I never understood why anyone would want an hoa... Here, take a bunch of my money to tell me what I can and can't do with my own property that I am paying for... Why would you want that?
@@springhollerfarm8668 I live in a rural area with no zoning and no HOAs. There are pig farms next to houses and junk yards next to houses and dumps next to houses and truck parks next to houses. Thats why you have HOAs and zoning. HOAs exclude the very people you want excluded. Those people can live in the blighted areas.
I don't live in the US and I was never able to undrestand why HOAs are such a thing there. I've never heard anyone saying something positive about them, so why do they even exist?
Theft is theft. Damn state now wants $20 a year to file instead of $10. Governments have had the biggest price increases, a recording fee went from $75 to $199. What a scam gvt has going !! Some of them need to be in a cell.
Moved into a hoa community when I was 52. Enjoyed it for about 2 years. Several older people would walk the streets every couple of weeks looking for any little infraction. They wouldn't stop and talk to you about it, they would send a registered letter. At 55 I retired and spent several hours a day in my garage. Car maintenance, wood working projects, etc. Got a letter that my Garage door could only be open during ingress or egress. Hung a for sale by owner sign out and was gone in 6 weeks. Rented a trailer for a year. Bought a couple of acres outside of town and built a house. Chickens roaming the back yard, 2 horses, mow the grass when I feel like it, and leave the Garage door open all day. Nice.
Old song, "Looking Out My Backdoor". I'm very happy for you and envy you the horses! However, I have seen subdivisions require that all house plans meet certain standards. Often required to have the garage openings perpendicular to the street.
And to think the NV legislators had to rein them in . These HOA's were placing leans and selling peoples homes that were disputing fines. Plus others were taking over boards and landing lucrative contracts with kickbacks . And they're still out of control.
It started out to preserve the value of the neighborhoods. No orange homes, no goats eating front grass. (although with the green movement, the collection of rain water and using goats may be back in style..) Now it’s gotten to controlling the drapery linings in your front windows and the plants you’re allowed. The scam that should be changed immediately Is that when you fight them and there’s a lawsuit they use your money to defend themselves.
My former HOA tried to pass a secret dues hike once. They didn’t send out any notices of a meeting and held it in secret and raised the dues from $250 a year to $1100 a year. When they told everyone we all started talking and realized they hadn’t told anyone and we forced them to hold another meeting and voted down the hike, then voted everyone off the board. We afterwards discovered during an audit of the books that $15k was unaccounted for and the former HOA president had contracted his family member to do all the common grounds maintenance for much higher than the previous contractor had charged.
Based grounds maintenance guy, that's on you for living in a place you don't own after paying for a home. The only thing you should pay is property tax and even then that's theft
I agree, but a clubhouse, a pool, a tennis court and a nice entrance do add considerable value to your property. On the other side, lots should be larger and these people can have some of the above things in their own backyard.
I lived in a HOA community once where the HOA president and the developer made the meetings so co confrontational that no one would go. They would send their children out to look for infractions and assess fines to the homeowners. It was found that the two gents had stolen $1M from the treasury over two-years. The developer fled the state and the president served time in the state penitentiary.
I've never been able to understand how people can move into HOA areas, I cannot understand or fathom why. I'm just a bill sitting on capital hill, School of Rock?
@@dragontalontsiawdit's actually quite simple. Some people don't want to live next to other people's trash and squalor. It's not only an eyesore, it runs your property value down. But as you said, you know that going in so everyone has that choice.
On paper, it's has some attractions. Everything is pretty much done for you and yoir house value won't go down because your neighbors won't start parking rusting cars in their front yard. Put eventually you will get an investation of parasites on the HOA board.
It's getting harder and harder to find houses that aren't part of one. At least up here.....I told a realtor that I didn't want anything in an HOA, she told me that cut my options down by 90%..... needless to say my other half and I have since decided it's time to save up to leave the state altogether.
Why, WHY, do people buy in HOA neighborhoods? They don't do anything except tell you what you can and can't do with your property and YOU PAY THEM to tell you what to do. It makes ZERO sense.
HOAs are dominant in the south where they were once used to keep black people out of the neighborhoods. You basically cant live anywhere nice in the suburbs without being involved with one.
@@kiranreilly4916 Exactly. Gotta keep them-thar Neegras outta the neighborhood!!!! Though, TBF, some hoity-toity northern neighborhoods cottoned on to this idea, and for the same reason.
The flip side is I have friends that ‘don’t’ live in an HOA community. In their case, a neighbor parks his almost 40 ft motorhome in front of my friend’s house. Another guy has is really into skeletons and has 30 or so in his front yard decorated all year long. There are certainly pros and cons and you need to watch them like a hawk.
Keeping "undesired" people out, having and maintaining an uniform look of the properties and therefor increasing the property value. Thank god we don't have these neighbourhood-boards in our country 😂
I've said this a million times: HOAs are one of the last remaining ways to keep feral BLM and MS-13 out of your neighborhood they epitomize local control and local governance which is why the establishment hates them so much
Typically common areas in a HOA property are not individually owned and are managed for the collective benefit. A HOA property also establishes rules that don’t diminish the property values of owners. If you don’t like that, don’t buy in a HOA property.
Some people cant afford to live in a community that doesn't have an HOA! We are not rich and the best home we could afford is in an HOA. Now for elderly it can be a good thing since they dont have to mow their own grass! It's a give and take but we have to question where our fees go!
My first encounter with an HOA was while living with a friend and his daughter. He had lost his wife and his daughter her mother. This was a new move to a new state. The 10 year old put a potted flower out front which was her mother favorite to remember her by. The next day i hear her crying out front and a grown man was out there yelling at her. I wanted to rip the guy apart limp by limb. He announced he was part of the HOA and was even more aggressive when i had no idea what that was. The "Infraction" resulted in the landlord getting a point against them. 3 points and they would be forced to sell the house. A big ordeal over a single flower in a pot. How anyone can live like this is beyond me. it's borderline fascist and Anti American. Does not suprise me these people are also white collar criminals. I would not care if my condo was worth 2.5 million. Money and property is meaningless when people have an authority to dictate to you. where a 10 year old girl cannot even put a flower out front to remember her mother by. It seems like a highly toxic existence to me.
WRONG ! It is quintessential Murkin ! Telling the world what they can and can't do and make up WMDs so they can attack and illegally invade an other country with your terrorist, Murkin, military when a country tells terrorist Murika to GFY
I fought my HOA when they tried to strong-arm the entire community to pay fees when it was once voluntary. I contacted an attorney and he gave me advice and the illegality of what they were doing. I wrote a strong letter refusing to pay and informed them of the law. I never saw another letter or notice afterwards.
@@ChristopherJohnsonIsAwesome Not necessarily a good idea. If the HOA maintains common areas (think townhouse exteriors) they're pretty much necessary. At best they're a pain.
I’m quite certain a LOT more HOA boards should be in jail. I’ve heard so many stories of boards stealing houses, land and even trying to take houses of people who aren’t IN the HOA. And they are all dealt with in civil court with lawsuits, instead of criminal court for criminal actions.
First of all, in WA only the government can do a taking. In FL, I doubt anything is proper. Secondly, I doubt this is the only HOA where this has occurred. Probably charges were only brought due the high dollar amounts.
HOAs are a menace! I used to own a condo townhouse and the HOA was constantly raising dues. 20 years ago, my dues were close to 1K a month (they started at $200 when I bought the house. We had a clubhouse, pool, and tennis courts that were locked and completely taken over by the board for their private parties. They contracted a terrible trash company that only allowed for a single receptacle to be taken every other week. The landscaping and snow removal was minimal. To this day, I have no idea where all those dues were going. They were also insanely power-hungry and would pass stupid rules. I got fined a few hundred dollars because they could see the glow of my Christmas tree from a half-moon window (that they also ruled you could not cover). They told me I had to have white, unblinking Christmas lights on the tree INSIDE my house! I ended up selling and buying a house with no HOA because I became incredibly frustrated over the whole thing.
Condos always look like a bad deal to me. Roofs wear out, AC furnaces wear out buildings need overhaul, parking lots need paving. All high ticket items and you get the bill.
Yup, HOAs have no taste for aesthetics. It's like any amount of colors is offensive to them because they're literally colorblind and are jealous that we get to enjoy them with our RGB cones in our eyeballs 😖
I have seen that with my own eyes. My HOA has been riddled with grifters for year. I have done everything within my power to fight these people. It is disgusting.
This is exactly why I'm on the board of my HOA. I've learned more in the last year about government and people than I could even imagine. The first president we had literally said "I'm the president I can do whatever I want." It doesn't surprise me that this kind of stuff happens.
I’m on my board as well. It’s a thankless job though. People are either angry that the HOA board is trying to stop them from doing things (like running a very visible business out of their house) or they’re angry that it’s taking too long for the HOA board to stop people from doing disruptive things. Nevermind that the HOA board has to refer things to an attorney many times and then it takes YEARS to work its way through the courts. Anyway, we keep the street lights on, the lakes maintained, the lake levels at a decent level, the lake fountains working (to keep the fish alive and the water clear), the grass in the common areas mowed, some flowers for decoration, the drainage cleaned out, etc. Over 80% of our budget just goes into maintenance. The rest goes into a road fund so that we have enough money to repair the roads because that was f’d up years ago and the county will not take over the maintenance of our roads as they were not built to county standards.
@@limsalalafells. Really ? The son of this guy took bribes internationally, China n Ukraine. They’ll be more ……your hatred blinds your very logic . That’s not good. It means your vulnerable to narcissists . Seriously. Need to look at actions not words .
I routinely deal with HOA boards in Florida filing claims on window damages, then making the tenants pay the damage on their own after the association gets and keeps the insurance money. Then they turn around and blame the insurance company for not giving the association enough money. It's millions of dollars a year and attorneys are helping them do it. Guess who the middleman is in this - the management company.
not just attorneys... it's the local Judge and DA that they "donated" to that will ignore any claim and the Sheriff who also received "donations" will also harrass and beat up and arrest anyone who dares to complain.
The entire country is seemingly run this way. They all pass the bill to the people, and slowly but surely people are becoming more and more distrustful of any entity at all. There's going to be some sort of cataclysm before 2030 that's going to radically change society across the world
I once got a warning letter for having left my trash cans out a day after trash had been picked up. We were in the hospital. So, I drafted a nasty response letter threatening to sell my home through HUD if I EVER received another worthless letter like that again. Then, I made sure I CC’d a number of neighbors. I later received a letter of apology and never received another warning letter from my HOA.
@@brnoamikHe did keep it clean. That's why his trash was removed from the house and placed in the specified receptical, in the specified place, on a specified day. Was he supposed to not put the trash out that day and let it stink up the area?
I worked in the HOA industry for close to 15 years. We managed Boards and always made them do everything by the book and if they tried anything shady, we refused to work with them. Fast forward a few years, I inherited a small vacation property that is in and HOA, self managed and shady as heck! I found out quickly what its like to be on the other side.
I was on our HOA board for several years as vice president. We really had a small one no pool or anything so our dues were around $200 per house per year. That covered maintaining the park and the public areas and keeping the street lights on. We did our best to be as easy to deal with as we could. We were never big fans of the whole use a ruler to measure somebody's front lawn thing. Generally if something was a problem we knew it the minute we saw it. They were really only a couple of those in the years I was there. As for the finances every meeting we had was open to the public and every finance document we had was also wide open. If we spent a penny we could tell you where it went. And part of the reason for that is because we had a law firm that was really good and would never have put up with anything even if somebody had tried it
I guerentee they were all 'bad' for someone. doesn't take long to find the ones that try regulate what color christmas lights you can use, Trick Treating hours etc. All it takes is one member of the No Fun Granny Brigade and suddenly your block is restricted to single strand of white lights during Christmas...
@davidlewis5312 I can tell you from experience all it takes is one Karen on the Board, and the whole HOA is doomed. They take over by being relentlessly obnoxious, and over time, other BOD members give up or quit. In my case, that's exactly what happened. It all started with half a dozen people renting their homes as Airbnb and one Karen who didn't like it, and the next thing you know, the whole neighborhood was fighting. It was so idiotic.
Oh my God just the title of this video made me so happy. I cost my HOA tens of thousands fighting over a fence for a severely disabled woman, and as much as i feel bad that my neighbors got screwed a little bit... I've never seen so many nasty people in one group in my LIFE. How anyone can be against helping a disabled woman who can barely walk and just needed a safe space for her beloved dog is BEYOND ME (she wasnt so disabled when she got the dog, it happened in the last few years)...
being disabled doesn't allow you to break the rules/laws. If that dog lady went around with a gun and stole the money at gun point would it be justified if she was disabled and needed it?
@@JankyShack how is having an accommodation for a disability the same as using lethal force to threaten for money? regardless should help both people, society is better when we help those in need.
@@daphnedherbert because the government has the monopoly of force, using the government to extract money from people is the same as holding a gun to their head. If your neighbor is very irresponsible with money and then gets cancer and requires 75% of your income to survive is that acceptable for them to take it from you because they need it?
I've never lived under an HOA and even I hate HOAs by proxy. I used to work for a company that did contract support work for professional associations. One of the projects we worked on was for a professional association that supported HOAs. Almost every person I spoke to had a horror story about their HOA. I'm still baffled why anyone would choose to live under such an arrangement. The detriments vastly outweigh the benefits. All my homies hate HOAs. Even Tay Zonday distrusts HOAs.
People choose to live in an association because it’s a tradeoff. For example, I live in a multiunit apartment building. I don’t want landscaping to look after, and I want to live in an urban area. The only choice, then, is buy a condominium or rent. Renting places one at the mercy of a landlord, which can be worse than an association. On the other hand, associations are universally bad, but the corruption is usually petty. It is hard to know how bad an association is beforehand.
You have to realize that it's the horror stories that make the news. Yes, it happens, but I'd wager for every one like this, there's ten more that just take modest fees and keep things maintained, but those stories won't generate any clicks.
We don't need to pass laws to protect homeowners. Homeowners can protect themselves if you just get rid of the laws protecting HOAs and other parasitic agencies.
Not only for HOAs but also for Non-Profit Organizations, it is important to have a 3rd party at least review the "books" including credit card, and bank statements annually.
*gasp! That sound you just heard was every church in existence grasping their pearls in dismay. How will they ever hide and protect their monetary investments from those greedy victims of sa etc? I wish I was actually joking.
@@toriless I agree with jonwinter, but there are ways you could do it that would protect smaller organizations from burdensome audits. For example, you could say "except for organizations with under _x_ employees, volunteers, and/or staff" or "except for organizations with operating budgets under $10,000 (or similar).
My wife was an HOA board treasurer! I just told her - don't pay yourself anything. Don't even do reimbursements - it will be our contribution to the HOA (and amounts were not relevant). My income at the time depended on being reliable with accounting / finance stuff and there is a fair bit of bad behavior in these systems. I wanted us to have nothing to do with any questions on this stuff.
