Science Will Never Know Consciousness: Rupert Spira
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 30 พ.ค. 2018
- www.scienceandnonduality.com
Rupert Spira has earned a reputation as a master and clarifier of the nature of consciousness. In this short talk he uses two powerful analogies to bring light to the age-old enigma of mind attempting to investigate its own nature. His conclusion: It is consciousness alone that knows consciousness. Mind cannot know its own essence. There will never be a science of consciousness.
For more information visit www.rupertspira.com.
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Rupert's clarity is flawless, I learn so much, bless him. About the mind in the dream state, it kind of gives away a subtle clue as to the nature of this universe.The nature and play of consciousness as trinity, i.e. seer/seeing/seen or knower/knowing/known, is most clearly evidenced in an obvious way through dreaming. It is the dreamer (seer)that does the dreaming (seeing) the dream (seen). Being the subject, the object and the medium all in one and in a very convincing way at that. I would say a clue to wake up...
Indeed, a subtle clue 😊👍👍👍🕊🍀
beautiful 🙏🏾
All these so called scientists out there are actually very unscientific when it comes to their takes on consciousness, it’s really annoying listening to them talk about a subject they really haven’t got any knowledge in, Rupert is a scientist truly, a scientist of consciousness.
Equilibrium consciousness is an epiphenomenon to aid in survival for living organisms
Simone De Filippo no it is not
Simone De Filippo I do not know if the laws of nature(the four fundamental forces) exist outside of space/time, but all you need are electromagnetic/nuclear strong & weak and gravity. I have had this discussion many times. I am a realist. The planets do EXIST without measurements, we are just not smart enough to grasp this without measurement. Give Lee Smolin a check, he's far smarter than me. Also some neurologist, split brain patients, corpus callosum cut, two consciousnesses, epi...... Have a great day my friend.
@@darren.davies3957 This is the dogma "scientists" preach: yes. Rubert turns that dogma on its head.
"So-called scientists"? Lose your high horse. There is a reason science uses empiricism. It's the most reliable tool so far. Anything else is at best speculation, at worst insanity.
If you think Rupert has found the truth through meditation, you might be right, and you might be wrong.
If you believe it without reserve, you begin to sound like the DMT fanatics, who never question the reality of the world they experience under the drug. I never heard Terrence McKenna acknowledge "it seems very real but maybe it's just the drug".
And if it's indeed the absolute truth, and you can only find it through such a subjective endeavor, you can't ridicule science for failing. Science is all about objectivity. Science has moved our asses to the Moon, instead of just keeping them on a cushion in a meditation hall.
Science is knowledge and knowledge comes from consciousness, For it is by consciousness that everything becomes known. The scientist is the knower. This is an awesome subject!
அபிலாஷ் வாஸுதேவன் WHAAAAAAAATTTT?!?😛
Excellent!
I would have fallen asleep if not for the sound of his dry mouth begging for water. My own essence calls for me to turn the dry mouth whisperer off before I scream.
Ahh, that's funny! I sped this video to 2x. That helps with the slow advancement of content, as well as distorting his voice to the point the dryness is no longer recognizable. c:
He *IS*.
This so called Rupert slices through ignorance and separation. Thank you!
U.G. Krishnamurti said this prior to 1980 in the video "All goals must go" @ ~ 29:00. No seat of human consciousness and science can try but they will never find it.
Indeed, but they can't avoid it 😁
Mind blowing! 🙏😔
💟 Another Priceless Jewel ☺️Thank You for sharing Rupert🙏
MASTER OF REALITY, Thank you...OM..................
Interested to see you studied pottery at Farnham with Henry Hammond. He and Paul Barron shared a pottery and kiln in the old farm outbuildings of my parents home outside Farnham after the war. I knew Hammond well as a boy.
No one alive today says it as completely and consistently as Rupert. Good talk.
"And the world is very obliging, it appears in accordance with whatever we believe about it"
What's he been smoking, and where can I get it?
