Well, this started out as a Quick Bytes episode, but then one thing led to another, yada yada yada, and well, enjoy this Mac's 15 minutes of fame! Do you remember this computer, in real life or on TV? Comment below & cheerio! Your friend in retro, Perifractic 👍🕹️
My dad had a Mac Plus, several of this era Macs actually. My first computer was a Mac Classic... similar look and specs, but slightly newer and with a hard drive. :)
I've personally never owned a Mac of this era, but I can clearly remember using them in school in the 80's and 90's, and honestly have never liked the way they ejected disc.
Google the PDFs 'Classic Mac Repair' and 'Dead Mac Scrolls', very handy. In the Classic Mac Repair, there is a section that goes over how to check the 5v and 12v lines which you can check from the external floppy connector. Adjusting is very easy, the adjustment is labeled on the white cardboard attached to the back of the analog board. Incorrrect voltage can cause these issues but its an easy check/fix if its that.
Are these the ones you mean? www.maccaps.com/MacCaps/DIY_Information_files/Classic%20Mac%20Repair%20Notes%20.pdf vintageapple.org/macbooks/pdf/The_Dead_Mac_Scrolls_1992.pdf
I wouldn't just yet turn the potentiometer I would do a full recape frist and then mess with it just for safe measures. I have done months of research and most people say dont twist it untill you know the problem because the pot can drift the voltage and your mac could end up reboot looping or chirping.
I have a Macintosh SE with dual 800k floppies I need to restore (both floppies) so this was very informative for where I should grease the mechanisms! :)
TNG has more claim on being an 80's show than that... What with it starting in 1987... Which, come to think of it is actually kind of a weird thought to me... I don't really associate that with the 80's... Not that I remember much of the 80's. Some bits and pieces, but I have much more consistent memories of about 1990 onwards than anything before that...
Recapping old macs is always recommended, because Apple used low quality capacitors that even if they aren't bulging at the top, they may be leaking electrolytic fluid at the bottom.
In order to ground / discharge you actually need a lead connected to ground. Since you disconnected the main lead, the ground connection inside the mac was actually floating. Next time you should connect a lead to actual ground (maybe a water tap, central heating, or the ground on one of your power sockets).
This is bad advice and very dangerous. The machine must be unplugged. Ask any electrical engineer. The voltage you are discharging is relative to itself. No ground is required. Also: photos.app.goo.gl/yNy5hL6uuVU8eZzT8 And most importantly: www.peachpit.com/articles/article.aspx?p=759704&seqNum=2
@@RetroRecipes I remember when I wanted to demonstrate this using a low-power flyback. I touched one lead, turned it on, and there were big (>2 cm) sparks jumping betwen the leads next to my finger. Unpowered it, touched the other, turned it on - same thing. But I moved my finger just a bit, and it got too close to the other HV wire - a centimeter long ark into my thumb, when my index was touching the other... I now call that thing a "learn to backflip" machine. The funny thing is that I shocked myself with it two more times on the same day.
Working from home on a friday morning... fresh brewed coffee in my mug.... jam on toast.... and I find this gem of a video. Absolutely wonderful. Thanks, mate.
Recently totally recapped a Macintosh Classic. While the caps looked fine, once I removed them you could see some physical leakage and that trademark fishy smell. Works great now.
I'd try with a drive replacement like the FLoppyEmu. With that you can easily find if the issue is with the drive or somewhere else. In my experience the capacitors never had anything to do with drive not working.. I own few Macintosh Plus/512K and when the drive didn't work the issue was always in some parts of the drive itself.
13:53 And I think this is down to one of these capacitors; They look fine, but over the 30 years they've changed electrically, and I think they've stopped being able to capacit.
That miniature Seinfeld set is just awesome. When you get in close with the camera it looks just like a scene from the show. Here’s an idea to try: get a green screen and chroma key yourself into the set, for whatever skit idea you want to do. Could be a fun idea!
You probably know this: they make special long T15 bits for specifically for getting into the Mac. You should pick one up in case you ever want to get "IN CASE" again, or another case. They cost about $8. I think I bought mine on eBay a couple years ago.
While it may not explicitly be the [only] culprit, at this point, I think you might as well do the re-capping to ensure the machine continues onward. But I guess that's just me being cautious with hardware.
1:40 1) Holy cow, that is so realistic! 2) It's so wild how the camera makes you think that the angles add up to 360º (all right angles), while it's actually 180º (an open stage). So weird to see "the set" from so far away! 3) Great recipode, Chris! Not even plinky-plonky! 4) That animation at the end looks like some early QuickTime stuff, by the look of it. Am I right?
Funny story, I never believed in the decharging in the CRTs until I had an issue with a Mac plus monitor swap out. I switched out a monitor from a Mac SE to a Mac plus. Everything was going fine. I swapped out the monitors no problem. When I picked up the dead monitor my finger went into the connection hole of the monitor. Needless to say I had a good shock. It was even worse than being shot by a Taser. 😄
4:47 "I'm not noticing any bulging capacitors, things are looking pretty good." Check those yelow or orange-ish ones. Technically they aren't bulging, but they are split in half. even if they aren't the source of your problem, it's recomended ro replace them.