My wife owns a condo. I called the condo board a bunch of ***holes to their faces during a meeting one time. I still regret losing my cool and my wife wasn't happy about my actions at the time, but the more time passes the more we both admit that I was right.
Hoa board members are real estate agents protecting their investments. They are the reason affordable housing doesn't exist. Ever wonder why houses have Sq ft minimums?
I had a friend whose neighborhood had a community pool. Everyone who wanted to use it paid an annual fee. My friend did the maintenance so she paid no fee and drew no salary. This one neighbor got himself put oner the board. He basically fired her and stated paying himself to do the maintenance. He also paid lots of money to family members to "work" at the pool and marked up the chemicals. Anyone who questioned him, he banned from the pool. The other residents had enough and replaced him, when the money for the saltwater system seem to disappear. . They had to open another checking account because he refused to give them access to that one. That state has laws that allowed him to do that. From what they were able to piece together he had cleaned them out. He ended up moving and claimed my friend made up lies because she wanted to be president.
This is a guy who’s house neighborhood should have set on fire with him strapped to the bed long before he was allowed to move away. When laws prevent Justice, you have to take Justice into your own hands.
That's horrible if that's true, but there are always two sides of every story. You say that he claimed your friend made up lies, but we don't any reason to trust any of you. I'll give you the benefit of the doubt though, since most people who write comments like this do it as a measure of self-therapy. Anyways, people who get away with these type of scams are able to because most people don't think or care about how the money is being spent. This is why it's always an older person who is in everyone's business all the time, because they know the tricks.
That's their scam. If you want to fuck with that person track them down, they are probably doing it again somewhere else. Thwart their plans, you could also put a bunch of information out of the internet on that guy so if anybody looked him up it would be easy to find out. I would of contacted local news to do a story etc etc etc
I believe you (just ignore these neigh sayers, they feel compelled to poo poo on everything; thanks for adding the comment, I enjoyed reading it down under in Australia,
For a while i was on the board of directors for a city dog park in los angeles. We were supposed to help with maintenance and community outreach. We did put on a lot of fun and educational events, but what irked me was the beautification and art grants we got to put up some statues... The artists picked were friends of the boards president, they got the money, but we never got the statues. Then i started noticing other sneaky stuff going on involving the neighborhood council. Crazy how even at the lowest levels, any bit of power is corrupting.
I volunteered at a local FM radio station run by the local university in town, University of Toronto. A few years near the end of my time there a woman near the top had absconded funds for the radio stations operating budget. These funds were raised from mandatory annual student council fees. This woman took thousands for herself and went to Montreal one weekend on a shopping spree. I heard later she worked with BLM Toronto.
We already have a solution for this. If YOU want a statue on YOUR land, YOU pay for it. Whenever you give your money to someone else to spend for you this is what happens.
Thank you. My wife and I had a condominium apartment and had to deal with a crooked board and professional manager. When I complained, we had our phone cut off several times. The junction box was found unlocked. I reconnected the wires. There was a lawyer on the board who worked in the AG's office. He covered for the manager who entered apartments without owners' knowledge. We moved out.
I lived in the former manager condo. I do not know what shenanigans they did but I got free cable while living there and I doubt they could figure out how to shut off electrical as well. Every few years someone would come by and spent a few hours trying to figure it out and give up.
It's scary to me that HOAs can impose stuff on you and if you don't abide by it you could lose your house. I'm sure a lot of HOAs out there are fine, but I will never be voluntarily placing myself under the authority of one.
I do not know about FL but is most states it is lot legal. ONLY the county or city can force a sale for unpaid property taxes. NO ONE ELSE!! Most likely the HOA was LYING about any such ability, most thieves are a liars too.
*hoa inspectors and board members might just find themselves arguing with someone who is a mma fighter or off their meds for a few weeks...those voices inside your head can get very persuasive and creative when dealing with others that annoy them* *ir so i've heard*
To me, these groups seem un-American. I don't doubt that they do serve some purpose, but any time we hear about them (sometimes fictional HOAs on TV), it's BAD. So yeah, "some I assume, are good people." But I don't want anything to do with them. (Shudder)
@@shadowlouise The problem with many HOA's is that they are only theoretically beholden to the communities that they manage. HOA management is often offloaded onto a corporate board that manages many geographically dispersed developments. The board members do not live in a given development and they do not feel any obligation to the members of the community that they govern. Take everything that's wrong with congress, and now shrink it down so that all the bad parts are concentrated in a body smaller than a county government and with even less oversight than the average middle school PTA. If you want to fix it - 1. Laws that require the members of the HOA board to LIVE inside the development that they manage. This should not be a full time job, it should be something done either by younger retirees of the community, or part time by a group of engaged homeowners. 2. No HOA can manage multiple developments or x-number of Condo Units/Houses nor can a board member sit on multiple boards. 3. Let's say for now, no more than '500' houses or a single large condo complex can be managed by a single HOA. 500 houses paying, let's say $50 dollars a month each would give an HOA an income of 25,000 a month or 300,000 a year. That should be more than enough to pay for basic security patrols, inspections, and the upkeep on a community clubhouse. And that's ALL an HOA should be doing. 4. The ability of the households to dissolve the HOA with a basic 50%+1 majority of votes. 5. The HOA board must be recertified by the households they manage every year. You might make it something simple like 50%+1 of household that vote. Which, combined with a relatively small size means an HOA should putter along comfortably, so long as it's doing an inoffensive job. But be easily dissolved if they try to act like Tyrant and earn the displeasure of their residents.
If I bought a house in a neighborhood that had an HOA, I would not join (it's a private contract association), and if they even attempted to steal my property through the courts, every board member would find his house burned to the ground the next day. Not even close to playing with psychopaths like them.
I've written to my SC legislators, congressmen and senators about reigning in HOAs. Not a word back from any of them. I've been around politics (New York) all my life. When the silence from politicians is deafening on matters pertaining to money and corporations, it usually signifies the politicians are in the pockets of the offending companies (HOAs). What will it take for state and local legislatures to address what has become a tyrannical abuse of authority by HOAs all over the country, but especially here in South Carolina?
As a native South Carolinean I could have told you that. The government people here are invested in properties and the manipulation of them for profit. New HOA communities sell for higher prices than non-HOA communities and that also keeps us "mere commoners' out of "their" business. The "Good Old Boy" system is still in place here, and the old money still rules.
A long time ago I joined a HOA board as a group takeover. We were shocked with the alleged incompetence of both the former Board Members and the Property Management Company. We found out Taxes were not filed or paid for the prior two years. We found bank accounts where only older former Board Members having signing authority on. We never confirmed any outright fraud, but suspect some were laying the ground that as board turnover and time to forget occurred, they could have later pulled the money from those accounts. Looking back at it, this was a rather ingenious idea that may have worked if it weren't for a new board to self audit their books.
What IS it with greedy bastards and their distain for paying taxes in the first place? Do they even realize the very roads they drive on is FUNDED by the government via taxes?
@@Echo81Rumple83 Yes, but the payment of taxes is the responsibility of the thieving peasants. Such fine and upstanding paragons of virtue such as themselves shouldn't lower themselves to pay for the roads only they should have the divine right to use.
If they find oil somewhere or wanna make a strip mine there will magically be a road there they don’t need my 70$ when they are printing our money out of value anyways why take it off me just print it and give it straight to them for a road we’re never paying back any of this debt anyways the whole economy is fake why can’t the roads get a “bailout” what’s the difference they need my two pennys when they’re already killing us
@@AustynSNmany wealthy pay ZERO taxes...so by your statement...they should NOT be allowed to use said roads...or the fire department, or ANY other programs offered via taxes!!..
Love when rogue hoa boards get their comeuppance. My current house was originally in a hoa development, then about 20 years ago all of the home owners got together and decided as adults they were all capable enough to maintain their own homes and properties without having someone take their money and tell them what to do.
I suspected our previous HOA of the same. There were about 150-200 homes, and the developer and a lackey that didnt live in the neighborhood was running everything. We paid $1200 a year, but yet, other than basic landscaping (mowing and taking care of the entrance, and a pool), we couldn’t figure out where the money was going. One of my neighbors, who was an accountant, told me once “The numbers don’t add up”.
I was on the board of a cab driver co-op in the 2000's, and a driver went a filed a change in the statement of officers at the Secretary of State claiming that he was now the president, that some friend of his was treasurer, and that a dead woman whose identity she stole was the secretary, and then mailed a letter to the taxi and limousine commission written on letterhead stolen from a law office that he had fired the rest of us. It took two years of litigation to get that sorted out.
I'm a Title Examiner. An HOA down the road from me was sued by one of their members, and long story short, the HOA charged three separate assessments totaling ~3k to each house to pay for a legal defense. Never ever ever live in an HOA.
That's a other issue. It's like how cops know that they're not paying out judgements against them. HOAs no reason to curb their behavior when they k ow they'll just charge the homeowners for any judgments.
And the problem is ... most of the time the "citizens" _are not involved._ I know of one great HOA; it's of the people, by the people, and for the people.
Steve, I've never lived in a condo, but I've worked on them and worked with the various "associations" who administer them. Most HOA's will fall into error if they don't religiously maintain open meetings rules and absolute term limitations on all elected officers, general consensus on issues like major improvements or changes to the Professional Management. Btw, working for some of the flakier ones can get you into tax trouble when they "report" having paid you thousands of dollars that don't appear on your own books is just one of the ways.
The thing that bothered me besides besides that my HOA stole my house from me. Even though I fought them in court and they could not meet their burden I still lost. The "JUDGE" took there side...! MY LAWYER STOPPED before we started our defense and told him. " "The Judge told us to proceed along with my 9 witnesses anyway". Rrrr SMH! I digress, When they published their budget and made available is always incredible to me that the budget and the end of the year fiscal report always worked out to be a dead 0 everytime for many years in a row... I'm not a smart man but that sounds fishy to me. It's been 5 years now that they stole my house my depression is gotten better but my life still sucks. Steve made a post I don't know a month ago about the Supreme Court saying that they have to give their change back while I'm in the process of that but I can't find any lawyer that will work to be paid after the settlement in Florida.
It ALL depends on the documents. Often the COUNTY will for a minimum number, mine is one per year, any time in that year. Notice MUST be sent and within a specific duration before the meeting, I have to look it up every year but something like no less than 3 week bit no more than 60 days. I suspect this is typical but in FL all bets are off. Me, I have the HOA account with a CC and checks to pay for the insurance, simple. You will find with a smaller association, like I recommend that term limitations is suicide, NO ONE WANTS THE JOB. The guy I took over for NEVER wanted the job but when the developer sold their house he was forced to do so by his wife. I gladly took over. It is an easy job. Fill out a report of the state, file the paperwork that the county public works sends and pay the required insurance. The only hard part is deciding when to hold the annual meeting so you get enough for a quorum which is hard to do when people are happy as in my HOA.
@@toriless I'm not sure what you're talking on the first part of your comments. My shui never made corned but they always lied about it and said though whatever they needed to be passed of course not enough people dont attend those meetings.
@@toriless I am not disagreeing with you about what any HOA's agreement says; I stated that they are all subject to fraud and misuse if the homeowners in an HOA system do not go , often, to the required meetings and actively vote for their officers and policies.
i have been a board member or treasurer of 2 different churches and a township trustee and i can tell you the money was handled very similar to what you describe… every quarter the board would review and any one who asked was immediately provided with financials. i can’t imagine dealing with a group that hides their financials or doesn’t review on a regular basis
Yeah, but a condo does it every month. They a VERY bureaucratic compared to ones involving homes. Even than then one next to mine charges $200 a month, mine is $100 a YEAR. People are SO prejudicial. HOAs are a just as much all alike as Europeans are all alike.
Steve, your assessment about every pot of money having schemers is so very true: It also drives massive national spending policies like the Prison Industrial Complex, and the Military Industrial Complex: it's private corporations trying to get their hands on all those sweet sweet taxpayer dollars...
As a former treasurer of a HOA, decades ago, we chose to have insurance to cover fraud by the board and we also had an independent financial audit done every year.
Very first thing our new HOA board did when the neighborhood transferred was limit the power of the board to raise dues over 10% with limited support. Requires 65% of ALL homes, not just the people who show up to a meeting. Might be the most important thing we ever do as a body.
if that 65% is not in the HOA by laws( which could require up to 75% of the members to approve) and HOA board passing a rule would hold no water whatsoever. The next board could vote to rescind it.
I was on an HOA board for two years. We also had a management company that we paid to take the money, repair issues, etc. We couldn't hire a vendor just because. There had to be at least three bids for any kind of work be it landscaping, tree work, painting, roofing or repairs. No one got hired because of who they knew. Like Steve said, every single penny was accounted for. ALL meetings were open to the homeowners. The only one they couldn't attend was if we were discussing homeowners who were behind on their payments for privacy reasons. Our dues are hardly ever raised and what it is always a very small amount because of inflation. That said, when I move within the next couple of years, I will not be purchasing a place with an HOA. I would like to decide what and when I am doing work to my own home.
Amen to that! I was in an HOA for 25 years. Never had an issue (except minor stuff) although others did. BUT, when we moved to our retirement home, the first thing I told the RE agent was "Don't even think about showing me a house in an HOA".
We are new to HOAs, moved into our current community 8 years ago and it was fine for the first 5 years, the last 3 years have been just awful! I absolutely disdain HOAs now and refuse to purchase a home in one going forward. It is very sad to me that you can’t live in an area with a group of people without it going down in flames.
No kidding about any amount of other people's money. I bought a home in a small 75 home community. We found out the developer was hanging on to the HOA after all the development was long finished. Taking it over and going through the books, we found out what a snake in the grass she was. She was paying for mowing of home owner lots. She had "lent" the HOA money, meaning she paid for development work on the neighborhood and tacked it on to future homeowner's tab. When she found out we were taking over, she raised rates to the max and sent out mailings trying to get all the homeowners to pay dues before the end of the year. You know, so she could take next year's money before we took over. Once a "friend" and I took over, well, lookie here? Other people's money! This guy immediately picked up where she left off. Let's keep all the extra money the developer cheated some of our neighbors over. Let's keep paying to mow property not owned by the HOA. Let's forego the maintenance the developer wasn't doing so we can have a nice juicy slush fund. Let's collect some money leasing our developer's sign for our neighborhood to a developer selling competing homes right across the street. Oh, and let's go ahead and plan on putting in public sewer and sidewalks in this rural neighborhood to upgrade private lots, you know, like my lot. Let's buy one of lots and put in a neighborhood playground. You know, the one next to my lot. Let's go spend a bunch of money on no-bid contracts for extravagant projects before the end of the year so we don't get exposed for creating our slush fund. Then let's cause a lot of drama trying to expand the number of directors so we can bring in our buddies to help avoid any more accountability. Then when all the drama and personal conflict become public, they kick us all out and hire a management company. Oh, lookie here at all these Other People's money!
