So, clearly some of you (not all) have a hard time listening (when it comes to my breakdown of Lori's SA at the hands of Shane Walsh.). I'm going to add this fourth clarification, because clearly three clarifications in the video was not enough. Lori **is not** directly responsible for her SA. Despite her abusive and unethical treatment of Shane, prior to said assault, what happened to her **was not** justified. Shane is the one who is ultimately morally culpable for his actions. In the same light, it's not unreasonable to argue that she increased the likelihood that she would be victimized by treating someone else like total s***. It's not crazy to assert that she could've prevented that particular issue, given she somewhat incited the behavior in the same way a bully might incite a victim to go postal at a school. In fact, this is one of the reasons why people and experts want to reduce bullying. It leads not only to self-deletion but also to kids playing real life CoD at school - where their classmates are the OpFor. Bullying is clearly wrong but it can also incite even worse behavior. Be that as it may, the moral blame is ultimately on the attacker (Shane in the case of this video). We can understand this to be certainly true while also acknowledging that people expose themselves to varying levels of risk -> and it's objectively true to state that if they get victimized, they are not morally culpable for it while also simultaneously being "guilty" of behaviors that may have increased their risk of being victimized in the first place. Acknowledging this doesn't absolve the attacker from their guilt; it doesn't justify their retaliation. It merely teaches people to be better at risk management - and, in a sense, helps to save people from harm. Don't be a dick to people and your chances of harm are reduced. If you avoid knowingly dating serial killers, you might just avoid being killed by said serial killer. Bad people exist in the world. It would behoove anyone to learn how to minimize being victimized by these people. Being a victim doesn't magically absolve you of your responsibilities that you have to yourself. But, to clarify for the fifth time now, this does not mean the attacker is innocent or that they don't deserve proper punishment for their clearly unethical and or illegal actions. It does not mean that the victim deserves their harm. This isn't some dichotomy where we have to pick between these two propositions; they can both be true at the same time. And if i had to put a figure to it, a number out of 5, I'd say the attacker's culpability is a 5 and the victim (depending on the circumstances) is never more than a 0.1. Are we clear now? That's five clarifications. 👍
if u had to clarify 5 times then maybe u didn’t say it in a clear way in the vid it’s fine to admit your choice of words was failing lol instead of being mad at us reacting to what u said
@@vampluvrgirl 04:34 Plain English. 08:10 Plain English. 10:09 Plain English. Perhaps you can enlighten me on how those words weren’t clear enough. Humble me. 🤗 But seriously. Listen better. This pinned comment isn’t for the majority lol it’s for the special minority with comprehension issues.
The biggest thing about Lori that annoyed me was how she walked around acting like The First Lady, which Carol called her as a compliment. Andrea was right during that kitchen argument. Lori walked around taking everything for granted, playing housewife and laying rules for everyone. Her main responsibility as a mother should’ve been protecting Carl but she instead kept losing sight of him and always asked others to take care of him while she caused unnecessary drama amongst the group.
Omg I was just about to say. I’m rewatching rn and her whole argument with Andrea basically telling her she needs to get back in the kitchen and help the women?? In an apocalypse?? When fighters are most definitely needed like hello???
@@joonbug1587 to be fair, Lori was right that Andrea did jack shit up on that RV. and the one time she actually shoots her gun 1. It was Daryl and 2. she misses
@@asinine- Andrea was making herself useful at least, which is more than I can say for Lori who actually crashed one of their vehicles. Plus, in Andrea's defense, she thought she was shooting at a walker given the way Daryl was walking, and Andrea couldn't tell from that scope it was him.
@dwnkaomwn3953 even if Daryl was a walker, using a gun to kill just one wouldn't be efficient. It's a waste of ammo and it'd only make a lot of noise and could have drawn out more
@@sorrenblitz805He looked all of 8! That’s how old I thought he was. In any event, Lori never knew where the kid was and with her 1950s mentality, you would think the least she could do is watch her kid! She’s supposed to be the homemaker - her words - so take care of the home, Lori! She couldn’t even do that!
Tbf they did say that most of the women were doing all the domestic work like meals and laundry…. Carl was like 10 he shoulda known to stay put 😭😭😭 that car crash tho 😂
He's 12, but the point still stands. If she cared about carl so much, why would she let him wander off multiple times? She let carl run off where he played with a walker that got dale killed, she let carl slip out of her sight when shane turned and carl was forced to kill shane, she blames rick when she should have been watching over carl in the first place.
@@CP4521 I think they changed his age later because CR shot up like a weed but I swear he was 8 when the show started. He looked all of 8 to me. But regardless……Lori’s mothering skills sucked!
Absolutely. But, Shane should've pursued a marriage-level relationship with Andrea once it presented itself. He should've stopped being a womanizer and gotten over Lori.
@@joeruiz4010He tried to leave multiple times but Lori kept pulling him back each time. The amount of confusion and suffering Shane went through mentally was insane. Each time Lori asked him to stay he was given a bit of hope that they could be together instead of just saying no, it wont happen, and that he needed to leave. Andrea was just some other woman, Lori was the woman he loved.
She's right Shane is dangerous. Her telling Rick that, after she told Shane to stay. Manipulating both of them to guarantee a death duel. That act isn't unjust hate, it's partly both.
Yeah like I get that telling Rick, “Shane is dangerous” she had all the right to say but she was playing with both of them and that lead to Dale and Shanes death (if I’m remembering correctly)
I don’t think it was intentional. I believe she felt Rick could solve the issue peacefully. Just like she thought Shane could coexist in the group with everyone. I do think it’s a stretch to say she’s fully responsible for Shane wanting to kill Rick. That final showdown happened because of Shane. Rick didn’t want it and Lori didn’t want it. I think it’s better to say she exacerbated the issue.
@@TheRealCaptainGold Anyone can believe Lori thought anything, I don't factor that. Lori isn't responsible for others actions. She did too much putting Rick and Shane on course for a final conflict.
@@RigItRay You’re right. She isn’t responsible for the actions of other people, yet you say she’s responsible for Shane wanting to kill Rick. You don’t see the issue? Influencing the outcome? Sure, why not. Totally responsible? No fam.
RANT INCOMING: My issue with Lori is how she went about dumping Shane once Rick returned. It does make sense if she believed he ‘lied’ about Rick’s death, but let’s get into it anyway. Firstly, what are the fucking odds Rick would wake up nearly 2 full months AFTER the Apocalypse and then manage to find his family? His family, mind you, that’s in an entirely different state from where he woke up. Next Lori seemingly forgets literally everything Shane did for her and Carl. Yeah it’s poetic for him to say they saved him, and maybe that’s true emotionally, but he actually saved them, and lead the Quarry group to great success before Rick arrived. She even has the audacity to pretty much say Shane lied about Rick being dead and blames him for taking her and Carl away. Again, not considering anything. He saved her life, he saved her sons life, he’s actually providing her with stability in the literal end of the world. She never comes across to the viewer like she understood the very real possibility that Shane actually thought Rick was fucking dead. Whereas we the audience see the horrific shit show that went down at the hospital when he went to get Rick. So to me it feels like she uses Shane for survival because it’s convenient and logical, and once her husband returns she immediately gets rid of him. Even if she didn’t want to stay with Shane after Rick returned, she should’ve had an adult conversation with everyone and tried to make things copacetic. Instead she antagonized the man who saved her and her son’s life until he went fucking crazy and tried to kill her husband. I genuinely believe Shane was telling the truth to Rick when he said he never looked at Lori that way before the apocalypse. Then on top of it Lori really must have had a low opinion of Shane to take the position that if he lied about Rick’s death, it must have been malicious. That paints Shane in such a shitty light which is not what he deserved considering how much he did for her family. Lori sucks
Rick didnt find them in a different state. Most of the show takes place in and around Atlanta. They dont leave Georgia until they head to DC and stumble upon Alexandria. But i agree with everything you said.
not to mention she wants shane to stay but when he tries to talk to her about almost anything she shits on him and makes him feel unimportant and that he doesn't deserve to be a part of the group or a part of her life
Yes as a mother I would say, at the end of the world with the dead walking, one month after your husband dies, your son should have been your only focus, not having sex in the woods with your husband best friend.
You can't discount that part of that might have been for Carl. She lived her life thinking she had a strong and righteous police officer to guide her son through his childhood. She then had that suddenly stricken away and a very obvious replacement right in front of her right when society crumbled beneath their feet.
At the same time, if your son really is in your focus, you will take that one guy you already know and let him protect you. If she hadnt slept with him, he would have forced himself on her (which we see later on). Thats the type of guy that would just have left them on the street if she turned him down. You could let that happen for good morals sake if you are alone, but not if you have a child to protect. Then most people in her place would have went along with it.
@@angela.8454 Except she also wanted Rick to "do something about" Shane, meaning she wanted to have them at each other's throat, guaranteeing that there's no way for those two to peacefully coexist in the same group. The best thing for Shane would be if he had left the group, giving him a proper chance to move on.
@@aprilbennett4161Exactly! And when Shane said he was leaving, Lori should have let him go but she doesn’t do that. She convinces him to stay and tells him she had feelings for him too! And this is in S2! No one has time for Lori and her manipulative games!
@@la214lashe does have feelings for him, familial feelings. Shane is like a brother to Rick and an uncle to Carl, Shane was the one who interpreted that as romantic when it clearly isn’t since Rick is there. Shane was family and she didn’t want her family to be broken or separated, so she told him to stay but to stay away from her
A loving wife! No sir. There was a flash back of Lori talking to a friend of hers. She said she was thinking of divorcing Rick because he didn't fight with her and was too nice. What. People please? All she does is cause drama and issues. Because as you said, she is impulsive and short sighted.
She didn’t say what you wrote 😂 what a way to twist someone’s words so you can use them to prove your point lol. She never talked rudely about Rick, she only had a conversation with her friend about couple stuff, things that couples go through. And how do you even know what their life looked like before the apocalypse? Rick could have easily been the one who didn’t treat her right and in my opinion that would be more likely than the other way around. 😂
She wanted to divorce rick because he didn't want to fight her and was too nice 😂 She is a DISTURBED character and I always hated her especially with that mentality!! If I married a man who didn't want to fight me and was "too nice",you bet your arse I am protecting that marriage
@@aakashbaliga1881that Ezekiel thing doesn't even matter imo. Its been years and the moment she caught wind of rick being alive she ran. The only thing I didn't like was leaving while her kids were facing such an existential threat
Lori went from being in love with shane, to making him stay away from her family, to forcing shane to stay when he was about to leave, to "my son and i are not your problem anymore", to " I'm sorry shane"
Lori wasn’t in love with Shane, he was a distraction and a good thing in a world gone to hell, had Rick been there Lori wouldn’t have looked at Shane for comfort
Nah, I gotta disagree. If you're happily married, then a few months later, she's sleeping with her husband's bestie ? lol She belongs to the streets ! When Rick came back, it wasn't obvious she was pregnant, so I'm guessing 3-4 months tops? So all it took was a few months (maybe weeks) for her to get over her dead husband? lol And to do it with Carl around ? Imagine if he had caught them ? Now, if a year or two had passed, it might be excusable, but a couple of months?? Would you have taken her back ? Not me he'll no give her to Shane personally I would've been doing everything in my power to hook up with Maggie + Beth !! A man can dream 😊
Maybe Lori as a character had a personality disorder. I'm not even trying to be funny, but these type of people do exist in the world. Imagine someone like that in this type of apocalyptic world.
There were! First season and first episode of s2 were written by the director of shawshank redemption. Everything after that was someone else bc the first directors ideas were "too expensive" 🙄 so she and all the characters were written by 2 different people! 3+ of you include the comics
>Hates that Rick doesn’t fight back >Doesn’t grieve her husband’s supposed death >Gets with her husbands best friend >Has unprotected sex in a zombie apocalypse >Pushes Shane away when Rick returns without hearing him out >Pawns her kid off to everyone >Doesn’t want him to shoot a gun in a literal zombie apocalypse >Tells Shane her family is “off limits” to him >Continues to treat Carl like a child in a world where he could die at any moment >Tells Shane to stay, giving him mixed signals >Tells Glenn to get her a pregnancy test >Finds out she’s pregnant, tells no one >Asks Glenn for abortion pills >This side quest almost gets Maggie killed >Takes the pills and then vomits them out >Doesn’t say shit to Rick, he finds out because of the pills >Tells him Shane is dangerous >Yells at Andrea because she wants to protect the group and not do traditional house wife things >Is completely ungrateful of the fact her husband returned from the dead while everyone else piles on their losses >Takes Maggie’s car (probably without asking idk) >Crashes into the _only thing_ on a goddamn empty road >Almost dies, and ends up losing a valuable vehicle >When Rick tells her he killed Shane, she treats him like a monster >Yells at Carl for clearing the infirmary at the prison (kinda justified) >Even when she’s dead she continues to haunt the damn show with her ghostly presence hell, yes, she deserves the hate. She is a terrible person, a terrible mother and a horrible wife. It’s one thing to act the way she does but who the hell has unprotected sex in an apocalypse where there are no meds or hospitals? In the woods where they could be jumped at any time? I probably missed a lot of other things, but still, Lori can rot in the depths of hell.
She was about to divorce Rick when he was shot, how long had she been flirting with Shane? She didn’t save anybody, she is a predator without power and becomes a victim who drains those who love her
@@XThink-hl6gv What makes her the devil, the big ones. Telling Shane to stay, telling rick Shane is dangerous, and push and pull Shane's emo. It guaranteed the death duel.
I’ll be honest she definitely deserves at least 95% of the blame that she gets. The relationship between her and Shane is the only thing she doesn’t deserve hate for. The moment Rick came back she doesn’t tell him about her & Shane, tries to abort the baby, denies Shane from Carl & worst of all his own unborn child, mixed signals like “Stay away from my family” to “How can you try & abandon us like that?” Shane had the right to see & raise his daughter, & had he at least been able to have that a group lead by Rick Shane Daryl would’ve been a pretty difficult group to go up against in the future!!
Sure, if Shane were a normal person in a normal circumstance, then he’d absolutely deserve the right to see his biological child. But Shane has been nothing but dangerous towards the members of the group as soon as Rick returned. He disrespected Lori and her family (are people forgetting he sexually assaulted her in the cdc? lol) and has shown that he DOES not have the capability or capacity to lead the group and provide stability for a child.
@@naha2153 Did you watch those seasons or his video. As soon as Rick came back she treated him like he was a villain, like he was lying about Rick. He cared for both Carl & Lori but she doesn’t care for the sacrifices he made for them. It wasn’t til near the end of season 2 where she says THANK YOU for all he’s done. The WORST thing of all was her telling him that even if the baby is his he won’t get to see it! You don’t think all of that, being in an apocalyptic world & being denied your right to be a father would send a man over the edge??? How she treats him is what cracks him, then he’s broken.
@@Sun-Warrior1911 To be fair, Shane is still responsible for going over the edge of his own accord. Lori just added gas to the fire. We can empathize with Shane, we can understand him, we can feel sorry for him, but we can’t remove his culpability.
@@TheRealCaptainGold Lori doesn’t just pour gas she helps light the fire too. His fire was protecting Lori and Carl, & it was safe and properly maintained surrounded by a circle of rocks. As soon as Rick comes back she snuffs out that flame & destroys the circle too. She helps him start a new unprotected flame with all the things she says to & about him. As if everything he’s done wasn’t for them but for himself, the fire he claimed kept him alive was nothing but an illusion when it really wasn’t. She said everything she needed to get him away so she could create the illusion of a happy marriage. She set the table for him, & Shane came and ate. Just because Shane’s body is found at the starting point of the inferno doesn’t make him the culprit IMO.
If they waited 1 more month all of this would've been avoided I fully blame Lori for wanting to bang another man so soon after her husband dies I don't care what anyone says no man like Rick deserve to be cursed with such a wife who moved on so quickly like he was nothing to her she deserve hate for sure
Which isn't justified cause Shane backed off when she told him that her family is off limits, which shows Shane being a sensible person and doing as told/doesn't even argue and tried to leave bec he couldn't bare it.
@@DeadX2 Yea but she doesnt know that. Its not out of the land of possibility someone would kill your husband during the apocalypse when they cant verify otherwise and then swoop in to cash in on some rebound poon
@@DeadX2 But she doesnt know that, and it isnt unreasonable to feel like he lied when he outright told her he died... Not "I didnt hear a heart beat cause they were shooting" not "They were bombing the hospital so it was loud" just that he died, he didnt say exactly why he couldnt hear his heartbeat till she confronted him about it. Moreover its really not unreasonable to assume it anyway since realistically he could just lie about it to get some rebound action since there is no government body to document that stuff during the outbreak and she knew that. Shane is also fragrantly not above lying and manipulating to get what he wants
*First, she gets mad at Rick for not yelling at her and being TOO GOOD a man. (before the zombie apocalypse).* *First she tells Rick to go get Merle. Then she scolds Rick for it.* *First she tells Rick that Shane is dangerous and must be delt with. Then Rick kills Shane in self defense...and Lori blames rick for it.* *She volunteers to leave Carl at the quarry camp and go into the city...but Shane convinces her not to. Then Lori drives off the farm and gets into a car accident like an idiot and has no regard for her unborn child and also risks the lives of others who have to save her.* She's selfish, self-contradicting, foolish, and has no concern for her son, unborn child, and husband, or anyone else in the group except for her Bad Boy Boyfriend, who she also ends up treating unfairly after Rick came back. Although she did think Rick was dead, she didn't even wait one month before hooking up with Shane. FOUR WEEKS. Bruh. Clearly, she never loved Rick. She despised him for being the "nice guy" "good man."
