It's just the Jedi focusing on the wrong things. They don't want to ask "why"? Why did Slick do this? And was he right? YES. And forget the "put his brothers in danger". For one, he would be saving far, far, faaaar more brothers if he found his freedom and sabotaged the Republic. Most importantly, the onus is not on Slick when the Jedi quite literally have a child army of Clone slaves in the first place. A slave wanting freedom is not wrong, and money too. The Jedi and Republic are the reason there are Clone slaves in the first place. And of course Slick would go to the Seps! The first step of freedom is to find safety in CIS territory. Come on.
Rex and Cody didn't say anything against it because they knew slick was right...when he straight out told Kenobi and Anakin how their order enslaved his brothers, none of the guards, not Cody, Not Rex said anything against it. Because they couldn't argue with it. They only said if he loved them he wouldn't have put them at risk and said nothing more to defend their jedi Generals because its true...even if their jedi treat them like living beings, no one else in the republic does
I really like how many individual clones there are and how different they are from each of their fellows. It’s one of the reasons why The Bad Batch and The Clone Wars are so good.
I know what I’m gunna say doesn’t exactly relate to what your saying. But I agree with you, and it’s one of the reasons I prefer the clone wars era over galactic civil war era any day.
Bad Batch? Don't you mean the Clone Wars? In Bad Batch the clones are antagonized heavily which I don't like. Basically turning them into buckedhead stormtroopers again. Just generic bad guys, idk what happened to the clones we knew in the Clone Wars
@@szczypior2714 Both but there are individual clones in The Bad Batch like Howser and The Batch itself. I hate the Mandolorian because of the generic bad guys are bad but the Bad Batch is actually well made and the clones are different from bucketheads. You see that on several episodes such as 11, 1, 12, and 9
Each year that passes in the Star Wars Universe, Slick looks better and better. However, his willingness to cooperate in a scheme that got several of his own brothers killed, really hurt his cause morally. He was well-intentioned and had very valid concerns and a reason to protest, but I can't deny that in execution he went about it very wrong. He is a good and complex character though, that's very well written. Fives on the other hand went about it the right way, morally, in fighting for he and his brothers' cause, but Palpatine made sure it didn't matter in the end tragically. Hopefully Howzer can come through and finally succeed.
Howzer succeeding is Palpatines plan. He made sure the clones on the twilek planet weren't issued order 66 and that no jedi were stationed there during order 66. This way the clone uprising begins and he can get rid of the disposable army of the republic, to make room for an army made up from the galaxy.
Clones were slaves and were just used to fight the CIS and kill jedi but at the end of the day the clones weren't getting paid, didn't really have any time away from the war, weren't allowed to form relationships, and if any clone decides to desert the GAR they were killed by covert clone assassins. So clones weren't treated like they were people but as a product with no worth.
@@capncake8837 true but the republic was against slavery but still they used a slave army to fight for the republic which is a contradiction to what the republic was meant to be
Tbh I always thought of Slick as a more "evil" version of Cut. Slick defected for the right reasons, but he seemed willing to sacrifice many of his own brothers for himself. I can understand why he might not want to risk trying to convince others to revolt since most clones were basically brainwashed and would probably just arrest him, but I still think he should have at least tried to escape by himself instead of selling out to the separatists and getting more clones killed. As I type this though I think I just gained a deeper respect for Howzer considering he was actually in a similar situation and made the most difficult decision. He could have joined the rebels on Ryloth and taught them how to best combat the tactics of his brothers, but instead he chose to speak out, not just for himself but to give his brothers a chance as well. He spoke for what he believed was right against an un-just system and faced the consequences, dude is a Clone Martin Luther King Jr. Tldr: I think Cut is fine because it's not his responsibility to help everyone else who's in a bad situation, I think Slick is in the wrong because he put others in even worse situations than they were already in, and I think Howzer is a Saint.
@@cosmicwolf4240 why do they do it? Yes there is basic camrodary but who told them they are brothers what were they bred for in the end? Like I said yes baseline they learn to fight and die along side each other and loyalty like any military force. But if you get down to it who forced them to think this way since their inception?
It's so impressive how a single clone trooper came up search ideas and betrayed his own brothers like that they are doing the right thing traitors or not
I feel like of all of the star wars analysis channels, you do the best character breakdowns. Thank you for your attention to detail, research and hard work. You make the star wars universe and the characters within more life-like! 🥰
This is what I like about TCW it shows that there really isn’t a good or bad side in war. That’s how it is in real life, even in wars where one side is clearly worse (Nazi Germany) it doesn’t mean the other side is perfect or even the “good guys” just not as bad.
Exactly, imagine the allied troops coming across the concentration and death camps. They started executing guards and other prison workers on the spot out of rage and anger. They were commiting war crimes by doing that showing that even the good guys have their moments of weakness.
@@TheDandyManncompletely wrong takeaway as its always correct to kill nazis lmfao the war crimes were letting the holocaust go on for so long and also those nuclear bombs
I have to wonder, since we saw some return of rouge clones like Cut Lawquane, could we possibly see Slick and Dogma make a return as well? Yeah the last we know of Slick and Dogma was that they both ended up being arrested through crimes that they committed, although I don't know about Dogma as he was the follow orders type guy and didn't exactly commit a crime but point his blaster at his brothers in defense of General Krell.
I have a theory that Tup wasn't the first clone trooper to have a faulty inhibitor chip, but rather, Slick was. Despite the contingency orders, the inhibitor chips were designed to make the clones obedient. To have that much free will makes me think that his chip was already decaying
Amazing video as usual! You've brought up great points. As a kid I disliked Slick for being a traitor and for causing more clones to die and I still hate that he did that, but over the years I've come to see his point. I believe that he was right in how he thinking the Republic mistreated clones, but that his way of rebelling was wrong. In my opinion, he should have just waited for an opportunity to desert the GAR like Cut did, though I understand what he did was needed for the plot. I've come to find him an interesting character and I've always appreciated how well-written he was. I've also recently rewatched the "Hidden Enemy" episode so it's nice to see this video, especially since I'm wondering what happened to him afterwards or what he would have done if he managed to escape.
There's also the point that, it's possible that Slick figured blowing up the armoury would force the Republic to abandon the fight, saving the lives of many of the clones who would have otherwise been killed in the battle.
We all have to remember that when slick was doing all this he was almost 10 or 11 years old. He didn't have enough experience from the outside in order to formulate a plan that wouldnt hurt his brothers but allow him his freedom. While he did the wrong thing it was all based on faulty planning and a lack of understanding of how to do the right thing while calling out the bad he saw.
Agreed. People have compared Slick’s actions to Howzer’s, but I don’t think it’s a fair comparison. When he rebelled, Howzer was a Captain on a remote planet who had lived through the war and seen what the Empire was doing. Slick was just a lowly Sargeant (in whatever legion he was in) who came to the realisation at the START of the war that he and millions of brothers were slaves, but he didn’t see a way out. It’s implied that maybe he talked to some of his fellows to feel them out and gauge their opinions, but came to the conclusion that he was alone and every other clone was more than happy to fight. That’s why he didn’t try to start a mutiny or rebellion. To his mind, the only way he was going to be free was if the Republic lost the war. Then Ventress presumably sensed his strong emotional distress and offered him an alternative and the means to carry it out.
@@jessebeegee Yeah, we shouldnt forget that the clones we see on screen are literal children with adult bodies enslaved to fight and die in a war as pawns of a sith lord. It always brings a tear to my eye whenever any clone dies because of this.
