Fouled Spark Plugs Cause No Start
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 29 ส.ค. 2024
- Classic Car Carburetor Foul Spark Plugs
Episode 498
Autorestomod
The F100 is not happy. It is fouling plugs. We look at how the carburetor can percolate the gas out of the carburetor and cause it to be rich on start up.
jford@autorestomod.com
www.patreon.com/gasolinemedia
Bought a 72 f250 with a 390 last year. (My first truck ever) so I could actually work on it and get my learn on. You guys have been super helpful. Keep it up baby!
Right on!
Yes, please do a follow up.
We'll do!
☕️😋That bronze paint really makes me want to sip another coffee. Great content again!
You should! Mmmmmcoooooofffeeeeeeeee.
you prolly dont care but does anyone know a way to get back into an instagram account..?
I stupidly forgot my account password. I would appreciate any tricks you can offer me
@Javier Zachariah instablaster =)
@Esteban Carmelo I really appreciate your reply. I got to the site through google and im waiting for the hacking stuff now.
Seems to take a while so I will get back to you later when my account password hopefully is recovered.
@Esteban Carmelo It worked and I finally got access to my account again. I am so happy:D
Thank you so much you saved my account :D
We placed a spacer on my wife's 1965 Mustang, 289 4V, and it helped out immensely. We also have an aluminum intake manifold.
We'll be sticking with the cast iron intake. My budget can't take the amount of aluminum that investment would need....
Well done guys - making excellent use of your thinking caps. It’s so hard to not jump to conclusions in cases like this.
Right? We'll see, the spacer came in and we are going to install it today.
I love you guys. I'm a ford guy but I have a 1969 AMC Ambassador and a 1979 Jeep Cherokee. Love the videos. 👍❤
Thanks for the kind words.
I snarfed my coffee just a wee bit this morning when I awoke to this video since I almost called you yesterday about my own Autolite 4100 carbur-tater problem. Like yours it runs way too nicely to be most of the major stuff, but it likes to spontaneously overfill the back bowl if I happen to over-enthusiastically enter my driveway, which means it then proceeds to trickle/pour gasoline onto the secondary throttle plates. Having checked and rechecked float level, wet, with the engine running, it’s something I’m still worrying through. Sometimes that’s just what you gotta do!
I will address that next on the video we'll put up on the fix we try. That is a consideration on the four barrel carburetors.
@@AutoRestoMod I’m gonna try getting a set of the baffles Ford apparently used originally...for science. I’m also changing the float out and putting in the missing damper spring that some previous rebuilder lost. And if all else fails, my fix of just not driving the car has otherwise been proven to be 100% effective in preventing me experiencing this issue.
This exact thing is happening to me! I took a look at my carb and someone has plugged all the vents? My truck starts right up in the morning but after even a short trip I’ll go to start it again and I’ll have to mash down on the accelerator to get it to go. Love to see what happens when you put the spacer on there.
OK. we'll be on it this weekend.
Had this problem before fixed it by putting a 4 core radiator in to help with cooling. Also changed the fan.
Love seeing that guy talk straight. Not acting like he does most of the time. I can respect that much better.
We play around just like we do when we do. It isn't acting.
Sorry if it came out wrong. I guess what i was trying to say is it was cool seeing you talk straight, like you would to somebody in person, rather than when you get a little nervous and talk in front of a camera. Sorry if I said it in an offensive way. I didn't really mean acting, it was more of a camera demeanor
greetings from across the ocean.
Howdy!
@@AutoRestoMod i wonder when the new video is on its way.
Great detective work guys.👍
Thank you! 👍
Yes more info would be very helpful
Noted!
I had this exact issue decades ago with my 360 FE. Summer time was the worst, you
would have to literally wait for ever for it to cool down before even attempting to restart it.
It would start right up on a cold morning and run just fine otherwise.
They are an issue.
I bought one of these, same color, new in 1974. I replaced the stock carburetor with a Holley four barrel and it went. That was in Vancouver where winters can get cold allowing the Ford to show its nature (Not a cold start engine usually) another problem fords have is the fiber gasket on the intake manifold. Nice truck but I don't miss it.
