Steel pipe structures by eliminating welding - CMM laser
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 11 มี.ค. 2012
- www.cmmlaser.it/
laser cut tubes at CMM laser
Apart from traditional cutting and drilling methods, CMM designs dismountable structures by eliminating traditional welding methods using nuts and bolts.
CMM have studied and developed new ways to eliminate or reduce traditional welding processes in frame steel construction. - แนวปฏิบัติและการใช้ชีวิต
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Gave this a thumbs up however, I'm not convinced that this could possibly replace welding. I don't see the strength and rigidity in this type of assembly. Although it could be combined with welding to produce a great structural unit.
When it comes down to it, the load is still dependent on bolts. The cut out section is a good idea, but welding it
instead of bolting it would offer much more structural intergrity.
Absolutely agree with you.
the bolts just hold the plate in place which doesn't have much to do with load. the other cross section of steel supports the other and they're both supported by the large tube.
Then again we have no idea what direction it goes or what load it will support and how. is it a wall structure or a ceiling structure? for its purpose, it could be more than sufficient.
since we don't know where or what its will be used for load and integrity are of no concern yet.
Druss Quinn this design only requires ten times the welding or more than using conventional designs
@@waynerobinson2301 -- just out of curiosity, but would the extra welding, if required, make this complex intersection of joints, stronger? if, it was possible to weld all the joints. Just thinking outside the box 🤔
Good idea. I think welding your design to the pipe, would be better than not welding altogether. I wish you luck in your success, but I also hope it's not just luck, and that no one get's killed by your engineering.
The gaps between members and bolt holes are potential water egress points and having water inside of hollow section will cause longterm integrity issues on the structure. These bolts will tend to corrode and even their replacement will require a lot of effort.
I still prefer the welded solution rather than bolted, however I accept that use of bolted connections is paramount in the live hydrocarbon plants, but the joint to be sufficiently protected from water entrap.
Is that the Bonanza song on valium? Nice joint. Weld it.
Where would you use this, like on the bottom of a picnic table ? This can be done with a band saw and welded like most have said before me.
Hey Thanks for cutting my pieces nice and clean so i can weld them easy.
thats the best thing for a laser to cut out pieces to weld
Clever thinking, so many industries could use this idea.
Given the proper weld procedure this joint would have amazing strength.
cool idea, should build a torture system for these to really test them to twisting bending stresses to see where it breaks and improve your design.
benjamin millard there are several earthquake tables in America and has been since Northridge earthquake or shortly thereafter .
benjamin millard MM ii
If anything, this will make welding better since the fitment is tight enough.
-- It takes 10 minutes to do the welding.
-- It takes about 2 hours to measure/secure the tube, cut the tube, deburr it, check the fitment, adjust the cut, deburr, clean the cut, sand the tube, clean the grit off the tube, then secure the tube into fit position, plus verifying the condition of the tools after you're done.
I've done laser-cut tube before. It takes like 45 minutes round trip. Unwrap, check fitment(usually fits perfectly), file cut edge lightly, clean tube, weld, take picture, post picture to Instagram, next project!
There is no doubt that movement will occur with this kind of joint, and will allow for faster wear. I would use welded joints, unless it's not an option. If that's the case, then this looks like the best alternative I've ever seen.
Excelente gracias.por la idea
I could only see this practice being used in lightweight demountable structures. The fault with this design is that half of the main structural member has been removed to accommodate the cross bracing. The plate i am guessing is only there for support of the piece so that it cannot fall out under lateral loading's.
Welding this joint would seal from moisture and return some of the strength to the structure, welding the plate over the top as a gusset would help but would need to be increased in size to perform well enough.
A great concept in theory, looks good in an animation but real world use would soon see cost of this type of joint configuration ruled out by any architect, designer or engineer. Speaking from engineer seat.
I agree, more suitable as a clamp for a wind brace.
They should have welded the pieces together afterwards.
Shannon K yes only for non human habitable structures like dog kennel. This has no purpose for general building or structures that are human life safety critical . In cabinetry you would use glue . This has no function that is beneficial of metal of any kind for building . It is ridiculous to think where it will ever be approved to use this
as a 10 year electrician, we let engineers think they sit in the seat... truth is, they cant tell if they are coming or going
Shannon K took the words right out of my mouth. The whole time I was watching the video I was contemplating on what to comment, and then I get to the comment section and you were the first comment I read. Well put sir.
