'd be nice if you explained what the "right" thing to do is instead of just pointing out everything that is "wrong" with his method.
I can appreciate your professional opinion but this is a DIY project so no such homeowner would have all the fancy machines and tools you use everyday. I would MacGuyver this the same way Tommy did and call it a job done. I called a gutter guy in for some simple repairs but he insisted on replacing my 30 yo gutters, which still functioned fine and in decent shape. Quoted me $3k for the job. I declined and replaced what I needed for about $200 + my time.
So far 7 minutes into the video, you said for both the chalk line and the caulk, that you don’t do it that way simply because of cleanup. You don’t have a more professional opinion? Sounds like you’re thinking about speed and he’s thinking about quality. Prove me wrong. Chalk line can be cleaned and as you said it leaves for a nice visual. Why would you want the downspout to act as a drain? The way you explain it makes me think there would be sitting water in it after a small rain. That’s bad. I’d rather have my gutters be slightly angled and working correctly. The caulk being placed before the crimping is a better seal. You can clean it up and then also place a second bead from the outside.
You also didn’t explain how you would level the gutter differently without a chalk line. Would you put the gutter straight against the house and drip edge and slightly lower the side you are wanting it to drain towards?
The old man is not in rush anywhere. He has 2 jobs a month, so yeah, nowhere to rush. And he doesn't know that the hole saws exist. The water will leak behind the gutter. Guaranteed.
@@mikemiller9891 we put a piece of allunium strip 3 inches wide under the drip edge and inside the gutter to prevent leaks between the gutter and fascia
@stevenllewellyn8906 he's targeted home owners, teaching them how to do it with out going out and buying and thousands in tools. I'm surprised you didn't figure that out.
Tommy knows his shit. Gutters is just one small part of his experience. He is very talented in all he does. You do it your way and he will do it his way and it is all good. Thanks for sharing...
Not when it comes to guttering! Almost 24 years now, close to 10k jobs done.
My money is on Tommy. Thanks for the critique tho
Like you said and an additional observation Josh, I would have also installed the down-spout flange under the gutter to avoid a lip above and potential obstruction to water flow. Using color matching screws blend nicely as well. But what do I know, I'm an electrician, cheers.
something to keep in mind here is that Tom Silva is doing this from a homeowner's perspective, not a professional installer perspective. so it makes sense that the demonstrated method here would differ somewhat from a professional method.
I'm sticking with old school helping home owners who can't afford pros and so far most home owners 98% is very, very happy with old school we learn to count our blessings one by one.
His methods weren’t “old school” they were just incorrect. I’m not saying this gentleman isn’t knowledgeable but he’s gonna cause more problems down the road installing gutter incorrectly.
No idea
As a gutter guy for over 2 decades, closing in on 10k jobs done. Ol Tommy is gonna cost you more in the long run! I haven't watched that vid in a few years but can't recall anything that was done the way a pro would do it. Correction, he's using elastomeric geocel. That's what I use as well.
@@dumbdems Not disagreeing with you but just calling out something wrong without backing it up with what is correct raises a red flag with me.
I used Tom's method today. Tom's method worked great. I purchased the gutters and materials at my local hardware store. I paid 213.10 for the materials. I installed in about five hours. I watched Tom's video before installing. The installation was easy and I saved a lot of money. No leaks. I would have preferred for some one to come and install for me but I did not have the money. Thanks Tom!!!!
I’m tackling my first gutter project this weekend, using Tom Silva’s methods. Start a Gutter business has great recommendations, but I prefer Silva’s positive attitude.
Wow. So much to say. He's showing a homeowner how to DIY. She most likely doesn't have the professional tools you have. Caulking all over everything? Looks pretty good to me. I had gutters professionally installed with to slight of a slope, and during a heavy rain the gutter would fill and spill over the edge. I had to increase the pitch, ever so slightly, so it would drain properly. Looks like extremely good instruction for the average homeowner. Just my opinion.
Glue not calking
Yeah, Tommy's not very smart, what does he know? Amature.
My main primary criteria is economical, functional and not look like crap. Meet all these 3 terms and it's good enough for me.
