Criminally low subscriber count for such a high quality production and presentation. You earned my sub, my friend! This review told me everything I need to know.
Great review. You picked up a new sub. Keep up the good work. I ordered the all in for this game and am awaiting on the delivery. Hopefully the campaign that the expansion adds will be good. I will keep it for the minis lane though.
great unboxing and overall review. love your thoughts, I love the asymmetry of the classes. a big improvement from the first Massive Darkness. the sandbox nature of the game allows for custom scenarios too. great review
Thanks for stopping by! Now that you mention it, that does make sense. I guess I just figured they'd have some sort of special attacks and stuff given how menacing they look. They add some really great astehtics to the gameboard.
Very nice review! Didn't go for MD2, after being bored by MD1 with the campaign mode. Makes sense, they canceled that one, but I do prefer games with campaings. 27:45 what different dungeon crawler would you recommend?
Maybe my brain is swayed by the fact that they're reopening their pledge manager in a few weeks, but... one of my favorite dungeon crawlers with a campaign is Middara: Unintentional Malum. It's most definitely not for everyone, as the scenario book is bigger than a lot of novels I've read and the art style is reallllly vibrant and anime-ish; but the equipment customization and story that it tells is, in my personal opinion, soooo good. Also, you can tell that the creators put a lot of heart into it.
@@shelltopgames1745 Thank you for the suggestion! Middara does not connect with me because of the art style.I do enjoy Descent Legends of the Dark "at the moment" (we don't play to regularly). Looking forward to other videos from you guys!
If you can get your hands on a copy of Chronicles of Drunagor, it is a solid dungeon crawler with a lot of depth. It is still taking late pledges on Gamefound, and there is a demo copy on Tabletop Simulator if you want to try it out. So far, my group has been playing on TTS and it is a lot of fun. It mixes resource management with dungeon crawling. If you are looking for a dungeon crawler with more meat on it's bones, I recommend this one, especially if you like Descent. The D&D adventure System board games are also fun, for a lighter persistent dungeon crawl. If you are familiar with D&D, then these should be easy to pick up. Then there is Shadows of Brimstone and Forbidden Fortress from Flying Frog. While it is diffidently heavy on the game expansions, it is a very solid system. Shadows is a wild west meets Cthulhu flavor (think Deadlands RPG if you are familiar), where Forbidden Fortress is influenced by Asian mythology. There are different characters to chose from who all have their own level up paths. the only downside in my opinion are the quests. For Shadows, the two big box starts both have the same starting 6 missions, and different advanced missions. I do wish the Outer Worlds aspect was incorporated better, and it is very component heavy. Make sure your game space is big enough. These are just my recommendations.
@@williamjgoins Thank you for those recommendations! I am a backer of the last Drunagor campaign in fact, but I have never played it so far. Now I am even more looking forward to it. For the D&D-Games, I have not a lot of knowledge about them. I will try to fix that. I do know the pen and paper game. And Shadows of Brimstone is a game I heard a lot of. I am intrigued, but in my understanding it is a special experience. Also it seems like the creator has difficulties to deliver its pledges. I will follow that game and see if an opportunity opens to check it out. I received Bardsung the other day. I find the rules very confusing (not necessarily the combat, but the set up rules and the exploration) - so far I can not recommend it, but I will try it again in future.
@Kaspar Baktat I did kick Brimstone, and it was a headache, and I will not kick anymore Flying Frog games. The game is solid, but the execution of the Kickstarter was frustrating. My friend picked up Bardsung, and the map tiles are not clearly marked. I haven't played anything past the tutorial so I do not have an opinion on the game. I have liked the Resident Evil games and Godtear from Steamforged Games.
The CMON community (for Zombicide and MD at least) tends to pop off custom scenarios and even custom heroes, and I would wager people will create custom classes too. I'm opening my box Saturday and playing, really looking forward to it.
@@shelltopgames1745 oh my gosh I loved it, I'm already digging into potentially making new heroes and new classes (if I can be clever enough to invent a new class, they did such a good job)
That's fair. I can see how this game might not appeal to everyone. Like I said, there are definitely other crawlers out there that'll scratch the itch.