“I knew a clone from when I was a Corporal early in the outer rim campaign, who, to a bunch of men and me around a fire in this miserable rainstorm on this monsoon planet said he thought that the Kaminoans discovering genetic engineering and cloning was one of the worst things to ever have happened to the wider galaxy. Although I wasn’t responsible for it, that soldier, despite him having done nothing wrong to my knowledge, probably said it in earshot of a superior who took offense to that, and we never saw him after he was recalled by command. Nobody knows if he was transferred or terminated. The crazy thing was, by now, I agree with him, I might have back then, although I don’t really remember.” -CS/CT-8711-12 “Cheng”, former Captain and scout of the 442nd Siege Battalion
That man sabotaged and blew up the armory, a spy like that would be wonderful to fight with. One moment you're pinned down the other moment the enemy base explodes like a deck of cards covered in gasoline
While Slick was correct about the Clones being enslaved, he was completely wrong in how he chooses to deal with the issue, sabotaging his Clone brothers and putting them in great danger than they were. He could have tried just talking to Rex and Cody, or Obi-Wan and Anakin, there all reasonable people and would have at least listened to him, because Slick was lucky and actually got Clone and Jedi leaders that actually cared about him and the others and would have done that, unlike if his Clone Commander was Neyo or if his Jedi was Krell. If he was under their command then his actions seen in the episode would have been the only option given how big pieces of Sith those two and other bad leaders during the Clone Wars were. I actually wonder how long Slick had been part of either the 212th or the 501st since it couldn't have been as long as some other Clones since in some comic stories told before the Battle of Christophses, it showed how Obi-Wan, Anakin, and Plo Koon all formed such strong bonds with their Clone Battalions/Legions, with the main lesson being that all three of them never leave a man behind, showing they deeply care about the Clones and thus showing why Clones like Cody, Rex, Wolf, Waxxer, Boil, Hardcase, and many others had such strong bonds and loyalty to them, as they were given the same kind from those Jedi. So, while Slick was right about the enslavement, given who his leaders were there were better options for dealing with the issue. Now if he had different leaders then his action would have been justified and honestly the only logical choices in that situation.
So, the slave soldier has the responsibility to explain to his commanders/owners that slaver is wrong? What was Obi-Wan or Anakin going to do? Unilaterally free all the clones? The Jedi and the Senate knew exactly what they were doing.
@@Alex-if1nf To be fair, I personally believe that all the good Jedi and Senators would have tried to help the Clones after the war, had everything not gone to Sith, although give the corruption in the Senate itself I'm not sure how well that would go over. But the point is, if Slick was so smart, smart enough to figure out how he and his brothers were enslaved, he should also been smart enough to realize that there were better options to solving that issue, espeically with the kind of leaders he had.
@@zexalbrony4799 like Shaaki-ti listened to Fives? I really resent this, the Jedi were good to the clones argument. They weren't. They were pleasant to them face to face and they genuinely cared about their well being (or some did) but that is the absolute bare minimum you should do for your fellow man. I don't know why people keep patting the Jedi on the back for this. There is a difference between being nice and being good. The previous commenter is spot on, it's not a slave's place to go up to his owner and say, "yeah, I'm a slave could you maybe fix that for me?" You say that Slick should have been smart enough to know that the Jedi would help them. One, that is a logical falicy. "You were smart enough to know this so why didn't you know this completely different thing?" Two, I doubt Slick spent a lot of one on one time with the Jedi. He was just a Sergeant. Three, I don't think the Jedi would have helped. Slick told them the clones were slaves to their very faces and they had no reaction. And even if they did care they had a war to win. They are not just going to free millions of unpaid soldiers. To use a logical falicy I think Slick would have been smart enough to figure that out. I agree with the video, no matter the damage he caused he had he right to fight for his freedom especially in the face of those who would keep it from him, even if those people were his brothers.
@@justlisten203 Yeah, Shaak-Ti messed up real bad, I can not deny that truth. And while I can agree that the Jedi as a whole had problems and issues, and there were many dick Jedi out there like Krell and Mundi who wouldn't have helped, there are just as many good Jedi and Senators, like I mentioned to Alex, out there who would have tried to help the Clones or at least the Clones under their command have freedom and better lives after the war and allow them to retire. Now given the corruption of the Senate I'm not sure if these Jedi and Senators would have succeeded, but the point is, they would have at least tried to help the Clones once the war was over. A good number of Star Wars fans believe this based on Jedi like Obi-Wan, Anakin, Plo Koon, Ahsoka, and so on, as well as Senators like Padem, Bail, Mon Mothma, and so on. Of course, this would have only happened after the war ended, and sadly the way the war ended nobody won, except Palpatine. Which is just another layer of tragedy to the war, the Clones, or at least those Clones under good Jedi and Republic officer leadership, would have probably had a chance a real chance at life outside of the military, at freedom and happiness, had the war not ended the way it did with the Empire coming to power and not preventing anyone Clone or Natural Recruit alike from leaving at least legally.
@@zexalbrony4799 I don't disagree. I think you are right that the decent people would have made the care of the clones a priority should the war gave ended. But that is information we can garner as audience members who see everything. Slick again is just a Sergeant in an army of slave soldiers who likely never had direct contact with his owners. He is not privy to the info we have as audience members. Besides this, the reaction of Obi-Wan and Anakin in this episode to being told they are using slaves always concerned me. They completely ignore this solid truth they were confronted with then hop over the the Zygerian arc where they're making sad faces at the institution of slavery. Never once does it occur to them that they are fighting for 'freedom' with an army of slaves despite having been told this. I know they care about their men but caring just isn't enough sometimes.
What I think would have been the best approach was to formulate a plan for a mass desertion kinda like how the draft was opposed during the Vietnam war but having clones form their own party to just desert the GAR rather than doing what I think to be wrong for slicks case cause at the end of the day if he would have gotten away from Rex and Cody he would have been killed by Ventress at the least or at the worst be tortured for what he knows
Remember that imperial clone Rex captured but then offed himself with the zappy teeth thing? Ngl he spoke with a familiar tone with Rex so I thought it was slick.
As much as a clone trooper and by extension Galactic Republic fan I am, I do have to acknowledge that on many levels it was like the CIS. For one thing, superweapons. Both sides came up with them. And while the CIS made many more superweapons, the Republic’s lack by comparison may be due to the Death Star. The Republic and Separatists during the war nearly went into bankruptcy during the Clone Wars, so you can imagine that they can’t devote too many credits to their superweapon projects. Perhaps the reason thr Republci has few superweapons in Disney Canon besides that electro-proton bomb was because most of the secret weapon projects budget was spent on the Death Star? I hate to imagine the price for that thing. Also when it came to superweapons, the Republic and Separatists had similar intentions for these weapons, quite different from the Empire. The Empire made superweapons to spread fear and establish dominance across the galaxy. Kind of like how nowadays countries use the threats of nuclear weapons to scare the world. Watching a planet be blown up by an Imperial Space Station the size of a moon would be very intimidating. However the Republic and Separatists, while likely also thinking to some extent that their weapons can spread fear, were more focused on just hurting the enemy. The Death Star is a major exception to this mindset, but most other superweapons in this period match up to it, at least in Disney Canon. The Malevolence disables fleets and destroys them. While the Separatist commanders like Grievous would happily use this on civilian fleets, this weapon clearly is intended just to wipe out large Republic fleets. The Defoiliator can wipe out a whole city of civilians. But most likely it was meant to just wipe out a whole base or an army in the middle of battle. The Blue Shadow Virus can wipe out a whole planet. However the Separatists may have only intended for strategic worlds like Coruscant, Kuat, and Kamino. High civilian body counts to be sure, but they wouldn’t have to use the bombs in every planet. Even the Republic’s electro-proton bomb is at least designed not to hurt civilians, just to knock out the droid army. Separatist weapons don’t have that consideration, but probably because the creators are more focused on how the weapon can hurt the enemy, not on if it will be used on civilians. And these weapons were at least made under the duress of war, even the Death Star. The Empire on the other hand kept working on the superweapon in their era of peace just so it could finally get rid of the Imperial Senate and rule forever. And the fact that both sides in the Clone Wars used manufactured armies while questionable morally at best, is understandable given neither government had a normal military on a galactic scale. Like it or not, both sides needed their armies, at least for the first year or two of the conflict. By the third though it can be argued that they could have just forced the planetary militias, all well experienced in regular combat instead of just fighting pirates by this point of the war to serve in a national military.
This episode got me thinking, of a question that led to a second question 1. What if Slick was around when Order 66 came? Would he be the first to pull the trigger without regret, or would he -like many clones we see in the movies and series - hesitated for a second? 2. But what if Order 66 was given and the clones were led by a FORMER jedi. A Jedi that openly renounced the order, but kept fighting and commanding his/her troopers, or a character like Pong Krell that was willing to switch sides or join the Empire and leave the order? Would the clones still pulled the trigger when someone openly renounced the Jedi order ?
