Comparing old and new APT NDM motor cars in a 14 car rake up an incline

I've had a 5 car APT set up away for a while so the time finally came to get everything out and running.
I then added a new 2023 NDM motor car and the results of the old vs new comparison were really quite interesting.

[@GDGRailway47712]

I know I'm quite late in response, but the APT-P was rarely run as a 14-car double set. Each half is actually counted as one set and they had to run two together. The full 14 car was just done a few times for press and promotional shots etc.
Much more common was to have a shorter (2 or 3 passenger car) set and a full 5 or 6 passenger car set. Sometimes with one and sometimes with two NDMs.
There is lots of info on formations on the 25kv APT site.

[@anfieldroadlayoutintheloft5204]

cool vid running trains thanks lee

[@Winklepicker84]

The pantographs as fitted on the 5 car set and the new ndm are the earlier Stone-Faiveley type, the ones on the 7 car are the later Brecknell-Willis High Speed type

[@WirenwoodModelRailway]

Thanks for the useful information, Phil, I wasn't aware of any of that! Regards, Chris

[@StormmyStormmy]

Hi, great informative video of issues that have plagued the APT second release that was rushed out by Hornby without full development, the first issue was back in the 80’s, I know a lot of people had a lot of issues with the 5 & 7 car set, I believe you can buy the later 3rd release parts to fit in the 2nd release NDM unit, I have 2x the 2nd issue NDM cars which run very well, I will upgrade the motor chassis mounts for the new ones, I have Legoman sound decoder which is an ESU micro V5 for mine that I will fit in time, I have applied Labelle 106 ptfe grease to the wheel bearing’s which has stopped the squeaking, I have also got ESU led lighting units with onboard stay alive power banks to stop any flickering etc, I will make do with what I have as I know Hornby don’t care as long as they sell their items, I will fit the black windscreen surrounds once they come available, I have the hunt couplings to replace the not so very good couplings Hornby supply, there are quite a few people who have sorted all the issues Hornby couldn’t be bothered to on the second run, I’m sure the longest rake the real APT ran was 9 & 11 cars according to history videos, I guess Hornby producing all the extra cars is a good money spinner for them, I have enough extra cars for an 11 car rake & I got the development coach as well, the 7 car set being sold with a dummy power car is an absolutely terrible thing to do, thanks for sharing.

[@WirenwoodModelRailway]

Thank you, some excellent tips in there - I keep thinking about changing out the capacitors in the coaches but having seen how flimsy the catches are in the motor car I'm reluctant. It's frustrating that we have to own the risk of putting it all right when it was Hornby's error. Thanks for all those tips, regards, Chris

[@StormmyStormmy]

@@WirenwoodModelRailway Hi, there are videos on youtube on how to take the body off without breaking the clips, the capacitors on the earlier coaches don’t work at all, I was thinking about fitting 2 function decoders to each to control the lighting then I saw a video on the Esu led lighting strips, they have amazing lighting sequences on them that will transform the APT, the early set are good if you follow the information on model railway forums about upgrading what Hornby couldn’t be bothered to do because of their greed and corner cutting.

[@lordsherifftakari4127]

a quick note regarding the tight fit of this train in your staging yard.
if possible, add 1 additional piece of standard straight track to provide that extra bit of wiggle room as well as track sensors so you know where the train is when you park it such that you are confident the points are fully clear.
squeaky bearings are easily dealt with by the application of a small amount of Graphite where the wheelsets are held to the bogies. this may also reduce overall friction resistance with the older power cars pulling the train uphill on a 2% incline.
my only real critique is the sharpness of your mainline curves, particularly given you are running a train with the power car in the middle pushing half the train around.
short of absolutely bulletproof Trackwork, there will be trouble spots.
passenger trains are not fond of tight curves and scale model equipment does look and run better using a broader radius in mainline curves.
general rule is to build all curves to meet the recommended radius for your longest piece of rolling stock to prevent undesirable performance issues and derailments.
I also noted that you are not using any sort of Roadbed under your track to further dampen noise and provide a smoother run

[@WirenwoodModelRailway]

Thanks for the tips! I did actually add another sensor to the storage line but as I've kind of done the electronics to death already, decided not to include it, although I had filmed it. And if only I could extend the lines! I'm kind of at the limit already and maybe should be thinking about shortening the train! I did give a lot of thought to some kind of bed underneath the track but to be honest, coming from train sets as a kid, I quite like the sound of the trains rattling around me! Regards, Chris

[@markpoynter5761]

Great video as I can repeat the same experiences with the APT. Bought the original 7 car set and had trouble fitting a 8 pin decoder (and broke the same plastic clips when trying to fit inside). Also disappointed with the original coach capactors as not only could they been seen but they never actually worked! Bought the new 7 car APT version (R30229) and they've addressed all these issues and more. The new coach packs are ones to buy (R40209A, R40210A, R40211A & R40212A) and they hide the capacitor and the stay alive works. So while it's great they've fixed the issues second time round, anyone who bought the first release have a compromised model.

[@WirenwoodModelRailway]

Ah thank you - I didn't realise they had different model numbers, I'll check back with what got delivered vs what I ordered! Those capacitors are particularly frustrating, it really wouldn't have been difficult for them to be tested before release, you'd think someone would have noticed! Regards, Chris

[@yorkshirejunction1734]

Great video. I didn't know about the old version and new release. I've been considering getting one for a while so this has been a very beneficial video for me 👍 much appreciated 👏👏 That's very poor from Hornby, especially when people are paying good money.
Always great to see your fiddle yard.
Regards
Yorkshire Junction 🚂

[@WirenwoodModelRailway]

Well, should you find yourself at this end of the M18 any time you'd be welcome to come and see it in person!

[@yorkshirejunction1734]

@@WirenwoodModelRailway
That's a very kind offer Wirenwood, I'd love to come and see the setup in person someday thank you. Keep up the good work 👍

[@WirenwoodModelRailway]

@yorkshirejunction1734 just drop me a line if you're going to be nearby, there's an email address on the channel somewhere! Best wishes, Chris

[@yorkshirejunction1734]

@@WirenwoodModelRailway cheers Chris will do 👍