I think Kojima should remake Metal Gear 1&2 and change the title of those two. I think it would be amazing and also add the information that was missing in V.
Troublesome 22 a whole game could be made about the real big boss and a dlc could be released for tpp to tie up loose ends and unfinished things, I would gladly buy both. And then he could go on to make the boss stealth game set in ww2 like he wanted to, and a full remaster of the entire series (besides 5) with the new fox engine. My life would be complete
@Tiredofdumbfuks yeah that one it was the most blatantly obvious. I still like MGS4 - it being my favorite in the series. But still I can't help but feel sorry for Kojima since the Metal Gear series was kinda intended to be a one and done series.
Venom Snake loses his home and most of his comrades on MSF. He fails to save Paz, which causes Chico to die and puts both him and Big Boss in a coma. Driven by revenge, he builds a new Mother Base for he can basically chase down a man he has no leads on. When he finally does get to Skull Face, he's already anticlimactically defeated by Sahelanthropus and Venom doesn't even kill him himself. He still has no real lead on Cipher. Venom is forced to kill his own men because of a parasite outbreak caused by a former "ally" at the base. The kids he saves turn on him and leave with Sahelanthropus after he rescued them twice. One of his buddies, and possible romantic interest, sacrifices herself to save him and is implied to die alone; even if she doesn't, she can't come back with those parasites in her. All just to find out you aren't even real and just a puppet in the grand scheme of things; making all you did hollow and meaningless. Yeah, I'd become a nuke wielding super-villain too. Kojima wanted you, the player, to be angry and feel that "phantom pain" when it all seemed meaningless because you weren't the real Big Boss. You are Venom Snake, and I think it did a good job making you feel like that in the end. Anyways, awesome video Jeremy!
@@thelel6591 Venom Snake turned evil because he developed a Metal Gear. That's as far as it went. Big Boss sends Solid as a mission to keep up appearances. He expects Venom to beat Solid since Venom is his best man and was left in charge of Outer Heaven by Big Boss.
I don't see Venom Snake as just a medic. He is you, the player as a full self insert in the game, just with all of Big Boss's memories and skills, that's why he was artificially induced into a coma. I think Kojima tried to do the whole phantom thing as a last big thank you to fans. Maybe it could have been executed better with more time and resources but of course that wasn't possible with Konami.
I personally see Venom Snake being the lesser evil. As Venom we are awarded for being a hero. We even get a (hidden) cut scene if all the nukes in the world are deactivated. We save children and try to keep them out of war. While Naked Snake has done a lot of morally questionable actions such as, had obtain a nuke/metal gear, bringing in children (Chico and Paz*) to work, and having some medic be involuntary brainwashed to believing that he's someone else while he was in a coma.
Yep. To me, the whole point in this game is that Big Boss was already a villain, and he fooled not only The Medic, but the players. He did to us exactly what the CIA did to him. Played us like a damn fiddle...
Ehhhh. I don't know about that. The first thing Venom does after saving those kids is talk about making them soldiers of his own. But doesn't because Kaz wants to give them a place to have some form of a childhood and the choice of joining when they're old enough. Chico and Paz kinda fell into Boss' lap. Both wanting to fight along side him. Then the fact that you can make nukes of your own which turn you into Demon Snake. As well as Boss and Kaz declaring a Peace Day on Mother Base. Going on his own crusade shortly after before trying to kill Solid.
+DatsRandom Ah, but that hidden cutscene still shows two sides to the story. Right after Kaz finishes his speech on nuclear disarmament, there is a long pause and he speaks in private to Venom about how Diamong Dogs must now control the world's supply of nukes. Through force. He even says 'gotta love the irony' -- because they way they do it is by taking everyone else's nuclear weapons. Then it shows a helicopter flying around mother base and shows you the war machines (tanks, etc) you've collected. But it's not tac-porn, it's telling you that it has to be done through force.
But look closer to why you are a hero. A hero for who? Not for the World thtas for sure You get heroism by doing terrorist missions in cover, by taking soliders to YOUR privet army. I mean, you are hero, but only for "those eho live in the battlefield". But the true is you are a criminal.
hmmmm I think you got it wrong there Jeremy, Venom Snake didn't go evil and forced Big Boss to send Solid Snake. Venom was meant to finish of Solid Snake but Snake proved to strong
+Jeremy Jahns the evidence points to this: the real BB sends Venom the "n313" tape with Solid's mission details, so Solid can be thwarted by Venom, which means the bosses (phantom and real BB) are in cahoots.
***** How is that more convoluted? That's literally what happened, Big Boss' plan was to send Snake into Outer Heaven as a decoy, to leak false information but Solid Snake ended up completing his mission. Venom Snake didn't split from Big Boss, hell that's why at the end Venom has that cassete tape so we can see that he knew about Big Boss's plan to send Solid Snake
***** most likely cause he didn't know Outer Heaven was ran by Big Boss and thought it was an enemy group. Hence why he would join up with Big Boss at Zanzibar , also like I said if Venom wasn't in on it than why did he get that tape from Big Boss about Operation Intrude 313. It was planned from the start
It's basically Sons of Liberty in reverse; Raiden throws away his (or the player's) dog tags and accepts his fate as is (like the end of Inception) but Venom Snake breaks the mirror of his old reflection (again or the player's) and continues the lie that he's Big Boss.
I'm so glad someone else appreciates the ending to MGSV, like holy Hell, trying to find someone on TH-cam who has something good to say about it is like finding a needle in a hay stack, at least for me. I'm gonna make a video going off about this hopefully in the near future, who knows, my focus is all over the place, but think about this; what if Kojima made MGSV as a means for the player to feel what it's like to be Big Boss? What if it was meant to evoke emotions of sorrow and anguish as you're yet another pawn in the giant chess game and you watch Venom writhe in guilt from committing these atrocities... You're supposed to feel what he feels because you are him. As Big Boss said, I am you and you are me. I get it that some people might find that kinda corny, but considering MGSV feels like a Big Boss simulator, it all makes sense. It's almost as though by the end of it, you were supposed to feel the effects of the PTSD that Venom is now stricken with, hence why unlike Big Boss, Venom is often very quiet, leaving for some pretty awkward silences between him and other characters. I don't know, something to chew on.
I also forgot to mention another speculation related to this, Kojima may have also intended for the player to feel brainwashed by the end of everything, feeling things like, "Why am I even doing all of this? I get that we're getting revenge, but that was mostly done with in the first chapter... I don't necessarily feel like Big Boss anymore, I almost feel like I'm just being dragged along by a faceless entity." ... That's probably because you were, all the way until the very end. Obviously, we all know who Big Boss is and all, but this makes the events of the game make a lot more sense I'd say. Part of me wishes Kojima could make a game out of the events after TPP considering the cutscene at the end of the game w/ Kaz, Venom, and Ocelot discussing getting revenge on the real OG Big Boss for fooling them and making them think they were actually fighting for the real Big Boss, but on the other hand, he didn't even want the series to drag on past Snake Eater/Subsistence, forcing him to make a game after now 17 games, including (what I remember to be)all spin-offs and hand-held exclusives (minus cameos), would not result in a great game I feel, nor should it. Kojima's pretty much Metal Gear'd out, he wants to make something new, as he should be free to, especially now that he's out of Konami's clutches.
+Teebz 1000 well, killing hundreds of soldiers along the way, choosing to bomb his own men, the vocal chord parasites... I'll give a more detailed response later when I can think more.
+SkebbenTheNobody Same, I haven't played any of the games so I'm still trying to get over the fact that Big Boss and Solid Snake aren't the same person.
I always interpreted the mirror scene as Venom finally destroying his former self and accepting his role as Big Boss. The tape is from the real Big Boss showing that he wants Venom to defeat Solid.
Big boss surpassed the boss. she didint loose on purpose.. she knew naked snake ( back then) would be able to kill her cause he at that pooint surpassed her.
@Ricardo Santos true. Solid snake didn't defeat big boss with guns or cqc though. He was unarmed and big boss was after him with a flame thrower. He got a flammable spray with a match and set big boss on fire. Yes he beat him but not in the way everyone thinks
Lol what you even expect from the main protagonist of the series? People play as solid mostly throughout the series, there's no way he will lose till the end lol, not that surprising if u ask me.
Am I the only 1 who feels bad for Eli (Liquid) after this Big Boss charade? Not only was he fueled by the belief that he was the genetically inferior clone which wasn't the case at all, but now he also had to live with the fact that he got his ass kicked and lectured by Big Medic AKA Venom Snake whom he assumed to be the real Big Boss?
+RandomBlackGamer You mean Kojima. There's only so many times someone can spend your money and scrub their work before you tell them to release what they have. Even if the game sells 50% more copies than it has, Konami is looking at losing upwards of twenty million on the game. His budget reached 88 million and he had more than half a decade to come up with the finale. Even the other guys developing Fox Engine were tired of having to start over every year.
+Joong Kim (Xephon0930) None of that has anything to do with the ending of MGS5. Kojima squandered millions of dollars and the time of his entire team for so many years that when they finally called him out, this is what he had to show for it. An incomplete story. It takes a ridiculous amount of mental gymnastics and supposition just to make sense of it. If he spent more time on the story rather than trying to stick it to Konami with his name appearing every five seconds of the game there wouldn't be much to complain about. He knew it was the last game and has let down a great deal of fans by making himself into even more of a 'wacky zany joke!' character.
+Joong Kim (Xephon0930) So because Konami cancelled a project lead by Kojima, with knowledge that he would not be under their employ, that excuses Kojima's ethics and failings in a completely different project? Really sad that the Kojima worship is so deep rooted. Dude deserves no loyalty and certainly doesn't enrich your life in any way so I'm really curious as to what benefits this white knighting grants you.
To all the haters.... i know what this ending means and signifies. It's not simply saying "You play as the medic" because that's a shallow way to look at it. At the beginning, we create our perfect avatar, a representation of ourself, we even put our own name and DOB in it. WE, the players, are the medic - WE are venom snake. Now, what is big boss? It isnt a person - it's a title. A legacy. Ok, so we don't play as Jack, the original big boss - but we DO play as big boss - Jack hands us the PLAYER that title - this is Kojima's final MGS game, and, as a farewell present, he is giving US the title of Big Boss. That's why Jack says thank you. It's subtle, but it's from Kojima. Jack says that the medic was his his most trusted lieutenant - why was he? What's so special about him? It's because we've known Jack since his very first mission. That's why Venom Snake has Jacks memories - it's because we were there WITH Jack. It's not a fuck you to fans - it's a thank you. It also fits with the canon too - it explains how Big Boss survived MG1s Outer Heaven ending - he didn't. Solid Snake killed Big Bosses phantom - he killed Venom. Sadly, this will be lost on most fans. Jeremy NAILED it here, and I'm just adding the deeper meaning of the layer here.
+Broken Minded As cute as that is, its still a story that tells us nothing about how Big Boss's downfall in becoming the villain, and that's what a lot of people expected and wanted to see. Instead, we got an overall underwhelming story that ended poorly.
Voxeschlong I kinda felt like there wasn't a proper ending, don't get me wrong I love this game and the ending, but it just felt like they just like dropped it there and just felt out of place.
Rohit Rajput well to be fair TPP is to tie up loose ends between ground zeroes and metal gear, yeah it doesn't excuse the cut content but the ending was fine.
Jeremy, I HIGHLY suggest you check out Super Bunnyhop's Metal Gear Solid V: Dissociative Disorder video. The really interesting stuff is him talking about the whole thing with Phantom Boss and his relation with the real one and how the whole thing fitted with the MSX games.
I actually loved the twist for the same reasons as you. What I'm pissed about is the cut mission that finishes Eli/Liquid's story. And it would have been cool if the end of the game showed a young Solid Snake invading Outer Heaven.
Oh! And it would have been cool to see Frank Yeager aka Gray Fox and Naomi's stories. If you remember, they were in Africa when Big Boss found them. After Fox killed her parents and adopted her, of course.
+Tony Arevalo INC Episodic DLC =/ That's one reason why I'd be pissed about it. Cutting stuff that could have been in the game to make it a much better content and story driven title, for the sake of money.
I just finished MGSV; I've had the game for 10 months, and only finished it now. woot.:l so I decided to go straight to your spoiler talk straight away after that, and I gotta say; I agree completely. the ending here, yeah, I actually liked it. :)
GentlemanGamer94 I liked MGSV TPP beat it a long time ago but I think that you should watch YongYea's video on how MGSV should've ended expanding on the ending with a Venom Snake vs Solid Snake.
Jeremy, while I do think you make great points and I wouldn't of had a problem with the ending, it's the fact that there was very important content that was cut that dives deeper into the descent of Venom/Phantom Snake. It's because of this cut content that a lot of answered things and holes were caused like the kids vanishing and Liquid and the Giant metal gear and volgin and etc.
+RaidenTheBloodEdge I didn't really see any potholes, but I see where other fans are coming from. My first reaction to the last chapter with Liquid was that he would eventually transform Meta gear Sahalanthropas into Metal gear Rex.
+Robert Wild But REX was an American 'black project', it was not remolded by Liquid at all, who only seized it in 2005 (and couldn't even activate it).