I can definitely agree with Slick having reasonable motivations. It’s early in the war, early in the relations between Jedi and Clones. And it was in this period that the CIS was most popular, the time when more planets joined willingly and out of necessity than by being conquered, though there was a lot of that also going on. Still, 22 BBY was probably the Separatists at their best not just tactically, but morally. So long as you ignore the invasions and super weapons. Slick could easily be manipulated to serve the Separatists since Whoarm Loathsom, the Separatist commander was mostly a reasonable and honorable commander. He would certainly balance out Ventress’s attitude. However, the downsides of Slick’s action fail to focus on more than the fact he probably would have gotten more brothers killed. The whole point of the Reoublic being on Christophsis anyways was because it was invaded by the Separatists who wanted their crystals. Ignoring the fact that they may have suffered under Separatist rule, especially if the local militia continues to operate as a guerrilla force during an occupation, those crystals probably wouldn’t be used for energy projects. Given how the Separatists at least came up with the Death Star’s designs, made the Defoiliator, the Maleveolence, the Blue Shadow Virus, and that’s just what we see in Disney Canon. We all know the CIS came up with worse in Legends Canon, though at least their super weapons like the Republic’s were focused on hurting the enemy while the Empire made there’s just to spread terror. Even with the Death Star, I would imagine the Clone Wars factions intended at most for the space station to cripple the enemy instead of being a weapon of fear. Anyways, the CIS would undoubtedly make dangerous super weapons out of the crystals. They do later on try to obtain Kyber Crystals, though that was by Palpatine’s order. Now again, we have to acknowledge Slick’s actions are reasonable. After all, the only organization to give a damn about the clones in the Republic was the Jedi Order who at most taught clones to act more independently. The government didn’t pay them, didn’t thank them for their service. And Padme, one of the few senators who did care for the clones died before she could present legislation to better the lives of the clones, and it’s questionable if it would have passed even after the war, even if Palpatine was exposed and taken down. Still, history judges people by their actions. We look to the motivations of people to understand why they do what they do, like how in Injustice we understand that Superman lost his wife, baby, and his city to the Joker, so we get why he killed the criminal and became a tyrant crushing crime and any dissidents. Some of his actions did help since his Regime killed a lot of villains and criminals, but it doesn’t make him completely right. I feel Slick’s actions would be the same. As an advisor to the Separatists, he probably would try to convince commanders to be more merciful towards his brothers and actually take clones as prisoners instead of executing them. However he would basically be helping another democracy on the verge of being a Sith Empire conquer the galaxy. True, Dooku probably wouldn’t be as bad as Palpatine, but he was far from being a political idealist when he became a Sith. And given the fact he was basically an unappreciated soldier for a republic where the citizens hated him because he was so expensive and making them poorer, I doubt he would extend his mercy to non-clones. If anything, he might just become a Separatist version of Commander Fox. Crush anybody in his path, but instead he may be more manipulative and try to get his own cut. Again, understandable motivations but what counts in the eyes of the people are the actions. The Separatists are remembers as people with reasonable complaints the New Republic addresses to some level, but who were manipulated by their government. Kind of like how future generations view the Galactic Republic’s last generation. Slick may save many of his brothers, but would probably crush the galaxy, both the guilty and the innocent, to do so.
I feel like while he had good intentions, Slick was blinded by the truth. To explain: While it's true the clones were largely slaves, the way he went about it arguably was worse. He's something of a hypocritical villain/antagonist, he claims he did what he did for his brothers, but put them into harms way and resulted in them being slaughtered. Similarly, he believed the Separatists would treat the clones better than the Republic, though, as stated in a previous video, this isn't entirely correct as most CIS leaders viewed the Clones as being around or less than clones. Also, while he didn't deliberately want to harm his brothers, his actions DID cause more casualties. While the statement about the Republic sending the clones to die is somewhat correct, it's likely less clones would have died had Slick not betrayed the Republic. But, in my opinion, there really isn't a right or wrong here, like you said, it's more a matter of who was more wrong. For me, regardless of his intentions, Slick's actions caused more harm to his brothers than he believed. It was only the timely arrival of Ahsoka Tano, Anakin's bizarre stealth tactics, and Obi-wan pulling a Anakin by committing a war crime to stall the CIS advance that saw that not all clones were slaughtered. In my book, indirectly putting people your supposedly trying to protect in harm's way is the same as deliberately putting them in harm's way. He had a good reason, but, unfortunately, all his actions did was cause more deaths. To explain: As we saw in The Clone Wars movie, which takes place after Hidden Enemy but came out first, the lack of armored support, which is what Slick destroyed, the battle was a lot longer. Though, regardless of morality, Slick wasn't very good at hiding his treason. His expression when Anakin and Obi-wan were discussing the battle early in the episode hinted at his treason, then he says "when the Jedi get back", which he shouldn't have known and, therefore, he should have kept that a secret, while trying to push the blame on one of his own soldiers.
Slick wanted first of all to be free, he was nothing more than a slave and the CIS gave him freedom if he decided to help them, Slick accepted and although that cost the lives of several of his brothers, he also intended that the CIS would capture them. Since the CIS definitely treated the clones better, as they were seen as slaves, victims of the evil of the Republic, and if the 501 and 212 had been taken prisoners they would have been treated as real people for the first time, since we know that Whorm Loathsom is an honorable man and would make sure the clones are treated fairly, so Slick's actions, while of questionable morality, were justified by the fact that living under the Republic is worse for a clone than living under the CIS.
@@condedooku9750 To explain: I'm not saying you're wrong. I just have different opinions. I'm basically using to each their own as a means to keep my negative arguing from coming out. I tend to let it come out way to much.
@@condedooku9750 We regularly see that the CIS has no issues executing clones or committing other crimes Take the citadel arc where the warden executes a clone prisoner Sure Loathsom would treat them well but he's not going to be the one overseeing their prison stays which would probably involved summary executions, forced labor and other crimes
Seeing this now as a kid I thought there was an episode where Ventress mind tricked him while telling him that they are slaves and that he was doing it for money
Slick may have imagined that if he successfully took out all the republic heavy vehicles and weapons that the clone forces would have been forced to surrender to the overwhelming separatist forces potentially saving lives. Though the decision to surrender would ultimately be in the hands of the Jedi generals, and Slicks failure to destroy the heavy cannons gave the republic forces a fighting chance.
I think Slick is just as likely to execute order 66 as Cody. It was a combination of being able to question orders and his loyalty to the Jedi that allowed Rex to hold off order 66 for as long as he did. Slick might have the ability, but he would not have the will to try
Trying to get other clones to revolt or even just come with him when he deserts the GAR would have accomplished nothing other than get him in trouble. Leaving without the other clones behind was his only option for the time being. He had to escape the GAR, and since he could be killed in combat any day, the sooner the better. After escaping, he could become an activist against the Republic's use of slave soldiers. He would also be well within his rights to just live his life.
It's a shame first the clones were like droids then they were individuals now in the bad batch there like plain zombies no personalities and only the officers have custom armor
Well it makes sense. Only a select few units got to keep their customization for the first years of the empire. The rest had to change to all white directly after the transition to the empire.
From the moment the first batch were created on Kamino, the Clones were the first slaves of the Empire. You can argue semantics about how the Empire really didn't begin till after order 66 and I will respect and listen to that point of view in response to my own. From the moment Shiv Palpatine was elected to be the Supreme Chancellor, is truly when the Republic died and the Empire was born in all but declaration. His choice of advisors was well crafted so as to manipulate the galaxy into total warfare. He methodically exploited the weaknesses he had observed over his decades in Galactic service so that no other diplomatic solution other than succession and war was permissible.
i always thought it as he was right in thinking and reason but wrong in action and i never got why Anakin never reacted to when he said that the clones were the jedi's slaves like did no one thought that was out of character for Anakin?