I can’t say where I just don’t know but one board member of an overbearing unscrupulous HOA was shot. That shook up the guilty board. They all resigned, and I think the shooter is about ready to get out of jail. So they are touchable just sorry somebody had to go to jail for it.
If you ever become incapacitated, that third item on your list would have to be dropped. My wife recently had to take care of financials for her stepmother when the stepmother’s dementia got more advanced.
@@techtutorvideos I saw a recent YT where the fellow goes on about hundreds of condo buildings in Florida about to face unfunded necessary repairs to pass their 40 year certificate. (You surely recall the recent collapse of a building ...) So values are plunging as people are trying to sell their dogs off ... I'm probably also highly influenced by the great John D. MacDonald book too....
The T-shirt is bang on, and broiught back memories of Saturday mornings when I, a Canadian kid, learned about the US system of government. The problem with HOAs is the apathy of the membership. Mass reluctance to attend meetings, ask questions and hold the board accountable just gives the petty dictators free reign to be criminals. Democracy is not a free gift - it's benefits are earned by engagement, some effort and getting off the couch to vote. There are many good and honest HOA/condo boards and I'd venture to say that they are the ones constantly seeking for input and engagement from their members. The shady ones count on apathy to create empires of corruption.
Most people aren't going to be interested in interacting with HOAs that are still using 20th century technology like snail mail and face-to-face meetings instead of e-mail and web sites/apps.
Why should you have to involve yourself in the business of others just to have the privilege of keeping them out of yours? Being left alone should be the default!
This is just another reason that if you are in an HOA, keep the board in check. Be involved in the meetings. Run for positions. Talk with other people when concerns are raised to see what they know. People may be afraid to say something for fear of retaliation. The best way to get an HOA under control is to be involved. Once you have to start taking things to court, it can be difficult to get them under control.
@@boumajohn The property management company is the company set up by the developer who built the houses right? And that there is a contract that states that control doesn’t automatically go to the property owners themselves?
@@boumajohn That is not how things work literally anywhere in the country. If you have a purchase contract that states that in the event of your HOA dissolving control reverts to the property management company you do not own land or property and if you were mislead into believing that, I suggest you retain a lawyer and sue everyone involved.
I used to be a union trustee, and I know how important it is that the money is taken care of properly and accounted for. Unfortunately, it’s a big temptation to too many people.
For 20 years I was in a good HOA and used the process that you mention for the board you were on. My HOA fees were $180. a year max. Good neigborhood with a HOA that was flexible. the only real change in 20 years was going from saying not metal roofs to allowing high end metal shingles that look like normal shingle.
@@MuzixMaker Being worthless would be a improvement as current HOAs are actively harmful while being worthless means it will be mostly benign. The best action though would just make them illegal entirely which would be the best fix.
A friend of of the family, who was a self made millionaire, told me back in the mid seventies to never go into business with anyone. "You find a way to make money, they find a way to steal it." Forty or so years ago I started to consider FL for retirement. I read a retired realtors article stating; never ever, ever, never buy a condo or get into a HOA situation in FL. I've been in FL renting a condo for the last 13 years, he was absolutely correct. I hear owners griping all the time about emergency assessments and a ton of other things pretty much everytime I hear their conversations.
Florida is a special place for sure. The place where a whole condo building collapsed because of poor design, poor maintenance and an unwillingness of residents to address emerging problems.
DAMN!!! I'm my HOA President, and I don't even want ANYTHING to do with any money that has a CHANCE of being attributed to me. I've gone months without being reimbursed (for community doggie bags) simply because we had lost our third of three Board Members and I refused to approve my own reimbursement. Good HOAs have good Boards and good Managers. Bad HOAs have bad Boards and bad Managers.
@@dand33911 Actually, all we do is enforce the rules we all agreed to. When we occur additional expenses because of maintenance issues, disposal of appliances, or other things we collect from the responsible party if we can identify them so the people who play by the rules don’t. I do it because I want to live in the community I bought into, not what people what to change it into because they don’t care about anyone else. When we fine we almost never collect because we agree to waive the fines when collected (we don’t even budget for fines). If you think this is power and control, well I probably can’t change your opinion. I do it for the community, not for me. The only ‘benefit’ that I get is that whenever I sell the community will still look good, not a trashy disaster that people try to turn it into.
@necigrad You want to live in the community you bought into, and that totally negates the opinions of your neighbors who bought after you. Yet you all pay the same fee. Seems fair...let me guess, boomer? We had a lakehouse with an organization fee. They maintained private roads, private beaches, and the dam. They had 0 authority over the individual lots/dwellings, etc. That's simply authoritarianism.
@merfishsandwich691 I think the entire concept is un-American. Imagine sitting around with your neighbors and being like, "You know what we should do? Let's voluntarily create a new tax, justify beurocrats, and enact arbitrary authoritarianism on ourselves" This is why we can't have a democracy, we have people with that mindset.
As a BoD member in a co-op our fiduciary responsibility is paramount and we do everything we can to reduce expenses to keep the fee down. Our community is mostly retirees on fixed income so it's a huge task - especially with cost rising so high now. In examining what previous members did in the past with budgets we found stupid and not planned spending, poor planning and -not misappropriation but - unrealistic budgeting, as well as unapproved projects and changes but nothing like what you reported (thankfully). Our current Board is made up of retired engineers, business owners, project managers et....so collectively we have the knowledge and skills to do our job. Plus we recently got a wonderful professional manager. We try desperately to educate our members on projects, budgets, & problem areas due to an aging infrastructure but sometimes is very hard to get them to pay attention to issues. And there is always the emotional factor....As for the inspections - we always notify owners if there is a concern to discuss an issue and try to mitigate it. That's the professional and right way to do things. Yeah - we have our chronic problem folks but 99% of the community works together to make the corrections. As I always remind them - they made the rules, not us.
Mine is $100 per year. I think I am doing pretty good at keeping the costs down. That's $8 a month. My neighbors are all rich anyway, nearly half have a Tesla (or two in one case).
If they are actually found guilty, I want to see specific results. 1 Makes HOAs illegals. 2, Throw them in jail for 20 years. 3, Take ALL of their Possessions and Assets, Liquadate them, and equaly share it with ONLY the HOA members not in the scheme, NOT to the Court, NOR to any Lawyers, JUST the HOA members that wasn't in on the scheme.
I'll tell you what would be justice, while they are charged vote them all out. Then make HOA rules they violate and take their house, because they sure would take yours.
@@jasonbourne1596 When I said '3, Take ALL of their Possessions and Assets, Liquadate them' I mean ALL their Possessions and ASSETS, INCLUDING their LAND and HOME and liquadate it into Cash to give to the others.
As a board member for two decades, well, also another association member for a decade, I have lots of experience with these typically volunteer boards. Beware of autocratic types that eagerly take on responsibilities, but ultimately have a pet project they want done. Once done, they are off the board. Also beware of idiots, who will ignorantly approve anything the autocrat demands. Beware of folks that approve stupid ideas - anyone can sue if damages result. These boards are meant to make common concerns as well handled as possible. But largely, people avoid taking on responsibilities. So the board is run by fools and dictators. Get on your board, and help it get better. An HOA is supposed to help people get along, keep the place attractive, pay bills, and prevent accidents.
Yea. Sounds like me. I wanted all the sprinklers to work. Spent hours of my own time following the HOA landscape tech around. Once the sprinkles were fixed, I was off the Board. 😉
@bhambhole Ha! Was going to do that at first but went with colour on a whim. No worries, we're on the same page and can share a laugh at (sorry, WITH) residents of HOAs. Hope your days are full of chuckles.
live in a farming area had a lady from the city try to start a HOA try to push her ideas/ways on us country folks . she didnt last too long in our town
I have a vague memory of something to do with this story a few months back. I remember that it was the the largest HOA in Florida, and I seem to remember that the HOA covered several communities. I'm glad the authorities didn't give this one the broom treatment.
My city almost feels like an hoa. All the rules and ordinances. The second the grass is 1/4" too tall, you get a notice saying cut it or we will and you pay the bill. Most hoa's I've seen are ran by people that would get ran out of office. Power trip individuals that love telling people what to do. I don't understand anyone who would want a home just to be told what to do with it.
My Mom's HOA was corrupt also. Not sure what exactly will happen but before leaving the Board several members voted this giant contract to this person who was NOT suitable to manage getting out of bed nevermind a decent sized HOA. They finaly got rid of her but it cost lawyer fees etc. Goes to show trust is over rated. There has to be checks and transparency
I wonder if it's the HOA who refused to allow members into meetings to vote on rules and price hikes, even calling police to keep them out. If you want to know a person's true nature, put them in a position of power!
I live in a rural area so it’s difficult for me to understand how a homeowner would pay a group of people to tell them what they can and cannot do with their own property.
complicated developed lands (aka urban/suburban or high income/population dense) usually have extremely complicated laws for almost everything, but also specific enough laws that learning it doesnt actually help much in other cities so it's not worth it. There's also the question of what's enforced, what's taboo, etc in the area. I guess the ideal is the HOA leaders learn all that and more and are paid to do external housekeeping/general order/legal disputes that pop up inherently where a lot of people/money circulate. Say, helping subletters know how to evict dangerous people or planning residential meetings to discuss budgets or the local environment. really, its pretty bad. its mostly sustained by the fact that they already exist and are power abusers with connections and money, which makes it much harder to say no when they show up to your house for their protection money and everyone else either left, paid, or were made an example of before you. As for entering a community like that, location is huge for people accustomed to living urban or suburban. you might need to add 10 or 30 minutes to your commute if you avoid an HOA since they can control a lot of neighborhoods. You might be told by a bunch of liars that the HOA is good or lied to about the contract your company sets you up with if you're getting accommodations from them. A lot of little tricks and inconveniences on people who cant really retaliate in a way that's not life altering compared to getting fucked for extra money.
Really? You've never been anywhere that's had a decent house next to a slum-like house w/trash everywhere? Seen it on tv? Heard about neighbor strife in the suburbs? I find that impossible to believe, lol.
@@purselmer5931 my neighbor to the north of me has about 50 acres and raises mules. My neighbor to the south of me has a couple of hundred acres and raises cattle. Across the road from me is all wooded and occupied by deer, bear, and other assorted woodland creatures. I don’t much care for city life, or suburban life either.
Being a member of the HOA board of the tract we used to live in was one of the most thankless things I've ever done in my life. We also had a management firm and, given the stories we heard almost monthly, I would happily have paid them double what they charged. The management firm taking the brunt of our neighbors' ire, but it was also the only time in my life I've been called a fascist (along with the rest of the unpaid board). One of the homeowners ignored the CC&Rs of the zero-lot-line tract -- 5-6' between houses, with each house having only one side yard, disconnected from its backyard -- which everyone who bought into the tract was required by their realtor to sign. They decided to enclose their entire front yard to the sidewalk with a solid 8' redwood fence without getting pre-approval, which would not have been granted: even their neighbors were opposed to it. Our management firm notified them after the work had just started, but they went ahead and completed it, then essentially said, "Yeah, what are you going to do about it?" I believe we had to get lawyers involved...and they eventually had to tear the fence down. Two additional stories on how thankless being on the HOA was: At an annual meeting, one irate owner yelled out he was was so mad, he would run for the board at the next month's election. A board member -- I think it may have been me -- told he not only was he welcome to run, most likely any of the current members of the board would happily resign or not run for re-election so the guy could run unopposed. He never submitted his name or asked anyone to nominate him. Our closest friends also lived in the tract, and after we'd sold and moved to a different tract -- one without an HOA, by the way -- one of them joined the board. A year or two later, they sold and moved to a bigger house a mile or two away, but the board was unable to find anyone to take over his spot on the board. I don't know if they changed the bylaws or took a vote of the homeowners to allow it, but our friend ended up remaining on the board an additional year or two after he was no longer an owner there.
I lived in a condo complex for about 13 years, i was actually on the board for several years. It was mostly retired knowledgeable people who managed everything very well. I remember when we painted all of the 58 buildings in complex with no raise in the fees because of how well it was managed. I moved from there 32 years ago but drive by it frequently and at 52 years old, looks good and is still kept up quite well.
Steve, could you look into a similar situation here in VA? Dogwood Valley Citizen's Association. RICO case tried in 2009, met all the criteria, but needed more hard evidence. Last I heard, Feds were looking into it, but it's been some time. Infrequent and undisclosed board meetings, all kinds of skulduggery, even peddling seats on the board for payment. It all started as basic extortion under threat of litigation. Basically collected road use fees, providing no road maintenance or services whatsoever, but then used the money to sue those who didn't pay when the roads fell apart. They even sued citizens that worked on the roads themselves to stop them. One family in particular was targeted -- the Millers, who have been relentlessly targeted for their attempts to expose the fraud. And according to the language of the deeds of dedication, the HOA had no legal standing to exist. Last I heard, there were questions as to whether the subdivision properties were sold legally in the first place.
HOA's should never be allowed to exist. only ever hear horrible stories and nightmares, not a single good story that couldnt have been accomplished without one. if HOA's continue to exist there needs to be federal laws limiting how much they can charge and severely limiting what they are allowed to do. nobody should be allowed to charge you money on a home you own, other than the people you owe money to on loans/mortgage
No one screams on the public internets about how it's so nice that the streets are clean and there's plenty of parking and all the homes look nice. There's a serious selection bias in your comment. HOAs proliferate because people are tired of living where someone's rusty work truck drips oil all over the road on a daily basis and where you can't keep a nice lawn because of all the weeds popping up due to the weed factory down the street. HOAs proliferate because "do what you want it's your house" means that the house across the way is a meth lab. No one talks about the reasons people want HOAs because people mostly only talk when they are angry about something. So you hear all the downsides. But if there were no upsides there would be no HOAs.
Who was actually writing the checks? It’s usually the management staff. If so, it sounds like they may be complicit. Also, there should have been audits performed every year and annual reports published. I managed six associations and we used to complain about how tight they were with money. Steve’s description of his experience serving on a HOA board of directors is exactly the way things should run.
Your HOA board experience sounds pretty much exactly like mine: boring budget concerns, repairs and maintenance, asshole renters, people behind on their dues, and keeping the reserve fund up to legally required levels. Since we weren't made of money most of the long-term projects were longer term than many people wanted, but they also weren't willing to just cough up the cash needed to do it right now. But hey, stick around for another decade and see how much progress has been made.
