I think we are having a lot of TH-cam issues going on with commenting. I been getting a lot of people telling me that they comment on my videos, and that those comments disappear. I've even been accused of deleting them. It's not me, I never delete comments unless they are truly rude and calling me bad names and the like. In fact, scrolling through the comments - ones I have already replied to, many of them have my reply deleted from them. I also saw this when I commented on Wilson Combat's channel, that my comments were immediately deleted. So to be clear, I do not delete comments over disagreements - so if your comment is missing I have no idea where it went. Only comments like "this guy is a moron" type of comments get deleted.
Sam, I appreciate all of your reviews. Thoughtful, common experience info is what we count upon. This is one of my favorite GunTube channels along with Honest Outlaw and Paul Harrell.
I initially decided to do it because a lot of people wanted to see .22 WMR, but also I was trying to cut channel costs. A 50 round pack of the best .22 WMR ammo is a lot less than most ammo. But I got to liking the testing too. I have some Fiocchi 40 gr JHP rounds to test soon.
@@GunSam If you haven't already, you should do a head-to-head gel test of .22 WMR CCi Maxi Mag JHP vs. CCi Maxi Mag JSP/Soft points vs CCi Maxi Mag FMJs.
That’s odd results from others I have seen, such as 22plinkster. Perhaps, something has changed. I am a big fan of the little magnum, but out of a rifle. Out of a pistol, the 380 ACP is in a different league. I still believe the little magnum would change someone’s attitude and probably, if they lived, would change them for life. Thanks for the video. I always enjoy them.
I'd take the 380 over the 22 mag, but I'm a revolver guy for EDC... My pocket carry is a 32 H&R mag which feels like the revolver equivalent to 380. Thanks for these videos. They're really helpful!
I've got a .32 S&W long revolver, a bit weak but I mean a gun is better than no gun right? I got it for a compact pocket gun with low recoil hoping my wife would like it. Oh well, she doesn't find it comfortable but I like it. And at my house it gives me 6 shots to run inside and grab something bigger.
@@Face2theScr33n Makes perfect sense to me! If you're getting jumped in a convenience store parking lot, 6 shots of 32 long in your pocket is WAY better than nothing! In fact, it might even be ideal if it's fast and accessible.
@@timt8029 It's funny you should bring that up! I was in my local shop yesterday, and they have one in stock. It's a 6-shot 3 inch "Pitbull " in 380. I handled it, and it felt alright! About the size of a 3" Taurus 856, but it wasn't quite as nice-looking. Doesn't require moon clips, which is pretty cool! My 32 H&R magnum is a Charter revolver, and it's one of my favorites. Perfect pocket carry for me.
Another great video. The 22 mag and the 32s are more effective than many realize. I can see a Taurus 3 inch 22 magnum and a Kel Tec P32 in my future. A couple of classic 32 revolvers are also on the bucket list.
Best ballistics tests on TH-cam. Love the test format. Great video man! I'd love to see you do 25acp vs 22lr in like, a Beretta jetfire or a cheap old galesi or something. The real pocket "mouse guns". It'd be a great excuse to buy a couple new guns... 😉
I wish lol. I am barely staying afloat right now with content costs. The cheapest .25 ACP pistols in my area are over $500 for the Beretta 21's in .25 auto.
I'm sorry there@@GunSam . You are by far the best/most consistent handgun ammo tester on TH-cam, and I very much enjoy your thoughtful commentary. I try to like every video even if it's not a favorite caliber or firearm because I'm hoping your channel will be discovered by more folks, and I enjoy watching those anyway now that I think of it. 👊
@@GunSam I just found a 22lr galesi and a 25acp Spanish Protector both at a local shop for 149 and 199! But seriously, I share your videos with friends all the time. What else can we viewers do to help the financial viability of your content??
@@progunliberal if I were to find some low end .25 ACP or even .32 ACP used in a gun store, I would buy one. I just never see them around me. I could buy online but when I did that before it became a headache to get all the various numbers for transfer and all of that. Buying online is like switching high schools. It's not fun.
Great review and testing. As more and more people migrate to these smaller low power rounds for self defense these videos become more important. In these non traditional self defense calibers it is the little things that make all the crucial difference between acceptable and not acceptable.
