This new WING feature is a BIG DEAL

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  • เผยแพร่เมื่อ 18 ม.ค. 2025

ความคิดเห็น • 116

  • @seancca
    @seancca 3 หลายเดือนก่อน +17

    The big Wing had the internal card slot too when it came out but they did not have the cards available for it yet.

  • @Chaz_r
    @Chaz_r 3 หลายเดือนก่อน +57

    You’re playing Drew at 2x and I’m playing you at 2x 😅 help me Jesus lol
    But yes a combo of waves plus BWC for less than $6k is impressive

    • @minhuang8848
      @minhuang8848 3 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

      yeah lmao, Drew was basically going at 6x for me, I was very confused when he just started talking quickly

    • @drummerboy100jh
      @drummerboy100jh 3 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      But is anyone talking about the LV1 Classic 64 channel with built-in Waves??

    • @TheXIT
      @TheXIT 3 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@drummerboy100jhCouldn’t they make the new LV-1 classic fold up?

    • @LordDavidYoung
      @LordDavidYoung 3 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      Same, the "what" at 1:11 was perfect.

    • @adedayofajemisin4767
      @adedayofajemisin4767 3 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@minhuang8848 same😂😂

  • @BartKrap
    @BartKrap 3 หลายเดือนก่อน +7

    Just to clarify: the waves card is an option. It's not built in by default.
    I'm sure that we will get access to the AvIO card and expansion module versions quite soon but I don't know when. As of now, the only way to get it, is to order the mixer with it built by Behringer which will have a charge associated with it.

  • @jouebien
    @jouebien 3 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

    there's also an internal dante option as well so you don't need to waste the expansion slot for dante.

  • @RylandRussell
    @RylandRussell 3 หลายเดือนก่อน +7

    I know the new full size wing is just a refresh but I wish it would have gotten the 24 XLR Combo I/O the other two got. Probably not a big deal if you don’t have wireless in the booth.

    • @Filis96
      @Filis96 3 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      Hi! Maybe the Stage Connect can help out in this situation. You could have 32ch of inputs for wireless in the booth. It is not that expensive. Draw back is- just line level signals from stageconnect

  • @PUGLIA_JO
    @PUGLIA_JO หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    They have always been able to do this. You can do this with the existing wing. We opened the wing 4 yrs ago and put a Brooklyn II Dante card inside the board and used the network ports for Dante.

  • @donzpressplay
    @donzpressplay 3 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

    I was thinking the same thing!!! Because the wing essential now has two I/O cards which is usually a feature you see in the $8000 plus console price range. I’m actually surprised Behringer themselves haven’t done more press on that feature in particular.

  • @DustySeven7
    @DustySeven7 3 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

    To clarify, the wing compact and rack DO NOT come with the new soundgrid installed. Its an option, and from it looks like, not yet available

  • @huktek
    @huktek 3 หลายเดือนก่อน +5

    The internal card was always a thing - many folks have their Dante card installed internally already. That said, YES the WSG being available is BIG news! Definitely opens up a whole world of processing for those few who need more than the Wing ships with

    • @gunchatv8472
      @gunchatv8472 3 หลายเดือนก่อน

      So you can install Dante card internally on old wing? How? Where? 😄

    • @huktek
      @huktek 3 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@gunchatv8472 In the internal slot...

    • @daanpendavingh3100
      @daanpendavingh3100 3 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      Yes you can install the Brooklyn module (that is on all the carrier boards) and install it in the internal slot. You can even use older Brooklyn modules from other manufacturers (you need to check which work, ofcoarse it is not supported by Behringer but most of them work!)

  • @abimaelmartell
    @abimaelmartell 3 หลายเดือนก่อน +6

    Nice, but i don't see this anywhere else. Also, is this on the old wing as well?

    • @MGort-bb8op
      @MGort-bb8op 3 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      Yes, many people already have placed the Dante card into the internal slot.

