MiG definitely has the same issue, the main difference is mig vertical up is far harder than 6010 up. I need to do a video just on mig vertical up since that’s quite tough and I could use the practice lol.
The astounding thing is that you were in your 99 degree shop for the purpose of teaching us something. And on a Sunday too! How many high school teachers or college professors would put up with the slightest discomfort in order to teach? The ones I know, and I know several, wouldn't even think of teaching in a 99 degree classroom. And that's in spite of their high pay. On a different note, I just watched your introductory video on tig welding aluminum that you posted a year ago. Good stuff! I've got some aluminum that's perfect for practicing on, so I'll get to it!
Thanks for the kind words 😀. It’s was no BS hot in the tin shed. I was filming from 9 am to 6pm at 100+. Believe it or not I can handle the heat ok, but the electronics can’t. Even with a fan to cool the camera down it would still shut down after 5 min. I was going to do another vertical up test plate and nail the uphill welds but it would have taken a ton of time and I still had 3 other videos to shoot. Luckily the cut and etch proved exactly what I had hoped. When I have my mind set on something I do it. The hardest part is getting started. I have had days where it took me 4 hours of sitting just to get going on something. Once I started things got rolling. It’s not easy but paying no attention to the heat, the workload, or anything that might instill doubt, and just starting it how things get done 😀. I also want to keep everyone motivated with some new content 😀
as Columbo used to say, 'One More Thing'... I have found that 3/32 6010 tends to dig in more, and cause undercut and burn through than 1/8 6010, this is probably due to the wider arc cone.....I used to repair tubular iron fence and gate, some by swimming pools with lots of chlorine corrosion [ a real pain] I recently had to repair an exhaust on a genset [pipe had rubbed on a bracket and worn through] on a Motorhome..... thin wall for sure, 'I was using my ESAB MiniArc Rogue 180 and had the Dig set on 0 and the hot start on 0, too hot.....so I bumped down to -10 and -10 , save the day and gave a great looking weld to boot....those little ESAB inverters are nice......Cheers, Paul
i have the same machine and i definitely agree with the digging of 3/32. i run 3/32 at anywhere from 50-65 amps and i can run the 1/8 from 65-100. if its really thin material, ill just pick up the 1/8 5p 6010 and run it on 65-70 amps with the hotstart on 2 and the arc force on 5 and it seems to run nicely
No bs it was so hot in the tin shed my camera shut down every 5min of filming. I didn’t give up by the equipment couldn’t handle it. Even the microphone had some glitches due to the heat. Should have cooked dinner on the welding table 😅
@@makingmistakeswithgreg Wow! The temperature in your shop was no joke! I was doing some welding in the mid 90's this last week in my shop, but 99 degrees is much tougher. Each degree makes a big difference. I would assume this kind of heat is (or was!) unusual for Milwaukee. I hope it cools off soon.
Greg, congrats on reaching 25K subs! Good work, my friend. I'm still welding almost every afternoon and the heat is living hell here too. I have been following the guidelines you show in your playlists and am still seeing gradual improvement. Below is something I learned that might benefit you in some situations. If you recall, we were having problems with slag inclusions when running 6013, mostly at the start of the weld bead. It took months, but I finally overcame most of that. This one simple tip will make a world of difference: Take a small piece of scrap plate and keep it within arm's reach on your table, and just before you are about ready to strike an arc and weld, reach over with the rod and drag it across the scrap plate a few times (a second or so each time). You will probably notice that it sputters for a few seconds then runs smooth. After that, you're home free. Now just strike up on your real base metal and it will run right, without that big wad of slag trying to outrace the weld pool. Do this with each new rod, even on tie-ins. I think it "preheats" the rod or something, but it works. Give it a try and see if it helps you too.
What you described is done on heavy plate welding, they basically attach “run on and run off” tabs so you start/stop on them so the weld that’s on what needs to be welded is 100% clean. On less critical work doing what you describe or just arcing off the table/plate close and bringing the arc onto what you’re welding will work too. Just avoid leaving arc strikes on the plates that don’t get welded over 😀. Glad to hear you’re slowly making progress. Steady practice and focusing on being consistent is what will lead you to develop the skill.