I can't believe it Sam I think you've made me a believer in larger longer barrelled 380s may carry in Summer or back n forth to range w Punch or Hydrashok Deep and not worry & I need to test the PPU I wouldn't mind you testing that in new protocol.
I think part of it is this M&P. The gas system however it works, makes it have less recoil than even steel pistols like PPK's and Bersas and whatnot. It's so weird how it feels like a .22 but throws a 9mm 100 gr bullet.
@GunSam all I've done vids on so far is Bersa Plus w 4.25"...so it's blowback but can shoot that or berettas super fast. I've got PPU jhps and getting some Punch in hope I can do more water jug tests in future different barrel lengths...but larger 380s may have a place...and they are much smaller top to bottom front of slide that similar 9mms so should be easier to carry in a way. I could maybe send you some ppu to test in a few calibers
Thanks. I was seriously looking at that 3" LCRx as a carry gun, until I started seeing disappointing performance in your real world gell tests. Thanks for all of your hard work. Happy Thanksgiving to all.
Happy Thanksgiving. The Hornady Critical Defense and Speer Gold Dot are better. The Critical Defense is the only load I've consistently seen do well in .22 WMR and always be available. It's almost worth settling in buying a .22 WMR because of that ammo. As long as you got that, practicing with cheaper ammo will do fine as long as both hit to the same point of aim.
I'm sticking to the dots in my 3 inch lcrx. Got plenty in stock and can practice with other 40gr. rounds that run at similar velocities. Thanks, Sam, and Happy Thanksgiving
Good video, I like seeing this comparison . The 380 ammo looks pretty good. 22 wmr punch deep penetration is nothing to downplay although I think a much better comparison would be Hornady critical defense 45 grain 22 WMR or Speer gold dot. I think you will see expansion. Punch penetrates well but I have not seen it expand yet on a video. Can you do a video with the hornady and Speer compared to the 380?
Thanks for testing these two cartridges. Like others have said, out of a rifle, the .22 mag could be really nasty. Out of the pistol, the .380 would be my choice. And the Federal Punch 85 gr is in the top 5 standard velocity loads for that round, right there with the higher velocity XTP loads and other Federal ones like Hydrashok and Hydrashok Deep. I hope you get to test the Defiant Munitions 80gr copper hollow point load sometime.
Again, most excellent demos. As I currently don’t own anything in either caliber, I can’t really be a critic although I have to admit that the .22WMR as well as newer .22LR products interest me. The thing I’ve noted over the years is that any handgun round is not guaranteed to perform to the expectations of the person stuck in a position to rely on a particular combo in any randomly imposed situation. In one of the Dillinger gang escapades, a shop keeper stepped out on the sidewalk with what I believe was a S&W K-22 and knocked an armored up Homer VanMeter in the noggin. Knocked Homer out or stunned him for a brief instance. Both Homer and the shopkeeper lived to do their respective things another day. Wonder how something in .22WMR would have performed. Anyway, thanks for the video.
Thanks. Everyone should have some .22 LR firearms. So easy to shoot and shoot a lot. The .22 WMR is fine, but honestly for the money you could shoot 9mm in a semi auto or revolver for the same price for ammo. The .22 LR is a must have, the .22 WMR is more of a "because I can" thing. Sort of like how people buy .45 caliber airguns that have 200-300 ft lbs energy. There's a better way, but...
@@GunSam Okay, your “because I can,” statement is really insightful. Incidentally, I still have a 45, an M&P full size 45. Not because it’s a custom gun or anything, but because I used to carry it daily, shot it a lot, and shot well with it. I liked to shoot it. Bought Milt Sparks gun leather for it. But I also concluded that if S&W what offered a 9mm with those same dimensions, including grip, I’d have been just as happy. The M&P 9s just didn’t have the same feel. But I digress…
I have a 22 WMR revolver with a 6.5 inch barrel. Using the velocity number from BBTI for that barrel length and CCI Maxi-Mag, if I recall correctly the energy calculates to 207 ft-lbs. That seems similar to the 380. (But of course that revolver is not very easy to conceal, if that is a concern.)
The 380 ACP punch is probably the best 380 ACP ammo I've seen. Right at 200 ft-lbs is also about as good as 380 gets energy wise. The projectile is doing what it should. Good construction.
