GM 2.0/2.2/2.4L, Timing Chain Replacement, Cloyes 9-4201S & 9-4202S
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 28 ก.ย. 2024
- 🔥 This technical video from Cloyes covers the removal and installation of the timing drive system for General Motors 2.0/2.2/2.4L Ecotec engine.
🔧 Like what you see? Why not Join Shop Masters, our community for mechanics and techs who love what they do, take pride in their work, and are always looking to improve their skills. It’s free to join, and as a member you’ll get early access to all sorts of helpful videos. Visit www.cloyes.com... to see what it’s all about.
⛓ Part numbers related to this video are: 9-4201S, 9-4201SA, 9-4201SA1K3, 9-4201SA2K3, 9-4201SAVVT1, 9-4201SAVVT2, 9-4201SAWP, 9-4201SB1K3, 9-4201SB2K3, 9-4201SBWP, 9-4201SWP, 9-4201SX, 9-4202S, 9-4202SA, 9-4202SAX, 9-4202SX, 9-4201, 9-4202, 9-5375, 9-5381, 9-5382, 9-5383, 9-5384, 9-5385, 9-5386, 9-5467, 9-5481, 9-5496, 9-5803, S849, S850T, S851, S853, S855, VC106, VC107, VTS106, VTS107
⚙️ Please see our online catalog at www.cloyes.com... for full details and to confirm vehicle fitment.
🚗 Application coverage ranges from the model years 2000-2017 and the following vehicles:
Buick Allure
Buick LaCrosse
Buick Regal
Buick Verano
Chevrolet Astra
Chevrolet Captiva Sport
Chevrolet Cavalier
Chevrolet Classic
Chevrolet Cobalt
Chevrolet Equinox
Chevrolet HHR
Chevrolet Impala
Chevrolet Malibu
Chevrolet Orlando
Chevrolet Zafira
GMC Terrain
Oldsmobile Alero
Pontiac G5
Pontiac G6
Pontiac Grand Am
Pontiac Pursuit
Pontiac Solstice
Pontiac Sunfire
Saab 9-3
Saab 9-3X
Saab 9-5
Saturn Aura
Saturn Ion
Saturn L100
Saturn L200
Saturn L300
Saturn LS
Saturn LS1
Saturn LW1
Saturn LW200
Saturn Sky
Saturn Vue
FYI: I broke a tooth on BOTH new balance shaft sprockets using the 'drill bit method!' To anyone who had the same problem, I'd suggest wrapping the OLD balance sprocket chain around the sprocket and grabbing with a vise-grip to hold in place while removing/installing the sprocket. By using the old chain, you take the pressure off the single tooth and greatly reduce the likelihood of damaging the sprocket!
Very good advice. The punch/bit method will work, but you do risk breaking a tooth. If we film an updated video for this application, the method you described is the method we will recommend.
Glad i followed this advice. I cut the old chain in half and wrapped it around the balance shaft sprocket and let it bind up against the block. Worked perfect to break the balance shaft bolts loose, then i wrapped the chain around the other way, let it bind up against the block on the intake side and against a bolt boss on the exhaust side and i could torque the sprocket bolts to spec
@@romanfedotov9434 Glad my advice panned out for you. It was REALLY upsetting when I broke not one, but BOTH of my new sprockets (and had to buy two more!)
When the first one snapped, I thought it was my fault or the gear was of poor quality. The second one proved of the stupid idea of using a drill bit!
@@romanfedotov9434 Yep i did this exact thing, ,the pin method just wasnt working
Thanks for this video. I watched many TH-cam videos on this procedure, but this is by far the best and most helpful.
Just watched the video and think it will help on this first time on this style engine. I did notice that no one has mentioned that if the original guides are broken or have misplaced parts you had better remove the oil pan and clean them out of the oil pickup tube screen. You will have a greater failure later.
Agreed, i found a number of broken guide fragments and metal from damaged bolts in the oil pan
Good video, especially showing how to get rid of the slack. Cloyes has awesome timing chain kits.
Dear Cloyes.
Please update the "CLOYES 95381" Timing guide.
The bolt hole wall tolerance is too thin. They rattle and break.
I've contacted Cloyes numerous times with no reply about it.
Cloyes should be the first to correct the 95381 Timing guide since Cloyes has the contract with GM.
Thank you.
This video is a big help. I wish you had a video on replacing valve guide seals on the 2.2 ecotec. Wife's car smokes especially after idling a while at a traffic light or first start up.
Thanks. We only specialize in the timing components so you will just see timing content from us, but I understand. Change the PCV valve first if you haven't already, just to make sure that isn't the problem.
@@Cloyes01 Thanks for the reply but there is no "conventional" pcv valve. There may be something built into the underside of the valve cover but haven't been able to find anything for sure and that would be an expensive guess. Thanks again, if I can solve this problem I'll probably be looking y'all up for the timing chain kitdls. Her car has been a great car(2003 Saturn Quad coupe) untill this smoking and has 171k miles and still looks brand new. Thanks again!