I want a comparative stress strain alalysis i would think all the connectinf sharp edges would make for a huge force concentration.
that's perfect solution for furniture kits etc etc...
This would be great for fast assembly and squaring of a complex structure prior to welding.
That is true, though someone still needs to program the robots/CNC and inspect their work.
Good idea, only issue is welds don't loosen with vibration. Bolts love to back out over time, and shear with load. Great for DIY builds, Home Depot products for consumers to self build. As for big industrial purposes, not safe or reliable in the long run.
Looks nice but what load can it take?
thank you !
I'm working a design where this kind of thing will most likely come in handy. Accurate frames and I won't have to "bend it all straight " and clean and polish welds afterwards. Horses for courses I reckon. ( I'll probably have it tacked together afterwards ; just to be sure ;)
no. weld it, solid. that looks like a fitting nightmare as well. throw it away and start over
A lot of negative comments on this guys idea.
I would weld the joint myself, but this joint would be fine, on certain load angles.
David Miller if an engineer signed off on this he would be branded crazy
You are obviously not certified welder out of LA . That certification authorizes you to act like a welder that is all . The approved plans have joint details . The joint parameters are pre approved so in fact you wont be welding this joint at all , on a dwelling for human occupancy . Maybe for a dog kennel
Any ideas what this could be used for?
Good idea !
neat idea but very weak
Any specifics on how much weight this can take? Looking at it I'd be worried if anyone attempted to use it on larger structures, but seems like it should work nicely for things like tentages, sheds etc.
about the maximum weight your bolt can handle because thats the only thing holding it on place
i am not convinced as 1. we are dealing with the heavy load carrying structures of steel in civil then for doing this type of practice we need to generate a huge amount of holes which is not an easy task.2.where and how much the size oh hollow space is also a time consuming and cumbersome task
Besides you can make those cuts by hand
What is the purpose? To be able to dismantle it?
I see 5 bolt holes, making this very strong joint. Engineers were thinking this through.
so what would the rating difference be compared to normal welding.
would you still weld the gaps. i would not want water to get inside and rust in locations i cant see. i can see this as a easy way to set up then weld it for strength and not having to use clamps and tac welding everything to death. but problem would be movement. nothing keeping it dead nuts on still if not welded. bolts are not reliable for life safety they back out and god only knows what else. i would want to see some OSHA certs and stats.
once the plans are standardized with the engineer they can be sent to the machines via a file, fully automated detailing shops for larger pieces search "beam drill line" most companies will replace hand fabrication with robots as soon as they can afford the investment sucks but machines work 24/7 and dont ask for benefits or overtime (there will be lots of work maintaining the machines for a few lucky people tho?)
However, would it not be faster ( land cheaper, since time is money) to simply pull your wire fed buzz box and stitch weld that plate on instead of having to tap all the bolt holes?
I like it when people try to re-invent the wheel.
It's still half as strong as a properly welded joint, at best. At worst, you get a stress concentration at the corner of the notch and it tears open.
Also, the bolts don't do anything but keep the smaller pieces from falling out.
Has anyone analyzed the time involved to make a joint of this type as opposed to welding it?....the old
adage "Time is money" comes to mind here, and
strength-wise, I can't imagine scaling this up as something reliable for larger structures, perhaps more appropriate for something assembled by the consumer such as sheds, carports, porch-enclosures, auxiliary or temporary dwellings and the like, even construction scaffolding.
bel lavoro
hmmmm, not sure where i could do this at. show wat uses u could use with this idea. i must b lost
Cool conceptually. Strength wise you have to weld it though. Bolted it's only as strong as those few threads your catching in what looks to be .120-.188 wall. Even tapping NF your not getting many threads, and it's only as strong as it's weakest link..
This needs next level engineering to work. It alone is a nice idea but impractical
Y para que sirve?
probably it's only for decorative purposes, like fair stands and similar...
This idea could be adapted to woodworking as well.
None of the structural? Damn... Hundreds of years people making houses in exactly this way all over the world.
Vibration not allowed
It has a flaw in the one bolt in the middle concept. That only secures one member of the cross. It would need 2 bolts for each member of the cross. An engineer was not thinking this through.
Nice!
If you welded that, I bet it would be super strong! ;)
One disadvantage of this method is Welding allows joining structural elements at infinitely variable angles and dimensions; this method looks like it would be limited to the angles which would hold the pieces in place.