@@GunSam Target Sports currently has the P38HSD1 in stock. You can also get it from Federal directly if you want to pay a lot more. I do wish it came out of a 2" barrel faster. But unlike the Punch, it seems to open up better.
@@GunSam I found this test more relevant for me. Also your glitch with the safety is one reason I like a revolver. Although key holing from a 2" barrel isn't the best news ever. th-cam.com/video/YpHFCD_-qG8/w-d-xo.html
Thanks Sam, very good comparison information. In certain situations, could the further penetration of the 22 mag be more desirable than the greater expansion of the 38 acp ?
Have you seen the 1776 .380 ammo? Its like a sintered round thats a little lighter, magnetic, has a flat nose and penetrates sheet metal better than any .380 ive tried.
Wow. I was expecting a lot more from the Punch myself. I guess in .22LR format, it excels. Not so much for magnum version. Probably in a rifle barrel everything would change but then again, what makes Punch so much better than any other brand in a rifle?
It is POS for EDC but I think pmr30 may represent 22mag a little better when you get it to feed. 2,200fps varmint rounds should rase some hell for 6" or so in gel.
The issue I have and have always had, is pistols like the PMR 30 are not really ergonomically normal for carry. Grip on the PMR 30 is massive, the overall size is just odd for carry. The LCRx even in a 3" is smaller than a Glock 19. If I had a thought that maybe 6 rounds of .22 WMR is not enough, I don't think the better solution is to just have more of the same 'not enough' lol.
@GunSam you're kinda missing his point he was trying to convey I think??... the extra inches of barrel will make a dif ...go snag the mp 22wmr n use the punch or hornady 30 gr or bettet yet 45 critical defense ...vastly different results...far as concealing the pmr is easy asf to conceal for me so is the mp 22 wmr . .as I have mainly carried 5.7 since 2006 in fn format (used to be 10mm for decade plus ) and then the ruger rock n now the mp has it its own 5.7 its an absolute joy to carry concealed with elite ammo t6b compared to the other 3 formats ..the mp22mag is about same size as their 5.7.. so it makes a great training tool for 5.7 of which im near 6k rds out of that n loving it (wallet not so much my pre pandemic stash is gettin low ,tho current 5.7 prices are getting better with aac )... but have 1800 thru the mp 22 already (way more reliable than the pmr30 outta the gate 100%) ...not that'd id intentionally trust rimfire for SD but it's sure better than a knife or bat if that's all you have time to grab realistically..... I can say rimfire reliability has greatly improved over the days of old... outta 1800 ive had 3 fail to fires (ironically all gave been cci ) ..out of 1000 in 9mm thru my staccato I had 2 ..1000 rds of 5.7 mainly vmax 0..(i never use that American eagle trash 5.7 ammo in pistols and advise others follow suit in pdw fine , pistols? hard pass ) ..so rimfire has greatly improved, which is great to see for the platform itself cuz imho some people have nerve dmg arthritis and can't handle normal SD loadings ...so im glad they now have a viable alt to ensure their safety ... feeling lucky ( see what i did there lol) shouldn't be an option esp in these crazy times where ppl seem to snap off for 0 reason n do cray crap to strangers (or heck maybe its more cell phones are just catching it and posting it up more n the world's ALWAYS been this volatile but i swear it hasnt who really knows lol ) ..in closing all I know is that 22wmr in the 30 vmax n 45 csd loads have dropped countless wild hogs my way in recent years (just a step behind what my 5.7 and 10mm did tbh ) .. and hogs hair , fatty skin, sinew,and bones are a lot more dense than what us sensitive humans are packing ...but those hunts were enough for me that if I had to, I certainly wouldn't hesitate to grab said rimfire to deter a threat ..bigger isn't always better no matter what the ladies tell us .. Case in point , ill take buffalo bore hardcast 10mm on bear to vital areas all day over a 500 smith paw shot lol....ie accuracy will always trump caliber....cheers n tell Paul Kersey I said my model 29 shots were THE og hand cannon sounds before he tried to 1 up me with his automag lolol .
It’s definitely designed to expand. I’ve seen other tests where it does expand, but I think it depends on if it’s clear gel or regular and what gun it’s shot from.