She did love Rick and was faithful, the only thing was the world literally ended. Imagine losing everything and the only thing you have left is your son and your husbands best friend. Lori needed comfort, and Shane was the one who could give it to her, she genuinely thought Rick was dead, there’s nothing wrong with their relationship before Rick came back
I mean it kind of seemed implied that this thing between Lori and Shane was brewing even before Rick was presumed dead. Not that they actually did anything, but the wheels were already in motion. I think for Lori it was just a matter of she didnt realize what she had until it was gone. Thats the only reason she jumped back to Rick so quick in my opinion. They definitely didnt seem like they were on the best of terms before the apocalypse.
The comics actually do kinda talk about how Rick's marriage isn't exactly doing too well, lack of communication, lack of emotional connection, they seem to mostly stay together for Carl.
Agreed. You don’t screw your dead husband’s best friend within three weeks of said death w/o there being some feelings already there! She was likely going to divorce Rick pre-ZA. I don’t think she was in love with Rick anymore, and she certainly wasn’t after he returned. She really wanted Shane but was too weak to say it. That’s why she cried when Rick killed him. She thought Shane would win the death match, which would have been fine with her!!
@@SpencersRain She asked Shane to stay AFTER that incident. I think she wanted Shane and was upset Rick lost that fight! Even the actress confirmed that Lori didn’t realize how deep her feelings were for Shane until she learned he was dead!!
She’s also a terrified traditional southern house wife. She was also clinging onto Shane cuz she knew it would keep her and Carl safe. Lori was never a survivor on her own she was just never built for twd world. She was absolutely terrified the whole time. It just makes me feel bad for her because she was completely lost in the post-apocalyptic world. Some ppl were never gonna make it. 😫
I’d say that’s the case about 60-70% of the time. Sometimes things happen and characters end up being hated when that’s not the intention, either because of the actor/actress, or just the way the character was written/set up
@@milaycastillo5723 People forget what kind of a man Rick was in Alexandria, though… he saw a woman he liked (Jessie Anderson) and who was in a toxic relationship, and found a way to get rid of her husband so he could get with her… just like Shane did.
I think what I get from Lori is that it's clear from a flashback at the beginning of s2 plus s1episode 1 that Lori and Rick's marriage was on the rocks prior to the apocalypse. They probably would've divorced had that not happened. Lori even questions if she loved rick in that flashback. I think you are correct about what brought shane and her together. But she sighted part of her frustration with Rick in those flashbacks as him not Getting angry with her and not putting her in her place. Something Shane does in the first episode when she walks off in a huff which led to them making out. I think she was drawn to Shane because he was exactly what Rick wasn't at that point. Assertive, tough, etc. Perhaps if the apocalypse hadn't happened they would've been together if her and Rick divorced. Plus it was at least 5 weeks Rick was in that comma. Quite quick to immediately hook up with him. If I had to guess it probably started the night Atlanta fell. And based on how they interacted it was far more than just a fling. Basically the thing is I actually think she loved Shane but didn't wanna admit it. If Rick didn't come back she'd have stayed with him. Definitely. I think as much as I dislike Andrea she was completely right about what she said to Lori in 18 miles out. Plus Shane probably would've recovered if he had the privilege of being Judiths dad. I mean it's not like the neighbors were gonna talk. Lol I agree her reaction to Rick's killing of Shane was mostly because of Carl but Rick needed her and she essentially emotionally abandoned him directly after he killed his best friend and brother for and largely because of her. That's why by season 3 their relationship is largely broken. And I think Lori definitely deserved the cold shoulder Rick gave her.
I feel like Lori would’ve gotten less hate if they kept her just long enough to complete a redemption arc of some sort. It was sorta teased at, with her and Rick slowly mending their broken relationshit and her admitting her faults and doing nothing to rock the boat. Had she received a proper redemption arc, it would’ve made her death more impactful than the shock value it provided. That said, Lori did have feelings for Shane. It was confirmed by Kirkman. Those feelings are partially what fuels her self guilt. Although I think it was clear she loved Rick more. Him “dying” and returning served as the catalyst for Lori experiencing the cliche’ “you never know what you have until you lose it” motif.
@@TheRealCaptainGold Agreed. I also think Shane despite how unstable he was never actually wanted to Kill Rick. I think he either wanted Rick to toughen up to ensure the safety of Lori, Carl and the baby or wanted Rick to Kill him again to prove to him he was willing to do anything to protect Them. Jon Bernthal even wanted the script to be changed to have his gun empty when confronting Rick. Re-watching I have a different perspective of Shane. He wasn't really a monster. In fact I now get increasingly annoyed by Dale. While he had some legitimate gripes with Shane I feel like maybe Dale had no right to make assumptions about him. "I know what kind of man you are" ...But do you, really ? Maybe you could make a video on weather or not Dale was right about Shane? Also maybe another interesting video topic would be when you Think the group began looking more to Rick to call the shots rather then Shane? I think Rick ultimately became the true Leader of the Group during the search for Sofia as around that time Shane's mental health declined after Otis.
Tbf it was two months after the literal apocalypse, not to mention her husband (Rick) was in a coma inside a hospital in a populated city. Not only that, but the group was in an entirely different state than them, so what was the likelihood of a single person getting out of an infected hospital in the middle of an infested city, and also finding his family in a separate state on foot without any clues?
@@Bureau_Of_Enigma_Affairs Wasn't two months. After Rick was left unattended, he couldn't have lived 3 days without water. Even with an IV. So, 3 days max in the hospital, 2 days at Morgan's and on that same second day he was already on the road to Atlanta. With no traffic it only took him a few hours to be within radio distance of the camp which was just outside of Atlanta. Shane and Lori were ALREADY banging because the opening scene of episode 2 was NOT the first time and that was on the SAME DAY Rick left Morgan's, day 5. She waited MAYBE 4 days. And that's being generous. From the time Shane left Rick to the time Rick found the group only 5 days passed at most. (And they weren't in a different state. Rick lived in King County, Georgia... The group was camped outside of Atlanta, Georgia. Rick from the comics was from Kentucky.)
@@dongeraci8599 In the show, it's revealed in Walking Dead (or Fear, forgot which) had doctor remained to provide medical attention to those in need who were all alone. Dave Erickson (a former showrunner for Fear the Walking Dead) claims that Robert Kirkman stated Rick had been unconscious for four to five weeks. So it was roughly one month he was in the hospital after the apocalypse started, and he was in a coma a little longer than that before Walkers invaded.
@@Bureau_Of_Enigma_AffairsIt wasn’t two months. It was THREE WEEKS! No one can convince me they didn’t have feelings for each other pre-ZA! They wasted no time getting together!
@@la214la 4-5 weeks; that's a month if not longer. And yes I agree that they definitely had feelings for each other beforehand, plus yk, trauma bonding, and all that.
Regarding Lori starting up a sexual (romantic?) relationship with Shane, I think she gets more hate for it because now we have a comparison. We just watched a spinoff where Rick's second wife and the love of his life did not engage in another romantic relationship for years after Rick's assumed death. And then went on a two-year search for him (that nearly killed her) on minimal evidence of his continued existence. The last shot of Michonne on the mothership was her about to go through a sea of walkers to find Rick. Keep in mind that Michonne and Rick were separated for far longer than they were ever together. That versus his wife of at least ten years having a relationship with his childhood best friend less than a month after being told he was dead. Yes, there is no set timetable on when a widow/er can start a new relationship, but most people would say a few weeks is way too short a turnaround. Even if, or maybe especially, when it's the end of the world and you have a young child that needs protecting and constant reassurance of safety. Woodland nookie time really needed to have taken a backseat to Carl and setting up provisions for survival.
I’m somewhat confused by the narrative I see in many comments that Lori was neglecting Carl or her duties at the camp by having short stints with Shane in the woods every so often. Am I forgetting something? Because it seems to have no relevance to the camps safety or Carl’s happiness, and if anything keeping Shane close kept Carl happy and protected. I also find the expectation that a grieving mother cannot find pleasure or comfort on her own time offputting.
@@SpencersRain I don't like Lori, but I think a lot of people have a lot of other issues and projection wrapped up in their hatred for Lori. There's this image of her just having non step sex with Shane while her child free roams, which isn't accurate or fair to her character at all. In the apocalypse I imagine a lot of people would be looking for pleasure anywhere, whether its drugs, alcohol or sex. That's how Maggie and Glenn started, but Lori is a mother and wife so there's this idea that she should sit at a widows peak mourning her lost husband until the end of time to be a 'good woman'.
Great video…although, I would disagree that Carl would be better off with Shane being a “father figure” because it’s not taking into account the fact Shane wasn’t an ideal father figure. There were plenty of viable “father figure” options at the camp. Also, Lori hooking up with Shane so fast completely ignores what Carl needed at that time. He didn’t need anymore confusion and their gross relationship, I would imagine, would have been extremely confusing.
My main gripe with Lori has always been her lack of consistency. You feel bad for the affair, so you cut Shane off completely and basically tell Rick to kill him. But, then you turn around and flip-flop when dealing with Shane directly and lead him on. Then you're surprised when what happened in the end happened. Lori is a very realistic character and was portrayed really well, too. She made so many poor choices without considering the consequences and handled the results even worse. But at the very least she was self-aware.
She told him that before he did anything to make her think he was dangerous though. She told him to stay before he was getting angry about the weapons and the barn and before he wanted to kill Randall. The time she says shane is dangerous is after rick kills Randall's group which is after shane has been causing tension.
@@mappingshaman5280he litteraly tried to rape Lori (he was drunk but still) And was saying crazy stuff he adapted faster though Those are still reasons and she could of told him to leave and he wouldn’t of died She’s just a bitch who can’t make up her mind she’s manipulative she played both rick and Shane she even admits it
Because women love being in danger, its a perfect mirror of the real world, they always love bad guys around 😂, ever wonder why most good guys are still single?
I also think she was trying to antagonize both Rick and Shane to fight each other because she wanted the man who won to look after herself, her son, and her unborn child. I don't think she cared about either but wanted a strong man to take care of her and lead the group but didn't want both of them around.
Some of you guys are talking about how Lori was evil for putting notions in Rick’s ear, but what I see is a wife warning her husband of what she knows and feels concerning the danger of his best friend. Also, Dale needs to hold some responsibility here… he saw Shane holding Rick in his sights right after Rick showed up at the Quarry Camp. He should have said something to Rick IMMEDIATELY. He figured out that Shane killed Otis and said nothing, and Shane outright confronted Dale over the guns out in the swamp. He could SEE Shane was completely unhinged and was slipping even farther, yet he kept that shit to himself… save for when he told Lori about it. That’s another reason why she talked to Rick and told him Shane was dangerous, because Dale even said it to her outright (he should’ve gone to Rick and told him, though).
Really. Big facts. Just putting all the blame on lori because the shane simps will justify any evil action he does. Shane was responsible for the farm falling in the first place. Lori isnt responsible for anything except her own actions. People just like to act as if its entirely loris fault.
You are very right about Dale, but very wrong about Lori. If Lori was that concerned about Shane she should have just let him leave like he wanted to. Instead she told the guy of who she's all so scared of to stay while also making her husband paranoid about that same guy. That's not a wife warning a husband, that's a wife setting up a death match.
@@gilgameshkingofheroes5903 I don’t think you’re seeing the entire picture here. Or maybe you just haven’t looked deeper than surface level. Let me explain: Lori WAS going to let Shane leave… until Shane realized he could use the fact that *he* helped get the surgical supplies that saved Carl, in his favor. Right after Hershel is finished with Carl’s operation, Lori is alone with her son. Shane goes to the room, taking up the ENTIRE DOORWAY with his body, and has this look on his face that says, “After all I just did, you’re still gonna make me leave? I just risked my life to save your son.” Even without having to say *a single word* , he is able to manipulate and guilt Lori into saying he can stay, while his body taking up the doorway closes off any way for her to physically leave the situation. Then, the very next morning, he does it *AGAIN* when he is exiting the RV and Lori is trying to enter. Hershel had just said that Carl was going to pull through, and Shane heard that shit. He tells her that he heard Carl was going to be alright, forcing her to admit it. Then he asks her if she meant it when she said he could stay. The ONLY REASON he did that is because he KNEW he’d manipulated her into it the night before. Watch this scene again, look at her face, and see how she answers him in this moment. A person without sight could tell that this was making her hella uneasy, and when she was like, “yeah, I meant it”, it was because Shane had just used THAT situation to manipulate her even further (by forcing her to say out loud, in so many words, that her kid was going to live because of him). Again, he does this when they are ALONE. Lori would not have told him to stay. But he cornered her multiple times and manipulated the shit out of her, Carl, and the entire situation. This is not her setting up a ‘death match’. This is emotional warfare… on SHANE’S part.
I don’t think Lori loyal was ride or die for/to Rick. Before everything happened they were fighting nonstop. She didn’t even cry when Shane told her Rick was shot. They definitely were headed to a divorce before everything took place. In my opinion Michonne was the opposite and everything that Lori was not. Although I don’t blame Lori for the affair it’s crazy to me that she didn’t even wait a month before getting with him meanwhile Michonne when almost ten years without being with anyone. I couldn’t even picture Michonne and Daryl together cause they were loyal to Rick. Unlike Lori and Shane. I feel like something was going on with Lori and Shane before Rick was shot and the outbreak happened cause they started up pretty quick after they assumed Rick died. Neither of them were truly loyal to Rick in my opinion.
No offense but you’re wrong because of one reason: the world went to hell. This isn’t like if Rick had just “died” in the line of duty, the world literally ended and Rick, as far as they knew, was 100% guaranteed dead, so that grief, coupled with the world ending, made them seek solace and comfort in each other, and when Rick came back, Lori ended the relationship because her husband was back. She was faithful to Rick and loved him, but she also couldn’t deny that Shane made her feel something, but it wasn’t love, just comfort.
I think you skipped over the fact that I said I don’t blame them for the affair. But what is crazy she and Shane started the affair not even a few weeks after they start Rick was dead. And what you’re saying isn’t all the way accurate for 1 both Shane and Lori hinted out through both seasons that something more was always happening between them which is why it was so much easier for them to start their affair and 2 Lori been pitting Rick and Shane since Rick came back and then got mad when Rick killed Shane which is why they were basically divorced in season 3. Lori didn’t even grief the presumed death of Rick yes the world was started to end but we seen Rick grieve her death for a long while before Michonne shoot even with Jackie. The second time Rick was presumed dead Michonne didn’t even think of looking in Daryl’s way like that and even Daryl had a small crush on Michonne in season 4. They both were loyal to Rick so much so that the moment that there was a small of hint of Rick being alive both Michonne and Daryl went to go look for him.
@@embracethymelanin_6518 the thing is, the world literally ended around them. The world ended and Rick died and all they had of their old lives were each other, so it makes sense they’d seek solace in each other, that they’d start something that’s meant to be more about forgetting than love. Rick even understands this, which is why he doesn’t hate them for the affair because they genuinely thought he was dead and the world had gone to shit. You can bring up Michonne all you want, but that genuinely doesn’t apply here because she was already used to this world, while Lori and Shane were just thrown into it and had no idea how to navigate it. Keep in mind Lori ended it when Rick came back and didn’t give any hints she wanted to start it back up, she just talked about it in past tense and thanked Shane for saving her and Carl, something Shane interpreted as romantic when it wasn’t. Ultimately it’s Shane who decided he deserved Lori when he didn’t, and that’s what led to Rick killing him. He even regretted it happened and would have taken it back if he could, he literally told Rick this.
What happened before the apocalypse is mostly irrelevant in this context. The entire franchise goes out of its way to make that point. Everything changed and she still stuck by him after realizing he was alive. These types of situations usually make people realize what's really important. She just couldn't stop being a people pleaser or making snap decisions and that's what her issue was. Also, comparing one person to another and judging everyone by the standard of one person makes no sense. Everyone reacts differently to different situations, especially traumatic ones.
People seem to forget Lori only told Rick that Shane was dangerous after Dale told her that he had killed Otis. Dale changed her mind about him and guess what? They were both right. Shane's mentality is NOT Lori's responsibility, he did all that to himself, and his fans don't wanna understand that he was a grown ass man responsible for his own actions. It takes TWO to tango, you all hate Lori but love Shane for doing the same, bunch of hypocrites.
