Why not leave the packing grease on? I do and get 500km or more before I need to lube. Only exception is if I am riding on gravel then I clean the chain as the packing grease attracts a lot of debris.
The packing grease prevents rust and corrosion while the chain is stored before sale. It's quite sticky and picks up grime and grit from the road (not just from the gravel). This decreases the life of the chain and hinders performance. In addition, the wax like coating interferes with most lubricant we use. Retain the packing grease? Will this myth never die? See: www.yahoo.com/video/technical-faq-leave-factory-lube-133018266.html Thanks for your comment. Regards, Tony
@@tony10speed I remove the grease from the outer surface of the chain using Tony's rag and Turpentine trick, and apply Squirt Lube on the rollers, thus violating both chain's and lubricant's manufacturers' directions. The chain does "sweat" grease through the waxy Squirt Lube but I wipe it off. I repeat the Turpentine wipe followed by a Squirt Lube application once a month.
For chains that you wax or use Squirt, I usually suggest removing the packing wax with degreaser overnight, wash with soap and water and thoroughly dry which is a little more effective then Turpentine. The "sweat" you talk about is the grime and grease that is captured by the Squirt that will need to be wiped off as you are doing. You are doing every thing correctly. How do you like the Squirt?
@@tony10speed Thank you once again for your channel! My Never-Thoroughly-Degrease policy makes me feel almost like a criminal. Yet a lazy criminal! Although the manufacturer of Squirt Lube would condemn me for misuse, I do like the product more than thinner dry lubes, and in 500ml bottle, it is cheaper than other dry lubes which are as thick. Few comments: 1. Since I apply The lube liberally (and let it dry over night), before exercising Tony's Turpentine Trick, I have to clean off the wax accumulated on the jockey wheels and the chainrings with a flat screwdriver. I does not flake off. 2. I live in the Near East (California like weather), but Squirt Lube (dry version) survives rainy days. No need to reapply after each rainy ride. (But then again, even after 1,500km some grease still resides between the chain's pins and rollers so this could be due in part to the grease and not Squirt Lube). On a commuter, It easily survives over 300 km. this figure is much better than the ones I got with thin dry lubes. 3. I use KMC X series chains, and chain stretch seems negligible when using Squirt Lube, yet chain stretch is dependent on shifting and riding style as well. All this is based on my experience maintaining 3 commuter bikes: Trek fx 1 (2017), Specialized Sirrus 1.0 (2021), Trek fx 1 stagger (2022).
@@kottelkannim4919 Thanks for the info. Very helpful. How do you know it's time to apply more Squirt and do you clean the chain before re-application (or just wipe the surface with Turps)?
Great video. I replaced my chain last year, it was the first time I'd ever replaced a chain by myself. I was surprised to feel the packing wax/grease on it when I opened the box, as I thought I was just buying a raw chain and would have to lube it myself. I called the bike shop when I got home, he said the leave it on, so I did. I road it for about 200 miles. And after every ride I would wipe it down because as you said, it's very sticky. I'm at the point now where I've wiped it down so much, the packing wax/grease is gone, so I used that park tools chain tool thing where you put de-greaser in the reservoir and strip the chain, and now I just lube it normally. Next time, I think I'll just strip it right away. Thanks Tony!
Stripping with degreaser and subsequently washing with soap & water, rinsing and wiping dry is a perfectly good method to prepare a new chain for installation and lubrication. The packing grease is very sticky and picks up lots of grease and road grime, needlessly wearing the bike chain. Why the myth of retaining the packing wax remains is still a mystery and perpetuated by some chain manufacturers and even bike shops. Thanks for your comment and safe cycling, Tony
Yes I have just recently fitted a new KMC 11 speed chain and soaked it in 250ml turps for 15 minutes three times and then methylated spirit twice. It is reassuring to hear your findings and that you do roughly the same thing to your new chain Tony 👍😀
Thanks. I use straight gum turpentine rather then methylated spirits in the methylated spirits does contain a small amount petroleum distillates that can interfere with any lubricant you might subsequently add. Not a big deal but worth mentioning. Keep up the good work and thanks for your comment, Tony
@@steveballzack1409 That's true, but gasoline, methyl hydrate and acetone are all quite toxic in addition are not environmentally friendly. What precautions do you take with these products and how do you dispose of them once used?
Excellent video Tony. Removing the packing grease is now one of the steps I'm always going to do. I've also been having a good experience with Squirt (wax and water emulsion lube) without going full immersive wax application.
If you are going to wax the chain, you might consider removing the packing wax by soaking in degreaser overnight, wash with soap and water, rinse and dry thoroughly. It's just a bit more effective. How long does one application of Squirt last you and what do you do before re-applying more Squirt?