The problem with Slick wasn't that he thought he was a slave and wanted his freedom per se. If Slick just got up and left the GAR, Captain Rex would still consider him a deserter perhaps. BUT, Captain Rex would NOT think he were a traitor. Let's start off with Captain Rex, who I would argue is the most complex character in the entire franchise if you look at everything he has said or done in totality. While Rex is fighting for the Republic as any soldier, he has his own subtle but visible motives, political perspectives, philosophy of war, and moral compass that makes him an intriguing and hard to pinpoint character more than anyone else, with only a few like Jinn, Tano, Ventress or Bonturi coming even close. Fives is basically a younger and more naive version of Rex throughout the series. Many clones may not be the most rule-following or obedient and while the average clone is more obedient than the average citizen, there is an acceptable range of rule-following within the GAR which allows their individuality to shine. Many of the clones like Domino Squad's Hevy and Cutup clearly were not the most obedient and made fun of others like Echo for their own goody two shoes attitudes but were never outright imprisoned for minor infractions and many would push the limits of acceptable behavior more than others. In fact, many of Rex's subordinates initially pushed him to turn on Krell on Umbara. Rex more than anyone understands when the chain of command goes awry because he understands what it is, what the Republic is and stands for, what the Separatists stand for, the character of democracy during a state of war, the importance for species-level autonomy and planetary self-rule against governmental corruption and criminal exploitation, and what role he can play towards a better galaxy and the future of the clones' and his own existence. Thus, when Rex saw Cut Lawquane in season 2, Rex decides not to report him because he understands why such a behavior may not be acceptable to the GAR but why it is ultimately morally permissible, even if he would not make the same decision himself. He sees Cut as clearly different than Slick. Cut had a family and house and a life that no clone ever saw but that the rest of the galaxy saw because he deserves happiness just as every other being and Rex can't deny him his true happiness especially because he was all but dead on Geonosis and as far as anyone knew he was KIA. Leaving the Republic is something others have thought about. Hevy would have left Domino Squad, probably stolen a shuttle or something if it weren't for 99. If any clone deserved to leave and find happiness, it would have been 99 who is a reminder of the cruelty of the republic and would have been terminated if not for Shaak Ti, giving him a role in the GAR which he bought until his dying breath. Fives broke regulations to give 99 his medallion out of appreciation and love for the downtrodden, an action Rex would likely have done back in his day. There is such a range of thoughts, emotions, and philosophies of many clones and leaving the grand army is not an official or snactioned choice but an understood one by some given their state of servitude. So yeah, Slick is kind of an arse hole.
First of all: his haircut is very cool, I actually cut my hair just like his. Second: he is utterly based, moral questions definitely have right or wrong answers, and the answer for Slick is: based
Personally it would have made more sense if Slick was an Arc trooper and a sergeant like Adin in the RC novels. More free thinking and all that. Eventually seeing the truth behind their situation and could have been hunted down by assassins had he escaped after his sabotage of the Republic fortifications in that one episode. Could have been an interesting perspective to see throughout the seasons.
Yes, that was slavery, but it was also conscription. The Clone Troopers of the Republic had a duty to serve. Slavery was only temporary and technical, the Kaminoans could have just as easily branded themselves as guardianships of the underage clones, and than handed them over to the Republic as part of conscription, liberating them of the guardianship, technically making them freemen. Conscription and disenfranchisement were the real statuses of the clones. The worst the Republic could have been said to have done is discriminated against clones in conscription, and the aforementioned disenfranchisement. But between that and slavery there's a long long way.
they weren't paid, and they were technically republic property (organic droids) as said many times in the series (especially by kaminoans). they were slaves plain and simple.
@@matthiuskoenig3378 Yeah they weren't payed. And yeah, they were Republic property, but it's obvious the Republic would have emancipated them after the war, even if without enfranchisement. The only difference between the clones and any normal civilian getting conscripted is that the clones weren't payed (though their expanses were provided for, which is better than most of the people of the Outer Rim had it income wise), they didn't have the right to vote, and the burden of conscription was discriminatorily placed entirely on their shoulders. So did the clones get the short end of the stick? Yes. Was the difference for them between being slaves and freemen the same as that difference for actual real world slaves? No. Not even close. So yeah, they were slaves, but it's just a status. It wasn't as bad as the name suggests, relative to the alternative. So no. Just being slaves is not a reason to sell your nation, your brothers, or your sole out. Had their slavery held more gravity, I'd probably see it another way
No, Slick wants to be free, Order 66 is the antithesis of free will for clones. He would of joined the rebellion most likely since they are the ones opposing authoritarianism. And this time he got to choose what he wants to fight fof
The main flaw in this logic that I can see is this; the clones weren't slaves, but indentured servants for a duration. As we know, the clones were only alive because the Republic had need of an army, so in turn the clones owed the Republic service until completion of the war, which was actually even upheld by the Empire and they were allowed to retire afterwards. Furthermore, the Clones did receive pay, even if it was a pittance for a drink or two, however they technically weren't even owed payment by the Republic as their payment was life.
Regardless how order 66 turned out Slick was wrong his actions were incredibly short sighted and plagued with tunnel vision Ventress wasn't going to let him live in a Separatist victory even if she was paying him so that "freedom" just wasn't happening
Slick had the same issue as Dooku and most other deserters - Sees an issue, actively tries to destroy it rather than change it - The reason Dooku was feared by the sith so much, the reason the null arcs existed because they didn't want to just be slaves. It needed to change, it did not need to be destroyed. Both still hurt innocent people and commited evils beyond imagining.
![[안방1열 풀캠4K] 베이비몬스터 'DRIP' (BABYMONSTER FullCam)│@SBS Inkigayo 241110](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/AQ4RIghEvUs/mqdefault.jpg)
I liked it how no one argued against his slavery ideology. But questioned why he put his brothers in danger.
Yeah lol, he wans't wrong about the slavery thing, I guess he is just hates for working with the seps
If it wasn't for that, he would've been right!
It's just the Jedi focusing on the wrong things. They don't want to ask "why"? Why did Slick do this? And was he right?
YES. And forget the "put his brothers in danger". For one, he would be saving far, far, faaaar more brothers if he found his freedom and sabotaged the Republic. Most importantly, the onus is not on Slick when the Jedi quite literally have a child army of Clone slaves in the first place. A slave wanting freedom is not wrong, and money too. The Jedi and Republic are the reason there are Clone slaves in the first place.
And of course Slick would go to the Seps! The first step of freedom is to find safety in CIS territory. Come on.
@@thenewkalpa
The Sith's trap is inescapable
Rex and Cody didn't say anything against it because they knew slick was right...when he straight out told Kenobi and Anakin how their order enslaved his brothers, none of the guards, not Cody, Not Rex said anything against it. Because they couldn't argue with it. They only said if he loved them he wouldn't have put them at risk and said nothing more to defend their jedi Generals because its true...even if their jedi treat them like living beings, no one else in the republic does
I really like how many individual clones there are and how different they are from each of their fellows. It’s one of the reasons why The Bad Batch and The Clone Wars are so good.
I know what I’m gunna say doesn’t exactly relate to what your saying. But I agree with you, and it’s one of the reasons I prefer the clone wars era over galactic civil war era any day.
Bad Batch? Don't you mean the Clone Wars?
In Bad Batch the clones are antagonized heavily which I don't like.
Basically turning them into buckedhead stormtroopers again. Just generic bad guys, idk what happened to the clones we knew in the Clone Wars
@@szczypior2714 Both but there are individual clones in The Bad Batch like Howser and The Batch itself. I hate the Mandolorian because of the generic bad guys are bad but the Bad Batch is actually well made and the clones are different from bucketheads. You see that on several episodes such as 11, 1, 12, and 9
"Share the same faces, you do. But different in the Force, you all are."
@the zman same
Each year that passes in the Star Wars Universe, Slick looks better and better. However, his willingness to cooperate in a scheme that got several of his own brothers killed, really hurt his cause morally. He was well-intentioned and had very valid concerns and a reason to protest, but I can't deny that in execution he went about it very wrong. He is a good and complex character though, that's very well written. Fives on the other hand went about it the right way, morally, in fighting for he and his brothers' cause, but Palpatine made sure it didn't matter in the end tragically. Hopefully Howzer can come through and finally succeed.
Howzer succeeding is Palpatines plan. He made sure the clones on the twilek planet weren't issued order 66 and that no jedi were stationed there during order 66. This way the clone uprising begins and he can get rid of the disposable army of the republic, to make room for an army made up from the galaxy.
Username checks out @TheWiseFives
@@arimo3644 Thearrogantfives is more like it in this case
Except it DID matter in the end. Ahsoka was able to remove Rex's chip because of Fives' actions and the rest is history.
He reminds me of Dooku
*Fives + Slick = Finds the truth and frees their brothers*
Slick legitimately has clone blood on his hands.
Fives didn't sell anyone out.
@@QuantumBeard at least 20 men were slain in the towers. If you Really take a toll count on all the bodies and every trooper who's shot to death.
Clones were slaves and were just used to fight the CIS and kill jedi but at the end of the day the clones weren't getting paid, didn't really have any time away from the war, weren't allowed to form relationships, and if any clone decides to desert the GAR they were killed by covert clone assassins. So clones weren't treated like they were people but as a product with no worth.
I mean, slaves ARE supposed to be property.