Excellent video, probably the best one I've seen especially without all the horribly mixed of terrible music. How refreshing, a simple video that is extremely helpful. On the 2013 Equinox 2.4L, the engine mounting bracket is blocking access to the lower engine chain path and where the tensioners are located. If this mount/bracket is removed would the engine tend to drop or move? This appears to be a serious issue for guy in his garage with no lift. Thanks again great effort!!
Yes the engine will want to drop some when it is removed. Use a jack under the oil pan to support the engine before removal. Find something flat and bigger than the jack head so the weight is distributed more, that way you don't damage the pan. When you raise the jack you only want a little pressure, stop when you see the engine move up a slight amount.
On the 2009 2.2 VVT the exhaust cam wanted to rotate counter clockwise when the chain came off. The 24mm wrench kept it from moving as it rested agsinst the cowl. In the video it shows having to rotate the intake cam in order to get the sprocket on the exhaust cam. However in my case I had to rotate the exhaust cam clockwise to get it on, since I only had one 24mm wrench and it was locked on the exhaust cam.
Another tip, when putting the crank pulley back on, you can torque it to the initial 74 ft lbs with a large screwdriver between the pulley and the housing. However to get the additional 75 degrees of rotation I chalked the bolt and pulley and then made a mark to where the bolt needed to rotate to for the extra 75 degrees. Then I used my 1400 ft lb impact gun to get it there.
The cams I was able to do myself by hand.
One thing I didn’t hear mentioned is if you’re doing this because the chain guide broke, make sure to drop the oil pan and clean out the oil pickup tube. I am in the process of doing one now and the oil pickup tube was completely jam packed with debris. Had I not done this I’m certain the motor would not have lasted more than 5 miles.
Very good point Jerrod. Thanks.
Absolutely. With the engine removed from my ‘08 Cobalt, I took off the oil pan and the OIL PICKUP TUBE was packed with debris. There were metal pieces from the chain guide, and broken plastic guide pieces.
Exactly I,m doing this Job on a 2011 Buick Regal 2.4 mine was also jam packed I took this oil pan off at first to clean out the Metal particles and knew there was debris ,you have to also take the metal Stupid cover off and knock the Oil pickup tube out of its hole first before you even find out what’s in it,stupid design but so are all GM products
A side note the upper chain guide was completely cut in Half,so if you hear any strange noise,take that Valve cover off to inspect
That must've been the it seized on me..broken guide .. replaced chain n everything but didn't check the oil pan now I'm swapping the engine.... (Year later)
Thanks for posting this. Going to do this. Does that tube just pop out?
These videos make shit like this possible.. THANKS !!
Installing this past weekend. I triple check the timing marks and got the car to start. However, I’m with engine codes p0016 p0017 p228d p0089. I did not use the Cyoles timing chain sprocket because it had a circle mark at 4 o’clock. I did use the OEM sprocket.
I have confirmed, the front cover gasket that I reused was compressed enough that oil got by it at the oil pump, I replaced the gasket with a new one, as I recommend for this job. No more ticking or rattle. Perhaps the chain was replaced before I bought the HHR and the cover gasket was reused and the bolts over torqued .
Glad you got it figured out!
I bought this timing kit and it is great, however what they don't tell you is that crankshaft harmonic balancer bolt has to be replaced with a new one , it is not included with this kit which I thought was a bummer, these bolts can be hard to find.....
Did u have to pull the engine?
@@psfanboy79 no, I did not have to pull the engine, it is tough to work upside down but it wasn't too bad to do. just put something to cover the oil pan when working on this, if you drop a bolt it could go right into the pan..... just did not think it is right to not include the crank bolt withis kit... but it is what it is....
It's not TTY...re-use it.
@@superdhc ok, thanks did not know that, my maual said it had to be replaced. thanks again for that infro....
The TTY Crank bolt is easy to find. Almost every GM dealership and part store has them either in stock or can get the bolt within 12 hours if you don't want to drive to the next city.
Always replace Crank, Cam and Intermediate idler gear bolts. Always.
Thank you for this video, wish all TH-cam videos were this good.
Your video and time help me, I thank you
Every other video tells me to position cylinder 1 at top dead center of the compression stroke. I have the phase sprockets.
great video, need to add how to do the bolt stretch after torquing down on the cams and crank bolt,,, the crank bolt should not be reused
Whenever he took the cam sprocket bolts out he said to discard them and throw them out....and when he took out the crank bolt he said to discard it so.... yeah he did cover that
He pulled to torque then Gave it another 30 degrees watch close when he torques it. And on the bolts why the hell can't they give a final tightness instead of the degree crap the head bolts are a real pain and after the 90 degrees on the head bolts how do you double check them?
@@stevemajor1110, if you really want to know, you could Google it. But since you asked, and I didn't feel like explaining it in detail, here ya' go: www.assemblymag.com/articles/87404-fastening-threads-torque-control-vs-angle-control
Primary tensioner just keeps backing off. I can't pull it out. Any suggestions?
I've done dozens and dozens of these 2.4 and 3.6 but never a 2010 equinox 2.4, the first model change year. What thee hell am I doing wrong? After hours of researching I found intake cam dowel hole Points 5 o clock. Still getting correlation codes tho. Ive combed through just about every wire, plug and sensor. Probe tests, cycle duty tests, frequency tests. I'm left speechless. Just when you think youve got every inch figured out that one sneaks up to bite you.