@@tony10speed It's hard to tell when I should reapply to be honest, as the chain is now so quiet and so clean. I've been doing it every 100 miles or so, which seems overkill, but excess squirt just flakes off, making it seem pretty idiot-proof. If I was going on a multiday ride, I think I'd apply it pretty liberally - a little touch up every 100 miles again (so every day or every other day). A little dab on each link, let dry, and you're good. No need to clean beforehand (nothing to clean off!) My derailleur jocky pulleys have never been so nice looking
@@tony10speed 150-170 KM. The very first appliance (when you apply, wait for some time, apply again, wiping the outer remains) lasts ~250 KM. That includes road and off-road rides.
I never soak new chains. I just wipe them with a bathroom wipe, lube with Triflow, let sit a few minutes, then wipe with bathroom wipes. Perhaps Triflow isn't the best lubricant but it does penetrate well and it cleans the chain well. This regimen is so fast and easy that I do it weekly. My chains and cassettes last a long time.
That will work but I must point out that the packing grease may degrade some added bicycle lubricant (which hopefully penetrates beyond the chain surface). Each person has there own method, but in general, a quick wash with a degreaser such a Simple Green (not soaking) followed by soap/water and drying is a wise choice. Thanks for your input, Tony
It's worth the time to clean the chain prior to installation. One note, some individuals suggest soaking in degreaser, washing with soap and water and drying the chain. The Turpentine may not be as effective but is much easier and does a decent job. Regards and safe cycling, Tony
Thanks for illustrating what the chain looks like with lube after cleaning the chain. However, what am i supposed to compare that to? I didn't get to see what it looked like on a new chain left untouched from new packaging
You'll find packing grease inside and on the outer plates of the chain. This grease will pickup grime and grit from the road and grind down your chain. Inaddition, it may interfere with subsequent bicycle lubricants one uses. The concern by some is that once you remove the packing grease, subsequent lubrication will not penetrate into the bushings and pins. We have show that bicycle lubricants, for the most part, do penetrate deep into the bushing and pins after removing packing grease or degreasing the chain. That's the point of this video. Thanks for your comment. Regards, Tony
@@EddieTimberlane Not advised. Will still pick up lots of grease and grime even if you use dry lubricant. Also, the packing grease may interfere with the lubricant you use. 🙄
Question in your opinion should the packing grease be removed before or after installation? I just had one new chain put on one bike and I stripped the packing grease first then lubed it with dry lube. I also had another chain Installed on another bike and left the packing grease in place was going to wait til I get about 100 miles on it before I clean it Your thoughts please. Safe cycling Tony
I prefer to remove the chain packing grease before installation only because it's easier to just dump the chain into a container of turpentine or degreaser and leave overnight. If it's already on the bike, one can use a chain clean devise such as that offered by Park or Muc-Off, fill with degreaser, clean, wash with soap and water, rinse and dry before lubrication. At the very least, if the chain is already on the bike, use a cloth with turpentine or degreaser (wear gloves and work outside) and wipe down the chain, wash and dry before lubrication. One of these methods should work for you. Regards, Tony
On my new Diverge (gravel bike), I bought from a dealer, I immediately noticed an amazing amount of debris being collected on the jockey wheels...I mean...it was awful and I'm a decades long cyclist. In all those years, I had no idea there was a packing "grease". It took an entire summer and attention to the jockey wheels to clear it...it was thick...along with cleaning and waxing my chain. FYI...I'd mentioned this issue more than once to my lbs and they had no clue or didn't want to admit to it. I'd absolutely strip and wax every new chain and most especially on anything like a gravel bike.
Stripping a new chain before waxing is a neccesity as you point out. Thanks for your observations and comment. I'm sure it will help others. Also visit our TH-cam home site at: th-cam.com/users/MrTony10speed Regards and safe cycling, Tony
Tend to leave it until it needs a clean re-lube. Use cheapo vaseline mineral oil (find it attracts less dirt). It’s negative point though, it washes off fairly quickly when exposed to water, especially rain
As mentioned in another comment, The packing wax is extremely sticky and picks up grime and grit from the road or tail. Most recommend removing the packing grease and re-lubricating the chain. Vaseline is a petroleum-based product. And while Vaseline is great for a variety of uses, it isn’t great for your bicycle chain. It is simply too thick and gooey to penetrate the pins and rollers of your bike chain. Vaseline is also very sticky, like grease, and will pick up too much dirt and grime from the road and trails. Can it be used? Yes, if you have no alternatives. Is it ideal? No, but if that's all you have, it will work. Thanks for your comment and safe cycling, Tony
Why am I the only person that seems to have the most incredible soft, effortless can't even feel it shifting with the factory wax until it wears off? I don't see this discussed at all, I've used many lubes and silca secret was the best, but nothing compares to factory grease for me
It may feel good when shifting, but the heavy wax picks up a lot of grit and grime from the road and accelerates chain wear. Any wax remaining within the chain itself may (after the surface wax disappears) may interfere chain lubricants you and I use. So, it may feel great, but you are doing the chain a disservice. I remove the packing wax but the decision is up to you.
I have turpentine. Soak overnight vs agitating container bathing? which one is better? Soak overnight seems easy, you just leave it overnight. Agitating require you to repeating for several bath until it clear, maybe 4-6 baths.