Seonaidh Ceannéidigh Thanks for clearing that up, it's been a while since I played the original metal gear solid. I was just saying what I assumed at first glance. But now that you mention that fact, it does make it dissapointing that Konami cut that section from the game.
For me Big Boss was never a villain, from the perspective of Solid Snake if he is, but not really, although Big Boss and Zero misinterpreted The Boss's Message, the one who truly understood the message was Venom Snake, it is demonstrated with the end of Nuclear Disarmament, and Venom's ideas are quite clear, also I think he values the lives of his men much more than the real Big Boss
valid point, Big Boss in the beginning of the escape during the hospital, was using his soldiers as protection from getting shot helping Venom escape. Venom when he was mistaken as Big Boss truly do care for his soldiers (and even enemies)
Lol you're totally right. This was my first metal gear and only for a second I was like WTF IM NOT EVEN BIG BOSS? And then I was like... hey that's pretty cool.
Cj Baker what second point? If the player is physically venom then while playing MG1 the player is killing himself. It's an unnecessary twist if intended to be taken literally. Time paradox. Are you referring to that?
I actually had the opposite reaction. I initially LIKED the twist and then I paced around and started wondering what this meant for the series and then I became pissed because I didn't understand what it all meant. Watching your video gave me a lot of relief and some much needed closer. I feel good about the ending now. Thanks, man.
I'm kinda in the middle. On one hand, I'm like "holy shit I would have never thought of this! Props to you kojima." On the hand, I'm like "well why? Why not just have me play as big boss?"
+fullmetalvenom because it goes against kojimas themes, think about it, you are playing a different main character or version of snake in every game, we never get the character we want
+rbraunbeck96 not to mention how butchered chapter 2 was........... i believe there were like 4 or 5 main missions in chapter 2 a then a bunch of replays of older missions.... that whole part felt incomplete but I was so sad to hear that there was to be a 3rd chapter.........i believe tthe chapter was gonna be called "PEACE"
I LOVED the ending. It made so much sense, really tied up all loose ends i could think of. Besides that, I really love the fact that medic is Venom Snake and Big Boss is a different person, this is why metal gear is great, it drops twists on you that you never see coming
The problem why I and many other MGS fans are so disappointed is, that we were promised to get the story about how Big Boss turns from a hero into a villain. We wanted to see how he met Grey Fox, trained Solid Snake, met Sniper Wolf etc. We got nothing of that, instead we got a story about a fake Big Boss with no major plot behind it. Seriously, not much happens in this game. I agree, the idea that there is a second boss isn't bad, but was it necessary to have it told through Kojimas last Metal Gear game instead of showing us the story about the real Big Boss? The character we really care about? Showing us how he build the "real Outer Heaven" aka Zanzibar Land? I think it would have been more interesting and would have had more impact. The story we got instead had no real epic moments, no real emotional impact at all. (Quiet was the only character that gave us a little bit of that) So the question is, was it worth it to close that little plot hole of super old MSX games, to instead not get the story about the real Big Boss? The story that actually everyone was hoping to finally hear? I mean, there are rumors a third chapter was actually planned, hell, even the last mission of the second chapter was cut out of this game, so I guess the story is incomplete anyway. Too bad we might never get to see it....
+RedVIII i think Kojima wanted to end the story at Third chapter with every explanation in it but Konami want to create more games off metal gear because of the huge success it has that why Kojima left Konami because his work in chapter 3 was completely cut out But that just a theory my theory :D
+RedVIII I actually think that the deception of Ahab, and his conversion from his former self into Venom snake is the turning point in for Big Boss from a hero to a villain/anti-hero. All his life he fought against the manipulation of soldiers by their commanders - BB was supposed to be the soldiers saint- instead he became the very thing he thing he intended to fight. Remember portable ops? That guy who commands the FOX unit with an iron fist and maniacal charisma, who endangers the lives of his soldiers by blatantly putting them in harms way with the promise of soldiers heaven. That's where the real vision of outer heaven germinated. And like that manipulative man, BB manipulated one of his own - who did nothing but suffer for BB's benefit and survival - and then feeds him this justification that they are the both the big boss. I mean that deception is so paramount BB's villainy - doesn't feel so strange to just pull soldiers out of the warzone like that and deny them any hope of a normal civilian life?
red99Baron Sounds like you assume. Like I said, nothing is shown. I wanted to see a big emotional Big Boss story, and I have the feeling I was robbed of it.
Dark ^-^ It would have been awesome if we got a third chapter where we maybe control the real Big Boss, so maybe yeah, maybe that was planned by Kojima, because the story definitely feels incomplete. However, I doubt Konami stopped it because they wanted to do those stories without Kojima in new games (they can do new Metal Gear stories regardless), but I think Kojima just used to much money trying to complete the game. Just see how big it already turned out. Konami pulled the plug on the third chapter because they wanted the game to be finished.
+RedVIII but was the big boss a villain? mgs was never about good versus evil. but it was about manipulation, and how information is the greatest weapon...
That's pretty much every Metal Gear major villain in a nutshell. Except Volgin. He's just a sadistic fuck. The problem all of the major Metal Gear villains face is while their methods and idealogies make some sense, they always go about it wrong. Hot Coldman wanted to essentially protect the world from nuclear war, but he came to insane conclusion that he MUST launch a nuke to prove it. Big Boss and Liquid simply wanted to give all soldiers a place where they are always needed. However Big Boss was manipulating child soldiers, holding the world hostage with nukes and denying the world a solution to the oil crises, he manipulated his own men and double crossing them. Liquid he wanted to make money, launch a nuke, and his motives were mostly petty revenge and inadequaticy issues. Solidus wanted to give himself and the people true freedom again, but at the needless cost of wiping out New York of power and destroying Wall Street. He also used child soldiers just like Big Boss. Ocelot he betrayed, manipulated and killed a lot of people just to destroy the Patriots and cause endless conflicts. Venom Snake in the end wasn't much of a villain. His only flaw is that when he discovers his true identity he just follows Big Boss's orders. Just copying Big Boss's lead. Be a warmonger. He at least had morals and didn't use child soldiers or nukes until the Outer Heaven uprising - probably under orders from Big Boss.
Very late to the topic but my interpretation is That venom snake basically becomes another soldier a thing not person a tool big boss uses to accomplish his goals so it’s a middle ground for what we thought would happen and what your interpretation was where big boss doesn’t become evil but does questionable things (which is he uses his soldiers like weapons just like the us army did to him)
Judge me as you might I feel like every few months to a year I come back to this video. It’s just a staple in my head of how cool the story can unfold in someone’s head
So people are getting pissed because of this plottwist while this entire franchise is known for more plottwists then M. Night Shyamalan has came up with. I mean every game has at least one if not multiple 'WTF?!'-moments. Even Ground Zeroes ended on kind of a shocker.
+Flashback007 liquid disguised as miller is ok, liquid ocelot was so bad that kojima changed to nanomachines/hypnotherapy excuse. Big boss being the father and the villian is ok, it's starwars like, but big boss not even being bigboss, just some random guy sucks... you know kojima did drop the ball before.
The point behind the twist was that Venom Snake personifies the player and, just as Big Boss said in the cassette tape, he (meaning us) carries a piece of Big Boss with him everywhere we go and we have helped build the legends of Big Boss and Metal Gear since the beginning of the series and that we are the core of the story. Big Boss also says in the cassette tape that the legend of Big Boss is more like himself and Venom Snake (meaning us) together, rather than Naked Snake alone. It was a fantastic way to pay homage to the fans as the last MGS game from Kojima. This is also why a majority of the game is gameplay rather than story because the gameplay is Venom Snake's (our) story and that is how the player leaves his mark on the game world, while the narrative is generally Snake's story.
All the "fans" who bitch at the twist ending clearly didn't stick to the end credits, the timeline reveal and listened to the extra audio tapes for completing the game because it does tell you what the real Big Boss is doing! But I understand the initial rage but damn that ending got me going so good!
I had the same exact reaction at first and I came to the same conclusion as you. I also liked the ending after mulling that all over in my head for a while. The only thing I wish was different about the game is Kojima was given just a little more time to close up the loose ends in the missing mission, and not just release it as an unfinished bonus content video.
oh my god, metal gear solid as a series is breathtaking. a true masterpiece. so rich and deep. I would have never seen any of this shit coming before playing TPP. kojima, I'll forgive you for cutting eli's ending from TPP (that's not really a spoiler) based on the fact that you made the connection between big boss's story and solid snake's story *extremely* good - you made the LET project make perfect sense as well and we now have a fluid timeline without any "well, that part's yet to be told" - bravo. and by the way JJ - awesome theory - it makes perfect sense as well. it doesn't sound far fetched - it actually would make more sense than a "normal" explanation
i always wonder how the f*ck does kojima's brain works to create such an amazing and super complex story like mgs, like the amount of details in the plot was just outstanding (probaly because of nanomachies, son)
Senjo Natsuzora hehe yeah, nanomachines as the explanation for most things in MGS2/4 seemed a little bit like "mediclorians" in the star wars prequels, but to be fair, it does make some sense in that universe - but then you get spooky ghosts~ like the sorrow - how is the sorrow able to be magic without nano machines yet people like vamp, ocelot (via liquid's arm) and the other "magical" people in the solid snake saga have to explain themselves with technology? seems a bit two sided. ah well, it's not too much of a problem :)
Alex R there's a little bit of magic in mgs world, we just need to accept it. It's like a classic 90's-2010 slice-of-life anime/manga, the world usually really realistist but always have a bit of supernatural elements throughout to spice things up. The most jar-dropping magic moment in mgs for me is Fortune, her power was explained nicely by technology reason, and then "nope, she was the real Lady Luck, magic son"
Iam looking forward to the E3 2016 Sony Press-Conference reveal for Kojimas Kickstarter Project "Metal Gear Solid 6 - The Fall of a Phantom" 14.06.2016 guys ;-)
Kinda late to the party here, but I would just like to say that the real Big Boss didn’t want Solid Snake to kill Venom Snake, the fake Big Boss, he was meant to go in there and be fed some false info and report back to the government that there was no threat in Outer Heaven, better yet, he gets killed while there. Which is why he was sent in with virtually nothing to defend himself, just a pack of cigarettes. So no Big Boss didn’t want Venom dead by any means.
I think something A LOT of people are forgetting as one of Metal Gear's trademarks is how it skips time through each installment. The fact that this game ends, fast-forwarding to the Outer Heaven Uprising about 10 years after the events of TPP is not unlike Peace Walker starting AFTER Big Boss lefts the Patriots and was cloned by Zero. Or how MGS2 skips Solid Snake and Octacon founding Pihlianthropy and how the Metal Gear designs go out in the open. Or MGS4 going straight into Solid Snake's body already deteriorating. Everyone saying WE NEED MORE CONTENT needs to calm down. There is no definite, absolute in-your-face what the fuck this is for real proof that a chapter 3 exists. Could it have been happening at one point? Sure. Was it cut from the game. Most likely, and probably because of the whole Konami vs. Kojima debacle. Mission 51 is definite proof and I do believe that THAT is something that should be patched into the game (as well as Quiet still being a buddy, but whatever). My point is, the whole cut content thing is an over reaction to a mild degree. Since this game ends the way it does, let alone it being what may very well be the final Metal Gear game for a very very long time, I can understand the sour taste. Trust me, I had it for a good couple of days too after beating it. But it took me a while to accept the ending as not unlike anything that has happnned in Metal Gear before, when you break it down to its very essence. So no. A Chapter 3 shouldn't and won't probably happen. But yes, I'm right there with you in wanting that mission 51 as a definitive climax to this game--one it needs very much (that shiv to the heart that was the standoff in mission 45 was amazing but no Metal Gear boss battle). The ending isn't something to be taken at face value, and is by no means a mere contextual, in the moment sort of ending. This is as much of an addition to the series as whole, changing the preconceived notion of the story of Metal Gear, while also being a fitting conclusion to the series as a whole. And for a prequel to not just tell us what we already know but tell us a story we never knew I think is brave and unheard of, and somthing people should be celbrating more than being mad at, not because it underwhelmed them which is as a good of a reason as any, but because it is lazy or its shit writing. If you wanted the heartfelt, ties up all loose ends ending, thats where MGS4 is. Thats where that needs to be, not here. If you were hoping to know how Big Boss was a villain this whole time, he's been one since Peace Walker AND better yet his betrayal/deceit of Venom/you is better villainy then doing any terrible, evil act you've seen before. This isn't bad writing. Is it upsetting or not as good as it could be? If that's your opinion that by all means preach it brother, or sister. Point is, this ending deserves a lot more HOORAYS then BOOS, and the fact so many fans of Metal Gear are refusing to look past the face value of what this ending is--not just respective to this story, but to the Metal Gear lore, mythos and universe--is kind of sad. Anyways, I'm still playing htis game 2 weeks after beating the story, and I'm loving it so fucking much.
+BruceWillisHasNoHair I totally agree with you on the first part about time skips, but I don't agree that there shouldn't be a third chapter of the game. It established new loose ends it still had to tie up, including context for the twist ending, it just came out of nowhere.