Question 1) What's the deal with the black plastic guide that always breaks. Is there a reason this peice is solid plastic instead of metal like the other side?
Question 2) I'm only getting a year out of these kits before it's time to change them again is this normal? I've changed my 2012 regal 2.0 lhu 3 times and 2013 equinox 2.4 twice, 8 months apart. The chains are either stretched or black plastic guide is busted.
Did my 2012 malibu in my driveway and im like why the fuck is this plastic. That one was worn, the metal one snapped and fell down. I left it in the pan lol. Ran good until a girl rear ended me and totaled it a year later.
Great video, but don't you need something holding the cams in place so that when you remove the sprockets and chain they don't move and screw up the timing? I've seen these blue or gold cam holders for this project for the Saab 9-3 but in the video I don't remember it mentioned. Thx.
They are not necessary, but can make the job easier. We do not use them during the video. The timing is set by the marked chain links aligning to the sprocket marks. If the cams move during disassembly, you will move the cams back when installing the new chain.
@@Cloyes01 Cloyes, the cam locks are necessary on a Saab if you are going to remove cam sprockets, and probably even if you don't. The sprockets are not keyed to the cam like a regular ecotech. They are just held by bolt tension. The cam sprockets also do not have timing marks on them. Blue locks are needed for the B207L (9-3 Linear little "t" engine, Gold is needed for the B207R big "T" engine. Trust me, I am putting one back together right now.
Is that balance shaft part number correct? I am getting 9-4202sax
Great video, keep it up. Cheers
Why would you not rotate the crank 720° before throwing everything back together? Wouldn't you want to do this to make sure you're timed properly and don't have any interference? Just curious. Great video.
Rotating the engine by hand, particularly in this application, comes with a risk of jumping time. Since the tensioner has no oil pressure behind it, the chain will have some slack. That slack shifts as the camshafts open and close valves and will allow the chain to jump teeth on the crankshaft sprocket. If the marks are all aligned properly there is no chance of interference. We recommend the first rotations of the engine be with the starter.
@@Cloyes01 thank you!
Doesn't the starter just turn the crank?@@Cloyes01
@@rkw3000 Yes, but the speed and constant load from the starter does not allow chain slack to shift back and forth as severely as turning it by hand.
@@rkw3000 Yes, but it is about the speed at which it turns. Slow rotation by hand allows the chain slack to shift back and forth because of the valves opening and closing. With the shifting of the slack, plus the tensioner not being primed up with oil, it is really easy for the chain to jump on the crankshaft sprocket. When you turn it over with the starter, there is a much lower chance of the chain jumping.
Es un excelente video lo unico que fallo es que el subtitulo no deja ver bien, saludos buen video
I ordered at kit from you all for a 2010 equinox and when I get the camshaft sprockets one with the unique color on the intake side and black on the exhaust and black on crank shaft and line the crank sprocket up with the timing mark my exhaust cam is setting between 11 and 12 o'clock and intake is setting close to 2 o'clock does that sound right
That sounds correct. As long as all three marks are aligned you have it right.
Is it safe to remove camshafts with Chains removed without the holding tool for valve lash , rocker and valve spring/stem replacement?
I have photographed the cam positions and as far as I can see as long as I put the cams back in proper positions and replace the camshaft caps properly there should be no problem. the Haynes manual does not have cam removal procedure for a engine that already has the
timing and balance shaft chains removed. Thank you!
Yes, it is safe to do so. To your point, just make sure to install the cams back on the correct banks and the caps are reinstalled as removed. Try to find a resting position before you pull them out, meaning the camshafts don't have valve spring pressure against them.
@@Cloyes01 Thank you for your help!
@@Cloyes01 Keep the timing tech videos coming! I feel that timing is one of the most complex jobs to do but with the proper
Knowledge, you realize that it's the complexity that deters people from doing their own timing chains out of fear of doing it wrong. It seems to me that Most if not all manufacturers
Great video! Thanks!
when I tried this at 9 minutes with the punch method the tooth broke off the gears, there not very strong and I didn't get close the the torque before it snapped, both gears snapped a tooth off.
Very useful video, thank you so much
Do any of the bolts under the timing cover require loctite? The chain guide bolts or sprockets?
very good and clear cheers
I have a 2012 2.4 ecotec ,I had the dealer do a timing chain under warranty , it only lasted a year and a half , timing keeps jumping , and only 54000 miles , oil changed is done regularly , any reason why it doesn't last long , are your parts better quality , I am mechanically incline and watching the videos I think I can tackle this , I like the car very disappointed in the engine is junk .
Thanks Travis
O
You asked "anyreason why it dosent last long" thrn answered it at the end if your comment. "The engine. Is junk" hahah
I have everything installed correctly and in the proper order but for some reason the chain is too tight for me to even get around the bottom sprocket. Is there a trick needed for the 2.4 ecotec with vvt? I ordered the 94201sa
Put on the crank first, line up that mark, then the intake, then the exhaust.
still having an issue
Valve cover and primary cam timing chain wouldn’t have to come off to just reset the balance shaft chain tensioner, correct? A water pump was changed and now it needs to be reset
Correct, you can remove and install the balance shaft tensioner without primary system removal. You will just need to remove the timing cover.
