DIY Fuel Injector cleaning - using XTool D7 to identify and correct Long Term Fuel Trim issue
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 21 ธ.ค. 2022
- This is a follow up to the MAP sensor cleaning video. If you're dealing with a rich condition on a 3.5L ECB, see that video also.
• DIY MAP sensor cleanin...
Short fuel trim is an input to computer for doing fuel trimming, the long therm is an output and much better representation of how the car is performing.
My understanding is that LTFT is an indicator of where total fuel trim (LTFT+STFT) has been averaging. This correct?
@@KentForrest My view is slightly different, take the inputs Air flow, injection timing etc. The ECM looks at short therm fuel trim which is read from O2 sensor and begins to adjust those parameters that can controls.
So you will always see an oscillation on the O2 sensor or close to a flat line if you got a Air Fuel Ratio sensor. The out put of all those changes is measure at the long therm fuel trim which is a learn value. Does why I said to get a smoke machine to smoke the cars and find any leaks first.
Check Motor Age on You Tube, he is got some nice videos
Great idea for using the scanner to check for idle smoothness. Consider getting/ doing a smoke test on the engine and the emissions components.
Coincidentally, I'm picking up a smoke tester for EVAP testing.
@@KentForrest Check this other video
th-cam.com/video/jeeqLL1MYRA/w-d-xo.html
Great video ! Dual catch cans on the EB motors are a must. You will be simply amazed at the amount of fuel and oil they take away from the intake system. This will keep the motor and the valves cleaner. Also, the spark gets get ruined VERY quickly. I would do new plugs every 15 to 20k miles. Motorcraft or NGK.
There's a range of thoughts on catch cans. I say "to each his own" on that issue. If someone wants to buy, mount and service catch cans then I think that's fine. It won't do any harm. But there are also many examples of stock 1st Gen Ecoboosts running 300,000+ miles with no significant problems and just following Ford's intervals. Ran across an example the other day where a guy has over 1 million miles now on F150. First engine went 650,000 miles, a second lasted 350,000 and the truck is now on its third engine. Original transmission still going.
We all approach it our own way. My approach is keeping all my vehicles bone stock, following factory service procedures, staying on top of factory technical service bulletins or recalls, and changing oil about twice as often as recommended.
@@KentForrest The EB motors are pretty hit or miss to be honest lol. Some of them blow up at 100k miles. Some of them go 300k. For sure the oil is important. Fuel dilution is another major problem with the Ecoboost. If I get another F150 I'm going the Coyote route.
@@TanManFixes if I get 250k-300k+ miles out of this engine, then I'll be content and just swap for a new engine and keep the same rig. If I get surprised by some catastrophe earlier than that, then my EB opinion may change.
I’ve got nearly 200k on my 2.0 EB on a 2014 Fusion. Seems to be pretty happy. No oil burning and regular oil changes.
Great info here. I've had good luck with Chevron Techron fuel injector cleaner. The last time I used the stuff was in 2020 traveling cross country I noticed after a full tank was ran through my milage went up about 2mpg. That doesn't seem like a lot, but in my Buick Enclave it got a consistent 25mpg on the highway and I dropped to around 23 or so. I now own a 2019 F150 with the 3.5 Ecoboost, I'm eager to keep tabs on things I plan on traveling across the country again with my small RV in tow any advantage in MPG will be extremely helpful.
Techron is good stuff from all I've read.
I do a lot of reading on the Ecoboosts, as I plan to own this truck indefinitely. Here's a thread about what you can get from well maintained Ecoboost engines:
www.f150ecoboost.net/threads/300-000-miles-on-my-2011-eco-boost.28082/
Good video. When looking at these live data stream values like your fuel trims for example, how does one know if the values are good or too high or low?
Nice video but it's a good idea to always update the scanner before use. Because the update just might correct the issue of course without it the issue remains. I mentioned that because I see you have updates available.
The X Tool shows you to choose updates to download/skip. When I'm starting with on an issue, I'll update just that car brand rather than wait for a lot of unrelated updates.