Subtitles please.
generous, scientific, aesthetic, poet, passionate, alive .... Rupert, we are ONE. I m blessed, so you are.
I posted this under one of Rupert's videos already. I want to pose it here too. I have a question to you guys. My Psychology Professor said that there
is nothing mystical about these teachings and that what these teachers
are really talking about when referring to GOD is the hypothalamus and
other brain regions setting up tension (thus initiating the seeking of
food sex or sleep) and then alleviating that tension through
establishing homeostasis. In this model, what these teachers have
learned is to shortcut this mechanism and engage homeostasis directly by
jumping off the tension that the brain initiates early enough.
I have to say that this is the most logical scientific explanation yet. I
Still trust Rupert that this is indeed more profound than a brain
mechanism. However I Would love him to reply to this proposal. It would
be in line with the fact that he said that all the seperate Self is ever
looking for in experiences like Chocolate binging or sex or fill in the
blank is the letting go of the seperate self. In scientific terms this
would be a brain mechanism leading to a brain/body state called
homeostasis. .. Then again it may be that hoeostasis is just the vehicle
of the knowing oneself as THAT, and not IT itself. Just a messenger to
the body that something right has happened. I don't know.
Hi Kili!
It seems to me that your professor is refering to relaxation exercises and tecniques and that he's not refering to consciousness.
What is his/her explaination to consciousness?
What is consciousness? :)
This is the key, I find. :)
You can share more if you feel like.
🙏🏽❤
If these things aren't that mystical and simply physical then don't you think this so called Consciousness can be manipulated. Because if your professor is equating this consciousness with hypothalamus then it's just a part of the body and like every other physical object this part can also be manipulated.
If that is the case, like if it is within the reach of science then science can definitely instill consciousness in a dead body. But there's definitely something which is still unknown and I don't think it's merely a physical entity.
Love Rupert. I agree. However, there is maybe some semantics here. Materialist science will never understand or know consciousness. But, I would say the Vedas are a science of consciousness. Science means to "know" or knowing. Certainly consciousness knows itself.
It's true for most, their "you in the dream" is not aware it's also the dreamer of its dream. However, there are lucid dreamers that simultaneously know they are in a dream and are the dreamer of the dream. Can a better science understand this phenomena? Yes.
Now, regarding our waking human lives, can we be in this "dream of life" (finite consciousness) and simultaneously know we are also the Dreamer (infinite consciousness) of our dream of life? Yes. Call it "lucid living" if you want.
In fact, Rupert does it. Many do it. Probably most at the conference do it or want to do it more. That's good.
Can we "know" this phenomena of "lucid living", a science of consciousness? Yes we can. 🙏🏽
John Browne
If it's not based on empirical evidence, it's not science.
Yes. Experience is the ultimate test. All I see is Gods face.
Thats what it said
Its in the foot
He is incredible!!!! It is so true!!! Thank you!
.........Beyond Action Packed. (:>)
If this is all a dream, does science have any validity?
Is there any objective reality 'out there'?
I obviously think so, or I wouldn't be commenting.
The world has to be in existence, and the physical laws must work for making that happen or there is no logical consistency.
Maybe I dreamed this vlog.
Is reality and science just something we agreed to but isn't necessarily so?
Has science gone about as far as it can go?
To recognize that consciousness plays a role but no more than that?
...strangely enough, the eye can ONLY see itself when placed in front of a mirror. The mind becomes that mirror that reflects its own essence. Without the mind consciousness doesn't know that it knows...The mind ponders its essence and this leads to the realization of consciousness or pure knowing.
jfhow
I also "dreamed" this vlog. So maybe it's objectively real, beyond our subjective perception.
@@glynemartinconsciousness doesnt need a mind to know itself. It needs the mind to know a world. Consciousness knows itself by being itself.
No there's nothing out there at all. But understand you too are one of the things appearing to be "out there" when you aren't.
Existence is utterly fucking insane and tbh can be frightening to really consider.
Heck ya
is the speaker's manner & speech pattern authentic?
Cameron G I find him more a professor than a spiritual sage or zen teacher.
