@@JayHowieMusicOfficial Absolutely. I actually have one of these sitting on my desk and it's been there for a long time, but I haven't even yet plugged it in. Now I shall. Thanks very much. Great tune, too!
Hello Jay! I a composer/songwriter and I've been using the BOSS VE 500 with my Takmanie and tascam 24 mixer for over a year now. Love the VE 500. I just need to learn more about the VE 500 to get better use out of it. So I am coming here to your channel to learn more, how to use my VE 500 MORE! I am preparing here in Vegas Nevada to do weekly open mic performances and I know the VE 500 will improve my solo perfomances!
When I bought this thing I thought I might regret it but I was totally wrong. Did more good for my solo gigs than any guitar unit I ever bought for sure. I do have one issue with it though. When I use pitch correction, the bleed from the guitar into the vocal mic gets ‘pitch corrected’ too and causes some weird phasing artifacts, so I end up never using pitch correction. But even so, the comp, de-es, reverb, and midi sync’d delays are more than worth it.
For me the pitch correction just sounds like a seperate robot voice on top of my normal one instead of just one pitch corrected voice. I dont use it because I dont want two voices coming out of my PA. Other than that, the enhance setting is absolutely immaculate... It's easily the best part of this pedal's vocal processing.
aye man . im waiting for this in the mail, and your video was the best so far. when i connect my guitar i have a seperate pedal board for effects. the reverbs and stuff will only effect my vocals right and not the guitar as well? cuz im happy with all my guitar tones if that makes sense. and can i connect my guitar to this and then into my tube amp and have a seperate out to the pay for the vocals only? you got me to subscribe. thanks for the video
Man! If I hadn't quit playing all those years ago, I'd be as good as you now. I had a 12-string, just got the idea that I could bend those strings too, like I saw you do in another video. And if I'd kept working on my voice, it'd be better than it is now. I don't know, Jay, it seems I'm just learning about all the things modern microprocessors can do with audio, and you're right--it never occurred to me to use it for my voice! I'm just becoming comfortable with the idea that I'll have to use my voice in the mix. I can carry a tune, more-or-less, but the tonal quality isn't to my liking. But now..... Wow, this opens up possibilities. Thanks for this video, dude, it's been a real eye opener! Keep up the good work, I like your style! Your guitar playing is awesome, your singing voice is haunting (for lack of a better term, but it's a good thing). Not bad lyrics, either! Stay wet!
I've just discovered your channel, love your work. You have an amazing voice. Any chance on doing a video on how to improve your voice. As a guitarist I am a shit singer and would love some singing tips for guitarist
Wow are you running any thing else through your guitar on is it just going through that little five hundred box cause it sounds awesome man that was cool is that song on Spotify cause I'm gonna add it to my Playlist 👏👏👏👊🤙✨️💫✨️💫🌠✨️
Hey Jay, Great video mate. Aussies get it mate 👍 Great vocal. I sing in a loud original guitar band - Rose Tattoo AC/DC style. Reckon this would be a great addition to help me out???
Thanks mate! I just uploaded a live performance with my band and you can also find it on my album ‘High Time’ which is available to stream on all platforms!
Really great review of this pedal...and amazing singing dude! Love the way you used the reverb and harmonies, nice and subtle! I'm not much of a singer myself, mainly play guitar, but I really want to start incorporating a few songs with vocals in my solo sets... so think i'm def gonna get this VE500, especially after watching your video! Someone told me that the compression on the VE500 makes it really loud... how has your experience been with the onboard compression? Thanks again! :)
The loop was done with my trusty BOSS RC-500. This is strictly a vocal pedal but you can use your guitar for things like the vocoder and talk box effects. It can also pick up what you’re playing to match the harmony feature with your chord progression
Hi Jay Great video mate explained simply that we can understand. I'm looking at the VE 500 for my solo gigs. I was going to buy a TC Helicon Voicelive 3 extreme, but christ you have to be an IT expert to use it. When you run your guitar through the Boss, does it have guitar fx as well ? Thank you mate.