Beware of soaking for more then about 10 min. See: th-cam.com/video/sh9FLSlGB8Y/w-d-xo.html The video is to remove packing grease. Chain cleaning and lubrication depend on the miles ridden and the weather/road conditions. For dry conditions I wipe down the drivetrain and lubricate the chain about every 150-200 miles. See: th-cam.com/video/I_5fNbDN3UA/w-d-xo.html If the conditions are wet or muddy, I'll wash the bike, dry and lubricate the chain. A sonic cleaner works well for both initial removal of packing grease as you describe above and periodic chain cleaning. The only down side to routine use of a sonic cleaner is that you have to remove the chain each time. Since I ride in mostly good conditions, removing the chain each time to clean is not worth the effort. Let me know if you have other questions. Regards, Tony
@@tony10speed Thank you Tony! I actually plan to soak overnight. Glad I see this reply before damage is done. So soak it, agitating it then sink or pour into the bag. Repeating for about 4-5 times? Also, do I need to use some kind of Alcohol after Turpentine? or it unnecessary. They say it for remove any residue film or something.
I now use Simple Green (from the local grocery store) as a cleaner/degreaser then wash with dish liquid soap and water before drying (I use a microfiber cloth then hand it up overnight). Simple Green is more environmentally safe the Turpentine although Turpentine will work. Use of Isopropyl Alcohol (although not a necessity) is a good way of removing any residuals. Regards, Tony@@Altimis
That'll work great. I tend to prefer Pure Gum Turpentine which does not contain some petroleum oils, but that's just my preference. Regards and safe cycling, Tony
Only adds to the point to remove any packing wax/lube, wipe down the chain and re-lubricate with you lubricant of choice. Thanks for you comment. Regards and safe cycling, Tony
But isnt the packing grease more viscous? Sure the after market lubricant gets into the rollers but its less viscous than the packing grease and therefore wears out faster (i guess). Wouldnt it make more sense to instead of removing all the grease to just clean the outside of the chain instead of completely soaking it in degreaser and relubing?
Some suggest just what you say. However, attempt to wipe off the packing grease still leaves some residual mostly on the inner side of the chain links and a little on the outside. This picks up a lot of grit and grime to wear the chain down more then the lighter lubricant we use. Inaddition, the packing grease may interfere with subsequent lubricants. Also, the current dry lubricants have Teflon like particles left on the chain after the solvent evaporates and is less likely to pickup dirt, grime and sand. Wet lubricants shed dirt and grime in wet conditions. I and most experts suggest removing the packing grease, but the opion is entirely up to you. Thanks for the question and safe cycling, Tony
The several we tried did penetrate well and my gut feeling is that the large manufacturers have looked at this - but this is only a guess. Some lubricants may not penetrate as well if they are very viscous. This is why I don't use Phil Tenacious Oil or thick motor oil as a chain lubricant (although they may work). I to use Phil Tenacious Oil for other bicycle applications such as when I rebuild freehubs and mixed with light synthetic motor oil to decrease noise of freewheels and more. Good question but I don't have all the answers since I haven't looked at "all" lubricants.
I would doubt that the sellers would take the time to remove the packing grease, but I'll have to ask some of my sales friends at the local bicycle store. Thanks for the question, Tony
if you do a more thorough job of removing the Manufacturer grease, then the lube which you applied may have penetrated even better. Part of waxing a chain is the need to remove the factory grease/wax. This usually takes 2 separate baths in mineral spirits, and then a soak in denatured alcohol. It's clean when you run a chain through a clean towel and there are no traces of grease in the towel. This ensures the wax, or in this case the dry lube, to adhere to the chain.
Very true, especially when waxing a chain. Some individuals use kerosene or gasoline which is highly toxic and not environmentally friendly. I use distilled Pure Grain Turpentine that does not contain the small amounts of petroleum products found in mineral spirits. Thanks for your input and safe cycling, Tony
Its also interesting to actually look for the factory grease that allegedly is inside the chain. So if you had to shorten a new chain there is a chance. Open up the links you removed. I couldnt find any!
Only if it's really full of grime and dirt. Some use a snap on chain cleaning kit you can fill with degreaser. Since I avoid the rain and muck when possible, I just wipe down the chain every 150 - 200 miles. See our 2-minute quick drivetrain quick cleanup below: th-cam.com/video/I_5fNbDN3UA/w-d-xo.html Regards and safe cycling, Tony
The chains will not rust after removing packing grease if they're kept lubricated. The packing grease, even if left on, will only last a few hundred miles before it's wears off. Here is my suggested weekly maintenance: th-cam.com/video/vqURwXOm0pw/w-d-xo.html Of course, if I ride in wet or very bad conditions, I wash down the bike, rinse, wipe dry and lubricate the chain.
@@tony10speed I've had that case. The chain was looking amazing until I decreased it and relubed it. It was completely rusted 3 days later in the wet winter. But my other bike chains didn't do that.