The glue comment? Who cares. It's all on the inside anyway. You think a drywaller cares about how the other side of the drywall repair looks?
I couldn't even count the number of times that I have had to correct the work of the so called pro's. The sloppy roof and fascia board were probably installed by a "pro." The fact that a door is under a roof with no gutter is also the work of a "pro." I've been at this longer than most of you have been alive, and Tommy is the man.
I’m an admirer of ol’ Tommy. He comes along and gets things done in a manner that your typical homeowner can relate to. I suppose it would be easy to one up just about anybody, but gotta be a little forgiving as this is for a regular schmuck looking to correct a failed or non existing situation. Good to hear your takes, but ol’ Tommy is the man !
Thank you Tommy Silva, with many years experience, more than some people
Drip edges will pull water up if nailed tight against fascia use a paint stick gap between apron and fascia to stop cohesion uptake
Tommy is a master carpenter and home builder. You are a professional gutter hanger. You gave it away when you said "we" would do it this way. This whole segment is designed to teach a homeowner to DIY.
Why not just do it right, what you said suggested is its OK to do a job wrong because its just DIY? Did you know DIY can also be done correctly? All these little details are important and are done based off of past problems that occurred in various applications.
@@petebusch9069 he did it right.
The sun glasses makes you a gutter guru. Your wisdom is so great I’m glad you critique the 50+ yrs of Tom Silva and his DIY friendly teachings
😂
Glad to have wandered onto your channel as I am in the process of figuring out how to fix the gutters I have. I enjoyed your critique of their gutter installation. I sometimes watch This Old House but just to dream about the tools they have and multiple ladders set up.
I am a union pipefitter and cringe at some of the stuff i have seen. Its easy to nit pick other peoples work. That being said, this job costs about $100 in material. A professional job would probably be about $1000. You do get what you pay for, but for most home owners this works just fine.
I'm sticking with Tom and don't care for the criticisms. But you got one thing right... the bracket hole. I always worry about being too low so I add sealant before I thread it through.
About ice, remember it's a regional thing. Some areas, especially NE, do have more serious ice issues. Not an issue in SE, SW
Thank you for sharing your experience with hanging guitars. Really enjoyed the commentary. You mentioned the hangers cutting into the lower body of the "hull" and allowing water come up and leak into the screw hole is something I hadn't thought about! I couldn't agree more!
Yee haw !!
"guitars" LOL. Autocorrupt strikes again!
Hi….thanks for the video. I live in Durango, Co…not nearly as brutal winters as you have, but I still get considerable snow, and then melt off….repeat.
I am in the process of completing a 2500 sq foot shop, with metal roof. Roof is 3:12 pitch with two rows of snow brake. I installed the roof with about 1.5 -2” overhang and the fascia is 8” tall. I am having gutters installed over the next few weeks, couldn’t get it done before winter unfortunately.
I get what you are saying about having the gutter closer to the drip edge to better capture the run off. However, to allow the snow that does slide off below the lower snow brake to hopefully clear the gutter on way down….how far below do you recommend? I would like to use the simplest method of gutter de-ice by just laying a heat cable in the gutter and downspout, and not laying it on the roofing above the gutter.
Also….my sub fascia is 2 x 6 with smart siding as the exposed fascia…is this enough “meat” to screw into if the truss ends are missed?
How might you recommend an install like this?
Thank you….Steve.
Thank you for saying what you did about the drip edge and getting the gutter under it!!!! That is bothering me right now, I just replaced the gutter over the garage and when you had to lower it at the down spout the gutter was no longer under the drip edge and I could see daylight between the gutter and the fascia. After just having to replace all the fascia on my storage room by myself, I can tell you that you do not want to have rotten water logged fascia to rip off and replace!!! I am thinking about getting some drip edge and sliding it under the existing and letting it hang over the gutter edge as a precautionary measure for my peace of mind. I am also getting ready to start installing 50 feet of gutter along the side of the house which has never had it before and we just had the house re roofed but they left no space behind the drip edge it is tight to the fascia. I am therefore thinking I an going to need more drip edge to slide under the existing and let it hang over into the gutter once again.
If anyone has a better idea would you please let me know, I would appreciate any info you can provide. As a 70 year old female, I try to keep my parents home up but I am willing to hear any suggestions!