6010 can make good looking welds in any position, you just have to be robot steady and know exactly what you're doing. I haven't been either of those in quite a while
In my opinion/expirence. 6010 downhill is best suited for open root usage. I welded a fair amount of 6010/7010 pipe downhill, and I'm familiar with uphill 6010/7018. Downhill with an open root is faster and just as good. But the moment you don't have a gap in the fitup, this is what we get.
love your content,man! Where do you keep coming up with ideas? I really enjoy the style of delivery. Also,6010 should never be put in an oven-it requires 3-7% moisture content in the flux to run right,once it catches fire throw the rod out and grab a new one. We would even dip them in water before lighting up
I have a list of over 100 ideas and randomly pick one when I don’t know what to cover lol. The more I plan the harder it is to get things done lol. Great tip on the 6010 and no oven, you are 100% correct. 6010s run real rough when they are baked out and even change how they run as the rod burns down. I have dipped rods in water before when they ran poorly and it definitely makes a difference lol.
If you can run a decent bead with other rods but not 6010 try to slow your travel speed significantly and be as consistent as possible. If you move as fast as you forward as any other rod it basically just undercuts the steel. The puddle so fast any movement is captured, so you must be consistent to weld decent with it. Even for me vertical up with a poor prop/hand rest and slightly wrong settings produces less than stellar results. Very little wiggle room before you get undercut lol.
On a beveled pipe with an open root the downhill would definitely work far better than a fillet weld. Part of the issue with a fillet weld is the angle you have forces you to weld through more weld pool metal than on beveled plates or on many other joints. I think I can get slightly more root fusion running downhill, I will do a part two soon 😀
These videos are awesome! If your welding something thats just gonna sit out in the weather can you just leave the slag on the weld? Will it effect the weld at all?
You can leave it on, but if you paint over it the paint will come off with the slag eventually. The weld will rust without being coated but that’s not a big deal. 6010 welds in field on rusty material tend to not be fully cleaned and left.
Hey Greg are up like near Milwaukee? That's a long drive from me, but I do HVAC work down here in Podunk, IN; and if I had the time, I wouldn't mind seeing if I could maybe install some air conditioning in your tin shed. Would make it a lot more enjoyable to work in. Maybe sometime like a 12K btu mini split, those don't need much power, and can run on a 120v 15 amp breaker.
I have a bunch of tig videos I am editing and will roll out soon. I had such a backlog of videos I had to edit and get through it took way longer than I wanted. 😀
I always learn something, sometimes a lot from your videos. It's amazing what you can learn from cutting and etching. What do you use for etching? Thanks. Well done.
Thanks and I am glad you have learned a bunch. To cut at etch the trick is to get a decent surface finish first. I use green rolloc discs but even a normal flap disc can do a ok job. Once the surface is consistent you take an acid and rub it on the area. I use naval jelly rust dissolver because it’s cheap and available everywhere. It works really good if the material is a bit warm.
@@makingmistakeswithgreg Thanks. I saw the Naval Jelly in the bottle on the table and wondered what it was for. That makes a nice safe etching solution. And it's readily available. I see some cutting and etching in my future this coming winter shop season.
That's right. That's one of the reasons 6010 works well for running open roots because it gives you a much larger degree of control in terms of your heat input, letting you whip in and out of the puddle to stay consistent, i.e. letting the puddle solidify quickly when you whip out of it.
As was mentioned 6010 offers the ability to bridge gaps in a fast manner that would be otherwise impossible to do with normal rods. It’s common for me to bridge a 1/4inch gap on some rusty material with 6010, with 7018/7014/6013/etc the molten pool would drip right off unless you do tack welds.
Hey there big fella, sorry for bothering ya, but I have a dumb question lol. Does ur little hone welder run normal 3/32 7018? At work people are starting to think they can use/borrow my Lincoln invertec, to use as needed. Ha. I assure you, that's not the case, with my 1900$ welder lol. So I'm looking for a decoy machine, so to speak lol.
Great question. I ran some 3/32 vertical up on some stuff so it runs it no problem. The amp dial is dead on at 90a too (the only place it is accurate lol) so it should work as expected.
@@makingmistakeswithgreg awesome! And thank you, too. I actually bought a yes welder 125 already, but it doesn't run them. I tried 7018 ac, and they worked, but come up, they're not the same. Not crying either, don't get me wrong. I didn't spend 65$ on a machine and expect it to be Miller. I'm fully aware of why my good one was so expensive. Some things cost a lot, because they're worth it. Anywho, thanks again, and please do have a good night, Sir.