If she had basically said "Look Shane, I'm sorry but Rick is alive and he's back. We can't be together anymore." That would have solved so many issues. Instead she accused him of lying, and then began to manipulate both men into hating each other. She didn't deserve the SA, but she was a terrible person in those instances. Also, yeah, constantly losing sight of her son and never knowing where the hell he was at any point in time.
To be fair, it did kind of look like Shane was lying. He literally told her Rick was 100% dead, only for Rick to come back. It does look like he lied. As for putting them against each other, she didn’t. She told Rick Shane was dangerous because Rick couldn’t see that, unlike Dale. If it had come from Dale, it would have been ok, right? That’s stupid. As for Carl, it’s hard for parents to 100% know where their kids are at all times, especially on a farm, so you can’t fault Lori for Carl either lying or disobeying her
@deadpooldan9862 Shane is portrayed as a good guy in the beginning. He did what he could to maybe protect Rick, but the military were going room to room, killing people. He's completely justified believing Rick is dead. She literally does drive a wedge between them. If Rick and Shane had just sat down and hashed things out, they might have been able to get back to some semblance of friendship, and kept Shane from literally going crazy. But instead she starts telling Rick he's dangerous while manipulating Shane from the other side. No one expects a parent to 100% always know, but Carl getting separated DURING AN APOCALYPSE happens way too fucking many times. After the first time, you'd think Laurie would be a bit more attentive, but she comes across rather neglectful.
@@NoodleKeeperYeah, he moved the bed we see it's blocking Rick's door. Besides, he couldn't tell he was really dead, his pulse was so weak and there was the gunshots in the background. Shane was a good guy in the beginning.
@charlespc Exactly. To say he left Rick for dead fails to recognize that Rick basically WAS dead. He was in a coma in a hospital that would eventually lose power and there were soldiers going door to door killing people. Shane MIGHT have been able to get Rick out of there, but more likely than not they would have both died if he tried.
@@deadpooldan9862 Man, Rick was on a coma without food and nutrients, walkers and the army were killing everyone and the only thing that was protecting Rick was a goddamn door and the bed blocking It. He Made an assumption because It was 100% logically impossible for Rick to survive, Shane didn't know and was happy for him to be alive but he knew that things with Lori were going to turn into a complicated matter with Rick back. Yeah, Shane became crazy but It wasn't his fault or Rick's, It was Lori's. Rick understood that Shane and His wife had something and he wasn't angry, he said: "Well, you were alone and I was in a coma. Atlanta was being destoyed while I was taking a long nap, don't worry about It". Last thing: Lori had problems with Shane, but he tried to Resolve things peacefully by talking, thing that Lori didn't let him do. These circumstances made me think about Lori, she's an awful wife and person even. She uses Shane and when he snaps because of her manipulating him, she tells Rick to kill him, His own Damn Best friend. I don't hate Lori, but she Is pulling a lot of the strings behind the group's backs.
@@emmypaasio9669I saw thatttt, wasn't it like in the newer season where Rick hallucinates Shane and Shane implied that Rick had to know the gravity of their new world and had the capability to live in it, using himself as a some sort of "life lesson"?
4:15 its not that she was loyal to Rick, its the way she ended her relationship with Shane. That is definitely not how to tie loose ends. There's nothing to commend how she just abandoned Shane like nothing happened at all. It's almost as if they're not mature adults that can handle an adult and mature conversation. She wasn't completely being fair to Shane. I'm sure if the two actually handled this responsibly, there wouldn't break which is the straw that broke the camel's back. Ultimately its Lori's fault for how Shane eventually started straying off. Personally I think Shane deserves the right to father or be a guardian to Judith
She wasn't in love with Shane. She was presented with the option and she took it for her safety and Carl's. That's all. The disdain for Shane came because of that. She sacrificed herself for a liar. That's what she thought.
The main thing I fault Lori on is telling Shane how she felt and that he wasn't the only one when she knew his mental state wasn't good. Then she got pissed at Rick when he admitted to killing Shane when it was her who told Rick that he as dangerous.
@@emilylee7220 An ounce of humanity irt to Lori overall or irt that specific situation??? Because Lori was objectively a bad person and a subpar mother post-apocalypse. Does it mean she deserves SA? Hell no, and anyone saying that can get thrown off a cliff. But the fact that she WAS SA’d isn’t an absolver, it doesn’t automatically make her NOT a bad person, and so far most of the comments here are simply calling out what she DID do, not blaming her for things she was a victim of.
Yaa its never ok just cause someone sexually assault you doesnt mean ur wrong is justified simple as that so stfu stop always bring SA emotions ...to show them victim... and create sympathy
The moment you wanna see how shitty Lori is. Rewatch her reaction to when Rick first reunites with Carl and Carl runs to him lol. But yeah season 2 when she was chirping into Rick’s ear that Shane’s dangerous and blah blah but her 1st place moment of most shitty character moment was her reaction to finding out Shane died 🤣 🎤 drop.
She was just shocked is all. I mean come on, they're in a zombie apocalypse and she fully exepts her husband to be dead due to his circumstances and Shane telling her. It took her some time to fully register what was happening in front of her.
I think that it would been Smarter to Just let Shane Leave the Group instead of Keeping him around and sending all those Mixed Messages. the whole conflict between Rick and Shane could have been avoided entirely if Shane Left but it seems like she Kept him around knowing exactly what would eventually happen and that just doesn't make a lot of sense to me. unless she wanted to be fought over like some kind of Trophy or something like that.
Lets see. Starts the situation that causes rick and shane to fight ending in one of them dying then hating the survivor. Selfish doesnt think things through fails to be a decent person. Being against the idea of teaching her kid how to be independent and help out in operations.
14:02 I like the video so far but I disagree with this take. Consent to sex is also consent to the RISK of getting pregnant. Engaging in risky behavior can yield outcomes that are less than ideal (no different than playing the lottery for example). Both Lori AND Shane are responsible for the pregnancy that she has as BOTH consensual participants engaged in the behavior. There are ways to negate or minimize the risk of risky behavior, but that is ultimately up to the people involved and how much they're willing to put in to minimize or negate said risk. Lori and Shane engaged in risky behavior and had a bad outcome. Lori had the option to take the pills, but ultimately chose not to. Whether you agree with those 2 actions is up to the individual and I don't think there's a bad argument for or against those 2 decisions.
Your belief assumes that sex is a requirement for pregnancy to begin with. It is not, in fact, a requirement for pregnancy. Impregnate. What does that mean? It means to get a woman or female animal pregnant. It is a verb that communicates an action *being done* to someone or something and not with something or someone. A woman can only get pregnant if she is inseminated by a male’s seed. This can be done during sex or independent of sex via artificial insemination. The point of all of this is to understand that *the primary agency in any pregnancy via intercourse falls on the male* and not the woman. A woman can consent to sex while also not consenting to pregnancy because the act of insemination is separate from intercourse in the same manner that other sexual acts are different than intercourse itself. To say that consent to sex is consent to the “risk of pregnancy” is like saying consent to sex is also the act of consenting to the risk of your gf pegging you without consent. It logically does not follow, at all. If your gf pegged you without your consent, despite the fact that you consented to sex itself, she’d be a rapist. Hence it is possible to consent to sex and not to being inseminated by a careless partner. This is why many women tell their partners not to impregnate them during sex. This isn’t some “take” it’s just how procreation works. This is actually something you’d cover when reading about the ethics of reproductive rights. And what I’ve just covered is one of the many reasons why the majority of bioethicists and moral philosophers are pro-choice. Consent to sex is not consent to pregnancy.
@TheRealCaptainGold I understand that, but in this particular case we're talking about two adults who chose to engage in this activity where pregnancy is can reasonably be a result. And, in this particular case, we don't know, nor have we seen, Lori outright tell Shane to not impregnate her. Pregnancy can still occur even if the man were to pull out, assuming they weren't using ANY protection on either side. Yes, there are methods of insemination without sex, but those instances only happen if you specifically opt into that, or if it's done against your will. But in general, engaging in sexual activity can yield a result that you don't want (depending if you want a child or not), but there's an assumption of risk that is accepted when both particpants engaging in that behavior commit the act UNLESS you outright tell your partner to do or not do something. As far as I know, Lori didn't tell Shane to not impregnate her, so I don't think the point works in this particular case. But, if there is a point where Lori did tell Shane to not impregnate her, then by all means let me know and I'll retract what I said since it would be on Shane at that point.
@@brendonleonard1733 She shouldn’t have to tell him that she doesn’t want to be impregnated, just like you don’t need to tell a person you’re with not to peg you without consent. It should be on Shane to ask for consent because he’s the one committing an action. This is how consent works. You presume you don’t have it until you do. Everything else you said doesn’t negate the fundamental truth that consent to sex is never consent to pregnancy or the “risk” of it.
@TheRealCaptainGold Except Shane isn't the only one committing the action. Lori participated in the action as well so pinning it all on Shane is illogical. Even if Shane were to have pulled out, pregnancy can still occur. Saying that you consent to sex but not pregnancy is no different than saying that you consent to playing the lottery but not losing money.
@@brendonleonard1733 She consented to sex, not insemination. Where am I losing you there? Your reasoning only works if Insemination is an inherent part of sex, when it isn’t necessarily. When we drive a car to a specific location, we consent to the risk that someone else **might** hit us, at no fault of our own. When they do hit us, on accident, we retain the right to potentially press charges and or file claims. To take your position on the matter would be akin to saying that we can’t press charges or file claims. If we don’t like car accidents, then we shouldn’t drive.
Under normal circumstances, sure that's reasonable, but these are not normal circumstances, this is the literal end of the world, trauma bonding is real.
@@theccc8318 still doesn't change the fact that her "dead" husband's body didn't even have enough time to cool down and she already on someone else's schlong
That's common, in fact some guys regularly make it a thing to visit funerals in order to pick up women. As weird as it sounds, grief is a pretty powerful emotion that can override even the most basics of logic and reasoning. You see this quite alot in the military, with stories of soldiers who went AWOL and were pronounced deceased, only to return home later to find their wives have remarried.
You must don’t like Shane too then. He broke the bro code and threw his and Rick’s friendship away because of a woman. Not to mention he tried to kill Rick like 3 times
Did you just say that sex is not a consent to pregnancy? That’s like saying that food is not a consent to nourishment. You didn’t actually answer the critics saying that Lori was irresponsible for getting pregnant. She chose to have unprotected sex with multiple men. That leads to pregnancies
Lori was a hot mess but the way that fandom has used her supposed “seductress” ways as a manipulative woman who drove Shane crazy really shows the underlying misogyny of this fandom. There are plenty of reasons to dislike her that don’t include absolving Shane of his shitty character and actions (which are not the responsibility of anyone but his crappy ass self)-and that’s not even mentioning the SA that most fans seem to conveniently forget about or pretend doesn’t exist. I really didn’t like Lori but honestly, wasn’t that mad at her in the end. She tried her best in her final moments and her death was brutal, finally confirming that she did at least care about her son (in spite of her many failings as a mother). I learned to let the resentment go because really, at some point it just becomes an excuse to hate her.
Lori doesn't deserve all the hate, but how she handled it caused some issues. She should have believed Shane wasn't lying and had a conversation with Rick about what happened before finding out she was pregnant
@@charlene4419 Shane and Lori didn't start their relationship AFTER Rick was supposedly dead. Probably they started while he was alive since they were that close. Both of them are wrong and I can understand they were trying to cope with grief in their own way but is still something, at least, dishonest
@@heloisaalmeida1243 How do you know that they started before Rick's ''death''? As far as I know there is no proof or no one has talked about it (I could be wrong here). I do think they should've told him at least earlier, but I guess they had their reasons, even if selfish
Well... she wasn't very helpful, she was indecisive, not that smart, wasn't a good wife and supportive of Rick. She just wasn't meant for the zombie apocalypse. That's just in my opinion.
As for the last point when she was talking to Rick, yes she was right though some of wha she said didn’t have to be said, it’s more so the way she worded her sentences she could’ve lightened it like he’s a danger etc, but the way it was worded and the tone kinda makes it look like she was just pitting them against each other even though she was right about him and everyone already knew it anyways💯
Lori doesn't deserve more hate than the Gorvernor, Negan, or Shane. This is the typical "i must hate the wife and must love men no matter what" situation. It happened to Skyler even when she was being logical and helpful. Anyone who uses their brain is going to understand Lori not wanting to give birth in an APOCALYPSE and die because of it (it's exactly what happened to her). Funny how no one ever talks about how Shane was also in the wrong for sleeping with his best friends wife, (Lori didn't force him to sleep with her, it takes two, right?). No one "manipulated" anyone, Shane was a grown ass man who knew exactly what he was doing, and made the wrong choices. NO ONE was shown "grieving" their families deaths, except Andrea and Amy when they were on the boat. Lori still had a mindset like the world was before the collapse, of course she didn't want her son around a gun. She treated Carl "like a child" maybe because... he.... WAS ONE??? She was in the wrong to tell Shane to stay but she didn't know he was completely obsessed with her. Let's not forget when he assaulted her at the CDC, was that her fault too? No she wasn't mad that Rick killed Shane, she was mad that Carl was involved, it's pretty clear in the scene. No she doesn't deserve this stupid excessive hate. You can deslike her, but she's not worse than cannibals, cold blooded murderers, or rapists. You "fans" need to watch the show again!
I think people have a tendency to hate characters who irritate them more than characters that do horrifying things but are entertaining and that they, for some reason, identify with
Well, then it says a lot about them because there's this ungoing thing of people making videos like: "Why everyone hates *insert female character*!", (I'm not talking about this one). It happens to every female character and it doesn't matter if the male leads are more irritating, example: Catelyn, Sansa and Arya (Game of Thrones), Skyler and Marie (Breaking Bad), Lori, Andrea, Sasha, Tara, Enid, Carol, Maggie, and even Beth (The Walking Dead), and then there's Pam, Meredith, Phyllis, Karen, Anglela (The Office), do you see a pattern here? People might say it's because of the "characters" being "badly written", but these characters are as flawed as the male ones from each of these shows i mentioned, the female ones always seem to hold higher standards, i don't know how on earth Michonne wasn't hated for some shallow reason.
Nah, Lori was terrible. Terrible mother, terrible wife, terrible friend, terrible driver. She was awful to both Rick and Shane. What special kind of idiot screws around in the zombie apocalypse with out using protection? She drive Shane crazy with her mixed messages and never had Rick's back.
So, by "terrible" you mean worse than a murderer? You might deslike her, but as i said, she was far from terrible. Lori wasn't a "terrible" mother, but she wasn't the best, there's no denying it, wanna know who was terrible? Alpha! She wasn't a "terrible friend" because she wasn't friends with anyone in the camp, but we have to agree that she was indeed a terrible driver. Again, she wasn't "awful" to both Rick or Shane, Shane was the one constantly being awful to Rick, Lori was simply a bad wife. Well, yes it wasn't *their* best idea to sleep around given the fact that they knew each other, but see how I'm taking BOTH of them accountable even though Shane was the one obsessed with her after Rick's return? She was indeed confusing towards Shane, but at the end of the day, he is responsable for his own decisions, crazy or not, he was the one choosing to kill his own best friend and puting others in danger, assaulting Lori and using her and Carl as an excuse to be stupid, (just like Walter White used his "family" as an excuse to do horrible things). If he was Rick's true friend, he wouldn't have slept with his wife in the first place, that's just screwed up between friends, (we already know she shouldn't have slept with her husbands best friend either).
•Found out Rick hid how hopeless the apocalypse made him feel because people looked to him for guidance and he wanted to give them hope, then started an argument to gaslight the living daylights out of him for “hiding things” while simultaneously hiding the fact that she shagged his best friend, found out she was pregnant by him, and was gonna abort it in secret. •Didn’t contribute anything to the group but had the audacity to boss people around and start an argument with Andrea for personally believing holding a gun was more important than washing dishes. •Refused to leave Shane alone even after ending things and even after he assaulted her. Told him to keep his distance, got mad at him for keeping his distance, told him to leave, begged him to stay when he was about to leave, all the while going behind his back at every turn to tell Rick that he’s dangerous and something needs to be done about him…when he was ABOUT TO LEAVE and she begged him to stay 😭! •Got upset with Rick for defending himself and handling Shane despite going on and on about how dangerous Shane was. Even broke down and started shedding tears. Man told her he killed Otis to get back to her so she knew exactly what he was capable of and still got upset. •Always lost track of Carl and never kept her eyes on him because she was always too busy trying to be everything but a mother. •Legit tried to stop Carl from running over to hug HIS DAD, then later stopped Carol from running over to save her daughter. •Left the camp to go look for Rick like she could handle anything on her own and crashed a car by hitting a parked zombie.
4:26 I’m not commending Lori because it was revealed that her and Rick were having marriage problems before Rick was shot. That wasn’t written frivolously. She was looking for an out.
great vid, i’ve been a lori defender since day one, she has major flaws just like every other character and gets hate because those flaws don’t mesh well for the circumstances she was placed into. other characters have a skewed morality but aren’t hated because it lends itself well to the apocalyptic circumstances
I love how AMC named an early episode “Tell it to the Frogs” while other episodes are named “Days Gone By”, “Too Far Gone”, and “The Day will Come When You Won’t Be”.