A roll of strip flashing will work just fine where it isn't behind the roof edge. On the new side best thing is to pry it away from the fascia just a touch. I do it by hand but can use a flat bar if needed. Just isnt as pretty after.
I noticed that he did not put the gutter under the drip edge, but his gutter had a lip on it to attach the bracket, I thought gutters were flat on the back side to go up and behind the drip edge and the one he put up would not fit behind the drip edge.
Hey, I didn't see anybody install a gutter on a flat roof & brick building on TH-cam. Can you tell me how to do it? Start with a gutter board. Should I use 1x8" or 2x8"? Which anchors to use & countersink the anchor or not? How to secure & install the gutter board? Then install the gutter.
Thank you for all your comments, they are very helpful not to make the same mistakes. I see all your points. I watch both videos and will use your advice. Will be putting gutters that constraction people took off and put away. Now we have disaster with tons of water running of the deck and roof in Seattle. Unbelievable unprofessional and damaging. 🙏
Great content! Where can I find the formulas for figuring the gutter size and downspout size in relation to roof area? I've heard people say they only ever install 5 inch gutters but always use 3x4 DS. Does that seem reasonable?
Sources differ. I've heard anywhere from 800 to 1000 sq. ft. of roof area for 5" gutter with (1) 2 x 3" downspout.
Really appreciate the critique, a lot of good tips. I am about to put all new gutters on a 2800 sq. ft. ranch style house, so quite a bit perimeter. In the past, I have applied caulk between top edge of gutter and facia, but that could be trying to solve a problem that doesn't actually exist.
what gutter attachment would you prefer, if not the ones shown?
How do you deal with winter Ice, and what mounting hangers do you use since you said you didn't like those brackets
ok Mr Silva was shooting a show while teaching a Homeowner how to do something that they never did , with the tools they might have at home. Also there are many ways to skin a cat. I will say both you and Mr Silva are right in your ways. But also never Question 50 plus yrs of experience that Silva family has.
Totally agree there are many ways to do these jobs! We just wanted to input our thoughts from our experience
The guy is a professional with a tv show. I think I’ll go with him
You can’t seriously be this stupid… wonderful logic you have there 😂😂😂
This video was really helpful! We installed gutters this morning using TOH’s video (which was a great visual tool). But unfortunately when it rained this afternoon, rain poured behind our gutters because we didn’t install under the drip edge like you recommend. I wish we had seen this video before we started to have a different option!
Like you said and an additional observation Josh, I would have also installed the down-spout flange under the gutter to avoid a lip above and potential obstruction to water flow. Screwing upward with color matching screws blend nicely as well. But what do I know, I'm an electrician, cheers.
Very good installation and assumption about the amount of water that can be collected from this big space of the roof and i liked that way of measurment of how low you presume to put the gutter of the drain edge of the roof thinking about the snow falling and charge the gutter with big weight of ice and or snow ...thank you very much and I will make my own calculation and add extra materials to stop the snow and pass the water but after all thank you very much.
One question I still have is do you need to gutter all exterior walls or only the walls with that type of roof pitch? I want to do my Mom’s to help her out but want to make sure ik what I’m doing first
Agree with most your takes, as far as the caulk I use to do it all afterwards except for splices and miters. We used silicone and would smooth out with fingers. Pop rivet outlets, downspouts, and joints, just caulk and crimp end caps. Outlets just hammer. awl, and tin snips to cut. Pitch is needed but you don't have to go crazy with it. Don't care for the hidden hangers with the hard downward angle either.
Try ruscoe 12-3 or geocel elastomeric aluminum seam sealer. Malco x style downspout punch is my personal fave.
How much cost to replace 7" box gutter on. 12 story building? 100f and 3 down spout?
lol a lot!
I've watched Tom Silva for decades. All in all he'd make a pretty decent handyman.
That last comment is on point - atleast here in California the rain isn't as heavy, water tension is something to be mindful of, so getting the gutter right up to the drip edge is preferable.
My current home has the gutter too low and the gutter is vinyl, which is infective because it does not sit flush with the fascia board.