I think the drive gear breaking after the ozone treatment is just a coincidence as they are notoriously prone to crumbling away as the plastic weakens with age (the 800k drives especially so as the Plus was the first machine to use these). The lubrication in the eject carriage tray (that holds the disk) also gums up and gets lethargic over time, as does the grease around that cog in the eject gearbox. During disk ejection the entire strain of the mechanism is channelled directly through that one gear, hence the already weak part shatters. After breaking a number of these due to this I now re-lube the drive mechanism on any machine new to me as a matter of course. Even so, about I’ve probably replaced this gear in a touch over half of the 20ish drives I’ve repaired. I’m not actually convinced on the longevity of any drives I have still retaining the original gear! However, the 1.44MB drives in the SEHDFD, SE30 and LC series machines appear be much less prone to breaking. As these were unobtanium until fairly recently I say the person responsible for designing and 3D printing a perfect replacement copy of this gear deserves a beer!
(Darth Vader voice) "I find your lack of eject disturbing" -> ROFL :D ^^ Congrats on getting major Brixty-Four coverage in the retro gamer magazine, BTW! That's awesome!! :D :D :D
You had a great chance of damaging the upper head by trying to insert a floppy after removing the black plastic part, that holds the head up, when no disk is inserted...
Hey Perifractic, have you ever considered buying a small air compressor and a blowgun attachment for your dust blowing needs? After paying 3-5 bucks for each can of that duster you're using, it would easily pay for itself in no time. Plus you can use other tools with it as well :)
Just when I was enjoying the fact that the drive was so serviceable and then the final sting in the tail. Blast. I have no idea if it is the caps or not but I am sure someone will. As usual, a mellifluous and enjoyable recipode.
I have had one instance of a floppy drive refusing to read because of bad capacitors, but in that instance it was surface-mount electrolytics on the drive itself.
I love you, your videos and the amount of care you take to restore these machines. Im still looking for a C64 in the wild to add to my collection and learning so much from watching you referb them. One day I'll be able to have that a reality. Thank you for what you do.
The magic of 3d printing! Did you design a new cog wheel based on the broken one, or were you able to find one ready made model? Thank you very much for this video.
Then wasting time and money in the late 90s designing a computer built inside a CRT when the world had already moved on to LCD/TFT flatscreen technology.
I don't think it's the caps, except for the eject motor. Maybe the disk drive power is separated from the logic power and maybe a bad cap could have shunted the supply for the drive. But thats a lot of maybes
Yeah, as much as people like to talk about the dangers of a CRT, the current is pretty low. Even if you DO get zapped the chances of it causing any serious injury are quite remote. I mean, YES, it IS effectively a giant capacitor that will store some charge for weeks after the machine is unplugged, but it's not the 'lethal' hazard it's made out to be. Meanwhile, attempting to discharge it carries a risk of it's own, since the tube contains a vacuum, and if you were to say scratch or otherwise damage the tube (the neck is especially fragile), it could implode, which would send shards of glass flying everywhere. CRT's do require some degree of caution. Also really, REALLY old ones (like the first ones that existed - pre 1900's even) produced X-rays, which is where all those old stories about 'sitting too close to the TV' being bad for you likely came from. So... Not as dangerous as it's sometimes presented, but still, use caution around CRT's...
I had picked up a super long Craftsman T-15 years ago for opening toastermacs. (Also at 1:50, that's an SE, but at 1:56, that's a Classic (or Classic II, or Performa 200, but based on the printing, it's probably a Classic/Classic II ) ;D
so lovely to see apt fellows like yourself giving these wonderful old machines some dedicated tlc and preserving this fascinating old tech. when i bought a ps1 in 1998 i passed on my beloved old c64 with a 1541 and about 300 tape games and about 100 diskettes, only to learn the little brats skipped it when they got a ps1 about 6 months down the line *weeps* lessons learned hard are lessons learned well i suppose
Try heating the electrolytic capacitors in the power supply with a hair dryer while trying to load the disk. The temporary expansion of the electrolyte will bring the capacitors temporarily closer to the marked and engineered values. A bad capacitor has lost electrolyte, coming out onto the PC Board by the leads. Look for a brown stain there to identify the bad ones!
The weird thing is I just tested all the voltages and they measured perfectly at the drive plug. I'm still just as confused as to what is going on here.
What you cannot easily test is the ripple coming out of the power supply from deficient filter capacitors, also capacitors supply rush current to prevent transient voltatage sags, like when the head Motor, and disc motor begins spinning. This could cause noise injected into the head read amplifier, leading to partially unrecognizable data being presented to the IO port on the motherboard.
Oh yeah, looking forward to the recapping video. Still have my old Mac plus which needs some soldering for the monitor connections. I might as well recap them as well
Jerry is only using his Mac in 1 or 2 episodes, though. It was product placement by Apple, but they often got it for free as just free props for production companies to use with no requirements to show the brand logo or anything. incidentally, I've also seen a few Atari STs on TV...one in a Pantene (I think) commercial and one a few times in IT'S GARRY SHANDLING'S SHOW (R.I.P. Garry).