What if my chain marks don't come back to the original places every two rotations of the crank
The chain marks won't, that is normal. They will eventually, but it will likely take over 100 rotations.
What about the washers between the crankshaft sprockets
GM did use frictional washers on both sides of the crankshaft sprocket in some applications. If your engine had them, clean them off and reuse them with the new sprocket.
What if I didn’t put them back on? I didn’t even know they were on there till I seen this comment?
@@dgreen4298 Most Ecotec engines do not have any washers. Even if it did, there is no harm in not reinstalling them.
At 11:33 how does turning only the intake cam shaft not mess the timing of the whole operation up? This is the only part i am unsure of.
The chain sets the timing. As long as all the marks align when you get the chain fully installed then the engine will be in time. If you need to rotate the shafts slightly to get everything aligned that is OK, as long as the marks align when you are done.
I understand everything till 11:34 ..procedure comes up ..I understand that you move the exhaust or intake cam...counterclockwise wise to "help" the Cam Phaser ..get align with the chain's color link but its not mandatory to move it .??.along it aligned up with the marks? Correct?
@Cloyes01
@@t0ny2trill If your chain and sprockets marks are aligned, then it will be 100% correct. Sometimes all the shafts are sitting perfect and you don't need to move anything, but sometimes you might need to move a shaft slightly to get it to come together. But ultimately the chain sets the timing. If your marks are aligned, then you are in time.
@Cloyes01 thank you cloyes after getting my hands dirty , I see why you need to my move the phasers ...to help you put the chain on and to properly set the phaser on the cam ..it will make a clicking noise .
Is there such a part called a Teflon bush that is part of the process of changing your timing chain.
There are no Teflon bushings directly related to our timing components. But it is certainly possible that there could be one somewhere outside the timing cover that is removed during disassembly.
Your in the wrong place asking a semi non-sequitur question. There may be a bushing made of teflon. I have no idea.
a question,, the little notch on the tensioner...will as you spin it in, it also rotates,,.. will it match up with the notch on the tensioner guide?
Yes, that notch will align itself to the corresponding feature of the tensioner guide.
2011 terrain I removed the bolt that hold the intake balance shaft sprocket… housing thing and it snapped in half. (Please forgive me I have no experience with mechanics work and I’m doing it on my own because of mechanics screwing me). It’s like a long piece of metal attached to the intake and exhaust balance sprockets that goes into the engine block. I didn’t realize you needed a drill bit to hold it in place. Will this mess up my engines timing? Also, I rotated the pistons to 90 degrees before TDC so that when I installed the head (at tdc) I wouldn’t scratch the valves or pistons. I also Cannot find cam sprocket bolts or a crankshaft bolt, going to check the dealership . Thank you everyone enjoy your Labor Day
Hello
I have the same chain set but I can't get the camshaft sprockets right am i doing something wrong i watch your video and i stil cant get it right
i have a Saab 9-3t BioPower
Do your camshafts and camshaft sprockets have the indexing features? Some Saab models require special tools because the cams and sprockets do not have the indexing features like the domestic GM models do.
@@Cloyes01 The camshaft have the indexing features
The original camshaft sprockets dosent the new sprockets have the indexing features
The thing is the chain doesn't line with the new camshaft sprocket
@@thisistheway1766 You typically need to rotate the cams and/or the crank to get the marks to align properly. Especially if you experienced a timing failure of any kind. The chain sets the timing in this engine, if all marks align, then you are in time.
Thanks bro 👍🏾👊
Instructions included with the duralast tensioner:
"Activate the tensioner prior to installation by pushing down on the plunger so that it fully extends and has spring pressure"...
"Gm recommends to activate the tensioner after installation by pushing on the chain with a rubber tipped tool.
We have found this method to be very difficult.
Failure to activate the tensioner will result in severe engine damage"
Returned the kit today, and ordered the Cloyes Tensioner to just swap out.
Do you suggest activating it and then installing it; any tips?
Do not activate before installation. There is a ratchet mechanism inside the tensioner, if you activate before installation the tensioner will be in its most extended ratchet slot and will overtighten the chain, break a guide, or damage the tensioner internally.
The instructions basically mean to 'load' the tensioner, to make sure it is pressed down and ready for install.
Then after install and chain and guides installed, then you 'activate' the tensioner with a good tap and watch the chain take tight form when success.
What year is that engine ?
First of all thx this video! If I only replace the main tensioner, do i need to loosen anything or just replace the tensioner and activate with pushing the chain?
Just remove and replace the tensioner and make sure to get the new one activated.
Great vid!!!
I am going to replace just the camshaft sprockets and was wondering if the intake and the exhaust camshaft sprockets are same on the 2.4 ecotec engine? Thanks
The non-VVT engines use the same camshaft sprockets on both cams. VVT equipped engines could have the same phaser on both cams, or some applications used unique intake and exhaust phasers. You can lookup your application on our website to see what phaser combination it requires.