Actually in other shows Tom says don't put thedrip edge against the facia board. Leave about a 1/4 inch so the water doesn't siphon back and go behind the gutter.
Thanks for the video. Cleared up that question about the gutter height!
Yes, I searched TH-cam for DIY gutter info to answer this exact question, whether the gutter should be behind the drip edge or not. I have not yet found that explicit answer, but for this "reaction" video.
Easy to criticize , he's demonstrating to a customer how it could be done if she wanted to do others herself , perhaps you could take this opportunity to be invited onto This Old House and show them how it's done . Worked with TOH once years ago and they were a fine bunch of guys , friendly , helpful and grateful . You'd never see them criticizing another directly in a video , they are more professional than that !!!
TH-cam is full of douche bags doing callout videos.
Agree!
I would criticize as well it's a hack job and now thousands of people will install the gutter incorrectly. If anything they are being unprofessional.
Go read some of the professionals' comments on the original video. Some seem to have a very high opinion of themselves, and were quite insulting. This video was more of a review of the procedure, which I found valuable, and his tone was measured and reasonable.
I don’t think he criticized just shared where he would have done it differently and the reasons as to why and also went further to suggest the possibility of that different approach might be because he lives in Montana. Also gave the guy props at certain points as well when he shared he would had used a different method as in using tin snippers or whatever vs a chisel (said still looked good) and at the very end said he does a decent job. Just gave his honest opinion good or bad nothing personal. I took it as a learning opportunity video. And even if let’s say this guy did it all backwards there was still the potential to learn the skill of how to speak to a client and I think he does 10/10 job. With that all said I am not telling you are wrong or don’t have a right to share your opinion/ just that someone else thinks differently and that’s the beauty of this platform to learn from one another weather good or bad it’s just different. And hopefully the guy who made this video won’t feel the need to change his own personal thoughts and feelings and the way he honestly would critique a method in the hopes to not hurt someone’s feelings. At the end of the day it’s all about code and the reasons why those codes or whatever were put in place to begin with. This Old House family could be the nicest people in the world but that ain’t gonna prevent some flimsy gutters being blown apart from ice in the winter. IMO
So is it just those particular brand of hangers that you don't like or do you not like the hidden hangers in general? I'm actually getting ready to do a gutter job and I was searching for information on how long of a run I could do, which is how I got to this video. I do have about 60 ft, so I'll have to think about how to break that up. Our side yards are virtually nonexistent so it's not as easy as one might think to have one in the middle
Good emphasis on screws showing, pitch of run, square feet of roof per down spout, gutter under drip edge, and direction of flow for down spouts, the small details are significant. Thank you!
I'm in Florida. The roofers nailed a 1x2 horizontally along the top of the facia. And then they put the drip edge over the 1x2. And the facia is angled inward about 20 degrees. So there is a 3/4 inch gap (the width of the 1x2) from the bottom edge of the drip edge to the angled facia. What would you use to fill that angled gap so that the rain gutter lays perpendicular to the ground?
Flashing
Make a wedge block out of azak 5/4
They make a few different wedges or blocks and t straps as well
Maybe the roof was done by others, but that is a drip edge not an apron that should be used at the gutter. Downspouts number and sizes can be calculated for your location based on the roof size.
Very interested his process on the gutter system and Seem not right to get gutter to lower from edge shingles it will get spillover the gutter missed when the rain getting heavy pours it will take problem the hight also should have upper almost touch against to drip edge what if they put the leaves filter installing it will great fit with no problems...
What kind of glue?
Geocel 2320
How much should cut and drop cost? I was quoted $1,800 for a 32' gutter last week and that seems absurd.
We must have the same contractor giving us bids. I'm getting ready to do my own gutter. It is absurd.
Great approach appreciated by this newbie. Also thanks for the bit on the ice slides.
Is there no issue with using an oval outlet for a retangular downspout?
works fine
Issue is that though you may be able to put elbows "A/B" on oval to rectangler or vice versa ,dropouts,you increase chances of downspout leaks (obviously from size differences? Improper pitching due to overcompensaion of gutter seating under drip edge ( gutter ser to high or low behind dripedge.