Yes but there are 3 or 4 ammos designed specifically for handgun velocity with a bullet construction designed to expand at lower velocity and energy. Those are the Speer Gold Dot, Hornady Critical Defense and Federal Punch. The other two expanded fine, and the punch did for me in the past, but it's so dependent on that 1,300 FPS I got in the past that just dropping 100 FPS and only like 20 ft lbs energy, was enough to make it not expand.
As far as I understand it, 22WMR is much more comparable to 32 ACP or 32 S&W Long in terms of ballistic energy out of a handgun. All 3 calibers fall in the 130 ft-lbs of energy range. Obviously the bullet weights and speeds between these are all quite different, which could definitely provide different penetration results. The 32 S&W Long is the heaviest and slowest, while the 22WMR out of a handgun is the lightest and fastest. The 32 ACP lies somewhere in the middle. I think a comparison of these three would be interesting.
Thanks for the vid, partner. I've heard the myth that 22 Mag is as good for self defense as 38 Special or 380 ACP for 40 years, but have yet to see it proven.
In 90% of DGUs the mere presence of a gun is sufficient. Unless aggressor can distinguish caliber of gun in your hand, it won’t matter in those 90% of cases. It’s the other 10% we’re worrying about. With the 90% in mind - I support having a 22 for self defense - if it’s a 223/556 rifle! Intimidation factor of seeing an AR is far more than that of seeing a pistol. Should boost that 90% appreciably.
Sticking to the dots for my lcrx. I have a good inventory and can train with 40gr. rounds with similar velocities. Thanks for the uploads Sam. HAPPY THANKSGIVING
.38 ACP is the predecessor of the .38 Super Auto. Which means the .38 ACP is a low pressured outdated round. It uses about the same 115-125 gr bullets as the 9x19mm and is similar in power to a standard pressure 9x19mm round. The .32 ACP is a much smaller round with just a .313" bullet diameter (compared to the .38 ACP's .36" diameter) and fires a bullet about 60-75 gr and fires it slower than the .38 ACP so the .32 ACP is about half as powerful.
@@GunSam I've just checked ballistic coefficients of few manufacturers for FMJ 380 ACP, and they are lower than for FMJ 32 ACP. Similar nose shapes of bullet but significantly heavier 38 and having lower BC. Something very strange!
I am not an expert on things of that nature, however what I can say is heavier bullets tend to have more momentum and go further with less drop due to momentum.
If I'm carrying a true pocket pistol it'll be a North American Arms.22 Magnum revolver and it'll be in my front right pocket and no one will be the wiser. I don't think you can get a semi-automatic handgun small enough to fit in your front pocket 100% comfortably. I can carry that North American Arms five shot revolver and forget it's there. It's better than a sharp stick.
@@GunSam I made a comment on a short yesterday that disappeared but it was early in posting. On the 22short to 44 mag which is a hot load for factory ammo .
I think we are having a lot of TH-cam issues going on with commenting. I been getting a lot of people telling me that they comment on my videos, and that those comments disappear. I've even been accused of deleting them. It's not me, I never delete comments unless they are truly rude and calling me bad names and the like. In fact, scrolling through the comments - ones I have already replied to, many of them have my reply deleted from them.
I also saw this when I commented on Wilson Combat's channel, that my comments were immediately deleted. So to be clear, I do not delete comments over disagreements - so if your comment is missing I have no idea where it went. Only comments like "this guy is a moron" type of comments get deleted.
In the real world ANY caliber beats a sharp stick. Love the reviews , another good one!
Sam, I appreciate all of your reviews. Thoughtful, common experience info is what we count upon. This is one of my favorite GunTube channels along with Honest Outlaw and Paul Harrell.
Thanks a lot! I appreciate it.
I love that you test so much 22wmr
I initially decided to do it because a lot of people wanted to see .22 WMR, but also I was trying to cut channel costs. A 50 round pack of the best .22 WMR ammo is a lot less than most ammo. But I got to liking the testing too. I have some Fiocchi 40 gr JHP rounds to test soon.
@@GunSam If you haven't already, you should do a head-to-head gel test of .22 WMR CCi Maxi Mag JHP vs. CCi Maxi Mag JSP/Soft points vs CCi Maxi Mag FMJs.