Hedgerow hi. ive watched him since in an interview and can see his manner & intonation on this video is a contrivance. its sad that someone who claims to be so enlightened doesn't teach authenticity by example
Yes he usually talks like this, but often is answering questions not giving speeches.
🙏🙏🙏
There is already a science of consciousness. Thomas Campbell has written 3 books about consciousness that gives an explanation of the nature of reality beyond your imagination.
He used intellect to write his book, and to do risk analysis for NASA, but his experiences in consciousness are from his experience. It is unusual to have a physicist who is also a consciousness researcher, both for 40 + years. He was the TC in Robert Monroe's Far Journey. He has unified Quantum theory with Relativity creating a TOE that places consciousness as fundamental. Good news for those who know that there is more to this reality than the physical.
Emerson Schindel
I spit on detractors of intellect. Didn't Dogen use intellect to write the Shobogenzo?
Amazing,
A sage , my pranams to this great guru
Pitch perfect Rupert...!!
Rupert..the baddest of all bad-asses...
Is it to try to find a scientific - mathematical language that takes consciousness into account an useless effort?
Thanks ....
We already have neurology and psychiatry and psychology. Do we need quackery on top of all this?
Why does it do this? The answer: That's just the way it is.
Penrose - consciousness is not a computation. See his videos and discussion. He also admits he does not know.
Amen
I cannot deny what he says and I can't prove he's wrong, but can anyone tell me why it has to be that way?
Why isn't conciousness an experience that is created as an effect of a huge network of communicating neurons in our brain?
Why isn't that enough of an explanation?
What other experience is there that reveals that conciousness is something above matter and not something created by matter?
Why are all of us a sort of dream of this one conciousness?
I don't see any reason why it needs to be so.
It sounds plausible, but is it necessary?
Also this raises some other questions: for example: why should we be nice to others if it's only just a sort of dream?
I can understand this way of thinking is kind of comforting to people who have suffered a lot, but what does it mean objectively?
The way that I see it is that I am afraid to die, to cease existing. It's this conciousness over matter story that gives me hope that some part of me will continue after I pass.
You are Consciousness 1 (logic and modern science):
P1. Only one substance can exist --- Due to the interaction problem
P2. Consciousness exist --- Gross perceptual appearances (aka matter) and subtle perceptual appearances (aka mind ) exist in Consciousness and hence can not be a different substance
C. Only Consciousness exist
The interaction problem demonstrate that two ontologically different substances can not logically exist. Hence only matter or Consciousness can exist. And since matter is never experienced (we experience Consciousness and perception), Consciousness is logically the only existing "substance", and gross and subtle objects logically have to be forms or modes of Consciousness. Due to the fact that Consciousness has no mass or extension in space; It has no borders, no limits and can not change. Hence Consciousness can not be a spacetime object. This means that Consciousness is dimensionless. And who are you that is conscious of Consciousness..? Correct. You are Consciousness. Can you die..?
You are Consciousness 2 (direct experience):
1. Are you conscious of the world?
2. Are you conscious of a thought in the mind?
3. Are you conscious of a sensation in the body?
4. Are you conscious of being conscious?
You will be able to answer "yes" to every question. Question 1-3 relates to "objects" with objective qualities. Question 4 relates to the "subject", but yet your answer is "yes". In other words: Consciousness is conscious of Itself. And "you" are this Consciousness. No body or mind is involved in this direct experience. Can you die..?
Midiwave Productions
I am trying your experiment, but there is something that keeps telling me that all of this is futile:
When I had a full anaesthetic for a minor operation a few years ago there was no experience at all. There was no blackness, no emptiness, just nothing at all. At least there is no memory of any experience.
In other words, by temporarily disabling parts of the brain conciousness ceased to be there. As you can see, this is where the story ends for me.