Remember,it's a gutter "system" not just a gutter. Disregarding any symmetric aspects of the system by like using 2 different styles of dropouts no matter D/S size or shape will eventually render the entire system as flawed and ineffective which could leave the home itself vulnerable to foundation damage as well as walls/siding of house becoming mold infested and toxic.
Stay with consistency and same style gutters with properly fitting (seamless) gutter pieces and D/S
Thank you for this video
Ever try cutting with an angle grinder? I work with siding it’s amazing and fast
Hello, great video. Any dos and fonts on installing gutters on traditional stucco? Any help will be greatly appreciated. Have a great day
Thank you!
So what type of hanger would you recommend?
we use Raytec hidden hangers!
Im happy with this video! Not that anyone cares.
This Old House doing a good Job and the Pro sharing some expert Tips that would have made it a bit more polished. But honestly that's the difference in price.
I didn't get that the video showed the guy ordering up the correct length of gutter, and then showed him hacksawing a hunk of it off? Did he mis-measure?
When you print the gutter off of the machine, it is is still connected to the rest of the metal on the rollers and has to be removed.
Think I'd be more concerned why that facia was so bouncy before hanging gutters
This video reeks of salesmanship. I am in my mid eighties now. Last month I changed all the gutters on my house. Just me. All by myself. It was easy. In a couple of places I had to replace short sections of the facia boards due to age and rot. It's an older home. I scraped and repainted before installing the new gutters. I used the vinal type. I used stainless stell screws at each junction point, except for the straight "union" connectors which are strong enough on their own, to prevent separation due to water or snow loading. I set a gradient of about .8% for drainage. It was easy to do... No biggie. I will admit that mine is a single storey house with a low angel roof. No special tools needed. I did all the work using a ladder. I've never been allergic to work but I am always allergic to paying labor charges.
I agree with you on that I would had put the screws from the bottom so you won’t see them stinky out is sealed anyways.
A little critical of Tom who was doiing this 30 years before you were even born. So dont be so critical of someone who has is own TV show and has to expalian how to do things, make repairs, usiung things a home owner can do them selves, not hiring a professional. They also have to do it in a way where it works nearly nationa wide not just in MT. Dont be so critical of the Old man
Lol just watched this video! Glad I found this!
I go 1/4 inch per ten feet max on a level fascia boatd
Apparently we do gutter the same way. Everything you said is correct from my experience.
This old house folks know a thing or two about construction work, but don't trust everything they say, one day that old man was demonstrating how to install shingles on a roof and the first thing i noticed was he installed the starter shingle upside down 😂 i had to take a screen shot of that.
Are you being sarcastic? The first shingle is supposed to be upside down.
@lesliebrew4789 nope, shingle manufacturers make starter shingles with a sealant strip that goes down not up, if you install an upside-down shingle as starter shingle the sealant strip will be in the middle not at the bottom as manufacturers recommend, you're not even supposed to use the same field shingles as starter shingles in the first place and if you do you're not a real roofer, or professional roofer, and jeopardize the manufacturers warranty.
I agree higher to start , metal roof more hangers or leaf guard
Oh man I totally forgot ya can't add pic in the comments... I worked for a long time friend doing soffit, fascia, asphalt shingles & rain gutters, however with latter of the bunch I only helped hang em couple times or go out hang some downspouts that we was short etc... now my buddy lives half block from my dad's where I'm doing in and he calls someone who comes looks at it then never even called em back nor gave em a bid (after wk thus far cutting back every single rafter board too make it plumb because he wants soffit/faciia next yr now I know he didn't bid it cause he didn't want headache from my pops cause I know he's been on my behind the entire time but he's getting it done right for darn near nothing so he can't complain too much or I'd atleast think so... lol
What kind of caulk is that used?
A Gutter sealant called, Geocel
Thanks for the tips
Yeah, I wouldn’t advise drinking rain water running off Asphalt Shingles that normally have an Algicide component on the Shingles. An aged metal roof would be fine though.