@@capncake8837 true but the republic was against slavery but still they used a slave army to fight for the republic which is a contradiction to what the republic was meant to be
@@MichaelMyers-ur4qs The republic was against slavery but didn’t do shit to stop it. Some of their suppliers were slavers and they didn’t care.
@@MichaelMyers-ur4qs where does one find lore on the cover clone assassins of which you speak? That sounds badass
@@MichaelMyers-ur4qs I mean other than the whole hunting-and-murdering-runaways thing...
Clone haircuts are measured on a scale from Slick to Howzer
Lmfao
LOL
Actually the instructor on the Star destroyer when boba tries to kill mace is the worst
@@thrawnedits5860 He wasn't a clone to be fair. He was a human Admiral
@@burningcoal5705 I’m not talking about the admiral I’m talking about the clone giving the guide
Tbh I always thought of Slick as a more "evil" version of Cut. Slick defected for the right reasons, but he seemed willing to sacrifice many of his own brothers for himself. I can understand why he might not want to risk trying to convince others to revolt since most clones were basically brainwashed and would probably just arrest him, but I still think he should have at least tried to escape by himself instead of selling out to the separatists and getting more clones killed. As I type this though I think I just gained a deeper respect for Howzer considering he was actually in a similar situation and made the most difficult decision. He could have joined the rebels on Ryloth and taught them how to best combat the tactics of his brothers, but instead he chose to speak out, not just for himself but to give his brothers a chance as well. He spoke for what he believed was right against an un-just system and faced the consequences, dude is a Clone Martin Luther King Jr.
Tldr: I think Cut is fine because it's not his responsibility to help everyone else who's in a bad situation, I think Slick is in the wrong because he put others in even worse situations than they were already in, and I think Howzer is a Saint.
Sgt Slick’s message was good… kinda, well aside from the greed thing but his actions were wrong… especially endangering his own brothers
He said that he wasn't really in it for the money. He wanted out of the GAR, and as such sent info to Ventress. The money was just a bonus.
Why are they his brothers? Yes he called them his brothers. But you impose that they are his brothers when in reality they were not.
@@thefluffles6384 how do you mean? Almost every other clone regards other clones as their brothers 🤨
@@cosmicwolf4240 why do they do it? Yes there is basic camrodary but who told them they are brothers what were they bred for in the end? Like I said yes baseline they learn to fight and die along side each other and loyalty like any military force. But if you get down to it who forced them to think this way since their inception?
"Force" is a strong word manipulated them.
“Right motive, wrong actions”
Essentially, yah.
Slick is my no. 1 pick to bring back in bad batch, especially after seeing Howzer
And Dogma, maybe they could do a prison break.
Agreed for BOTH him and Dogma
yh that would be amazing
The order 66 question at the end was a strong point
Wait im being questioned
It's so impressive how a single clone trooper came up search ideas and betrayed his own brothers like that they are doing the right thing traitors or not
I think Slick would be an interesting character for the Bad batch whether as himself or a mention
The idea of "If a slave rebels does it really matter _how_ they rebel?" is a strong one
I remember a Clone Trooper named Chopper in that episode….
As do I.
chopper ol boy
Slick is confirmed BASED
Based on what?
@@LtCaveman redpilled
slick is unbased and unredpilled
@@Akio99x
No. Based and basedpilled.
Sort of.
It's all in the name. Slick was likely astute enough to realize that a mutiny would cause nothing but his own arrest.
Howzer is slick ‘21
I feel like of all of the star wars analysis channels, you do the best character breakdowns. Thank you for your attention to detail, research and hard work. You make the star wars universe and the characters within more life-like! 🥰
It would of been interesting if slick and his platoon joined the separtist
That would have been AWESOME.
I would find it funny Rex goes to save clones and runs into Slick as a "Told ya so." Moment
This must be a joke. The complexity of the Senate is unmatched.
He could've been a great senator representing all the G.A.R. too bad he was never giving the chance.
After considering all factors, I’ve decided that my response is “viva le resistance.” I just hope that the Bad Batch can finish what Slick started.
This is what I like about TCW it shows that there really isn’t a good or bad side in war. That’s how it is in real life, even in wars where one side is clearly worse (Nazi Germany) it doesn’t mean the other side is perfect or even the “good guys” just not as bad.
Exactly, imagine the allied troops coming across the concentration and death camps. They started executing guards and other prison workers on the spot out of rage and anger. They were commiting war crimes by doing that showing that even the good guys have their moments of weakness.
@Hoggy Muscles I agree, some retribution is necessary at times. But again the good guys are not always perfect.
@@TheDandyManncompletely wrong takeaway as its always correct to kill nazis lmfao the war crimes were letting the holocaust go on for so long and also those nuclear bombs
Slick did nothing wrong he was just one of the few clones who saw the truth of the GAR
He has less clone blood on his hand then me
I have to wonder, since we saw some return of rouge clones like Cut Lawquane, could we possibly see Slick and Dogma make a return as well? Yeah the last we know of Slick and Dogma was that they both ended up being arrested through crimes that they committed, although I don't know about Dogma as he was the follow orders type guy and didn't exactly commit a crime but point his blaster at his brothers in defense of General Krell.
He was way ahead of his time.
I’m surprised that Cody and Rex didn’t really think about what Slick said about them all being slaves.
Never knew there was more complexity to it!
I think that slik's intentions were good, but he had the worst way possible of trying to achieve it.
Yes, and that statement could also be attributed to Barriss Offee
@@SchultzDorinda barris wasnt a hero. She framed ahsoka
@@abdullahx4908 having good intentions doesn't mean being a hero.
You know I kind of want to see what happen to this guy after all this time. Him and maybe Dogma.
I wonder if the Imperial Army let Dogma out and rejoin
I feel like I didn't like Slick because of his haircut...
I like ya cut g
@@daw4yz244 Considering that he gets punched and knocked out, that’s appropriate.
I dislike ya cut g
I think his haircuts pretty Slick
Slick, "If I join you, will you treat my brothers fairly?"
CIS, "Hold our war crimes."
I have a theory that Tup wasn't the first clone trooper to have a faulty inhibitor chip, but rather, Slick was. Despite the contingency orders, the inhibitor chips were designed to make the clones obedient. To have that much free will makes me think that his chip was already decaying
He was so slick when Me and Cody tried to catch him
Can I have your autograph?
@@geetslys sure
[Captain Rex]
this makes me think of that episode in a whole new way
Slick was pretty Slick
Slick was a Chad of Liberty. A slave craving the fruit of freedom
Amazing video as usual! You've brought up great points. As a kid I disliked Slick for being a traitor and for causing more clones to die and I still hate that he did that, but over the years I've come to see his point. I believe that he was right in how he thinking the Republic mistreated clones, but that his way of rebelling was wrong. In my opinion, he should have just waited for an opportunity to desert the GAR like Cut did, though I understand what he did was needed for the plot. I've come to find him an interesting character and I've always appreciated how well-written he was. I've also recently rewatched the "Hidden Enemy" episode so it's nice to see this video, especially since I'm wondering what happened to him afterwards or what he would have done if he managed to escape.
Slick has clone boy blood on his hands, and that's enough to counter anything anyone has to say🤷🏻♂️
Not this he had a very nice helmet
@@eastsidepeezy7514 fuck
Touché lmao
There's also the point that, it's possible that Slick figured blowing up the armoury would force the Republic to abandon the fight, saving the lives of many of the clones who would have otherwise been killed in the battle.
We all have to remember that when slick was doing all this he was almost 10 or 11 years old. He didn't have enough experience from the outside in order to formulate a plan that wouldnt hurt his brothers but allow him his freedom. While he did the wrong thing it was all based on faulty planning and a lack of understanding of how to do the right thing while calling out the bad he saw.
Agreed. People have compared Slick’s actions to Howzer’s, but I don’t think it’s a fair comparison. When he rebelled, Howzer was a Captain on a remote planet who had lived through the war and seen what the Empire was doing. Slick was just a lowly Sargeant (in whatever legion he was in) who came to the realisation at the START of the war that he and millions of brothers were slaves, but he didn’t see a way out. It’s implied that maybe he talked to some of his fellows to feel them out and gauge their opinions, but came to the conclusion that he was alone and every other clone was more than happy to fight. That’s why he didn’t try to start a mutiny or rebellion. To his mind, the only way he was going to be free was if the Republic lost the war. Then Ventress presumably sensed his strong emotional distress and offered him an alternative and the means to carry it out.
holy shit i always forget this
@@jessebeegee Yeah, we shouldnt forget that the clones we see on screen are literal children with adult bodies enslaved to fight and die in a war as pawns of a sith lord. It always brings a tear to my eye whenever any clone dies because of this.