While there are a few TWD characters approaching pure evil, there aren't any perfectly good ones. They're all imperfect and flawed. I always felt people were overly harsh on Lori too.
She was a very toxic person who ruined not just the relationship with Rick and Shane but also with Carl. During an apocalypse where there are walkers that devour people she was more focused on her own drama than on her son. She didn't know where her son was most of the time because she had other people watching him. People who also had jobs to do and couldn't focus 100% on HER SON. I was surprised that Carl had survived that long during the first 2 seasons and it wasn't Carl that died instead of Sophia. She also wasn't the only one that could have told Rick about the relationship with Shane, Shane could have pulled Rick into a private conversation and told him what happened after he thought he was dead. They both had a relationship with Rick, as his wife and as his best friend, Lori wasn't the only one that could have told Rick about it. But what makes her relationship with Shane the absolute worst is the push and pull. The way she told him to stay and telling him he is a part of her family and then turning around and telling him to leave her family alone, to stay away, and that he is a liar.
although you're right about Rick not being in a hospital in Atlanta (he wakes up in Harrison Memorial Hospital, in King County), you're incorrect about where they lived. the Grimes family and Shane lived in King County, Georgia- not Cynthiana, Kentucky.
One thing to note, Rick was not in Atlanta at the hospital, he was at a hospital in his hometown in King's County which is miles away from Atlanta, so he was far away enough from the bombing to be okay. Also, in a short there was a surviving nurse at the hospital who attended to Rick and other patients who were still on life support.
Lori went wrong when she played two men against each other. That and when she couldn't keep her eyes on her child. Otherwise I would not have a problem with Lori, she's dealing with an impossible situation that none of us can even begin to imagine.
Shit take after shit take 🤣😂. Lori didnt tell shane or rick to do anything. They are two grown ass men responsible for their own emotions and actions. This is the most retarded fan base on any show i swear to fuck.
Rick wasn't a badass then, Shane was a prick. In the first scene of the show we learn this. We love Rick because he became strong and always had good intentions. We love michonne because she admired Rick, but she knew him in different circumstances.
people forget that - Loti saved Hershel's life by doing cpr after the amputation - She admits she's made mistakes with shane - admits she's messed up as a mother amd - takes a very different attitude towards Rick in the prison Definitely some redemption going on here
She thought her husband was dead. She was a widow with a small child. Her husband's partner wants to help her and keep her safe. He was a friend. What was she supposed to say, no, I'm in mourning? Let the walkers eat me and Carl.
Ok so I believe the reason why lori gets hate for being with Shane isn’t because it’s right after Rick. It’s because that was Rick’s best friend. He wasn’t like a normal friend he worked with Rick imagine you in heaven seeing that😂, Carl even looked at him like an uncle so yea they was close so it makes you think if Rick got into an normal accident would that have still happened, probably not but i understand there in a apocalyptic world & they think he dead so the only comfort she has is Shane the only person she knows. However I know some other people would just be a widow and go for someone else like some others did. Abraham got with Rosita. Pretty sure she wasn’t related to his wife in any way. You’re right about your point but I’m pointing out that this is most likely the reason she got hate & not rlly anything else👁️🗨️.
The problem with your opinion on Shane being dangerous is that everytime Shane did walk away Lori said things that encouraged Shane to continue his advancements. She overall deserves all the hate she earned
No she didn’t. She told him how she felt, but it was Shane who interpreted it as her saying she loved him, when she made it absolutely clear Rick was the one for her
The thing about her talking about Shane being dangerous to Shane is the fact that she is directly responsible for this outcome with how she treated him and then when Rick takes care of the problem she has the audacity to be disgusted as if she didn't want this outcome in the first place. A LOT of her actions came off as manipulative more than noble.
Or the fact that she walked around on a high horse as if she was like the backbone of the group. She couldn't watch her kid then got mad at others when he was in danger or hurt. She was not built for this world, she belongs at a book study circle with other hoity toity moms
If you were too look up a step by step list on how to manipulate two men to fight to the death, she followed every step. Then after all is said and done, she gaslit rick making him feel guilty. She's a total piece.
What too many people fail to see is while Shane volunteered to put his life at risk so he could save Carl, it was also to get back on Lori's good graces. He did it for Carl, but also to totally manipulate Lori. Rewatch those two scenes when she tells Shane he can stay... BOTH TIMES it is when she is in a very emotional state. The first time, it is after Shane gets back with the supplies. He WAITS until he hears Hershel say Carl's surgery was successful and he should be alright. Then, Shane goes to find Lori. He finds her ALONE, at Carl's bedside- her kid who has basically just been saved because of his actions- and HE KNOWS THIS. He takes up the entire doorway with his body language, and gives her this pleading look that says, " after all I just did, are you still gonna make me leave?"... What tf is she supposed to do in that moment? What is she supposed to say?! It is SO fucking MANIPULATIVE on his part, and he KNOWS it! He knows it so much, in fact, that the next day, when he hears that Carl is out of the woods and will make a full recovery, he AGAIN confronts Lori while she is alone, and he says to her that he heard Carl is going to be okay. She says yes, then turns to go into the RV. He stops her and asks her AGAIN if she meant it, because he knew how he confronted her the night before. Well, here she is again, in the same boat. She just confirmed to him that yeah, Carl would be alright, because of what Shane did for him. He manipulates her at every fucking opportunity! Always waiting until she is in a position where she is stuck and cannot tell him to leave. This is NOT her being wishy washy! You can look at her face, listen to her voice, and see her body language when she tells him that, "yeah, I meant it", that she really did not, but is caught off guard by him, once again. The ONLY TIME I ever saw her be wishy washy was in the very beginning when she could not make up her mind on whether Rick should go bring back Merle... and I feel that this was just poor decisions the writers made for her character. When she goes to talk to Shane when he is working on the windmill, that is NOTHING MORE than her trying to apologize to Shane for her part in the mess that was their fling, and to empathize with him about how she KNOWS how incredibly difficult all of this must be for him. It is nothing more than her trying to be a decent fucking human, going to him to apologize and take responsibility for her actions, and for hurting him. It IS NOT on Lori for how Shane misunderstands her words! Shane only hears what he WANTS TO HEAR! That is ALL on him... The only thing I can say about Lori losing track of Carl is that now that Rick is back, he is JUST AS RESPONSIBLE for his kid's safety and well-being! Shane even says something to him about him needing to talk to Carl about the gun he stole from Daryl, and Rick basically blows him off, because he is too busy trying to figure out what to do with Randall. Yeah, but place all the blame squarely on Lori... I'd also like to point out that CARL GETS BIT AND DIES on Rick's watch. Can't blame that one on her!! You are 100% right about Lori being pissed off at Rick for Carl having to put down a reanimated Shane (It was what started the downfall of Carl not being a kid anymore, and she did try to help keep some semblance of innocence for her kid in that fucked up world), but what else I noticed in her reaction is that if Rick had just told everyone else what Jenner told him at the CDC, Carl would not have been caught off guard when Shane got back up and came after Rick... he would have been prepared for it. Also, she HAD to realize that RICK HIMSELF should have known to IMMEDIATELY stab Shane in the brain after he killed him, and HE DIDN'T DO IT! We realize she had to know this, because the interaction in question between Lori and Rick happens RIGHT AFTER he tells the group that they are all infected and that he knew it and kept it a secret, because HE felt it was best that he keep that little tidbit to himself. She IS NOT WRONG for being angry about this!!!! We know that Rick and Shane saw for themselves that there were two undead security guards they killed that had not been bitten or scratched, when they were at the place where they were going to leave Randall, in 18 Miles Out. So, Rick did have what Jenner told him CONFIRMED and it is JUST as much Rick's fault for not making SURE Shane didn't reanimate (knowing what he knew!!), as it is Lori's for 'losing track' of Carl. Carl played a HUGE PART in what happened to himself, as well. He was sneaky, he didn't listen to ANY adults, and he was stubborn/hardheaded, and he did what he wanted, no matter what. I would think that being in a zombie apocalypse would QUICKLY cure a normal kid from sneaking off like he did, But not Carl. He never learned! I will say that the shit she throws Andrea's way for not helping out with the traditionally female roles was COMPLETELY UNDESERVED and fucking GROSS! I hated that shit SO MUCH! Andrea was a fucking HERO for pointing out everything Lori had and took for granted! I cheered when she told Lori off in that moment (Andrea also gets way too much hate, but that's for another post, lol). Initially, I could not STAND Lori! TWD quickly became one of my favorite shows, and I have watched it more times than I can count. The 1st 3 seasons are my favorites and I began paying close attention to the body language and interactions of the people I didn't like, from the eye a mother/parent, and quickly started catching things I never noticed before. I began to see Lori in a COMPLETELY different light. The only things I still don't like are how wishy washy she was when it came down to looking for Merle (writer's fault), and her seeing womens' roles as so fucking traditional and attacking Andrea for it. Otherwise, she was just trying to do the best she could. I respect where she was coming from, for the most part. She was not a character anywhere NEAR as deserving of the vitriol she gets, and it's DISGUSTING.
It is wrong because Shane is her husband best friend, Maggie husband was killed as well and she focused on her kid. Michonne was on the "watched" Rick died and decided to focus on her kids. Lori apologist are so funny. She was a horrible character and so was Shane.
@@deadpooldan9862 there really shouldn't even be a relationship to argue about cause as u said its a literal apocalypse and she's got a kid who she always looses, talk about priorities man?
@@mochi1854 two things: 1. It’s the literal apocalypse, conventional norms and what you shouldn’t or shouldn’t do in regular society, such as hooking up immediately after your spouse died, doesn’t hold because the world literally ended and people need things to feel safe and comforted, and 2. Carl didn’t tell her, obviously she wouldn’t know 100% where he’s at at all times
1:48 the only thing I’ll say about the relationship (cause it does get too much hate but I think some is justified) is that Rick wakes up on day 59 of the apocalypse, so just about 2 months. So Lori not only got over her husband being left in a coma to die, but also the destruction of her entire life, seeing people literally being ripped apart and eaten in front of her, and seeing an entire city get bombed, and she did all of that, in less than 2 months for the relationship to start. I think if when the show started they were in the beginning stages of a relationship people would have taken it a bit better, but as is I give their timeline at max a month of her grieving Rick/the world before they started getting together, which imo is a bit gross. Especially since when Rick does come back we do see that Lori truly does love Rick even though they were having problems before the world fell. No there’s no timeline for grieving, but I find it kind of hard to believe that’d you’d be okay enough with *everything* happening around you, while also having a young son who just lost his dad and his world, to be ready and able to have another relationship, while living in the middle of the woods with really zero defense.
Neither of your victim blaming examples make sense. A guy wearing a white supremacist shirt to a BLM rally and a guy shitting in someone's food are both the aggressors in their respective situations, the physical assault they get as a result is retaliation from the actual victims. Lori should've heard him out but she was also in a weird mindset after grieving her husband, seeing him come back to life, and believing she'd been emotionally manipulated. Anything Shane did to her that night past talking is 1000000% his fault and 0 blame is on Lori here.
100% agree with your bit on her treatment of Shane after Rick comes back and prior to him assaulting her. She had no right to tell him he couldn’t see Carl (and by extension Rick).
So, clearly some of you (not all) have a hard time listening (when it comes to my breakdown of Lori's SA at the hands of Shane Walsh.). I'm going to add this fourth clarification, because clearly three clarifications in the video was not enough.
Lori **is not** directly responsible for her SA. Despite her abusive and unethical treatment of Shane, prior to said assault, what happened to her **was not** justified. Shane is the one who is ultimately morally culpable for his actions. In the same light, it's not unreasonable to argue that she increased the likelihood that she would be victimized by treating someone else like total s***. It's not crazy to assert that she could've prevented that particular issue, given she somewhat incited the behavior in the same way a bully might incite a victim to go postal at a school. In fact, this is one of the reasons why people and experts want to reduce bullying. It leads not only to self-deletion but also to kids playing real life CoD at school - where their classmates are the OpFor. Bullying is clearly wrong but it can also incite even worse behavior.
Be that as it may, the moral blame is ultimately on the attacker (Shane in the case of this video). We can understand this to be certainly true while also acknowledging that people expose themselves to varying levels of risk -> and it's objectively true to state that if they get victimized, they are not morally culpable for it while also simultaneously being "guilty" of behaviors that may have increased their risk of being victimized in the first place.
Acknowledging this doesn't absolve the attacker from their guilt; it doesn't justify their retaliation. It merely teaches people to be better at risk management - and, in a sense, helps to save people from harm. Don't be a dick to people and your chances of harm are reduced. If you avoid knowingly dating serial killers, you might just avoid being killed by said serial killer. Bad people exist in the world. It would behoove anyone to learn how to minimize being victimized by these people. Being a victim doesn't magically absolve you of your responsibilities that you have to yourself. But, to clarify for the fifth time now, this does not mean the attacker is innocent or that they don't deserve proper punishment for their clearly unethical and or illegal actions. It does not mean that the victim deserves their harm. This isn't some dichotomy where we have to pick between these two propositions; they can both be true at the same time. And if i had to put a figure to it, a number out of 5, I'd say the attacker's culpability is a 5 and the victim (depending on the circumstances) is never more than a 0.1.
Are we clear now? That's five clarifications.
👍
if u had to clarify 5 times then maybe u didn’t say it in a clear way in the vid it’s fine to admit your choice of words was failing lol instead of being mad at us reacting to what u said
@@vampluvrgirl learn to listen better
@@sepitai or make a better video 🤗
@@vampluvrgirl
04:34 Plain English.
08:10 Plain English.
10:09 Plain English.
Perhaps you can enlighten me on how those words weren’t clear enough. Humble me. 🤗
But seriously. Listen better. This pinned comment isn’t for the majority lol it’s for the special minority with comprehension issues.
5 paragraphs and Lori still sucks. She's somewhere down there with Skylar from Breaking Bad no matter how much you defend her.
The biggest thing about Lori that annoyed me was how she walked around acting like The First Lady, which Carol called her as a compliment. Andrea was right during that kitchen argument. Lori walked around taking everything for granted, playing housewife and laying rules for everyone. Her main responsibility as a mother should’ve been protecting Carl but she instead kept losing sight of him and always asked others to take care of him while she caused unnecessary drama amongst the group.
Yes! Lori did barely anything and was constantly mad at people and I was like “ma’am your 10-13 year old son is more useful than you!”
Omg I was just about to say. I’m rewatching rn and her whole argument with Andrea basically telling her she needs to get back in the kitchen and help the women?? In an apocalypse?? When fighters are most definitely needed like hello???
@@joonbug1587 to be fair, Lori was right that Andrea did jack shit up on that RV. and the one time she actually shoots her gun 1. It was Daryl and 2. she misses
@@asinine- Andrea was making herself useful at least, which is more than I can say for Lori who actually crashed one of their vehicles. Plus, in Andrea's defense, she thought she was shooting at a walker given the way Daryl was walking, and Andrea couldn't tell from that scope it was him.
@dwnkaomwn3953 even if Daryl was a walker, using a gun to kill just one wouldn't be efficient. It's a waste of ammo and it'd only make a lot of noise and could have drawn out more
She literally didn't know where her eight-year-old son was ever pretty much she's horrible mother
I think he's supposed to be 10 in the show but your point still stands.
@@sorrenblitz805He looked all of 8! That’s how old I thought he was.
In any event, Lori never knew where the kid was and with her 1950s mentality, you would think the least she could do is watch her kid! She’s supposed to be the homemaker - her words - so take care of the home, Lori! She couldn’t even do that!
Tbf they did say that most of the women were doing all the domestic work like meals and laundry…. Carl was like 10 he shoulda known to stay put 😭😭😭 that car crash tho 😂
He's 12, but the point still stands.
If she cared about carl so much, why would she let him wander off multiple times? She let carl run off where he played with a walker that got dale killed, she let carl slip out of her sight when shane turned and carl was forced to kill shane, she blames rick when she should have been watching over carl in the first place.
@@CP4521 I think they changed his age later because CR shot up like a weed but I swear he was 8 when the show started. He looked all of 8 to me.
But regardless……Lori’s mothering skills sucked!
Rick gave Shane every bit of credit, respect and understanding a man can
Absolutely. But, Shane should've pursued a marriage-level relationship with Andrea once it presented itself. He should've stopped being a womanizer and gotten over Lori.
@@joeruiz4010He tried to leave multiple times but Lori kept pulling him back each time. The amount of confusion and suffering Shane went through mentally was insane. Each time Lori asked him to stay he was given a bit of hope that they could be together instead of just saying no, it wont happen, and that he needed to leave. Andrea was just some other woman, Lori was the woman he loved.
She's right Shane is dangerous. Her telling Rick that, after she told Shane to stay. Manipulating both of them to guarantee a death duel. That act isn't unjust hate, it's partly both.