This is my current situation right now as well. I got on the HOA board so it wasnt dissolved - we're fixing things, but insurance hit us hard in Florida - and people are upset that their dues are going up (so is mine, I'm not exempt) and we pulled out the numbers for what their mortgage company will charge them compared to what the dues will happen and that got them quiet. But some of these people think I'm a paid employee and try to treat me like poo - when I am volunteering my time to try and help keep the community clean and properly funded. I am a homeowner as well - so the dues hit me just as hard as everybody else.
@@Nowyn Insurance costs are a real driver for things getting done "right now" or "nope, not gonna' happen." Yes, you WILL fix the equipment on the play area, or remove it, to reduce liability for injuries, and no, you WON'T be building a pool since it's an attractive nuisance that attracts kids from all over." Because a kid with a broken arm costs a lot less than the lawsuit for a dead one that climbed the fence after dark. One of our biggest problems was when a new development went in adjacent to mine the real estate agents advertised my HOA's play and picnic area as "open to the public." It took the threat of a lawsuit a couple years later for their HOA to tell people to knock it off and get their asshole delinquent teenagers under control.
My short time on an HOA board was like this too. It was a building with commercial and residential units. The most pressing issue was increasing the reserve fund, as there were some maintenance items that had been deferred too long and would need to be addressed soon. I got a glimpse of a far different condo board once at work (commercial building). I was once asked to represent my boss at a board meeting when he was out of town, and it was full of drama.
Steve Lehto; it is a pleasure to listen to your podcast here on TH-cam. I'm listening from TAMPA BAY FLORIDA ,USA🇺🇸 I feel that I can belive what you say is true with no reason for doubt. GOD Bless You.
This has been going on forever with an HOA I am familiar with because the people who stole the positions on the board are totally ignorant that there are laws regarding boards These ignorant individuals have been abusing the funds for years by committing similar infractions and unscrupulous practices for years.
I've been seeing lots of HOA horror stories, especially what it pertains to people who refuse to join. It really reminds me of mob tactics, "something terrible might happen if you don't join". You think anyone will eventually look into this, because too many of them are operating like a mafia
Bigger HOA’s tend to have better boards just because there will be more board volunteers/candidates to choose from, and some will know the trades, some will know contracts, some will understand accounting, and some will know many in the community. I was in one with 300 units, and we also had excellent management advice which we were big enough to afford. They had accumulated the largest reserves in Los Angeles County and paid cash for many Loma Prieta earthquake repairs without having to make emergency assessments. In smaller HOA’s it can be difficult to fill all positions and reach quorum. The battles are usually the same: litter/trash, those seeking more security vs. the gate-proppers, the nonconformists vs the rule-followers, pets, and noise. That said, I still prefer not to commit to be in an HOA, but I have managed to avoid a city government, too: I’m in unincorporated county. It’s great! They can certainly still run county budgets into the ground, but I’m better protected from actions that could deprive me of home ownership and value.
Why would an HOA in Los Angeles County be paying for earthquake repairs in the San Francisco Bay area hundreds of miles away? The Loma Prieta earthquake did not damage a single thing in Los Angeles County.
@@EXROBOWIDOW GREAT CATCH! I'm from the bay area and was living in West Hollywood for the so-called Northridge Quake. I meant that one (centered in Canoga Park or somewhere nearby, I believe). All our HVAC equipment on the roofs were rocked off their platforms and we had one stairwell collapse and some broken windows. It was so long ago I switched my geography.
As I often post on these HOA stories, there are a handful of laws constraining HOAs that could be passed that would prevent 90%+ of the problems of HOAs. 1) Remove the HOA's ability to foreclose on properties for non-payment of fees and/or fines. (only allow the HOA to place a lien on the property that can be collected when the home is sold). 2) Limit the total amount that HOA's are allowed to assess against a home owner in fines to 10% of the home's property tax assessed value. 3) Limit their ability to assess fines to only 1% of the property's assessed value per month (none of this $1000 a day crap). 4) Outlaw HOA restrictions against solar (and other "green" energy technologies). 5) Outlaw HOA restrictions against display of political, religious flags and signs (or holiday decorations). 6) All HOA charters must include provisions to allow the members of the HOA to dissolve the HOA without permission or cooperation from the HOA board. I'm sure there's more that could be added to this list, but I wanted to keep things to the bare essentials. (I'd like to add a provision to the law that says if any HOA board member or official is ever caught doing something illegal that they are required to sell their home and the proceeds are divided among the HOA members, but that would be a hard one to get passed).
I would vote for legislation like this in a heartbeat. Another thing that needs to be outlawed is special assessments for known maintenance items. E.g. the HOA cannot issue a special assessment for a roof replacement due to age. It's a maintenance item with a known lifespan. A properly run HOA will have the cash in the bank from funds collected over the 20-30 year lifespan of the old roof to simply cut the check for a new one. A good friend of mine has lived in a few HOAs. When looking at property in an HOA they demand copies of third-party audited financials for the past 10 years. Most HOAs don't have those, and the ones that do won't turn them over. When they encounter an HOA willing to turn them over to a prospective member things are generally on the level and they'll consider buying into it.
I'm pretty sure #4 is already a nationwide law. People have rights to install solar even if an HOA objects. None of your other ideas are based in reality. Condos need HOAs. Single family dwellings, not so much.
@@jblyon2 I'm not sure about the roof issue. I just sold a condo in a complex that was very old. Roofs lasted 40 years and seems they all went about the same time. When a new roof was needed, a fairly nominal special assessment was passed. The complex was huge and everything else well maintained. I see your point though. (One thing that did chap my hide was that the management company used a fly-by-night company to replace our roof in '19 and "didn't know" if there was even a warranty on it. We voted that management company OUT very soon afterwards.)
@@KabobHope I should be clear that I am differentiating between home owner's associations and condo associations. As for solar rights, those are state by state. Here in KS its HOAs are allowed to ban solar panels (was a huge dust up over this on Nextdoor in the HOA controlled community just north of my free neighborhood so I'm pretty sure my info on that is current). I would agree that single family home neighborhoods really shouldn't have HOAs (unless there is some community property like a pool or gates and guard shacks that needs to be paid for).
@@KabobHope You are incorrect. Certain states have passed laws or had court rulings overriding HOA restrictions on solar, but there is no national protection.
I think you're missing the point for some of this. Housing is not cheap - and its only getting worse. I bought in 2018 for 145k - these are now up to 210k. So trying to find a single family home in an area that doesnt have an HOA is getting harder and harder and more expensive. Sometimes you have to settle for what you can get if you want to own and build equity.
Your comments about your condo board reminded me about the tax revenue and budget reports that the library board I was a member of would receive. We had yearly audits by an out side accountant to make sure our budget was inline with all revenue.
HOA members often have had no powers their entire lives and quickly become corrupt and power hungry once on the board. My mother and all neighbors fell victim to this in a vacation resort setting in WI. Head member took out 9 credit cards in the name of the entire private community and not caught until over $750K was run upon the credit cards all spent personally
This sounds familiar. We had a sudden, hidden 80% jump in our fees, for what seems like no reason (we had a surplus). We went in in January, and paid the amount it said we owed, and had a $0 balance. Next thing we know, we get a letter, threatening us for non payment. The non-payment was for the 80% increase, which we (and others) knew NOTHING about!
I’ve done several subdivisions, and I set up the recorded restrictions before the first sale was made. After everything was sold, the subdivision was then in the hands of the different property owners. No HOA. Giving them the restrictions when they first purchased, assured them that I was not going to come back and try to change things up. They were in effect beneficiaries of the safe guarding restrictions which they all had signed with their purchase papers.
I have a story of outrageous behaviour from a board member in my building. We have external walkways where the steel support structure has started to rust away. At the AGMs the meeting won't approve the funds to fix the problem, so this guy has been spending his spare time to do it personally by hand himself for nothing!! Doing it himself after work because the rest of the owners are willing to see it collapse rather than spend any money is appalling! The power trips some board members get on is beyond words.
@Rhaspun That is why most HOAs use a management company to advise them and conduct the routine administrative functions. The HOA board acts as a board of directors that exercises oversight, both of the management of the management company, and enforcement of bylaws.
I had the opposite, my deck rails were fine but some other units were rotting. Rather than fix failing rails they forced every unit to have them replace. The cost was a rip-off too. It would have cost half a much for me to hire someone but that was not an option. I bet the company was doing some private kickback to a board member. I hate condos.
@@Rhaspun He knows what he is doing, he works in the trades. The problem is not him, it is the owners not approving necessary work because they don't want to spend money.
@@toriless They have to maintain uniformity or the building looks like shit and it reduces everyones property value. Depending on the types of rails and if they can be sourced or not, you cant replace some railings and not others. They all have to be done if there is extensive damage. Condo boards will look at the contractor reputation as well as the quote. They are not going to risk a half assed job just to save a few bucks, penny wise pound foolish is a real thing. Also, just because YOU could do something cheaper, or know friends who can do things cheaper does not mean that is a normal situation, because that would involve the work being done for no profit. Contractor companies on the other hand DO work for profit, so they will cost more than a friend of a friend doing you a favor.
First rule of shopping for a home....No HOA.
It is getting harder and harder to find homes for sale not in an HOA.
I never understood why anyone would want an hoa... Here, take a bunch of my money to tell me what I can and can't do with my own property that I am paying for... Why would you want that?
@@springhollerfarm8668 Half of the fools I talk too never read the contract and don't even know the house is in an HOA until after the purchase.
@@paytonpeta1336right, they come with the territory now.
@@springhollerfarm8668 I live in a rural area with no zoning and no HOAs. There are pig farms next to houses and junk yards next to houses and dumps next to houses and truck parks next to houses. Thats why you have HOAs and zoning. HOAs exclude the very people you want excluded. Those people can live in the blighted areas.
A HOA board getting arrested? That's a story that brings a smile to my face.
Just like the classic joke of a bus full of (pick a group) at the bottom of the ocean... it's a start.
I have never been under an HOA Boot Heal... this arrest story still bring me a smile.
Mine too!
I don't live in the US and I was never able to undrestand why HOAs are such a thing there. I've never heard anyone saying something positive about them, so why do they even exist?
Theft is theft. Damn state now wants $20 a year to file instead of $10. Governments have had the biggest price increases, a recording fee went from $75 to $199. What a scam gvt has going !! Some of them need to be in a cell.
Moved into a hoa community when I was 52. Enjoyed it for about 2 years. Several older people would walk the streets every couple of weeks looking for any little infraction. They wouldn't stop and talk to you about it, they would send a registered letter. At 55 I retired and spent several hours a day in my garage. Car maintenance, wood working projects, etc. Got a letter that my Garage door could only be open during ingress or egress. Hung a for sale by owner sign out and was gone in 6 weeks. Rented a trailer for a year. Bought a couple of acres outside of town and built a house. Chickens roaming the back yard, 2 horses, mow the grass when I feel like it, and leave the Garage door open all day. Nice.
Perfect!
Where do you live?
Old song, "Looking Out My Backdoor". I'm very happy for you and envy you the horses! However, I have seen subdivisions require that all house plans meet certain standards. Often required to have the garage openings perpendicular to the street.
horrific
@@perisword7918Good answer... sheep😅
I lived in an hoax community for a year in Vegas. Hearing board members getting arrested is music to my ears.
Autocorrect says the quiet part outloud.
And to think the NV legislators had to rein them in . These HOA's were placing leans and selling peoples homes that were disputing fines. Plus others were taking over boards and landing lucrative contracts with kickbacks . And they're still out of control.
“HOAX”😂 I like it!
District Attorneys needs to look into more HOAs
HOAs need to be abolished.
@@StudleyDuderight At least foced membership in an HOA
And more people need to look into district attorneys.
HOA’s need to be illegal
It started out to preserve the value of the neighborhoods. No orange homes, no goats eating front grass. (although with the green movement, the collection of rain water and using goats may be back in style..)
Now it’s gotten to controlling the drapery linings in your front windows and the plants you’re allowed.
The scam that should be changed immediately Is that when you fight them and there’s a lawsuit they use your money to defend themselves.
Makes me happy just to hear that HOA members were arrested and prosecuted.
We need a clean FBI sweep across the country on these corrupt organizations.
Same
Embezzlement.
Best thing I heard all month.
Same here!!
My former HOA tried to pass a secret dues hike once. They didn’t send out any notices of a meeting and held it in secret and raised the dues from $250 a year to $1100 a year. When they told everyone we all started talking and realized they hadn’t told anyone and we forced them to hold another meeting and voted down the hike, then voted everyone off the board. We afterwards discovered during an audit of the books that $15k was unaccounted for and the former HOA president had contracted his family member to do all the common grounds maintenance for much higher than the previous contractor had charged.
Nepotism is a common disease of HOA boards, as well as Cronyism.
Based grounds maintenance guy, that's on you for living in a place you don't own after paying for a home.
The only thing you should pay is property tax and even then that's theft
Kickbacks for various maintenance contracts are common.
They can't help themselves.
I agree, but a clubhouse, a pool, a tennis court and a nice entrance do add considerable value to your property. On the other side, lots should be larger and these people can have some of the above things in their own backyard.
Wow. Embezzlement and fraud. Part of why I rarely trust HOAs.
I lived in a HOA community once where the HOA president and the developer made the meetings so co confrontational that no one would go. They would send their children out to look for infractions and assess fines to the homeowners. It was found that the two gents had stolen $1M from the treasury over two-years. The developer fled the state and the president served time in the state penitentiary.
I hope I am never desperate enough to buy a house that someone else gets to be in charge of.
I've never been able to understand how people can move into HOA areas, I cannot understand or fathom why.
I'm just a bill sitting on capital hill, School of Rock?
@@dragontalontsiawdit's actually quite simple. Some people don't want to live next to other people's trash and squalor. It's not only an eyesore, it runs your property value down. But as you said, you know that going in so everyone has that choice.
On paper, it's has some attractions. Everything is pretty much done for you and yoir house value won't go down because your neighbors won't start parking rusting cars in their front yard.
Put eventually you will get an investation of parasites on the HOA board.
@@markrichards4042agree. A quick drive around town will provide enough justification to choose a neighborhood with an HOA.
It's getting harder and harder to find houses that aren't part of one. At least up here.....I told a realtor that I didn't want anything in an HOA, she told me that cut my options down by 90%..... needless to say my other half and I have since decided it's time to save up to leave the state altogether.
Why, WHY, do people buy in HOA neighborhoods? They don't do anything except tell you what you can and can't do with your property and YOU PAY THEM to tell you what to do. It makes ZERO sense.
HOAs are dominant in the south where they were once used to keep black people out of the neighborhoods. You basically cant live anywhere nice in the suburbs without being involved with one.
@@kiranreilly4916 Exactly. Gotta keep them-thar Neegras outta the neighborhood!!!! Though, TBF, some hoity-toity northern neighborhoods cottoned on to this idea, and for the same reason.