Thinking about buying your kit for my LE5 2.4L ecotec in my 2007 G6. Is the chain a different design compared to oem or are they both the same design? Just trying to get a feel or the difference between the 2
The chain we supply is a match to the OEM design.
Mine has 170 k on it may be time to change it what u guys think?
Does the 94201swp complete kit for timing and balance chain with water pump- come with timing cover gasket and gasket for water pump ?
It does not include the timing cover gasket, but the O-ring gasket for the water pump is included.
Excellent
Hi cloyes, I have an Opel Zafira 2.2l ecotec engine and am hearing some rattling noise from the left side of the engine is it possible that the noise is coming from the timing chain. Please I need help!
Worn or failing timing systems will make a rattling noise. If the noise is coming from the timing cover area it is likely that is what you are hearing.
@@Cloyes01 Thanks very much for your response
@@Cloyes01 Hi cloyes, What's the best way to fix it the noise. Please I need help!
@@salmanphariss2086 The only way to know the health of the timing system would be to remove the timing cover for an inspection. With the cover off you can check for broken guides, a stretched chain, or an over-extended tensioner. If any of these are the case I would recommend our 9-4201S timing kit to replace the components.
@@Cloyes01 That's very useful. Thanks once again!
My 06 cobalt ss supercharged has 130000 miles now and I've noticed about an eighth maybe even a sixteenth of an inch of slack in the timing chain between the cam sprockets. Is this something to worry about? All markings are lined up just didn't know if this was wear and tear that needs to be adressed thanks for any input
It is normal for a small amount of slack to develop between the cam sprockets when the engine is not running. The camshafts are under valve spring pressure and will rest in positions that create that small amount of slack. The only way to gauge chain life would be to check tensioner extrusion with all the chain slack on the tensioner side of the sprockets. If the tensioner can extend far enough to remove all chain slack then the chain is still withing operational limits.
do the timing marks on the NA crank balance sprocket and the force sprocket match up? It doesn't seem like it on the kit I bought. maybe the +/- 5 degrees on the forced is the reason why?
They are different, but the timing procedure is the same. Just make sure the marks on the chain and sprockets all align.
I got to the point of installing the timing chain tensioner and it doesn’t seem to want to go through all the way so I can thread it in. Any ideas as to why?
It was accidentally activated prior to installing.
@@shawnshurtz9147 turns out the diameter of the part was too thick returned to parts store and returned the defective one then got correct one. Thank you for the reply though 😁
Do you guys have all that for a 2015 Chevy Malibu 2.5 non turbo ?
Does the 2014 LE9 use the same VVT sprockets on both intake and exhaust or both different , thanks
The LE9 used the unique phaser on the intake camshaft. It will take 2 different phasers.
Simply said you're the greatest thank you so much conveyed that to anybody all so well I did not know that there were two chains inside there my Cobalt has like 60,000 miles on it 2008 do I need to do this at this time I just put synthetic oil in the engine and I'm fixing to do the transmission change filter and oil but how many miles are the timing chains good for please respond and thank you for your video great job
It's supposed to last 200k but you will need to inspect it at 150k
@@harrywillisdick8660 hey thank you hundred fifty thousand miles check it on the timing chain 2.2 4-cylinder thank you for responding I just now got it today have a great one
@@apaulothegreat1581 I was given an 01 saturn with the 2.2 ecotec and it slipped the timing chain and bent all the valves at 128,000. Hit and miss with these things. That was a LOT of work to rebuild the head and do the timing and balance shaft chains with it shoehorned sideways in the car. I'll do head gaskets on a V8 any day over that damn thing.
@@MattsRageFitGarage hey thanks a lot it's early morning but the sun ain't come up here still clicking alone yeah I got about sixty thousand three hundred miles now on the 2008 Chevrolet Cobalt with a 2.2 I change the oil and put Castrol synthetic in it seemed to help on the cold one in startups with the injectors rattling let's just watch a dealership tells me I thought it was the timing chain when I first bought the car news I should note injectors
I have an 08 with a hard 160,000 miles on it. Really realiable and I never changed the chain or guides.
Saturn Vue 2006 2.4 liter my top carm sprocket break what will cause that to happen please
Why doesnt the cloyes vvt sprockets for the 2.4l ecotec have markings for intake and exaust all same part number😂
Do all six of the timing marks, 3 on the balance chain and 3 on the timing chain, need to be in the correct time at the same time after first installing? I just replaced both the balance and timing chains. While installing the balance chain, I ensured that all three of my timing marks were correct. While installing the timing chain, the crankshaft sprocket mark was off, so I had to slightly rotate the crankshaft by hand. Now, all three of my timing marks are correct on the timing chain, but the marks are incorrect on the balance chain. Since I ensured that all three of the balance chain marks were correct before I worked on the timing chain, does it matter that they no longer appear in time?