That is for the Mage Amulet. There is a 2 way sticker that you use to connect the dial to the amulet board. only problem is that it is to snug of a fit so it is harder to spin as a dial.
@@williamjgoinsno. That token is trash. The pouch board with the wizard dial included a black circle that is slightly smaller than the hole which allows it to rotate much easier.
The rabbit and I would probably have to go with Middara: Unintentional Malum if we had to choose one together. We just love the story and the characters; even though the balancing and mechanics are sometimes a bit questionable in the game. Game design-wise, I'd have to go with Gloomhaven (though the rabbit would probably disagree). Of course, this is just our unprofessional opinions 🤣
New sub here. Thanks for the vid. I also love Middara, and saw MD2 at my LCS this morning. Walked away with Zombicide Invader since that’s what my family wanted to play. Should I still consider MD2? Would prob be solo only. It looked like there weren’t many missions included. I’m a campaign guy. Nevermind on that last bit…just heard your campaign and mission thoughts at the end. Should have waited. LOL.
If you want to turn it into a campaign game, only the Heavenfall expansion is required. I'm sure you already know that though since you got everything.
Oh, man. Heavenfall is still in the shrink wrap 🤣 Honestly, there was so much content that we promised ourselves we'd play just the base game first, so we wouldn't get overwhelmed and give up. We'll open the rest... eventually.
I would not call it a "campaign", it's a short campaign and to make it last longer, they make leveling up slower. From what I've seen, even the campaign does not seems to offer a lot of replayability.
Waw.. the thing about the enemy leader is quite underwhelming. Descent 2nd Edition figured that out, and really, making elite monsters of a group is not rocket science. In Descent 2nd Edition the Red Elites always had at least two or three different surges and passive effects AND always had more health, and sometimes better defense and/or attack.
@@10hitscombo I have not played Massive Darkness, or Massive Darkness 2. But I can tell you I have introduced Descent 2 for a couple and they joined me and my girlfirend for 3 campaigns in a row, beggining to end. All co-op, 4 players, against the A.I. using the App on a tablet, with the 3 of 4 different narrative campaigns there. That couple had never played a board game before in their lifes and they are addicted to Descent now. They played 3 different characters and classes trough 3 different campaigns and we're already planning on the next one after we just finished our 3rd. Because of this I started hunting down almlst al the big and small expansions and we really have put it to use. It's a simple system to understand, but with many layers and combos, and has a lot of story, which changes depending if you win or lose a quest, the story goes to a different place when you lose, instead of making you replay the same quest again.
I heard the game is easy and you can actually win it without thinking too much. Mobs allegedly disappear before they even have a chance to do anything. I am not looking for another Gloomhaven (there's only one GH;)) but having to think and often replay the scenarios to hone your tactics and strategy begore you eventually get this satisfying win is something I expect from a game like this.
Necroing this thread ftw! But yeah this game is very/to easy even for a beer and pretzels type game. I would say if you are looking for a zero to hero in one session type game then MD2 is great. But if you are looking for anything with even a bit of a challenge then it's not MD2.
the game definitely needs an increase difficulty add-on. That, and an updated FAQ/Errata balancing update away from being perfect imho. the Golden Axe and Double Flail also need a nerf. way too overpowered imho especially in campaign mode.
I played the game and it's a very casual experience at a pro level price. The game is not very original, the game is not complex, there's no depth in the strategy. Replayability is not great because of all the random loot, you can't really predict or prepare for a build. You basically just select the best gear you find, period. If the first sword you find is better than the fifth weapon you'd find, you stick to that sword. The combat is way too simplistic to be really fun: grab a bunch of die, roll, do the math and repeat. You may reroll once in a while depending on the class, but that's about it. This game is a costly snack in my opinion. If you really like casual gaming or want a basic introduction to Dungeon Crawler, that may be worth a try. But, I would not commit too much on this game. If you like the genre, you'll want something more complex and meatier soon enough. On the other hand, if you end up don't liking the style, you would not have spent too much and the game will probably be easy to resell.