I used 1 drop of yellow outdoor acrylic in 2 oz of chain lubricant. Worked well with both dry and wet lubricant. I was surprised since I expected I would have to use an oil based paint but the acrylic work well (I still have the bottle of dyed lubricant in a clear container waiting for another project and the dye is still dissolved 2-years later).
Yes, turpentine can cause a number of symptoms including headaches, dizziness, nausea, confusion and rapid pulse. Breathing Turpentine can irritate the lungs causing coughing and/or shortness of breath. It can also be an irritant to the skin. For this reason, always wear gloves and work in a well ventilated area. I would point out that the dangers are probably less then working with more volatile petroleum products such as gasoline and kerosene. Still precautions should always be taken. Turpentine can also be recycled by storing in a container with a screw on lid. The dirt and grease will settle to the bottom and one can re-use the Turpentine. Good question, thanks.
Depends on the condition of the chain. If you ride in dry conditions (and avoid the rain when possible), just wiping down the chain or doing a quick drive train cleanup (see below) is often enough before you lubricate the chain. Sometime after riding in dirt and muck, washing with soap and water, rinsing, and wiping dry will do. Only occasionally will you need to degrease and that's when you pickup a lot of grime and muck from the road. See: th-cam.com/video/I_5fNbDN3UA/w-d-xo.html Regards, Tony
I don't know what the manufacturers are thinking. Do they think we don't know how to remove packing was (as in the video) or we won't buy their bicycle chain if we have to clean it before installation? Good question and I'd love to hear from the manufactures. Regards, Tony
Mineral spirits, as opposed to Pure Gum Turpentine, contains minimal amounts of petroleum oils, not enough to lubricate the chain efficiently but can interfere with the lubricants you and I use on our bike chains. Pure Gum Turpentine does not and is my preference. Good question, thanks.
Thank you from the USA. Also visit our TH-cam home site below and if you have question on any of our videos, be sure to put them in the comment section: th-cam.com/users/MrTony10speed Regards and safe cycling, Tony
I agree with you and it should be removed before lubricating the chain. It seems like this question will never die. Thanks for your comment and safe cycling, Tony
I always degrease new chain, firstly because I use wax based lube and the other hand factory grease collect more dirt and ending up a gunky black chain what is not fine for me.
As previously stated in other comments, the packing grease is quite sticky and picks up grime and grease from the road or trail. This increases wear and decreases performance. The packing grease may also interfere with the chain lubricants you and I use. My preference is to remove it and then lubricate the chain. I think that the manufactures, in this isolated case, have mislead us and a number of experts in bike maintenance agree. Thanks for the question, Tony
The packing wax is very sticky and picks up grime and grit from the road, increasing chain wear. It also can interfere with chain lubricant you and I use for our bike chain. I prefer to remove it, but that's up to you.
It is suggested by the experts such as Lennord Zinn (The Art of Bike Maintenance - in a post of his) to remove packing grease (which only serves to coat the chain surface to prevent rust and corrosion and is not meant to be a chain lubrication). My own research of the topic suggests that the packing grease may interfere with subsequent chain lubricants that are used. I suggest removal packing grease and then use of specific chain lubricants based on what I have read, but I leave that up to you. Also, when you clean your chain to remove packing grease, scrub but don't soak your chain in solvent for more then a few minutes as pointed out in the following video: th-cam.com/video/sh9FLSlGB8Y/w-d-xo.html Then rinse thoroughly and dry. Regards and safe cycling, Tony
For every chain lubricant out there, there are ardent followings and others who will tell you it's no good. Then there are those who wax their chains, which is not a bad idea if you live in a damp or wet climate. I, myself, use Finish Line Dry or Wet depending on the conditions (i use different bikes for dry and wet conditions so I don't have to remove lubricant to switch), but that's just my personal preference. There a several videos out there that compare chain wear using a mechanical setup and different lubricants, but remember, these setups may not represent true outdoor life experience. Do some reading and try different lubricants until you find one that suits you. Regards and safe cycling, Tony
Why not leave the packing grease on? I do and get 500km or more before I need to lube. Only exception is if I am riding on gravel then I clean the chain as the packing grease attracts a lot of debris.
The packing grease prevents rust and corrosion while the chain is stored before sale. It's quite sticky and picks up grime and grit from the road (not just from the gravel). This decreases the life of the chain and hinders performance. In addition, the wax like coating interferes with most lubricant we use. Retain the packing grease? Will this myth never die? See:
www.yahoo.com/video/technical-faq-leave-factory-lube-133018266.html
Thanks for your comment. Regards, Tony
@@tony10speed I remove the grease from the outer surface of the chain using Tony's rag and Turpentine trick, and apply Squirt Lube on the rollers, thus violating both chain's and lubricant's manufacturers' directions. The chain does "sweat" grease through the waxy Squirt Lube but I wipe it off. I repeat the Turpentine wipe followed by a Squirt Lube application once a month.
For chains that you wax or use Squirt, I usually suggest removing the packing wax with degreaser overnight, wash with soap and water and thoroughly dry which is a little more effective then Turpentine. The "sweat" you talk about is the grime and grease that is captured by the Squirt that will need to be wiped off as you are doing. You are doing every thing correctly. How do you like the Squirt?