11/10 on the Pun-O-meter And link to the STL for the gear? Can’t hurt to change the capacitors ... May work may be easier to see the amperage draw to the drive during normal operation and clicky operation.
As much as I love pretty much ALL retro-computer equipment (including old apple models), I utterly despise this machine with a vengeance!!!!! I was forced to use these back in the 90's while doing my degree. Always crashing (Gurrrgh!) and slower than a unipedal dog with a broken leg.....
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Thnk you for the video. One note: If you are discharging a device, you need a *real* ground. Don't use the device groud (because it is not connectoed to anything), use a radiator or something like this (or a ground wire in the house if you konw what you're doing).
Because it has nowhere to discharge (as I see in the video, maybe you discharged it already). Discharge means to connect the charged part to the ground. You did this with a screwdriver, right? But the ground of the machine should also be grounded somewhere (connected to a ground) - if not connected, the machine ground is just not ground. Ususaly the ground connection is obtained through the power cable (side by side with the power and neutral line).
You may want to replace the capacitors. They may look fine, but considering the heat they sustain during operation, and their age that actually breaks the rubber-bakelite seals on the capacitor itself. A manufacturer[ELNA - elna.co.jp/en ] states that the current products' seals are guaranteed only up to 15 years.
Please take care that you acctually plug the ground somewhere it acctually connects to ground when you do the discharges. Not just where the ground should be. When you hover mac like that, there is no ground at all anywhere...
The voltage you are discharging is relative to itself. No ground is required. Also: photos.app.goo.gl/yNy5hL6uuVU8eZzT8 And most importantly: www.peachpit.com/articles/article.aspx?p=759704&seqNum=2
@@RetroRecipes You are most correct, and these manuals are ok - in principle. To be perfectly safe connect ground plane to wall socket ground. Not neutral or, god forbid, whole plug... This way you are providing common ground for you and your electronic and completely safe discharge path. I've had instances of caps blowing on discharge, without proper ground, imagine that with a CRT? :)
I'm curious as to why that one gear broke down the way it did while the other ones were all fine. I'd wager that gear was white when it was brand new. Must have been a different plastic batch
Also like other people have mentioned, the tantalums on your logic board are a good candidate for recapping too. I've seen a couple of videos on IBM and Apple rescues where the tantalum capacitors had either gone short or gone open
Since oxidation was a concern from the ozone, I'd look at pulling all the DIP chips and cleaning the contacts and. re-inserting them. At the very least the IWM chip which is the floppy controller. That broken eject gear is very common amongst all the 3.5 drives that Apple used, so I doubt the ozone had anything to do with it. I would also recommend cleaning and lubricating the four bushings on the disk carrier as well, as they often seize up and put strain on the eject motor
Are there any other socketed chips? If so take them out and clean the contacts. Maybe take a close look at the logicboard in case of some prior accidental damage, and the floppy drive cable in case there's damage there. Recapping isn't a bad idea overall.
This is lovely late night viewing for me and every episode seems to get better! The camera work, editing and production are top notch m8. Bit o witty banter too. It's feckin good, it really is :)
OMG That screaming Floppy drive.... You MONSTER! What kind of heinous torturing did you do to make it scream like that (ok i know the ozone thingy but, i had to make a joke about the screaming... )
Thanks for the VERY informative video! I have a bunch of 800k drives (Sony MFD-51W-03 & -10 & others) for Mac Plus computers that I'm trying to get back into working condition. I've managed to get a few of them back to fully functioning, thanks to yours and other youtube videos! But there are a few drives in which the head assembly simply does not move from the zero point. Well, if I manually move the head away from zero, when I power up the computer it will return to zero, but after that the heads never move. The drive spins and everything else appears to be okay. Have you ever encountered this type of behavior? Do you happen to know the solution for it? Here's a video of it: @t Thanks again!!
Ive seen capacitors in power supplies for older computers do that IE the computer would turn on but wouldn't boot THE lights would come on But nothing else
Imagine how nice all these things would look if they didn't have that fire retardant in the plastic. What were the odds of any computers causing a fire anyhow? It seems that they were just being overly cautious.
Actually the current theory is that it has nothing to do with the fire retardant at all. I talked about this in the video where I try to retrobrite using air.
EDIT: I WAS WRONG, basing my understanding on a mad French man I worked with in the 90s. Really should have known better! Sorry for ever doubting you peri. When you 'discharged' the CRT to the chassis, the chassis itself wasn't grounded so all you did was increase the risk of an electric shock and potentially frying the electronics. Chances are that the CRT had already discharged via a bleeder resistor, but if you had yanked the power lead whilst the CRT was on this may have had a less fortunate outcome. Next time, keep the power cable connected but switched off at the socket to ensure the chassis is properly earthed when you discharge a CRT. Getting zapped isn't always dangerous; it depends on the path the electricity finds through your body. e.g. If your left hand is grounded and your right hand is shocked, the charge will travel through your heart, which if you're unlucky can cause ventricular fibrillation (i.e. your heart stops).
