Thank you for sharing this Dr. I found this very beneficial, particularly the way you review different facets of Quranic translations. I've learned a few new things. JazakAllahu khayra
I found this analysis very illuminating in qur'an translation issues, JZK. I'm left wondering if translations along these lines, where a focus is made on particular 'hermeneutics', would be more beneficial if offered as essays on how the new analysis changes the standard translational narrative, rather than complete translations. Someone complained about pedantry, I don't agree and feel that when it comes to understanding the qur'an we cannot afford to be precious about favoured personalities but must accept that every human endeavour is less than perfect and we should foster a culture of valuing constructive criticism and observations so as to collectively shift towards improved comprehension of the divine text.
As-Salaamu alaikum. I think “pathetic” was used to show that the names they, the fellow prisoners and their people, called upon were distressingly inadequate.
Jzk great review Ustadh, but there is a a nahwi point to keep in mind. The ma'rifah for az-zi'bu is not lam of haqiyah, so you can't say; "I fear the wolf would eat him." The ال before the word here, signifies a mental concept, but due to the qareenah of أكل we know the speaker is talking about a subject from this conceptualization. There is no previous wolf being mentioned rather the concept of a wolf, but when this zihni concept materializes, it is any wolf from among the wolves. This is, لام العهد الذهني - وهي ما يراد به حقيقة الشيء من حيث وجودها في بعض غير معين. For example, if you were to say: ادخل السوق without the store being specified, we know due to the Qareenah of ادخل that it can’t refer to the conceptualization in your mind )because you can’t enter that), rather it must refer to one of the individuals of that conceptualization which is found in the real world. Another example is the verse: وأخاف أن يأكله الذئب, so since we have the Qareenah of أكل, we know this can’t refer to a conceptualization, but rather an individual of that conceptualization in the real world. This word (which comes with لام العهد الذهني) in meaning is like a nakirah (because it refers to a بعض غير معين), even though it’s rulings are those of a maarifah, for example, it being mubtada, dhul haal, or sifah for a ma'rifah, and the mawsoof to a ma’rifah etc. The reason Al Qazwini said “like a nakirah” is because when a nakirah is mentioned, what’s intended is an unspecified group from the haqeeqah, but when this is mentioned what’s intended is the haqeeqah itself and the بعضية only manifests due to a qareenah like الأكل or الدخول.
Salaam and thanks for your comment. You’ll notice that I didn’t say that Sh. Keller was wrong to say “a wolf”, in fact that is justified as you have explained. But that doesn’t mean - as you claimed - that it is wrong to say “the wolf”, as this depends on how you wish to analyse this not only from a nahw perspective but a tafsir one as well.
@@MrGJMarshall you mean by Ahmad Zaki Hammad? They both have interpretive glosses but Hammad distinguishes them appropriately. He also has (somewhat scarce) footnotes, whereas Keller has none. Hammad’s language is also more comprehensible.
Jazaak Allah khayran for sharing this. What do you think about this expression 'Lord of all Worlds of Beings'? I think of 'beings' as animate creation, whereas 'worlds' possess both animate and inanimate creation - Allah is the Lord of both. Perhaps it is my limitation in English, however this expression seems to limit the praise of Lordship to only the worlds that possess 'beings'. Perhaps deep in theology we can consider that all of creation is animate in the sight of Allah, praising him? I am trying to understand this choice, but the sentence structure to me on first and second and third glance presents a confine more than the more commonly used expression "Lord of all the worlds" that indicates a limitless praise. I'd be grateful for your thoughts on this. Thank you.
Wa iyyakum. I’d need to hear his reasoning behind that, but for me the expression ought to have been “worlds of being” i.e. varieties of existence. Not to say that this is the best translation per se, but I don’t find the meaning of “worlds of beings” to be quite as clear; it does sound a bit more like animate creations, although it’s possible he intended it more broadly than that.
One point that may be relevant is that some exegetes do understand this as being about sentient beings, hence the plural form which is usually for humans and their like (cf. عوالم).
@@IbnAshur Jazaakum Allah khayran, thanks for your thoughts. That's what I was looking for - some reason in exegetes that supports this expression. I'm more interested to know in the aspect of knowledge but as an English speaker the more common translation speaks to my heart quite well and I'll refer to that in my personal life.
@@sacredartworkshops1160 indeed, sometimes the ‘classic’ translation is a great fit, and no need to fix what’s not broken! But on the flip side, we can get so used to something that we can’t see how it’s inadequate or could be improved. So that’s a constant tussle in the life of a Quran retranslator.