The part that really gets me is when she gets shocked and mad at Rick when he tells her that he killed Shane.
Yeah like I get that telling Rick, “Shane is dangerous” she had all the right to say but she was playing with both of them and that lead to Dale and Shanes death (if I’m remembering correctly)
I don’t think it was intentional. I believe she felt Rick could solve the issue peacefully. Just like she thought Shane could coexist in the group with everyone.
I do think it’s a stretch to say she’s fully responsible for Shane wanting to kill Rick. That final showdown happened because of Shane. Rick didn’t want it and Lori didn’t want it. I think it’s better to say she exacerbated the issue.
@@TheRealCaptainGold Anyone can believe Lori thought anything, I don't factor that. Lori isn't responsible for others actions. She did too much putting Rick and Shane on course for a final conflict.
@@RigItRay
You’re right. She isn’t responsible for the actions of other people, yet you say she’s responsible for Shane wanting to kill Rick. You don’t see the issue? Influencing the outcome? Sure, why not. Totally responsible? No fam.
RANT INCOMING:
My issue with Lori is how she went about dumping Shane once Rick returned. It does make sense if she believed he ‘lied’ about Rick’s death, but let’s get into it anyway.
Firstly, what are the fucking odds Rick would wake up nearly 2 full months AFTER the Apocalypse and then manage to find his family? His family, mind you, that’s in an entirely different state from where he woke up.
Next Lori seemingly forgets literally everything Shane did for her and Carl. Yeah it’s poetic for him to say they saved him, and maybe that’s true emotionally, but he actually saved them, and lead the Quarry group to great success before Rick arrived.
She even has the audacity to pretty much say Shane lied about Rick being dead and blames him for taking her and Carl away. Again, not considering anything. He saved her life, he saved her sons life, he’s actually providing her with stability in the literal end of the world. She never comes across to the viewer like she understood the very real possibility that Shane actually thought Rick was fucking dead. Whereas we the audience see the horrific shit show that went down at the hospital when he went to get Rick.
So to me it feels like she uses Shane for survival because it’s convenient and logical, and once her husband returns she immediately gets rid of him.
Even if she didn’t want to stay with Shane after Rick returned, she should’ve had an adult conversation with everyone and tried to make things copacetic. Instead she antagonized the man who saved her and her son’s life until he went fucking crazy and tried to kill her husband.
I genuinely believe Shane was telling the truth to Rick when he said he never looked at Lori that way before the apocalypse. Then on top of it Lori really must have had a low opinion of Shane to take the position that if he lied about Rick’s death, it must have been malicious. That paints Shane in such a shitty light which is not what he deserved considering how much he did for her family.
Lori sucks
I agree with all of this 💯%
Frr
Facts Lori is trash
Rick didnt find them in a different state. Most of the show takes place in and around Atlanta. They dont leave Georgia until they head to DC and stumble upon Alexandria. But i agree with everything you said.
not to mention she wants shane to stay but when he tries to talk to her about almost anything she shits on him and makes him feel unimportant and that he doesn't deserve to be a part of the group or a part of her life
Yes as a mother I would say, at the end of the world with the dead walking, one month after your husband dies, your son should have been your only focus, not having sex in the woods with your husband best friend.
The guy who made the video act like a horny simp who throws rationality just for lust and acts like it's part of nature.
You can't discount that part of that might have been for Carl. She lived her life thinking she had a strong and righteous police officer to guide her son through his childhood. She then had that suddenly stricken away and a very obvious replacement right in front of her right when society crumbled beneath their feet.
@shooby9496 imo i don't think you can justify fucking your husband's best friend 1 months after him dieing
As a mother myself I agree !
At the same time, if your son really is in your focus, you will take that one guy you already know and let him protect you. If she hadnt slept with him, he would have forced himself on her (which we see later on). Thats the type of guy that would just have left them on the street if she turned him down. You could let that happen for good morals sake if you are alone, but not if you have a child to protect. Then most people in her place would have went along with it.
The fact she would go back and forth telling Shane not to leave then being like “get away from me” 🤦
don’t leave the group but stay the fuck away from my family, not a hard thing to
@@angela.8454 Except she also wanted Rick to "do something about" Shane, meaning she wanted to have them at each other's throat, guaranteeing that there's no way for those two to peacefully coexist in the same group. The best thing for Shane would be if he had left the group, giving him a proper chance to move on.
@@aprilbennett4161Exactly! And when Shane said he was leaving, Lori should have let him go but she doesn’t do that. She convinces him to stay and tells him she had feelings for him too! And this is in S2! No one has time for Lori and her manipulative games!
@@la214lashe does have feelings for him, familial feelings. Shane is like a brother to Rick and an uncle to Carl, Shane was the one who interpreted that as romantic when it clearly isn’t since Rick is there. Shane was family and she didn’t want her family to be broken or separated, so she told him to stay but to stay away from her
@@deadpooldan9862 I disagree. She had romantic feelings for Shane. That’s SWC’s interpretation too, and she would know best! 🤷🏾♀️
A loving wife! No sir. There was a flash back of Lori talking to a friend of hers. She said she was thinking of divorcing Rick because he didn't fight with her and was too nice.
What. People please? All she does is cause drama and issues. Because as you said, she is impulsive and short sighted.
She didn’t say what you wrote 😂 what a way to twist someone’s words so you can use them to prove your point lol. She never talked rudely about Rick, she only had a conversation with her friend about couple stuff, things that couples go through. And how do you even know what their life looked like before the apocalypse? Rick could have easily been the one who didn’t treat her right and in my opinion that would be more likely than the other way around. 😂
@@nikolaremesova4218Lori even said herself that she was acting shitty towards Rick 😭😭😭
@@nikolaremesova4218Ah yes so because Rick is a man, he's automatically more likely to treat Lori wrong. Like what??? Have you even watched the show?
She wanted to divorce rick because he didn't want to fight her and was too nice 😂 She is a DISTURBED character and I always hated her especially with that mentality!! If I married a man who didn't want to fight me and was "too nice",you bet your arse I am protecting that marriage
Michonne>>>> Lori. Michonne believed Rick could’ve been dead for over 6 years but also never gave up on him and eventually found him Lori would never
Michonne is black though🤮
michonne left her children during the whisper war bro😭 Shane took advantage of Lori as you can tell in the CDC
@@savvywavvy2934 womp womp
Well she did have that weird thing going with ezekiel. But that was after years, lori folded almost immediately
@@aakashbaliga1881that Ezekiel thing doesn't even matter imo. Its been years and the moment she caught wind of rick being alive she ran. The only thing I didn't like was leaving while her kids were facing such an existential threat
Lori went from being in love with shane, to making him stay away from her family, to forcing shane to stay when he was about to leave, to "my son and i are not your problem anymore", to " I'm sorry shane"
Lori wasn’t in love with Shane, he was a distraction and a good thing in a world gone to hell, had Rick been there Lori wouldn’t have looked at Shane for comfort
The relationship was fine. It was everything Lori did after said relationship's abrupt end. Pure aggrivation
She wanted Shane to disappear but always be her servant and protector but not part of her new life
He was family til Rick died and then came back
She wanted Shane to disappear but always be her servant and protector but not part of her new life
He was family til Rick died
She wanted Shane to disappear but always be her servant and protector but not part of her new life
He was family til Rick died and then came back
@@AntOfBobby lol !!! 😆
Nah, I gotta disagree. If you're happily married, then a few months later, she's sleeping with her husband's bestie ? lol She belongs to the streets ! When Rick came back, it wasn't obvious she was pregnant, so I'm guessing 3-4 months tops? So all it took was a few months (maybe weeks) for her to get over her dead husband? lol And to do it with Carl around ? Imagine if he had caught them ? Now, if a year or two had passed, it might be excusable, but a couple of months?? Would you have taken her back ? Not me he'll no give her to Shane personally I would've been doing everything in my power to hook up with Maggie + Beth !! A man can dream 😊
Kinda feels like there were two different writers for Lori and both had different ideas on what kind of character she should’ve been.
I agree. I know people can be wishy washy in real life but it feels unintentional here with Lori.
Maybe Lori as a character had a personality disorder. I'm not even trying to be funny, but these type of people do exist in the world. Imagine someone like that in this type of apocalyptic world.
There were! First season and first episode of s2 were written by the director of shawshank redemption. Everything after that was someone else bc the first directors ideas were "too expensive" 🙄 so she and all the characters were written by 2 different people! 3+ of you include the comics
@@Thebatcavepetfriendlybakerywhoa! Thanks for sharing! Didn’t know that
maybe she was bipolar
>Hates that Rick doesn’t fight back
>Doesn’t grieve her husband’s supposed death
>Gets with her husbands best friend
>Has unprotected sex in a zombie apocalypse
>Pushes Shane away when Rick returns without hearing him out
>Pawns her kid off to everyone
>Doesn’t want him to shoot a gun in a literal zombie apocalypse
>Tells Shane her family is “off limits” to him
>Continues to treat Carl like a child in a world where he could die at any moment
>Tells Shane to stay, giving him mixed signals
>Tells Glenn to get her a pregnancy test
>Finds out she’s pregnant, tells no one
>Asks Glenn for abortion pills
>This side quest almost gets Maggie killed
>Takes the pills and then vomits them out
>Doesn’t say shit to Rick, he finds out because of the pills
>Tells him Shane is dangerous
>Yells at Andrea because she wants to protect the group and not do traditional house wife things
>Is completely ungrateful of the fact her husband returned from the dead while everyone else piles on their losses
>Takes Maggie’s car (probably without asking idk)
>Crashes into the _only thing_ on a goddamn empty road
>Almost dies, and ends up losing a valuable vehicle
>When Rick tells her he killed Shane, she treats him like a monster
>Yells at Carl for clearing the infirmary at the prison (kinda justified)
>Even when she’s dead she continues to haunt the damn show with her ghostly presence
hell, yes, she deserves the hate. She is a terrible person, a terrible mother and a horrible wife. It’s one thing to act the way she does but who the hell has unprotected sex in an apocalypse where there are no meds or hospitals? In the woods where they could be jumped at any time? I probably missed a lot of other things, but still, Lori can rot in the depths of hell.
>Spells her name wrong
@@paradoxworkshop4659 uh her name isn’t spelled wrong? What do you even mean?
@@Cosmic_Espeon she Spells her name Lori
@@paradoxworkshop4659 yeah I know that, where did I misspell her name? Because I only say her name once and I spelled it right.
@@Cosmic_Espeon She, in the show, spells it Lori...which is the dumb hick version of Laurie, which is another reason for the hate...
I don't fault Lori for her relationship with Shane. Lori was literally the devil on Rick's shoulder telling him Shane is dangerous.
She was right though.
@@XThink-hl6gvyeah but she still got pissed when Rick says he killed Shane at the end of season 2, which is dumb asf
@@themoongateofficial
That don’t make her the devil, it makes her emotionally stupid lol
She was about to divorce Rick when he was shot, how long had she been flirting with Shane?
She didn’t save anybody, she is a predator without power and becomes a victim who drains those who love her
@@XThink-hl6gv What makes her the devil, the big ones. Telling Shane to stay, telling rick Shane is dangerous, and push and pull Shane's emo. It guaranteed the death duel.
I’ll be honest she definitely deserves at least 95% of the blame that she gets. The relationship between her and Shane is the only thing she doesn’t deserve hate for. The moment Rick came back she doesn’t tell him about her & Shane, tries to abort the baby, denies Shane from Carl & worst of all his own unborn child, mixed signals like “Stay away from my family” to “How can you try & abandon us like that?” Shane had the right to see & raise his daughter, & had he at least been able to have that a group lead by Rick Shane Daryl would’ve been a pretty difficult group to go up against in the future!!
Sure, if Shane were a normal person in a normal circumstance, then he’d absolutely deserve the right to see his biological child. But Shane has been nothing but dangerous towards the members of the group as soon as Rick returned. He disrespected Lori and her family (are people forgetting he sexually assaulted her in the cdc? lol) and has shown that he DOES not have the capability or capacity to lead the group and provide stability for a child.
@@naha2153 Did you watch those seasons or his video. As soon as Rick came back she treated him like he was a villain, like he was lying about Rick. He cared for both Carl & Lori but she doesn’t care for the sacrifices he made for them. It wasn’t til near the end of season 2 where she says THANK YOU for all he’s done. The WORST thing of all was her telling him that even if the baby is his he won’t get to see it! You don’t think all of that, being in an apocalyptic world & being denied your right to be a father would send a man over the edge??? How she treats him is what cracks him, then he’s broken.
@@Sun-Warrior1911
To be fair, Shane is still responsible for going over the edge of his own accord. Lori just added gas to the fire. We can empathize with Shane, we can understand him, we can feel sorry for him, but we can’t remove his culpability.
@@TheRealCaptainGold Lori doesn’t just pour gas she helps light the fire too. His fire was protecting Lori and Carl, & it was safe and properly maintained surrounded by a circle of rocks. As soon as Rick comes back she snuffs out that flame & destroys the circle too. She helps him start a new unprotected flame with all the things she says to & about him. As if everything he’s done wasn’t for them but for himself, the fire he claimed kept him alive was nothing but an illusion when it really wasn’t. She said everything she needed to get him away so she could create the illusion of a happy marriage. She set the table for him, & Shane came and ate. Just because Shane’s body is found at the starting point of the inferno doesn’t make him the culprit IMO.
If they waited 1 more month all of this would've been avoided I fully blame Lori for wanting to bang another man so soon after her husband dies I don't care what anyone says no man like Rick deserve to be cursed with such a wife who moved on so quickly like he was nothing to her she deserve hate for sure
As a society, we need to talk more about how being wrong about something isn't lying.
She doesnt think being wrong = lying, she was under the impression he just lied to get at her
Which isn't justified cause Shane backed off when she told him that her family is off limits, which shows Shane being a sensible person and doing as told/doesn't even argue and tried to leave bec he couldn't bare it.
@@xvoidxhunter2129 except he didnt lol
@@DeadX2 Yea but she doesnt know that. Its not out of the land of possibility someone would kill your husband during the apocalypse when they cant verify otherwise and then swoop in to cash in on some rebound poon
@@DeadX2 But she doesnt know that, and it isnt unreasonable to feel like he lied when he outright told her he died... Not "I didnt hear a heart beat cause they were shooting" not "They were bombing the hospital so it was loud" just that he died, he didnt say exactly why he couldnt hear his heartbeat till she confronted him about it.
Moreover its really not unreasonable to assume it anyway since realistically he could just lie about it to get some rebound action since there is no government body to document that stuff during the outbreak and she knew that. Shane is also fragrantly not above lying and manipulating to get what he wants
Nah she taking all this hate from the gates of hell 😂
*First, she gets mad at Rick for not yelling at her and being TOO GOOD a man. (before the zombie apocalypse).*
*First she tells Rick to go get Merle. Then she scolds Rick for it.*
*First she tells Rick that Shane is dangerous and must be delt with. Then Rick kills Shane in self defense...and Lori blames rick for it.*
*She volunteers to leave Carl at the quarry camp and go into the city...but Shane convinces her not to. Then Lori drives off the farm and gets into a car accident like an idiot and has no regard for her unborn child and also risks the lives of others who have to save her.*
She's selfish, self-contradicting, foolish, and has no concern for her son, unborn child, and husband, or anyone else in the group except for her Bad Boy Boyfriend, who she also ends up treating unfairly after Rick came back.
Although she did think Rick was dead, she didn't even wait one month before hooking up with Shane. FOUR WEEKS. Bruh. Clearly, she never loved Rick. She despised him for being the "nice guy" "good man."
Exactly. Well said.
She did love Rick and was faithful, the only thing was the world literally ended. Imagine losing everything and the only thing you have left is your son and your husbands best friend. Lori needed comfort, and Shane was the one who could give it to her, she genuinely thought Rick was dead, there’s nothing wrong with their relationship before Rick came back
Facts
@@deadpooldan9862 Is that the lie you tell yourself?
@@CirilloRuca how is it a lie? It’s the complete truth, even Rick understood that despite still being hurt about it
I mean it kind of seemed implied that this thing between Lori and Shane was brewing even before Rick was presumed dead. Not that they actually did anything, but the wheels were already in motion. I think for Lori it was just a matter of she didnt realize what she had until it was gone. Thats the only reason she jumped back to Rick so quick in my opinion. They definitely didnt seem like they were on the best of terms before the apocalypse.
The comics actually do kinda talk about how Rick's marriage isn't exactly doing too well, lack of communication, lack of emotional connection, they seem to mostly stay together for Carl.
Agreed. You don’t screw your dead husband’s best friend within three weeks of said death w/o there being some feelings already there! She was likely going to divorce Rick pre-ZA. I don’t think she was in love with Rick anymore, and she certainly wasn’t after he returned. She really wanted Shane but was too weak to say it. That’s why she cried when Rick killed him. She thought Shane would win the death match, which would have been fine with her!!
@@sorrenblitz805 Comic Lori and TV Lori are very different characters.
@@la214laI doubt that. She was afraid of Shane at this point due to learning about what he did to Otis.