    • @abimaelmartell
      @abimaelmartell 3 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@MGort-bb8op I think this is a different thing isn't it? I believe the Dante card goes where the SD Card Recorder is, i saw Drew's video, and he mentions this card needs to be installed internally by Behringer. We'll see when they start selling it

    • @morsikpl
      @morsikpl 3 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      @@abimaelmartell no, the "external Dante" is actually just a wrapper around Dante Brooklyn module which is the same format as internal module (miniPCI).
      You can simply remove that module from "external version", and put it directly into internal module slot. I did that, and many other people did. The only thing you have to do additionally is to reflash with internal module Dante firmware, because if you don't - you lose WING remote control capability.
      It doesn't need to be installed by Behringer, as it's simple miniPCI format. But because it's internal, they vary warranty based on "installed by Behringer".

    • @abimaelmartell
      @abimaelmartell 3 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      @@morsikpl cool, thanks for sharing, i didn't knew about that internal slot, pretty cool

    • @dallasphill
      @dallasphill 3 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      @@morsikpl I have a 32 channel dante card from an x32 that I reflashed with the Wing 64ch dante firmware so the WING would recognize it and installed it in the internal slot of my WING. 32 channels of dante to an x32 rack and still have the sd recorder in the external slot of the WING!!!

  • @BartKrap
    @BartKrap 3 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

    I'm just waiting for the card to come available in stores. I already have a full size wing, would love to install a Waves card in it in the future and am more than capable of doing it without damaging any components.

  • @MrWillihelmdueck
    @MrWillihelmdueck 3 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

    Ad a LV1 user I think of this as a SoundGrid to Dante bridge with mixing capability and additional IO. Might be something to look into…

  • @TellsMusic03
    @TellsMusic03 3 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

    This was always a feature, it just wasn’t known. When I purchased my wing I bought it second hand and the guy that I got it from installed the Dante card into the I/O module inside.
    The difference is we actually have a WSG card available for the wing! So now Dante can go inside and WSG on the outside panel or visa versa. But this future have been available since the console release. But of course no one was opening the consoles to look 😂

  • @thomasjclay
    @thomasjclay 3 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

    Where do we buy the internal card?!?

    • @PUGLIA_JO
      @PUGLIA_JO หลายเดือนก่อน

      For Dante or waves? Waves is proprietary and will most likely have to be purchased with the card installed. You can buy a Dante card separately and open the board to install it and add a waves expansion card to replace the play audio.
      We put a Dante Brooklyn 2 card internal, kept the play audio for virtual sound checks and process natively with the Mac.

  • @ricardo55498
    @ricardo55498 3 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

    just to point one other thing on the table apparently the waves and dante internal module can be installed on ALL wings already in the field.

  • @not0evn
    @not0evn 3 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    Same feelings man!! It was awesome to see that new waves console at churchfront, but the value of the Behringer with the waves card** is an automatic buy for me.

  • @ZachBrownMedia
    @ZachBrownMedia 3 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    Yeah I had to do the same double take haha. It's so casually mentioned on behringer's website.. that should be one of the top features mentioned - The value for the Compact and Rack are insanse

  • @wayneebersole2054
    @wayneebersole2054 หลายเดือนก่อน

    This is the setup I've been dreaming of for our church. We may have to upgrade . . .

  • @DustySeven7
    @DustySeven7 3 หลายเดือนก่อน +6

    You think this was the big news? check out the firmware 3.0 update that also dropped. We got bus to bus routing on ALL 16 buses now. All channels can be sent to the 8 Matrices, PSE on ALL channels. Mixbus and Matrix output delay is now a thing.

    • @samuelharmoko250
      @samuelharmoko250 2 หลายเดือนก่อน

      doesn’t that just effectively give you 24 buses to do wtv?

    • @DustySeven7
      @DustySeven7 2 หลายเดือนก่อน

      ​@@samuelharmoko250essentially yes. And if you are using the wing rack for only IEMs, you also have the 4 mains for total of 28 stereo mixes

    • @samuelharmoko250
      @samuelharmoko250 2 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@DustySeven7 28 stereo possible iem buses is crazy. and even if it was a front of house board with fx and other stuff taking up buses that’s still way more than enough

  • @hantedhido4608
    @hantedhido4608 3 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

    Now this is Something to Upgrade for 😮

  • @nnamdivictore
    @nnamdivictore 3 หลายเดือนก่อน

    Two things that came out this time but have made me sooooo happy are the wing compact and the waves LV1 classic mixer. These two? My God! What a time to be alive.