I don’t know why, but there’s something seems very wrong with this sound coming out of the box. Your voice sounds like it’s full of air and not really vocal sounds. As if some kind of way too much over, breathy thing is happening to your voice thing makes it sound terrible. Is there some kind of button or knob that would prevent that or is causing that
I'm not 100% on what you mean mate but there is heaps and heaps of functionality on this thing and you can tweak the hell out of it to get it where you want. I think I might have had the mic sensitivity up a little high and a few other things probably where they shouldn't have been but you live and learn. I probably should have used an SM-58 or something like that instead of the SM7B too. The desktop editor is phenomenal though and allows you to really dive deep into the settings and adjust everything until you get it where you want it. I found it to be a great bit of kit all in all but probably should have spent a bit more time with it if I could have.
Hello, I bought boss ve-50" I have noticed that when you use pitch correction or when you use ehnace the treble (and it is especially noticeable on the ''s''), the treble sound is not stable and is noticeable as some noise. Is it normal for this to happen when using these effects? thank you
Great demo! I'm curious if you have used this in a live situation. I had harmonizers "hear" the music when played loud but as a result it muddied the harmonies and didn't sound good.
I have mate. This thing has fully adjustable mic sensitivity so you can adjust it to suit the room and what the mic picks up. It would all depend on how close you get to the mic when you sing but if you're worried about outside bleed this is definitely something you can tweek straight from the pedal.
What ever you normally run your vocal mic into mate. If you normally run it into a mixer then you just put the VE-500 between the vocal mic and the mixer. If you use some sort of amp then you do the same.
I found it to be pretty good. But it would depend on your mic I would say and how much noise it picks up itself. Something like an SM58 would match perfectly
Hi Jay, are you using modulation on your guit at the start or is the mic picking up your guitar modulating it ? I use the VE 500 and i get this a lot live, due to mic picking guit so i cant use harmonies. never had this problem with Voicelive 3, Ive tried the noise suppresion fumction but doesnt seem to work. ✌
Hey mate. I have some reverb and delay on the guitar. When I was listening back to the recording and singled out the vocal I couldn’t hear any guitar so the modulation you are hearing may just be the reverb and delay. You can adjust the mic sensitivity and bring that down until it only picks up the direct signal from your vocal. Not sure if you have mucked about with that at all? The SM7B that I am using is a very quiet mic and I did have to adjust the sensitivity so it didn’t have so much gain, the same way you would use an outboard preamp. Hope that makes sense?
@@JayHowieMusicOfficial Hi Jay, yeh just listened back again to your vid, i think its the same problem i'm having, when you hit the harmony on the guit mod really increases. Are you using the pitch correction ? I used to use a low setting but you could here it trying to correct the guit Haha terrible . So when you soloed the vocal there was no guit bleed? its defo mod and not delay. I have the gain way down on my mic and eat the mic (Senn e943. nNo worries mate, i do have my monitors loud as im deaf as a post. Great voice 🤟
Hey mate. I did it both ways. Obviously using the computer software makes everything a bit clearer as its a bigger screen but I found it just as easy doing everything from the actual pedal itself.
There is a really good a video that goes through it. I can’t remember what the channel was but I’ll see if I can try to track it down and I’ll post it here if I find it for you.
@@JayHowieMusicOfficialyeah sweet. I’m in Renmark atm on my second lap around oz..struggling singer song writer meself,,love your voice brother, sic tone, can the effects pedal make me sound like you??😂
Wow amazing musician you are. Sexy voice, great song. Can you use this to just record in your home studio as well or is it just live, also if so can you use it without the guitar just for vocals?
You can 100% use this in the studio! Obviously it is aimed at live performance but if you were wanting to use it in the studio, that is definitely something you can do. And you don't need any instruments plugged into it to use. I was using my guitar to showcase the talkbox and vocoder effects but this is a vocal pedal not a guitar pedal.
Thanks for the demo. The patch with pitch correction on sounds absolutely horrible in my opinion, kind of destroying your voice. Much cleaner with PCR off. It seems the PCR effect generates quite a bit of artefacts on sibilants.
I don't think it is too bad for what it is (my opinion only). It is definitely no Auto-Tune but I think with a bit of tweaking of the parameters it is more than possible to dial in something that is may be a little less intense. With all the features available on it I feel you would have to spend some serious time getting everything just right on it.
That's a passionate comment. I am using compression on the pedal just not in post. If I used compression in post, that would not give the true sound of the pedal
@@JayHowieMusicOfficiallol , yeah that is what i mean... The ve-500 has a built-in compressor, so it is much nicer to hear it processing your vocal too.