That’s odd results from others I have seen, such as 22plinkster. Perhaps, something has changed. I am a big fan of the little magnum, but out of a rifle. Out of a pistol, the 380 ACP is in a different league. I still believe the little magnum would change someone’s attitude and probably, if they lived, would change them for life. Thanks for the video. I always enjoy them.
GS. Good video. That seemed like really good .380 ammo. Thanks for sharing. Take care.
Thank you, take care.
I'd take the 380 over the 22 mag, but I'm a revolver guy for EDC... My pocket carry is a 32 H&R mag which feels like the revolver equivalent to 380. Thanks for these videos. They're really helpful!
I've got a .32 S&W long revolver, a bit weak but I mean a gun is better than no gun right? I got it for a compact pocket gun with low recoil hoping my wife would like it. Oh well, she doesn't find it comfortable but I like it. And at my house it gives me 6 shots to run inside and grab something bigger.
@@Face2theScr33n Makes perfect sense to me! If you're getting jumped in a convenience store parking lot, 6 shots of 32 long in your pocket is WAY better than nothing! In fact, it might even be ideal if it's fast and accessible.
I think charter arms makes a .380 revolver now.
@@timt8029 It's funny you should bring that up! I was in my local shop yesterday, and they have one in stock. It's a 6-shot 3 inch "Pitbull " in 380. I handled it, and it felt alright! About the size of a 3" Taurus 856, but it wasn't quite as nice-looking. Doesn't require moon clips, which is pretty cool! My 32 H&R magnum is a Charter revolver, and it's one of my favorites. Perfect pocket carry for me.
@@Face2theScr33n I thought I was the only one who had my get you by house gun to fight my way to the better stash. Good stuff.
Another great video.
The 22 mag and the 32s are more effective than many realize. I can see a Taurus 3 inch 22 magnum and a Kel Tec P32 in my future. A couple of classic 32 revolvers are also on the bucket list.
75 yards banging steel! You have to be the most humble guntuber.
Best ballistics tests on TH-cam. Love the test format. Great video man! I'd love to see you do 25acp vs 22lr in like, a Beretta jetfire or a cheap old galesi or something. The real pocket "mouse guns". It'd be a great excuse to buy a couple new guns... 😉
I wish lol. I am barely staying afloat right now with content costs. The cheapest .25 ACP pistols in my area are over $500 for the Beretta 21's in .25 auto.
I'm sorry there@@GunSam . You are by far the best/most consistent handgun ammo tester on TH-cam, and I very much enjoy your thoughtful commentary. I try to like every video even if it's not a favorite caliber or firearm because I'm hoping your channel will be discovered by more folks, and I enjoy watching those anyway now that I think of it. 👊
@@GunSam I just found a 22lr galesi and a 25acp Spanish Protector both at a local shop for 149 and 199! But seriously, I share your videos with friends all the time. What else can we viewers do to help the financial viability of your content??
@@progunliberal if I were to find some low end .25 ACP or even .32 ACP used in a gun store, I would buy one. I just never see them around me. I could buy online but when I did that before it became a headache to get all the various numbers for transfer and all of that. Buying online is like switching high schools. It's not fun.
@GunSam You have great content and one I watch most. Happy Thanksgiving.
Great review and testing. As more and more people migrate to these smaller low power rounds for self defense these videos become more important. In these non traditional self defense calibers it is the little things that make all the crucial difference between acceptable and not acceptable.
I can't believe it Sam I think you've made me a believer in larger longer barrelled 380s may carry in Summer or back n forth to range w Punch or Hydrashok Deep and not worry & I need to test the PPU I wouldn't mind you testing that in new protocol.
I think part of it is this M&P. The gas system however it works, makes it have less recoil than even steel pistols like PPK's and Bersas and whatnot. It's so weird how it feels like a .22 but throws a 9mm 100 gr bullet.
@GunSam all I've done vids on so far is Bersa Plus w 4.25"...so it's blowback but can shoot that or berettas super fast. I've got PPU jhps and getting some Punch in hope I can do more water jug tests in future different barrel lengths...but larger 380s may have a place...and they are much smaller top to bottom front of slide that similar 9mms so should be easier to carry in a way. I could maybe send you some ppu to test in a few calibers
Thanks. I was seriously looking at that 3" LCRx as a carry gun, until I started seeing disappointing performance in your real world gell tests. Thanks for all of your hard work. Happy Thanksgiving to all.