I just played it again and I have the same thoughts. Venom Snake loses it, because he feels used to strengthen the Legend of Big Boss. So in the End he uses his Name to create Outer Heaven. The real Big Boss returned to Foxhound as a Comander and Instructor, that is also where he met Solid Snake. (Even if he hates the LET Project, he respected Snake as a Soldier. Seen in MGS4) So he sends his "Clone" with the same Capabiltys to take down his Phantom to sace the World. After leaving Foxhound he creates Zanzibar Land, but the AI System of the Patriots sees it as a threat, so they send Solid Snake again to kill his "Father" Also Master Miller hates the fact, that Ocelot lied to him and that Miller would stand with Venom Snake instead of going with Big Boss. "We each have a Role to play, and when the Time comes, one of us has to Die" On the Tapes in Phantom Pain you can listen to audio where Zero visits the real Big Boss and Ocelot. He never wanted the MSF to be destoryed. By Privatising the Military it even played in Zeroes Hands. But after Skull Face poisens Zero the AI that Sigint built gets Control and seeks Big Boss dead and the inconvinient stateless Army destroyed. In favor to have full control of the coming War Economy.
Let me clue you up. Big Boss chose David (Solid Snake) to take down his phantom Venom Snake during the Outer Heaven incident in 1995 as a test, in order to see if he had what it took to actually kill him. David passed that test with flying colours (with a little help from Frank Jaeger), and so four years later you have Zanzibar land again with Frank helping him (secretly this time) toward the final confrontation with Big Boss. The reason for this is because Big Boss saw something in David that reminded him of The Boss whom he killed during Operation Snake Eater. As such he wanted David to kill him, because the anguish he felt from killing his own mentor still weighed heavily upon him. Frank being Big Boss's most trusted lieutenant understood his commander's wishes, and he wanted David to kill him as well. Eli (Liquid Snake) despite having Big Boss's dominant genes was simply nothing in the eyes of his father, even though he too wanted him dead just like David did.
Spoilers ahead: This was not the game you found young Sniper Wolf while riding as Saladin in Afghanistan. You did not save Gray Fox in Mozambique. You did not go on adventures with your 2nd in Command and you did not meet young Naomi Hunter in Rhodesia. You did not discover how Big Boss went from Diamond Dogs/Outer Heaven (anti-Patriot/Cipher organization) to Foxhound (Patriot/Cipher organization) and why. You don't learn about how BB, the supposed villain of the series, ends up being this malicious villain that supposedly wants a world of "perpetual war" (as he himself says in MG2). Instead, you get a game where you play as some random guy who happened to be in the same plane as BB. You learn that just about anyone can be Big Boss if not better. You go on ultimately pointless adventures that contribute nothing to the overall story of the saga. You're supposed to accept that Big Boss is just a manipulative asshole even though they offer you no context to his actions. Ocelot is boring. Kaz is outright detestable. Quiet could as easily been made out of cardboard. Skullface went nowhere. Mother Base is empty and lifeless. Parasites are the new (old?) nanomachines. Huge, huge missed opportunities all around. Even for an MGS game, this story is embarrassing. Great gameplay, though.
+4Clubs Well it isn't a random guy. He is the best soldier besides Big Boss. I really wanted to see Sniper Wolf, Gray Fox, and all of The Sons Of Big Boss group but we didn't and we cant change that. Oh well it happened and this is the last Metal Gear game from Kojima and it explained how Big Boss was a "villain" because Venom Snake became power hungry and turned into a dick so people even thought worst of him.
+4Clubs Your wrong you did play Big Boss you played the very first big boss ever seen in a metal gear game, you just didn't play as Naked Snake MGS has always about the fact that given the right set of circumstances anyone can be BB/Snake, Solid was the inferior clone yet beats both big bosses and his "superior" clones, Ryden was a rookie fresh out of training who was manipulated into becoming for all intent and purposes snake for that mission and now Venom is continuing that tradition
My favourite MGS, played them all many, many times and the story in V was fantastic and filled in the gaps between this and the NES Metal Gear perfectly.
orkutfinance a lot of people guessed that but I highly doubt you guessed the reasons and intentions behind it. I guessed it from gz when the medic sounded like deeper keifer
orkutfinance I began noticing the similarities when Ishmael said "we're sitting ducks blend in with the bodies." because I kept confusing Ahab with Ishmael.
+ItsDrafty Well the "Medic" was the best soldier MSF had, besides Snake of course. That + all the hypnotherapy. I agree that it's kind of far-fetched that he shares Big Boss's skills, but it's not completely impossible.
+ItsDrafty There is another thing that people miss with this series. They make a big deal out of using the word "legend". It's the legend of Big Boss, the legend of Solid Snake. It's their legend that gives them their name, not their skill. While they are extremely skilled they can be bested, hell, you can recruit people to mother base who are better than Snake. You carry on his legend. Their is also the idea that is set up that you are the medic, and that you have his skill because you've been on all of his missions, you know his story backwards and forwards, and thus, you can now hold the title of Big Boss.
+ItsDrafty hes actually not as skilled as naked snake at all. multiple times in Phantom Pain, he makes mistakes and comes off as a novice in the field. one example is when he gets bit by the snake in Afghanistan and Quiet pretty much has to save his life.
I like this take. Naked Snake realizes the symbolism in the title of “Big Boss” and seizes the opportunity to use Venom as a lightning rod to inherit the curse that comes with the title of “Boss”. IE: everyone we encounter in MGS referred to as “Boss” goes down in history as the worst person who ever lived, despite having the truest of intentions. Even Liquid. Jack saw the writing on the wall and ultimately found a way to break the cycle. Yep, BUT… THAT is what makes him the bad guy. He surrendered to The Patriots. That’s also what makes MGS so compelling when it’s all put together. Ocelot is the hero. Even though he has to APPEAR as the villain. In the end we see his admiration for Big Boss was in part built on the ability Jack had to walk away from the fight. I know people will hate that take, but it holds up. All the way around it does.
***** I just thought the twist was cool and how it tied into the original Metal Gear, MGSV in general has a pretty disappointing story, so it was cool to see at least one unique twist. K.
I do agree that the idea of having a real Big Boss and a 'copy' Big Boss' makes sense, but I had really wished for Venom to be more than just a seemingly random medic.
I thought the scene with the ashes was a great, emotional piece. It was Venom being remorseful over what he had to do and wanting to honor them in a meaningful way.
They can't just leave us with The Phantom Pain! Hideo Kojima has to remake/remaster/whatever the first two Metal Gear games. Yes, I'm aware Konami is in control, but that was his, dammit!!
Javelin the only way that could happen is if Kojima Productions (now an independent studio) can come to an agreement with Konami to develop more MGS games as a third party.
Okay, late to the party, but I've finally beaten it and holy shit! I'm very happy this wasn't spoiled to me at all. I kind of guessed that something was up with Big Boss, because in this entry it didn't feel like Big Boss, and that guy with the bandages was voiced by Keifer Sutherland and at first I thought it was Solidus too, but damn I was still surprised at that twist. But do you know why I love this twist? It's because Kojima pretty much said here: "Hey Chris, guess what? You are Big Boss. You are literally Big Boss, you are just as awesome and you didn't even realise it if you were too immersed in the game." He says that to EVERYONE that plays this game and I love that. :D
I don't hate the ending but I think this game has the weakest plot of ANY metal gear games. Kojima's claims that this would be "the missing link" the game that ties everything together don't pan out, bugger all is explained and he'd need dlc the size of that which rivals the whole game to truly tie everything together. Additionally there were barely any cutscenes, Venom's practically a silent protagonist, Quiet's is a great character but also bugger all is explained (not to mention inconsistencies), and overall this just wasn't a metal gear experience for me. I loved the plot and story of mgs 2 and 3 the most out of all the games, and it saddens me that V doesn't even come halfway close to the experience of those games.
+BakedCookie the game wasn't completely finished. There was third chapter cut from the game called peace which was supposed to sum up the whole game. Konami really fucked us over on that one #FucKonami
+Dmitry Shubkin Something that people said for MGS2 , 3 ,4 and Peace Walker .................... Everytime a MGS is released , the fanbase just shows their flip flopping and inconsistent opinion .
I think this is one of the best games of all time.i loved the ending twist should there have been more absolutely but when I really think about how far the series has come and how great the story is I tend to love the game a bit more
I completely agree with you 100%. I think why most people are hating it is because they're looking at it at a different angle. In the ending, it's revealed you were playing as the medic. On the surface, thats shallow as FUCK. But if you look at it as you, *the player*, was Big Boss, its impactful. As that hit me during the credits, I legit had my mind blown. Now the legendary soldier was two people, allowing him to have a second life. I don't think the real Big Boss wanted to take Venom out in MG1, I think that its still the twist that your commander was the villain. Snake killing Venom in Outer Heaven allowed Big Boss to completely slide off the radar and reconstruct Outer Heaven in Zanzibarland. It allowed him to completely restart and give one last shot at fulfilling the Boss' Will. Even though TPP is missing major parts of the game, I will always defend the twist ending.
If Big Boss is not a villain. Why would he and Ocelot agree to kill all those people in the Hospital in the beginning of Phantom pain for the sake of "both big bosses" to escape? He was willing to sacrifice them and that was the plan all along by Ocelot i think and agreed by Big Boss. That's what i remembered from the tape after the BIG reveal. So i'm still confused about him.
In my opinion it would have been better if they only coincidentally found out Big Boss was alive a day or so maybe before The Medic woke up from his coma, because if it were me I wouldn't give my life for ANYONE, especially when there is no guarantee he's going to make it out. I mean, look at it. Venom almost got killed like three times, and was only saved by Bill Nye the fire guy (my name for him lmao) and Phycho Mantis.
No they didn’t. Stop trying to cling to the idea that Big Boss is a hero. He’s not. The truth tapes are clear on the fact that the people in the hospital had no idea they were going to be attacked but Big Boss and Ocelot gave them no warning as they needed to use them as shields to aid in Big Boss and Venoms escape. They were innocents who Big Boss was happy to sacrifice to help ave himself
its all about perspective. big boss has done some stupid, evil shit and sometimes on purpose and sometimes by accident. but he mostly did it for a higher purpose which was to carry out the Zanzibar plan and retaliate against the patriots and carry out the boss' will etc etc. in my opinion he still kinda is a hero but he took the needed sacrifices to carry out the plan just like so many other war hero's in this world. just like the boss when she convinced the public that she betrayed her country and did some fucked up things, but in the end it was for her country, even if it did result in her death as well as others.
i dont think he happily chose to sacrifice innocents with a big smile on his face XD. big boss is the kinda guy to execute his plan or mission, if there needs to be sacrifices then so be it. in his perspective, he was doing it for a higher purpose which was to carry out the bosses will and go against the patriots.
This is how you explain the big boss storyline with only a few simple words MGS 3 innocence MGS Peace Walker misunderstanding MGS V anger MG 1 & 2 lost MGS4 regret
FYI guys Kojima productions is back. They are with Sony though! there's a chance there will be more metal gear to come! Now everybody say it with me: Fuck konami!!!
The Happy Cats Tail if only...Konami owns all the rights to mgs, they can sue kojima if he tried. If only Konami would be good people and hand the game over to kojima
+Gio The Megaman Just accidently came across this post, it is so worth it to get into this series. One of the most interesting and rewarding stories in ANY medium. The games are readily available on multiple consoles, get the legacy collection for either ps3 or 360, and then you just need mgs4 and 5, you are in for a ride man!
I liked the ending because we the player have ultimately become Big Boss. I thought Big Boss's final message to Venom Snake was in fact a message to the fans from Hideo. "From here on out: You're Big Boss."
Look, you can hate on the twist all you want but keep this in mind: You are playing as the guy who SINGLE HANDEDLY took down Sahelantropus, fought countless armored vehicles/helicopters, whit just one real arm, one eye and a metal shard stuck in his head. Big Boss couldn´t have chosen a better candidate to become his phantom. The legend of BB lives on because of Venom
Good points that I've not considered. I'm still pissed that the story was incomplete; MGS5 didn't feel like a metal gear game to me. Still a solid game though.
Great video! I personally loved the story and the ending. Your analogy with MGS2 and Metal Gear being more about the story told over the course of the series is what I love the most about it. It's not your clear as day, typical, hold your hand type of story telling and really gets you to think and process events.
U made it all make sense Jeremy. Metal Gear has always been that thinking mans story and you've connected the dots on this one-yeah I agree with you on Big Boss's character throughout this whole ordeal
I was nine years late, but I finally finish the game, and for me as a MGS fan that played the main entries in the saga it make sense but it missed that last game with solid snake fighting venom snake that would be a great closing, but is you didn't played the other games you would be missing a lot of pieces on the MGS puzzle, awesome review Jeremy it shows that you know and care.
😂😂 that’s the beauty of it man.....my mind was pretty much fucked after MGS2. I’ll never forget that feeling when Otacon said at the end the Patriots died a 100 years ago
Me too at least have a stable 60 fps for backwards compatible version. If you make Snake go up the stairs in which you go and meet Rat patrol and go up the stairs with the camera aiming at the wall the 60fps is just so beautiful.