@@tony10speed Thank you once again for your channel!
My Never-Thoroughly-Degrease policy makes me feel almost like a criminal. Yet a lazy criminal! Although the manufacturer of Squirt Lube would condemn me for misuse, I do like the product more than thinner dry lubes, and in 500ml bottle, it is cheaper than other dry lubes which are as thick.
Few comments:
1. Since I apply The lube liberally (and let it dry over night), before exercising Tony's Turpentine Trick, I have to clean off the wax accumulated on the jockey wheels and the chainrings with a flat screwdriver. I does not flake off.
2. I live in the Near East (California like weather), but Squirt Lube (dry version) survives rainy days. No need to reapply after each rainy ride. (But then again, even after 1,500km some grease still resides between the chain's pins and rollers so this could be due in part to the grease and not Squirt Lube). On a commuter, It easily survives over 300 km. this figure is much better than the ones I got with thin dry lubes.
3. I use KMC X series chains, and chain stretch seems negligible when using Squirt Lube, yet chain stretch is dependent on shifting and riding style as well.
All this is based on my experience maintaining 3 commuter bikes: Trek fx 1 (2017), Specialized Sirrus 1.0 (2021), Trek fx 1 stagger (2022).
@@kottelkannim4919 Thanks for the info. Very helpful. How do you know it's time to apply more Squirt and do you clean the chain before re-application (or just wipe the surface with Turps)?
Great video. I replaced my chain last year, it was the first time I'd ever replaced a chain by myself. I was surprised to feel the packing wax/grease on it when I opened the box, as I thought I was just buying a raw chain and would have to lube it myself. I called the bike shop when I got home, he said the leave it on, so I did. I road it for about 200 miles. And after every ride I would wipe it down because as you said, it's very sticky. I'm at the point now where I've wiped it down so much, the packing wax/grease is gone, so I used that park tools chain tool thing where you put de-greaser in the reservoir and strip the chain, and now I just lube it normally. Next time, I think I'll just strip it right away. Thanks Tony!
Stripping with degreaser and subsequently washing with soap & water, rinsing and wiping dry is a perfectly good method to prepare a new chain for installation and lubrication. The packing grease is very sticky and picks up lots of grease and road grime, needlessly wearing the bike chain. Why the myth of retaining the packing wax remains is still a mystery and perpetuated by some chain manufacturers and even bike shops. Thanks for your comment and safe cycling, Tony
Tony, when you are right, YOU ARE RIGHT!
Thanks Stan. This seems to still be a debated issue and it's hard to put it to rest. Regards and safe cycling, Tony
Yes I have just recently fitted a new KMC 11 speed chain and soaked it in 250ml turps for 15 minutes three times and then methylated spirit twice. It is reassuring to hear your findings and that you do roughly the same thing to your new chain Tony 👍😀
Thanks. I use straight gum turpentine rather then methylated spirits in the methylated spirits does contain a small amount petroleum distillates that can interfere with any lubricant you might subsequently add. Not a big deal but worth mentioning. Keep up the good work and thanks for your comment, Tony
I go with white gas, methyl hydrate, and a final rinse with acetone. Can't get any cleaner than that.
@@steveballzack1409 That's true, but gasoline, methyl hydrate and acetone are all quite toxic in addition are not environmentally friendly. What precautions do you take with these products and how do you dispose of them once used?
@@tony10speed I just let them evaporate in a container outside.
Also not gasoline, I think it's naphtha. Coleman fuel type stuff.
@@tony10speed Methyl hydrate is usually just 90-95% ethanol mixed with 5-10% methanol. It is perfectly environmentally friendly.
Excellent video Tony. Removing the packing grease is now one of the steps I'm always going to do. I've also been having a good experience with Squirt (wax and water emulsion lube) without going full immersive wax application.
If you are going to wax the chain, you might consider removing the packing wax by soaking in degreaser overnight, wash with soap and water, rinse and dry thoroughly. It's just a bit more effective. How long does one application of Squirt last you and what do you do before re-applying more Squirt?
@@tony10speed It's hard to tell when I should reapply to be honest, as the chain is now so quiet and so clean. I've been doing it every 100 miles or so, which seems overkill, but excess squirt just flakes off, making it seem pretty idiot-proof. If I was going on a multiday ride, I think I'd apply it pretty liberally - a little touch up every 100 miles again (so every day or every other day). A little dab on each link, let dry, and you're good. No need to clean beforehand (nothing to clean off!) My derailleur jocky pulleys have never been so nice looking
@@tony10speed 150-170 KM. The very first appliance (when you apply, wait for some time, apply again, wiping the outer remains) lasts ~250 KM.
That includes road and off-road rides.
I never soak new chains. I just wipe them with a bathroom wipe, lube with Triflow, let sit a few minutes, then wipe with bathroom wipes. Perhaps Triflow isn't the best lubricant but it does penetrate well and it cleans the chain well. This regimen is so fast and easy that I do it weekly. My chains and cassettes last a long time.