"Good soldiers follow orders."
Then:🙂 Now:☹️
I really doubt he would tell any of his brother's due to them being so loyal telling any other clone could have gotten him caught
“Good guy? Bad guy? It’s all a machine partner”
Imagine his return in the Bad Batch
I thaught about it too
slick's heart may have been in the right place (according to our own code of morality), but the way he went about it was clearly wrong
I wish we got to see more of slick and his squad. Like we have almost no info on them.
I think 8:49 isn't from an episode of the clone wars but an animation a fan made
“I knew a clone from when I was a Corporal early in the outer rim campaign, who, to a bunch of men and me around a fire in this miserable rainstorm on this monsoon planet said he thought that the Kaminoans discovering genetic engineering and cloning was one of the worst things to ever have happened to the wider galaxy. Although I wasn’t responsible for it, that soldier, despite him having done nothing wrong to my knowledge, probably said it in earshot of a superior who took offense to that, and we never saw him after he was recalled by command. Nobody knows if he was transferred or terminated. The crazy thing was, by now, I agree with him, I might have back then, although I don’t really remember.” -CS/CT-8711-12 “Cheng”, former Captain and scout of the 442nd Siege Battalion
That man sabotaged and blew up the armory, a spy like that would be wonderful to fight with.
One moment you're pinned down the other moment the enemy base explodes like a deck of cards covered in gasoline
Very pleased to see the proper, critically thinking argument toward the end. Not nearly enough of that in general or in Star Wars these days.
While Slick was correct about the Clones being enslaved, he was completely wrong in how he chooses to deal with the issue, sabotaging his Clone brothers and putting them in great danger than they were. He could have tried just talking to Rex and Cody, or Obi-Wan and Anakin, there all reasonable people and would have at least listened to him, because Slick was lucky and actually got Clone and Jedi leaders that actually cared about him and the others and would have done that, unlike if his Clone Commander was Neyo or if his Jedi was Krell. If he was under their command then his actions seen in the episode would have been the only option given how big pieces of Sith those two and other bad leaders during the Clone Wars were.
I actually wonder how long Slick had been part of either the 212th or the 501st since it couldn't have been as long as some other Clones since in some comic stories told before the Battle of Christophses, it showed how Obi-Wan, Anakin, and Plo Koon all formed such strong bonds with their Clone Battalions/Legions, with the main lesson being that all three of them never leave a man behind, showing they deeply care about the Clones and thus showing why Clones like Cody, Rex, Wolf, Waxxer, Boil, Hardcase, and many others had such strong bonds and loyalty to them, as they were given the same kind from those Jedi.
So, while Slick was right about the enslavement, given who his leaders were there were better options for dealing with the issue. Now if he had different leaders then his action would have been justified and honestly the only logical choices in that situation.
So, the slave soldier has the responsibility to explain to his commanders/owners that slaver is wrong? What was Obi-Wan or Anakin going to do? Unilaterally free all the clones? The Jedi and the Senate knew exactly what they were doing.
@@Alex-if1nf To be fair, I personally believe that all the good Jedi and Senators would have tried to help the Clones after the war, had everything not gone to Sith, although give the corruption in the Senate itself I'm not sure how well that would go over. But the point is, if Slick was so smart, smart enough to figure out how he and his brothers were enslaved, he should also been smart enough to realize that there were better options to solving that issue, espeically with the kind of leaders he had.
@@zexalbrony4799 like Shaaki-ti listened to Fives?
I really resent this, the Jedi were good to the clones argument. They weren't. They were pleasant to them face to face and they genuinely cared about their well being (or some did) but that is the absolute bare minimum you should do for your fellow man. I don't know why people keep patting the Jedi on the back for this. There is a difference between being nice and being good.
The previous commenter is spot on, it's not a slave's place to go up to his owner and say, "yeah, I'm a slave could you maybe fix that for me?"
You say that Slick should have been smart enough to know that the Jedi would help them. One, that is a logical falicy. "You were smart enough to know this so why didn't you know this completely different thing?"
Two, I doubt Slick spent a lot of one on one time with the Jedi. He was just a Sergeant.
Three, I don't think the Jedi would have helped. Slick told them the clones were slaves to their very faces and they had no reaction. And even if they did care they had a war to win. They are not just going to free millions of unpaid soldiers. To use a logical falicy I think Slick would have been smart enough to figure that out.
I agree with the video, no matter the damage he caused he had he right to fight for his freedom especially in the face of those who would keep it from him, even if those people were his brothers.
@@justlisten203 Yeah, Shaak-Ti messed up real bad, I can not deny that truth.
And while I can agree that the Jedi as a whole had problems and issues, and there were many dick Jedi out there like Krell and Mundi who wouldn't have helped, there are just as many good Jedi and Senators, like I mentioned to Alex, out there who would have tried to help the Clones or at least the Clones under their command have freedom and better lives after the war and allow them to retire. Now given the corruption of the Senate I'm not sure if these Jedi and Senators would have succeeded, but the point is, they would have at least tried to help the Clones once the war was over. A good number of Star Wars fans believe this based on Jedi like Obi-Wan, Anakin, Plo Koon, Ahsoka, and so on, as well as Senators like Padem, Bail, Mon Mothma, and so on. Of course, this would have only happened after the war ended, and sadly the way the war ended nobody won, except Palpatine. Which is just another layer of tragedy to the war, the Clones, or at least those Clones under good Jedi and Republic officer leadership, would have probably had a chance a real chance at life outside of the military, at freedom and happiness, had the war not ended the way it did with the Empire coming to power and not preventing anyone Clone or Natural Recruit alike from leaving at least legally.
@@zexalbrony4799 I don't disagree. I think you are right that the decent people would have made the care of the clones a priority should the war gave ended.
But that is information we can garner as audience members who see everything. Slick again is just a Sergeant in an army of slave soldiers who likely never had direct contact with his owners. He is not privy to the info we have as audience members.
Besides this, the reaction of Obi-Wan and Anakin in this episode to being told they are using slaves always concerned me. They completely ignore this solid truth they were confronted with then hop over the the Zygerian arc where they're making sad faces at the institution of slavery. Never once does it occur to them that they are fighting for 'freedom' with an army of slaves despite having been told this.
I know they care about their men but caring just isn't enough sometimes.
Obi-Wan Kenobi: did I hear someone say high ground?
3:00 he should’ve followed the advice of DJ in the last Jedi
“Live free don’t join”
What I think would have been the best approach was to formulate a plan for a mass desertion kinda like how the draft was opposed during the Vietnam war but having clones form their own party to just desert the GAR rather than doing what I think to be wrong for slicks case cause at the end of the day if he would have gotten away from Rex and Cody he would have been killed by Ventress at the least or at the worst be tortured for what he knows
was waiting for anyone to talk about this
Sweet video, love the dives into the moral nuances.
Remember that imperial clone Rex captured but then offed himself with the zappy teeth thing? Ngl he spoke with a familiar tone with Rex so I thought it was slick.