I JUST started playing this franchise this year. Going to start the original Metal Gear Solid today. Been loving every moment of these games. The ending of Phantom Pain blew my god damn mind.
I love MGS but i dont really understand the whole story.I'm interested tho.I only played Peace Walker on my PSP. lol. that was a good game.Fun fact,I'm downloading Phantom Pain right now on my laptop since I can run it.Can't wait to play the game! :D
Play all of them! There literally isn't a single bad (and canon) Metal Gear Solid game out there. Just might be a little tough getting used to them after playing Phantom Pain -- some of the game mechanics haven't aged well at all. I'd recommend playing in chronological order to help with that a bit: 1964 - MGS3 Snake Eater (PS2, PS3, 360, 3DS) 1970 - MGS Portable Ops [optional] (PSP) 1974 - MGS Peace Walker (PSP, PS3, 360) 1975 - MGSV Ground Zeroes (PS3/4, 360,Xbone, PC) 1984 - MGSV Phantom Pain (PS3/4, 360,Xbone, PC) 1995 - Metal Gear [optional] (Available in HD Collection on PS3/360) 1999 - Metal Gear 2 Solid Snake [optional] (Available in HD Collection on PS3/360) 2005 - Metal Gear Solid (PS1, PS3, PC, Gamecube remake) 2007 - MGS2 Sons of Liberty (PS2, PS3, 360, PC) 2014 - MGS4 Guns of the Patriots (PS3)
Xeni Kobalt damn that's a lot of information you got there XD thanks.yeah i'll try my best to play most of MGS game.but i can only play games that is available on PC and PSP since i dont have any console :)
Completely agree with you Jeremy. The twist is believable and the theories are very sound. I love that there is so much room for interpretation and it's not all neatly tied up in a bow! I really enjoyed it as well.
The problem most people have with the ending was that it leaves so many issues unaddressed. The metal gear is still around, the parasite is still a threat, and not to mention an entire third act was cut from the game. The story wasn't finished, and that's konamis fault.
Here's my ideal future for the Metal Gear franchise: A good gaming company or more than one buy the Metal Gear license for the boat load of money it's worth (I'm thinking like Naughty Dog, Bethesda, etc.) And make at least two more metal gear games: MGS VI, the REAL final chapter, and a spin off. The spinoff will not be open world and will be Hideo Kojima's last game. The spin off will be open world and will not be directed by Hideo Kojima. The MGS VI will take place in between 1984-1999, it is not open world, and it has three different plots that come together: Big Boss building Zanzibar, Venom going against Big Boss, and the rise of Solid Snake and Gray Fox. Big Boss will create the nation Zanzibar by freeing it from corrupt governments (maybe by cipher?) And he will become a hero that rescues people like Naomi Hunter, Frank Jaeger, and Sniper Wolf and brings them into Zanzibar. It's kind of like what you do in Peace Walker by incorporating Cecile, Huey, and Paz. On his side will also be Ocelot. Venom will combat cipher and for whatever reasons, will come to hate Big Boss and will go against him alongside Kaz, in a civil war for the title of Big Boss. Meanwhile, Big Boss will train Solid Snake as part of Foxhound, where he gets good enough to defeat both Big Bosses and will be the only one with the happy ending. The spin-off will be an open world, but will have nothing to do with the Snakes or the Patriots because I think with the filler, that universe can be put to rest. Create some kind of new enemy similar to the patriots, and in my head, a protagonist who like Solid Snake, but with a sense of humor. The point of the spinoff is to keep the gameplay and value of the series alive. Seriously though, something needs to be done about the gap Phantom Pain left. They can't just say this is the missing piece, but leave out 11 years that basically defines the character of nearly all its protagonists by Metal Gear.
These games have a bigger storyline than War and Peace. Could fill an encyclopedia! Surprised there hasn't been a movie yet. Could make a ton of sequels.
I like the ending but what the hell happened after chapter 1? It's like they just made a mad dash to the ending after Skull Face's arc, padding the way with reused missions and you don't even get to go after Liquid & Psycho Mantis(what did they do with the last english strain parasites and Sahelanthropus?).
+FreshIngredient There was a cut ending called kingdom of the flies which would wrap up the whole eli and mantis story arch. Also they cut out chapter 3 peace. You can find it on youtube
+FreshIngredient I have a feeling Konami suddenly in the middle of development gave them a hard deadline and told them they were being let go after such and such date. So they needed to have a "finished" game by then. Honestly I feel like the game could've used another year in the oven just to iron out the rest of the story, because the gameplay is all there. With Konami's sudden and aggressive switch to dumping most of their console game market the timing for this game just seems to be unfortunate. The Kingdom of Flies content would've added the last part of the game that is clearly missing.
+Ethos998 Probably unfinished because Mgsv was a monetary black hole. I think Konami probably didn't think they would break even or just didn't want anymore money dumped in the project. Oh well, maybe we'll see TPP epilogue later. pull the lever! coming to a pachinko machine near you!
+Dominik Santiago Wait can't find it are you playing with us! I heard it was never made and was just some cut cutscenes put on a bonus disc. Is it the real ending or just random cut scenes?
+Therealmadkong Your right it's only on the collectors edition disc it's messed up that they cut the final act of the game out it seems like mission 46 where the truth is feels like the halfway point of the game
Good vid Jeremy, there's also a couple of extra things which I think makes the series better as a whole. I always wondered why Big Boss dropped the fact he's Solid Snake's father in MG2, and not MG1 when I think it would've been more appropriate there. But yeah, a body double in Outer Heaven puts that rest. Also from a gameplay point of view, the fact you're not playing as BB, but rather your own avatar that you create amplifies how YOU as a player create you're own army, which in my opinion works better as a game than if you build a base from BB's perspective. Playing from BB's perspective may or may not have made the story stronger, but the avatar undoubtedly works far better from the gameplay's perspective.
I love the ending I feel like it makes sense. What I think is that (don't read this if you haven't finished the game) when Venom Snake smashes the mirror isn't only a awesome fourth wall breaking move that shows that everyone is their own Big Boss/Snake, I think it's also showing Venom Snake realizing he'll have to obey all of the BIG Big Boss's orders and he doesn't like that because maybe he wants to be completely in charge. So I believe Venom Snake punching the mirror is him saying "FFFFFFF******CK NO!". PS: it could be a different reason, becuase when Snake looks at the mirror again, he sees his "inner demon" and tries to stop it from coming out. PPS: ooooorrrrrr, the other snake we see after the window gets smashed could be a vision of the BIG Big Boss. Demon Snake Vs Solid Snake anyone? It's like BIG Big Boss knows Venom Snake won't obey and the broken mirror is the first sign of those two in a battle against each other. There, I've said my three theories.
Well, in MGS 4, he does kill the Patriots and Zero, so maybe this was part of his plan to find Zero and the Patriots in peace, while the world is chasing Venom Snake? To be fair, I liked this ending, but the problem for me was that the last few missions were only harder challenge versions of previous missions. That was my main problem, personally, the twist was interesting and as an idea, it was good for me.
I mean... I dont hate the twist ending... But it didnt had any emotion... I fucking cryied at the end of Metal Gear Solid 4 and 3, I was mindfucked at the end of Metal Gear Solid 2, I was happy at the end of Metal Gear Solid... But in this one... The LAST one... I felt nothing...
this was my first metal gear. and I can't tell you how confused I am.
At least you have to had played Peace Walker and Snake Eater to get all the context to enjoy the story.
Wow. Play MGS 1 thru 4. It's a masterpiece! MGS 5 is a joke by comparison. Plus 4 is the END of MGS.
yup ,MGS 4 is the end of the series
MGS 5 is good tho
+DevineAaron so we not gonna mention metal gear rising huh...
+Senjo Natsuzora I played that game and once I saw him in an sumbreo I was done.
Sony should buy the rights to Metal Gear Solid so Kojima could make another MGS that'll explain everything that went unanswered in MGS V.
I think Kojima should remake Metal Gear 1&2 and change the title of those two. I think it would be amazing and also add the information that was missing in V.
HOPELESS ENTERTAINMENT Konami still owns the shits, they remade the Snake Eater for a fucking slot machine #FKonami
Troublesome 22 a whole game could be made about the real big boss and a dlc could be released for tpp to tie up loose ends and unfinished things, I would gladly buy both. And then he could go on to make the boss stealth game set in ww2 like he wanted to, and a full remaster of the entire series (besides 5) with the new fox engine. My life would be complete
Kojima doesn't want to do anymore Metal Gear games. He's been wanting to stop ever since the first game was done.
@Tiredofdumbfuks yeah that one it was the most blatantly obvious. I still like MGS4 - it being my favorite in the series. But still I can't help but feel sorry for Kojima since the Metal Gear series was kinda intended to be a one and done series.
The fact still remains that jeep ride with Skull face was awkward as fuck.
I think Konami just rushed the damn thing to show Kojima the door...
It was also too long
I know right
you can skip it though so that's good but I didn't cos I wanted to listen
remember the ladder ?
Venom Snake loses his home and most of his comrades on MSF. He fails to save Paz, which causes Chico to die and puts both him and Big Boss in a coma. Driven by revenge, he builds a new Mother Base for he can basically chase down a man he has no leads on. When he finally does get to Skull Face, he's already anticlimactically defeated by Sahelanthropus and Venom doesn't even kill him himself. He still has no real lead on Cipher. Venom is forced to kill his own men because of a parasite outbreak caused by a former "ally" at the base. The kids he saves turn on him and leave with Sahelanthropus after he rescued them twice. One of his buddies, and possible romantic interest, sacrifices herself to save him and is implied to die alone; even if she doesn't, she can't come back with those parasites in her. All just to find out you aren't even real and just a puppet in the grand scheme of things; making all you did hollow and meaningless. Yeah, I'd become a nuke wielding super-villain too.
Kojima wanted you, the player, to be angry and feel that "phantom pain" when it all seemed meaningless because you weren't the real Big Boss. You are Venom Snake, and I think it did a good job making you feel like that in the end.
Anyways, awesome video Jeremy!
This is probably the best explanation of the "Phantom Pain" name. I think more people should have this kind of mindset.
You're giving Kojima too much credit I think, most of what you said was just a result of bad and rushed writing.
And thats the problem. Im fake snake.
So did venom snake turn evil because of big boss forcing u to be brainwashed and then he sends solid snake to take u out?
@@thelel6591 Venom Snake turned evil because he developed a Metal Gear. That's as far as it went. Big Boss sends Solid as a mission to keep up appearances. He expects Venom to beat Solid since Venom is his best man and was left in charge of Outer Heaven by Big Boss.
I don't see Venom Snake as just a medic. He is you, the player as a full self insert in the game, just with all of Big Boss's memories and skills, that's why he was artificially induced into a coma.
I think Kojima tried to do the whole phantom thing as a last big thank you to fans. Maybe it could have been executed better with more time and resources but of course that wasn't possible with Konami.
This, not enough people have realised this
Thomazo Agreed
***** He's the Big Boss from MG1
Gotta admit I felt pretty good seeing MY name on that letter from big boss
Nah
I personally see Venom Snake being the lesser evil. As Venom we are awarded for being a hero. We even get a (hidden) cut scene if all the nukes in the world are deactivated. We save children and try to keep them out of war. While Naked Snake has done a lot of morally questionable actions such as, had obtain a nuke/metal gear, bringing in children (Chico and Paz*) to work, and having some medic be involuntary brainwashed to believing that he's someone else while he was in a coma.
+DatsRandom My thoughts precisely.
Yep. To me, the whole point in this game is that Big Boss was already a villain, and he fooled not only The Medic, but the players. He did to us exactly what the CIA did to him. Played us like a damn fiddle...
Ehhhh. I don't know about that. The first thing Venom does after saving those kids is talk about making them soldiers of his own. But doesn't because Kaz wants to give them a place to have some form of a childhood and the choice of joining when they're old enough. Chico and Paz kinda fell into Boss' lap. Both wanting to fight along side him. Then the fact that you can make nukes of your own which turn you into Demon Snake. As well as Boss and Kaz declaring a Peace Day on Mother Base. Going on his own crusade shortly after before trying to kill Solid.
+DatsRandom Ah, but that hidden cutscene still shows two sides to the story.
Right after Kaz finishes his speech on nuclear disarmament, there is a long pause and he speaks in private to Venom about how Diamong Dogs must now control the world's supply of nukes. Through force. He even says 'gotta love the irony' -- because they way they do it is by taking everyone else's nuclear weapons. Then it shows a helicopter flying around mother base and shows you the war machines (tanks, etc) you've collected. But it's not tac-porn, it's telling you that it has to be done through force.
But look closer to why you are a hero. A hero for who? Not for the World thtas for sure
You get heroism by doing terrorist missions in cover, by taking soliders to YOUR privet army. I mean, you are hero, but only for "those eho live in the battlefield". But the true is you are a criminal.
hmmmm I think you got it wrong there Jeremy, Venom Snake didn't go evil and forced Big Boss to send Solid Snake. Venom was meant to finish of Solid Snake but Snake proved to strong
+The ZombieMan It's possible. Guess we'll never know for sure.
