thank you Scott! going to be looking into putting my Talon on Haltech and am interested in furthering my understanding for this software personally so I can provide help to others in my area considering nobody tunes Haltech around me. +1 for detail of explanation!
Thank you for this video, unfortunetaly that doesn't explain the real difference between open loop and close loop control, you are only showing 2 things : - There is few pourcent missing in the base PWM map in open loop near in the max torque range : that's why there is torque missing. - You probably don't raise the PWM during spool in the open loop map : that's why the turbo spool is better in your case in close loop mode. These things can be done in open loop mode. What you should insist on is : the close loop mode permits to cancel the boost error, better boost aim tracking. BUT, need to be correctly setup in order to not let it do some mistakes !
also soft gate springs are harder to set up for high boost with 4 port solenoid in closed loop with out multiple start duty points. a little easier to have a proper set up open loop table and trim by gear. both methods need to be set up correctly to deliver the same out come, the closed loop is just a bit easier for the average punter on a simple setup not requiring in depth control for repeatable outcomes.
So, base duty is the percentage of work the solenoid does to let air out to spool the turbo? So too high of a duty will hit the boost target too soon and trigger the boost cut. That explains why I hit my boost cut so quickly. Too high of a duty at certain kPa.
open and closed loop applies here but it's not where the gains are you could have got this boost response by A. setting up haltech open loop EBC with map as an axis...or B stuck a 12psi check valve in the hose ...this super basic pneumatic verses a more complicated ecu controlled ebc. you also really should have mentoined some of the other advantages of ecu controlled boost ..low boost on cold engine low boost in low gear low boost low traction low boost..
I just bought a GF8 WRX with a PS1000 in it, it has been tuned to 16psi with a GFB boost T. I want to buy one of your open loop boost controllers. I want to be able to switch between 8 and 16 from inside the car preferably with a toggle or momentary switch. Is this possible? Also how do I set up the turbo timer function?
I'm not fully understanding how it made MORE power given that the same boost, timing, and afr was used. The turbo isn't spooling throughout the entire midrange. The gain in power started after the powerband's clearly shown onset of boost. I will be awaiting an explanation. Thank you
The wastegate will open proportional to boost until the amount of gas through the turbocharger is not enough to generate more boost. With Any electronical boost control (open o close loop) you can have the WG completly closed until yo get close to your desired boost... You will get more boost sooner but the same maximun boost
i have a platinum sport 2000 on my 2jzgte I've been running off the waste gate springs, would i spool noticeably faster if i went closed loop to manage my boost?
+180StypeX Any improvement would depend on the specific hardware setup, however generally adding electronic control does give a noticeable improvement to spool time by avoiding wastegate creep.
+haltechecu 2jzgte, precision 6266 twin scroll dual BB, tial 44mm wastegate. Makes 600whp at 22psi but full boost doesnt come on until 5k which i believe is very odd, im hoping perhaps adding the haltech solenoid and running closed loop instead of just wastegate springs controlling boost will help. I also tested for boost leaks & there are none.
Hi Scott, i have a 4g63 proyect with E6k computer i try to set a mac solenoid boost control and i can not make it work. The soleniod is good but the E6k does not control it. I dont know what i'm doing wrong.
i was going to post this exact question. I tune ford ecus using hptuners but there is still a few PID controlled tables and I haven't been able to wrap my head around it properly. did you end up getting around to covering this in a video at all?
hi scot i am new starter in tuning world i like to tune my owne car i am car technicians i have one simple qeustion can i tune cars with hall tech software that doesn't have hall tech ecu for example bosch edc series of ecu can i tune with hall tech tune software thanks for help
+redlimit835 It is possible to compare separate log files in the one graph - once you have loaded both .csv files, drag and drop the second data set onto the first. Right click > Move Offset to line up the data. Please contact Haltech Support directly if you require more information.
Hey Turd! Great question. Our tech support team will be more than happy to answer it for you. You can get in contact with them here: www.haltech.com/support
Great to see and fact based comparison between these two boost control methods. EBC is displaying outstanding numbers. Great info guys!
Awesome videos enjoyed how you are able to explain things on mighty car mods and really enjoy these videos for the same reason. Thanks!
Scott is always awesome in explaining,
Did you get a raise for peeing on the seat?
Awesome info! I would really like to see a rally anti-lag technically speaking. covering different ways to set up a funtional rally anti lag system.
thank you Scott! going to be looking into putting my Talon on Haltech and am interested in furthering my understanding for this software personally so I can provide help to others in my area considering nobody tunes Haltech around me. +1 for detail of explanation!
These Videos are a life saver for me.
Awesome explanation, and I see that for motorsports use CL will win races!
the loss of midrange response is due to bleed type mechanical.
a ball and spring will show same as closed loop EBC in this setting
hehehe oldschool scotty :) nice work!
Neat explanation Scott .
exactly what I've been searching for. +1
I'm getting one for my 33, can't wait B-)
Thank you for this video, unfortunetaly that doesn't explain the real difference between open loop and close loop control, you are only showing 2 things :
- There is few pourcent missing in the base PWM map in open loop near in the max torque range : that's why there is torque missing.
- You probably don't raise the PWM during spool in the open loop map : that's why the turbo spool is better in your case in close loop mode.
These things can be done in open loop mode.