"by temporarily disabling parts of the brain consciousness ceased to be there"...I think not. This is a subject of current research in anesthesia. Clearly, the autonomic nervous system remained engaged even if you had no memory or recall of your state. Again, the part that you allude to as consciousness appears to be sense perception alone. You can be aware of your heart beat for example, but not in a true sense where by you can be sure of what your heart is doing right now (chemically, electrically and structurally). You have no consciousness of those facts, yet you know consciousness is there without your "awareness" so to speak. This is just to indicate that the body-mind-sense organ model is not the final frontier after all.
Wouter. There is no loss of consciousness during coma, deep sleep or anesthesia: www.sciencealert.com/your-consciousness-does-not-switch-off-during-a-dreamless-sleep-say-scientists
Midiwave Productions
If a tree falls in a forest with no one to experience it, it's still a tree falling.
Rupert Spira- the most bad ass non duality teacher on the circuit! Come at him Materialists, I dare you!
Phoenix Rising nonsense, consciousness is an epiphenomenon, anyone who studies the brain with an open mind!! And the universe is finite, so where is this infinite consciousness, rubbish
19.25
"what we call the world is not what we see ,it is the way we see,and we are free at every moment to see the world in accordance with limitations of our own mind or to see the world as an expression of objectivazation of the essence of each of our minds.."
We are FREE??????? WE who?
Mind is part of the total functioning of manifest Consciousness how the hell can it be free???
We see the world as we can see it. The world is as it should be. When it’s time to be some other way, then it will be.
After having written this, feel like posting this Nisargadatta's statement.
"The witness is that which says 'I know'. The person says 'I do'. Now, to say 'I know' is not untrue-it is merely limited. But to say 'I do' is altogether false, because there is nobody who
does; all happens by itself, including the idea of being a doer."
All happens by itself including the idea of having a choice to see the world the"right" way..
The content is great! His delivery is stiff and stilted.
He is precise. Maybe he loves being stilted :)
Or maybe public speaking is just not his forte.
His delivery is peaceful instead of the more familiar theatrics of other teachers.
your delivery could use a little work.
He’s refreshing change from all the screeching Americans
It's about time to realize that NonDuality has been overtaken by science. Tom Campbell explains all about consciousness NonDuality is not aware of. All the people studying NonDuality are better of with Toms theorie of everything. His work is mind-blowing and if you really understand what he proclaims your life will never be the same. I did what Tom advised: don't believe anything I say; just meditate and see what happens. After 3 months of meditating I had the first encounter with nonphysical entities and out of body experiences. Two entities are always with me. I think they are interfaces of The Larger Consciousness System because they really support me. Transcend NonDuality [from philosophy to science].
Advaita vedanta aka non dualism has been taught for centuries and by those who have actually realized it. I assure you that no one will be discussing Tom Campbell's views on non duality decades from now let alone centuries.
Tom Campbell has no experience of consciousness other then the ordinary waking state.....he has no experience of higher state of consciousnesses,hence his theories are mostly speculative lacking in direct experience....!!... explaining a different state of consciousness to someone who hasn't wld obviously seem like woo-woo....!!...
Science is an illusion of knowledge .
Two awakened teachers giving satsang on Kundalini this June 30 2018. Heres the link:
www.rasatransmissioninternational.com/events
Listening to all these soft spoken soy boys of spirituality and Consciousness makes me sad that they are the leading edge of research
Oh yes they are...research into consciousness...as opposed to dead, lifeless, fleshy-grey-brain matter....which is the exclusive domain of the ignoramus(es) of materialism... *:-)*
Glyne Martin
The need to ridicule someone with a different POV is proof of a small petty ego.
just wanted to say "soft spoken soy boys" did we?
it's easy to intuit the rage buried this guy's arrogance
Frank. He is claiming that 1. Consciousness is the only real substance, and 2. "Matter" does not exist. Both claims are true.
You can assert whatever you like. There is no evidence for the claim, however.
Consciousness is self-evident, and in order to find "matter" --- an ontologically substance outside Consciousness --- we have to be able to exist outside Consciousness, which of course is not possible.
That's your proof??? Hahaha. Have a lovely evening.