Using Top Tier gasoline might cost more at the pump, but I think will keep things clean long term.
Hi Kent , thanks for supporting, ive jeep grand Cherokee limited 2016, i need ur advice to choose which obd full compatible with my car thanks 🙏🏽
If you want and need the diagnostic capabilities, I think this D7 should be fully compatible.
If you don't need diagnostics, if you just want to read codes and see basic live data, there's a lot of choices for less money.
Someone mentioned cleaning the throttle plate. At the moment my 2016 Frontier vibrates quite bad. If I clean the throttle body Ill have like 5 minutes of no bad vibration before it comes back. Just remember throttle bodies can be a big cause of the shakey-shakes!
I eventually got around to checking and cleaning my throttle body. It was a whole lot cleaner then I expected it to be when I got there. It definitely wasn't in any sort of problem condition.
@@KentForrest so many things cause a rough idle, man. Sparks, coils, engine mount, MAF, idler, throttle body, etc. Can be like chasing a ghost sometimes!
@@McAdamsMechanics Yep, and the EcoBoosts are just kind of famous for this anyway.
@@KentForrest EcoBoost or IdleBoost? 🤔
Does the D 7 Scanner give you graph for 02 sensors and fuel trim with engine running?
Yes
@KentForrest I notice you have 333 live data points. I just bought the D7 but my 2002 honda crv only has 63 data points, which are useless in diagnosing. Is this a scanner issue or those are the only data points available for that model. Thanks!
I think Honda's generally have fewer data points. Global OBD might be helpful especially Mode 6 data. It was explained to me that if it relates to emissions, Global OBD has the required info.
Have the spark plugs been replaced yet?
Yes, I do plugs every 60k miles on this Ecoboost.
The question is: should you bother trying to get rid of a lean/rich condition if there are no codes. I've tried to improve my fuel trim but I could not find a solution. So, is it worth spending the time and money to fix a "minor" issue?
Necessary? No. Factory service manual says +20/-20 is acceptable. Would I pay a shop to hunt the issue down? Also no.
As a DIY I will often tinker on matters that aren't necessarily "problems" but are just "not exactly right."
The Xtool series has a terrible live data playback function: I have a problem with my BMW suddenly bucking at speed and stalling at Idle. It happens infrequently. Probably every 1 to 2 hours of driving. No codes are thrown. Live data is what I need so I bought this scan tool. I bought the D8 model. I finally have the bucking event recorded after about 45 minutes of recording. I stop the car and save the data for review. I start the playback thinking I can go to the end and see the parameters, but you can’t scroll or go fast forward. You have to sit and wait until the end. This is crazy stupid if you just recorded almost an hour of data to catch an event that you waited for. The cds (recording) file is proprietary when I try and open it to view, its encoded. You can do the export data and the data will be saved as text file (CSV) that can be opened it Excel, but when you stop recording after about 30 minutes of collection. It may not be able to write it to the internal storage because of its size. I sit and wait a minute or two for it to respond. It has no progress meter. I suspected my fuel pump is the issue. I recorded the fuel pump parameters, but I can’t add any engine data parameters like engine speed and peddle position in with the fuel pump because they are in a different live data category: engine vs fuel delivery. This is just plain crazy. All parameters should be able to be chosen from all groups for the maximum of 8 that can be displayed/saved. These are major problems with the live playback and could be solved easily in an update to the software but who knows when that will happen.
Thanks for editing back that last sentence.
As for the recording, that's interesting. I've only recorded long drives on one occasion. Seems like it would have bothered me also if I couldn't fast forward playback. Surprised I didn't notice that. I'll have to look to see if the D7 has this same limitation that you mention.
I've so far not ran into a case where my own troubleshooting needs crossed beyond what I could record in a single live data session, but yeah that would frustrate me also to run into that.
Haven't had this issue with mine at all. Perhaps it's a BMW specific problem..?
I found that the large csv file will download if you wait. I bring them into my computer and have programmed excel to retrieve and graph any time frame of the data. It took me about 8 man hours of programming, something I used to be good at. So I solved most of my issues.