Limited possibilities and usefulness, but still maybe for temporary purposes ...
But welding with my everlast is the best part of making stuff!
How does laser cutting cost compare to welding in this case?
+mesomorfo Bad :D
great
Cost for welding cheaper than all that laser cutting
What uses more energy and materials? What is proven to be stronger. What is proven to be more durable. What is proven to be more labor intensive. What is cheaper?
would rather have the neat joint welded and not really on four bolts and a plate.
Same here ! Welding beats a bolt every time !
...and exactly how do you get your spanner inside the post to hold the nut? (Unless of course it is 'welded' on...)
Camera Promotion?
Cool idea, Innershield is garbage, But I'd radius the pointed tips or you may find the tip break off, then hairline cracks may compromise joint. But i'm not an engineer, so proceed.
a few minutes welding or a shit load of time cutting a precise cutout and drilling and tapping several holes
good
But this cutting of steel section reduces strength considerably. Looks nice, but structure may fail.
Complimenti da Francesco ....fabbro a Castelgoffredo qualche anno ......fa.
Nice joint, but weld it anyways ! ! !
Looks good on paper lol as the engineer says.
Whats wrong with welding ? This is only if you need to detach the pipe.
disassembly
thats what a plasma torch, oxy fuel torch, grinder, arc gouging is for. you act like its impossible to take a weld out
it is in a rental unit over carpet
so said the land lord :P fire brigade. this is for people diy'ers who dont know how too weld
they have robots that will do all of it and self tapping bolts too but i guess they have welding robots too.
*&%^ YOU! I am a welder and I approve this message
Вы используете инструмент для зачистки ржавчины ? предлагаю свой cup brush megaloder эффективен по ржавчине без браширования и быстро.
what ?
Welds are stronger
Just don't put any weight on it! We've removed 3/4 of the steel and it's completely unsupported now.
а что это такое?
Fucking bolts would be the first to rust out, unless you wanted to pay more for stainless, then you're left with the bolts that might snap under pressure.
As an art piece yes. As a load bearing structural member no. Corrosion 101.
welding is the only way
WON"T PASS CODE
good for toys.
lol this isnt new how do you think they built skyscrapers before welding
given that the first skyscrapper ever was built like 100 years after welding was invented and common, id say you are full of shit
* * Youre dumb. They built skyscrapers with riviets before welding.
The guy who cant even spell rivet is calling me dumb, oh the irony.
* * NOT nice
ryderducan with rivets you dummy
by the time I cut all that shit out and make those holes I could weld a table and two benches
put it together weld it up simple
just weld it haha
Kept looking for a laser...... I felt cheated.
scaffolding
They...took...yer jerb...
Not strong connection very bad
Wouldn’t call this new
R u for real .. id rather do it the right way and weld it
people saying "welding is better", have no idea what they are using this for. This gives you the option to disassemble. Keyboard warriors...
I agree with you on the labour, but "structures" can be for a tarp, or a 5 story building.
true, but still, this can be used for the structure of a gazebo, or a tent. I don't know. People think only in bridges or stuff like that.
welding master race.
bluetorch13 it is being represented as structural not light weight
bluetorch13 it still has a gusset that is not welded and is secured by four 5/16 bolts no strength / this is not structural or scalable to be structural so what use is this over bolted clips and thrue bolts ? None / ths is labor intensive in field and no loading will be allowed / i think its nonsense really
I'm sorry. This is the internet, not english class. I'm sorry I failed to proof-read a hastily typed comment. Actually I'm not sorry.
This technique makes no sense
Decorative; yes!
Structural; HELL NO!!
This is nowhere near as strong as a welded member
It is not now an approved joint for anything that i know of and most likely never will be / this joint is someone thinking on computer program only . All industry have standards and these standards will include joint design and fasteners . How the fuck can people passing them self off as engineers not know this ? / in most situations anything can be done if by testing , with results , a structural engineer will sign off on it . Should it fail that engineer will be sued if someone is hurt or killed and he will lose everything he owns and his engineers stamp . I cant believe the ignorance of people on here
Fucking ridiculous your iron will be messed up in shipment and load rating is very limited in application
haha that piece needed to hold it together could make 50 meters of welding wire instead! stoopid!
You've designed a weaker structure. No amount of engineering can overcome this.
Sorry I really could care less. Off to do machine design homework.