The flip side is I have friends that ‘don’t’ live in an HOA community. In their case, a neighbor parks his almost 40 ft motorhome in front of my friend’s house. Another guy has is really into skeletons and has 30 or so in his front yard decorated all year long. There are certainly pros and cons and you need to watch them like a hawk.
Keeping "undesired" people out, having and maintaining an uniform look of the properties and therefor increasing the property value. Thank god we don't have these neighbourhood-boards in our country 😂
Imagine there weren't enough homes for everyone who needs them, and if you can find a home, its usually got a HOA.
I've said it a million times. There is NOTHING an HOA can do for me to make it worth the hassle and control they exert over something you "own".
Nah.. The BANKERS OWN EVERYTHING and you OWN NOTHING.. 💵💵😂😂
I've said this a million times: HOAs are one of the last remaining ways to keep feral BLM and MS-13 out of your neighborhood they epitomize local control and local governance which is why the establishment hates them so much
Typically common areas in a HOA property are not individually owned and are managed for the collective benefit. A HOA property also establishes rules that don’t diminish the property values of owners. If you don’t like that, don’t buy in a HOA property.
Some people cant afford to live in a community that doesn't have an HOA! We are not rich and the best home we could afford is in an HOA. Now for elderly it can be a good thing since they dont have to mow their own grass! It's a give and take but we have to question where our fees go!
Not a damn thing!
My first encounter with an HOA was while living with a friend and his daughter. He had lost his wife and his daughter her mother. This was a new move to a new state. The 10 year old put a potted flower out front which was her mother favorite to remember her by. The next day i hear her crying out front and a grown man was out there yelling at her. I wanted to rip the guy apart limp by limb. He announced he was part of the HOA and was even more aggressive when i had no idea what that was. The "Infraction" resulted in the landlord getting a point against them. 3 points and they would be forced to sell the house. A big ordeal over a single flower in a pot. How anyone can live like this is beyond me. it's borderline fascist and Anti American. Does not suprise me these people are also white collar criminals. I would not care if my condo was worth 2.5 million. Money and property is meaningless when people have an authority to dictate to you. where a 10 year old girl cannot even put a flower out front to remember her mother by. It seems like a highly toxic existence to me.
NOT legal in my state, WA.
I would have showed him my gun collection when pointing it at him. And also put up no trespass signs. And camera's.
WRONG ! It is quintessential Murkin ! Telling the world what they can and can't do and make up WMDs so they can attack and illegally invade an other country with your terrorist, Murkin, military when a country tells terrorist Murika to GFY
Strike 2 rentoid now CLEAN IT UP RENTIE
It is
I fought my HOA when they tried to strong-arm the entire community to pay fees when it was once voluntary. I contacted an attorney and he gave me advice and the illegality of what they were doing. I wrote a strong letter refusing to pay and informed them of the law. I never saw another letter or notice afterwards.
Find neighbors that dislike the HOA, get the majority elected in, then move to dissolve the HOA.
@@ChristopherJohnsonIsAwesome Not necessarily a good idea. If the HOA maintains common areas (think townhouse exteriors) they're pretty much necessary. At best they're a pain.
@@donaldmaxie5264 sounds like you need a landscaping company not an HOA.
@@Thezuule1 Landscaping companies replace roofs now??
@@donaldmaxie5264 no that would be roofers.
I’m quite certain a LOT more HOA boards should be in jail. I’ve heard so many stories of boards stealing houses, land and even trying to take houses of people who aren’t IN the HOA. And they are all dealt with in civil court with lawsuits, instead of criminal court for criminal actions.
Aren't HOA supposed to be regulated and audited by state or local governments?
@@johnbell1810 theyre not. in some cases they actually supersede the local governments. Theres a whole last week tonight segment about it
First of all, in WA only the government can do a taking. In FL, I doubt anything is proper. Secondly, I doubt this is the only HOA where this has occurred. Probably charges were only brought due the high dollar amounts.
HOAs are a menace! I used to own a condo townhouse and the HOA was constantly raising dues. 20 years ago, my dues were close to 1K a month (they started at $200 when I bought the house. We had a clubhouse, pool, and tennis courts that were locked and completely taken over by the board for their private parties. They contracted a terrible trash company that only allowed for a single receptacle to be taken every other week. The landscaping and snow removal was minimal. To this day, I have no idea where all those dues were going. They were also insanely power-hungry and would pass stupid rules. I got fined a few hundred dollars because they could see the glow of my Christmas tree from a half-moon window (that they also ruled you could not cover). They told me I had to have white, unblinking Christmas lights on the tree INSIDE my house! I ended up selling and buying a house with no HOA because I became incredibly frustrated over the whole thing.
HOA dues of almost $1000 per month? That's definitely WAY too high. Who can afford that on top of their house payment? Wow.
Condos always look like a bad deal to me. Roofs wear out, AC furnaces wear out buildings need overhaul, parking lots need paving. All high ticket items and you get the bill.
CHRISTmas was the problem for the Satanists.
You could have run for a board seat.
Yup, HOAs have no taste for aesthetics. It's like any amount of colors is offensive to them because they're literally colorblind and are jealous that we get to enjoy them with our RGB cones in our eyeballs 😖
I have seen that with my own eyes. My HOA has been riddled with grifters for year. I have done everything within my power to fight these people. It is disgusting.
This is exactly why I'm on the board of my HOA. I've learned more in the last year about government and people than I could even imagine. The first president we had literally said "I'm the president I can do whatever I want." It doesn't surprise me that this kind of stuff happens.
I’m on my board as well. It’s a thankless job though. People are either angry that the HOA board is trying to stop them from doing things (like running a very visible business out of their house) or they’re angry that it’s taking too long for the HOA board to stop people from doing disruptive things. Nevermind that the HOA board has to refer things to an attorney many times and then it takes YEARS to work its way through the courts. Anyway, we keep the street lights on, the lakes maintained, the lake levels at a decent level, the lake fountains working (to keep the fish alive and the water clear), the grass in the common areas mowed, some flowers for decoration, the drainage cleaned out, etc. Over 80% of our budget just goes into maintenance. The rest goes into a road fund so that we have enough money to repair the roads because that was f’d up years ago and the county will not take over the maintenance of our roads as they were not built to county standards.
That sounds like something the 🍊 guy did...
@@limsalalafells. Really ? The son of this guy took bribes internationally, China n Ukraine. They’ll be more ……your hatred blinds your very logic . That’s not good. It means your vulnerable to narcissists . Seriously. Need to look at actions not words .
@@limsalalafells In the coming weeks you’re going to be in for a real eye opener. I hope. Otherwise, you may go crazy.
When it comes to criminal corruption, Beijing Biden is your man..
I routinely deal with HOA boards in Florida filing claims on window damages, then making the tenants pay the damage on their own after the association gets and keeps the insurance money. Then they turn around and blame the insurance company for not giving the association enough money. It's millions of dollars a year and attorneys are helping them do it. Guess who the middleman is in this - the management company.
You have to be a idiot to buy into a hoa and it is a scam for them to steal money from the owners .
not just attorneys... it's the local Judge and DA that they "donated" to that will ignore any claim and the Sheriff who also received "donations" will also harrass and beat up and arrest anyone who dares to complain.
The entire country is seemingly run this way.
They all pass the bill to the people, and slowly but surely people are becoming more and more distrustful of any entity at all.
There's going to be some sort of cataclysm before 2030 that's going to radically change society across the world
*checks 2nd amendment* yep this is EASILY remedied
@@HerpaDurpVgso your remedy is murder or violent threats….gets you no where but prison
For many of us, this is a brilliant and uplifting headline.
I once got a warning letter for having left my trash cans out a day after trash had been picked up. We were in the hospital. So, I drafted a nasty response letter threatening to sell my home through HUD if I EVER received another worthless letter like that again. Then, I made sure I CC’d a number of neighbors. I later received a letter of apology and never received another warning letter from my HOA.
Keep your place clean mate, not cool.
@@brnoamikshaddup! What should he do, Bedazzle his trash can so it's pretty?
What is hud
@@brnoamikHe did keep it clean. That's why his trash was removed from the house and placed in the specified receptical, in the specified place, on a specified day. Was he supposed to not put the trash out that day and let it stink up the area?
@@EternalDawn Housing and Urban Development.
HUD helps apartment and homeowners offer reduced rents to low-income tenants.
I worked in the HOA industry for close to 15 years. We managed Boards and always made them do everything by the book and if they tried anything shady, we refused to work with them. Fast forward a few years, I inherited a small vacation property that is in and HOA, self managed and shady as heck! I found out quickly what its like to be on the other side.
Too bad there are enough management companies like yours... but so many are just as corrupt as the boards :(
I was on our HOA board for several years as vice president. We really had a small one no pool or anything so our dues were around $200 per house per year. That covered maintaining the park and the public areas and keeping the street lights on. We did our best to be as easy to deal with as we could.
We were never big fans of the whole use a ruler to measure somebody's front lawn thing. Generally if something was a problem we knew it the minute we saw it. They were really only a couple of those in the years I was there. As for the finances every meeting we had was open to the public and every finance document we had was also wide open. If we spent a penny we could tell you where it went.
And part of the reason for that is because we had a law firm that was really good and would never have put up with anything even if somebody had tried it
Sell quik
I guerentee they were all 'bad' for someone. doesn't take long to find the ones that try regulate what color christmas lights you can use, Trick Treating hours etc. All it takes is one member of the No Fun Granny Brigade and suddenly your block is restricted to single strand of white lights during Christmas...
@davidlewis5312 I can tell you from experience all it takes is one Karen on the Board, and the whole HOA is doomed. They take over by being relentlessly obnoxious, and over time, other BOD members give up or quit. In my case, that's exactly what happened. It all started with half a dozen people renting their homes as Airbnb and one Karen who didn't like it, and the next thing you know, the whole neighborhood was fighting. It was so idiotic.
Oh my God just the title of this video made me so happy.
I cost my HOA tens of thousands fighting over a fence for a severely disabled woman, and as much as i feel bad that my neighbors got screwed a little bit... I've never seen so many nasty people in one group in my LIFE.
How anyone can be against helping a disabled woman who can barely walk and just needed a safe space for her beloved dog is BEYOND ME (she wasnt so disabled when she got the dog, it happened in the last few years)...
Forget that disabled woman's fence, how tall is your grass getting???
lol
being disabled doesn't allow you to break the rules/laws. If that dog lady went around with a gun and stole the money at gun point would it be justified if she was disabled and needed it?
@@JankyShack🤡
@@JankyShack how is having an accommodation for a disability the same as using lethal force to threaten for money? regardless should help both people, society is better when we help those in need.
@@daphnedherbert because the government has the monopoly of force, using the government to extract money from people is the same as holding a gun to their head. If your neighbor is very irresponsible with money and then gets cancer and requires 75% of your income to survive is that acceptable for them to take it from you because they need it?
"HOA Board Arrested"
You love to see it.
I mean, it's a small start in the right direction.
Millions cheered
I've never lived under an HOA and even I hate HOAs by proxy. I used to work for a company that did contract support work for professional associations. One of the projects we worked on was for a professional association that supported HOAs. Almost every person I spoke to had a horror story about their HOA. I'm still baffled why anyone would choose to live under such an arrangement. The detriments vastly outweigh the benefits.
All my homies hate HOAs. Even Tay Zonday distrusts HOAs.
People choose to live in an association because it’s a tradeoff. For example, I live in a multiunit apartment building. I don’t want landscaping to look after, and I want to live in an urban area. The only choice, then, is buy a condominium or rent. Renting places one at the mercy of a landlord, which can be worse than an association. On the other hand, associations are universally bad, but the corruption is usually petty. It is hard to know how bad an association is beforehand.
"HOAs" are the work of the 😈
You have to realize that it's the horror stories that make the news. Yes, it happens, but I'd wager for every one like this, there's ten more that just take modest fees and keep things maintained, but those stories won't generate any clicks.
Hold them accountable and pass laws to protect homeowners.
Pass laws to protect the average citizen? Ha. This is America
Deposits of dues/fees/fines and checks written could easily be kept online so anyone could login daily or weekly and see what’s going on.
I mean, they have been arrested.
We don't need to pass laws to protect homeowners. Homeowners can protect themselves if you just get rid of the laws protecting HOAs and other parasitic agencies.
@@cybersal7 Keeping anything online doesn't mean anyone can see what's going on.
Not only for HOAs but also for Non-Profit Organizations, it is important to have a 3rd party at least review the "books" including credit card, and bank statements annually.
With an annual budget of $1100 that would bankrupt mine.
*gasp!
That sound you just heard was every church in existence grasping their pearls in dismay.
How will they ever hide and protect their monetary investments from those greedy victims of sa etc? I wish I was actually joking.
@@toriless I agree with jonwinter, but there are ways you could do it that would protect smaller organizations from burdensome audits. For example, you could say "except for organizations with under _x_ employees, volunteers, and/or staff" or "except for organizations with operating budgets under $10,000 (or similar).
Especially churches that promote republican candidates. And the NFL!
@@CM-xr9oqSynagogues have WAY more money
My wife was an HOA board treasurer! I just told her - don't pay yourself anything. Don't even do reimbursements - it will be our contribution to the HOA (and amounts were not relevant). My income at the time depended on being reliable with accounting / finance stuff and there is a fair bit of bad behavior in these systems. I wanted us to have nothing to do with any questions on this stuff.
Very smart!
SMART CHOICE
Yeah, it took me years to decide that the HOA should pay for the gas for mowing the sidewalks. Just seemed petty.
My wife owns a condo. I called the condo board a bunch of ***holes to their faces during a meeting one time. I still regret losing my cool and my wife wasn't happy about my actions at the time, but the more time passes the more we both admit that I was right.
Truth hurts.
Hoa board members are real estate agents protecting their investments. They are the reason affordable housing doesn't exist. Ever wonder why houses have Sq ft minimums?
They needed to hear it.
I had a friend whose neighborhood had a community pool. Everyone who wanted to use it paid an annual fee. My friend did the maintenance so she paid no fee and drew no salary. This one neighbor got himself put oner the board. He basically fired her and stated paying himself to do the maintenance. He also paid lots of money to family members to "work" at the pool and marked up the chemicals. Anyone who questioned him, he banned from the pool. The other residents had enough and replaced him, when the money for the saltwater system seem to disappear. . They had to open another checking account because he refused to give them access to that one. That state has laws that allowed him to do that. From what they were able to piece together he had cleaned them out. He ended up moving and claimed my friend made up lies because she wanted to be president.
This is a guy who’s house neighborhood should have set on fire with him strapped to the bed long before he was allowed to move away. When laws prevent Justice, you have to take Justice into your own hands.
That's horrible if that's true, but there are always two sides of every story. You say that he claimed your friend made up lies, but we don't any reason to trust any of you.
I'll give you the benefit of the doubt though, since most people who write comments like this do it as a measure of self-therapy.