This is bad advice and very dangerous. The machine must be unplugged. Ask any electrical engineer. The voltage you are discharging is relative to itself. No ground is required. Also: photos.app.goo.gl/yNy5hL6uuVU8eZzT8 And most importantly: www.peachpit.com/articles/article.aspx?p=759704&seqNum=2
@@RetroRecipes Thanks for correcting me. I'm ready for my walk of SHAME! SHAME! SHAME! When I was a teenager I worked in a computer shop and our tech guy discharged CRTs using a screwdriver plugged into the earth pin of a wall socket. I foolishly assumed that mad bastard knew what he was doing! I promise to double check stuff in future before spewing bad advice in TH-cam comments!!!!!
@@RetroRecipes D'OH!. ;). Then it can be whatever, including the caps in the floppy drives anyway. I've just seen Amiga ones and they love to fail with age. I insist that I would change the caps there first, but that's just an idea of course. Cheers.
![BOWKYLION - วิงวอน (ex-change) [Official MV]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/cLdnZWDaO-w/mqdefault.jpg)
Well, this started out as a Quick Bytes episode, but then one thing led to another, yada yada yada, and well, enjoy this Mac's 15 minutes of fame! Do you remember this computer, in real life or on TV? Comment below & cheerio! Your friend in retro, Perifractic 👍🕹️
My dad had a Mac Plus, several of this era Macs actually. My first computer was a Mac Classic... similar look and specs, but slightly newer and with a hard drive. :)
I've personally never owned a Mac of this era, but I can clearly remember using them in school in the 80's and 90's, and honestly have never liked the way they ejected disc.
You yada yada'd over the best part!!!
That's my ketchup secret 🍈🍈
I would vote but lego's site is messed up
Google the PDFs 'Classic Mac Repair' and 'Dead Mac Scrolls', very handy. In the Classic Mac Repair, there is a section that goes over how to check the 5v and 12v lines which you can check from the external floppy connector. Adjusting is very easy, the adjustment is labeled on the white cardboard attached to the back of the analog board. Incorrrect voltage can cause these issues but its an easy check/fix if its that.
Are these the ones you mean?
www.maccaps.com/MacCaps/DIY_Information_files/Classic%20Mac%20Repair%20Notes%20.pdf
vintageapple.org/macbooks/pdf/The_Dead_Mac_Scrolls_1992.pdf
"Macintosh repair and upgrade secrets" is good as well
I had the Dead Mac Scrolls but not Classic Mac Repair. It's excellent! 👍🕹️
I wouldn't just yet turn the potentiometer I would do a full recape frist and then mess with it just for safe measures. I have done months of research and most people say dont twist it untill you know the problem because the pot can drift the voltage and your mac could end up reboot looping or chirping.
@@JosephDavies yup, those are them.
I have a Macintosh SE with dual 800k floppies I need to restore (both floppies) so this was very informative for where I should grease the mechanisms! :)
"80's TV show"
For six months lol. And 8 and a half years in the 90's
But we'll give you that one on technicality.
The Simpsons was a short on the Tracy Ullman show for 87-89 so it's a slightly stronger case to consider them 80s along with Married with Children.
Saved by the Bell count? lol
TNG has more claim on being an 80's show than that...
What with it starting in 1987...
Which, come to think of it is actually kind of a weird thought to me...
I don't really associate that with the 80's...
Not that I remember much of the 80's.
Some bits and pieces, but I have much more consistent memories of about 1990 onwards than anything before that...
Seinfeld was a 90s sitcom. Sure it started in 1989, but that was barely 1 pilot episode, it's first season started in 1990. See IMDB.
@@KuraIthys Because TNG was a daytime/afternoon juggernaut in syndication throughout the 90's and 2000's
I never saw a single episode on primetime.
Recapping old macs is always recommended, because Apple used low quality capacitors that even if they aren't bulging at the top, they may be leaking electrolytic fluid at the bottom.
In order to ground / discharge you actually need a lead connected to ground. Since you disconnected the main lead, the ground connection inside the mac was actually floating. Next time you should connect a lead to actual ground (maybe a water tap, central heating, or the ground on one of your power sockets).
This is bad advice and very dangerous. The machine must be unplugged. Ask any electrical engineer. The voltage you are discharging is relative to itself. No ground is required. Also: photos.app.goo.gl/yNy5hL6uuVU8eZzT8
And most importantly: www.peachpit.com/articles/article.aspx?p=759704&seqNum=2
As it's a capacitor, you only have to short it - no need to actually ground it.
@@RetroRecipes I remember when I wanted to demonstrate this using a low-power flyback.
I touched one lead, turned it on, and there were big (>2 cm) sparks jumping betwen the leads next to my finger.
Unpowered it, touched the other, turned it on - same thing.