All six marks should align at the same time, but you still have a 50% chance of it being correct. You need to make sure the mark on the intake balance shaft is up and the mark on the exhaust balance shaft is down when the camshaft sprocket marks are at 10 O'clock and 2 O'clock. If the balance shaft positions are opposite (intake-down and exhaust-up) then your balance shafts are 180 degrees out of time and you will need to address it. If you properly timed the balance shaft system before it rotated, then you will either be perfect or 180 degrees out
@@Cloyes01 Perfect, thank you so much for the quick response. That was my assumption, so I already removed the necessary items to put all six in alignment. After removing the primary tensioner, though, I’m unable to remove the snap ring to deactivate it. None of my expensive snap ring pliers will budge the ring. Any advice how I can remove this? Thanks again.
@@arnieb4849 We typically use snap ring pliers and a small flat tip screwdriver. You got to get the snap ring compressed enough to work the screwdriver behind it and then pry it out.
I have some slack in my chain after installation and im concerned its to much slack. Whats a sufficient amount of slack?
The chain will have some slack after the install. The tensioner will need some oil pressure behind it to take the slack out of the system. Even then, valve spring pressure will clock the camshafts one way or the other when the engine is not rotating and slack will gather somewhere. Too much slack is not an issue until the tensioner is completely extended and can no longer tension the chain. Usually you will get cam-to-crank correlation codes before the chain stretches this far.
Any reason behind not having any slack at all?
I have a car with this engine. And without marks on the camshafts from the factory. New timing kit has these marks.
The engine is suffering from a slack timing chain.
How do I know when the chain is slack and crank set in TDC. That the camshafts are in TDC?
You have to have marks on the cam phasers. Also TDC on the exhaust stroke all 4 cam lobes will be down on the #1 cylinder and the key on the crank is at 12:00.
Does it matter if the balance shaft sprockets move a bit? Yes mine rotated a bit on disassembly. As long as chain links line up I guessing I’m ok???
On disassembly yes they might move, but as long as everything lines up properly when you're done, it should be fine. The balance shafts are weighted so without the chain on they might fall/rotate a bit until new chain and tensioner is on.
Youre fine. If youre concerned, remove the BC tensioner, de-activate, put a pin in it, reinstall pull the pin.
I have a little play in the right side balance shaft guide these are all new parts and idk anymore
Great video but that engine it’s a nightmare I’m staying away from chevy 4 cyl engine
Wait until you do a v6 twice the parts and time
thanks.
Would this be same process for Ecotec 2.4L from a 2012 Chevy Equinox?
Very similar, the only difference will be the cam sprockets. You will have phasers instead of plain cam sprockets, but they will be marked as well and everything lines up the same.
@@Cloyes01 Awesome, thank you! Great video's and tutorials!
@@Cloyes01 So if we have phasers are the phaser sprockets used again or do we need to buy new phaser sprockets?
@@kirkfranks1 Phasers can be reused, just inspect the sprocket teeth and make sure they are not heavily worn. It is recommended to replace them while you are in there though.
I have a 2010 Cobalt 2.2 VVT. At cold starts it'll have that rattling noise for a few seconds then quiets. It has 79k so is it best to replace the kit vs just the tensioner?
Same thing here's, only last about 1-2 seconds, it's not pistons.
Same here... I just took it apart and the chain was loose a little. 110k
i bought the 9-4201S, but the crankshaft sprocket doesn´t have the black plastic, is just a metallic sprocket, there´s anything wrong?? 10:37
No, since filming this video we have updated the crankshaft sprocket and eliminated the rubberized cushion coating that is prone to breaking apart.
@@Cloyes01 thanks!!!
Should threadlocker be used on the bolts??
It is not required, but it can only be beneficial.
@@Cloyes01 thank you 😀 trying this in my VX220 this weekend. Wish me luck!
Cody !!
Nice
TDC on the EXHAUST stroke? I was always taught TDC was on the compression stroke
In a four stroke engine you have 2 moments that the piston reaches top dead center. Once on the compression stroke, then once again on the exhaust stroke. Typically you would time the engine at TDC on the compression stroke like an old small block, but not on these Ecotec engines. TDC of the compression stroke in an Ecotec is when the crank key is up, but the camshaft marks are 180 degrees out.
I have verified this On my 2012 equinox, timing marks on my cam gears point inward and downward when at the end of compression stroke. Exhaust stroke is correct.
I torqued your bolt at the 63 ft pound on the cam sprockets and the bolt broke. Are you sure that's the right torque? GM is like about less than 30 ft pound.
The GM torque specifications we found are 22 lb/ft plus 100 degrees on VVT equipped engines, and 63 lb/ft plus 30 degrees on non-VVT engines.
@@Cloyes01 I only have 2 torque wrenches. one in 250 ft pounds and 250 inch lbs .From what I understand, you can torque in inches and multiply by 12. True? But since 22 times 12 is 264, is there a way I could get that extra 14 inches? Without going out and get a different wrench. If you understand what i mean.
@@cartroublewannafix8611 Using the inch pound wrench at 250 inch pounds will get you to 20.82 foot pounds. That is close enough and likely within the range of accuracy for an over the counter torque wrench. Possibly just as accurate as using the larger torque wrench at 22 pounds.
If you are concerned, you can torque to the 250 inch pounds, then set the larger wrench to 22 foot pounds. That way you know it should only require slightly more torque before you get the click.
@@Cloyes01 I forgot to mention that on my ft lbs one I only have from 50 l ft pounds to 250 ft pounds. I don't have the 22 pounds on the big one.