Happy Thanksgiving. The Hornady Critical Defense and Speer Gold Dot are better. The Critical Defense is the only load I've consistently seen do well in .22 WMR and always be available. It's almost worth settling in buying a .22 WMR because of that ammo. As long as you got that, practicing with cheaper ammo will do fine as long as both hit to the same point of aim.
I'm sticking to the dots in my 3 inch lcrx. Got plenty in stock and can practice with other 40gr. rounds that run at similar velocities. Thanks, Sam, and Happy Thanksgiving
great video Sam
good news about the federal punch --- I will pass it on
Thanks.
no surprises...thanks for the great tests...
I was a bit surprised. I've seen other people test the .22 mag to great results.
Good video, I like seeing this comparison . The 380 ammo looks pretty good.
22 wmr punch deep penetration is nothing to downplay although I think a much better comparison would be Hornady critical defense
45 grain 22 WMR or Speer gold dot. I think you will see expansion. Punch penetrates well but I have not seen it expand yet on a video.
Can you do a video with the hornady and Speer compared to the 380?
Thanks for testing these two cartridges. Like others have said, out of a rifle, the .22 mag could be really nasty. Out of the pistol, the .380 would be my choice. And the Federal Punch 85 gr is in the top 5 standard velocity loads for that round, right there with the higher velocity XTP loads and other Federal ones like Hydrashok and Hydrashok Deep. I hope you get to test the Defiant Munitions 80gr copper hollow point load sometime.
Change the grip. The smaller grip from the 2 inch LCR fits perfectly, more concealable, and handier...
No. You're backwards thinking. I don't have girly man hands. If the small one fits you, that's fine, but it does not fit me
Again, most excellent demos. As I currently don’t own anything in either caliber, I can’t really be a critic although I have to admit that the .22WMR as well as newer .22LR products interest me. The thing I’ve noted over the years is that any handgun round is not guaranteed to perform to the expectations of the person stuck in a position to rely on a particular combo in any randomly imposed situation. In one of the Dillinger gang escapades, a shop keeper stepped out on the sidewalk with what I believe was a S&W K-22 and knocked an armored up Homer VanMeter in the noggin. Knocked Homer out or stunned him for a brief instance. Both Homer and the shopkeeper lived to do their respective things another day. Wonder how something in .22WMR would have performed. Anyway, thanks for the video.
Thanks. Everyone should have some .22 LR firearms. So easy to shoot and shoot a lot. The .22 WMR is fine, but honestly for the money you could shoot 9mm in a semi auto or revolver for the same price for ammo. The .22 LR is a must have, the .22 WMR is more of a "because I can" thing. Sort of like how people buy .45 caliber airguns that have 200-300 ft lbs energy. There's a better way, but...
@@GunSam Okay, your “because I can,” statement is really insightful. Incidentally, I still have a 45, an M&P full size 45. Not because it’s a custom gun or anything, but because I used to carry it daily, shot it a lot, and shot well with it. I liked to shoot it. Bought Milt Sparks gun leather for it. But I also concluded that if S&W what offered a 9mm with those same dimensions, including grip, I’d have been just as happy. The M&P 9s just didn’t have the same feel. But I digress…
Interesting test. Thx.
I have a 22 WMR revolver with a 6.5 inch barrel. Using the velocity number from BBTI for that barrel length and CCI Maxi-Mag, if I recall correctly the energy calculates to 207 ft-lbs. That seems similar to the 380. (But of course that revolver is not very easy to conceal, if that is a concern.)
The 380 ACP punch is probably the best 380 ACP ammo I've seen. Right at 200 ft-lbs is also about as good as 380 gets energy wise. The projectile is doing what it should. Good construction.
If I recall, the Federal Hydrashok Deep was a tad better
th-cam.com/video/rW2gI4007g0/w-d-xo.html
@@GunSam Target Sports currently has the P38HSD1 in stock. You can also get it from Federal directly if you want to pay a lot more. I do wish it came out of a 2" barrel faster. But unlike the Punch, it seems to open up better.