Anyways, people who get away with these type of scams are able to because most people don't think or care about how the money is being spent. This is why it's always an older person who is in everyone's business all the time, because they know the tricks.
That's their scam. If you want to fuck with that person track them down, they are probably doing it again somewhere else. Thwart their plans, you could also put a bunch of information out of the internet on that guy so if anybody looked him up it would be easy to find out. I would of contacted local news to do a story etc etc etc
I believe you (just ignore these neigh sayers, they feel compelled to poo poo on everything; thanks for adding the comment, I enjoyed reading it down under in Australia,
@@terrylegrosbisson1177 I see that passive aggression is still a thing in the land down under.
For a while i was on the board of directors for a city dog park in los angeles. We were supposed to help with maintenance and community outreach. We did put on a lot of fun and educational events, but what irked me was the beautification and art grants we got to put up some statues... The artists picked were friends of the boards president, they got the money, but we never got the statues. Then i started noticing other sneaky stuff going on involving the neighborhood council. Crazy how even at the lowest levels, any bit of power is corrupting.
& money
I volunteered at a local FM radio station run by the local university in town, University of Toronto. A few years near the end of my time there a woman near the top had absconded funds for the radio stations operating budget. These funds were raised from mandatory annual student council fees. This woman took thousands for herself and went to Montreal one weekend on a shopping spree. I heard later she worked with BLM Toronto.
Grifters gotta grift.
The fish rots from the head down. The US has become a criminal enterprise.
We already have a solution for this. If YOU want a statue on YOUR land, YOU pay for it. Whenever you give your money to someone else to spend for you this is what happens.
Thank you.
My wife and I had a condominium apartment and had to deal with a crooked board and professional manager.
When I complained, we had our phone cut off several times. The junction box was found unlocked. I reconnected the wires. There was a lawyer on the board who worked in the AG's office. He covered for the manager who entered apartments without owners' knowledge.
We moved out.
I lived in the former manager condo. I do not know what shenanigans they did but I got free cable while living there and I doubt they could figure out how to shut off electrical as well. Every few years someone would come by and spent a few hours trying to figure it out and give up.
It's scary to me that HOAs can impose stuff on you and if you don't abide by it you could lose your house. I'm sure a lot of HOAs out there are fine, but I will never be voluntarily placing myself under the authority of one.
I do not know about FL but is most states it is lot legal. ONLY the county or city can force a sale for unpaid property taxes. NO ONE ELSE!! Most likely the HOA was LYING about any such ability, most thieves are a liars too.
*hoa inspectors and board members might just find themselves arguing with someone who is a mma fighter or off their meds for a few weeks...those voices inside your head can get very persuasive and creative when dealing with others that annoy them*
*ir so i've heard*
To me, these groups seem un-American. I don't doubt that they do serve some purpose, but any time we hear about them (sometimes fictional HOAs on TV), it's BAD. So yeah, "some I assume, are good people." But I don't want anything to do with them. (Shudder)
@@shadowlouise The problem with many HOA's is that they are only theoretically beholden to the communities that they manage. HOA management is often offloaded onto a corporate board that manages many geographically dispersed developments. The board members do not live in a given development and they do not feel any obligation to the members of the community that they govern.
Take everything that's wrong with congress, and now shrink it down so that all the bad parts are concentrated in a body smaller than a county government and with even less oversight than the average middle school PTA.
If you want to fix it -
1. Laws that require the members of the HOA board to LIVE inside the development that they manage. This should not be a full time job, it should be something done either by younger retirees of the community, or part time by a group of engaged homeowners.
2. No HOA can manage multiple developments or x-number of Condo Units/Houses nor can a board member sit on multiple boards.
3. Let's say for now, no more than '500' houses or a single large condo complex can be managed by a single HOA. 500 houses paying, let's say $50 dollars a month each would give an HOA an income of 25,000 a month or 300,000 a year. That should be more than enough to pay for basic security patrols, inspections, and the upkeep on a community clubhouse. And that's ALL an HOA should be doing.
4. The ability of the households to dissolve the HOA with a basic 50%+1 majority of votes.
5. The HOA board must be recertified by the households they manage every year. You might make it something simple like 50%+1 of household that vote. Which, combined with a relatively small size means an HOA should putter along comfortably, so long as it's doing an inoffensive job. But be easily dissolved if they try to act like Tyrant and earn the displeasure of their residents.
If I bought a house in a neighborhood that had an HOA, I would not join (it's a private contract association), and if they even attempted to steal my property through the courts, every board member would find his house burned to the ground the next day. Not even close to playing with psychopaths like them.
I've written to my SC legislators, congressmen and senators about reigning in HOAs. Not a word back from any of them. I've been around politics (New York) all my life. When the silence from politicians is deafening on matters pertaining to money and corporations, it usually signifies the politicians are in the pockets of the offending companies (HOAs). What will it take for state and local legislatures to address what has become a tyrannical abuse of authority by HOAs all over the country, but especially here in South Carolina?
should be illegal and anyone that anyone been on them jail for life
Simple solution, NEVER buy a HOA controlled property! Term limits Simple, NEVER vote for an incumbent!
@@Jay.Kellettterm limits is will only Fox part of the problem. Stop lobbyist as well and all,the unelected career bureaucrats.
As a native South Carolinean I could have told you that. The government people here are invested in properties and the manipulation of them for profit. New HOA communities sell for higher prices than non-HOA communities and that also keeps us "mere commoners' out of "their" business. The "Good Old Boy" system is still in place here, and the old money still rules.
They won't ever help you: it's not in their political interests. They don't want to fight anyone.
A long time ago I joined a HOA board as a group takeover. We were shocked with the alleged incompetence of both the former Board Members and the Property Management Company. We found out Taxes were not filed or paid for the prior two years. We found bank accounts where only older former Board Members having signing authority on. We never confirmed any outright fraud, but suspect some were laying the ground that as board turnover and time to forget occurred, they could have later pulled the money from those accounts. Looking back at it, this was a rather ingenious idea that may have worked if it weren't for a new board to self audit their books.
What IS it with greedy bastards and their distain for paying taxes in the first place? Do they even realize the very roads they drive on is FUNDED by the government via taxes?
@@Echo81Rumple83 Yes, but the payment of taxes is the responsibility of the thieving peasants. Such fine and upstanding paragons of virtue such as themselves shouldn't lower themselves to pay for the roads only they should have the divine right to use.
If they find oil somewhere or wanna make a strip mine there will magically be a road there they don’t need my 70$ when they are printing our money out of value anyways why take it off me just print it and give it straight to them for a road we’re never paying back any of this debt anyways the whole economy is fake why can’t the roads get a “bailout” what’s the difference they need my two pennys when they’re already killing us
@@AustynSNmany wealthy pay ZERO taxes...so by your statement...they should NOT be allowed to use said roads...or the fire department, or ANY other programs offered via taxes!!..
@@kathleenhuff3059 I didn't mean that specifically, but I won't say it's not a good idea.
Love when rogue hoa boards get their comeuppance. My current house was originally in a hoa development, then about 20 years ago all of the home owners got together and decided as adults they were all capable enough to maintain their own homes and properties without having someone take their money and tell them what to do.
EXACTLY.
Wow , awesome
I suspected our previous HOA of the same. There were about 150-200 homes, and the developer and a lackey that didnt live in the neighborhood was running everything. We paid $1200 a year, but yet, other than basic landscaping (mowing and taking care of the entrance, and a pool), we couldn’t figure out where the money was going. One of my neighbors, who was an accountant, told me once “The numbers don’t add up”.
Exactly
That's why "HOA" is a Crime Syndicate.
I was on the board of a cab driver co-op in the 2000's, and a driver went a filed a change in the statement of officers at the Secretary of State claiming that he was now the president, that some friend of his was treasurer, and that a dead woman whose identity she stole was the secretary, and then mailed a letter to the taxi and limousine commission written on letterhead stolen from a law office that he had fired the rest of us. It took two years of litigation to get that sorted out.
Those are sworn statement. The false filing alone is a crime.
My old mum always said, if you want people to stay honest, never put temptation within their grasp.
Wise, she was.
@@j.l.m.6862are you their mom?
Seems unlikely
I'm a Title Examiner. An HOA down the road from me was sued by one of their members, and long story short, the HOA charged three separate assessments totaling ~3k to each house to pay for a legal defense. Never ever ever live in an HOA.
That's a other issue. It's like how cops know that they're not paying out judgements against them. HOAs no reason to curb their behavior when they k ow they'll just charge the homeowners for any judgments.
Not having an HOA increases the value of a house.
Hoas claim that they keep property values up, but that doesn't apply if no one wants to buy the houses.
Shocking: a HOA acting like my local government
And the problem is ... most of the time the "citizens" _are not involved._ I know of one great HOA; it's of the people, by the people, and for the people.
haaaa! best one! and makes so much sence
Ah, you live in a Red State, do you?
Politicians in training.
@@TimeSurfer206 Funnily enough, HOAs act more like leftist governments.
Steve, I've never lived in a condo, but I've worked on them and worked with the various "associations" who administer them. Most HOA's will fall into error if they don't religiously maintain open meetings rules and absolute term limitations on all elected officers, general consensus on issues like major improvements or changes to the Professional Management. Btw, working for some of the flakier ones can get you into tax trouble when they "report" having paid you thousands of dollars that don't appear on your own books is just one of the ways.
The thing that bothered me besides besides that my HOA stole my house from me. Even though I fought them in court and they could not meet their burden I still lost. The "JUDGE" took there side...! MY LAWYER STOPPED before we started our defense and told him. " "The Judge told us to proceed along with my 9 witnesses anyway". Rrrr SMH! I digress,
When they published their budget and made available is always incredible to me that the budget and the end of the year fiscal report always worked out to be a dead 0 everytime for many years in a row...
I'm not a smart man but that sounds fishy to me.
It's been 5 years now that they stole my house my depression is gotten better but my life still sucks. Steve made a post I don't know a month ago about the Supreme Court saying that they have to give their change back while I'm in the process of that but I can't find any lawyer that will work to be paid after the settlement in Florida.
It ALL depends on the documents. Often the COUNTY will for a minimum number, mine is one per year, any time in that year. Notice MUST be sent and within a specific duration before the meeting, I have to look it up every year but something like no less than 3 week bit no more than 60 days. I suspect this is typical but in FL all bets are off.
Me, I have the HOA account with a CC and checks to pay for the insurance, simple. You will find with a smaller association, like I recommend that term limitations is suicide, NO ONE WANTS THE JOB. The guy I took over for NEVER wanted the job but when the developer sold their house he was forced to do so by his wife. I gladly took over. It is an easy job. Fill out a report of the state, file the paperwork that the county public works sends and pay the required insurance. The only hard part is deciding when to hold the annual meeting so you get enough for a quorum which is hard to do when people are happy as in my HOA.
@@toriless I'm not sure what you're talking on the first part of your comments.
My shui never made corned but they always lied about it and said though whatever they needed to be passed of course not enough people dont attend those meetings.
@@toriless I am not disagreeing with you about what any HOA's agreement says; I stated that they are all subject to fraud and misuse if the homeowners in an HOA system do not go , often, to the required meetings and actively vote for their officers and policies.
i have been a board member or treasurer of 2 different churches and a township trustee and i can tell you the money was handled very similar to what you describe… every quarter the board would review and any one who asked was immediately provided with financials. i can’t imagine dealing with a group that hides their financials or doesn’t review on a regular basis
Yeah, but a condo does it every month. They a VERY bureaucratic compared to ones involving homes. Even than then one next to mine charges $200 a month, mine is $100 a YEAR. People are SO prejudicial. HOAs are a just as much all alike as Europeans are all alike.
A lot people deal with the federal government and the armed forces on regular basis.
Steve, your assessment about every pot of money having schemers is so very true: It also drives massive national spending policies like the Prison Industrial Complex, and the Military Industrial Complex: it's private corporations trying to get their hands on all those sweet sweet taxpayer dollars...
Well your beloved Ukraine is certainly making a load of money from the US tax payers…
As a former treasurer of a HOA, decades ago, we chose to have insurance to cover fraud by the board and we also had an independent financial audit done every year.
Why pay more for insurance, get rid of the hoa and save money
The fact you even needed insurance for fraud proves someone already did it, it's telling the story isn't it.
@@n5sdm Its actually really hard to get rid of an hoa
@JankyShack I know. Join the board. Become president, get like minded people to join in an effort to dissolve it. It's easier that way.
Yes. A independent financial audit should be the norm for all HOAs.
Very first thing our new HOA board did when the neighborhood transferred was limit the power of the board to raise dues over 10% with limited support. Requires 65% of ALL homes, not just the people who show up to a meeting. Might be the most important thing we ever do as a body.
Yep, agree with that. That is called sound governance.
if that 65% is not in the HOA by laws( which could require up to 75% of the members to approve) and HOA board passing a rule would hold no water whatsoever. The next board could vote to rescind it.
I was on an HOA board for two years. We also had a management company that we paid to take the money, repair issues, etc. We couldn't hire a vendor just because. There had to be at least three bids for any kind of work be it landscaping, tree work, painting, roofing or repairs. No one got hired because of who they knew. Like Steve said, every single penny was accounted for. ALL meetings were open to the homeowners. The only one they couldn't attend was if we were discussing homeowners who were behind on their payments for privacy reasons. Our dues are hardly ever raised and what it is always a very small amount because of inflation. That said, when I move within the next couple of years, I will not be purchasing a place with an HOA. I would like to decide what and when I am doing work to my own home.
Amen to that! I was in an HOA for 25 years. Never had an issue (except minor stuff) although others did. BUT, when we moved to our retirement home, the first thing I told the RE agent was "Don't even think about showing me a house in an HOA".
We are new to HOAs, moved into our current community 8 years ago and it was fine for the first 5 years, the last 3 years have been just awful! I absolutely disdain HOAs now and refuse to purchase a home in one going forward. It is very sad to me that you can’t live in an area with a group of people without it going down in flames.
Until they call an executive session and kick you out. Condo HOA's are the worst.
No kidding about any amount of other people's money. I bought a home in a small 75 home community. We found out the developer was hanging on to the HOA after all the development was long finished. Taking it over and going through the books, we found out what a snake in the grass she was. She was paying for mowing of home owner lots. She had "lent" the HOA money, meaning she paid for development work on the neighborhood and tacked it on to future homeowner's tab. When she found out we were taking over, she raised rates to the max and sent out mailings trying to get all the homeowners to pay dues before the end of the year. You know, so she could take next year's money before we took over.