This is a reasonable take. Personally, MD hits a valuable sweet spot in my collection. While many compare MD to the video game Diablo, I also see it share roots of the digital genre of rogue-like. Part of the adventure of MD is seeing how you/ your party do/does with what you find and seeing what comes at you when you have had to cobble a build together then try it all over again. It is Zombicide+ with a tilt towards cardboard video game and away from barber pole puzzle solving. With that in mind, I really enjoy it as an above party game but well below brain burner (Gloomhaven) type dungeon crawl.
@@BalkanBiker : au contraire! I played Diablo a lot. Fast action-rpg is fun in a video game, but I feel MD2 lacks depth. I know a lot pf people appreciate this game. I just gave my perspective on it. I was expecting more, but well... it is what it is.
I sold Massive Darkness along with its expansions. It definitely reminds me of Diablo 3 but without the story and without the lore. It looks mechanically like D but has zero world building and zero charm. CMON made me miss Diablo and only gave me plastic. It’s an empty product, you need to paint the minis and even then you’ll spend time trying to find the right spot where the mini came from. Avoid!
Criminally low subscriber count for such a high quality production and presentation. You earned my sub, my friend! This review told me everything I need to know.
Thank you for the kind words, and glad we could be of service!
Your sub made our day 😊
@@shelltopgames1745 You're most welcome and it was certainly well deserved. Take care!
Very good video. You're very clear and concise on the rules and lay everything out in a sensible way so it's easy to follow along
Thank you for the kind words! It makes our day to hear that.
Great review.
You picked up a new sub. Keep up the good work.
I ordered the all in for this game and am awaiting on the delivery. Hopefully the campaign that the expansion adds will be good. I will keep it for the minis lane though.
Thank you!!! That's great to hear!
Your shipment box is going to be absolutely massive 😁. I hope you enjoy all the minis coming your way.
Solid review. The comparisons to other games like zombicide and Diablo really helped. Keep it up!
Thank you for your support!
great unboxing and overall review. love your thoughts, I love the asymmetry of the classes. a big improvement from the first Massive Darkness. the sandbox nature of the game allows for custom scenarios too. great review
Thank you so much! The characters are so different from one another that running the same mission with another hero still feels very fresh.
This is a great review. I'm still trying to pull the trigger on my order and trying to talk myself out of it, but it looks so damn good. :)
Subscribed. Us smaller content creators need a voice!!! Great review too
Such a clear review - love it!
Awesome Quality Review! Insta-subbed
Just seeing how you have it sorted and bagged is a help for first time unboxing.
Glad it helped. Wasn't sure if anybody was actually watching my unboxing portions ☺️
Thanks for shopping by.
Thanks for the video! Isn't the idea of the mob leader that they have the special weapon you drew and get to loot?
Thanks for stopping by! Now that you mention it, that does make sense. I guess I just figured they'd have some sort of special attacks and stuff given how menacing they look. They add some really great astehtics to the gameboard.
All I know is if I were a goblin and I found a glowing sword, I would definitely get a swell head about it!
Heard a ton of different pronounciations of CMON over the years, but QMON is certainly new :D
Yes, my friends tell me that I have a problem. 😂
Amazing job. You're going to grow if you keep at it.
Very nice review! Didn't go for MD2, after being bored by MD1 with the campaign mode. Makes sense, they canceled that one, but I do prefer games with campaings.
27:45 what different dungeon crawler would you recommend?
Maybe my brain is swayed by the fact that they're reopening their pledge manager in a few weeks, but... one of my favorite dungeon crawlers with a campaign is Middara: Unintentional Malum.
It's most definitely not for everyone, as the scenario book is bigger than a lot of novels I've read and the art style is reallllly vibrant and anime-ish; but the equipment customization and story that it tells is, in my personal opinion, soooo good. Also, you can tell that the creators put a lot of heart into it.
@@shelltopgames1745 Thank you for the suggestion! Middara does not connect with me because of the art style.I do enjoy Descent Legends of the Dark "at the moment" (we don't play to regularly). Looking forward to other videos from you guys!
If you can get your hands on a copy of Chronicles of Drunagor, it is a solid dungeon crawler with a lot of depth. It is still taking late pledges on Gamefound, and there is a demo copy on Tabletop Simulator if you want to try it out. So far, my group has been playing on TTS and it is a lot of fun. It mixes resource management with dungeon crawling. If you are looking for a dungeon crawler with more meat on it's bones, I recommend this one, especially if you like Descent.