Because you asked us to let you know what we thought of your critique: Respectfully and foremost, Josh, learn humility. The smirk doesn't serve you well. Anyone can, and a certain element of contractor typically does, stand back and point out the flaws of another contractor's work. Presumably, they do that to make themselves look superior and to steer customers to them with their smug know-it-all tactic. "Pushers get pushed, Donny Beals," and know-it-alls eventually realize that the more they know, the more they realize they don't know and they need to rely on the help and friendship of their peers. One might learn from Socrates: "I know that I know nothing." In reality, a savvy customer believes one's smugness will be used against them if ever they disagree with that contractor or point out a problem. In time, one may learn that fine people like Tommy Silva have a far greater depth of knowledge and experience well beyond fifteen years and can stand there in front of someone's work, buddies by his side, with arms folded and smirking that grin. He could even make a video critiquing you to the world. It's doubtful you'll see that from a true professional, however. In conclusion, Josh, there's a way to tell people your methods without sardonically picking apart those of another contractor. There's food for thought and also the feedback you requested.
I bet you’re fun at parties!
@@DeadPoolSniper Actually, that’s kind of you to notice. Notice, too, that flames don’t have shadows.
@@tmcg4019Gay people have shadows.
I kind of agree with the host here that I would be worried about water coming up under the drip-edge. That is the most important thing. I would have installed flashing. That said, I would have liked to hear what the host would recommend, as I probably wouldn't know how to resolve the issue. Water will get behind it, especially in the winter with ice. Also, I agree again with the host regarding the pronounced angle of the run, which I had on a previous home and it looked terrible. The technique of temporarily screwing in the gutter seemed convoluted and put additional holes in the back of the gu tter (leaking) - I thought this would be resolved by simply installing the brackets when on the ground.
As far as Tommy goes, he's awesome in many things, but nobody is excellent in everything; I didn't see where the host was disrespectful - I thought it was an honest review.
Reading a lot of the comments here, people seem to think that a DIY video should *not* be professional. I guess, as a DIYer, I want my work to end up as professional-quality as possible, maybe even better (noting that a lot of pro's are sloppy or cut corners).
Good thing I’ve seen the houses his family as built they been standing since the 50s
Best way to know your gutter will drain well is to set it then pore in a little water, water seeks it's own level !
Rather than pouring in some water, just use your garden hose.
Oh nooo!!! So many things wrong in one video . Funny seeing you try to be nice in the reaction video😂😂😂.
Doesn't that hurt your chissel?
It sure does but this is an old beat up chisel anyway... 😂😂😂
Very entertaining… thanks man!
I found it amazing that neither Tommy S or Josh indicated what they recommend for an average slope to allow the gutter to drain
properly. I suspect the slope is around 1/2" fall for every 10'.
Great point as that is very important! Up here in Montana we generally aim for 1/4" for every 40'
@@StartARainGutterBusiness thanks for clarifying that... I have a 63 foot run on the side of my house and a half inch every ten feet would mean id be off the facia at the end lol
I do an 1/8 of a pitch every 2 ft but depends on the run an number of downspouts it’s not a bad idea to start your gutter perfectly level and then pitch it remember how water flows
There is absolutely no reason to slope a gutter. Gutters should ALWAYS be installed level, sunce water in a closed system will drain at the same rate at all points in that system. In other words, the water can never accumulate in a level gutter because the opening for the downspout is at the same elevation as the rest of the bottom of the gutter.
Spec in my area is 1 inch every 40 feet. I have been reported for failing a home inspection for having less. I think that is a bit picky since I always water test when I install. The recommendation is that a 2x3 down will handle about 600 sq. ft. while a 3x4 will handle 1200.
Absoluely agree about drip edge. Water has a tendency to do weird things due to surface tension. Always tuck under drip edge. Also agree with slope critisism. Just make sure no low spots. I can tell TOH is teaching something they have done, maybe twice. Thanks for video.
I can do without this simpering, condescending guy. The gutter Tommy at Ask TOH was hanging was pretty simple, but this is a DIY homeowner show. Based on my recent (9/20/2022) quote for gutter along 45 feet of my house in Northern Virginia, the price difference was 500% between parts from a big box store and the installed gutters by a contractor. Mine was a straight run with two downspouts, but up about 25 feet. If I had one like the TOH video I would do it in a minute rather than hire a contractor who would charge 5 times materials and be finished in two hours.
Makes me regret buying a 2 story house.