@@IbnAshur Totally, the Qur'an is a miraculous revelation and deserves that. I appreciate the effort just want to understand what might have been inadequate enough to change it into an articulation that is more of an uncommon if not irregular English form and seems to limit rather than expand by the phrase 'worlds of beings' as opposed to "all the worlds". Allahu Alim.
I think an interesting thing is the author tries to bend English to fit the Arabic (e.g. "for useless", "guide us the Straight Way", "and birds eat from his head"), not sure that makes sense, like its not grammatically correct English at the end of the day, but interesting choice.
I wish there was a full, reliable tafsir in modern English for ordinary people to better understand the Book of Allah. I know The Study Qur'an exists, but it has issues since: a) It's academic and filled with all kinds of footnote superscript that interfere with the reading of it. b) It contains non-orthodox, misguided viewpoints in places.
From whatever little I could gather, it’s in works by the Keller-Hani duo again. The Quran Beheld is does try to fill the gap and tie the loose ends to an extent. I fully agree with your comments on The Study Quran deviations.
We share your wish and are working towards it. Before even a page can be written, there are stages needed of creating the conditions and training the people. Fortunately, we are not so very far off from the goal, with Allah’s permission.
Translations are NEVER ENOUGH ! We MUST ask ALLAAH to SEND HELP from RELIABLE QUR’AN - ARABIC Scholars: TEACH 13 Sciences of ISLAMIC Arabic GRAMMAR , Vocabulary , SUNNAH , Authentic Hadiths , etc……!
A very awkward competitor analysis to say the least. 2 hours of pedantic fault finding which really failed to deliver much value as most of the criticisms were based on your feelings.
It’s interesting that you only observed the faults (and “fault finding”) in this video, while there was actually a lot more to it than criticisms. For people interested in the field, it was intended to describe both the benefits of the work and questions raised by the methodology and particular choices. I have certainly seen others who have heaped unadulterated praise on the work, without any kind of close reading as I presented in this video. Let me share with you the perspective of Sh. Abu Aaliyah of Jawziyyah Institute, not because you have to agree with him, but simply because the video came across to him in the spirit which I intended. Maybe you mistake me talking about how I “feel” about certain things to be a sign that I’m led by my emotions! “Bless you, not just for your academic exactitude (which was delightful and highly instructive), but also for the respect and humility you demonstrated when differing with the Shaykh’s translation. Also noteworthy was the way in which you tried to put yourself in the Shaykh’s shoes to discern why he might have translated a particular passage in the way he did. All in all, much to learn from your delivery - both in the sense of knowledge, as well as respectful humility.”
@@IbnAshur I think your sheikh would have a problem with your use of “unadulterated” in your reply 🤦🏽♂️ Anyway by the tone of your reply it seems like I may have offended you or the sheikh which certainly was not the intention. I was hoping to learn with an open mind but the continuous nitpicking gave a bias impression. Regardless please accept my humble apologies.
Apology accepted. In any case, we assume (from what we have heard of him) that Sh. Keller himself will receive the observations in the spirit they were intended. If strong credentials are needed to offer any critique of a translation, then perhaps something is also needed before indulging in critique of a review. Certainly other people have expressed that they found value in the points raised, but you can't please everyone.
This translator is ultimately the cause of many of his “murids” being psychologically, emotionally and physically abused and the younger generation driven away from his group and Islam. Also, having an understanding of NK and how he presents himself, I would take what he writes with a grain of salt.
@@asiyah5786 Don't pay too much attention to people who slander dear sister, there are many hopeless people out there who will say many things about many people simply to justify their own worth. Some leave noble works to benefit others, others spread lies and put people down to feel better about themselves.
Exciting!
Assakamualaykum Paul, have you purchased the Quran Beheld and what are your thoughts? Maybe a review video might be useful?
Thank you for sharing this Dr. I found this very beneficial, particularly the way you review different facets of Quranic translations. I've learned a few new things. JazakAllahu khayra
Thank you for your kind feedback!
أحسن الله إليكم يا دكتور!