LOL
Greetings! I think I remember you saying that you thought you had a 390GT. All the "S" code 390 engines came from the factory with a 1/4" Phenolic spacer. The original carb was usually a Holley 4150. I think such a spacer would really help. BTW thanks for the great video on the F100 Mirrors! I was able to get the parts you suggested and the job went smoothly. Thanks for all the great videos. You guys rock!
You are correct. We have the phenolic in place. hoping the 1/2 inch will help.
JEFF and KAM. I have been FIXING THIS issue since 1983.. the fix is a 10 micron fuel filter before the mechanical fuel pump.. disconnecting the fuel line to the carb.. extending the fuel line into a clean clear soda bottle. disconnect the power to the ignition coil.. get somebody to crank the engine for 15 seconds while you watch the pulses into the bottle.. you should have equal pulses.. do this 3 times.. each time for 15 seconds.. hook the hose back to the carb and you are fixed..
WHY.. sediment in the fuel pump check valves reduces the suction from the tank and the pressure held in the fuel line to the carb.. it also gets into the needle and seat in the carb.. what happens.. when you shut off.. your needle and seat is leaking and overflowing the bowl and fuel is dripping out of the booster venturi's. causing the carb to flood the cylinders.. but eventually the fuel in the line is exhausted and whats left turns to vapor and vapor starts pouring out of the carb.. down at the fuel pump the partially open check valves allow gravity to allow fuel to drain back to the tank.. taking some out of the float bowls as the needle and seat level is below the normal fuel level..
the 10 micron filter before the pump works with flushing the pump with filtered fuel..
don't believe me.. pull the fuel line off the carb.. and try blowing into it.. you should NOT be able to blow bubbles in the fuel tank.. still don't believe me.. extend the fuel line with some clear vinyl hose and hang it over the hood latch.. crank the engine with the coil power disconnected until you get fuel in the clear hose.. notice how long it takes to get fuel from the tank and thru the pump into the hose when you have fuel in the hose stop cranking.. watch the fuel vanish backward thru the fuel pump as the check valves are now partially open..
i use either a 1984 corvette fuel filter as it has 3/8 inlet and out let or a 1994 ford probe fuel filter as it has 5/16 inlet and outlets and those are both 10 micron rated filters. it is the only fix and i have been fixing cars for a living since 1979.. after a year of automotive trade school.. not just a guy with a bucket of tools..
there are other issues the 10 micron fuel filter fixes.. Hot vapor lock coming to a stop or idling in heavy traffic.. the engine will start to run rough then stall and won't crank .. this is the fuel in the pump and the line to the pump not having enough pressure to stop from boiling and turning to vapor the liquid fuel is pushed back to the tank thru the partially open check valves in the fuel pump .. the engine running on vapors leans out. the pistons and rings expand beyond normal and grip tight in the cylinder walls preventing the starter from being able to spin the crank.. this is why after 10 minutes the engine can be cranked but it takes a while of cranking to get the fuel from the tank.
Aweome input! We will look at that next.
Yes! Please do another. My 74 is having a similar issue!
We did.
My 69 cougar did the same, I installed an electric fuel pump.i shut the pump off before shutting the car off to let it use up most of the fuel in the cab. I turn the pump on before starting again. It has fixed my problem. Just my 2 cents.
Interesting solution.
i will email you when i get the chance to have free time to open up the carb if need be xmas is around the corner so most likely early january ........my neighbor told me to throw in a set of platinum plugs in my 1970 engine with a pertronix ignitor in the dist .......besides the carb issue what do you think about platinum plugs in a 1970 engine ......yall have a great channel i love it , soon yall will have 100k subs and a silver plack on the wall ,,,bravo ..
Definitely going to have to deal with heat issues on my 289. Here in the southwest with temps in the summer topping 115° to 118°.
Fingers crossed!
Jeff, please do a follow up. My 71 F100 390 has been doing that for about a year now. Aluminum intake, spacer under carb, fires great in the morning..... after running, not so much. Going to switch to non ethanol gas to see if it clears up. May end up putting in heat extractors in the hood to cool it down a little more. These FE's sure put out the heat!