@@SpencersRain She asked Shane to stay AFTER that incident. I think she wanted Shane and was upset Rick lost that fight! Even the actress confirmed that Lori didn’t realize how deep her feelings were for Shane until she learned he was dead!!
She’s also a terrified traditional southern house wife. She was also clinging onto Shane cuz she knew it would keep her and Carl safe. Lori was never a survivor on her own she was just never built for twd world. She was absolutely terrified the whole time. It just makes me feel bad for her because she was completely lost in the post-apocalyptic world. Some ppl were never gonna make it. 😫
FYI if you hate or love a character this means that actor or actress did their job.
Not really
I’d say that’s the case about 60-70% of the time. Sometimes things happen and characters end up being hated when that’s not the intention, either because of the actor/actress, or just the way the character was written/set up
She acts pretty much the same in prison break. I mean different script and character but I find the actress Sarah Wayne Callies acting very wooden
I don’t see Lori as loyal, just in need of protectors
She was as loyal as Rick was. But still, they weren't a happy couple before all that. The show starts by Rick telling this to Shane.
@@milaycastillo5723 People forget what kind of a man Rick was in Alexandria, though… he saw a woman he liked (Jessie Anderson) and who was in a toxic relationship, and found a way to get rid of her husband so he could get with her… just like Shane did.
@@tiabeaniesemotionalsupportdmon So true
@@tiabeaniesemotionalsupportdmon Rick and carl did that family dirty
You can be a loyal person in need of a protector
I think what I get from Lori is that it's clear from a flashback at the beginning of s2 plus s1episode 1 that Lori and Rick's marriage was on the rocks prior to the apocalypse. They probably would've divorced had that not happened. Lori even questions if she loved rick in that flashback. I think you are correct about what brought shane and her together. But she sighted part of her frustration with Rick in those flashbacks as him not Getting angry with her and not putting her in her place. Something Shane does in the first episode when she walks off in a huff which led to them making out. I think she was drawn to Shane because he was exactly what Rick wasn't at that point. Assertive, tough, etc. Perhaps if the apocalypse hadn't happened they would've been together if her and Rick divorced. Plus it was at least 5 weeks Rick was in that comma. Quite quick to immediately hook up with him. If I had to guess it probably started the night Atlanta fell. And based on how they interacted it was far more than just a fling. Basically the thing is I actually think she loved Shane but didn't wanna admit it. If Rick didn't come back she'd have stayed with him. Definitely.
I think as much as I dislike Andrea she was completely right about what she said to Lori in 18 miles out. Plus Shane probably would've recovered if he had the privilege of being Judiths dad. I mean it's not like the neighbors were gonna talk. Lol I agree her reaction to Rick's killing of Shane was mostly because of Carl but Rick needed her and she essentially emotionally abandoned him directly after he killed his best friend and brother for and largely because of her. That's why by season 3 their relationship is largely broken. And I think Lori definitely deserved the cold shoulder Rick gave her.
I feel like Lori would’ve gotten less hate if they kept her just long enough to complete a redemption arc of some sort. It was sorta teased at, with her and Rick slowly mending their broken relationshit and her admitting her faults and doing nothing to rock the boat. Had she received a proper redemption arc, it would’ve made her death more impactful than the shock value it provided.
That said, Lori did have feelings for Shane. It was confirmed by Kirkman. Those feelings are partially what fuels her self guilt. Although I think it was clear she loved Rick more. Him “dying” and returning served as the catalyst for Lori experiencing the cliche’ “you never know what you have until you lose it” motif.
@@TheRealCaptainGold Agreed. I also think Shane despite how unstable he was never actually wanted to Kill Rick. I think he either wanted Rick to toughen up to ensure the safety of Lori, Carl and the baby or wanted Rick to Kill him again to prove to him he was willing to do anything to protect Them. Jon Bernthal even wanted the script to be changed to have his gun empty when confronting Rick. Re-watching I have a different perspective of Shane. He wasn't really a monster. In fact I now get increasingly annoyed by Dale. While he had some legitimate gripes with Shane I feel like maybe Dale had no right to make assumptions about him. "I know what kind of man you are" ...But do you, really ? Maybe you could make a video on weather or not Dale was right about Shane? Also maybe another interesting video topic would be when you Think the group began looking more to Rick to call the shots rather then Shane? I think Rick ultimately became the true Leader of the Group during the search for Sofia as around that time Shane's mental health declined after Otis.
The only real problem with the relationship is how how fast they both moved on
Tbf it was two months after the literal apocalypse, not to mention her husband (Rick) was in a coma inside a hospital in a populated city. Not only that, but the group was in an entirely different state than them, so what was the likelihood of a single person getting out of an infected hospital in the middle of an infested city, and also finding his family in a separate state on foot without any clues?
@@Bureau_Of_Enigma_Affairs Wasn't two months. After Rick was left unattended, he couldn't have lived 3 days without water. Even with an IV. So, 3 days max in the hospital, 2 days at Morgan's and on that same second day he was already on the road to Atlanta. With no traffic it only took him a few hours to be within radio distance of the camp which was just outside of Atlanta. Shane and Lori were ALREADY banging because the opening scene of episode 2 was NOT the first time and that was on the SAME DAY Rick left Morgan's, day 5. She waited MAYBE 4 days. And that's being generous. From the time Shane left Rick to the time Rick found the group only 5 days passed at most. (And they weren't in a different state. Rick lived in King County, Georgia... The group was camped outside of Atlanta, Georgia. Rick from the comics was from Kentucky.)
@@dongeraci8599 In the show, it's revealed in Walking Dead (or Fear, forgot which) had doctor remained to provide medical attention to those in need who were all alone. Dave Erickson (a former showrunner for Fear the Walking Dead) claims that Robert Kirkman stated Rick had been unconscious for four to five weeks.
So it was roughly one month he was in the hospital after the apocalypse started, and he was in a coma a little longer than that before Walkers invaded.
@@Bureau_Of_Enigma_AffairsIt wasn’t two months. It was THREE WEEKS!
No one can convince me they didn’t have feelings for each other pre-ZA! They wasted no time getting together!
@@la214la 4-5 weeks; that's a month if not longer. And yes I agree that they definitely had feelings for each other beforehand, plus yk, trauma bonding, and all that.
Regarding Lori starting up a sexual (romantic?) relationship with Shane, I think she gets more hate for it because now we have a comparison. We just watched a spinoff where Rick's second wife and the love of his life did not engage in another romantic relationship for years after Rick's assumed death. And then went on a two-year search for him (that nearly killed her) on minimal evidence of his continued existence. The last shot of Michonne on the mothership was her about to go through a sea of walkers to find Rick. Keep in mind that Michonne and Rick were separated for far longer than they were ever together.
That versus his wife of at least ten years having a relationship with his childhood best friend less than a month after being told he was dead.
Yes, there is no set timetable on when a widow/er can start a new relationship, but most people would say a few weeks is way too short a turnaround. Even if, or maybe especially, when it's the end of the world and you have a young child that needs protecting and constant reassurance of safety. Woodland nookie time really needed to have taken a backseat to Carl and setting up provisions for survival.
Omg your right lol
I’m somewhat confused by the narrative I see in many comments that Lori was neglecting Carl or her duties at the camp by having short stints with Shane in the woods every so often. Am I forgetting something? Because it seems to have no relevance to the camps safety or Carl’s happiness, and if anything keeping Shane close kept Carl happy and protected. I also find the expectation that a grieving mother cannot find pleasure or comfort on her own time offputting.
@@SpencersRain I don't like Lori, but I think a lot of people have a lot of other issues and projection wrapped up in their hatred for Lori. There's this image of her just having non step sex with Shane while her child free roams, which isn't accurate or fair to her character at all. In the apocalypse I imagine a lot of people would be looking for pleasure anywhere, whether its drugs, alcohol or sex. That's how Maggie and Glenn started, but Lori is a mother and wife so there's this idea that she should sit at a widows peak mourning her lost husband until the end of time to be a 'good woman'.
Great video…although, I would disagree that Carl would be better off with Shane being a “father figure” because it’s not taking into account the fact Shane wasn’t an ideal father figure. There were plenty of viable “father figure” options at the camp. Also, Lori hooking up with Shane so fast completely ignores what Carl needed at that time. He didn’t need anymore confusion and their gross relationship, I would imagine, would have been extremely confusing.
My main gripe with Lori has always been her lack of consistency. You feel bad for the affair, so you cut Shane off completely and basically tell Rick to kill him. But, then you turn around and flip-flop when dealing with Shane directly and lead him on. Then you're surprised when what happened in the end happened.
Lori is a very realistic character and was portrayed really well, too. She made so many poor choices without considering the consequences and handled the results even worse. But at the very least she was self-aware.
So she knew Shane was dangerous but told him to don't leave the group and stay? Lol yeah she wanted to keep a bad dangerous man in the group.. why?
She told him that before he did anything to make her think he was dangerous though. She told him to stay before he was getting angry about the weapons and the barn and before he wanted to kill Randall. The time she says shane is dangerous is after rick kills Randall's group which is after shane has been causing tension.
@@mappingshaman5280he litteraly tried to rape Lori (he was drunk but still)
And was saying crazy stuff he adapted faster though
Those are still reasons and she could of told him to leave and he wouldn’t of died
She’s just a bitch who can’t make up her mind she’s manipulative she played both rick and Shane she even admits it
Because women love being in danger, its a perfect mirror of the real world, they always love bad guys around 😂, ever wonder why most good guys are still single?
I also think she was trying to antagonize both Rick and Shane to fight each other because she wanted the man who won to look after herself, her son, and her unborn child.
I don't think she cared about either but wanted a strong man to take care of her and lead the group but didn't want both of them around.
@@Bureau_Of_Enigma_Affairs exactly lol that’s her whole character
People should never feel bad for hating a character even if it’s for the most trivial reason. This is fiction after all.
Idk. Depends on why you hate them. It’d be pretty bad to hate a black character just because they’re black lol
Some of you guys are talking about how Lori was evil for putting notions in Rick’s ear, but what I see is a wife warning her husband of what she knows and feels concerning the danger of his best friend. Also, Dale needs to hold some responsibility here… he saw Shane holding Rick in his sights right after Rick showed up at the Quarry Camp. He should have said something to Rick IMMEDIATELY. He figured out that Shane killed Otis and said nothing, and Shane outright confronted Dale over the guns out in the swamp. He could SEE Shane was completely unhinged and was slipping even farther, yet he kept that shit to himself… save for when he told Lori about it. That’s another reason why she talked to Rick and told him Shane was dangerous, because Dale even said it to her outright (he should’ve gone to Rick and told him, though).
Really. Big facts. Just putting all the blame on lori because the shane simps will justify any evil action he does. Shane was responsible for the farm falling in the first place. Lori isnt responsible for anything except her own actions. People just like to act as if its entirely loris fault.
@@dwayneb1047 You are so correct.
Looks like you’re the only normal and reasonable person in this comment section full of weird and loser tv show fans lol
You are very right about Dale, but very wrong about Lori.
If Lori was that concerned about Shane she should have just let him leave like he wanted to. Instead she told the guy of who she's all so scared of to stay while also making her husband paranoid about that same guy. That's not a wife warning a husband, that's a wife setting up a death match.
@@gilgameshkingofheroes5903 I don’t think you’re seeing the entire picture here. Or maybe you just haven’t looked deeper than surface level. Let me explain:
Lori WAS going to let Shane leave… until Shane realized he could use the fact that *he* helped get the surgical supplies that saved Carl, in his favor. Right after Hershel is finished with Carl’s operation, Lori is alone with her son. Shane goes to the room, taking up the ENTIRE DOORWAY with his body, and has this look on his face that says, “After all I just did, you’re still gonna make me leave? I just risked my life to save your son.” Even without having to say *a single word* , he is able to manipulate and guilt Lori into saying he can stay, while his body taking up the doorway closes off any way for her to physically leave the situation. Then, the very next morning, he does it *AGAIN* when he is exiting the RV and Lori is trying to enter. Hershel had just said that Carl was going to pull through, and Shane heard that shit. He tells her that he heard Carl was going to be alright, forcing her to admit it. Then he asks her if she meant it when she said he could stay. The ONLY REASON he did that is because he KNEW he’d manipulated her into it the night before. Watch this scene again, look at her face, and see how she answers him in this moment. A person without sight could tell that this was making her hella uneasy, and when she was like, “yeah, I meant it”, it was because Shane had just used THAT situation to manipulate her even further (by forcing her to say out loud, in so many words, that her kid was going to live because of him). Again, he does this when they are ALONE.
Lori would not have told him to stay. But he cornered her multiple times and manipulated the shit out of her, Carl, and the entire situation. This is not her setting up a ‘death match’. This is emotional warfare… on SHANE’S part.
I don’t think Lori loyal was ride or die for/to Rick. Before everything happened they were fighting nonstop. She didn’t even cry when Shane told her Rick was shot. They definitely were headed to a divorce before everything took place. In my opinion Michonne was the opposite and everything that Lori was not. Although I don’t blame Lori for the affair it’s crazy to me that she didn’t even wait a month before getting with him meanwhile Michonne when almost ten years without being with anyone. I couldn’t even picture Michonne and Daryl together cause they were loyal to Rick. Unlike Lori and Shane. I feel like something was going on with Lori and Shane before Rick was shot and the outbreak happened cause they started up pretty quick after they assumed Rick died. Neither of them were truly loyal to Rick in my opinion.
💯
No offense but you’re wrong because of one reason: the world went to hell. This isn’t like if Rick had just “died” in the line of duty, the world literally ended and Rick, as far as they knew, was 100% guaranteed dead, so that grief, coupled with the world ending, made them seek solace and comfort in each other, and when Rick came back, Lori ended the relationship because her husband was back. She was faithful to Rick and loved him, but she also couldn’t deny that Shane made her feel something, but it wasn’t love, just comfort.
I think you skipped over the fact that I said I don’t blame them for the affair. But what is crazy she and Shane started the affair not even a few weeks after they start Rick was dead. And what you’re saying isn’t all the way accurate for 1 both Shane and Lori hinted out through both seasons that something more was always happening between them which is why it was so much easier for them to start their affair and 2 Lori been pitting Rick and Shane since Rick came back and then got mad when Rick killed Shane which is why they were basically divorced in season 3. Lori didn’t even grief the presumed death of Rick yes the world was started to end but we seen Rick grieve her death for a long while before Michonne shoot even with Jackie. The second time Rick was presumed dead Michonne didn’t even think of looking in Daryl’s way like that and even Daryl had a small crush on Michonne in season 4. They both were loyal to Rick so much so that the moment that there was a small of hint of Rick being alive both Michonne and Daryl went to go look for him.
@@embracethymelanin_6518 the thing is, the world literally ended around them. The world ended and Rick died and all they had of their old lives were each other, so it makes sense they’d seek solace in each other, that they’d start something that’s meant to be more about forgetting than love. Rick even understands this, which is why he doesn’t hate them for the affair because they genuinely thought he was dead and the world had gone to shit. You can bring up Michonne all you want, but that genuinely doesn’t apply here because she was already used to this world, while Lori and Shane were just thrown into it and had no idea how to navigate it. Keep in mind Lori ended it when Rick came back and didn’t give any hints she wanted to start it back up, she just talked about it in past tense and thanked Shane for saving her and Carl, something Shane interpreted as romantic when it wasn’t. Ultimately it’s Shane who decided he deserved Lori when he didn’t, and that’s what led to Rick killing him. He even regretted it happened and would have taken it back if he could, he literally told Rick this.
What happened before the apocalypse is mostly irrelevant in this context. The entire franchise goes out of its way to make that point. Everything changed and she still stuck by him after realizing he was alive. These types of situations usually make people realize what's really important. She just couldn't stop being a people pleaser or making snap decisions and that's what her issue was.
Also, comparing one person to another and judging everyone by the standard of one person makes no sense. Everyone reacts differently to different situations, especially traumatic ones.
Lori and Shane should’ve just came clean to Rick in the beginning
But after 5 weeks and carls happy n cheerful and she’s all loved up with new fella , in less than 2 months
People seem to forget Lori only told Rick that Shane was dangerous after Dale told her that he had killed Otis. Dale changed her mind about him and guess what? They were both right. Shane's mentality is NOT Lori's responsibility, he did all that to himself, and his fans don't wanna understand that he was a grown ass man responsible for his own actions.
It takes TWO to tango, you all hate Lori but love Shane for doing the same, bunch of hypocrites.
THANK YOU
If she had basically said "Look Shane, I'm sorry but Rick is alive and he's back. We can't be together anymore." That would have solved so many issues. Instead she accused him of lying, and then began to manipulate both men into hating each other. She didn't deserve the SA, but she was a terrible person in those instances. Also, yeah, constantly losing sight of her son and never knowing where the hell he was at any point in time.