I love when gear reviews are done by such talented musicians
Man, that was an amazing song/performance; caught me off-guard (thought you going easy as a demo)! Thank you, Jay!
Thanks so much mate! I have recorded it with a band on my new album
This might be the best demo of this pedal on the web.
Gee man that’s a really big compliment! I wasn’t sure if I should keep doing these type of videos or not but you’ve just helped me make that decision!
@@JayHowieMusicOfficial Absolutely. I actually have one of these sitting on my desk and it's been there for a long time, but I haven't even yet plugged it in. Now I shall. Thanks very much. Great tune, too!
My goodness, what a beautiful song! I almost forgot why I was watching the video. Cool!
Bro you didn’t have to go that hard for the demo wow!!! Blew my mind
Hahaha well I just wanted to showcase all the cool things it does! Glad you dig it mate!
Thanks for the video! I USE THE VE 8 ACOUSTIC SINGER, HAVE 3 OF EM. They work for my style and gigs. I know I'll soon be trying this too! Aloha!
Hello Jay! I a composer/songwriter and I've been using the BOSS VE 500 with my Takmanie and tascam 24 mixer for over a year now. Love the VE 500. I just need to learn more about the VE 500 to get better use out of it. So I am coming here to your channel to learn more, how to use my VE 500 MORE! I am preparing here in Vegas Nevada to do weekly open mic performances and I know the VE 500 will improve my solo perfomances!
Thank you as always Jay Howie I love you my friend
Thanks Patricia!
Nice Bass VI on the wall.
You said it (well at least for me) , im always first concerned with reverb, delay, compression, de ess etc…
Great content, thank you!
Thanks so much John! I appreciate the feedback mate!
I love that song man!
Haha.. people are gonna buy that pedal and expect to sound like that... great song! Great voice! Cheers!
Thank you for this helpful info. Also thank you for that gorgeous song, wow! Also you’re beautiful
Happy manorial day jay Howie thank you for your music my friend love you my friend
Awesome!!! Is it an original song?
Wow! Came here for the demo but what a great song! Def subscribed player! 🎸
I use the TC Helicon Harmony Singer 2 and it produces great harmonies for live performances.
Do you say this one everyone’s post
it possible plug keyboard to this effect for auto chord detection for harmony ?
@@amozingamazing I think it is but I haven’t tried it
does it work without a guitar input? Like if I'm playing electric through another fx pedal, I still want harmonies for my mic
@@benjiman818 harmony singer 2 needs a guitar input. Boss makes harmonizers that don’t need a guitar input.
When I bought this thing I thought I might regret it but I was totally wrong. Did more good for my solo gigs than any guitar unit I ever bought for sure.
I do have one issue with it though. When I use pitch correction, the bleed from the guitar into the vocal mic gets ‘pitch corrected’ too and causes some weird phasing artifacts, so I end up never using pitch correction.
But even so, the comp, de-es, reverb, and midi sync’d delays are more than worth it.
They need to fix pitch correction imo. It never felt right for me even in lowest settings..
@@rovenordiales it sounds great to me when there’s no other sounds bleeding into the mic, but in a live setting that’s an impossible expectation.
For me the pitch correction just sounds like a seperate robot voice on top of my normal one instead of just one pitch corrected voice. I dont use it because I dont want two voices coming out of my PA. Other than that, the enhance setting is absolutely immaculate... It's easily the best part of this pedal's vocal processing.
@@jrjj447 I haven’t had that issue at all…I wonder if you might be able to fix that in the settings
@@89ji76 Maybe its my particular model. I'll have to mess around with the settings some more.
My people come from Ayrshire Scotland bout 200 years ago, last name Howie and musician live in North Carolina
This is the sound I’m looking for
A great piece of kit mate!
aye man . im waiting for this in the mail, and your video was the best so far. when i connect my guitar i have a seperate pedal board for effects. the reverbs and stuff will only effect my vocals right and not the guitar as well? cuz im happy with all my guitar tones if that makes sense. and can i connect my guitar to this and then into my tube amp and have a seperate out to the pay for the vocals only? you got me to subscribe. thanks for the video
Man! If I hadn't quit playing all those years ago, I'd be as good as you now. I had a 12-string, just got the idea that I could bend those strings too, like I saw you do in another video. And if I'd kept working on my voice, it'd be better than it is now.