+Jeremy Jahns the evidence points to this: the real BB sends Venom the "n313" tape with Solid's mission details, so Solid can be thwarted by Venom, which means the bosses (phantom and real BB) are in cahoots.
***** He doesn't hate them, he just hates the way they came about to exist and the man who made them
***** How is that more convoluted? That's literally what happened, Big Boss' plan was to send Snake into Outer Heaven as a decoy, to leak false information but Solid Snake ended up completing his mission. Venom Snake didn't split from Big Boss, hell that's why at the end Venom has that cassete tape so we can see that he knew about Big Boss's plan to send Solid Snake
***** most likely cause he didn't know Outer Heaven was ran by Big Boss and thought it was an enemy group. Hence why he would join up with Big Boss at Zanzibar , also like I said if Venom wasn't in on it than why did he get that tape from Big Boss about Operation Intrude 313. It was planned from the start
It's basically Sons of Liberty in reverse; Raiden throws away his (or the player's) dog tags and accepts his fate as is (like the end of Inception) but Venom Snake breaks the mirror of his old reflection (again or the player's) and continues the lie that he's Big Boss.
You could say that.
I'm so glad someone else appreciates the ending to MGSV, like holy Hell, trying to find someone on TH-cam who has something good to say about it is like finding a needle in a hay stack, at least for me. I'm gonna make a video going off about this hopefully in the near future, who knows, my focus is all over the place, but think about this; what if Kojima made MGSV as a means for the player to feel what it's like to be Big Boss? What if it was meant to evoke emotions of sorrow and anguish as you're yet another pawn in the giant chess game and you watch Venom writhe in guilt from committing these atrocities... You're supposed to feel what he feels because you are him. As Big Boss said, I am you and you are me. I get it that some people might find that kinda corny, but considering MGSV feels like a Big Boss simulator, it all makes sense. It's almost as though by the end of it, you were supposed to feel the effects of the PTSD that Venom is now stricken with, hence why unlike Big Boss, Venom is often very quiet, leaving for some pretty awkward silences between him and other characters. I don't know, something to chew on.
That is exactly what I thought. This *is* the story of Big Boss' downfall, told through the eyes of others.
I also forgot to mention another speculation related to this, Kojima may have also intended for the player to feel brainwashed by the end of everything, feeling things like, "Why am I even doing all of this? I get that we're getting revenge, but that was mostly done with in the first chapter... I don't necessarily feel like Big Boss anymore, I almost feel like I'm just being dragged along by a faceless entity." ... That's probably because you were, all the way until the very end. Obviously, we all know who Big Boss is and all, but this makes the events of the game make a lot more sense I'd say. Part of me wishes Kojima could make a game out of the events after TPP considering the cutscene at the end of the game w/ Kaz, Venom, and Ocelot discussing getting revenge on the real OG Big Boss for fooling them and making them think they were actually fighting for the real Big Boss, but on the other hand, he didn't even want the series to drag on past Snake Eater/Subsistence, forcing him to make a game after now 17 games, including (what I remember to be)all spin-offs and hand-held exclusives (minus cameos), would not result in a great game I feel, nor should it. Kojima's pretty much Metal Gear'd out, he wants to make something new, as he should be free to, especially now that he's out of Konami's clutches.
... what atrocities though? like what did venom snake/big boss do here that's so bad?
+Teebz 1000 well, killing hundreds of soldiers along the way, choosing to bomb his own men, the vocal chord parasites... I'll give a more detailed response later when I can think more.
RetroHellspawn well that's war and stuff. Solid Snake killed loads of soldiers. Big Boss here was killing bad soldiers holding prisoners nd shit
As someone who's not played a lot of MSG games:
W... w... wha, what?
+SkebbenTheNobody Lol. Yeah, that must have been a cornucopia of useless terminology & explanation right there.
+Jeremy Jahns where's your 100000 plack
+SkebbenTheNobody Same, I haven't played any of the games so I'm still trying to get over the fact that Big Boss and Solid Snake aren't the same person.
+Jeremy Jahns You should've had a "Big Boss" counter, for everytime you said "Big Boss"
+SkebbenTheNobody indeed.
Anyone else notice that the entire Metal Gear (not including rising) series was set over the span of 50 years? Starts in 1964 and ends in 2014.
At at least one game of all the Metal Gear games was set during a year in each decade? I thought that was cool.
+AJA Ryan1994 holy shit your right
1964: MGS3, 1974: MGS: PW, 1984: MGSV: TPP, 1994: Metal Gear, 2004: Metal Gear Solid, 2014: MGS4.... its amazing.
@@Stynkrat It's beautiful
I've looked at it for five hours now
I always interpreted the mirror scene as Venom finally destroying his former self and accepting his role as Big Boss.
The tape is from the real Big Boss showing that he wants Venom to defeat Solid.
so solid defeats both bosses not just one? lol he is a legend
Ricardo Santos doubt snake was in his prime they're he was probably way more skilled in mgs 2
Big boss surpassed the boss. she didint loose on purpose.. she knew naked snake ( back then) would be able to kill her cause he at that pooint surpassed her.
@Ricardo Santos true. Solid snake didn't defeat big boss with guns or cqc though. He was unarmed and big boss was after him with a flame thrower. He got a flammable spray with a match and set big boss on fire. Yes he beat him but not in the way everyone thinks
Lol what you even expect from the main protagonist of the series? People play as solid mostly throughout the series, there's no way he will lose till the end lol, not that surprising if u ask me.
Let's just say we aided solid into killing the 2 bosses let that sink in
Am I the only 1 who feels bad for Eli (Liquid) after this Big Boss charade? Not only was he fueled by the belief that he was the genetically inferior clone which wasn't the case at all, but now he also had to live with the fact that he got his ass kicked and lectured by Big Medic AKA Venom Snake whom he assumed to be the real Big Boss?
So true, no redemption for the guy at all ughh damn you Konami...
+RandomBlackGamer You mean Kojima. There's only so many times someone can spend your money and scrub their work before you tell them to release what they have. Even if the game sells 50% more copies than it has, Konami is looking at losing upwards of twenty million on the game.
His budget reached 88 million and he had more than half a decade to come up with the finale. Even the other guys developing Fox Engine were tired of having to start over every year.
+Joong Kim (Xephon0930) None of that has anything to do with the ending of MGS5. Kojima squandered millions of dollars and the time of his entire team for so many years that when they finally called him out, this is what he had to show for it. An incomplete story. It takes a ridiculous amount of mental gymnastics and supposition just to make sense of it. If he spent more time on the story rather than trying to stick it to Konami with his name appearing every five seconds of the game there wouldn't be much to complain about. He knew it was the last game and has let down a great deal of fans by making himself into even more of a 'wacky zany joke!' character.
+Joong Kim (Xephon0930)
So because Konami cancelled a project lead by Kojima, with knowledge that he would not be under their employ, that excuses Kojima's ethics and failings in a completely different project?
Really sad that the Kojima worship is so deep rooted. Dude deserves no loyalty and certainly doesn't enrich your life in any way so I'm really curious as to what benefits this white knighting grants you.
I like your videos, feels weird seeing you a forum that's by chance lol
Kojima played me like a damn fiddle.
Anyway is better than Big boobs
To all the haters.... i know what this ending means and signifies. It's not simply saying "You play as the medic" because that's a shallow way to look at it. At the beginning, we create our perfect avatar, a representation of ourself, we even put our own name and DOB in it. WE, the players, are the medic - WE are venom snake. Now, what is big boss? It isnt a person - it's a title. A legacy. Ok, so we don't play as Jack, the original big boss - but we DO play as big boss - Jack hands us the PLAYER that title - this is Kojima's final MGS game, and, as a farewell present, he is giving US the title of Big Boss. That's why Jack says thank you. It's subtle, but it's from Kojima. Jack says that the medic was his his most trusted lieutenant - why was he? What's so special about him? It's because we've known Jack since his very first mission. That's why Venom Snake has Jacks memories - it's because we were there WITH Jack. It's not a fuck you to fans - it's a thank you. It also fits with the canon too - it explains how Big Boss survived MG1s Outer Heaven ending - he didn't. Solid Snake killed Big Bosses phantom - he killed Venom. Sadly, this will be lost on most fans. Jeremy NAILED it here, and I'm just adding the deeper meaning of the layer here.
Did you comment or copy/paste this from another video. I read this on a video showing the 'real' mgs5 ending and was looking for it to post on here xD
+UndercoverMartyn I have two accounts, this, and broken minded xD
+Confused Demon Productions
You're pretty good.
+UndercoverMartyn yeah i started this message and nd its effort writing it again h
+Broken Minded As cute as that is, its still a story that tells us nothing about how Big Boss's downfall in becoming the villain, and that's what a lot of people expected and wanted to see. Instead, we got an overall underwhelming story that ended poorly.
My problem wasn't the ending, rather how rushed it was.
exactly!
Voxeschlong I kinda felt like there wasn't a proper ending, don't get me wrong I love this game and the ending, but it just felt like they just like dropped it there and just felt out of place.
Rohit Rajput well to be fair TPP is to tie up loose ends between ground zeroes and metal gear, yeah it doesn't excuse the cut content but the ending was fine.
Voxeschlong well my problem was how it just popped up out if the blue with no big event to trigger it
Julio Kazuki konami’s fault there
Personally I enjoyed how Venom Snake is like a "new" Snake. Plus even part 2 referenced how enough training and memories can make you a great warrior
Jeremy, I HIGHLY suggest you check out Super Bunnyhop's Metal Gear Solid V: Dissociative Disorder video. The really interesting stuff is him talking about the whole thing with Phantom Boss and his relation with the real one and how the whole thing fitted with the MSX games.
I actually loved the twist for the same reasons as you. What I'm pissed about is the cut mission that finishes Eli/Liquid's story. And it would have been cool if the end of the game showed a young Solid Snake invading Outer Heaven.
Oh! And it would have been cool to see Frank Yeager aka Gray Fox and Naomi's stories. If you remember, they were in Africa when Big Boss found them. After Fox killed her parents and adopted her, of course.
+Tony Arevalo INC Episodic DLC =/
That's one reason why I'd be pissed about it. Cutting stuff that could have been in the game to make it a much better content and story driven title, for the sake of money.
+Tony Arevalo yea but that's a story for the real big boss. It wouldn't make sense if it was venom that did those stuff
SpazticzGamer I know. It was just something that I was looking forward to when I heard about the setting. That's all.
If they release a DLC of Solid Snake in Outer Heaven with FoxEngine...
I'm already throwing money on the screen.
I just finished MGSV; I've had the game for 10 months, and only finished it now. woot.:l so I decided to go straight to your spoiler talk straight away after that, and I gotta say; I agree completely. the ending here, yeah, I actually liked it. :)
I still haven't finished
GentlemanGamer94 I liked MGSV TPP beat it a long time ago but I think that you should watch YongYea's video on how MGSV should've ended expanding on the ending with a Venom Snake vs Solid Snake.
same the ending was so awesome
I loved the plot twist
Wait... It took you 10 months to finish it?
I finished it in a month
But then again, different playstyles, different people
Jeremy, while I do think you make great points and I wouldn't of had a problem with the ending, it's the fact that there was very important content that was cut that dives deeper into the descent of Venom/Phantom Snake. It's because of this cut content that a lot of answered things and holes were caused like the kids vanishing and Liquid and the Giant metal gear and volgin and etc.
+RaidenTheBloodEdge I didn't really see any potholes, but I see where other fans are coming from. My first reaction to the last chapter with Liquid was that he would eventually transform Meta gear Sahalanthropas into Metal gear Rex.
+Robert Wild But REX was an American 'black project', it was not remolded by Liquid at all, who only seized it in 2005 (and couldn't even activate it).
Seonaidh Ceannéidigh Thanks for clearing that up, it's been a while since I played the original metal gear solid. I was just saying what I assumed at first glance. But now that you mention that fact, it does make it dissapointing that Konami cut that section from the game.
Robert Wild It's mind boggling, isn't it? Why not cut Eli's escape and plug that hole? I have no idea.
+RaidenTheBloodEdge MGSV: THE PHANTOM CONTENT
For me Big Boss was never a villain, from the perspective of Solid Snake if he is, but not really, although Big Boss and Zero misinterpreted The Boss's Message, the one who truly understood the message was Venom Snake, it is demonstrated with the end of Nuclear Disarmament, and Venom's ideas are quite clear, also I think he values the lives of his men much more than the real Big Boss
valid point, Big Boss in the beginning of the escape during the hospital, was using his soldiers as protection from getting shot helping Venom escape. Venom when he was mistaken as Big Boss truly do care for his soldiers (and even enemies)
Lol you're totally right. This was my first metal gear and only for a second I was like WTF IM NOT EVEN BIG BOSS? And then I was like... hey that's pretty cool.
This was posted a year ago and ive NEVER seen anyone bring up that second point
Cj Baker what second point? If the player is physically venom then while playing MG1 the player is killing himself. It's an unnecessary twist if intended to be taken literally. Time paradox. Are you referring to that?