@@GunSam I found this test more relevant for me. Also your glitch with the safety is one reason I like a revolver. Although key holing from a 2" barrel isn't the best news ever.
th-cam.com/video/YpHFCD_-qG8/w-d-xo.html
Consistency would be nice! LOL.
th-cam.com/video/FdPUG7AAFjQ/w-d-xo.html
🇺🇸
Thanks Sam, very good comparison information. In certain situations, could the further penetration of the 22 mag be more desirable than the greater expansion of the 38 acp ?
Have you seen the 1776 .380 ammo? Its like a sintered round thats a little lighter, magnetic, has a flat nose and penetrates sheet metal better than any .380 ive tried.
Wow. I was expecting a lot more from the Punch myself. I guess in .22LR format, it excels. Not so much for magnum version. Probably in a rifle barrel everything would change but then again, what makes Punch so much better than any other brand in a rifle?
It is POS for EDC but I think pmr30 may represent 22mag a little better when you get it to feed. 2,200fps varmint rounds should rase some hell for 6" or so in gel.
Have not seen chronograph on varmint rounds yet with pmr 30
The issue I have and have always had, is pistols like the PMR 30 are not really ergonomically normal for carry. Grip on the PMR 30 is massive, the overall size is just odd for carry. The LCRx even in a 3" is smaller than a Glock 19. If I had a thought that maybe 6 rounds of .22 WMR is not enough, I don't think the better solution is to just have more of the same 'not enough' lol.
@GunSam you're kinda missing his point he was trying to convey I think??... the extra inches of barrel will make a dif ...go snag the mp 22wmr n use the punch or hornady 30 gr or bettet yet 45 critical defense ...vastly different results...far as concealing the pmr is easy asf to conceal for me so is the mp 22 wmr . .as I have mainly carried 5.7 since 2006 in fn format (used to be 10mm for decade plus ) and then the ruger rock n now the mp has it its own 5.7 its an absolute joy to carry concealed with elite ammo t6b compared to the other 3 formats ..the mp22mag is about same size as their 5.7.. so it makes a great training tool for 5.7 of which im near 6k rds out of that n loving it (wallet not so much my pre pandemic stash is gettin low ,tho current 5.7 prices are getting better with aac )... but have 1800 thru the mp 22 already (way more reliable than the pmr30 outta the gate 100%) ...not that'd id intentionally trust rimfire for SD but it's sure better than a knife or bat if that's all you have time to grab realistically.....
I can say rimfire reliability has greatly improved over the days of old... outta 1800 ive had 3 fail to fires (ironically all gave been cci ) ..out of 1000 in 9mm thru my staccato I had 2 ..1000 rds of 5.7 mainly vmax 0..(i never use that American eagle trash 5.7 ammo in pistols and advise others follow suit in pdw fine , pistols? hard pass )
..so rimfire has greatly improved, which is great to see for the platform itself cuz imho some people have nerve dmg arthritis and can't handle normal SD loadings ...so im glad they now have a viable alt to ensure their safety ... feeling lucky ( see what i did there lol) shouldn't be an option esp in these crazy times where ppl seem to snap off for 0 reason n do cray crap to strangers (or heck maybe its more cell phones are just catching it and posting it up more n the world's ALWAYS been this volatile but i swear it hasnt who really knows lol ) ..in closing all I know is that 22wmr in the 30 vmax n 45 csd loads have dropped countless wild hogs my way in recent years (just a step behind what my 5.7 and 10mm did tbh ) .. and hogs hair , fatty skin, sinew,and bones are a lot more dense than what us sensitive humans are packing ...but those hunts were enough for me that if I had to, I certainly wouldn't hesitate to grab said rimfire to deter a threat ..bigger isn't always better no matter what the ladies tell us ..
Case in point , ill take buffalo bore hardcast 10mm on bear to vital areas all day over a 500 smith paw shot lol....ie accuracy will always trump caliber....cheers n tell Paul Kersey I said my model 29 shots were THE og hand cannon sounds before he tried to 1 up me with his automag lolol .
yep
Hey Sam! You still have that .30 break barrel?
Yeah lol
@@GunSam break it out for some interesting science! IIRC that video did pretty damn good on views too.
I wonder if the 22 Magnum is a non expanding Hollow Point design.
It is “ long “ for caliber to hopefully cause tumbling.
It’s definitely designed to expand. I’ve seen other tests where it does expand, but I think it depends on if it’s clear gel or regular and what gun it’s shot from.