@@andrewbradstreet4218. The 7018 starts on it aren’t the best, but it has no problem running them. 6010 is a no go and 6011 is pretty limited. The fact it will run a 7018 at 90a makes it worth the price as far as I am concerned lol.
@@makingmistakeswithgreg exactly! Pretty impressive what you can get for so little these days, at least in that dept. Everybody else hasn't got the memo yet, apparently.
So I had a fan and had to run it when the camera shut down due to temps. The internal temp of the tin shed didn’t drop below 90 at any point and hovered right near 100 virtually the whole day. I filmed from 9-10am to atleast 6pm. I have a very high heat tolerance, I was wearing pants, and a long sleeve shirt the whole time. I focused on how important it was to make content and put the discomfort to the back of my mind. Luckily the tin shed has heat so winter won’t be bad at all 😀. Your mentioning of thinking your kidneys were shutting down is a great idea for a video. Dehydration is no joke, the scary part is when you hit the dangerous point it’s almost too late to do something about it. That’s where if you’re working alone it can be very dangerous.
@@makingmistakeswithgreg yeah that’s what I do and it’s got to where I have to stop or collapse. If your neck starts hurting and you can’t hold your head up that’s from your spinal cord swelling and you need to get some ice and put it on your neck and if possible get air. Just be careful you can also get a cheap cooling vest .
So I have done it a bunch on exhaust. It honestly welds pretty good. It will do the same exact thing as 6010 in the sense it will lose all penetration. Which on thin material isn’t the end of the world. Flux core is universally run uphill in the manufacturing world.
@@makingmistakeswithgreg You're right, you don't really want to blow holes in exhaust pipe. Because then you'd never finish the job, and be chasing holes all day, haha. Bead on caulk works on exhaust we're just trying to glue 2 pieces of non-structural metal together and not have leaks.
@@makingmistakeswithgreg I had to run a combination of up and downhill on a hinge repair for a pretty heavy swing gate . I didn't want to run stick as I was welding a 6 mm hinge plate onto probably 2mm walled galvanized square tubing . The previous guys welded it really badly with a few 1/2 inch welds which is crazy for that size gate leaf ( 100kg + ) .
Haha I have before, but I do indeed have a black dry erase marker 😅. I used purple power to get a sharpie mark off, I thought it was done for when I realized I did that before 😅
@@makingmistakeswithgreg A little brakekleen works too, but you have to be fast or it can melt the white plastic. Also use the non chlorinated kind, chlorinated brake cleaner and welding don't mix very well...
Normally you seem to be spot on but this time... maybe learn to manipulate the rod and mig gun into the base metal more for down hill. (other weld vids show this with bend and etch tests) All you are doing is showing that _you_ have issues going down hill.
I am not sure, you seem to be confused. Running vertical down is impossible to have as much penetration as up. The heat input is higher going up and gravity makes it easier to hit the root over welding through the pool. Manipulation doesn’t change this, please link a video that shows someone getting the same penetration going down as up. If you’re going to make a suggestion that the information is wrong, but not post supporting evidence or links, it doesn’t make your opinion very strong. Also, the video demonstrates what can happen when you use the same amperage and run a weld downhill vs up. What actually happens is dependent on many factors. There is a reason vertical down is not commonly done in industry and on thicker plate. I think you’re confusing thinner material like 1/8th with thicker material and not understand what’s actually going on.
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Thanks for also covering information on MIG as a part of this fine video.
MiG definitely has the same issue, the main difference is mig vertical up is far harder than 6010 up. I need to do a video just on mig vertical up since that’s quite tough and I could use the practice lol.
Thank u Greg greatly appreciate each an every lesson God Bless 🙏🏽❤️🙏🏽🙏🏽
The astounding thing is that you were in your 99 degree shop for the purpose of teaching us something. And on a Sunday too! How many high school teachers or college professors would put up with the slightest discomfort in order to teach? The ones I know, and I know several, wouldn't even think of teaching in a 99 degree classroom. And that's in spite of their high pay.
On a different note, I just watched your introductory video on tig welding aluminum that you posted a year ago. Good stuff! I've got some aluminum that's perfect for practicing on, so I'll get to it!
Thanks for the kind words 😀. It’s was no BS hot in the tin shed. I was filming from 9 am to 6pm at 100+. Believe it or not I can handle the heat ok, but the electronics can’t. Even with a fan to cool the camera down it would still shut down after 5 min. I was going to do another vertical up test plate and nail the uphill welds but it would have taken a ton of time and I still had 3 other videos to shoot. Luckily the cut and etch proved exactly what I had hoped.