I actually had the opposite reaction. I initially LIKED the twist and then I paced around and started wondering what this meant for the series and then I became pissed because I didn't understand what it all meant. Watching your video gave me a lot of relief and some much needed closer. I feel good about the ending now. Thanks, man.
I'm kinda in the middle. On one hand, I'm like "holy shit I would have never thought of this! Props to you kojima." On the hand, I'm like "well why? Why not just have me play as big boss?"
+fullmetalvenom because it goes against kojimas themes, think about it, you are playing a different main character or version of snake in every game, we never get the character we want
I disageee. I just think kojima loves to be a dick to his fans and since this is his last chance of being a dick he did this.
+fullmetalvenom That's just like my reaction. Can I just fucking play the game with the real Big Boss? please?
+Ates Goksu There was supposed to be a third chapter that tied everything up but Konami cut it
+rbraunbeck96 not to mention how butchered chapter 2 was........... i believe there were like 4 or 5 main missions in chapter 2 a then a bunch of replays of older missions.... that whole part felt incomplete but I was so sad to hear that there was to be a 3rd chapter.........i believe tthe chapter was gonna be called "PEACE"
I LOVED the ending. It made so much sense, really tied up all loose ends i could think of. Besides that, I really love the fact that medic is Venom Snake and Big Boss is a different person, this is why metal gear is great, it drops twists on you that you never see coming
The problem why I and many other MGS fans are so disappointed is, that we were promised to get the story about how Big Boss turns from a hero into a villain. We wanted to see how he met Grey Fox, trained Solid Snake, met Sniper Wolf etc. We got nothing of that, instead we got a story about a fake Big Boss with no major plot behind it. Seriously, not much happens in this game. I agree, the idea that there is a second boss isn't bad, but was it necessary to have it told through Kojimas last Metal Gear game instead of showing us the story about the real Big Boss? The character we really care about? Showing us how he build the "real Outer Heaven" aka Zanzibar Land? I think it would have been more interesting and would have had more impact. The story we got instead had no real epic moments, no real emotional impact at all. (Quiet was the only character that gave us a little bit of that)
So the question is, was it worth it to close that little plot hole of super old MSX games, to instead not get the story about the real Big Boss? The story that actually everyone was hoping to finally hear?
I mean, there are rumors a third chapter was actually planned, hell, even the last mission of the second chapter was cut out of this game, so I guess the story is incomplete anyway.
Too bad we might never get to see it....
+RedVIII i think Kojima wanted to end the story at Third chapter with every explanation in it but Konami want to create more games off metal gear because of the huge success it has that why Kojima left Konami because his work in chapter 3 was completely cut out But that just a theory my theory :D
+RedVIII I actually think that the deception of Ahab, and his conversion from his former self into Venom snake is the turning point in for Big Boss from a hero to a villain/anti-hero. All his life he fought against the manipulation of soldiers by their commanders - BB was supposed to be the soldiers saint- instead he became the very thing he thing he intended to fight. Remember portable ops? That guy who commands the FOX unit with an iron fist and maniacal charisma, who endangers the lives of his soldiers by blatantly putting them in harms way with the promise of soldiers heaven. That's where the real vision of outer heaven germinated. And like that manipulative man, BB manipulated one of his own - who did nothing but suffer for BB's benefit and survival - and then feeds him this justification that they are the both the big boss. I mean that deception is so paramount BB's villainy - doesn't feel so strange to just pull soldiers out of the warzone like that and deny them any hope of a normal civilian life?
red99Baron
Sounds like you assume. Like I said, nothing is shown. I wanted to see a big emotional Big Boss story, and I have the feeling I was robbed of it.
Dark ^-^
It would have been awesome if we got a third chapter where we maybe control the real Big Boss, so maybe yeah, maybe that was planned by Kojima, because the story definitely feels incomplete. However, I doubt Konami stopped it because they wanted to do those stories without Kojima in new games (they can do new Metal Gear stories regardless), but I think Kojima just used to much money trying to complete the game. Just see how big it already turned out. Konami pulled the plug on the third chapter because they wanted the game to be finished.
+RedVIII but was the big boss a villain? mgs was never about good versus evil.
but it was about manipulation, and how information is the greatest weapon...
I feel like Big Boss had good intentions, but fucked up his execution.
me trying at life
That's pretty much every Metal Gear major villain in a nutshell. Except Volgin. He's just a sadistic fuck.
The problem all of the major Metal Gear villains face is while their methods and idealogies make some sense, they always go about it wrong.
Hot Coldman wanted to essentially protect the world from nuclear war, but he came to insane conclusion that he MUST launch a nuke to prove it.
Big Boss and Liquid simply wanted to give all soldiers a place where they are always needed. However Big Boss was manipulating child soldiers, holding the world hostage with nukes and denying the world a solution to the oil crises, he manipulated his own men and double crossing them.
Liquid he wanted to make money, launch a nuke, and his motives were mostly petty revenge and inadequaticy issues.
Solidus wanted to give himself and the people true freedom again, but at the needless cost of wiping out New York of power and destroying Wall Street. He also used child soldiers just like Big Boss.
Ocelot he betrayed, manipulated and killed a lot of people just to destroy the Patriots and cause endless conflicts.
Venom Snake in the end wasn't much of a villain. His only flaw is that when he discovers his true identity he just follows Big Boss's orders. Just copying Big Boss's lead. Be a warmonger. He at least had morals and didn't use child soldiers or nukes until the Outer Heaven uprising - probably under orders from Big Boss.
Very late to the topic but my interpretation is
That venom snake basically becomes another soldier a thing not person a tool big boss uses to accomplish his goals so it’s a middle ground for what we thought would happen and what your interpretation was where big boss doesn’t become evil but does questionable things (which is he uses his soldiers like weapons just like the us army did to him)
Judge me as you might I feel like every few months to a year I come back to this video. It’s just a staple in my head of how cool the story can unfold in someone’s head
Same
So people are getting pissed because of this plottwist while this entire franchise is known for more plottwists then M. Night Shyamalan has came up with. I mean every game has at least one if not multiple 'WTF?!'-moments. Even Ground Zeroes ended on kind of a shocker.
That's the reason I'm pissed a bit, there's always some annoying plot twist.
+DADchs13 AI pod, ocelot and kaz calling you snake, seeing your reflection
+Strider119119 Lol why would you be pissed, it's iconic for Metal Gear to have some kinda fuked up moment lol, it's expected.
+Flashback007 Because the game is drawing more attention from newer fans who think they know Metal Gear, but don't.
+Flashback007 liquid disguised as miller is ok, liquid ocelot was so bad that kojima changed to nanomachines/hypnotherapy excuse. Big boss being the father and the villian is ok, it's starwars like, but big boss not even being bigboss, just some random guy sucks... you know kojima did drop the ball before.
The point behind the twist was that Venom Snake personifies the player and, just as Big Boss said in the cassette tape, he (meaning us) carries a piece of Big Boss with him everywhere we go and we have helped build the legends of Big Boss and Metal Gear since the beginning of the series and that we are the core of the story. Big Boss also says in the cassette tape that the legend of Big Boss is more like himself and Venom Snake (meaning us) together, rather than Naked Snake alone. It was a fantastic way to pay homage to the fans as the last MGS game from Kojima. This is also why a majority of the game is gameplay rather than story because the gameplay is Venom Snake's (our) story and that is how the player leaves his mark on the game world, while the narrative is generally Snake's story.
All the "fans" who bitch at the twist ending clearly didn't stick to the end credits, the timeline reveal and listened to the extra audio tapes for completing the game because it does tell you what the real Big Boss is doing! But I understand the initial rage but damn that ending got me going so good!
I had the same exact reaction at first and I came to the same conclusion as you. I also liked the ending after mulling that all over in my head for a while. The only thing I wish was different about the game is Kojima was given just a little more time to close up the loose ends in the missing mission, and not just release it as an unfinished bonus content video.
I like how after Venom Snake punches the mirror you can see the logo on the door changes from "Diamond Dogs" to " Outer Heaven". Nice touch.
oh my god, metal gear solid as a series is breathtaking. a true masterpiece. so rich and deep. I would have never seen any of this shit coming before playing TPP. kojima, I'll forgive you for cutting eli's ending from TPP (that's not really a spoiler) based on the fact that you made the connection between big boss's story and solid snake's story *extremely* good - you made the LET project make perfect sense as well and we now have a fluid timeline without any "well, that part's yet to be told" - bravo. and by the way JJ - awesome theory - it makes perfect sense as well. it doesn't sound far fetched - it actually would make more sense than a "normal" explanation
i always wonder how the f*ck does kojima's brain works to create such an amazing and super complex story like mgs, like the amount of details in the plot was just outstanding (probaly because of nanomachies, son)
Senjo Natsuzora hehe yeah, nanomachines as the explanation for most things in MGS2/4 seemed a little bit like "mediclorians" in the star wars prequels, but to be fair, it does make some sense in that universe - but then you get spooky ghosts~ like the sorrow - how is the sorrow able to be magic without nano machines yet people like vamp, ocelot (via liquid's arm) and the other "magical" people in the solid snake saga have to explain themselves with technology? seems a bit two sided. ah well, it's not too much of a problem :)
Alex R there's a little bit of magic in mgs world, we just need to accept it. It's like a classic 90's-2010 slice-of-life anime/manga, the world usually really realistist but always have a bit of supernatural elements throughout to spice things up. The most jar-dropping magic moment in mgs for me is Fortune, her power was explained nicely by technology reason, and then "nope, she was the real Lady Luck, magic son"
Iam looking forward to the E3 2016 Sony Press-Conference reveal for Kojimas Kickstarter Project "Metal Gear Solid 6 - The Fall of a Phantom"
14.06.2016 guys ;-)
+TheDarkPremonition Sadly that will be only a dream as Konami owns the Metal Gear IP. Even if Kojima wanted a 6th, he couldn't
+Daniel Li Just call it solid metal gear and say it's a whole different thing, problem solved, Kappa
+ojakoo Hello fellow Twitch user PogChamp
Since konami owns the rights of MGS this wont happen. So maybe he will release "solid gear metal - the fall of the plastic surgery commander"
+TheDarkPremonition I could only imagine how fast that would hit it's goal..
Kinda late to the party here, but I would just like to say that the real Big Boss didn’t want Solid Snake to kill Venom Snake, the fake Big Boss, he was meant to go in there and be fed some false info and report back to the government that there was no threat in Outer Heaven, better yet, he gets killed while there. Which is why he was sent in with virtually nothing to defend himself, just a pack of cigarettes. So no Big Boss didn’t want Venom dead by any means.
I think something A LOT of people are forgetting as one of Metal Gear's trademarks is how it skips time through each installment. The fact that this game ends, fast-forwarding to the Outer Heaven Uprising about 10 years after the events of TPP is not unlike Peace Walker starting AFTER Big Boss lefts the Patriots and was cloned by Zero. Or how MGS2 skips Solid Snake and Octacon founding Pihlianthropy and how the Metal Gear designs go out in the open. Or MGS4 going straight into Solid Snake's body already deteriorating.
Everyone saying WE NEED MORE CONTENT needs to calm down. There is no definite, absolute in-your-face what the fuck this is for real proof that a chapter 3 exists. Could it have been happening at one point? Sure. Was it cut from the game. Most likely, and probably because of the whole Konami vs. Kojima debacle. Mission 51 is definite proof and I do believe that THAT is something that should be patched into the game (as well as Quiet still being a buddy, but whatever).
My point is, the whole cut content thing is an over reaction to a mild degree. Since this game ends the way it does, let alone it being what may very well be the final Metal Gear game for a very very long time, I can understand the sour taste. Trust me, I had it for a good couple of days too after beating it. But it took me a while to accept the ending as not unlike anything that has happnned in Metal Gear before, when you break it down to its very essence.
So no. A Chapter 3 shouldn't and won't probably happen.
But yes, I'm right there with you in wanting that mission 51 as a definitive climax to this game--one it needs very much (that shiv to the heart that was the standoff in mission 45 was amazing but no Metal Gear boss battle).
The ending isn't something to be taken at face value, and is by no means a mere contextual, in the moment sort of ending. This is as much of an addition to the series as whole, changing the preconceived notion of the story of Metal Gear, while also being a fitting conclusion to the series as a whole. And for a prequel to not just tell us what we already know but tell us a story we never knew I think is brave and unheard of, and somthing people should be celbrating more than being mad at, not because it underwhelmed them which is as a good of a reason as any, but because it is lazy or its shit writing.
If you wanted the heartfelt, ties up all loose ends ending, thats where MGS4 is. Thats where that needs to be, not here.
If you were hoping to know how Big Boss was a villain this whole time, he's been one since Peace Walker AND better yet his betrayal/deceit of Venom/you is better villainy then doing any terrible, evil act you've seen before. This isn't bad writing. Is it upsetting or not as good as it could be? If that's your opinion that by all means preach it brother, or sister.
Point is, this ending deserves a lot more HOORAYS then BOOS, and the fact so many fans of Metal Gear are refusing to look past the face value of what this ending is--not just respective to this story, but to the Metal Gear lore, mythos and universe--is kind of sad.
Anyways, I'm still playing htis game 2 weeks after beating the story, and I'm loving it so fucking much.