Once a "friend" and I took over, well, lookie here? Other people's money! This guy immediately picked up where she left off. Let's keep all the extra money the developer cheated some of our neighbors over. Let's keep paying to mow property not owned by the HOA. Let's forego the maintenance the developer wasn't doing so we can have a nice juicy slush fund. Let's collect some money leasing our developer's sign for our neighborhood to a developer selling competing homes right across the street. Oh, and let's go ahead and plan on putting in public sewer and sidewalks in this rural neighborhood to upgrade private lots, you know, like my lot. Let's buy one of lots and put in a neighborhood playground. You know, the one next to my lot. Let's go spend a bunch of money on no-bid contracts for extravagant projects before the end of the year so we don't get exposed for creating our slush fund. Then let's cause a lot of drama trying to expand the number of directors so we can bring in our buddies to help avoid any more accountability. Then when all the drama and personal conflict become public, they kick us all out and hire a management company.
Oh, lookie here at all these Other People's money!
Sounds like our government
_Reads title_
*cheers erupt, everyone in the control room stands up and hugs one another*
We did it folks! Finally got an HOA.
*sadly slips rifle back into its holder*
Hopefully more to come. They are the mobs of the neighborhoods
Let the floodgates open wide
I can’t say where I just don’t know but one board member of an overbearing unscrupulous HOA was shot. That shook up the guilty board. They all resigned, and I think the shooter is about ready to get out of jail.
So they are touchable just sorry somebody had to go to jail for it.
Another case of "no good deed goes unpunished"....
That's sarcasm, by the way..... @@cybersal7
"never would we ever expect to see this behavior from one of the biggest HOA-"
Imma stop ya right there, chief 😂
On my never list:
- Buying a condo
- Buying a house that is subject to a HOA
- Letting others manage my money (I don't mean investments)
If you ever become incapacitated, that third item on your list would have to be dropped. My wife recently had to take care of financials for her stepmother when the stepmother’s dementia got more advanced.
@@techtutorvideos
I saw a recent YT where the fellow goes on about hundreds of condo buildings in Florida about to face unfunded necessary repairs to pass their 40 year certificate.
(You surely recall the recent collapse of a building ...)
So values are plunging as people are trying to sell their dogs off ...
I'm probably also highly influenced by the great John D. MacDonald book too....
The T-shirt is bang on, and broiught back memories of Saturday mornings when I, a Canadian kid, learned about the US system of government. The problem with HOAs is the apathy of the membership. Mass reluctance to attend meetings, ask questions and hold the board accountable just gives the petty dictators free reign to be criminals. Democracy is not a free gift - it's benefits are earned by engagement, some effort and getting off the couch to vote. There are many good and honest HOA/condo boards and I'd venture to say that they are the ones constantly seeking for input and engagement from their members. The shady ones count on apathy to create empires of corruption.
Yes, trying to get a quorum for elections is always a challenge.
Sadly, these days people think, I need to vote on Americas Got Talent or the Voice, not actual elections!
Most people aren't going to be interested in interacting with HOAs that are still using 20th century technology like snail mail and face-to-face meetings instead of e-mail and web sites/apps.
I bet you didn't know there's no VOTING for a master in a true democracy.. 😂😂
Why should you have to involve yourself in the business of others just to have the privilege of keeping them out of yours? Being left alone should be the default!
This is just another reason that if you are in an HOA, keep the board in check. Be involved in the meetings. Run for positions. Talk with other people when concerns are raised to see what they know. People may be afraid to say something for fear of retaliation. The best way to get an HOA under control is to be involved. Once you have to start taking things to court, it can be difficult to get them under control.
@@boumajohn The property management company is the company set up by the developer who built the houses right? And that there is a contract that states that control doesn’t automatically go to the property owners themselves?
@@boumajohn Er, unless the property management company is party to the plot sales agreement, they have no say. ???
Actually, if you really want to live like a "free" American, everybody refuse to buy a home with HOA involved. Eventually they will be eradicated
In other words invest hundreds of hours per year trying to manage something that shouldn't exist in the first place.
@@boumajohn That is not how things work literally anywhere in the country. If you have a purchase contract that states that in the event of your HOA dissolving control reverts to the property management company you do not own land or property and if you were mislead into believing that, I suggest you retain a lawyer and sue everyone involved.
I used to be a union trustee, and I know how important it is that the money is taken care of properly and accounted for. Unfortunately, it’s a big temptation to too many people.
One more reason to only join a small one. Less money
My neighbors are all rich, who cares about few thousand in reserve.
For 20 years I was in a good HOA and used the process that you mention for the board you were on. My HOA fees were $180. a year max. Good neigborhood with a HOA that was flexible. the only real change in 20 years was going from saying not metal roofs to allowing high end metal shingles that look like normal shingle.
Mandatory membership should be prohibited by law.
Then it’s worthless
@@MuzixMaker That is the point, I guess. HOAs are worthless. Their contribution to land value is questionable at best.
@@MuzixMaker Being worthless would be a improvement as current HOAs are actively harmful while being worthless means it will be mostly benign. The best action though would just make them illegal entirely which would be the best fix.
@@MuzixMaker precisely. It took you that long to understand that?
@@DeathlordSlavik at least make membership voluntary, with option to leave, anytime you want.
A friend of of the family, who was a self made millionaire, told me back in the mid seventies to never go into business with anyone. "You find a way to make money, they find a way to steal it."
Forty or so years ago I started to consider FL for retirement. I read a retired realtors article stating; never ever, ever, never buy a condo or get into a HOA situation in FL. I've been in FL renting a condo for the last 13 years, he was absolutely correct. I hear owners griping all the time about emergency assessments and a ton of other things pretty much everytime I hear their conversations.
Florida is a special place for sure. The place where a whole condo building collapsed because of poor design, poor maintenance and an unwillingness of residents to address emerging problems.
What kind of ship won't sail a partnership of course?
DAMN!!! I'm my HOA President, and I don't even want ANYTHING to do with any money that has a CHANCE of being attributed to me. I've gone months without being reimbursed (for community doggie bags) simply because we had lost our third of three Board Members and I refused to approve my own reimbursement. Good HOAs have good Boards and good Managers. Bad HOAs have bad Boards and bad Managers.
So you just want power and control over your neighbors... that's worse.
Authoritarianism has no place in a free country.
@@dand33911 Actually, all we do is enforce the rules we all agreed to. When we occur additional expenses because of maintenance issues, disposal of appliances, or other things we collect from the responsible party if we can identify them so the people who play by the rules don’t. I do it because I want to live in the community I bought into, not what people what to change it into because they don’t care about anyone else. When we fine we almost never collect because we agree to waive the fines when collected (we don’t even budget for fines).
If you think this is power and control, well I probably can’t change your opinion. I do it for the community, not for me. The only ‘benefit’ that I get is that whenever I sell the community will still look good, not a trashy disaster that people try to turn it into.
@necigrad
You want to live in the community you bought into, and that totally negates the opinions of your neighbors who bought after you. Yet you all pay the same fee.
Seems fair...let me guess, boomer?
We had a lakehouse with an organization fee. They maintained private roads, private beaches, and the dam. They had 0 authority over the individual lots/dwellings, etc. That's simply authoritarianism.
There are no good HOAs.
@merfishsandwich691
I think the entire concept is un-American.
Imagine sitting around with your neighbors and being like, "You know what we should do? Let's voluntarily create a new tax, justify beurocrats, and enact arbitrary authoritarianism on ourselves"
This is why we can't have a democracy, we have people with that mindset.
As a BoD member in a co-op our fiduciary responsibility is paramount and we do everything we can to reduce expenses to keep the fee down. Our community is mostly retirees on fixed income so it's a huge task - especially with cost rising so high now. In examining what previous members did in the past with budgets we found stupid and not planned spending, poor planning and -not misappropriation but - unrealistic budgeting, as well as unapproved projects and changes but nothing like what you reported (thankfully). Our current Board is made up of retired engineers, business owners, project managers et....so collectively we have the knowledge and skills to do our job. Plus we recently got a wonderful professional manager. We try desperately to educate our members on projects, budgets, & problem areas due to an aging infrastructure but sometimes is very hard to get them to pay attention to issues. And there is always the emotional factor....As for the inspections - we always notify owners if there is a concern to discuss an issue and try to mitigate it. That's the professional and right way to do things. Yeah - we have our chronic problem folks but 99% of the community works together to make the corrections. As I always remind them - they made the rules, not us.
Mine is $100 per year. I think I am doing pretty good at keeping the costs down. That's $8 a month. My neighbors are all rich anyway, nearly half have a Tesla (or two in one case).
So many HOA horror stories. Fining those they didn't like not fining family & Friends, non bid contracts to their family members, and many more
Sounds just like the governments to me.. 😂😂😂
@@jpnewman1688 a government within a government within a government.
If they are actually found guilty, I want to see specific results. 1 Makes HOAs illegals. 2, Throw them in jail for 20 years. 3, Take ALL of their Possessions and Assets, Liquadate them, and equaly share it with ONLY the HOA members not in the scheme, NOT to the Court, NOR to any Lawyers, JUST the HOA members that wasn't in on the scheme.
I'll tell you what would be justice, while they are charged vote them all out. Then make HOA rules they violate and take their house, because they sure would take yours.
They should be either illegal, or voluntary.
@@jasonbourne1596 When I said '3, Take ALL of their Possessions and Assets, Liquadate them' I mean ALL their Possessions and ASSETS, INCLUDING their LAND and HOME and liquadate it into Cash to give to the others.
When people become in control of something without any real checks and balances this stuff will always happen.
And here's the kicker: there are never any real checks and balances.
@@gorkyd7912of course there's always check$ and balance$.. 😂😂
@@JP-gi7dw Damn you must be an HOA board member with that thinking! 😉
@@Xeonerable nah.. I'm just more aware of how the shit show really works.. 😂😂
As a board member for two decades, well, also another association member for a decade, I have lots of experience with these typically volunteer boards. Beware of autocratic types that eagerly take on responsibilities, but ultimately have a pet project they want done. Once done, they are off the board.
Also beware of idiots, who will ignorantly approve anything the autocrat demands. Beware of folks that approve stupid ideas - anyone can sue if damages result.
These boards are meant to make common concerns as well handled as possible. But largely, people avoid taking on responsibilities. So the board is run by fools and dictators. Get on your board, and help it get better. An HOA is supposed to help people get along, keep the place attractive, pay bills, and prevent accidents.
Yea. Sounds like me. I wanted all the sprinklers to work. Spent hours of my own time following the HOA landscape tech around. Once the sprinkles were fixed, I was off the Board. 😉
Bravo! And Steve, I've always admired you for citing the journalists who have reported the stories you mention.
Ben has been pinned against the edge of the bookcase by the sword on our right.
my day just got a little bit better, the sky more blue, the sun a little brighter, the grass more green
But is your grass the approved shade of green? ;)
@bhambhole Ha! Was going to do that at first but went with colour on a whim. No worries, we're on the same page and can share a laugh at (sorry, WITH) residents of HOAs. Hope your days are full of chuckles.
You know none of that is true, right?? 😂😂
And how many times did you VOTE for the corrupt system to be your master?? 😊😊
live in a farming area had a lady from the city try to start a HOA try to push her ideas/ways on us country folks . she didnt last too long in our town
I have a vague memory of something to do with this story a few months back. I remember that it was the the largest HOA in Florida, and I seem to remember that the HOA covered several communities. I'm glad the authorities didn't give this one the broom treatment.
My city almost feels like an hoa. All the rules and ordinances. The second the grass is 1/4" too tall, you get a notice saying cut it or we will and you pay the bill. Most hoa's I've seen are ran by people that would get ran out of office. Power trip individuals that love telling people what to do. I don't understand anyone who would want a home just to be told what to do with it.
My Mom's HOA was corrupt also. Not sure what exactly will happen but before leaving the Board several members voted this giant contract to this person who was NOT suitable to manage getting out of bed nevermind a decent sized HOA. They finaly got rid of her but it cost lawyer fees etc. Goes to show trust is over rated. There has to be checks and transparency
The situation in my Condo was the president kept wanting to buy up any unit he could. He wanted to create his own fiefdom.
Was his name brandon ?
I have never in my life seen an honest HOA. The one I was part of was exactly the same way.
I remember this story a few weeks ago HOA was even charging them the security vehicle gas fee even though security uses electric golf carts lol
I wonder if it's the HOA who refused to allow members into meetings to vote on rules and price hikes, even calling police to keep them out.
If you want to know a person's true nature, put them in a position of power!
Just make sure that removing them from said position of power is as easy as snapping a finger….
"money laundering is something with normally associate with drug cartels" and politicians, judges, police, bankers.......
Dont forget about Wall Street.
Most hollywood movies...
@@gorkyd7912 that too.
The difference between a drug cartel and an HOA cartel is that the drug cartel sells a tangible product.
Why would anyone want to move to a home with an HOA? If I own my own property, I will do as I see fit. HOAs are not for me!
I love it, I value a house in a HOA at 1 Dollar. Which is why I built my house on 5 acres in the country.
Your front door can be any color you choose?
Wait for the manure farm to open upwind.
@@rogersmith7396 That’s part of living in the country.
@@rogersmith7396 No manure farms it is not zoned for that type of operation. I am in a watershed area.
Around here the watersheds are where we throw all the poisons we don't want hanging around on our property. Where do you live Mass?@@kirkmorrison6131
I live in a rural area so it’s difficult for me to understand how a homeowner would pay a group of people to tell them what they can and cannot do with their own property.
The main purpose of an HOA is to maintain common property,
complicated developed lands (aka urban/suburban or high income/population dense) usually have extremely complicated laws for almost everything, but also specific enough laws that learning it doesnt actually help much in other cities so it's not worth it. There's also the question of what's enforced, what's taboo, etc in the area. I guess the ideal is the HOA leaders learn all that and more and are paid to do external housekeeping/general order/legal disputes that pop up inherently where a lot of people/money circulate. Say, helping subletters know how to evict dangerous people or planning residential meetings to discuss budgets or the local environment.
really, its pretty bad. its mostly sustained by the fact that they already exist and are power abusers with connections and money, which makes it much harder to say no when they show up to your house for their protection money and everyone else either left, paid, or were made an example of before you. As for entering a community like that, location is huge for people accustomed to living urban or suburban. you might need to add 10 or 30 minutes to your commute if you avoid an HOA since they can control a lot of neighborhoods. You might be told by a bunch of liars that the HOA is good or lied to about the contract your company sets you up with if you're getting accommodations from them. A lot of little tricks and inconveniences on people who cant really retaliate in a way that's not life altering compared to getting fucked for extra money.
Really? You've never been anywhere that's had a decent house next to a slum-like house w/trash everywhere? Seen it on tv? Heard about neighbor strife in the suburbs? I find that impossible to believe, lol.
@@techtutorvideos Yeah, I can read. Thanks.
@@purselmer5931 my neighbor to the north of me has about 50 acres and raises mules. My neighbor to the south of me has a couple of hundred acres and raises cattle. Across the road from me is all wooded and occupied by deer, bear, and other assorted woodland creatures. I don’t much care for city life, or suburban life either.