But I moved my finger just a bit, and it got too close to the other HV wire - a centimeter long ark into my thumb, when my index was touching the other...
I now call that thing a "learn to backflip" machine. The funny thing is that I shocked myself with it two more times on the same day.
Living dangerously! 👍🕹️
Working from home on a friday morning... fresh brewed coffee in my mug.... jam on toast.... and I find this gem of a video. Absolutely wonderful. Thanks, mate.
Still haven't gotten my screwdriver back, Perifractic.
Oh shoot sorry Filip. Soon I promise.
haha
Recently totally recapped a Macintosh Classic. While the caps looked fine, once I removed them you could see some physical leakage and that trademark fishy smell. Works great now.
I'd try with a drive replacement like the FLoppyEmu. With that you can easily find if the issue is with the drive or somewhere else.
In my experience the capacitors never had anything to do with drive not working..
I own few Macintosh Plus/512K and when the drive didn't work the issue was always in some parts of the drive itself.
I've reached out to the guy that makes it dot-dot-dot 🤞🕹️
"No, sir. I didn't see you playing with your dolls again." - Space Balls
I like how you made a plug for your article, and made the comment at the end of the drive assembly to state, not to forget the plug.
Well spotted 👍🕹️
13:53 And I think this is down to one of these capacitors; They look fine, but over the 30 years they've changed electrically, and I think they've stopped being able to capacit.
1MB of memory!!!.....Holy hell are you going to run the world with that?
Not just the world. The Universe! *Cue the Imperial March*
I know! That's 384K more memory than Bill Gates supposedly said you'd ever need!
Nobody needs more than 1MB of memory!
Yeah because that 1MB makes the computer slow enough to stop time
No matter how many times I hear the unscrew/screw noise, it still makes me smile.
That miniature Seinfeld set is just awesome. When you get in close with the camera it looks just like a scene from the show. Here’s an idea to try: get a green screen and chroma key yourself into the set, for whatever skit idea you want to do. Could be a fun idea!
Haha I like that!
You probably know this: they make special long T15 bits for specifically for getting into the Mac. You should pick one up in case you ever want to get "IN CASE" again, or another case. They cost about $8. I think I bought mine on eBay a couple years ago.
While it may not explicitly be the [only] culprit, at this point, I think you might as well do the re-capping to ensure the machine continues onward. But I guess that's just me being cautious with hardware.
1:40 1) Holy cow, that is so realistic!
2) It's so wild how the camera makes you think that the angles add up to 360º (all right angles), while it's actually 180º (an open stage). So weird to see "the set" from so far away!
3) Great recipode, Chris! Not even plinky-plonky!
4) That animation at the end looks like some early QuickTime stuff, by the look of it. Am I right?
Funny story, I never believed in the decharging in the CRTs until I had an issue with a Mac plus monitor swap out. I switched out a monitor from a Mac SE to a Mac plus. Everything was going fine. I swapped out the monitors no problem. When I picked up the dead monitor my finger went into the connection hole of the monitor. Needless to say I had a good shock. It was even worse than being shot by a Taser. 😄
Jeez!
4:47 "I'm not noticing any bulging capacitors, things are looking pretty good."
Check those yelow or orange-ish ones. Technically they aren't bulging, but they are split in half. even if they aren't the source of your problem, it's recomended ro replace them.
Those splits are actually by design from the factory, so if they blow they blow away from the board
@@RetroRecipes Good to know!
I think the drive gear breaking after the ozone treatment is just a coincidence as they are notoriously prone to crumbling away as the plastic weakens with age (the 800k drives especially so as the Plus was the first machine to use these). The lubrication in the eject carriage tray (that holds the disk) also gums up and gets lethargic over time, as does the grease around that cog in the eject gearbox. During disk ejection the entire strain of the mechanism is channelled directly through that one gear, hence the already weak part shatters. After breaking a number of these due to this I now re-lube the drive mechanism on any machine new to me as a matter of course. Even so, about I’ve probably replaced this gear in a touch over half of the 20ish drives I’ve repaired. I’m not actually convinced on the longevity of any drives I have still retaining the original gear! However, the 1.44MB drives in the SEHDFD, SE30 and LC series machines appear be much less prone to breaking. As these were unobtanium until fairly recently I say the person responsible for designing and 3D printing a perfect replacement copy of this gear deserves a beer!
(Darth Vader voice) "I find your lack of eject disturbing" -> ROFL :D ^^ Congrats on getting major Brixty-Four coverage in the retro gamer magazine, BTW! That's awesome!! :D :D :D
Thank you for your kind words. Means a lot. 👍🕹
You had a great chance of damaging the upper head by trying to insert a floppy after removing the black plastic part, that holds the head up, when no disk is inserted...
Hey Perifractic, have you ever considered buying a small air compressor and a blowgun attachment for your dust blowing needs? After paying 3-5 bucks for each can of that duster you're using, it would easily pay for itself in no time. Plus you can use other tools with it as well :)
Just when I was enjoying the fact that the drive was so serviceable and then the final sting in the tail. Blast. I have no idea if it is the caps or not but I am sure someone will. As usual, a mellifluous and enjoyable recipode.