I don't know, Jay, it seems I'm just learning about all the things modern microprocessors can do with audio, and you're right--it never occurred to me to use it for my voice! I'm just becoming comfortable with the idea that I'll have to use my voice in the mix. I can carry a tune, more-or-less, but the tonal quality isn't to my liking. But now..... Wow, this opens up possibilities.
Thanks for this video, dude, it's been a real eye opener! Keep up the good work, I like your style! Your guitar playing is awesome, your singing voice is haunting (for lack of a better term, but it's a good thing). Not bad lyrics, either!
Stay wet!
Thanks Jeff! I’m really glad you got something out of the video! And I’m super glad to hear that you have picked up the guitar again!!
I've just discovered your channel, love your work. You have an amazing voice.
Any chance on doing a video on how to improve your voice. As a guitarist I am a shit singer and would love some singing tips for guitarist
Wow are you running any thing else through your guitar on is it just going through that little five hundred box cause it sounds awesome man that was cool is that song on Spotify cause I'm gonna add it to my Playlist 👏👏👏👊🤙✨️💫✨️💫🌠✨️
Great song, mate. Brilliant.
Hey Jay,
Great video mate. Aussies get it mate 👍
Great vocal. I sing in a loud original guitar band - Rose Tattoo AC/DC style. Reckon this would be a great addition to help me out???
Great video with a real-life review. And I loved your song and your performance.
Thanks Ron! I appreciate the feedback mate!!
Nice one for the video. So it does some guitar effects as well or just vocal ?
omg, amazing song 😍
Thanks mate! I just uploaded a live performance with my band and you can also find it on my album ‘High Time’ which is available to stream on all platforms!
When the voice is not clean and sounds like a soloist is doing harmony with him/herself,is that thru a voice processor?
Great song!
Nice song and great demo! 😁🤘
Really great review of this pedal...and amazing singing dude! Love the way you used the reverb and harmonies, nice and subtle! I'm not much of a singer myself, mainly play guitar, but I really want to start incorporating a few songs with vocals in my solo sets... so think i'm def gonna get this VE500, especially after watching your video! Someone told me that the compression on the VE500 makes it really loud... how has your experience been with the onboard compression? Thanks again! :)
Love the South Africa gas can guitar
It’s a fantastic piece. I picked it up in Cape Town when I was holiday inn there.
Really like the way you did the video with the setting. Did the pedal loop your guitar with the pedal?
The loop was done with my trusty BOSS RC-500. This is strictly a vocal pedal but you can use your guitar for things like the vocoder and talk box effects. It can also pick up what you’re playing to match the harmony feature with your chord progression
Hey Jay. Great video. Is this still the unit you are using?
Unfortunately I had to get rid of it mate. Wish I didn’t though!!
Dude reviews the pedal and casually drops an incredible song during the review haha
Hahaha thanks mate! Glad you liked the song. The pedal has that many features I thought I had to play something that showcased them.
Lekker South African Guitar there
This is a great demo man thank you so much
Thank you so much! It’s only the second one I have done so the feedback is really appreciated!
Nice tips, thanks
LOVE your song!!!
Bruh the midi in feature is so sick
Like if you’re live looping, the tempo can be synced to your delay automatically
Yeah man or you can use a tap tempo too. It’s a pretty sweet little piece of kit
@@JayHowieMusicOfficial just bought it. Stoked!
jay, how did you get the vocoder and the guitar to sound the same.? did great on the song by the way bro.
Is there a setting yhat makes me sound like you😊
Hi Jay Great video mate explained simply that we can understand. I'm looking at the VE 500 for my solo gigs. I was going to buy a TC Helicon Voicelive 3 extreme, but christ you have to be an IT expert to use it. When you run your guitar through the Boss, does it have guitar fx as well ? Thank you mate.
No
Can you change the patches via midi control - PC/Laptop DAW?
Well done
Why dont they make vocal reverb delay pedals. As good as the guitar reverb delay pedals
would you use this kind of pedal in a full band setup as well?
Great job and information! Nice song too. With the guitar plugged into as well, are you able to change the sounds of the guitar also?
Thanks, great job and great song.