  • @nugznmugz
    @nugznmugz หลายเดือนก่อน

    Looks cool. There's an internal Dante card too.

  • @OndiiiCZ
    @OndiiiCZ 3 หลายเดือนก่อน

    They had it since the first release so you could have put a dante card to the internal slot as well.
    So you can either have dante inside and waves soundgrid outside, or the other way around.
    It just depends on which of those two you want to have redundancy (since the internal slot does not use both network ports for redundancy).

  • @lukelissenberg
    @lukelissenberg 3 หลายเดือนก่อน

    This is awesome! Anybody know how much extra the internal card will cost?

  • @EmeraldAudiovisual
    @EmeraldAudiovisual หลายเดือนก่อน

    The Behringer "Millenium Falcon" .. oh . and you can use either Dante or Waves in that internal slot !! So you can either do mix or match ... or you can do 128 channel Dante !!!

  • @MakaniGames
    @MakaniGames 2 หลายเดือนก่อน

    The soundgrid integration is kinda overhyped since we can't make use of the insertpoints on the channels to do it. If Behringer decide to unlock the Insertpoints to be straight SEND and RETURNS and not tied to the FX Rack then I will get very excited.

  • @spey188
    @spey188 3 หลายเดือนก่อน

    Hi im just wondering how are you guys finding the efnote drum kit. I have been looking at the mini one . Many thanks

  • @Gregsound1
    @Gregsound1 หลายเดือนก่อน

    FYI it’s not 2499 with the card installed.

  • @musicmankeyz
    @musicmankeyz 3 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

    Dude no disrespect but the plugins on the wing console is definitely not meh..I can't speak to auto tune because I don't use auto tune of any kind at my church and thank God we don't need that either. But the comps, eqs and gates emulated are just fine. No they aren't waves lol but they work just fine and the upcoming 3.0 firmware will have updates for all those emulations..I have seen comparisons between wing emulated comps and gates and waves emulated comps and believe the differences are a lot more minimal that you'd think.

    • @huktek
      @huktek 3 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Yeah for sure! in a Live scenario and even in broadcast world - there's really not much "plugin" wise that the Wing doesnt do well. Autotune is literally the ONLY one I can think of, and I'm not a fan of autotune anyhow - as it opens up a failure point for the FOH tech to make HUGE mistakes with key selection etc.

  • @HATCH_KTV
    @HATCH_KTV 14 วันที่ผ่านมา

    Waiting for the Wing Rack actual setup and review ❤

  • @jensdroessler3575
    @jensdroessler3575 3 หลายเดือนก่อน

    All the Wing models have the external card slot using network ports on the card AND that internal card slot which uses the built-in network ports. They had since day one. The problem is that the Dante card has only been available for like a year now and the Waves Soundgrid card isn‘t available at all yet. Neither the internal version called AoIP module nor the one for the external slot. A Behringer representative said almost a year ago the AoIP module was already in stock and the external card would be available in Q1 of 2024. Hasn‘t happened yet, obviously. And that‘s why nobody talks too much about it. It‘s simply not here yet.
    The next problem with Waves Soundgrid or even the Fourier Audio box as external processing is that the Wing allows inserts only via the FX engines. That means maximum of 16 external inserts, and each of them burns one of the internal FX of the Wing. Wanna use 16 channels of Waves processing? Then you can‘t use any internal FX engines of the Wing and no additional Waves processing. There are workarounds, but no real solutions. I still hooe they can change the number of external insert sends/returns in the future, because otherwise Waves is a bit pointless.

  • @DanteWilliams728
    @DanteWilliams728 3 หลายเดือนก่อน

    Is this good as the Midas M32?