Thank you! We'll get it working don't worry 🤞🕹️
I have had one instance of a floppy drive refusing to read because of bad capacitors, but in that instance it was surface-mount electrolytics on the drive itself.
I love you, your videos and the amount of care you take to restore these machines. Im still looking for a C64 in the wild to add to my collection and learning so much from watching you referb them. One day I'll be able to have that a reality. Thank you for what you do.
Wow thank you Sara! Keep your fleaBay eyes peeled and let me know how you get on! 👍🕹️
He knows what we came here for, the instant replay of the dust getting blown off.
The magic of 3d printing! Did you design a new cog wheel based on the broken one, or were you able to find one ready made model? Thank you very much for this video.
See description 👍🕹️
You really put a lot of time and effort into each and every episode. Kudos for that 👍🏻
Thanks for noticing!
With the support of ladyfrantic and puppyfrantic
I've never owned a Mac in my life, but still had to watch the whole video.
00:50 No manual eject mechanism on floppy drive - brilliant idea and the one button mouse, absolutely magic!
Then wasting time and money in the late 90s designing a computer built inside a CRT when the world had already moved on to LCD/TFT flatscreen technology.
I don't think it's the caps, except for the eject motor. Maybe the disk drive power is separated from the logic power and maybe a bad cap could have shunted the supply for the drive. But thats a lot of maybes
After a rather stressful day of working with old Apples and Macs this was a great stress relieving video! Thank you. You cracked me up.
I was waiting for the Mac to start jumping around spitting out random chunks of diskette like throwing a brick into a washing machine!
What could be better than Saturday afternoon? Saturday afternoon with a Perifractic video!!! Great as ever.
Thank you for your kind words. Means a lot. 👍🕹
Now you need a scale model of Jerry's Apartment from Season 1 where it had the slanted windows
Woah!
puppy-fractic's face. Awww give the poor pupper their bed back. Mean mean mean Lord Mac. Bad Sith Lord. Bad!
She actually has two identical. Spoilt pupper!
I know I’ve said it before but I love the screw sound effects!!! Great video btw!
Man, I really don't like Apple these days, but there's something about these old Macs that just endears me.
Yeah, as much as people like to talk about the dangers of a CRT, the current is pretty low. Even if you DO get zapped the chances of it causing any serious injury are quite remote.
I mean, YES, it IS effectively a giant capacitor that will store some charge for weeks after the machine is unplugged, but it's not the 'lethal' hazard it's made out to be.
Meanwhile, attempting to discharge it carries a risk of it's own, since the tube contains a vacuum, and if you were to say scratch or otherwise damage the tube (the neck is especially fragile), it could implode, which would send shards of glass flying everywhere.
CRT's do require some degree of caution.
Also really, REALLY old ones (like the first ones that existed - pre 1900's even) produced X-rays, which is where all those old stories about 'sitting too close to the TV' being bad for you likely came from.
So... Not as dangerous as it's sometimes presented, but still, use caution around CRT's...
I had picked up a super long Craftsman T-15 years ago for opening toastermacs. (Also at 1:50, that's an SE, but at 1:56, that's a Classic (or Classic II, or Performa 200, but based on the printing, it's probably a Classic/Classic II ) ;D
Touching a high voltage switching power supply is a shocking experience!
Genuinely impressed at your Vader impression
I am (not) your father!
I can't see it, did you provide a link to that 3D printed gear? Which plastic (ABS, PETG, etc.) did you use?
Sorry I got it on eBay... There are a few sellers I think
Good job on fixing that Macintosh's floppy drive!
It'd be a shame if you had lost it due to your amazing attempt of retro-sunbrighting.
Loving the sound effects! Especially the unscrewing noise 🤣🤣
What that was real!
so lovely to see apt fellows like yourself giving these wonderful old machines some dedicated tlc and preserving this fascinating old tech. when i bought a ps1 in 1998 i passed on my beloved old c64 with a 1541 and about 300 tape games and about 100 diskettes, only to learn the little brats skipped it when they got a ps1 about 6 months down the line *weeps* lessons learned hard are lessons learned well i suppose
Try heating the electrolytic capacitors in the power supply with a hair dryer while trying to load the disk. The temporary expansion of the electrolyte will bring the capacitors temporarily closer to the marked and engineered values.
A bad capacitor has lost electrolyte, coming out onto the PC Board by the leads. Look for a brown stain there to identify the bad ones!
The weird thing is I just tested all the voltages and they measured perfectly at the drive plug. I'm still just as confused as to what is going on here.
What you cannot easily test is the ripple coming out of the power supply from deficient filter capacitors, also capacitors supply rush current to prevent transient voltatage sags, like when the head Motor, and disc motor begins spinning. This could cause noise injected into the head read amplifier, leading to partially unrecognizable data being presented to the IO port on the motherboard.
Also reseat all that RAM, the BIOS may not have a good storage medium to work from to run its start up routines.