بوركت حبيبنا الشيخ تشاد 🌹
Love to see a in-depth tafsir and produced on the level of Zondervan and other Bible publishers
I found this analysis very illuminating in qur'an translation issues, JZK. I'm left wondering if translations along these lines, where a focus is made on particular 'hermeneutics', would be more beneficial if offered as essays on how the new analysis changes the standard translational narrative, rather than complete translations. Someone complained about pedantry, I don't agree and feel that when it comes to understanding the qur'an we cannot afford to be precious about favoured personalities but must accept that every human endeavour is less than perfect and we should foster a culture of valuing constructive criticism and observations so as to collectively shift towards improved comprehension of the divine text.
Well said
Thank you for your review.
I wonder if Shaykh Nuh has any intentions to translate the tafsir into English?
Amazing insight, ماشاءاللہ! The audio could be louder though.
Thank you, and sorry - technical error!
@@IbnAshur No worries! I just thought I would let you know.
As-Salaamu alaikum. I think “pathetic” was used to show that the names they, the fellow prisoners and their people, called upon were distressingly inadequate.
Jzk great review Ustadh, but there is a a nahwi point to keep in mind. The ma'rifah for az-zi'bu is not lam of haqiyah, so you can't say; "I fear the wolf would eat him." The ال before the word here, signifies a mental concept, but due to the qareenah of أكل we know the speaker is talking about a subject from this conceptualization. There is no previous wolf being mentioned rather the concept of a wolf, but when this zihni concept materializes, it is any wolf from among the wolves. This is, لام العهد الذهني - وهي ما يراد به حقيقة الشيء من حيث وجودها في بعض غير معين. For example, if you were to say: ادخل السوق without the store being specified, we know due to the Qareenah of ادخل that it can’t refer to the conceptualization in your mind )because you can’t enter that), rather it must refer to one of the individuals of that conceptualization which is found in the real world. Another example is the verse: وأخاف أن يأكله الذئب, so since we have the Qareenah of أكل, we know this can’t refer to a conceptualization, but rather an individual of that conceptualization in the real world. This word (which comes with لام العهد الذهني) in meaning is like a nakirah (because it refers to a بعض غير معين), even though it’s rulings are those of a maarifah, for example, it being mubtada, dhul haal, or sifah for a ma'rifah, and the mawsoof to a ma’rifah etc. The reason Al Qazwini said “like a nakirah” is because when a nakirah is mentioned, what’s intended is an unspecified group from the haqeeqah, but when this is mentioned what’s intended is the haqeeqah itself and the بعضية only manifests due to a qareenah like الأكل or الدخول.
Salaam and thanks for your comment. You’ll notice that I didn’t say that Sh. Keller was wrong to say “a wolf”, in fact that is justified as you have explained. But that doesn’t mean - as you claimed - that it is wrong to say “the wolf”, as this depends on how you wish to analyse this not only from a nahw perspective but a tafsir one as well.
Is this a better English translation than The Gracious Quran?
@@MrGJMarshall you mean by Ahmad Zaki Hammad? They both have interpretive glosses but Hammad distinguishes them appropriately. He also has (somewhat scarce) footnotes, whereas Keller has none. Hammad’s language is also more comprehensible.
@@IbnAshur thank you. That's helped me decide which one to buy.
Jazaak Allah khayran for sharing this. What do you think about this expression 'Lord of all Worlds of Beings'? I think of 'beings' as animate creation, whereas 'worlds' possess both animate and inanimate creation - Allah is the Lord of both. Perhaps it is my limitation in English, however this expression seems to limit the praise of Lordship to only the worlds that possess 'beings'. Perhaps deep in theology we can consider that all of creation is animate in the sight of Allah, praising him? I am trying to understand this choice, but the sentence structure to me on first and second and third glance presents a confine more than the more commonly used expression "Lord of all the worlds" that indicates a limitless praise. I'd be grateful for your thoughts on this. Thank you.
Wa iyyakum. I’d need to hear his reasoning behind that, but for me the expression ought to have been “worlds of being” i.e. varieties of existence. Not to say that this is the best translation per se, but I don’t find the meaning of “worlds of beings” to be quite as clear; it does sound a bit more like animate creations, although it’s possible he intended it more broadly than that.
One point that may be relevant is that some exegetes do understand this as being about sentient beings, hence the plural form which is usually for humans and their like (cf. عوالم).
@@IbnAshur Jazaakum Allah khayran, thanks for your thoughts. That's what I was looking for - some reason in exegetes that supports this expression. I'm more interested to know in the aspect of knowledge but as an English speaker the more common translation speaks to my heart quite well and I'll refer to that in my personal life.