@@cartroublewannafix8611 I seen a video where the mechanic explained by using a long handled torque wrench has more leverage and you will have more pressure in the inittial torque.
13:53 why not? It should be timed and ready to turn an infinite number of times.
I dont get that either
@@frankjustyk9720 There is no oil pressure for the hydraulic tensioner when you roll it by hand and you risk jumping timing. I believe GM service manual says this too. Probably wouldn't happen but all the ones I have done I just double check everything is lined up, put it together and fire it up. Never had an issue
The timing marks on the chain /will/ come back around; but not immediately on the next rotation. It could take ~20-30 (just guessing) before they come back around to the same spot on the gears.
I just checked my chain - 46 teeth on cam; 23 on crank. (makes sense; exactly 2x on the cams). The chain has 148 teeth. In one rotation of the chain, the cam has gone 3.2173 rotations (.The lowest common multiple of 46 and 148 is 3404. If we take 3404 / 46, we get 74 (rotations).
So if you rotate the engine over by hand, you'll have to continue to rotate it for 74 rotations before they come back into alignment. You would essentially see the timing chain move about 2 teeth per rotation and they would have to 'walk' all the way around the cam gear.
James O'Gorman at 14:03, he cleared up what I meant. The engine will be correctly timed and it could be turned. The kicker on these is the hydraulic tensioner. On engines without tensioners on the cam chain, they are free to be turned as much as a person wants without any engine damage.
2007 Chevy Cobalt I'm having a hell of a time no garage and fighting the cold weather. It's January in Ohio so it's kinda cold
Anyways I followed this video and it helped alot but that harmonic balancer was a bitch and I accidently turned the crank trying to tighten it. I was so pissed I haven't been back out there to try again. I have no clue what I'm doing lol
Unless the chain skipped teeth that doesn't matter on this motor. It has keyways on all the sprockets.
Thank you very good to know. The cams aren't way off but it just don't look like 10 and 2
@@randomfloob8443 how did it end up going for you? Doing this job probably this week. Like you, I also dont know what I'm doing haha
Well to be honest I been lazy it's been raining alot here but I did manage to get everything back together. However it did not start. It sounded like it really wanted to and I got excited but no go. Something I did notice that I should have tried first was my spark plugs all four were black. Carbon fouling I believe but I haven't checked for spark.( Should of been the first test) but I'm not a mechanic so I'm learning as I go. Anyways if it turns out to be fouled plugs and I did all that shit for nothing I'll be licking my wounds from the cash I been spending
I am sorry I don't reply fast and I changed the name lol
I already installed the timing chain on my 2012 Chevy Malibu. What happens if the timing sprockets on the water timing chain are not aligned properly? Does the vehicle overheat? Do some cooling systems not function properly?
The balance shaft chain that drives the water pump needs to be timed for proper balance shaft operation. There should be no water pump or cooling related issues as long as the chain is turning the pump. You could experience excessive engine vibrations, but that is it.
I have a question. Hopefully, it's not too absurd...
I had to replace the cylinder head with a new one since the old one was cracked due to the past owner overheating this 2014 chevrolet Equinox 2.4 L. I have everything installed correctly except the timing chain set which i just purchased for Cloyes...I don't have a clue on how to set the timing since everything has been replaced...cylinder head, waterpump, voltage packs, plugs, gaskets...ect.
With this all in mind, can you help me understand how to set the timing at this point.
The chain sets the timing in this engine, and all the sprockets index onto their shafts one way. You just need to get the 2 cams and crank to the positions to align the marked links. If all three marks are aligned properly, then the engine will be in time. The only issue you may run into is rotating the cams if one of the pistons are at TDC. You may need to rotate the crank to get your pistons down, then move your cams, then bring the crank key back to 12.
@Cloyes01 thank you very much I will try this 😊
why can’t the tensioner be installed activated
If the tensioner is activated and fully extended, the internal ratchet mechanism will be in its last, most extended step. If you attempt to install it at this point you will either damage/bypass that internal mechanism, or the tensioner will overtighten the chain and likely cause damage to the guides or chain. The ratchet mechanism needs to start at the most compressed position and work its way out over time as the chain stretches.
👍👍👍👍
I have to check timing on the 2.4 ecotec motor with VVT that another mechanic did the timing chain on but now has correlation codes and p0011 , p0014. It wouldnt run after he did the work. I got it started and some times it runs perfect for a minute then goes to running horrible and dies. upon reving i here a strange noise in the engine. I am guessing he some how has the cams off from the cam gears and the valves are just barely hitting on rev up. Anyway I need a video on how to set these up with the VVT if anyone can help. I cant find any videos or pics of proper set up. We did rent the special tool.
This video will apply directly to the VVT engines as well. The only difference you will find is that the cam sprockets look different. The timing is still set the same, it uses the same chain and marks, and the VVT cam sprockets are marked as well.
With that said, it sounds like you may have a VVT system issue, not a timing issue. If the car runs perfect for any amount of time, then the timing is likely correct. It is either mechanically in or out, it won't switch. The VVT system includes the variable cam sprockets (cam phasers) and the VVT control solenoid. This is the system that adjusts cam timing of each cam as you drive. If you have a bad solenoid or phaser you can experience the symptoms you are describing.