To be fair, it did kind of look like Shane was lying. He literally told her Rick was 100% dead, only for Rick to come back. It does look like he lied. As for putting them against each other, she didn’t. She told Rick Shane was dangerous because Rick couldn’t see that, unlike Dale. If it had come from Dale, it would have been ok, right? That’s stupid. As for Carl, it’s hard for parents to 100% know where their kids are at all times, especially on a farm, so you can’t fault Lori for Carl either lying or disobeying her
@deadpooldan9862 Shane is portrayed as a good guy in the beginning. He did what he could to maybe protect Rick, but the military were going room to room, killing people. He's completely justified believing Rick is dead.
She literally does drive a wedge between them. If Rick and Shane had just sat down and hashed things out, they might have been able to get back to some semblance of friendship, and kept Shane from literally going crazy. But instead she starts telling Rick he's dangerous while manipulating Shane from the other side.
No one expects a parent to 100% always know, but Carl getting separated DURING AN APOCALYPSE happens way too fucking many times. After the first time, you'd think Laurie would be a bit more attentive, but she comes across rather neglectful.
@@NoodleKeeperYeah, he moved the bed we see it's blocking Rick's door. Besides, he couldn't tell he was really dead, his pulse was so weak and there was the gunshots in the background. Shane was a good guy in the beginning.
@charlespc Exactly. To say he left Rick for dead fails to recognize that Rick basically WAS dead. He was in a coma in a hospital that would eventually lose power and there were soldiers going door to door killing people. Shane MIGHT have been able to get Rick out of there, but more likely than not they would have both died if he tried.
@@deadpooldan9862 Man, Rick was on a coma without food and nutrients, walkers and the army were killing everyone and the only thing that was protecting Rick was a goddamn door and the bed blocking It. He Made an assumption because It was 100% logically impossible for Rick to survive, Shane didn't know and was happy for him to be alive but he knew that things with Lori were going to turn into a complicated matter with Rick back. Yeah, Shane became crazy but It wasn't his fault or Rick's, It was Lori's. Rick understood that Shane and His wife had something and he wasn't angry, he said: "Well, you were alone and I was in a coma. Atlanta was being destoyed while I was taking a long nap, don't worry about It".
Last thing: Lori had problems with Shane, but he tried to Resolve things peacefully by talking, thing that Lori didn't let him do. These circumstances made me think about Lori, she's an awful wife and person even. She uses Shane and when he snaps because of her manipulating him, she tells Rick to kill him, His own Damn Best friend. I don't hate Lori, but she Is pulling a lot of the strings behind the group's backs.
Hooking up with your husbands best friend is never okay even if you think he’s dead.
Karma is a bitch they both ended up zombies 😂
We could’ve got 3-4 more seasons outta Shane if it wasn’t for her.
Heh.. Yeah.. Loris fault the writers of the show decided to kill off Shane, a moment shaping Rick and makes him a man of the apocalypse
Shane probably could’ve made it to the negan war, and probably die there trying to kill him
Thank God for that
@@emmypaasio9669that was one of the few things that followed the comics.
@@emmypaasio9669I saw thatttt, wasn't it like in the newer season where Rick hallucinates Shane and Shane implied that Rick had to know the gravity of their new world and had the capability to live in it, using himself as a some sort of "life lesson"?
4:15 its not that she was loyal to Rick, its the way she ended her relationship with Shane. That is definitely not how to tie loose ends. There's nothing to commend how she just abandoned Shane like nothing happened at all. It's almost as if they're not mature adults that can handle an adult and mature conversation. She wasn't completely being fair to Shane. I'm sure if the two actually handled this responsibly, there wouldn't break which is the straw that broke the camel's back. Ultimately its Lori's fault for how Shane eventually started straying off.
Personally I think Shane deserves the right to father or be a guardian to Judith
She wasn't in love with Shane. She was presented with the option and she took it for her safety and Carl's. That's all. The disdain for Shane came because of that. She sacrificed herself for a liar. That's what she thought.
@@milaycastillo5723 I never said she was in love with Shane, they had a relationship, that much is fact that you can't deny.
@cinnamoonfang6104 all I'm saying is she didn't love him. Maybe that's why she was quick to abandon him when Rick appeared.
"Did Lori Deserve the Hate?" YES
No.
@@nikolaremesova4218 Yes.
Yes she deserves almost all of the hate
@nikolaremesova4218 yes
Rick and Lori would have had problems with or without the end of the world.
The main thing I fault Lori on is telling Shane how she felt and that he wasn't the only one when she knew his mental state wasn't good. Then she got pissed at Rick when he admitted to killing Shane when it was her who told Rick that he as dangerous.
I didn’t have that big of a problem with Lori until her reaction when she found out Rick had to kill Shane
That was a normal reaction tbh, every person is different
@@nikolaremesova4218 No...? When SPECIFICALLY she warned him about being mentally unstable. Dude, stop the copium. It's embarrassing.
Her reaction wasn't just about Rick killing Shane, it was about Carl being the one to put Shane down. Watch that scene again, but properly.
@@Espritlumiere Thank you finally someone said it.
Sexual assault is never okay. It doesn't matter what was going on between them, giving any excuses to it is disgusting.
Yes! Thank you! I’m desperately scrolling through these comments trying to find an ounce of humanity, it’s like a war zone down here.
@@emilylee7220 An ounce of humanity irt to Lori overall or irt that specific situation??? Because Lori was objectively a bad person and a subpar mother post-apocalypse. Does it mean she deserves SA? Hell no, and anyone saying that can get thrown off a cliff. But the fact that she WAS SA’d isn’t an absolver, it doesn’t automatically make her NOT a bad person, and so far most of the comments here are simply calling out what she DID do, not blaming her for things she was a victim of.
Yaa its never ok just cause someone sexually assault you doesnt mean ur wrong is justified simple as that so stfu stop always bring SA emotions ...to show them victim... and create sympathy
@@bluebay1031bad person deserve SA both are bad so it doent matte...r
Noone in these comments disagrees, thanks for pointing out the obvious
The moment you wanna see how shitty Lori is. Rewatch her reaction to when Rick first reunites with Carl and Carl runs to him lol. But yeah season 2 when she was chirping into Rick’s ear that Shane’s dangerous and blah blah but her 1st place moment of most shitty character moment was her reaction to finding out Shane died 🤣 🎤 drop.
She was just shocked is all. I mean come on, they're in a zombie apocalypse and she fully exepts her husband to be dead due to his circumstances and Shane telling her. It took her some time to fully register what was happening in front of her.
@@buffbread4226 I call bullshit on that 😂
@@buffbread4226 I’ve seen that look on someone’s face in reality. Trust me, it ain’t shock.
I think that it would been Smarter to Just let Shane Leave the Group instead of Keeping him around and sending all those Mixed Messages.
the whole conflict between Rick and Shane could have been avoided entirely if Shane Left but it seems like she Kept him around knowing exactly what would eventually happen and that just doesn't make a lot of sense to me. unless she wanted to be fought over like some kind of Trophy or something like that.
She's like a lady on Real house wives of X, Y or Z just making drama for drama not thinking any real consequences would happening
Lets see. Starts the situation that causes rick and shane to fight ending in one of them dying then hating the survivor. Selfish doesnt think things through fails to be a decent person. Being against the idea of teaching her kid how to be independent and help out in operations.
14:02 I like the video so far but I disagree with this take. Consent to sex is also consent to the RISK of getting pregnant.
Engaging in risky behavior can yield outcomes that are less than ideal (no different than playing the lottery for example). Both Lori AND Shane are responsible for the pregnancy that she has as BOTH consensual participants engaged in the behavior. There are ways to negate or minimize the risk of risky behavior, but that is ultimately up to the people involved and how much they're willing to put in to minimize or negate said risk.
Lori and Shane engaged in risky behavior and had a bad outcome. Lori had the option to take the pills, but ultimately chose not to. Whether you agree with those 2 actions is up to the individual and I don't think there's a bad argument for or against those 2 decisions.
Your belief assumes that sex is a requirement for pregnancy to begin with. It is not, in fact, a requirement for pregnancy.
Impregnate. What does that mean? It means to get a woman or female animal pregnant. It is a verb that communicates an action *being done* to someone or something and not with something or someone. A woman can only get pregnant if she is inseminated by a male’s seed. This can be done during sex or independent of sex via artificial insemination.
The point of all of this is to understand that *the primary agency in any pregnancy via intercourse falls on the male* and not the woman. A woman can consent to sex while also not consenting to pregnancy because the act of insemination is separate from intercourse in the same manner that other sexual acts are different than intercourse itself.
To say that consent to sex is consent to the “risk of pregnancy” is like saying consent to sex is also the act of consenting to the risk of your gf pegging you without consent. It logically does not follow, at all. If your gf pegged you without your consent, despite the fact that you consented to sex itself, she’d be a rapist. Hence it is possible to consent to sex and not to being inseminated by a careless partner. This is why many women tell their partners not to impregnate them during sex. This isn’t some “take” it’s just how procreation works.
This is actually something you’d cover when reading about the ethics of reproductive rights. And what I’ve just covered is one of the many reasons why the majority of bioethicists and moral philosophers are pro-choice. Consent to sex is not consent to pregnancy.
@TheRealCaptainGold I understand that, but in this particular case we're talking about two adults who chose to engage in this activity where pregnancy is can reasonably be a result. And, in this particular case, we don't know, nor have we seen, Lori outright tell Shane to not impregnate her.
Pregnancy can still occur even if the man were to pull out, assuming they weren't using ANY protection on either side. Yes, there are methods of insemination without sex, but those instances only happen if you specifically opt into that, or if it's done against your will.
But in general, engaging in sexual activity can yield a result that you don't want (depending if you want a child or not), but there's an assumption of risk that is accepted when both particpants engaging in that behavior commit the act UNLESS you outright tell your partner to do or not do something. As far as I know, Lori didn't tell Shane to not impregnate her, so I don't think the point works in this particular case. But, if there is a point where Lori did tell Shane to not impregnate her, then by all means let me know and I'll retract what I said since it would be on Shane at that point.
@@brendonleonard1733
She shouldn’t have to tell him that she doesn’t want to be impregnated, just like you don’t need to tell a person you’re with not to peg you without consent. It should be on Shane to ask for consent because he’s the one committing an action. This is how consent works. You presume you don’t have it until you do.
Everything else you said doesn’t negate the fundamental truth that consent to sex is never consent to pregnancy or the “risk” of it.
@TheRealCaptainGold Except Shane isn't the only one committing the action. Lori participated in the action as well so pinning it all on Shane is illogical. Even if Shane were to have pulled out, pregnancy can still occur.
Saying that you consent to sex but not pregnancy is no different than saying that you consent to playing the lottery but not losing money.
@@brendonleonard1733
She consented to sex, not insemination. Where am I losing you there? Your reasoning only works if Insemination is an inherent part of sex, when it isn’t necessarily.
When we drive a car to a specific location, we consent to the risk that someone else **might** hit us, at no fault of our own. When they do hit us, on accident, we retain the right to potentially press charges and or file claims. To take your position on the matter would be akin to saying that we can’t press charges or file claims. If we don’t like car accidents, then we shouldn’t drive.
Lori was just a 304 in an apocalyptic world
Lori grimes was survived from apocalypse from July 2010 to June 2011 since Outbreaks begans July 2010 so Lori grimes was dies on june 22 2011 on 3×04
@@Cindykimberlymariannapoe haha thanks man that’s awesome
She sure moved on pretty quick….
And who the hell in their right mind hooks up with their dead best friend’s girl, talk about disrepect.
Under normal circumstances, sure that's reasonable, but these are not normal circumstances, this is the literal end of the world, trauma bonding is real.
the world ended. your standards of what’s normal and moral don’t hold up in that type of world
@@theccc8318 still doesn't change the fact that her "dead" husband's body didn't even have enough time to cool down and she already on someone else's schlong
Clown 😂🤡
@@theccc8318 Trauma bonding didn't have to be fugging, the chick's literally got a kid and in an apocalypse. Talk about priorities.
She is the one who poured gasoline into the Rick v Shane situation. Yes.
Shane did that himself 😂
The only two reasons I don’t like the idea of Shane and Lori is because she moved on quite fast and got with her husband’s best friend
That's common, in fact some guys regularly make it a thing to visit funerals in order to pick up women. As weird as it sounds, grief is a pretty powerful emotion that can override even the most basics of logic and reasoning. You see this quite alot in the military, with stories of soldiers who went AWOL and were pronounced deceased, only to return home later to find their wives have remarried.
Yeah, and he got together with his best friend’s wife
You must don’t like Shane too then. He broke the bro code and threw his and Rick’s friendship away because of a woman. Not to mention he tried to kill Rick like 3 times
Lori deserved almost all the bullshit Skylar got. I totally agree with you, my daughter and I said the same thing.
Did you just say that sex is not a consent to pregnancy? That’s like saying that food is not a consent to nourishment.
You didn’t actually answer the critics saying that Lori was irresponsible for getting pregnant. She chose to have unprotected sex with multiple men. That leads to pregnancies
By your logic no one should complain about car accidents. You're low iq and a pdf file
Lori was a hot mess but the way that fandom has used her supposed “seductress” ways as a manipulative woman who drove Shane crazy really shows the underlying misogyny of this fandom. There are plenty of reasons to dislike her that don’t include absolving Shane of his shitty character and actions (which are not the responsibility of anyone but his crappy ass self)-and that’s not even mentioning the SA that most fans seem to conveniently forget about or pretend doesn’t exist. I really didn’t like Lori but honestly, wasn’t that mad at her in the end. She tried her best in her final moments and her death was brutal, finally confirming that she did at least care about her son (in spite of her many failings as a mother). I learned to let the resentment go because really, at some point it just becomes an excuse to hate her.
White knight some more 😂
Lori doesn't deserve all the hate, but how she handled it caused some issues. She should have believed Shane wasn't lying and had a conversation with Rick about what happened before finding out she was pregnant
yes she was sociopathic pitting two best friends against one another
bro what??? She isn't sociopathic, I think that's far fetched, you have to meet certain, multiple criteria for that
Yeah yeah and shane isn't wrong for sleeping with dead best friend wife right?
@@heloisaalmeida1243 they both thought he was dead for christ sake!! I don't blame them, it was also good for Carl cause he had a father figure
@@charlene4419 Shane and Lori didn't start their relationship AFTER Rick was supposedly dead. Probably they started while he was alive since they were that close. Both of them are wrong and I can understand they were trying to cope with grief in their own way but is still something, at least, dishonest
@@heloisaalmeida1243 How do you know that they started before Rick's ''death''? As far as I know there is no proof or no one has talked about it (I could be wrong here). I do think they should've told him at least earlier, but I guess they had their reasons, even if selfish
no one will ever convince me that Lori didn’t deserve every ounce of hate she got.
Well... she wasn't very helpful, she was indecisive, not that smart, wasn't a good wife and supportive of Rick. She just wasn't meant for the zombie apocalypse. That's just in my opinion.
Come on.. we all know she does... lol but we gonna watch the video anyway to remind us why we hated her.
As for the last point when she was talking to Rick, yes she was right though some of wha she said didn’t have to be said, it’s more so the way she worded her sentences she could’ve lightened it like he’s a danger etc, but the way it was worded and the tone kinda makes it look like she was just pitting them against each other even though she was right about him and everyone already knew it anyways💯
I agree with your points in the video, and you’ve done an amazing job with analyzing the whole thing. 😀👍
Lori doesn't deserve more hate than the Gorvernor, Negan, or Shane. This is the typical "i must hate the wife and must love men no matter what" situation. It happened to Skyler even when she was being logical and helpful.
Anyone who uses their brain is going to understand Lori not wanting to give birth in an APOCALYPSE and die because of it (it's exactly what happened to her).
Funny how no one ever talks about how Shane was also in the wrong for sleeping with his best friends wife, (Lori didn't force him to sleep with her, it takes two, right?).
No one "manipulated" anyone, Shane was a grown ass man who knew exactly what he was doing, and made the wrong choices.
NO ONE was shown "grieving" their families deaths, except Andrea and Amy when they were on the boat.
Lori still had a mindset like the world was before the collapse, of course she didn't want her son around a gun.
She treated Carl "like a child" maybe because... he.... WAS ONE???
She was in the wrong to tell Shane to stay but she didn't know he was completely obsessed with her.
Let's not forget when he assaulted her at the CDC, was that her fault too?
No she wasn't mad that Rick killed Shane, she was mad that Carl was involved, it's pretty clear in the scene.
No she doesn't deserve this stupid excessive hate. You can deslike her, but she's not worse than cannibals, cold blooded murderers, or rapists. You "fans" need to watch the show again!
I think people have a tendency to hate characters who irritate them more than characters that do horrifying things but are entertaining and that they, for some reason, identify with
Well, then it says a lot about them because there's this ungoing thing of people making videos like: "Why everyone hates *insert female character*!", (I'm not talking about this one).