Does the vocal harmony work with electric guitar connected to external multi effect ? and how they connect? Thanks
Use the thru
Nice, do you play a lot of gigs?
What mi are you using? Great one!
Thanks mate! That's a Shure SM7B
Thanks good job man
Thanks for watching mate!
I don’t know why, but there’s something seems very wrong with this sound coming out of the box. Your voice sounds like it’s full of air and not really vocal sounds. As if some kind of way too much over, breathy thing is happening to your voice thing makes it sound terrible. Is there some kind of button or knob that would prevent that or is causing that
I'm not 100% on what you mean mate but there is heaps and heaps of functionality on this thing and you can tweak the hell out of it to get it where you want. I think I might have had the mic sensitivity up a little high and a few other things probably where they shouldn't have been but you live and learn. I probably should have used an SM-58 or something like that instead of the SM7B too. The desktop editor is phenomenal though and allows you to really dive deep into the settings and adjust everything until you get it where you want it. I found it to be a great bit of kit all in all but probably should have spent a bit more time with it if I could have.
This or the TC Helicon Voicelive?
is there a loop for the guitar on the pedal ??
Time to start tuning your instrument to MHz instead of relative string to string tuning👍🏼
Love ya work and enjoyed this vid bro 👍 Luv to see a vid like this for a guitar loop pedal for us old unplugged school 🤦🏼♂️👌 Keep on trucking 👍
Hey J thanks for the vid! You mind sharing which Lav mic your using? Sounds lush
Hey mate! I am using the Rode VideoMic Pro that sits on top of the camera.
Hello, I bought boss ve-50"
I have noticed that when you use pitch correction or when you use ehnace the treble (and it is especially noticeable on the ''s''), the treble sound is not stable and is noticeable as some noise. Is it normal for this to happen when using these effects? thank you
Great demo! I'm curious if you have used this in a live situation. I had harmonizers "hear" the music when played loud but as a result it muddied the harmonies and didn't sound good.
I have mate. This thing has fully adjustable mic sensitivity so you can adjust it to suit the room and what the mic picks up. It would all depend on how close you get to the mic when you sing but if you're worried about outside bleed this is definitely something you can tweek straight from the pedal.
@@JayHowieMusicOfficial Thanks for you quick reply!
Thanks for the demo mate. Is it easy to set your own presets on the pedal it’s self?
Super easy mate!
Does it have a user scale?
Thank you. How about a digital Piano? Does it pick the key if you're not using a guitar, but using digital piano?
It sure does work with a piano. I’m the official BOSS video for the VE-500 they actually use a keyboard instead of a guitar.
@@JayHowieMusicOfficial will this work without instruments for example plugging through backing track
Talentat 💚🔥🙏Superbe piese
Does this Boss VE500 have to be hooked up to a mixer ??
What ever you normally run your vocal mic into mate. If you normally run it into a mixer then you just put the VE-500 between the vocal mic and the mixer. If you use some sort of amp then you do the same.
Will this pedal loop your guitar
What is the product please? Cannot understand due to heavy accent. Thanks
It is the BOSS VE-500 mate.
Hi, great review. Con you play harmonys with a bass guitar?
Hey mate! Great question! You can plug your Bass guitar in, your Keyboard etc. and it will pick up the notes
What compressor are u using for the vocals
Put me down for the CD........
Definitely man! You can purchase it from my website!
How good is it at rejecting outside noise for example I use backing tracks ?
Thanks 🙏
I found it to be pretty good. But it would depend on your mic I would say and how much noise it picks up itself. Something like an SM58 would match perfectly
Does it have a guitar tuner?
Hi Jay, are you using modulation on your guit at the start or is the mic picking up your guitar modulating it ? I use the VE 500 and i get this a lot live, due to mic picking guit so i cant use harmonies. never had this problem with Voicelive 3, Ive tried the noise suppresion fumction but doesnt seem to work. ✌
Hey mate. I have some reverb and delay on the guitar. When I was listening back to the recording and singled out the vocal I couldn’t hear any guitar so the modulation you are hearing may just be the reverb and delay. You can adjust the mic sensitivity and bring that down until it only picks up the direct signal from your vocal. Not sure if you have mucked about with that at all? The SM7B that I am using is a very quiet mic and I did have to adjust the sensitivity so it didn’t have so much gain, the same way you would use an outboard preamp. Hope that makes sense?