  • @mark12.31
    @mark12.31 3 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    I'm not a Behringer fan but these do look like nice consoles. That said, I continue to see people throw around purchasing products like churches have endless funds and buying a $2500 console and $2500 or whatever Waves server, etc., is simple. What many TH-cam content creators seem to fail to realize is that, for many churches, spending even $2000 on "a sound board" is expensive and a stretch. I'm not saying don't talk about the options but it seems I continue to see recommendations for products made like everyone is constantly sitting on $10k to spend and that the $10k replenishes itself. Wouldn't that be nice...
    I have an SQ-6 and mentioned a while back that to solve some issues in our church (~100 on a given Sunday) we needed to purchase a stage box and connecting ethercon cable and was told that's way too expensive and can't be afforded. I don't think we're alone in that, especially in 2024's economy...

  • @benratliff9157
    @benratliff9157 3 หลายเดือนก่อน

    I vaguely remember reading or hearing something that there’s an internal dante card too. But i did read that it won’t be available till Q1 my hope is you can add it after the fact

    • @DustySeven7
      @DustySeven7 3 หลายเดือนก่อน

      you available again. they use to sell just the module for a time being. but then they changed to Brookylln 3 cards. Also you but the expansion slot dante card and pull the module off and install internally and flash the internal firmware to the module and it work

  • @petercastle4381
    @petercastle4381 3 หลายเดือนก่อน

    Hi Churchfront please post your videos on the Wing in the independent Behringer Wing Studio Music Production on f book

  • @henryvanweeren7233
    @henryvanweeren7233 3 หลายเดือนก่อน

    How much would it cost for music/vocal lessons for worship team members?
    How much time does an average small church's FOH people practice mixing (especially multitracks)?

  • @Alex-Isayev
    @Alex-Isayev 3 หลายเดือนก่อน

    I don’t know why this is considered big news. I’ve been using those two built-in network ports for Dante for a few years now.

  • @joshsobeck
    @joshsobeck 3 วันที่ผ่านมา

    Very curious to see if it's going to be how Drew's video describes it - SoundGrid absolutely requires a closed-loop network that doesn't have a router or any other devices on it that aren't directly SoundGrid-related. If those ethernet control ports are shared for both remote control as well as SoundGrid... that's an absolute recipe for disaster. Myself and several other touring engineers have walked away from SoundGrid recently because the network protocol is so finicky. Dante is so much more stable.

  • @stevieraypage
    @stevieraypage 2 หลายเดือนก่อน

    But.. you can also use waves native via usb for only $100. Right?

  • @krissmith1909
    @krissmith1909 3 หลายเดือนก่อน

    Do you still need the DSP for plugins or does it use the wings internal since it’s AoIP?

  • @brofoxx
    @brofoxx 3 หลายเดือนก่อน

    The Wing Rack, I imagine, would normally be used with some remote app over wi-fi. Using the internal card changes the RJ45 jack (to SG for Waves) so you cant connect the Rack to a router at the same time. Perhaps not a issue with the boards but potentially a huge issue with the Rack ver.

  • @gabopenav
    @gabopenav 3 หลายเดือนก่อน

    Does the rack version have this same feature?

  • @maizesoft
    @maizesoft 3 หลายเดือนก่อน

    how come you didn't get one for review?

    • @Churchfront
      @Churchfront  3 หลายเดือนก่อน

      I was too busy to fit filming in within Behringer's deadlines.

  • @leonardocaminati6432
    @leonardocaminati6432 3 หลายเดือนก่อน

    Does the waves sound grid feature works also on earlier wings version? Or is it just something that works with the new ones?

    • @AaronFagerstrom
      @AaronFagerstrom 3 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      Yes, you can install a Waves card on both the new and old versions of the Wing

    • @leonardocaminati6432
      @leonardocaminati6432 3 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@AaronFagerstrom But the guy is not talking about installing a waves card. There isn't even a waves card for wing, only for x32 and m32.

    • @steventurner1628
      @steventurner1628 3 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@leonardocaminati6432it is an internal card. Likely once it becomes available you’ll have to ship your console back to behringer and have them install it.