That will work but I must point out that the packing grease may degrade some added bicycle lubricant (which hopefully penetrates beyond the chain surface). Each person has there own method, but in general, a quick wash with a degreaser such a Simple Green (not soaking) followed by soap/water and drying is a wise choice. Thanks for your input, Tony
Excellent timing. I'm about to replace my chain for the new season.
It's worth the time to clean the chain prior to installation. One note, some individuals suggest soaking in degreaser, washing with soap and water and drying the chain. The Turpentine may not be as effective but is much easier and does a decent job. Regards and safe cycling, Tony
Thanks for illustrating what the chain looks like with lube after cleaning the chain. However, what am i supposed to compare that to? I didn't get to see what it looked like on a new chain left untouched from new packaging
You'll find packing grease inside and on the outer plates of the chain. This grease will pickup grime and grit from the road and grind down your chain. Inaddition, it may interfere with subsequent bicycle lubricants one uses. The concern by some is that once you remove the packing grease, subsequent lubrication will not penetrate into the bushings and pins. We have show that bicycle lubricants, for the most part, do penetrate deep into the bushing and pins after removing packing grease or degreasing the chain. That's the point of this video. Thanks for your comment. Regards, Tony
@@tony10speed oh I see. Can you just lubricate over the top of the packing grease? Does lubricant also attract dirt and grime?
@@EddieTimberlane Not advised. Will still pick up lots of grease and grime even if you use dry lubricant. Also, the packing grease may interfere with the lubricant you use. 🙄
Question in your opinion should the packing grease be removed before or after installation?
I just had one new chain put on one bike and I stripped the packing grease first then lubed it with dry lube.
I also had another chain Installed on another bike and left the packing grease in place was going to wait til I get about 100 miles on it before I clean it
Your thoughts please.
Safe cycling Tony
I prefer to remove the chain packing grease before installation only because it's easier to just dump the chain into a container of turpentine or degreaser and leave overnight. If it's already on the bike, one can use a chain clean devise such as that offered by Park or Muc-Off, fill with degreaser, clean, wash with soap and water, rinse and dry before lubrication. At the very least, if the chain is already on the bike, use a cloth with turpentine or degreaser (wear gloves and work outside) and wipe down the chain, wash and dry before lubrication. One of these methods should work for you. Regards, Tony
On my new Diverge (gravel bike), I bought from a dealer, I immediately noticed an amazing amount of debris being collected on the jockey wheels...I mean...it was awful and I'm a decades long cyclist. In all those years, I had no idea there was a packing "grease". It took an entire summer and attention to the jockey wheels to clear it...it was thick...along with cleaning and waxing my chain. FYI...I'd mentioned this issue more than once to my lbs and they had no clue or didn't want to admit to it. I'd absolutely strip and wax every new chain and most especially on anything like a gravel bike.
Stripping a new chain before waxing is a neccesity as you point out. Thanks for your observations and comment. I'm sure it will help others.
Also visit our TH-cam home site at:
th-cam.com/users/MrTony10speed
Regards and safe cycling, Tony
Great info, as usual, from Tony Marchand.
Thank you. Also visit our TH-cam home site at:
th-cam.com/users/MrTony10speed
Regards and safe cycling, Tony
Tend to leave it until it needs a clean re-lube. Use cheapo vaseline mineral oil (find it attracts less dirt). It’s negative point though, it washes off fairly quickly when exposed to water, especially rain
As mentioned in another comment, The packing wax is extremely sticky and picks up grime and grit from the road or tail. Most recommend removing the packing grease and re-lubricating the chain.
Vaseline is a petroleum-based product. And while Vaseline is great for a variety of uses, it isn’t great for your bicycle chain. It is simply too thick and gooey to penetrate the pins and rollers of your bike chain. Vaseline is also very sticky, like grease, and will pick up too much dirt and grime from the road and trails. Can it be used? Yes, if you have no alternatives. Is it ideal? No, but if that's all you have, it will work.
Thanks for your comment and safe cycling, Tony
Why am I the only person that seems to have the most incredible soft, effortless can't even feel it shifting with the factory wax until it wears off?
I don't see this discussed at all, I've used many lubes and silca secret was the best, but nothing compares to factory grease for me
It may feel good when shifting, but the heavy wax picks up a lot of grit and grime from the road and accelerates chain wear. Any wax remaining within the chain itself may (after the surface wax disappears) may interfere chain lubricants you and I use. So, it may feel great, but you are doing the chain a disservice. I remove the packing wax but the decision is up to you.
@@tony10speed on another note I would say the factory lube is easier to remove after riding 100 miles or so (while wiping the outside)
I have turpentine. Soak overnight vs agitating container bathing? which one is better? Soak overnight seems easy, you just leave it overnight. Agitating require you to repeating for several bath until it clear, maybe 4-6 baths.