If you have done all that, I might look to the timing and see if it is too high.
@@AutoRestoMod Appreciate it. Dropped the Petronix 2 module in it, idle is at 800-900, and the timing is set 9 degrees BTDC. My ears did perk up when you mentioned the spark plug gap needing to be different with the Petronix. I'll do a plug swap out this weekend and see what I get.
I have a Weiad triangle shaped air filter on a 289. The bottom plate is flat and allot smaller than a stock air filter.
I like the look of the stock Ford air cleaner.
Great episode, yes please do a resolution to your testing and trial of the phenolic and plate.
Looks like we will be doing it!
Sir, first thing in a situation like this is, use a vacuum gauge.
I'm not trying to be a know it all, I'm trying to help. As a Racing Engine Builder for decades, it's a know fact, that 90 percent of the time the carb is blamed, it's not the carb.
GOD BLESS.
T.S. RACING
Agreed. The engine in fine tune, the issue is fuel push from heat. A "hot soak" problem. I've put the vacuum gauge to it and we are at about 18 inches no fluctuation.
Just thinking out loud - I’m thinking you may have a tank full of winter blend fuel in the truck, winter blend is a “lighter” blend than summer gas as it has quite a bit more butane in it which will tend to boil up quite a bit quicker than summer blend now that temps have come up some. Springtime & fall wit ill usually show it up the best especially on older carbed autos. A quick remedy you might try is to “heavy” it up with a touch of fuel stabilizer to get you over the hump till summer blend is out. Best of luck & as always great videos !
You may be right. I try to run ethanol free or 93 but these carbs are inherently pukey. I'm going to try the spacer and see.
If I don't use a spacer due to clearance issues, I like to use the 3/8 thick flange gasket to insulate the carb a little. I remember International Harvester used a thick gasket that extended out just past the fuel bowl that was supposed to keep the fuel in the bowls cooler.
We have a 3/8 fiber gasket that Ford used on the Boss302 in play now. I want to further isolate the carb and see what that does.
Definitely would like to see the result of the phenolic spacer. I have a 77 F150 with the 460 and have been dealing with this issue since getting the truck back on the road in 2018. I always have to give a couple of pumps as least for the truck to start. Of course, it's always worse in the summer and after driving it for more than 30 minutes, stopping and then restarting, I usually have to pump it a lot to get it restarted due to the gas boiling out of the carb. I can't run a phenolic spacer right now because I still have the original spreadbore manifold that the Motorcraft 4350 used to reside on. I now run a Holley with an aluminum, spreadbore to standard bore spacer under it. I bought a phenolic spacer to try to fix my issue but the carb ended up sitting so high, the kickdown for the transmission wouldn't line up. Luckily, this isn't my daily driver so I tend to just deal with it best I can. But I'd like to upgrade to an aluminum intake down the road and then I could use the phenolic spacer instead of the aluminum adapter. I enjoy ya'lls videos, thanks.
You might look at an aluminum plate between the Holley and the spacer.
It’s even worse in the summer. It’s an issue on mine. I kinda just deal with it:
Never been a strong suit of mine. LOL
Good Diagnostics, would like to see an update on this issue..
Will do
The new intros are really nice.
Thanks!
Get a turkey roaster pan and a hood scoop like they used on the Cobra.
My Bronco always did this after a long highway drive. I always wondered why it never did it for the first 10 years, then it became a constant problem on hot days. Somehow the factory tune prevented but, but after a few carb rebuilds it lost that tune.
Interesting. The f700s had a scoop that was for extracting hot air....hmmmm
You probably found out what the problem was but watched your video again and it dawned on me check your exhaust something is plugging your exhaust that would be the problem with your manifold heating up.
Carburetors! The never ending saga!
It's true...
You might want to check out your EGR take that apart change the platum
Boiling point of gasoline varies with seasonal change, winter forumalitions have a lower point than do summer fuels. Change over varies depending on region. Seems no matter what season, after a week or so of setting, bowls in my stuff are mostly dry.