What you should insist on is : the close loop mode permits to cancel the boost error, better boost aim tracking. BUT, need to be correctly setup in order to not let it do some mistakes !
also soft gate springs are harder to set up for high boost with 4 port solenoid in closed loop with out multiple start duty points. a little easier to have a proper set up open loop table and trim by gear. both methods need to be set up correctly to deliver the same out come, the closed loop is just a bit easier for the average punter on a simple setup not requiring in depth control for repeatable outcomes.
I'd like to use the Closed Loop setup and enable boost assist. Is it really just a toggle in the Haltech NSP software?
So, base duty is the percentage of work the solenoid does to let air out to spool the turbo? So too high of a duty will hit the boost target too soon and trigger the boost cut. That explains why I hit my boost cut so quickly. Too high of a duty at certain kPa.
is there a tutorial for installing it in your car so it's all set for the tuner? sorry dumb question
open and closed loop applies here but it's not where the gains are you could have got this boost response by A. setting up haltech open loop EBC with map as an axis...or B stuck a 12psi check valve in the hose ...this super basic pneumatic verses a more complicated ecu controlled ebc. you also really should have mentoined some of the other advantages of ecu controlled boost ..low boost on cold engine low boost in low gear low boost low traction low boost..
How difficult is it to set up a EBCS? I'm only running on WG pressure and I want to install the EBCS that I bought.
matt - we have already done it - go to our TH-cam channel and scroll through the DIY videos - you will find the anti lag one there:)
How about comparison to 4 port ?
I just bought a GF8 WRX with a PS1000 in it, it has been tuned to 16psi with a GFB boost T. I want to buy one of your open loop boost controllers. I want to be able to switch between 8 and 16 from inside the car preferably with a toggle or momentary switch. Is this possible? Also how do I set up the turbo timer function?
the elite 750 only has open loop boost control.
so will it have similar result compare the elite 1500 to 750 as shown here?
Can we see the difference betwen two methods in the software...?
I'm not fully understanding how it made MORE power given that the same boost, timing, and afr was used. The turbo isn't spooling throughout the entire midrange. The gain in power started after the powerband's clearly shown onset of boost.
I will be awaiting an explanation. Thank you
The wastegate will open proportional to boost until the amount of gas through the turbocharger is not enough to generate more boost. With Any electronical boost control (open o close loop) you can have the WG completly closed until yo get close to your desired boost... You will get more boost sooner but the same maximun boost
i tried turning up the boost but i don't have a programmable ecu or any turbochargers, car still makes 110hp :/
how do you wire the solenoid to the platinum pro plugin, cheers
Man he challenged me to try it I think I have to now
i have a platinum sport 2000 on my 2jzgte I've been running off the waste gate springs, would i spool noticeably faster if i went closed loop to manage my boost?
+180StypeX Any improvement would depend on the specific hardware setup, however generally adding electronic control does give a noticeable improvement to spool time by avoiding wastegate creep.
+haltechecu 2jzgte, precision 6266 twin scroll dual BB, tial 44mm wastegate. Makes 600whp at 22psi but full boost doesnt come on until 5k which i believe is very odd, im hoping perhaps adding the haltech solenoid and running closed loop instead of just wastegate springs controlling boost will help. I also tested for boost leaks & there are none.
*****
Contact support@haltech.com. Our tech guys should be able to help you out.
what about comparing a spring and ball mechanical vs. closed loop. what about comparing open vs closed EBC
drtone n
Hi Scott, i have a 4g63 proyect with E6k computer i try to set a mac solenoid boost control and i can not make it work. The soleniod is good but the E6k does not control it. I dont know what i'm doing wrong.
Hi mate,
Send us a message through here: www.haltech.com/contactus/
One of our support team should be able to help you out :)
Do you have any video's that explain P I D and how it works?
+64ls1nova not yet, but we will get to that subject soon:)
Thanks. That would be a very helpful subject for allot of people.
i was going to post this exact question. I tune ford ecus using hptuners but there is still a few PID controlled tables and I haven't been able to wrap my head around it properly.
did you end up getting around to covering this in a video at all?
Closed Loop Control Drive
th-cam.com/video/MLK5-nw9w-w/w-d-xo.html
hi scot i am new starter in tuning world i like to tune my owne car i am car technicians i have one simple qeustion can i tune cars with hall tech software that doesn't have hall tech ecu for example bosch edc series of ecu can i tune with hall tech tune software thanks for help
no
+TheMrkylester101 thx for info
I was disappointed to find that you can't compare two data sets in a single scatter plot in the data log viewer...
+redlimit835 It is possible to compare separate log files in the one graph - once you have loaded both .csv files, drag and drop the second data set onto the first. Right click > Move Offset to line up the data. Please contact Haltech Support directly if you require more information.
hello! nice videos, do you have it in spanish? thanks
Not as yet, but we are looking at adding Spanish subtitles to our videos.
Excelelnt vid, but the music is annoying and distracting. Please turn it down or better yet - OFF. Thank you,
This video is 6 years old. We've improved a lot since then :)
how can it bring boost on earyler?
it's only boosting more because you have set it up like that probably increased the gain untill boost target is reached then back off
It's Tuning Fork!!
how much to do this to my car ?
It all depends on your car and what your goals for it are, it's be to contact your local tuner for a quote.
P1233 Ford
The fact that he is nervous and playing with his hands is making me far more annoyed than it should.
+Steven Harmsen He just don't want that EVO to pop lolll
wak doyok gapo mu
Running open boost control via haltech 3 port . Can I switch to closed loop running the same psi as open without retuning the fuel and ignition?
Hey Turd! Great question. Our tech support team will be more than happy to answer it for you. You can get in contact with them here: www.haltech.com/support