Why balisticions turn grey
22 magnum expands when shot out of a rifle. Legit manstopper from my RIA M1500.
Yes but there are 3 or 4 ammos designed specifically for handgun velocity with a bullet construction designed to expand at lower velocity and energy. Those are the Speer Gold Dot, Hornady Critical Defense and Federal Punch. The other two expanded fine, and the punch did for me in the past, but it's so dependent on that 1,300 FPS I got in the past that just dropping 100 FPS and only like 20 ft lbs energy, was enough to make it not expand.
As far as I understand it, 22WMR is much more comparable to 32 ACP or 32 S&W Long in terms of ballistic energy out of a handgun. All 3 calibers fall in the 130 ft-lbs of energy range. Obviously the bullet weights and speeds between these are all quite different, which could definitely provide different penetration results. The 32 S&W Long is the heaviest and slowest, while the 22WMR out of a handgun is the lightest and fastest. The 32 ACP lies somewhere in the middle. I think a comparison of these three would be interesting.
Very good
Looks like rimfire is for small game, centerfire for social?
No one ever said "go ahead and shoot me with that little 22"
Thanks for the vid, partner. I've heard the myth that 22 Mag is as good for self defense as 38 Special or 380 ACP for 40 years, but have yet to see it proven.
In 90% of DGUs the mere presence of a gun is sufficient. Unless aggressor can distinguish caliber of gun in your hand, it won’t matter in those 90% of cases. It’s the other 10% we’re worrying about.
With the 90% in mind - I support having a 22 for self defense - if it’s a 223/556 rifle! Intimidation factor of seeing an AR is far more than that of seeing a pistol. Should boost that 90% appreciably.
I believe the .22 WMR would expand if it was out of a rifle hitting 1800 fps+. The speed out of the short barrel isn’t doing it justice
👍
This is a quick test I did in February with this same .22 WMR Federal Punch in the same revolver. th-cam.com/users/shorts8N0m7NzeLGI
Have there been any bad comments coming to you from my account high jacker ?
Sticking to the dots for my lcrx. I have a good inventory and can train with 40gr. rounds with similar velocities. Thanks for the uploads Sam.
HAPPY THANKSGIVING
Isn't.38 ACP just scalled up .32 ACP?
.38 ACP is the predecessor of the .38 Super Auto. Which means the .38 ACP is a low pressured outdated round. It uses about the same 115-125 gr bullets as the 9x19mm and is similar in power to a standard pressure 9x19mm round. The .32 ACP is a much smaller round with just a .313" bullet diameter (compared to the .38 ACP's .36" diameter) and fires a bullet about 60-75 gr and fires it slower than the .38 ACP so the .32 ACP is about half as powerful.
@@GunSam I've just checked ballistic coefficients of few manufacturers for FMJ 380 ACP, and they are lower than for FMJ 32 ACP. Similar nose shapes of bullet but significantly heavier 38 and having lower BC. Something very strange!
I am not an expert on things of that nature, however what I can say is heavier bullets tend to have more momentum and go further with less drop due to momentum.
@@GunSam Same here
People are failing to see that this is a revolver and there is a lot of gad leaking around the cylinder.
I wouldn't consider sun 5% gas loss as 'a lot'
Within the first minute I see a major error. You can't test ammo if you are using a revolver vs a semi-auto, why is that class???
There are not many 380 revolvers and the 22 magnum is iffy in semi-auto pistols.
If I'm carrying a true pocket pistol it'll be a North American Arms.22 Magnum revolver and it'll be in my front right pocket and no one will be the wiser. I don't think you can get a semi-automatic handgun small enough to fit in your front pocket 100% comfortably. I can carry that North American Arms five shot revolver and forget it's there. It's better than a sharp stick.
🙂👍
Real world accuracy, most shots are 5 to 15 feet not 25 yards
You are right. No one should move back further and try to be accurate. Better to need it and not have it than have it and not need it.
PizzA
🤷♂️ this comment shouldn’t disappear.
Where would it go?
@@GunSam I made a comment on a short yesterday that disappeared but it was early in posting. On the 22short to 44 mag which is a hot load for factory ammo .
.22 videos - hope they stop getting released by this channel.
You hope I stop releasing what I like releasing? Well, your hopes are dashed.
Says a guy never shot by a 22 magnum...