+BruceWillisHasNoHair My thoughts exactly... All this negative circle-jerk surrounding MGSV is just getting out of hand...
+BruceWillisHasNoHair I totally agree with you on the first part about time skips, but I don't agree that there shouldn't be a third chapter of the game. It established new loose ends it still had to tie up, including context for the twist ending, it just came out of nowhere.
I just played it again and I have the same thoughts.
Venom Snake loses it, because he feels used to strengthen the Legend of Big Boss. So in the End he uses his Name to create Outer Heaven. The real Big Boss returned to Foxhound as a Comander and Instructor, that is also where he met Solid Snake. (Even if he hates the LET Project, he respected Snake as a Soldier. Seen in MGS4)
So he sends his "Clone" with the same Capabiltys to take down his Phantom to sace the World.
After leaving Foxhound he creates Zanzibar Land, but the AI System of the Patriots sees it as a threat, so they send Solid Snake again to kill his "Father"
Also Master Miller hates the fact, that Ocelot lied to him and that Miller would stand with Venom Snake instead of going with Big Boss.
"We each have a Role to play, and when the Time comes, one of us has to Die"
On the Tapes in Phantom Pain you can listen to audio where Zero visits the real Big Boss and Ocelot. He never wanted the MSF to be destoryed. By Privatising the Military it even played in Zeroes Hands.
But after Skull Face poisens Zero the AI that Sigint built gets Control and seeks Big Boss dead and the inconvinient stateless Army destroyed. In favor to have full control of the coming War Economy.
Well said brother! well said!!
Let me clue you up. Big Boss chose David (Solid Snake) to take down his phantom Venom Snake during the Outer Heaven incident in 1995 as a test, in order to see if he had what it took to actually kill him. David passed that test with flying colours (with a little help from Frank Jaeger), and so four years later you have Zanzibar land again with Frank helping him (secretly this time) toward the final confrontation with Big Boss. The reason for this is because Big Boss saw something in David that reminded him of The Boss whom he killed during Operation Snake Eater. As such he wanted David to kill him, because the anguish he felt from killing his own mentor still weighed heavily upon him.
Frank being Big Boss's most trusted lieutenant understood his commander's wishes, and he wanted David to kill him as well. Eli (Liquid Snake) despite having Big Boss's dominant genes was simply nothing in the eyes of his father, even though he too wanted him dead just like David did.
Spoilers ahead:
This was not the game you found young Sniper Wolf while riding as Saladin in Afghanistan. You did not save Gray Fox in Mozambique. You did not go on adventures with your 2nd in Command and you did not meet young Naomi Hunter in Rhodesia. You did not discover how Big Boss went from Diamond Dogs/Outer Heaven (anti-Patriot/Cipher organization) to Foxhound (Patriot/Cipher organization) and why. You don't learn about how BB, the supposed villain of the series, ends up being this malicious villain that supposedly wants a world of "perpetual war" (as he himself says in MG2).
Instead, you get a game where you play as some random guy who happened to be in the same plane as BB. You learn that just about anyone can be Big Boss if not better. You go on ultimately pointless adventures that contribute nothing to the overall story of the saga. You're supposed to accept that Big Boss is just a manipulative asshole even though they offer you no context to his actions. Ocelot is boring. Kaz is outright detestable. Quiet could as easily been made out of cardboard. Skullface went nowhere. Mother Base is empty and lifeless. Parasites are the new (old?) nanomachines. Huge, huge missed opportunities all around.
Even for an MGS game, this story is embarrassing. Great gameplay, though.
+4Clubs Yeah this game had potential to be the best of the saga if the story was about the real Big Boss...
***** But Kojima went "Nope, I guess we need a whole game to explain how Big Boss survives MG1". It's the most retarded thing ever.
+4Clubs Well it isn't a random guy. He is the best soldier besides Big Boss. I really wanted to see Sniper Wolf, Gray Fox, and all of The Sons Of Big Boss group but we didn't and we cant change that. Oh well it happened and this is the last Metal Gear game from Kojima and it explained how Big Boss was a "villain" because Venom Snake became power hungry and turned into a dick so people even thought worst of him.
+4Clubs Your wrong you did play Big Boss you played the very first big boss ever seen in a metal gear game, you just didn't play as Naked Snake
MGS has always about the fact that given the right set of circumstances anyone can be BB/Snake, Solid was the inferior clone yet beats both big bosses and his "superior" clones, Ryden was a rookie fresh out of training who was manipulated into becoming for all intent and purposes snake for that mission and now Venom is continuing that tradition
+4Clubs
You didnt even get anything about what was told in MGS V. Your comment hurts to read.
My favourite MGS, played them all many, many times and the story in V was fantastic and filled in the gaps between this and the NES Metal Gear perfectly.
JJ I'm not gonna lie, you took the words right outta my mouth! I instantly thought about Metal Gear when I found out that I wasn't really Big Boss
Funny thing, I figured out the entire plot when Ismael spoke. I knew that he was Big Boss. The Medic also sounded like Keifer.
Same, I kinda guessed it.
It was MGS2 all over again. But much more telegraphed. Ground Zeroes was the tanker episode.
orkutfinance a lot of people guessed that but I highly doubt you guessed the reasons and intentions behind it. I guessed it from gz when the medic sounded like deeper keifer
orkutfinance ye
orkutfinance I began noticing the similarities when Ishmael said "we're sitting ducks blend in with the bodies." because I kept confusing Ahab with Ishmael.
I just can't get behind some guy being as skilled as Big Boss. I wish it was a more established character or the Decoy Octopus theory came true.
+ItsDrafty Well the "Medic" was the best soldier MSF had, besides Snake of course. That + all the hypnotherapy.
I agree that it's kind of far-fetched that he shares Big Boss's skills, but it's not completely impossible.
+ItsDrafty There is another thing that people miss with this series. They make a big deal out of using the word "legend". It's the legend of Big Boss, the legend of Solid Snake. It's their legend that gives them their name, not their skill. While they are extremely skilled they can be bested, hell, you can recruit people to mother base who are better than Snake. You carry on his legend. Their is also the idea that is set up that you are the medic, and that you have his skill because you've been on all of his missions, you know his story backwards and forwards, and thus, you can now hold the title of Big Boss.
+Venom Fox If you notice Venom's CQC is different than BB's, so the skills AREN'T the same
+ItsDrafty hes actually not as skilled as naked snake at all. multiple times in Phantom Pain, he makes mistakes and comes off as a novice in the field. one example is when he gets bit by the snake in Afghanistan and Quiet pretty much has to save his life.
+Evnyofdeath From GZ to TPP they're exactly the same. If TPP not being a bit better.
I like this take.
Naked Snake realizes the symbolism in the title of “Big Boss” and seizes the opportunity to use Venom as a lightning rod to inherit the curse that comes with the title of “Boss”. IE: everyone we encounter in MGS referred to as “Boss” goes down in history as the worst person who ever lived, despite having the truest of intentions. Even Liquid. Jack saw the writing on the wall and ultimately found a way to break the cycle.
Yep, BUT… THAT is what makes him the bad guy. He surrendered to The Patriots. That’s also what makes MGS so compelling when it’s all put together. Ocelot is the hero. Even though he has to APPEAR as the villain. In the end we see his admiration for Big Boss was in part built on the ability Jack had to walk away from the fight.
I know people will hate that take, but it holds up. All the way around it does.
LOL I loved this ending I thought that was clever as fuck
+XsvruploaderX then you're dumb as fuck.
Ishraq Mirza nope. i knew he wasn't big boss and that ishmail is big boss but i wanted a better explanation.
+KainScion Uh no.
***** I just thought the twist was cool and how it tied into the original Metal Gear, MGSV in general has a pretty disappointing story, so it was cool to see at least one unique twist. K.
+Shawn “Nico” Contreras Yes. Because Big Boss is just a title. Kojima wanted YOU, the player, assume this title.
Kiefer Sutherland was great, I liked his voice more than David Hayter.
+TomLehockySVK you don't even know his name...
+Doruk Evcim I wanted to say Keifer
I do agree that the idea of having a real Big Boss and a 'copy' Big Boss' makes sense, but I had really wished for Venom to be more than just a seemingly random medic.
I thought the scene with the ashes was a great, emotional piece. It was Venom being remorseful over what he had to do and wanting to honor them in a meaningful way.
What if Hideo Kojima was M. Night Shyamalan the whole time?
I personally LOVED this game. All the unanswered question and plot twists is what makes this game hugely interesting and makes you wishing for more.
They can't just leave us with The Phantom Pain! Hideo Kojima has to remake/remaster/whatever the first two Metal Gear games. Yes, I'm aware Konami is in control, but that was his, dammit!!
Javelin So true, sucks Konami owns the rights to the game. It's not theirs!
Javelin the only way that could happen is if Kojima Productions (now an independent studio) can come to an agreement with Konami to develop more MGS games as a third party.
They played him like a dam fiddle!!!
Give it back Konami bastards ! It's ours, we made it! Us and Kojima !
Okay, late to the party, but I've finally beaten it and holy shit! I'm very happy this wasn't spoiled to me at all. I kind of guessed that something was up with Big Boss, because in this entry it didn't feel like Big Boss, and that guy with the bandages was voiced by Keifer Sutherland and at first I thought it was Solidus too, but damn I was still surprised at that twist. But do you know why I love this twist? It's because Kojima pretty much said here: "Hey Chris, guess what? You are Big Boss. You are literally Big Boss, you are just as awesome and you didn't even realise it if you were too immersed in the game." He says that to EVERYONE that plays this game and I love that. :D
4 years later and you’ve nailed it 👏👏👏 top class 👍
I don't hate the ending but I think this game has the weakest plot of ANY metal gear games. Kojima's claims that this would be "the missing link" the game that ties everything together don't pan out, bugger all is explained and he'd need dlc the size of that which rivals the whole game to truly tie everything together. Additionally there were barely any cutscenes, Venom's practically a silent protagonist, Quiet's is a great character but also bugger all is explained (not to mention inconsistencies), and overall this just wasn't a metal gear experience for me. I loved the plot and story of mgs 2 and 3 the most out of all the games, and it saddens me that V doesn't even come halfway close to the experience of those games.
***** I guess that's the best way to sum it up
It explains a two decade plot hole.
+BakedCookie the game wasn't completely finished. There was third chapter cut from the game called peace which was supposed to sum up the whole game. Konami really fucked us over on that one #FucKonami
+Dmitry Shubkin Something that people said for MGS2 , 3 ,4 and Peace Walker .................... Everytime a MGS is released , the fanbase just shows their flip flopping and inconsistent opinion .
+BakedCookie You can thank Konami for messing it up.
you're right, there is another metal gear game. metal gear survive might fill all the plot holes XD
Smfh.
DRGIZMO29 good one. I love that joke.
Hahahahaha
I think this is one of the best games of all time.i loved the ending twist should there have been more absolutely but when I really think about how far the series has come and how great the story is I tend to love the game a bit more
9:39 Jeremy predicts the future.
That was the best explanation I've ever heard
I completely agree with you 100%. I think why most people are hating it is because they're looking at it at a different angle.
In the ending, it's revealed you were playing as the medic. On the surface, thats shallow as FUCK. But if you look at it as you, *the player*, was Big Boss, its impactful. As that hit me during the credits, I legit had my mind blown.
Now the legendary soldier was two people, allowing him to have a second life. I don't think the real Big Boss wanted to take Venom out in MG1, I think that its still the twist that your commander was the villain. Snake killing Venom in Outer Heaven allowed Big Boss to completely slide off the radar and reconstruct Outer Heaven in Zanzibarland. It allowed him to completely restart and give one last shot at fulfilling the Boss' Will.
Even though TPP is missing major parts of the game, I will always defend the twist ending.
If Big Boss is not a villain. Why would he and Ocelot agree to kill all those people in the Hospital in the beginning of Phantom pain for the sake of "both big bosses" to escape? He was willing to sacrifice them and that was the plan all along by Ocelot i think and agreed by Big Boss. That's what i remembered from the tape after the BIG reveal. So i'm still confused about him.
In my opinion it would have been better if they only coincidentally found out Big Boss was alive a day or so maybe before The Medic woke up from his coma, because if it were me I wouldn't give my life for ANYONE, especially when there is no guarantee he's going to make it out. I mean, look at it. Venom almost got killed like three times, and was only saved by Bill Nye the fire guy (my name for him lmao) and Phycho Mantis.
Its simple He already is a demon
No they didn’t. Stop trying to cling to the idea that Big Boss is a hero. He’s not. The truth tapes are clear on the fact that the people in the hospital had no idea they were going to be attacked but Big Boss and Ocelot gave them no warning as they needed to use them as shields to aid in Big Boss and Venoms escape. They were innocents who Big Boss was happy to sacrifice to help ave himself
its all about perspective. big boss has done some stupid, evil shit and sometimes on purpose and sometimes by accident. but he mostly did it for a higher purpose which was to carry out the Zanzibar plan and retaliate against the patriots and carry out the boss' will etc etc. in my opinion he still kinda is a hero but he took the needed sacrifices to carry out the plan just like so many other war hero's in this world. just like the boss when she convinced the public that she betrayed her country and did some fucked up things, but in the end it was for her country, even if it did result in her death as well as others.
i dont think he happily chose to sacrifice innocents with a big smile on his face XD.
big boss is the kinda guy to execute his plan or mission, if there needs to be sacrifices then so be it. in his perspective, he was doing it for a higher purpose which was to carry out the bosses will and go against the patriots.