Oh yeah, looking forward to the recapping video. Still have my old Mac plus which needs some soldering for the monitor connections. I might as well recap them as well
"Luke, you are my Mac!" 😆
Jerry is only using his Mac in 1 or 2 episodes, though. It was product placement by Apple, but they often got it for free as just free props for production companies to use with no requirements to show the brand logo or anything. incidentally, I've also seen a few Atari STs on TV...one in a Pantene (I think) commercial and one a few times in IT'S GARRY SHANDLING'S SHOW (R.I.P. Garry).
RIP Garry ❤️
11/10 on the Pun-O-meter
And link to the STL for the gear?
Can’t hurt to change the capacitors ... May work may be easier to see the amperage draw to the drive during normal operation and clicky operation.
Sorry I got the gear on eBay so I don't have the STL myself
Perifractic's Retro Recipes No worries. Looking forward to the next instalment!
Seinfeld explains perfectly where all the bad i mean dad jokes come from.
Recap (replace ALL the elcos) the entire analog board as soon as possible!
As much as I love pretty much ALL retro-computer equipment (including old apple models), I utterly despise this machine with a vengeance!!!!! I was forced to use these back in the 90's while doing my degree. Always crashing (Gurrrgh!) and slower than a unipedal dog with a broken leg.....
Thnk you for the video. One note: If you are discharging a device, you need a *real* ground. Don't use the device groud (because it is not connectoed to anything), use a radiator or something like this (or a ground wire in the house if you konw what you're doing).
To discharge a CRT? Why?
Because it has nowhere to discharge (as I see in the video, maybe you discharged it already). Discharge means to connect the charged part to the ground. You did this with a screwdriver, right? But the ground of the machine should also be grounded somewhere (connected to a ground) - if not connected, the machine ground is just not ground. Ususaly the ground connection is obtained through the power cable (side by side with the power and neutral line).
Actually that's not correct and is very dangerous. I'll explain why in a video this weekend. 👍🕹️
@@RetroRecipes ok
This scratched all of my itches.
Wow! Amazing mini scenario
You may want to replace the capacitors. They may look fine, but considering the heat they sustain during operation, and their age that actually breaks the rubber-bakelite seals on the capacitor itself. A manufacturer[ELNA - elna.co.jp/en ] states that the current products' seals are guaranteed only up to 15 years.
Please take care that you acctually plug the ground somewhere it acctually connects to ground when you do the discharges.
Not just where the ground should be. When you hover mac like that, there is no ground at all anywhere...
The voltage you are discharging is relative to itself. No ground is required. Also: photos.app.goo.gl/yNy5hL6uuVU8eZzT8
And most importantly: www.peachpit.com/articles/article.aspx?p=759704&seqNum=2
@@RetroRecipes You are most correct, and these manuals are ok - in principle. To be perfectly safe connect ground plane to wall socket ground. Not neutral or, god forbid, whole plug...
This way you are providing common ground for you and your electronic and completely safe discharge path.
I've had instances of caps blowing on discharge, without proper ground, imagine that with a CRT? :)
I'm curious as to why that one gear broke down the way it did while the other ones were all fine. I'd wager that gear was white when it was brand new. Must have been a different plastic batch
Also like other people have mentioned, the tantalums on your logic board are a good candidate for recapping too. I've seen a couple of videos on IBM and Apple rescues where the tantalum capacitors had either gone short or gone open
Since oxidation was a concern from the ozone, I'd look at pulling all the DIP chips and cleaning the contacts and. re-inserting them. At the very least the IWM chip which is the floppy controller.
That broken eject gear is very common amongst all the 3.5 drives that Apple used, so I doubt the ozone had anything to do with it. I would also recommend cleaning and lubricating the four bushings on the disk carrier as well, as they often seize up and put strain on the eject motor
Well I've tried 3 drives, so I don't think it's the bushings... Sadly my IWM isn't socketed. What would you do first, recap or swap IWMs? Thanks! 👍🕹️
Are there any other socketed chips? If so take them out and clean the contacts.
Maybe take a close look at the logicboard in case of some prior accidental damage, and the floppy drive cable in case there's damage there.
Recapping isn't a bad idea overall.
Also, do you have any external Apple 3.5 drives? If so, plug it in to the drive port and see if it can read a disk from that
Nice ideas. The other 2 main chips are socketed and I'm going to reseat them 👍🕹️
Look at the capatitor at 13:59, the top one is broken of on the side, i see a gap there.
This is lovely late night viewing for me and every episode seems to get better! The camera work, editing and production are top notch m8. Bit o witty banter too. It's feckin good, it really is :)
Wow thank you very much!
Looking forward to the next episode in this Mac saga.
You are not getting enough gigawatts to the flux capacitor. :D
(5:10) "And if you do die, don't come running to me."
Because Perifractic installed chainsaw windows, to automatically fight through zombie hordes.
Absolutely love the Seinfeld Set replica.
Cool isn't it?! 👍🕹️
Jerry also had some boxed NES games on his shelf.