The D&D adventure System board games are also fun, for a lighter persistent dungeon crawl. If you are familiar with D&D, then these should be easy to pick up.
Then there is Shadows of Brimstone and Forbidden Fortress from Flying Frog. While it is diffidently heavy on the game expansions, it is a very solid system. Shadows is a wild west meets Cthulhu flavor (think Deadlands RPG if you are familiar), where Forbidden Fortress is influenced by Asian mythology. There are different characters to chose from who all have their own level up paths. the only downside in my opinion are the quests. For Shadows, the two big box starts both have the same starting 6 missions, and different advanced missions. I do wish the Outer Worlds aspect was incorporated better, and it is very component heavy. Make sure your game space is big enough.
These are just my recommendations.
@@williamjgoins Thank you for those recommendations!
I am a backer of the last Drunagor campaign in fact, but I have never played it so far. Now I am even more looking forward to it.
For the D&D-Games, I have not a lot of knowledge about them. I will try to fix that. I do know the pen and paper game.
And Shadows of Brimstone is a game I heard a lot of. I am intrigued, but in my understanding it is a special experience. Also it seems like the creator has difficulties to deliver its pledges. I will follow that game and see if an opportunity opens to check it out.
I received Bardsung the other day. I find the rules very confusing (not necessarily the combat, but the set up rules and the exploration) - so far I can not recommend it, but I will try it again in future.
@Kaspar Baktat I did kick Brimstone, and it was a headache, and I will not kick anymore Flying Frog games. The game is solid, but the execution of the Kickstarter was frustrating.
My friend picked up Bardsung, and the map tiles are not clearly marked. I haven't played anything past the tutorial so I do not have an opinion on the game. I have liked the Resident Evil games and Godtear from Steamforged Games.
The CMON community (for Zombicide and MD at least) tends to pop off custom scenarios and even custom heroes, and I would wager people will create custom classes too. I'm opening my box Saturday and playing, really looking forward to it.
Oh yes, I can definitely see that with a game like this. Hope you're enjoying your game!
@@shelltopgames1745 oh my gosh I loved it, I'm already digging into potentially making new heroes and new classes (if I can be clever enough to invent a new class, they did such a good job)
I tried my best to like MD1 but couldn't do it. Won't get MD2 as a result.
That's fair. I can see how this game might not appeal to everyone. Like I said, there are definitely other crawlers out there that'll scratch the itch.
@2:04. Lol. I literally kept that same punch out piece wondering if it was garbage or a useful token too!
I have the biggest problem throwing things out. You never know when a piece of cardboard that looks like garbage is actually an important component 🤣
That is for the Mage Amulet. There is a 2 way sticker that you use to connect the dial to the amulet board. only problem is that it is to snug of a fit so it is harder to spin as a dial.
@@williamjgoinsno. That token is trash. The pouch board with the wizard dial included a black circle that is slightly smaller than the hole which allows it to rotate much easier.
Solid review dude
Many thanks! Appreciate you stopping by for it.
If not MD2, then what in your opinion is the best dungeon crawler?
The rabbit and I would probably have to go with Middara: Unintentional Malum if we had to choose one together. We just love the story and the characters; even though the balancing and mechanics are sometimes a bit questionable in the game.
Game design-wise, I'd have to go with Gloomhaven (though the rabbit would probably disagree).
Of course, this is just our unprofessional opinions 🤣
Very good presentation of the game.
New sub here. Thanks for the vid. I also love Middara, and saw MD2 at my LCS this morning. Walked away with Zombicide Invader since that’s what my family wanted to play. Should I still consider MD2? Would prob be solo only. It looked like there weren’t many missions included. I’m a campaign guy. Nevermind on that last bit…just heard your campaign and mission thoughts at the end. Should have waited. LOL.
If you want to turn it into a campaign game, only the Heavenfall expansion is required.
I'm sure you already know that though since you got everything.
Oh, man. Heavenfall is still in the shrink wrap 🤣
Honestly, there was so much content that we promised ourselves we'd play just the base game first, so we wouldn't get overwhelmed and give up. We'll open the rest... eventually.