Have you cleaned the throttle plate?
I use a 75k mile interval on the throttle body. I'm at 130k, so it's been quite a while since that plate was cleaned.
Roughly idle and horse power loss might be attributed to throttle cleaning since the plate overtime gets nasty forcing zero throttle or 16% to be out of spec and forcing that number to climb just a little on a rag and a good wipe down you can get it almost factory fresh and then you’re idle will be like a kitten purring after your computer does its relearn which I think this thing could actually do for you but it’s probably better to let it relearn while driving since you have other learned values you might not want to delete it just sucks every time you need to clean it you gotta replace the gasket Or at least I think we’re supposed to but it’s really good to know that stuff works on injectors my only other question is do you do induction services as well or do you just drive them hard every once in a while to blow all the junk out and thanks for the video I appreciate all you all doing keeping us informed with the information we will probably need soon and thanks for showing us how you use your xtool scanner
@@jnhudspeath the 3.5 EB has a reputation for carbon, so I do (somewhat reluctantly) pay to have the dealer shop run their induction service at intervals, and on top of that I run my own Seafoam intervals.
I'm not 100% sure the dealer's chemicals are anything far better than the Seafoam (or other brands) we DIYers use. And it definitely chaps my hide a bit to pay shop labor rates for a chemical process. But I'm looking for 300k+ miles from this truck and I figure the cost of the dealer service is one of those "better safe than sorry" kind of things.
I anticipate some manual, physical cleanings along the way getting to that 300k+, but have so far only used chemicals.
Yea thats what i did, cleaned the throttle plate and change spark plugs not properly gap. But idle was going up and down but not rough and a rich mixture. Use the same tool and use the throttle relearn , it was on 62% compensating. Reset the whole thing and its smooth as a butter.
You should get a camera and check to see if there’s carbon buildup or not. Depends on the year. Once they added port injection (I think around 2016-2017) the carbon problem wasn’t much of one any longer.
Lots of guys recommend a walnut blasting (European cars had these as regular services when they went DI).
Where can you see battery voltage
This is going to vary by vehicle. On my Ford it's under the Body Control Module, Live Data.
Depending on what you're trying to accomplish, I usually find it much faster to just read voltage directly from the battery with a multimeter.
I'll only use the scanner for this when it happens to already be hooked up and I'm already in there doing other things.
@@KentForrest that's just crazy to me. I have a cheapo launch 123e and there is a separate section for the battery no matter the vehicle. So I can see voltage drop on the crank. Can't be under the hood looking at a multimeter and starting the car.
@@himeedajew I use different tools for different things. I have a DMM, a cheap scan tool, the D7, and a battery system tester. I grab different tools depending on what I need atm.
I'll compare it to how I have my phone, a tablet, and a laptop. My laptop can check the weather. But I'm not gonna boot up my laptop to check the weather. However, if I wanted to study forecasts, winds, tides, currents, and make a plan for a 4 day sailing trip, that's the laptop for sure.
D7 is extremely useful. But I'm glad to have simpler, faster tools for certain things.
The ecoboost is direct injected so a fuel injector cleaner will clean the injector (highly doubt most are very dirty if at all) but WILL not clean the valves which are the real issue on any direct injected engine.
ALSO RedLine fuel injector cleaner has the most % of PEA (polyetheramine) the strongest fuel cleaning agent on the face of the earth. Regane at Walmart is a close second. Not a fan of the expensive product you used. But to each their own.
Valves were not my concern here. This vehicle has had the intake cleaned in the last 12 months. I was strictly after the injectors. I understand the Ecoboost, GDI, and where the fuel is delivered.
I've seen opinions on the internet typed out from behind keyboards about whether fuel injectors do get dirty, or if that is a myth. Also, if they get dirty, whether that always results in lean (clogged) or if it can result in rich (failure to atomize).
After lots of reading and seeing a range of opinions expressed , I decided it was pretty cheap to just buy a can and see what happens.
My LTFT improved. A bit immediately, and a bit more over the next few hundred miles.
Make of that whatever you will.