    • @AlexShourds
      @AlexShourds 3 หลายเดือนก่อน

      ​@@leonardocaminati6432he means the internal card. You can have them installed on older versions of the Wing

    • @DustySeven7
      @DustySeven7 3 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@leonardocaminati6432 ....that is what was being talked here. The soundgrid module for the wing is NOW out. just not well known and not fully showing at retailers yet.

  • @cosminbadica7371
    @cosminbadica7371 3 หลายเดือนก่อน

    What about latency for this new model wing?

    • @DustySeven7
      @DustySeven7 3 หลายเดือนก่อน

      same as before. its the exact same core mixing engine. just a new color for the full size and 2 new form factors

  • @jthunderbass1
    @jthunderbass1 3 หลายเดือนก่อน

    I don’t use dark mode cause my eyes are bad. I hate dark mode. Light made is so much easier to see things on the screen.

  • @EvanVincent.
    @EvanVincent. 3 หลายเดือนก่อน

    Now I need 5k to buy this combo. 😬

  • @brybigdog
    @brybigdog 3 หลายเดือนก่อน

    You can do that with the original wing as well. Check out the guy who put his Dante card into the internal slot.

    • @gunchatv8472
      @gunchatv8472 3 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Is there youtube link or article about that?

    • @brybigdog
      @brybigdog 3 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@gunchatv8472 th-cam.com/video/Z3lfnDy8F0I/w-d-xo.html

    • @brybigdog
      @brybigdog 3 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@gunchatv8472 th-cam.com/video/Z3lfnDy8F0I/w-d-xo.html

    • @brybigdog
      @brybigdog 3 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@gunchatv8472 search for "How to install Dante Brooklyn II in Behringer WING"

    • @brybigdog
      @brybigdog 3 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Tried to post the link but it's not showing? It's on YT

  • @BAADSessions
    @BAADSessions 3 หลายเดือนก่อน

    Looking forward to getting my hands on one of the internal DANTE cards. I'll buy a Universal Audio Apollo x16p and run some of my channels/busses with UAD processing.
    Capitol Chambers, the 1073, 610, Avalon pres and 1176/LA-2A compressors, Voice of god. I cannot wait!

  • @johnmcvicker6728
    @johnmcvicker6728 3 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    Hard to lean toward an LV1 system when something like this offers so much. I would say even more so if that ethernet port going to a PC and Waves Superack Performer would be similar. Do we really need a Waves hardware server in this case? It's an over-priced PC, basically.

    • @DustySeven7
      @DustySeven7 3 หลายเดือนก่อน

      still need the waves server for DSP offload if wanting SuperRack Soundgrid. Could use SuperRack native or Liveprofessor with soundgrid card instead to still beat USB latenecy, but then the computer is doing the DSP

  • @carlostorres1171
    @carlostorres1171 3 หลายเดือนก่อน

    “Just when you thought Behringer couldn’t get any better at globalism”
    We merely adopted globalism. Behringer was born in it. Molded by it. 🤣

  • @djaubreyclark47
    @djaubreyclark47 2 หลายเดือนก่อน

    Is this just on the new Wings?

  • @musicmankeyz
    @musicmankeyz 3 หลายเดือนก่อน

    One other thing though and I don't like this about the wing is the insert side of things..we should be able to insert external things on every channel instead of having to use one of the limited 16fx racks. The way this is so easy to do on the Presonus Studio live, it's baffling to me why behringer didn't implement something similar.but waiting to see usage of WSG or Dante on the wing.

    • @audiotom2010
      @audiotom2010 3 หลายเดือนก่อน

      That‘s not true. th-cam.com/video/wkSElE_-v3M/w-d-xo.htmlsi=1tYmeDeGK7mHt8au

    • @joshuabaldwin3490
      @joshuabaldwin3490 3 หลายเดือนก่อน

      You can replace gate, EQ and compressor on every channel with either wing ones, or with emulations of other popular studio gear/plugins.

    • @musicmankeyz
      @musicmankeyz 3 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@joshuabaldwin3490 yh I know you can infact I use the other emulated eqs and comps and gates but if I have to use an external one like something from my laptop I have to use it as an external insert on the fx rack and that's very limited..on the presonus studio live I can use external plugins on every channel with the press of a button

    • @quintonrice4122
      @quintonrice4122 3 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@musicmankeyzHow is it done on the Presonus? Is it the usb tap or is there a different “insert” method I’m missing?