@@JayHowieMusicOfficial Hi Jay, yeh just listened back again to your vid, i think its the same problem i'm having, when you hit the harmony on the guit mod really increases. Are you using the pitch correction ? I used to use a low setting but you could here it trying to correct the guit Haha terrible . So when you soloed the vocal there was no guit bleed? its defo mod and not delay. I have the gain way down on my mic and eat the mic (Senn e943. nNo worries mate, i do have my monitors loud as im deaf as a post. Great voice 🤟
Is there quality line stereo out for recording?
I'm curious about the South African flag behind you? as a South African myself mad respect I dig your music man
It’s a township guitar that I picked up when I was in Cape Town back in 2016. I don’t really play it that much to be honest.
พอกดเอฟเฟคแล้วเสีนงกีต้าร์เข้าเฉย
What is the price of this VE 500?
In Australia they are $620
How do you find using the on screen menu deep diving to make presets? Did you do it online at home via the website or just on the pedal?
Hey mate. I did it both ways. Obviously using the computer software makes everything a bit clearer as its a bigger screen but I found it just as easy doing everything from the actual pedal itself.
@JayHowieMusicOfficial would love a for someone to do a video on that? 😉 there's not much around on this pedal. Kinda odd really
There is a really good a video that goes through it. I can’t remember what the channel was but I’ll see if I can try to track it down and I’ll post it here if I find it for you.
Nice
did you loop the rhythm during the song for the solo or re-record it?
how long of a loop can you do and can you store loops for many songs?
thx
Hey mate. I looped it during the song using the Boss RC-500. I didn’t use the loop feature on the VE-500 just because of the way I set things up.
Is it possible to do a guitar loop on VE-500?
Hi can this be played even with an electric guitar?
Sure can my man!
Hey. LOve the pedal but I'm not a fan of artificial harmonies. Can you use the harmony button for another function...like as a control function?
Hi Jay, may I ask where abouts in oz your based mate?
Most definitely mate! I am in Central Victoria.
@@JayHowieMusicOfficialyeah sweet. I’m in Renmark atm on my second lap around oz..struggling singer song writer meself,,love your voice brother, sic tone, can the effects pedal make me sound like you??😂
ok sometimes i use backing tracks can i take i ine in from that instead of guitar to get the key for harmonies
I’m not 100% on this one mate but I can’t see why not. I would suggest tracking one down at your local music shop and trying it out?
@@JayHowieMusicOfficial i just bought 1 so we shall see
edit yeah it works
@@JayHowieMusicOfficial so sussed that is there a additional footswitch that matches the unit
Wow amazing musician you are. Sexy voice, great song. Can you use this to just record in your home studio as well or is it just live, also if so can you use it without the guitar just for vocals?
You can 100% use this in the studio! Obviously it is aimed at live performance but if you were wanting to use it in the studio, that is definitely something you can do. And you don't need any instruments plugged into it to use. I was using my guitar to showcase the talkbox and vocoder effects but this is a vocal pedal not a guitar pedal.
Nice video, but that background music that kept playing while he was talking really distracted me
That’s a fair call. I have stopped using it now for that reason.
Thanks for the demo. The patch with pitch correction on sounds absolutely horrible in my opinion, kind of destroying your voice. Much cleaner with PCR off. It seems the PCR effect generates quite a bit of artefacts on sibilants.
I don't think it is too bad for what it is (my opinion only). It is definitely no Auto-Tune but I think with a bit of tweaking of the parameters it is more than possible to dial in something that is may be a little less intense. With all the features available on it I feel you would have to spend some serious time getting everything just right on it.
What’s with the South Africa flag guitar? My ex-wife is RSA.
Better off with a real reverb
What do you consider a real reverb? Tube driven? Just curious
JESUS, FOR GOD SAKE, USE THE COMPRESSOR!!! THAT IS ONE OF THE MOST IMPORTANT OF ALL... TO MAKE THE SOUND QUALITY SOUND LIKE A RECORD OR PRODUCED
That's a passionate comment. I am using compression on the pedal just not in post. If I used compression in post, that would not give the true sound of the pedal
@@JayHowieMusicOfficiallol , yeah that is what i mean... The ve-500 has a built-in compressor, so it is much nicer to hear it processing your vocal too.
tune your guitar man !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!