Beware of soaking for more then about 10 min. See:
th-cam.com/video/sh9FLSlGB8Y/w-d-xo.html
The video is to remove packing grease. Chain cleaning and lubrication depend on the miles ridden and the weather/road conditions. For dry conditions I wipe down the drivetrain and lubricate the chain about every 150-200 miles.
See:
th-cam.com/video/I_5fNbDN3UA/w-d-xo.html
If the conditions are wet or muddy, I'll wash the bike, dry and lubricate the chain.
A sonic cleaner works well for both initial removal of packing grease as you describe above and periodic chain cleaning. The only down side to routine use of a sonic cleaner is that you have to remove the chain each time. Since I ride in mostly good conditions, removing the chain each time to clean is not worth the effort.
Let me know if you have other questions. Regards, Tony
@@tony10speed Thank you Tony! I actually plan to soak overnight. Glad I see this reply before damage is done.
So soak it, agitating it then sink or pour into the bag. Repeating for about 4-5 times?
Also, do I need to use some kind of Alcohol after Turpentine? or it unnecessary. They say it for remove any residue film or something.
I now use Simple Green (from the local grocery store) as a cleaner/degreaser then wash with dish liquid soap and water before drying (I use a microfiber cloth then hand it up overnight). Simple Green is more environmentally safe the Turpentine although Turpentine will work. Use of Isopropyl Alcohol (although not a necessity) is a good way of removing any residuals. Regards, Tony@@Altimis
@@tony10speed Really appreciated for your helpful and informative answer.
I clean my new chains with mineral spirits and then Simple Green mixed with some boiling water.
That'll work great. I tend to prefer Pure Gum Turpentine which does not contain some petroleum oils, but that's just my preference. Regards and safe cycling, Tony
I bought a KMC Z8 chain once and left the initial lube on. It started squeaking after about 50 km.
Only adds to the point to remove any packing wax/lube, wipe down the chain and re-lubricate with you lubricant of choice. Thanks for you comment. Regards and safe cycling, Tony
But isnt the packing grease more viscous? Sure the after market lubricant gets into the rollers but its less viscous than the packing grease and therefore wears out faster (i guess).
Wouldnt it make more sense to instead of removing all the grease to just clean the outside of the chain instead of completely soaking it in degreaser and relubing?
Some suggest just what you say. However, attempt to wipe off the packing grease still leaves some residual mostly on the inner side of the chain links and a little on the outside. This picks up a lot of grit and grime to wear the chain down more then the lighter lubricant we use. Inaddition, the packing grease may interfere with subsequent lubricants. Also, the current dry lubricants have Teflon like particles left on the chain after the solvent evaporates and is less likely to pickup dirt, grime and sand. Wet lubricants shed dirt and grime in wet conditions.
I and most experts suggest removing the packing grease, but the opion is entirely up to you.
Thanks for the question and safe cycling, Tony
@@tony10speed thanks for your elaborate answer
Do all lubricants penetrate deep inside the chain?
The several we tried did penetrate well and my gut feeling is that the large manufacturers have looked at this - but this is only a guess. Some lubricants may not penetrate as well if they are very viscous. This is why I don't use Phil Tenacious Oil or thick motor oil as a chain lubricant (although they may work). I to use Phil Tenacious Oil for other bicycle applications such as when I rebuild freehubs and mixed with light synthetic motor oil to decrease noise of freewheels and more. Good question but I don't have all the answers since I haven't looked at "all" lubricants.
how about when you buy a new bike. is the chain used in the new bike have packing wax?
I would doubt that the sellers would take the time to remove the packing grease, but I'll have to ask some of my sales friends at the local bicycle store. Thanks for the question, Tony
if you do a more thorough job of removing the Manufacturer grease, then the lube which you applied may have penetrated even better. Part of waxing a chain is the need to remove the factory grease/wax. This usually takes 2 separate baths in mineral spirits, and then a soak in denatured alcohol. It's clean when you run a chain through a clean towel and there are no traces of grease in the towel. This ensures the wax, or in this case the dry lube, to adhere to the chain.
Very true, especially when waxing a chain. Some individuals use kerosene or gasoline which is highly toxic and not environmentally friendly. I use distilled Pure Grain Turpentine that does not contain the small amounts of petroleum products found in mineral spirits. Thanks for your input and safe cycling, Tony
Its also interesting to actually look for the factory grease that allegedly is inside the chain. So if you had to shorten a new chain there is a chance. Open up the links you removed. I couldnt find any!
The grease is clear and difficult to see. How did you make your observation?
Should you periodically remove the chain to thoroughly clean it?
Only if it's really full of grime and dirt. Some use a snap on chain cleaning kit you can fill with degreaser. Since I avoid the rain and muck when possible, I just wipe down the chain every 150 - 200 miles. See our 2-minute quick drivetrain quick cleanup below:
th-cam.com/video/I_5fNbDN3UA/w-d-xo.html
Regards and safe cycling, Tony
From my experience, it´s impossible to do an "almost 100%" cleaning job without removing the chain.
Cheap chains will rust after removing the packing grease. There it's better left on.