@@Cloyes01 you guys are awesome for responding to these comments!
Those aren’t correlation, those are the VVT solenoids which you can buy on Amazon for $25. Probably clogged.
librosss venden libros formato digital???
How did you remove harmonic balancer??
@Jimmy S my timing cover is leaking and I need to replace the gasket, the pulley wont rotate the other way once i begin to loosen it?
You're probably already done but:
I used an 11mm socket. Stuck it between the spines of the balancer pulley and the spines on the engine cover.
Or you could a use a large sized spanner tool to help hold it in place.
What a great tutorial you made by this, hats off!
This is such a better video than your previous one THANK YOU!! the last video said nothing about taking up the slack of the chain before triggering the tensioner which i believe is why i had slackness in my chain
Made everything simple as shit. I’ve down loads of timing belts but never a chain, and was pretty nervous going into it. This was an absolute gem of a video. 10/10. Glad the engine was out in the vid. Made everything super clear. Thanks
It's too easy that way, and clean too. Cheating, I say.
This is my second comment on this video, but I think it is worth saying. I, like many of you, had a really hard time getting the sprockets off on the balance shafts. In fact, I ended up dropping drill bits and punches into my oil pan (100% my fault- I should have stuffed a rag into the void leading to the oil pan). Anyhow, what I ended up doing (and it worked really well) is I took the old balance shaft chain, and cut it in half with a cutting wheel. From there, I draped the chain over the top of 1 of the sprockets, bunched one end of it and let it bind on the housing. This held the sprocket solid and allowed me to remove and reinstall the new one.
Were you able to get your stuff put of the oil pan
@@Burgerkinglover32 yeah- I think I had to drop the oil pan to get everything out
@billyjacque6940 was it difficult did you do it on a lift or on the ground
Ok i have everything broken down and i am trying to remove the balance shaft gears but they will not come off. I tried sticking a punch in the hole to keep the gear from moving but the bolt will not break aloose. Any suggestions ?
If you can reach it with an impact gun, CAREFULLY try a couple of SHORT bursts with the impact gun.
If you dont have an impact gun, or cannot reach with the impact gun, use a breaker bar and sharply hit the end of it with a hammer.
You need sudden sharp force to get the bolt to start moving.
Stay gold.
Like to thank you guys for the great information! I just finished my first Eco timing chain and balance chain replacement on a 2013 Equinox. With your help I was able to get the job done right the first time. I've done some timing chain's before on older cars and got the much needed help from you on these newer engine's. These are a little bit more complex engine's. Thanks again!
I dont mean to be so offtopic but does any of you know a tool to get back into an Instagram account..?
I was stupid forgot my account password. I would love any assistance you can offer me.
@Archie Louis Instablaster =)
@Brodie Moshe I really appreciate your reply. I got to the site thru google and im trying it out atm.
Looks like it's gonna take quite some time so I will get back to you later when my account password hopefully is recovered.
@Brodie Moshe it did the trick and I now got access to my account again. I am so happy!
Thank you so much you saved my account !
@Archie Louis You are welcome =)
I took my 2012 Buick Regal to MileX to get water pump done. Then they messed my timing up. When i brought it back they said it was a ignition coil (i changed em all a month prior). I told them that im thinkin they made a simple mistake when puttin timing chain back. They refused to acknowledge that they are ABLE to make mistakes smdh so im stuck with a car that FINALLY went to crap COMPLETELY and dk what to do. I'm NOT a mechanic. But i know when somethins NOT RIGHT. ✌
Go somewhere for 2nd opinion explain the situation and when its the timing demand they replace ur
I love the cloyes timing videos. Used this one today on a customers car. They were quoted 16 hours for the job by the dealer, we did it in 6.
I also used your video for the gm 3.6 in the GMC Acadia. Great videos 👍
Very informative quick guide. Thx, Cloyes!
What a shitty engine.
Yup.
It's only shitty because the front guide continually breaks in these.
I wonder who makes the front guide anyway..
wrap the old chain around balance shaft gear and hold with Visegrips to break bolt loose much easier
yeah just figured that out... my knuckles hurt
Yup. Messing around with a drill bit to hold em in place sucked. I just wrapped the old chain and wedged the links between the gear and the bolt on the balance shaft hold down plate
very impressed with the cost of the VVT kit and this tutorial. all aftermarket manufacturers need to take notice of Cloyes and follow their example. much appreciated!
i just learned how to replace my water pump and timing chain for free thanks just saved me so much more money!!!
I've got an 07 HHR with 2.2. It currently has 308000 miles on it. Replaced alternator is the only thing I had to do on the engine. It still has the original clutch.
Better go buy some lottery tickets you're luck is about to Run out
@@mftstrifelegit2786 what more do you expect of the motor if it dies tommorrow 308 is good enough
Very nice video.. thanks for your guidance.. I bought your pats and installed myself with the engine in the vehicle..
I am looking to change the timing chain for 2.4 Chevy Equinox. Please, give me your e-mail, I have couple of questions with that. Thank you!