@@sacredartworkshops1160 indeed, sometimes the ‘classic’ translation is a great fit, and no need to fix what’s not broken! But on the flip side, we can get so used to something that we can’t see how it’s inadequate or could be improved. So that’s a constant tussle in the life of a Quran retranslator.
@@IbnAshur Totally, the Qur'an is a miraculous revelation and deserves that. I appreciate the effort just want to understand what might have been inadequate enough to change it into an articulation that is more of an uncommon if not irregular English form and seems to limit rather than expand by the phrase 'worlds of beings' as opposed to "all the worlds". Allahu Alim.
I think an interesting thing is the author tries to bend English to fit the Arabic (e.g. "for useless", "guide us the Straight Way", "and birds eat from his head"), not sure that makes sense, like its not grammatically correct English at the end of the day, but interesting choice.
I wish there was a full, reliable tafsir in modern English for ordinary people to better understand the Book of Allah. I know The Study Qur'an exists, but it has issues since:
a) It's academic and filled with all kinds of footnote superscript that interfere with the reading of it.
b) It contains non-orthodox, misguided viewpoints in places.
From whatever little I could gather, it’s in works by the Keller-Hani duo again. The Quran Beheld is does try to fill the gap and tie the loose ends to an extent. I fully agree with your comments on The Study Quran deviations.
We share your wish and are working towards it. Before even a page can be written, there are stages needed of creating the conditions and training the people. Fortunately, we are not so very far off from the goal, with Allah’s permission.
@@IbnAshur + Treat Meme
Alhamdulillah, good news on both counts then.
Tafsir al-Jalalayn & Muhammad al Ghazali’s Journey Through the Qur’an
Translations are NEVER ENOUGH ! We MUST ask ALLAAH to SEND HELP from RELIABLE QUR’AN - ARABIC Scholars: TEACH 13 Sciences of ISLAMIC Arabic GRAMMAR , Vocabulary , SUNNAH , Authentic Hadiths , etc……!
Correct, translations are just one tool to study the Quran.
A very awkward competitor analysis to say the least. 2 hours of pedantic fault finding which really failed to deliver much value as most of the criticisms were based on your feelings.
It’s interesting that you only observed the faults (and “fault finding”) in this video, while there was actually a lot more to it than criticisms. For people interested in the field, it was intended to describe both the benefits of the work and questions raised by the methodology and particular choices. I have certainly seen others who have heaped unadulterated praise on the work, without any kind of close reading as I presented in this video.
Let me share with you the perspective of Sh. Abu Aaliyah of Jawziyyah Institute, not because you have to agree with him, but simply because the video came across to him in the spirit which I intended. Maybe you mistake me talking about how I “feel” about certain things to be a sign that I’m led by my emotions!
“Bless you, not just for your academic exactitude (which was delightful and highly instructive), but also for the respect and humility you demonstrated when differing with the Shaykh’s translation. Also noteworthy was the way in which you tried to put yourself in the Shaykh’s shoes to discern why he might have translated a particular passage in the way he did. All in all, much to learn from your delivery - both in the sense of knowledge, as well as respectful humility.”
@@IbnAshur I think your sheikh would have a problem with your use of “unadulterated” in your reply 🤦🏽♂️
Anyway by the tone of your reply it seems like I may have offended you or the sheikh which certainly was not the intention. I was hoping to learn with an open mind but the continuous nitpicking gave a bias impression. Regardless please accept my humble apologies.
Apology accepted. In any case, we assume (from what we have heard of him) that Sh. Keller himself will receive the observations in the spirit they were intended. If strong credentials are needed to offer any critique of a translation, then perhaps something is also needed before indulging in critique of a review. Certainly other people have expressed that they found value in the points raised, but you can't please everyone.
This translator is ultimately the cause of many of his “murids” being psychologically, emotionally and physically abused and the younger generation driven away from his group and Islam. Also, having an understanding of NK and how he presents himself, I would take what he writes with a grain of salt.
And by “grain of salt” I mean don’t take him as an authority but rather verify what you learn from other sources
Fasiqs never get tired spreading falsehood haan..Now that Quran Beheld is on its way to become best seller trying hard to cause damage. Keep trying …
@@rainpoetry3695 victims or disgruntled ex mureeds who could not make it in the tariqa .
Why do you say this? Where is the evidence for this?
@@asiyah5786 Don't pay too much attention to people who slander dear sister, there are many hopeless people out there who will say many things about many people simply to justify their own worth. Some leave noble works to benefit others, others spread lies and put people down to feel better about themselves.