  • @BrotherIon
    @BrotherIon 3 หลายเดือนก่อน

    Doesn’t come stock. It will be an optional upgrade.

  • @DuroSamples
    @DuroSamples 2 หลายเดือนก่อน

    mmmmh yeah! and no ULTRANET for p16... LOL.... Bravo, Behringer.

  • @GuillaumeLortie
    @GuillaumeLortie 2 หลายเดือนก่อน

    Waves cards have been a thing for years ;)
    Nothing new here.
    I’m more interested into the 8 Matrix now used a IEM Bus

  • @maikuirock8015
    @maikuirock8015 3 หลายเดือนก่อน

    Oohhh LV1 Classic or this???

  • @vadimmartynyuk
    @vadimmartynyuk 3 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    WING APP is still terrible

  • @johannesje9954
    @johannesje9954 3 หลายเดือนก่อน

    wasnt that always possible? But just the other way around? There were right from the beginning people who put the Dante in the Network IO (only downside was the warranty lost for opening the mixer) but by doing this you were always able to use another regular card (eg Waves)

    • @AlexShourds
      @AlexShourds 3 หลายเดือนก่อน

      A Waves sound grid card for the expansion slot on the wing doesn't exist (yet). So no it was not always possible. They just announced the Sound grid internal card so this is the only way you can do it now.

    • @BartKrap
      @BartKrap 3 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      Well yes, it has always been possible. It's just that there was only the dante card available. So you could install 2 dante cards for 128x128 audio, but realistically not a lot of people need that.
      With the waves card, you can get both 64x64 waves and 64x64 dante on the same mixer. Just to give you an idea, the WSG bridge runs upwards of $3k. A Rack with both cards will be about $2k and gives you 24 inputs, 8 outputs, more connectivity options and a full mixer that you could use as a backup or as a monitor mixer for the band while you run a waves setup at FOH. That's the big game changer here.

  • @adon-nk8fr
    @adon-nk8fr หลายเดือนก่อน

    woah, was already on 2x speed, and then it went to like abazzilion speed

  • @mjtejero
    @mjtejero 3 หลายเดือนก่อน

    Hahaha i knew what you'll talk about before i watch this video. Same video from Drew that I watched 😀😀 it's definitely a greaaaat addition 🥰

  • @dannyaudiohead
    @dannyaudiohead 3 หลายเดือนก่อน

    Good job bud

  • @Renniz72
    @Renniz72 3 หลายเดือนก่อน

    Black consoles. Dark mode. This is satanic!

    • @joshuafoster6790
      @joshuafoster6790 3 หลายเดือนก่อน

      It matches my blackmagic gear lol

  • @arthurwhist
    @arthurwhist 3 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    Not suitable for working in a quiet studio, the internal fan noise is very loud. I bought a brand new console a couple of weeks ago but the fan noise was so loud that, at first, I thought it was defective so I sent it back. Today I got a new one but it has exactly the same issue, when the board gets hot and the internal fan kicks in, the fan noise is very loud, it literally sounds like a refrigerator, which makes it impossible to record in the same room without geting the fan noise in all the recordings. I'm very dissapointed because the idea behind this console is very good and I love the mixing workflow and behringer's approach, but if you are going to use it in a quiet studio without a separate control room, just forget about it.

    • @Featherlightstudio
      @Featherlightstudio 3 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Is the internal fan upgradeable for a slower, quieter version?

    • @arthurwhist
      @arthurwhist 2 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      @@Featherlightstudio That's why I'm trying to figure out. The loud fan inside is a Sunon Maglev MF40201V2-1000C-A99 12volts / 0.64 W.

    • @johnnulf624
      @johnnulf624 2 หลายเดือนก่อน

      I wonder if the rack unit has this problem

    • @arthurwhist
      @arthurwhist 2 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@johnnulf624 I don't know, haven't tried the rack version yet