Exactly!! You could buy all the tools you need and still do the job for a fraction....may not be A+ work, but I'm okay with functioning B+
Not the length of gutter , it square footage of roof
Agreed!
Most of these critiques seem like non issues. Especially the showing screws. I can't fathom caring about something like that as s home buyer or seller.
I agree: something is wrong here that might be generational: woods are no longer durable and typical low cost modern fascia will NOT withstand the water it will be exposed to if the drip edge doesn't reach into the gutters. Modern materials have no margin for error.
Hey my friend, thanks for the videos.
Is there any chance I could get in contact with guys by phone!?
I’m planning to start my business soon and I need some more specific information if you can help me.
Mateus.
Lol. Got love the fact Tom did not watch any TH-cam installs before he went over there woth his Old house crest stuck out and just totally winged it, using his chisel to cut the outlet hole, lol, spreading caulk like cake icing, lol. Thumbs up.
Yeah he's a much better carpenter than gutter installer. The only useful fact here is practiced more in commercial applications. I.E. the front nose of gutter shall remain no more than 1/4 below drip point of roofing system. Not to argue but it's written if you don't know where we'll then your more of a seamless installer than a metal fabricator and that's OK. I'm with you drip-edge is intended to keep moisture in a gutter or at the very least keep it on the outside of the fascia.
X pattern holes suck. They tear in the corners . Inserts are way better.
Ice and snow does not slide off of shingle roof
Should have made it high in the middle and put a downspout at each end.
Maybe. Its hard to assess without complete information such as square footage, roof pitch, gutter size & length, etc.
Seems like no one uses rivets
Tommy is a God amongst men in the carpentry world.
Wax the hacksaw. It helps!
Got about 5 mins in. I had watched This Old House's video first. It'd be nice if you explained what the "right" thing to do is instead of just pointing out everything that is "wrong" with his method.
I can appreciate your professional opinion but this is a DIY project so no such homeowner would have all the fancy machines and tools you use everyday.
I would MacGuyver this the same way Tommy did and call it a job done.
I called a gutter guy in for some simple repairs but he insisted on replacing my 30 yo gutters, which still functioned fine and in decent shape. Quoted me $3k for the job. I declined and replaced what I needed for about $200 + my time.
You kind of just said things without any of your own solutions or recommendations. I don't think you understand how these videos work.
How much does a gutter man make
It's a DIY perspective..... getting it knocked out in an hour isn't too important. Hand tools are fine.
So far 7 minutes into the video, you said for both the chalk line and the caulk, that you don’t do it that way simply because of cleanup. You don’t have a more professional opinion? Sounds like you’re thinking about speed and he’s thinking about quality. Prove me wrong. Chalk line can be cleaned and as you said it leaves for a nice visual. Why would you want the downspout to act as a drain? The way you explain it makes me think there would be sitting water in it after a small rain. That’s bad. I’d rather have my gutters be slightly angled and working correctly. The caulk being placed before the crimping is a better seal. You can clean it up and then also place a second bead from the outside.
You also didn’t explain how you would level the gutter differently without a chalk line. Would you put the gutter straight against the house and drip edge and slightly lower the side you are wanting it to drain towards?
The old man is not in rush anywhere. He has 2 jobs a month, so yeah, nowhere to rush. And he doesn't know that the hole saws exist. The water will leak behind the gutter. Guaranteed.
Why will water leak behind?
Because of this guy attitude , he would work on my house
I snap at the bottom of the gutter. Because I back flash the gutter
what is back flash?
@@mikemiller9891 we put a piece of allunium strip 3 inches wide under the drip edge and inside the gutter to prevent leaks between the gutter and fascia
The only way to win with a Toxic person is Not to Play!
You know a guy is old school when he used a drill driver instead of an impact
I'd love to see a pullout test on an impact driven screw vs a drill driven screw I would bet that the drill driven screw wins hands down.
Or a chisel to cut a hole. They make hole saws or at least a step bit lol.
@stevenllewellyn8906 he's targeted home owners, teaching them how to do it with out going out and buying and thousands in tools. I'm surprised you didn't figure that out.
@@jackblackattack was that supposed to make sense? Are you retarded?