And no NES?!
Perifractic's Retro Recipes Very strange, I know, but true! It was discussed on Nintendo Age and other places. :)
Good times coming!
This video was really rad! Super well made
2:00 except that on this frame shot, it's not a SE. It's a Classic (1990) or Classic II. Can't read the writing but definitely that shape.
Does anyone have a link to the new gear? The old link in the description no longer works.
I agree with jan bete it is allways a good idea to repace the caps
Hi, _I'm_ Jan Beta!
@@RetroRecipes lol
Totally off-topic, but what breed is puppy-fractic? A german-shepherd?
German Shepherd Great Pyrenees mix ❤️🕹️
I'm still waiting for the "Ask Puppyfractic" recipode! :D
So is she! 🤣
OMG That screaming Floppy drive.... You MONSTER! What kind of heinous torturing did you do to make it scream like that (ok i know the ozone thingy but, i had to make a joke about the screaming... )
5:10 "if you do die, don't come running to me" AS ZOMBIE!
Absolutely love the wee Seinfeld set!
Isn't it cool! 👍🕹️
This Floppy is behaving just like Kramer
Hipster doofus 💾
4:45 ta-da, it's really that simple!
Thanks for the reminder about the Brixty-four vote. Account created and vote registered.
E P I C !!!! So informative and entertaining!!! 💥💥👍👍👍👍
Thank you for your kind words. Means a lot. 👍🕹
Thanks for the VERY informative video!
I have a bunch of 800k drives (Sony MFD-51W-03 & -10 & others) for Mac Plus computers that I'm trying to get back into working condition. I've managed to get a few of them back to fully functioning, thanks to yours and other youtube videos! But there are a few drives in which the head assembly simply does not move from the zero point. Well, if I manually move the head away from zero, when I power up the computer it will return to zero, but after that the heads never move. The drive spins and everything else appears to be okay. Have you ever encountered this type of behavior? Do you happen to know the solution for it? Here's a video of it: @t
Thanks again!!
So good, so satisfying
0:42 is R2D2 being tickled by C3P0
voted for the brixty four and tweeted about it. how has it not reached the goal yet??
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Honestly people blame the Lego site for being so hard to sign up for...
Perifractic's Retro Recipes it’s no different than signing up for any other site...... damn pansy’s! Lmao I’m kidding!!! 😂
That Philips screw driver joke really makes me laught :D
your very funny and your video's are never boring.
[Mac Plus screaming]
did your floppy drive feel loose when the gear broke cause mine feels really loose and im about to replace the gear
Not really
Ive seen capacitors in power supplies for older computers do that IE the computer would turn on but wouldn't boot THE lights would come on But nothing else
Imagine how nice all these things would look if they didn't have that fire retardant in the plastic. What were the odds of any computers causing a fire anyhow? It seems that they were just being overly cautious.
Actually the current theory is that it has nothing to do with the fire retardant at all. I talked about this in the video where I try to retrobrite using air.
Really good episode!
EDIT: I WAS WRONG, basing my understanding on a mad French man I worked with in the 90s. Really should have known better! Sorry for ever doubting you peri.
When you 'discharged' the CRT to the chassis, the chassis itself wasn't grounded so all you did was increase the risk of an electric shock and potentially frying the electronics.
Chances are that the CRT had already discharged via a bleeder resistor, but if you had yanked the power lead whilst the CRT was on this may have had a less fortunate outcome.
Next time, keep the power cable connected but switched off at the socket to ensure the chassis is properly earthed when you discharge a CRT.
Getting zapped isn't always dangerous; it depends on the path the electricity finds through your body. e.g. If your left hand is grounded and your right hand is shocked, the charge will travel through your heart, which if you're unlucky can cause ventricular fibrillation (i.e. your heart stops).
This is bad advice and very dangerous. The machine must be unplugged. Ask any electrical engineer. The voltage you are discharging is relative to itself. No ground is required. Also: photos.app.goo.gl/yNy5hL6uuVU8eZzT8
And most importantly: www.peachpit.com/articles/article.aspx?p=759704&seqNum=2
@@RetroRecipes Thanks for correcting me. I'm ready for my walk of SHAME! SHAME! SHAME!
When I was a teenager I worked in a computer shop and our tech guy discharged CRTs using a screwdriver plugged into the earth pin of a wall socket. I foolishly assumed that mad bastard knew what he was doing! I promise to double check stuff in future before spewing bad advice in TH-cam comments!!!!!
In my modern macbook pro, it turned out to be the hdd cable that caused the question mark.
What an Amazing work here. Congratulations !. BTW can you recommend a 3D printing site that can deliver to (almost) any country?
I would change first the caps in the floppy drive. I think that that will be enough.
Thing is I've tried 3 drives...
@@RetroRecipes D'OH!. ;). Then it can be whatever, including the caps in the floppy drives anyway. I've just seen Amiga ones and they love to fail with age. I insist that I would change the caps there first, but that's just an idea of course. Cheers.
Interesting... 15:22 It is look like epson sd-700 drive