It happens to every female character and it doesn't matter if the male leads are more irritating, example: Catelyn, Sansa and Arya (Game of Thrones), Skyler and Marie (Breaking Bad), Lori, Andrea, Sasha, Tara, Enid, Carol, Maggie, and even Beth (The Walking Dead), and then there's Pam, Meredith, Phyllis, Karen, Anglela (The Office), do you see a pattern here? People might say it's because of the "characters" being "badly written", but these characters are as flawed as the male ones from each of these shows i mentioned, the female ones always seem to hold higher standards, i don't know how on earth Michonne wasn't hated for some shallow reason.
Nah, Lori was terrible. Terrible mother, terrible wife, terrible friend, terrible driver. She was awful to both Rick and Shane. What special kind of idiot screws around in the zombie apocalypse with out using protection? She drive Shane crazy with her mixed messages and never had Rick's back.
So, by "terrible" you mean worse than a murderer? You might deslike her, but as i said, she was far from terrible.
Lori wasn't a "terrible" mother, but she wasn't the best, there's no denying it, wanna know who was terrible? Alpha! She wasn't a "terrible friend" because she wasn't friends with anyone in the camp, but we have to agree that she was indeed a terrible driver. Again, she wasn't "awful" to both Rick or Shane, Shane was the one constantly being awful to Rick, Lori was simply a bad wife.
Well, yes it wasn't *their* best idea to sleep around given the fact that they knew each other, but see how I'm taking BOTH of them accountable even though Shane was the one obsessed with her after Rick's return?
She was indeed confusing towards Shane, but at the end of the day, he is responsable for his own decisions, crazy or not, he was the one choosing to kill his own best friend and puting others in danger, assaulting Lori and using her and Carl as an excuse to be stupid, (just like Walter White used his "family" as an excuse to do horrible things). If he was Rick's true friend, he wouldn't have slept with his wife in the first place, that's just screwed up between friends, (we already know she shouldn't have slept with her husbands best friend either).
@@tonyahines4554literally just say you hate women and move on
•Found out Rick hid how hopeless the apocalypse made him feel because people looked to him for guidance and he wanted to give them hope, then started an argument to gaslight the living daylights out of him for “hiding things” while simultaneously hiding the fact that she shagged his best friend, found out she was pregnant by him, and was gonna abort it in secret.
•Didn’t contribute anything to the group but had the audacity to boss people around and start an argument with Andrea for personally believing holding a gun was more important than washing dishes.
•Refused to leave Shane alone even after ending things and even after he assaulted her. Told him to keep his distance, got mad at him for keeping his distance, told him to leave, begged him to stay when he was about to leave, all the while going behind his back at every turn to tell Rick that he’s dangerous and something needs to be done about him…when he was ABOUT TO LEAVE and she begged him to stay 😭!
•Got upset with Rick for defending himself and handling Shane despite going on and on about how dangerous Shane was. Even broke down and started shedding tears. Man told her he killed Otis to get back to her so she knew exactly what he was capable of and still got upset.
•Always lost track of Carl and never kept her eyes on him because she was always too busy trying to be everything but a mother.
•Legit tried to stop Carl from running over to hug HIS DAD, then later stopped Carol from running over to save her daughter.
•Left the camp to go look for Rick like she could handle anything on her own and crashed a car by hitting a parked zombie.
If you love someone you look for them, you don't assume they're gone.
I'm not even going to watch the video but came in here and say yes, absolutely yes.
It's hard to watch...
I haven’t started the video yet, only saw the thumbnail: yes.
4:26 I’m not commending Lori because it was revealed that her and Rick were having marriage problems before Rick was shot. That wasn’t written frivolously. She was looking for an out.
My issue is when she put rick and shane against each other she did fuel the fire between them.
great vid, i’ve been a lori defender since day one, she has major flaws just like every other character and gets hate because those flaws don’t mesh well for the circumstances she was placed into. other characters have a skewed morality but aren’t hated because it lends itself well to the apocalyptic circumstances
2:11 Who the hell are these random women?
I love how AMC named an early episode “Tell it to the Frogs” while other episodes are named “Days Gone By”, “Too Far Gone”, and “The Day will Come When You Won’t Be”.
While there are a few TWD characters approaching pure evil, there aren't any perfectly good ones. They're all imperfect and flawed. I always felt people were overly harsh on Lori too.
As someone who became the child a widow at 6, Shane, a trusted male role model for Carl was an absolutely fantastic thing to happen for Carl's sake.
She was a very toxic person who ruined not just the relationship with Rick and Shane but also with Carl. During an apocalypse where there are walkers that devour people she was more focused on her own drama than on her son. She didn't know where her son was most of the time because she had other people watching him. People who also had jobs to do and couldn't focus 100% on HER SON. I was surprised that Carl had survived that long during the first 2 seasons and it wasn't Carl that died instead of Sophia. She also wasn't the only one that could have told Rick about the relationship with Shane, Shane could have pulled Rick into a private conversation and told him what happened after he thought he was dead. They both had a relationship with Rick, as his wife and as his best friend, Lori wasn't the only one that could have told Rick about it. But what makes her relationship with Shane the absolute worst is the push and pull. The way she told him to stay and telling him he is a part of her family and then turning around and telling him to leave her family alone, to stay away, and that he is a liar.
Gosh someone finally said it all. Great video!
My two hot cents for this discussion.
Lori *DESERVES* hate, but not to the extreme the fanbase gets.
In other words, OVERhated
Nah she deserves it lol but yeah she’s overhated
She gets just the right amount of hate. She’s definitely not overhated.
@@la214la
Definitely over-hated when a sizable number of people consider her to be a villain. 😬
@@TheRealCaptainGold Nope! She gets the right amount of hate b/c she's hateable.
9:40 you know how bad this sounds right
Also Rick was NOT in a hospital in Atlanta. Rick Shane, Lori and Carl all lived in Cynthiana Kentucky. He went from Kentucky to Georgia.
although you're right about Rick not being in a hospital in Atlanta (he wakes up in Harrison Memorial Hospital, in King County), you're incorrect about where they lived. the Grimes family and Shane lived in King County, Georgia- not Cynthiana, Kentucky.
One thing to note, Rick was not in Atlanta at the hospital, he was at a hospital in his hometown in King's County which is miles away from Atlanta, so he was far away enough from the bombing to be okay. Also, in a short there was a surviving nurse at the hospital who attended to Rick and other patients who were still on life support.
Lori went wrong when she played two men against each other. That and when she couldn't keep her eyes on her child. Otherwise I would not have a problem with Lori, she's dealing with an impossible situation that none of us can even begin to imagine.
Shit take after shit take 🤣😂. Lori didnt tell shane or rick to do anything. They are two grown ass men responsible for their own emotions and actions. This is the most retarded fan base on any show i swear to fuck.
Your takes are a hard pill to swallow. But truthful. And enlightening. Earned a sub from me👌
Shes the one who pushed shane into being a villain.. she really was the true villain of the first two seasons.
Rick wasn't a badass then, Shane was a prick. In the first scene of the show we learn this. We love Rick because he became strong and always had good intentions. We love michonne because she admired Rick, but she knew him in different circumstances.
Pushed into being a villain 🤣🤣. How old was Shane again to be pushed to be a villain?
A man goes crazy yes ofc blame the woman in the group!! 😂 you should get tested if you’re not a psychopath yourself
he’s a grown man i don’t think he was pushed into being any kind of villain
The biggest joke i’ve ever heard 😂😂😂 this is next level of delusional and crazy
people forget that
- Loti saved Hershel's life by doing cpr after the amputation
- She admits she's made mistakes with shane
- admits she's messed up as a mother amd
- takes a very different attitude towards Rick in the prison
Definitely some redemption going on here
She thought her husband was dead. She was a widow with a small child. Her husband's partner wants to help her and keep her safe. He was a friend. What was she supposed to say, no, I'm in mourning? Let the walkers eat me and Carl.
Without watching the video :yes
After watching the video: yes
Ok so I believe the reason why lori gets hate for being with Shane isn’t because it’s right after Rick. It’s because that was Rick’s best friend. He wasn’t like a normal friend he worked with Rick imagine you in heaven seeing that😂, Carl even looked at him like an uncle so yea they was close so it makes you think if Rick got into an normal accident would that have still happened, probably not but i understand there in a apocalyptic world & they think he dead so the only comfort she has is Shane the only person she knows.
However I know some other people would just be a widow and go for someone else like some others did. Abraham got with Rosita. Pretty sure she wasn’t related to his wife in any way. You’re right about your point but I’m pointing out that this is most likely the reason she got hate & not rlly anything else👁️🗨️.
You need more subs! You have great vid quality and your commentary is top tier
i didn't watch a second of the video, i just came here to say yes, yes she did
The problem with your opinion on Shane being dangerous is that everytime Shane did walk away Lori said things that encouraged Shane to continue his advancements. She overall deserves all the hate she earned
No she didn’t. She told him how she felt, but it was Shane who interpreted it as her saying she loved him, when she made it absolutely clear Rick was the one for her
The thing about her talking about Shane being dangerous to Shane is the fact that she is directly responsible for this outcome with how she treated him and then when Rick takes care of the problem she has the audacity to be disgusted as if she didn't want this outcome in the first place. A LOT of her actions came off as manipulative more than noble.
Not to mention she is the QUEEN of mixed signals...
Or the fact that she walked around on a high horse as if she was like the backbone of the group. She couldn't watch her kid then got mad at others when he was in danger or hurt. She was not built for this world, she belongs at a book study circle with other hoity toity moms
If you were too look up a step by step list on how to manipulate two men to fight to the death, she followed every step. Then after all is said and done, she gaslit rick making him feel guilty. She's a total piece.
What too many people fail to see is while Shane volunteered to put his life at risk so he could save Carl, it was also to get back on Lori's good graces. He did it for Carl, but also to totally manipulate Lori. Rewatch those two scenes when she tells Shane he can stay... BOTH TIMES it is when she is in a very emotional state. The first time, it is after Shane gets back with the supplies. He WAITS until he hears Hershel say Carl's surgery was successful and he should be alright. Then, Shane goes to find Lori. He finds her ALONE, at Carl's bedside- her kid who has basically just been saved because of his actions- and HE KNOWS THIS. He takes up the entire doorway with his body language, and gives her this pleading look that says, " after all I just did, are you still gonna make me leave?"... What tf is she supposed to do in that moment? What is she supposed to say?! It is SO fucking MANIPULATIVE on his part, and he KNOWS it! He knows it so much, in fact, that the next day, when he hears that Carl is out of the woods and will make a full recovery, he AGAIN confronts Lori while she is alone, and he says to her that he heard Carl is going to be okay. She says yes, then turns to go into the RV. He stops her and asks her AGAIN if she meant it, because he knew how he confronted her the night before. Well, here she is again, in the same boat. She just confirmed to him that yeah, Carl would be alright, because of what Shane did for him. He manipulates her at every fucking opportunity! Always waiting until she is in a position where she is stuck and cannot tell him to leave. This is NOT her being wishy washy! You can look at her face, listen to her voice, and see her body language when she tells him that, "yeah, I meant it", that she really did not, but is caught off guard by him, once again.
The ONLY TIME I ever saw her be wishy washy was in the very beginning when she could not make up her mind on whether Rick should go bring back Merle... and I feel that this was just poor decisions the writers made for her character.
When she goes to talk to Shane when he is working on the windmill, that is NOTHING MORE than her trying to apologize to Shane for her part in the mess that was their fling, and to empathize with him about how she KNOWS how incredibly difficult all of this must be for him. It is nothing more than her trying to be a decent fucking human, going to him to apologize and take responsibility for her actions, and for hurting him. It IS NOT on Lori for how Shane misunderstands her words! Shane only hears what he WANTS TO HEAR! That is ALL on him...
The only thing I can say about Lori losing track of Carl is that now that Rick is back, he is JUST AS RESPONSIBLE for his kid's safety and well-being! Shane even says something to him about him needing to talk to Carl about the gun he stole from Daryl, and Rick basically blows him off, because he is too busy trying to figure out what to do with Randall. Yeah, but place all the blame squarely on Lori... I'd also like to point out that CARL GETS BIT AND DIES on Rick's watch. Can't blame that one on her!!
You are 100% right about Lori being pissed off at Rick for Carl having to put down a reanimated Shane (It was what started the downfall of Carl not being a kid anymore, and she did try to help keep some semblance of innocence for her kid in that fucked up world), but what else I noticed in her reaction is that if Rick had just told everyone else what Jenner told him at the CDC, Carl would not have been caught off guard when Shane got back up and came after Rick... he would have been prepared for it. Also, she HAD to realize that RICK HIMSELF should have known to IMMEDIATELY stab Shane in the brain after he killed him, and HE DIDN'T DO IT! We realize she had to know this, because the interaction in question between Lori and Rick happens RIGHT AFTER he tells the group that they are all infected and that he knew it and kept it a secret, because HE felt it was best that he keep that little tidbit to himself. She IS NOT WRONG for being angry about this!!!! We know that Rick and Shane saw for themselves that there were two undead security guards they killed that had not been bitten or scratched, when they were at the place where they were going to leave Randall, in 18 Miles Out. So, Rick did have what Jenner told him CONFIRMED and it is JUST as much Rick's fault for not making SURE Shane didn't reanimate (knowing what he knew!!), as it is Lori's for 'losing track' of Carl. Carl played a HUGE PART in what happened to himself, as well. He was sneaky, he didn't listen to ANY adults, and he was stubborn/hardheaded, and he did what he wanted, no matter what. I would think that being in a zombie apocalypse would QUICKLY cure a normal kid from sneaking off like he did, But not Carl. He never learned!
I will say that the shit she throws Andrea's way for not helping out with the traditionally female roles was COMPLETELY UNDESERVED and fucking GROSS! I hated that shit SO MUCH! Andrea was a fucking HERO for pointing out everything Lori had and took for granted! I cheered when she told Lori off in that moment (Andrea also gets way too much hate, but that's for another post, lol). Initially, I could not STAND Lori! TWD quickly became one of my favorite shows, and I have watched it more times than I can count. The 1st 3 seasons are my favorites and I began paying close attention to the body language and interactions of the people I didn't like, from the eye a mother/parent, and quickly started catching things I never noticed before. I began to see Lori in a COMPLETELY different light. The only things I still don't like are how wishy washy she was when it came down to looking for Merle (writer's fault), and her seeing womens' roles as so fucking traditional and attacking Andrea for it. Otherwise, she was just trying to do the best she could. I respect where she was coming from, for the most part. She was not a character anywhere NEAR as deserving of the vitriol she gets, and it's DISGUSTING.
uh, is it just me or do i hear the theme from Dying LIght in the background?
It is wrong because Shane is her husband best friend, Maggie husband was killed as well and she focused on her kid. Michonne was on the "watched" Rick died and decided to focus on her kids. Lori apologist are so funny. She was a horrible character and so was Shane.
*You don't date your friends ex girlfriend or worse in this case wife. Doesn't matter if they thought he was dead. There is a code.*
That doesn’t apply when the world literally ends
@@deadpooldan9862 there really shouldn't even be a relationship to argue about cause as u said its a literal apocalypse and she's got a kid who she always looses, talk about priorities man?
@@mochi1854 two things: 1. It’s the literal apocalypse, conventional norms and what you shouldn’t or shouldn’t do in regular society, such as hooking up immediately after your spouse died, doesn’t hold because the world literally ended and people need things to feel safe and comforted, and 2. Carl didn’t tell her, obviously she wouldn’t know 100% where he’s at at all times
@@deadpooldan9862i agree but then don’t hate lori for it.
1:48 the only thing I’ll say about the relationship (cause it does get too much hate but I think some is justified) is that Rick wakes up on day 59 of the apocalypse, so just about 2 months. So Lori not only got over her husband being left in a coma to die, but also the destruction of her entire life, seeing people literally being ripped apart and eaten in front of her, and seeing an entire city get bombed, and she did all of that, in less than 2 months for the relationship to start. I think if when the show started they were in the beginning stages of a relationship people would have taken it a bit better, but as is I give their timeline at max a month of her grieving Rick/the world before they started getting together, which imo is a bit gross. Especially since when Rick does come back we do see that Lori truly does love Rick even though they were having problems before the world fell. No there’s no timeline for grieving, but I find it kind of hard to believe that’d you’d be okay enough with *everything* happening around you, while also having a young son who just lost his dad and his world, to be ready and able to have another relationship, while living in the middle of the woods with really zero defense.
Neither of your victim blaming examples make sense. A guy wearing a white supremacist shirt to a BLM rally and a guy shitting in someone's food are both the aggressors in their respective situations, the physical assault they get as a result is retaliation from the actual victims.
Lori should've heard him out but she was also in a weird mindset after grieving her husband, seeing him come back to life, and believing she'd been emotionally manipulated. Anything Shane did to her that night past talking is 1000000% his fault and 0 blame is on Lori here.
"Shane isn't a bad person by this point (lori's SA)."
Excuse me? Are we forgetting about the fact he pointed a shotgun at rick's back?
Yes
Walking dead opening theme plays **Roll Credits**
100% agree with your bit on her treatment of Shane after Rick comes back and prior to him assaulting her. She had no right to tell him he couldn’t see Carl (and by extension Rick).