The definition of the term evidence is "the available body of facts or information indicating whether a belief or proposition is true or valid". The proposition that Consciousness exists is self-evidently true. Because we are conscious. Right..? But there is no evidence in support of the proposition that matter exists, since matter is defined as a substance outside Consciousness. And it is not possible to know anything about what is going on outside Consciouness. Right..?
In other words: Anyone claiming that Consciousness does not exist or that "matter" does exist is denying the evidence from experience, logic and science:
1. Experience: We experience Consciousness and we do not experience "matter".
2. Logic:
A: We realize that it is not logically possible for materialistic science to find materialistic evidence for the existence of Consciousness, since Consciousness is not a materialistic object.
B: We also realize that we do not logically need evidence from materialistic science since the existence of Consciousness --- even though it is not a materialistic object --- is self-evident.
C: We realize that it is not logically possible for materialistic science to find evidence for the existence of "matter", since "matter" --- an ontologically real substance outside Consciousness --- can not be found.
D: We also realize that we logically can not and do not experience "matter", but sensation and perception.
3. Materialistic science: Materialistic science can not find any evidence for "matter" or Consciousness. Hence materialistic science has nothing to say on this particular subject.
4. Non-materialistic science: Non-materialistic science can provide evidence for the causal power of Consciousness and the non-local, non-spacetime nature of Consciousness.
This guy may be exceptionally intelligent but his communication style is terrible.
God is terrifyingly large
bla bla bla
...so you finally did not get it...at all...
Wow the intellectuality just oozes from you
@@clairejohnson7809 are you drowning?? 😆
He's lost it. Bonkers.
I posted this under one of Rupert's videos already. I want to pose it here too. I have a question to you guys. My Psychology Professor said that there
is nothing mystical about these teachings and that what these teachers
are really talking about when referring to GOD is the hypothalamus and
other brain regions setting up tension (thus initiating the seeking of
food sex or sleep) and then alleviating that tension through
establishing homeostasis. In this model, what these teachers have
learned is to shortcut this mechanism and engage homeostasis directly by
jumping off the tension that the brain initiates early enough.
I have to say that this is the most logical scientific explanation yet. I
Still trust Rupert that this is indeed more profound than a brain
mechanism. However I Would love him to reply to this proposal. It would
be in line with the fact that he said that all the seperate Self is ever
looking for in experiences like Chocolate binging or sex or fill in the
blank is the letting go of the seperate self. In scientific terms this
would be a brain mechanism leading to a brain/body state called
homeostasis. .. Then again it may be that hoeostasis is just the vehicle
of the knowing oneself as THAT, and not IT itself. Just a messenger to
the body that something right has happened. I don't know.
Isn't the need to believe an attachment?
@@edgepixel8467 It is important when it comes to death. If you jump off of identification with your personality and identify with that large room, the difference is that out of that there will emerge occasional feelings of trust and thoughts of trust that this is indeed the aspect of yourself that doesn't die. PEople keep trying to tell me that this is not important. It is important. And no, not just to the ego.
Kili Fischkopp
It can be useful, certainly, but is it true? There's value in anything that helps us live with sanity and enjoyment. Even if it's just a noble lie.
The problem is, when you suspect a placebo is a placebo, it won't work anymore.
On the other hand, if we're going to die why not simply accept that fact, without the need to tell ourselves pacifing fairytales with consciousness this, consciousness that?
@@edgepixel8467 Yes true. Just that 9/10 of these teachers don't seem to look at it that way. If they did, they would deemphasize this point. Instead they confront scientists with the issue, again and again. Spira, Tolle, even Ajahn Brahm, a now monk prior Cambridge Physicist ! He says scientists ''know everythingbut understand very little".
Kili Fischkopp
I am a meditation practitioner myself. I've had some experiences too. But do I diss scientists? No. Be an inquirer, not a zealot, I say.
If a person is truly enlightened they would have a more humble attitude I think. "Science has its shtick and I have mine, there's need for both."
But you stand to gain both dough and esteem from books and sycophants I guess it gets harder.