I would not call it a "campaign", it's a short campaign and to make it last longer, they make leveling up slower. From what I've seen, even the campaign does not seems to offer a lot of replayability.
Waw.. the thing about the enemy leader is quite underwhelming. Descent 2nd Edition figured that out, and really, making elite monsters of a group is not rocket science. In Descent 2nd Edition the Red Elites always had at least two or three different surges and passive effects AND always had more health, and sometimes better defense and/or attack.
Since you have played descent 2nd edition, which one do you think is better Massive darkness 2 or descent 2nd edition?
@@10hitscombo I have not played Massive Darkness, or Massive Darkness 2. But I can tell you I have introduced Descent 2 for a couple and they joined me and my girlfirend for 3 campaigns in a row, beggining to end. All co-op, 4 players, against the A.I. using the App on a tablet, with the 3 of 4 different narrative campaigns there. That couple had never played a board game before in their lifes and they are addicted to Descent now. They played 3 different characters and classes trough 3 different campaigns and we're already planning on the next one after we just finished our 3rd. Because of this I started hunting down almlst al the big and small expansions and we really have put it to use. It's a simple system to understand, but with many layers and combos, and has a lot of story, which changes depending if you win or lose a quest, the story goes to a different place when you lose, instead of making you replay the same quest again.
I heard the game is easy and you can actually win it without thinking too much. Mobs allegedly disappear before they even have a chance to do anything. I am not looking for another Gloomhaven (there's only one GH;)) but having to think and often replay the scenarios to hone your tactics and strategy begore you eventually get this satisfying win is something I expect from a game like this.
Necroing this thread ftw! But yeah this game is very/to easy even for a beer and pretzels type game. I would say if you are looking for a zero to hero in one session type game then MD2 is great. But if you are looking for anything with even a bit of a challenge then it's not MD2.
the game definitely needs an increase difficulty add-on. That, and an updated FAQ/Errata balancing update away from being perfect imho. the Golden Axe and Double Flail also need a nerf. way too overpowered imho especially in campaign mode.
Why those nails be claws tho
Great review! Sub from me!
Thanks! That means the world to us 😁
Kumon games lol
I played the game and it's a very casual experience at a pro level price. The game is not very original, the game is not complex, there's no depth in the strategy.
Replayability is not great because of all the random loot, you can't really predict or prepare for a build. You basically just select the best gear you find, period. If the first sword you find is better than the fifth weapon you'd find, you stick to that sword.
The combat is way too simplistic to be really fun: grab a bunch of die, roll, do the math and repeat. You may reroll once in a while depending on the class, but that's about it.
This game is a costly snack in my opinion. If you really like casual gaming or want a basic introduction to Dungeon Crawler, that may be worth a try. But, I would not commit too much on this game. If you like the genre, you'll want something more complex and meatier soon enough. On the other hand, if you end up don't liking the style, you would not have spent too much and the game will probably be easy to resell.
This is a reasonable take. Personally, MD hits a valuable sweet spot in my collection. While many compare MD to the video game Diablo, I also see it share roots of the digital genre of rogue-like. Part of the adventure of MD is seeing how you/ your party do/does with what you find and seeing what comes at you when you have had to cobble a build together then try it all over again. It is Zombicide+ with a tilt towards cardboard video game and away from barber pole puzzle solving. With that in mind, I really enjoy it as an above party game but well below brain burner (Gloomhaven) type dungeon crawl.
I see you've never played Diablo. Random loot and quick and casual battles is a good thing. This is not a game for you.
@@BalkanBiker : au contraire! I played Diablo a lot. Fast action-rpg is fun in a video game, but I feel MD2 lacks depth. I know a lot pf people appreciate this game. I just gave my perspective on it. I was expecting more, but well... it is what it is.
I sold Massive Darkness along with its expansions. It definitely reminds me of Diablo 3 but without the story and without the lore.
It looks mechanically like D but has zero world building and zero charm. CMON made me miss Diablo and only gave me plastic. It’s an empty product, you need to paint the minis and even then you’ll spend time trying to find the right spot where the mini came from. Avoid!