Slick would’ve been a helluva a rebel
As much as a clone trooper and by extension Galactic Republic fan I am, I do have to acknowledge that on many levels it was like the CIS. For one thing, superweapons. Both sides came up with them. And while the CIS made many more superweapons, the Republic’s lack by comparison may be due to the Death Star. The Republic and Separatists during the war nearly went into bankruptcy during the Clone Wars, so you can imagine that they can’t devote too many credits to their superweapon projects. Perhaps the reason thr Republci has few superweapons in Disney Canon besides that electro-proton bomb was because most of the secret weapon projects budget was spent on the Death Star? I hate to imagine the price for that thing. Also when it came to superweapons, the Republic and Separatists had similar intentions for these weapons, quite different from the Empire. The Empire made superweapons to spread fear and establish dominance across the galaxy. Kind of like how nowadays countries use the threats of nuclear weapons to scare the world. Watching a planet be blown up by an Imperial Space Station the size of a moon would be very intimidating. However the Republic and Separatists, while likely also thinking to some extent that their weapons can spread fear, were more focused on just hurting the enemy. The Death Star is a major exception to this mindset, but most other superweapons in this period match up to it, at least in Disney Canon. The Malevolence disables fleets and destroys them. While the Separatist commanders like Grievous would happily use this on civilian fleets, this weapon clearly is intended just to wipe out large Republic fleets. The Defoiliator can wipe out a whole city of civilians. But most likely it was meant to just wipe out a whole base or an army in the middle of battle. The Blue Shadow Virus can wipe out a whole planet. However the Separatists may have only intended for strategic worlds like Coruscant, Kuat, and Kamino. High civilian body counts to be sure, but they wouldn’t have to use the bombs in every planet. Even the Republic’s electro-proton bomb is at least designed not to hurt civilians, just to knock out the droid army. Separatist weapons don’t have that consideration, but probably because the creators are more focused on how the weapon can hurt the enemy, not on if it will be used on civilians. And these weapons were at least made under the duress of war, even the Death Star. The Empire on the other hand kept working on the superweapon in their era of peace just so it could finally get rid of the Imperial Senate and rule forever. And the fact that both sides in the Clone Wars used manufactured armies while questionable morally at best, is understandable given neither government had a normal military on a galactic scale. Like it or not, both sides needed their armies, at least for the first year or two of the conflict. By the third though it can be argued that they could have just forced the planetary militias, all well experienced in regular combat instead of just fighting pirates by this point of the war to serve in a national military.
This episode got me thinking, of a question that led to a second question
1. What if Slick was around when Order 66 came? Would he be the first to pull the trigger without regret, or would he -like many clones we see in the movies and series - hesitated for a second?
2. But what if Order 66 was given and the clones were led by a FORMER jedi. A Jedi that openly renounced the order, but kept fighting and commanding his/her troopers, or a character like Pong Krell that was willing to switch sides or join the Empire and leave the order?
Would the clones still pulled the trigger when someone openly renounced the Jedi order ?
You should’ve shown Rex knock out Slick in the Intro
I can definitely agree with Slick having reasonable motivations. It’s early in the war, early in the relations between Jedi and Clones. And it was in this period that the CIS was most popular, the time when more planets joined willingly and out of necessity than by being conquered, though there was a lot of that also going on. Still, 22 BBY was probably the Separatists at their best not just tactically, but morally. So long as you ignore the invasions and super weapons. Slick could easily be manipulated to serve the Separatists since Whoarm Loathsom, the Separatist commander was mostly a reasonable and honorable commander. He would certainly balance out Ventress’s attitude. However, the downsides of Slick’s action fail to focus on more than the fact he probably would have gotten more brothers killed. The whole point of the Reoublic being on Christophsis anyways was because it was invaded by the Separatists who wanted their crystals. Ignoring the fact that they may have suffered under Separatist rule, especially if the local militia continues to operate as a guerrilla force during an occupation, those crystals probably wouldn’t be used for energy projects. Given how the Separatists at least came up with the Death Star’s designs, made the Defoiliator, the Maleveolence, the Blue Shadow Virus, and that’s just what we see in Disney Canon. We all know the CIS came up with worse in Legends Canon, though at least their super weapons like the Republic’s were focused on hurting the enemy while the Empire made there’s just to spread terror. Even with the Death Star, I would imagine the Clone Wars factions intended at most for the space station to cripple the enemy instead of being a weapon of fear. Anyways, the CIS would undoubtedly make dangerous super weapons out of the crystals. They do later on try to obtain Kyber Crystals, though that was by Palpatine’s order. Now again, we have to acknowledge Slick’s actions are reasonable. After all, the only organization to give a damn about the clones in the Republic was the Jedi Order who at most taught clones to act more independently. The government didn’t pay them, didn’t thank them for their service. And Padme, one of the few senators who did care for the clones died before she could present legislation to better the lives of the clones, and it’s questionable if it would have passed even after the war, even if Palpatine was exposed and taken down. Still, history judges people by their actions. We look to the motivations of people to understand why they do what they do, like how in Injustice we understand that Superman lost his wife, baby, and his city to the Joker, so we get why he killed the criminal and became a tyrant crushing crime and any dissidents. Some of his actions did help since his Regime killed a lot of villains and criminals, but it doesn’t make him completely right. I feel Slick’s actions would be the same. As an advisor to the Separatists, he probably would try to convince commanders to be more merciful towards his brothers and actually take clones as prisoners instead of executing them. However he would basically be helping another democracy on the verge of being a Sith Empire conquer the galaxy. True, Dooku probably wouldn’t be as bad as Palpatine, but he was far from being a political idealist when he became a Sith. And given the fact he was basically an unappreciated soldier for a republic where the citizens hated him because he was so expensive and making them poorer, I doubt he would extend his mercy to non-clones. If anything, he might just become a Separatist version of Commander Fox. Crush anybody in his path, but instead he may be more manipulative and try to get his own cut. Again, understandable motivations but what counts in the eyes of the people are the actions. The Separatists are remembers as people with reasonable complaints the New Republic addresses to some level, but who were manipulated by their government. Kind of like how future generations view the Galactic Republic’s last generation. Slick may save many of his brothers, but would probably crush the galaxy, both the guilty and the innocent, to do so.
I agree with M. Myers . I am thinking they were like human robots . BUT , not all had the same mind on their Being .
Slick: Schrodinger's Clone Trooper.
He had extra hand to hand training
I feel like while he had good intentions, Slick was blinded by the truth. To explain: While it's true the clones were largely slaves, the way he went about it arguably was worse.
He's something of a hypocritical villain/antagonist, he claims he did what he did for his brothers, but put them into harms way and resulted in them being slaughtered. Similarly, he believed the Separatists would treat the clones better than the Republic, though, as stated in a previous video, this isn't entirely correct as most CIS leaders viewed the Clones as being around or less than clones. Also, while he didn't deliberately want to harm his brothers, his actions DID cause more casualties.
While the statement about the Republic sending the clones to die is somewhat correct, it's likely less clones would have died had Slick not betrayed the Republic.
But, in my opinion, there really isn't a right or wrong here, like you said, it's more a matter of who was more wrong. For me, regardless of his intentions, Slick's actions caused more harm to his brothers than he believed. It was only the timely arrival of Ahsoka Tano, Anakin's bizarre stealth tactics, and Obi-wan pulling a Anakin by committing a war crime to stall the CIS advance that saw that not all clones were slaughtered.
In my book, indirectly putting people your supposedly trying to protect in harm's way is the same as deliberately putting them in harm's way. He had a good reason, but, unfortunately, all his actions did was cause more deaths.
To explain:
As we saw in The Clone Wars movie, which takes place after Hidden Enemy but came out first, the lack of armored support, which is what Slick destroyed, the battle was a lot longer.
Though, regardless of morality, Slick wasn't very good at hiding his treason. His expression when Anakin and Obi-wan were discussing the battle early in the episode hinted at his treason, then he says "when the Jedi get back", which he shouldn't have known and, therefore, he should have kept that a secret, while trying to push the blame on one of his own soldiers.
Slick wanted first of all to be free, he was nothing more than a slave and the CIS gave him freedom if he decided to help them, Slick accepted and although that cost the lives of several of his brothers, he also intended that the CIS would capture them. Since the CIS definitely treated the clones better, as they were seen as slaves, victims of the evil of the Republic, and if the 501 and 212 had been taken prisoners they would have been treated as real people for the first time, since we know that Whorm Loathsom is an honorable man and would make sure the clones are treated fairly, so Slick's actions, while of questionable morality, were justified by the fact that living under the Republic is worse for a clone than living under the CIS.
@@condedooku9750
To each their own.
@@AngelDust6969 Okay
@@condedooku9750
To explain:
I'm not saying you're wrong. I just have different opinions. I'm basically using to each their own as a means to keep my negative arguing from coming out. I tend to let it come out way to much.
@@condedooku9750 We regularly see that the CIS has no issues executing clones or committing other crimes
Take the citadel arc where the warden executes a clone prisoner
Sure Loathsom would treat them well but he's not going to be the one overseeing their prison stays which would probably involved summary executions, forced labor and other crimes
How about an in depth video on "what if Slick was successful in his"?
Seeing this now as a kid I thought there was an episode where Ventress mind tricked him while telling him that they are slaves and that he was doing it for money
Clones Hevy, Cutup, 99, Echo & Rex are the GOAT’s just to name a few.