Woman: "How can you be so mean and heartless?"
Man: "You forget, my dear, I used to be an HOA board member."
Being a member of the HOA board of the tract we used to live in was one of the most thankless things I've ever done in my life. We also had a management firm and, given the stories we heard almost monthly, I would happily have paid them double what they charged.
The management firm taking the brunt of our neighbors' ire, but it was also the only time in my life I've been called a fascist (along with the rest of the unpaid board). One of the homeowners ignored the CC&Rs of the zero-lot-line tract -- 5-6' between houses, with each house having only one side yard, disconnected from its backyard -- which everyone who bought into the tract was required by their realtor to sign. They decided to enclose their entire front yard to the sidewalk with a solid 8' redwood fence without getting pre-approval, which would not have been granted: even their neighbors were opposed to it. Our management firm notified them after the work had just started, but they went ahead and completed it, then essentially said, "Yeah, what are you going to do about it?" I believe we had to get lawyers involved...and they eventually had to tear the fence down.
Two additional stories on how thankless being on the HOA was:
At an annual meeting, one irate owner yelled out he was was so mad, he would run for the board at the next month's election. A board member -- I think it may have been me -- told he not only was he welcome to run, most likely any of the current members of the board would happily resign or not run for re-election so the guy could run unopposed.
He never submitted his name or asked anyone to nominate him.
Our closest friends also lived in the tract, and after we'd sold and moved to a different tract -- one without an HOA, by the way -- one of them joined the board. A year or two later, they sold and moved to a bigger house a mile or two away, but the board was unable to find anyone to take over his spot on the board. I don't know if they changed the bylaws or took a vote of the homeowners to allow it, but our friend ended up remaining on the board an additional year or two after he was no longer an owner there.
I lived in a condo complex for about 13 years, i was actually on the board for several years. It was mostly retired knowledgeable people who managed everything very well. I remember when we painted all of the 58 buildings in complex with no raise in the fees because of how well it was managed. I moved from there 32 years ago but drive by it frequently and at 52 years old, looks good and is still kept up quite well.
58 buildings !!! RUN RUN RUN, I can smell the stench !! You know who paints our buildings, the owners !!
@@toriless we also gradually replaced the old skake roofs and put comps on all the buildings
Steve, could you look into a similar situation here in VA? Dogwood Valley Citizen's Association. RICO case tried in 2009, met all the criteria, but needed more hard evidence. Last I heard, Feds were looking into it, but it's been some time. Infrequent and undisclosed board meetings, all kinds of skulduggery, even peddling seats on the board for payment. It all started as basic extortion under threat of litigation. Basically collected road use fees, providing no road maintenance or services whatsoever, but then used the money to sue those who didn't pay when the roads fell apart.
They even sued citizens that worked on the roads themselves to stop them. One family in particular was targeted -- the Millers, who have been relentlessly targeted for their attempts to expose the fraud. And according to the language of the deeds of dedication, the HOA had no legal standing to exist. Last I heard, there were questions as to whether the subdivision properties were sold legally in the first place.
If you did it, you did it.
Even if you're put on trial and found not guilty.
If you did it, you did it.
We were looking to buy a home. As soon as we saw that the HOA fees were $960.00 monthly we walked away disgusted. No freaking way!
a wise choice
That's more than my mortgage was when I had one.
HOA's should never be allowed to exist. only ever hear horrible stories and nightmares, not a single good story that couldnt have been accomplished without one. if HOA's continue to exist there needs to be federal laws limiting how much they can charge and severely limiting what they are allowed to do. nobody should be allowed to charge you money on a home you own, other than the people you owe money to on loans/mortgage
Tell that to the municipality that taxes your property.
You should hear horror stories where no HOA
@@saraf9081They are still better then HOA’s.
No one screams on the public internets about how it's so nice that the streets are clean and there's plenty of parking and all the homes look nice. There's a serious selection bias in your comment. HOAs proliferate because people are tired of living where someone's rusty work truck drips oil all over the road on a daily basis and where you can't keep a nice lawn because of all the weeds popping up due to the weed factory down the street. HOAs proliferate because "do what you want it's your house" means that the house across the way is a meth lab. No one talks about the reasons people want HOAs because people mostly only talk when they are angry about something. So you hear all the downsides. But if there were no upsides there would be no HOAs.
Who was actually writing the checks? It’s usually the management staff. If so, it sounds like they may be complicit. Also, there should have been audits performed every year and annual reports published. I managed six associations and we used to complain about how tight they were with money. Steve’s description of his experience serving on a HOA board of directors is exactly the way things should run.
Sounds like they had NO management service.
Your HOA board experience sounds pretty much exactly like mine: boring budget concerns, repairs and maintenance, asshole renters, people behind on their dues, and keeping the reserve fund up to legally required levels.
Since we weren't made of money most of the long-term projects were longer term than many people wanted, but they also weren't willing to just cough up the cash needed to do it right now. But hey, stick around for another decade and see how much progress has been made.
This is my current situation right now as well. I got on the HOA board so it wasnt dissolved - we're fixing things, but insurance hit us hard in Florida - and people are upset that their dues are going up (so is mine, I'm not exempt) and we pulled out the numbers for what their mortgage company will charge them compared to what the dues will happen and that got them quiet.
But some of these people think I'm a paid employee and try to treat me like poo - when I am volunteering my time to try and help keep the community clean and properly funded.
I am a homeowner as well - so the dues hit me just as hard as everybody else.
@@Nowyn Insurance costs are a real driver for things getting done "right now" or "nope, not gonna' happen." Yes, you WILL fix the equipment on the play area, or remove it, to reduce liability for injuries, and no, you WON'T be building a pool since it's an attractive nuisance that attracts kids from all over." Because a kid with a broken arm costs a lot less than the lawsuit for a dead one that climbed the fence after dark.
One of our biggest problems was when a new development went in adjacent to mine the real estate agents advertised my HOA's play and picnic area as "open to the public." It took the threat of a lawsuit a couple years later for their HOA to tell people to knock it off and get their asshole delinquent teenagers under control.
My short time on an HOA board was like this too. It was a building with commercial and residential units. The most pressing issue was increasing the reserve fund, as there were some maintenance items that had been deferred too long and would need to be addressed soon.
I got a glimpse of a far different condo board once at work (commercial building). I was once asked to represent my boss at a board meeting when he was out of town, and it was full of drama.
Steve Lehto; it is a pleasure to listen to your podcast here on TH-cam. I'm listening from TAMPA BAY FLORIDA ,USA🇺🇸 I feel that I can belive what you say is true with no reason for doubt. GOD Bless You.
This has been going on forever with an HOA I am familiar with because the people who stole the positions on the board are totally ignorant that there are laws regarding boards These ignorant individuals have been abusing the funds for years by committing similar infractions and unscrupulous practices for years.
Probably
Find neighbors that dislike the HOA, get the majority elected in, then move to dissolve the HOA.
BEST headline I've seen in a while!
After being scammed out of millions of dollars if I was a resident I think I would lean towards dissolving the HOA.
One member at a time. In acid. Oh, not that kind of dissolving?
I've been seeing lots of HOA horror stories, especially what it pertains to people who refuse to join. It really reminds me of mob tactics, "something terrible might happen if you don't join". You think anyone will eventually look into this, because too many of them are operating like a mafia
All HOAs should be abolished for racketeering.
Bigger HOA’s tend to have better boards just because there will be more board volunteers/candidates to choose from, and some will know the trades, some will know contracts, some will understand accounting, and some will know many in the community. I was in one with 300 units, and we also had excellent management advice which we were big enough to afford. They had accumulated the largest reserves in Los Angeles County and paid cash for many Loma Prieta earthquake repairs without having to make emergency assessments. In smaller HOA’s it can be difficult to fill all positions and reach quorum. The battles are usually the same: litter/trash, those seeking more security vs. the gate-proppers, the nonconformists vs the rule-followers, pets, and noise.
That said, I still prefer not to commit to be in an HOA, but I have managed to avoid a city government, too: I’m in unincorporated county. It’s great! They can certainly still run county budgets into the ground, but I’m better protected from actions that could deprive me of home ownership and value.
Why would an HOA in Los Angeles County be paying for earthquake repairs in the San Francisco Bay area hundreds of miles away? The Loma Prieta earthquake did not damage a single thing in Los Angeles County.
@@EXROBOWIDOW GREAT CATCH! I'm from the bay area and was living in West Hollywood for the so-called Northridge Quake. I meant that one (centered in Canoga Park or somewhere nearby, I believe). All our HVAC equipment on the roofs were rocked off their platforms and we had one stairwell collapse and some broken windows. It was so long ago I switched my geography.
As I often post on these HOA stories, there are a handful of laws constraining HOAs that could be passed that would prevent 90%+ of the problems of HOAs.
1) Remove the HOA's ability to foreclose on properties for non-payment of fees and/or fines. (only allow the HOA to place a lien on the property that can be collected when the home is sold).
2) Limit the total amount that HOA's are allowed to assess against a home owner in fines to 10% of the home's property tax assessed value.
3) Limit their ability to assess fines to only 1% of the property's assessed value per month (none of this $1000 a day crap).
4) Outlaw HOA restrictions against solar (and other "green" energy technologies).
5) Outlaw HOA restrictions against display of political, religious flags and signs (or holiday decorations).
6) All HOA charters must include provisions to allow the members of the HOA to dissolve the HOA without permission or cooperation from the HOA board.
I'm sure there's more that could be added to this list, but I wanted to keep things to the bare essentials. (I'd like to add a provision to the law that says if any HOA board member or official is ever caught doing something illegal that they are required to sell their home and the proceeds are divided among the HOA members, but that would be a hard one to get passed).
I would vote for legislation like this in a heartbeat. Another thing that needs to be outlawed is special assessments for known maintenance items. E.g. the HOA cannot issue a special assessment for a roof replacement due to age. It's a maintenance item with a known lifespan. A properly run HOA will have the cash in the bank from funds collected over the 20-30 year lifespan of the old roof to simply cut the check for a new one.
A good friend of mine has lived in a few HOAs. When looking at property in an HOA they demand copies of third-party audited financials for the past 10 years. Most HOAs don't have those, and the ones that do won't turn them over. When they encounter an HOA willing to turn them over to a prospective member things are generally on the level and they'll consider buying into it.
I'm pretty sure #4 is already a nationwide law. People have rights to install solar even if an HOA objects.
None of your other ideas are based in reality. Condos need HOAs. Single family dwellings, not so much.
@@jblyon2 I'm not sure about the roof issue. I just sold a condo in a complex that was very old. Roofs lasted 40 years and seems they all went about the same time. When a new roof was needed, a fairly nominal special assessment was passed. The complex was huge and everything else well maintained. I see your point though. (One thing that did chap my hide was that the management company used a fly-by-night company to replace our roof in '19 and "didn't know" if there was even a warranty on it. We voted that management company OUT very soon afterwards.)
@@KabobHope I should be clear that I am differentiating between home owner's associations and condo associations.
As for solar rights, those are state by state. Here in KS its HOAs are allowed to ban solar panels (was a huge dust up over this on Nextdoor in the HOA controlled community just north of my free neighborhood so I'm pretty sure my info on that is current).
I would agree that single family home neighborhoods really shouldn't have HOAs (unless there is some community property like a pool or gates and guard shacks that needs to be paid for).
@@KabobHope You are incorrect. Certain states have passed laws or had court rulings overriding HOA restrictions on solar, but there is no national protection.
If you purposely move into an hoa community, you have agreed to be bent over.
HOA fees should be used to issue lifetime supply of asstroglide to every resident.
Should be illegal, or voluntary. Very simple.
I think you're missing the point for some of this. Housing is not cheap - and its only getting worse. I bought in 2018 for 145k - these are now up to 210k. So trying to find a single family home in an area that doesnt have an HOA is getting harder and harder and more expensive. Sometimes you have to settle for what you can get if you want to own and build equity.
....backwards and forward.
Your comments about your condo board reminded me about the tax revenue and budget reports that the library board I was a member of would receive. We had yearly audits by an out side accountant to make sure our budget was inline with all revenue.
HOA members often have had no powers their entire lives and quickly become corrupt and power hungry once on the board. My mother and all neighbors fell victim to this in a vacation resort setting in WI. Head member took out 9 credit cards in the name of the entire private community and not caught until over $750K was run upon the credit cards all spent personally
Just do not say all as some other people have done, for either entity
@@torilessall what? HOAs? They shouldn't exist
This sounds familiar. We had a sudden, hidden 80% jump in our fees, for what seems like no reason (we had a surplus). We went in in January, and paid the amount it said we owed, and had a $0 balance. Next thing we know, we get a letter, threatening us for non payment. The non-payment was for the 80% increase, which we (and others) knew NOTHING about!
I’ve done several subdivisions, and I set up the recorded restrictions before the first sale was made.
After everything was sold, the subdivision was then in the hands of the different property owners. No HOA.
Giving them the restrictions when they first purchased, assured them that I was not going to come back and try to change things up.
They were in effect beneficiaries of the safe guarding restrictions which they all had signed with their purchase papers.
That’s the truth Steve, the money itself attracts the scoundrels.
I have a story of outrageous behaviour from a board member in my building. We have external walkways where the steel support structure has started to rust away. At the AGMs the meeting won't approve the funds to fix the problem, so this guy has been spending his spare time to do it personally by hand himself for nothing!!
Doing it himself after work because the rest of the owners are willing to see it collapse rather than spend any money is appalling! The power trips some board members get on is beyond words.
Likely the board members have never had a job that was a position of power and responsibility. They don't know what they're doing.
@Rhaspun That is why most HOAs use a management company to advise them and conduct the routine administrative functions. The HOA board acts as a board of directors that exercises oversight, both of the management of the management company, and enforcement of bylaws.
I had the opposite, my deck rails were fine but some other units were rotting. Rather than fix failing rails they forced every unit to have them replace. The cost was a rip-off too. It would have cost half a much for me to hire someone but that was not an option. I bet the company was doing some private kickback to a board member. I hate condos.
@@Rhaspun He knows what he is doing, he works in the trades. The problem is not him, it is the owners not approving necessary work because they don't want to spend money.
@@toriless They have to maintain uniformity or the building looks like shit and it reduces everyones property value. Depending on the types of rails and if they can be sourced or not, you cant replace some railings and not others. They all have to be done if there is extensive damage.
Condo boards will look at the contractor reputation as well as the quote. They are not going to risk a half assed job just to save a few bucks, penny wise pound foolish is a real thing. Also, just because YOU could do something cheaper, or know friends who can do things cheaper does not mean that is a normal situation, because that would involve the work being done for no profit. Contractor companies on the other hand DO work for profit, so they will cost more than a friend of a friend doing you a favor.