This is how you explain the big boss storyline with only a few simple words
MGS 3 innocence
MGS Peace Walker misunderstanding
MGS V anger
MG 1 & 2 lost
MGS4 regret
Jeremy, THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU!!! ❤️ I can die happy knowing the beginning.
FYI guys Kojima productions is back. They are with Sony though! there's a chance there will be more metal gear to come!
Now everybody say it with me: Fuck konami!!!
+The Happy Cats Tail Unfortunately, Konami owns the rights to the Metal Gear franchise. : /
+Robby Bobby I know :( it's possibly Kojima could get the rights back somehow but unlikely as fuck.
Sony could buy it out, or profit from Death Stranding could buy the rights.
***** i highly highly doubt that would happen but its definitely possible. i think we just have to face it ):
The Happy Cats Tail if only...Konami owns all the rights to mgs, they can sue kojima if he tried. If only Konami would be good people and hand the game over to kojima
This is the most convoluted shit i have ever heard. . . and it makes me want to play these games.
+Gio The Megaman I'll agree with the first part of your post...lol
+Gio The Megaman Hello there! You must be new to the Metal Gear Solid fandom! XD
Alan Hawke the Biracial Activist pretty new, never played a single game
Gio The Megaman It's a great series. One giant ass plot that makes you go "What the hell..." more than twelve times but still! xDD
+Gio The Megaman Just accidently came across this post, it is so worth it to get into this series. One of the most interesting and rewarding stories in ANY medium.
The games are readily available on multiple consoles, get the legacy collection for either ps3 or 360, and then you just need mgs4 and 5, you are in for a ride man!
I liked the ending because we the player have ultimately become Big Boss.
I thought Big Boss's final message to Venom Snake was in fact a message to the fans from Hideo.
"From here on out: You're Big Boss."
Look, you can hate on the twist all you want but keep this in mind: You are playing as the guy who SINGLE HANDEDLY took down Sahelantropus, fought countless armored vehicles/helicopters, whit just one real arm, one eye and a metal shard stuck in his head.
Big Boss couldn´t have chosen a better candidate to become his phantom. The legend of BB lives on because of Venom
Good points that I've not considered.
I'm still pissed that the story was incomplete; MGS5 didn't feel like a metal gear game to me. Still a solid game though.
Great video! I personally loved the story and the ending. Your analogy with MGS2 and Metal Gear being more about the story told over the course of the series is what I love the most about it. It's not your clear as day, typical, hold your hand type of story telling and really gets you to think and process events.
The worst part is how much this will fuck up all the Big Boss wiki entries
Very emotional when Quiet left and moved on. 😢
U made it all make sense Jeremy. Metal Gear has always been that thinking mans story and you've connected the dots on this one-yeah I agree with you on Big Boss's character throughout this whole ordeal
Big boss is not and never has been the villian. He's the hero.
Wtf are you talking about? He's a warmonger who's happy to use children in his army.
The hero betrayed by the country he served
@@LunarSault23 and the hero who ended up betraying his most loyal companions to fulfill his own selfish dream
Lol I had a similar reaction after the twist. I just sat there staring at my character in the AC
I was nine years late, but I finally finish the game, and for me as a MGS fan that played the main entries in the saga it make sense but it missed that last game with solid snake fighting venom snake that would be a great closing, but is you didn't played the other games you would be missing a lot of pieces on the MGS puzzle, awesome review Jeremy it shows that you know and care.
I've played all metal gear games at least twice and I'm still very confused after 20 years
😂😂 that’s the beauty of it man.....my mind was pretty much fucked after MGS2. I’ll never forget that feeling when Otacon said at the end the Patriots died a 100 years ago
Yep it's part of the franchise is awesome, the lore is endless.
the franchise is now okay to end. honestly the phantom pain was a great game to finally give us a game to conclude on.
Have you forgotten 4 that's the real ending to the series
+HOPELESS ENTERTAINMENT i really wish they would just remaster 4, that's my favorite game of all time
HOPELESS ENTERTAINMENT 4 is the real ending, but Phantom pain was an ending on Big Boss' story.
Not Big Boss his ends with Snake in 4. This leads to Venoms ending in MG
Me too at least have a stable 60 fps for backwards compatible version. If you make Snake go up the stairs in which you go and meet Rat patrol and go up the stairs with the camera aiming at the wall the 60fps is just so beautiful.
I JUST started playing this franchise this year. Going to start the original Metal Gear Solid today. Been loving every moment of these games. The ending of Phantom Pain blew my god damn mind.
what id give to be in your shoes. best advice I can give. play MGS 4 very last
@@dresoto2694 I actually beat 4 last night! And man...WHAT. A. GAME.
@@AustinPPutnam please tell me you played it last
@@dresoto2694 I did!
Hearing this made me feel better.
Really? I didn't mind. I've never minded the whole protagonist switch thing.
Every time he says Big Boss I’m taking a shot of Remy Martin
I love MGS but i dont really understand the whole story.I'm interested tho.I only played Peace Walker on my PSP. lol. that was a good game.Fun fact,I'm downloading Phantom Pain right now on my laptop since I can run it.Can't wait to play the game! :D
Play mgs3 ._. It's one of the best.
all you really need to play is 3, pw, and read a plot summery on gz.
Play all of them! There literally isn't a single bad (and canon) Metal Gear Solid game out there. Just might be a little tough getting used to them after playing Phantom Pain -- some of the game mechanics haven't aged well at all. I'd recommend playing in chronological order to help with that a bit:
1964 - MGS3 Snake Eater (PS2, PS3, 360, 3DS)
1970 - MGS Portable Ops [optional] (PSP)
1974 - MGS Peace Walker (PSP, PS3, 360)
1975 - MGSV Ground Zeroes (PS3/4, 360,Xbone, PC)
1984 - MGSV Phantom Pain (PS3/4, 360,Xbone, PC)
1995 - Metal Gear [optional] (Available in HD Collection on PS3/360)
1999 - Metal Gear 2 Solid Snake [optional] (Available in HD Collection on PS3/360)
2005 - Metal Gear Solid (PS1, PS3, PC, Gamecube remake)
2007 - MGS2 Sons of Liberty (PS2, PS3, 360, PC)
2014 - MGS4 Guns of the Patriots (PS3)
Xeni Kobalt
damn that's a lot of information you got there XD thanks.yeah i'll try my best to play most of MGS game.but i can only play games that is available on PC and PSP since i dont have any console :)
***** Here's hoping for a PC release of the HD collection. :P
#FucKonami
+Paradox Acres #HitTheLever!
FucKonami News
+Hodd Toward You are not the true Todd Howard, you are a disgrace on this name.
***** who is obese sack of shit?
***** in jim s case it doesn t matter that he s fat.just listen to him how he s smart about gaming topics etc
Completely agree with you Jeremy. The twist is believable and the theories are very sound. I love that there is so much room for interpretation and it's not all neatly tied up in a bow! I really enjoyed it as well.
The problem most people have with the ending was that it leaves so many issues unaddressed. The metal gear is still around, the parasite is still a threat, and not to mention an entire third act was cut from the game. The story wasn't finished, and that's konamis fault.
Here's my ideal future for the Metal Gear franchise: A good gaming company or more than one buy the Metal Gear license for the boat load of money it's worth (I'm thinking like Naughty Dog, Bethesda, etc.) And make at least two more metal gear games: MGS VI, the REAL final chapter, and a spin off. The spinoff will not be open world and will be Hideo Kojima's last game. The spin off will be open world and will not be directed by Hideo Kojima.
The MGS VI will take place in between 1984-1999, it is not open world, and it has three different plots that come together: Big Boss building Zanzibar, Venom going against Big Boss, and the rise of Solid Snake and Gray Fox.
Big Boss will create the nation Zanzibar by freeing it from corrupt governments (maybe by cipher?) And he will become a hero that rescues people like Naomi Hunter, Frank Jaeger, and Sniper Wolf and brings them into Zanzibar. It's kind of like what you do in Peace Walker by incorporating Cecile, Huey, and Paz. On his side will also be Ocelot.
Venom will combat cipher and for whatever reasons, will come to hate Big Boss and will go against him alongside Kaz, in a civil war for the title of Big Boss.
Meanwhile, Big Boss will train Solid Snake as part of Foxhound, where he gets good enough to defeat both Big Bosses and will be the only one with the happy ending.
The spin-off will be an open world, but will have nothing to do with the Snakes or the Patriots because I think with the filler, that universe can be put to rest. Create some kind of new enemy similar to the patriots, and in my head, a protagonist who like Solid Snake, but with a sense of humor. The point of the spinoff is to keep the gameplay and value of the series alive.
Seriously though, something needs to be done about the gap Phantom Pain left. They can't just say this is the missing piece, but leave out 11 years that basically defines the character of nearly all its protagonists by Metal Gear.
I think Bethesda is out of the picture now
These games have a bigger storyline than War and Peace. Could fill an encyclopedia! Surprised there hasn't been a movie yet. Could make a ton of sequels.
I like the ending but what the hell happened after chapter 1? It's like they just made a mad dash to the ending after Skull Face's arc, padding the way with reused missions and you don't even get to go after Liquid & Psycho Mantis(what did they do with the last english strain parasites and Sahelanthropus?).
+FreshIngredient There was a cut ending called kingdom of the flies which would wrap up the whole eli and mantis story arch. Also they cut out chapter 3 peace. You can find it on youtube
+FreshIngredient I have a feeling Konami suddenly in the middle of development gave them a hard deadline and told them they were being let go after such and such date. So they needed to have a "finished" game by then. Honestly I feel like the game could've used another year in the oven just to iron out the rest of the story, because the gameplay is all there. With Konami's sudden and aggressive switch to dumping most of their console game market the timing for this game just seems to be unfortunate. The Kingdom of Flies content would've added the last part of the game that is clearly missing.
+Ethos998 Probably unfinished because Mgsv was a monetary black hole. I think Konami probably didn't think they would break even or just didn't want anymore money dumped in the project. Oh well, maybe we'll see TPP epilogue later. pull the lever! coming to a pachinko machine near you!
+Dominik Santiago Wait can't find it are you playing with us! I heard it was never made and was just some cut cutscenes put on a bonus disc. Is it the real ending or just random cut scenes?
+Therealmadkong Your right it's only on the collectors edition disc it's messed up that they cut the final act of the game out it seems like mission 46 where the truth is feels like the halfway point of the game
its weird that the ultimate bad guy hires the protagonists to screw the good guys
Jeremy, you just saved the series for me. Thanks for pointing that out with MG1 & MG2! Totally forgot that!!!
I thought it was brilliant from the moment I saw it.
Never been this early before, holy shit
Good vid Jeremy, there's also a couple of extra things which I think makes the series better as a whole. I always wondered why Big Boss dropped the fact he's Solid Snake's father in MG2, and not MG1 when I think it would've been more appropriate there. But yeah, a body double in Outer Heaven puts that rest. Also from a gameplay point of view, the fact you're not playing as BB, but rather your own avatar that you create amplifies how YOU as a player create you're own army, which in my opinion works better as a game than if you build a base from BB's perspective. Playing from BB's perspective may or may not have made the story stronger, but the avatar undoubtedly works far better from the gameplay's perspective.
I have SO much evidence that Venom Snake is the true villainous Big Boss. So this guy is right.
I love the ending I feel like it makes sense.
What I think is that (don't read this if you haven't finished the game) when Venom Snake smashes the mirror isn't only a awesome fourth wall breaking move that shows that everyone is their own Big Boss/Snake, I think it's also showing Venom Snake realizing he'll have to obey all of the BIG Big Boss's orders and he doesn't like that because maybe he wants to be completely in charge. So I believe Venom Snake punching the mirror is him saying "FFFFFFF******CK NO!".
PS: it could be a different reason, becuase when Snake looks at the mirror again, he sees his "inner demon" and tries to stop it from coming out.
PPS: ooooorrrrrr, the other snake we see after the window gets smashed could be a vision of the BIG Big Boss. Demon Snake Vs Solid Snake anyone? It's like BIG Big Boss knows Venom Snake won't obey and the broken mirror is the first sign of those two in a battle against each other.
There, I've said my three theories.
Well, in MGS 4, he does kill the Patriots and Zero, so maybe this was part of his plan to find Zero and the Patriots in peace, while the world is chasing Venom Snake? To be fair, I liked this ending, but the problem for me was that the last few missions were only harder challenge versions of previous missions. That was my main problem, personally, the twist was interesting and as an idea, it was good for me.
I mean... I dont hate the twist ending... But it didnt had any emotion... I fucking cryied at the end of Metal Gear Solid 4 and 3, I was mindfucked at the end of Metal Gear Solid 2, I was happy at the end of Metal Gear Solid... But in this one... The LAST one... I felt nothing...