Fives deserves Top 5
However we got the perspective of a “ traitor“ on how he defected to the good guys that was FN 2187 “Finn”
Slick may have imagined that if he successfully took out all the republic heavy vehicles and weapons that the clone forces would have been forced to surrender to the overwhelming separatist forces potentially saving lives. Though the decision to surrender would ultimately be in the hands of the Jedi generals, and Slicks failure to destroy the heavy cannons gave the republic forces a fighting chance.
I think Slick is just as likely to execute order 66 as Cody. It was a combination of being able to question orders and his loyalty to the Jedi that allowed Rex to hold off order 66 for as long as he did. Slick might have the ability, but he would not have the will to try
Order 66 also killed sepertists and jedi
Trying to get other clones to revolt or even just come with him when he deserts the GAR would have accomplished nothing other than get him in trouble. Leaving without the other clones behind was his only option for the time being. He had to escape the GAR, and since he could be killed in combat any day, the sooner the better. After escaping, he could become an activist against the Republic's use of slave soldiers. He would also be well within his rights to just live his life.
Bro I need to see slick again in the bad batch please Dave please!!!!?
Good soldiers follow orders,
The best know when not to.
Bring back Slick to the Bad Batch!
It's a shame first the clones were like droids then they were individuals now in the bad batch there like plain zombies no personalities and only the officers have custom armor
Well it makes sense. Only a select few units got to keep their customization for the first years of the empire. The rest had to change to all white directly after the transition to the empire.
@@jameshersom2536 yeah
Given how Ventress treats republic traitors I sadly feel like Slick's freedom would have come at the end of a crimson blade.
From the moment the first batch were created on Kamino, the Clones were the first slaves of the Empire. You can argue semantics about how the Empire really didn't begin till after order 66 and I will respect and listen to that point of view in response to my own. From the moment Shiv Palpatine was elected to be the Supreme Chancellor, is truly when the Republic died and the Empire was born in all but declaration. His choice of advisors was well crafted so as to manipulate the galaxy into total warfare. He methodically exploited the weaknesses he had observed over his decades in Galactic service so that no other diplomatic solution other than succession and war was permissible.
I actually just watched this episode earlier today lol.
"Good soldiers don't follow orders"
i always thought it as he was right in thinking and reason but wrong in action and i never got why Anakin never reacted to when he said that the clones were the jedi's slaves like did no one thought that was out of character for Anakin?
Just watched the episode yesterday again 🥴😎
The problem with Slick wasn't that he thought he was a slave and wanted his freedom per se. If Slick just got up and left the GAR, Captain Rex would still consider him a deserter perhaps. BUT, Captain Rex would NOT think he were a traitor.
Let's start off with Captain Rex, who I would argue is the most complex character in the entire franchise if you look at everything he has said or done in totality. While Rex is fighting for the Republic as any soldier, he has his own subtle but visible motives, political perspectives, philosophy of war, and moral compass that makes him an intriguing and hard to pinpoint character more than anyone else, with only a few like Jinn, Tano, Ventress or Bonturi coming even close. Fives is basically a younger and more naive version of Rex throughout the series.
Many clones may not be the most rule-following or obedient and while the average clone is more obedient than the average citizen, there is an acceptable range of rule-following within the GAR which allows their individuality to shine. Many of the clones like Domino Squad's Hevy and Cutup clearly were not the most obedient and made fun of others like Echo for their own goody two shoes attitudes but were never outright imprisoned for minor infractions and many would push the limits of acceptable behavior more than others. In fact, many of Rex's subordinates initially pushed him to turn on Krell on Umbara. Rex more than anyone understands when the chain of command goes awry because he understands what it is, what the Republic is and stands for, what the Separatists stand for, the character of democracy during a state of war, the importance for species-level autonomy and planetary self-rule against governmental corruption and criminal exploitation, and what role he can play towards a better galaxy and the future of the clones' and his own existence.
Thus, when Rex saw Cut Lawquane in season 2, Rex decides not to report him because he understands why such a behavior may not be acceptable to the GAR but why it is ultimately morally permissible, even if he would not make the same decision himself. He sees Cut as clearly different than Slick. Cut had a family and house and a life that no clone ever saw but that the rest of the galaxy saw because he deserves happiness just as every other being and Rex can't deny him his true happiness especially because he was all but dead on Geonosis and as far as anyone knew he was KIA. Leaving the Republic is something others have thought about. Hevy would have left Domino Squad, probably stolen a shuttle or something if it weren't for 99. If any clone deserved to leave and find happiness, it would have been 99 who is a reminder of the cruelty of the republic and would have been terminated if not for Shaak Ti, giving him a role in the GAR which he bought until his dying breath. Fives broke regulations to give 99 his medallion out of appreciation and love for the downtrodden, an action Rex would likely have done back in his day. There is such a range of thoughts, emotions, and philosophies of many clones and leaving the grand army is not an official or snactioned choice but an understood one by some given their state of servitude.
So yeah, Slick is kind of an arse hole.
1:41 and Finn
*FREEDOOOOOOMM!*
he’s pretty cool
I just love commander Cody
First of all: his haircut is very cool, I actually cut my hair just like his.
Second: he is utterly based, moral questions definitely have right or wrong answers, and the answer for Slick is: based
Is there any information about what happend to slick after he was captured? Was he executed or just imprisoned?
I read this one comic called star wars destinies and him and another clone won me over in it and I forgave them both
Oh yes i absolutely loved that comic!
@@oya9984 Slick became such a badass character 😁😝
Personally it would have made more sense if Slick was an Arc trooper and a sergeant like Adin in the RC novels. More free thinking and all that. Eventually seeing the truth behind their situation and could have been hunted down by assassins had he escaped after his sabotage of the Republic fortifications in that one episode. Could have been an interesting perspective to see throughout the seasons.
Dogma and slick should or need to be in the bad breath because I need to know what happened to them!
I would’ve liked to see commander fox take issue with slick
Yes, that was slavery, but it was also conscription.
The Clone Troopers of the Republic had a duty to serve. Slavery was only temporary and technical, the Kaminoans could have just as easily branded themselves as guardianships of the underage clones, and than handed them over to the Republic as part of conscription, liberating them of the guardianship, technically making them freemen. Conscription and disenfranchisement were the real statuses of the clones.
The worst the Republic could have been said to have done is discriminated against clones in conscription, and the aforementioned disenfranchisement. But between that and slavery there's a long long way.
they weren't paid, and they were technically republic property (organic droids) as said many times in the series (especially by kaminoans). they were slaves plain and simple.
@@matthiuskoenig3378 Yeah they weren't payed.
And yeah, they were Republic property, but it's obvious the Republic would have emancipated them after the war, even if without enfranchisement.
The only difference between the clones and any normal civilian getting conscripted is that the clones weren't payed (though their expanses were provided for, which is better than most of the people of the Outer Rim had it income wise), they didn't have the right to vote, and the burden of conscription was discriminatorily placed entirely on their shoulders.
So did the clones get the short end of the stick? Yes. Was the difference for them between being slaves and freemen the same as that difference for actual real world slaves? No. Not even close.
So yeah, they were slaves, but it's just a status. It wasn't as bad as the name suggests, relative to the alternative.
So no. Just being slaves is not a reason to sell your nation, your brothers, or your sole out. Had their slavery held more gravity, I'd probably see it another way
I feel like Slick would gladly execute Order 66
Maybe.
No, Slick wants to be free, Order 66 is the antithesis of free will for clones. He would of joined the rebellion most likely since they are the ones opposing authoritarianism. And this time he got to choose what he wants to fight fof
I hope he shows up in the Bad Batch
The main flaw in this logic that I can see is this; the clones weren't slaves, but indentured servants for a duration. As we know, the clones were only alive because the Republic had need of an army, so in turn the clones owed the Republic service until completion of the war, which was actually even upheld by the Empire and they were allowed to retire afterwards. Furthermore, the Clones did receive pay, even if it was a pittance for a drink or two, however they technically weren't even owed payment by the Republic as their payment was life.
Regardless how order 66 turned out Slick was wrong his actions were incredibly short sighted and plagued with tunnel vision Ventress wasn't going to let him live in a Separatist victory even if she was paying him so that "freedom" just wasn't happening
Slick had the same issue as Dooku and most other deserters - Sees an issue, actively tries to destroy it rather than change it - The reason Dooku was feared by the sith so much, the reason the null arcs existed because they didn't want to just be slaves.
It needed to change, it did not need to be destroyed. Both still hurt innocent people and commited evils beyond imagining.