My old 428 has always been hell on plugs(we been together 48 years), a Pertronix conversion didn't give much improvement. Somewhere around 20 years ago, I added a Crane Hi-6 ign(their version of MSD 6AL, now discontinued?). It's triggered by the Pertronix. Opened plug gap to .045 and it still runs the same 20+ year old plugs that were in it when I installed the Hi-6. Assumin' there gas in carb bowl, starts easily. NOTE These ign systems will burn up the orig type graphite wires. To retain the OEM look, I now use the Pertronix Flame Thrower, 7mm spiral core wires.
Awesome tip!
Had similar issue to this with an Edelbrock 600 carb on my 289. Had to increase the spacer thickness and swapped to Aluminum. It still didn't completely stop the issue yet. Still working on trying to solve the issue but the ethanol fuel and the Texas heat don't help a non-daily driver!!
Yep. We have one more trick to try after this one (if it doesn't work)
Love the channel and the content. Keep up the great work!
Thanks, will do!
1. Does driving at highway speeds for a while (like 30 mins) unfoul spark plugs?
2. Is an inadequate cooling system the root of the problem? Ie. will an electric fan, new radiator help?
3. Also - I love the music at 2:30!!
1. Yes.
2. No. It runs quite cool thanks to the clutch fan and huge radiator.
3. We use Artlist for our videos: Born Tough by James Paul Mitchell
@@AutoRestoMod thanks Jeff for always answering
Great topic today. This might be the hot start problem I'm having with my 73 stang, 302 2v. I'm very interested in the spacer and where you get it. Take care 🙂
We'll be hitting it when we get the parts.
Another brilliant video thank you again 🍻🍻🍻🍻🍻💪🏼😎
Thanks!
Had a simular problem but on a holley. My problem ended up being the o-rings on the aftermarket needle and seats.
Some of those can be an issue. That is a good point.
i have a(4vents)vented fuel tank in my 1970 fury plus a vented cap ...is that ok or should i just use a normal non vented cap .....im asking because i have no clue if im over venting and maybe is it possible that too many vents create a vacume dumping extra fuel into the intake ......my plugs are wet thats why im asking
That is more likely a carburetor problem than a venting problem with the fuel tank. You may have a situation where your floats are set incorrectly or you may have a blown power valve if it's running a Hollwy carburetor. Email me at jford@autorestomod.com and we can break it down further.
Ayeeeeeee - this California gas gives us weird issues over here too. 🍻🇺🇸
Ethanol....
Fundamentally your problem is hot mustard.
Yes.
I ultimately solved the fuel percolation problem in my ‘71 Corvette by insulating the fuel pump to carb fuel line. It was routed too close to the engine block. Sounds like that’s not your problem, though.
Fueling can be super vexing...
Is there a reason my post from this morning is not here? I did link to another channel and gave credit.
1) this is a Holley. The body warps so air enters the carb (anyone ever deal with the original gaskets to the metering block?) You likely replaced the gasket during the re-build
2) Vapor separator gas filter. Will need a return line to the gas tank
LInks will sometimes get sent to the spam folder by TH-cam.
1. Autolite, but that is an issue, however, I did check the base for warpage and used a new gasket.
2. The problem really seems to be perking, the front drivers side of the bowl gets very hot and I think it is probably losing gas to vapor.
@Autorestomod Manic Mechanic Gasoline Media 1) on Holleys, warpage between base and metering block
2) vapor separator gas filter will take care of percolation.
I believe a third alternative is to run a return back to the gas tank from what i have read.
Won't do much for the perk...
Of course we want to see what the fix was!
LOL
Has this same issue with my firebird , it was the ecm
Can be
Thank you for the tip on spark plug gap. I hav a 63 Falcon with a pertronix EI. I gap the plugs at .030. Do you think the plug gap could be contributing to the plugs consistently fouling with soot? What would you recommend the gap to be set to? One last thing, pls do a follow up!!
Gap to .45 and see if that helps. You might need to adjust the jetting and some other things, but start there. Followup airs 4.8.21
Do you think a vapor separator and a fuel return line would help?
It has the fuel can and vapor system on it.