The chains will not rust after removing packing grease if they're kept lubricated. The packing grease, even if left on, will only last a few hundred miles before it's wears off. Here is my suggested weekly maintenance:
th-cam.com/video/vqURwXOm0pw/w-d-xo.html
Of course, if I ride in wet or very bad conditions, I wash down the bike, rinse, wipe dry and lubricate the chain.
@@tony10speed I've had that case. The chain was looking amazing until I decreased it and relubed it. It was completely rusted 3 days later in the wet winter. But my other bike chains didn't do that.
How did you turn the lubricant yellow?
I used 1 drop of yellow outdoor acrylic in 2 oz of chain lubricant. Worked well with both dry and wet lubricant. I was surprised since I expected I would have to use an oil based paint but the acrylic work well (I still have the bottle of dyed lubricant in a clear container waiting for another project and the dye is still dissolved 2-years later).
Is turpentine hazardous to your health?
Yes, turpentine can cause a number of symptoms including headaches, dizziness, nausea, confusion and rapid pulse. Breathing Turpentine can irritate the lungs causing coughing and/or shortness of breath. It can also be an irritant to the skin. For this reason, always wear gloves and work in a well ventilated area. I would point out that the dangers are probably less then working with more volatile petroleum products such as gasoline and kerosene. Still precautions should always be taken. Turpentine can also be recycled by storing in a container with a screw on lid. The dirt and grease will settle to the bottom and one can re-use the Turpentine. Good question, thanks.
Should you degrease your chain prior to applying new lubricant?
Depends on the condition of the chain. If you ride in dry conditions (and avoid the rain when possible), just wiping down the chain or doing a quick drive train cleanup (see below) is often enough before you lubricate the chain. Sometime after riding in dirt and muck, washing with soap and water, rinsing, and wiping dry will do. Only occasionally will you need to degrease and that's when you pickup a lot of grime and muck from the road.
See:
th-cam.com/video/I_5fNbDN3UA/w-d-xo.html
Regards, Tony
Do you think the manufacturers have an interest in telling us not to remove the packing wax/lube?
I don't know what the manufacturers are thinking. Do they think we don't know how to remove packing was (as in the video) or we won't buy their bicycle chain if we have to clean it before installation? Good question and I'd love to hear from the manufactures. Regards, Tony
Why not use mineral spirits?
Mineral spirits, as opposed to Pure Gum Turpentine, contains minimal amounts of petroleum oils, not enough to lubricate the chain efficiently but can interfere with the lubricants you and I use on our bike chains. Pure Gum Turpentine does not and is my preference. Good question, thanks.
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Regards and safe cycling, Tony
whatever stuff the manufacturers put on the bike chain, it's just to prevent it from rusting when it's sitting on the shelf waiting to be bought.
I agree with you and it should be removed before lubricating the chain. It seems like this question will never die. Thanks for your comment and safe cycling, Tony
I always degrease new chain, firstly because I use wax based lube and the other hand factory grease collect more dirt and ending up a gunky black chain what is not fine for me.
Agree completely, especially if you're waxing your chain. Thanks for your insight. Regards, Tony
Why not leave the packing grease on the chain?
As previously stated in other comments, the packing grease is quite sticky and picks up grime and grease from the road or trail. This increases wear and decreases performance. The packing grease may also interfere with the chain lubricants you and I use. My preference is to remove it and then lubricate the chain. I think that the manufactures, in this isolated case, have mislead us and a number of experts in bike maintenance agree. Thanks for the question, Tony
It is pointless to remove it. Too much extra work for no measurable gains.
The packing wax is very sticky and picks up grime and grit from the road, increasing chain wear. It also can interfere with chain lubricant you and I use for our bike chain. I prefer to remove it, but that's up to you.
If you only use wet lube and degrees your chain once a month ish, i think the factory grease disappears in a couple months.
It is suggested by the experts such as Lennord Zinn (The Art of Bike Maintenance - in a post of his) to remove packing grease (which only serves to coat the chain surface to prevent rust and corrosion and is not meant to be a chain lubrication). My own research of the topic suggests that the packing grease may interfere with subsequent chain lubricants that are used. I suggest removal packing grease and then use of specific chain lubricants based on what I have read, but I leave that up to you.
Also, when you clean your chain to remove packing grease, scrub but don't soak your chain in solvent for more then a few minutes as pointed out in the following video:
th-cam.com/video/sh9FLSlGB8Y/w-d-xo.html
Then rinse thoroughly and dry.
Regards and safe cycling, Tony
What are the best chain lubricants?
For every chain lubricant out there, there are ardent followings and others who will tell you it's no good. Then there are those who wax their chains, which is not a bad idea if you live in a damp or wet climate. I, myself, use Finish Line Dry or Wet depending on the conditions (i use different bikes for dry and wet conditions so I don't have to remove lubricant to switch), but that's just my personal preference. There a several videos out there that compare chain wear using a mechanical setup and different lubricants, but remember, these setups may not represent true outdoor life experience. Do some reading and try different lubricants until you find one that suits you. Regards and safe cycling, Tony