Ever sent your oil sample to a company like Blackstone and have them do an oil test. The report will till wear pattern and how the engine is burning fuel.
Huh, no, I haven't we'll look into that though.
Yes do a follow up video.
On the way.
I always suspect a leaking powervalve before anything else. They will leak just a tiny amount and will cause a rich start. And since this is a new problem I would not suspect heat soak as it didn't do it last year did it?
You could be right.
@@AutoRestoMod It would be the second time I was right about something this century according to the better half.. :)
Yes do a follow up video...please
OK!
Yes Col. Mustard update
And more this next week.
people have been talking about autolite plugs and how the ones made in china are bad , is that true ?
Not my experience.
Havingvsame issue with my 77 F100 351. Did you see improvement?
Yup.
Hey all, quick question. I have a 69 f250 and the brake lights arent working, turn signals work but no brakes. Replaced the brake switch, flasher relay and bulbs. After all that, the brakes and emergency flasher doesnt work. Any ideas?
I'd look to a grounding issue. We did a video on chasing grounds:
th-cam.com/video/ecC07ZvWFwA/w-d-xo.html
@@AutoRestoMod Would a bad ground effect the brake lights and not the turn signals? They are the same bulb.
Wow fuel boil at 40 degree day. Lucky it's not Australia, still 90 of your f's here. Has the intake gasket moved or blown through into the intake??? 🤔
No the intake is solid. And it runs too good for me to think carb issues.
a follow up on this would be nice
OK, we we got the parts in to try the spacer.
should i run non ethonal fuel in my 1970 carb engine ?
I do think that the non ethanol fuels run better in the older cars.
@@AutoRestoMod❤
It's got the "vapors"
Yes, perhaps a nice lay down on a lounging couch and it will feel better.
Please do a follow up
Shooting it this week.
The jets maybe clogged?
Nope. Runs too well.
I added 1 inch spacer on my 360 and it gets cold enough to ice over
Yup. That can happen.
Whats up with that clean @$$ blue explorer in the background
It is our new hoopty. 1994 Exploder, 4.0 five speed 4x4. It is really nice.
@@AutoRestoMod very nice i had a 97 that with reg maint. Ran to 439k. Had to sell it when i PCS'd though.
That moment when you are getting gas and you hop in and it won’t start. Yay ethanol fuel
Or it does and black smokes...
This is very, very similar to the issues I am seeing with a 62 283 with a Rochester 2 gc (all stock, cast iron) even down to the substance around the spark plugs. However, I have been running ethanol free fuel. I also have the phenolic spacer that I am planning on installing. I'd really be interested in seeing the resolution to this.
My 67 327 has the same issue. Only thing that will help engines like ours out is to plug the exhaust port for the choke. Between the heads and intake. And remove the exhaust heat rise valve on the passenger side. I switched to old c4b edlebrock intake and switched to electronic choke. Hope this helps.
@@ivanbadillo4909 Thank you , Ivan. I am running stock 265 exhaust manifolds. The exhaust valve has been removed and replaced with a spacer. When I replaced the manifold, I didn't block off the exhaust that runs under the carb. The carb I have is actually a Rochester 2g, so it has the manual choke wired open, because the car will not start with any amount of choke applied at this point. I misspoke above when I said Rochester 2gc.
Right on
How's the spark?
Really good for points. We have no run issues, just hard starts.
Can you say carb spacer and heat sheild
We can and will!
The problem is Carbon on the valves
I feel pretty sure that the issue is heat related. While we were messing around with it after shooting the bowl temp was 210 on one corner, making me think that is causing the vapors...
Your truck has a bad case of post nasal drip, fuel wise. Cough cough.....
Needs some Afrin...
bet your float level is .150 too high.
Nope. Thought that a while back, and reduced the float level.
The amount of advertising in your videos is VERY distracting
If you want the content you have to have the advertising. This is how I make my living. I'm sure you wouldn't want someone to come in and tell you that the amount of whatever you have going on with the background in your shop is distracting and you need to stop it.
Fuel injection 🤔
Lot of folks can't afford fuel injection. But it is an option.