When I have my mind set on something I do it. The hardest part is getting started. I have had days where it took me 4 hours of sitting just to get going on something. Once I started things got rolling. It’s not easy but paying no attention to the heat, the workload, or anything that might instill doubt, and just starting it how things get done 😀. I also want to keep everyone motivated with some new content 😀
Yay! Back to SMAW!
I have a stainless steel flux Core Video out this week too, going back to my roots lol.
as Columbo used to say, 'One More Thing'...
I have found that 3/32 6010 tends to dig in more, and cause undercut and burn through
than 1/8 6010, this is probably due to the wider arc cone.....I used to repair tubular iron
fence and gate, some by swimming pools with lots of chlorine corrosion [ a real pain]
I recently had to repair an exhaust on a genset [pipe had rubbed on a bracket and worn through] on a Motorhome.....
thin wall for sure,
'I was using my ESAB MiniArc Rogue 180 and had the Dig set on 0 and the hot start on 0,
too hot.....so I bumped down to -10 and -10 , save the day and gave a great
looking weld to boot....those little ESAB inverters are nice......Cheers, Paul
i have the same machine and i definitely agree with the digging of 3/32. i run 3/32 at anywhere from 50-65 amps and i can run the 1/8 from 65-100. if its really thin material, ill just pick up the 1/8 5p 6010 and run it on 65-70 amps with the hotstart on 2 and the arc force on 5 and it seems to run nicely
How is the arc cone wider on the smaller rod?
@@citrusblast4372 I was not clear, it is the 1/8" that has the wider arc cone......sorry.....
Greg- Got my TH-cam Welder sticker the other day! Thank you very much!!
It was sent in error. We need you to return it.
No problem, welcome to the TH-cam certified welder group 😅
At least the parts were preheated just sitting there in the shop!
No bs it was so hot in the tin shed my camera shut down every 5min of filming. I didn’t give up by the equipment couldn’t handle it. Even the microphone had some glitches due to the heat. Should have cooked dinner on the welding table 😅
@@makingmistakeswithgreg Wow! The temperature in your shop was no joke! I was doing some welding in the mid 90's this last week in my shop, but 99 degrees is much tougher. Each degree makes a big difference. I would assume this kind of heat is (or was!) unusual for Milwaukee. I hope it cools off soon.
Excellent instruction. Thanks
You’re welcome 😀
Greg, congrats on reaching 25K subs! Good work, my friend.
I'm still welding almost every afternoon and the heat is living hell here too. I have been following the guidelines you show in your playlists and am still seeing gradual improvement.
Below is something I learned that might benefit you in some situations. If you recall, we were having problems with slag inclusions when running 6013, mostly at the start of the weld bead.
It took months, but I finally overcame most of that. This one simple tip will make a world of difference: Take a small piece of scrap plate and keep it within arm's reach on your table, and just before you are about ready to strike an arc and weld, reach over with the rod and drag it across the scrap plate a few times (a second or so each time). You will probably notice that it sputters for a few seconds then runs smooth. After that, you're home free. Now just strike up on your real base metal and it will run right, without that big wad of slag trying to outrace the weld pool. Do this with each new rod, even on tie-ins. I think it "preheats" the rod or something, but it works. Give it a try and see if it helps you too.
What you described is done on heavy plate welding, they basically attach “run on and run off” tabs so you start/stop on them so the weld that’s on what needs to be welded is 100% clean. On less critical work doing what you describe or just arcing off the table/plate close and bringing the arc onto what you’re welding will work too. Just avoid leaving arc strikes on the plates that don’t get welded over 😀. Glad to hear you’re slowly making progress. Steady practice and focusing on being consistent is what will lead you to develop the skill.
6010 can make good looking welds in any position, you just have to be robot steady and know exactly what you're doing. I haven't been either of those in quite a while
I just found your channel a week ago or so and I love it. Great job!
Thanks for the kind words and I am glad you’re enjoying the videos 😀.
In my opinion/expirence. 6010 downhill is best suited for open root usage. I welded a fair amount of 6010/7010 pipe downhill, and I'm familiar with uphill 6010/7018. Downhill with an open root is faster and just as good. But the moment you don't have a gap in the fitup, this is what we get.
love your content,man! Where do you keep coming up with ideas? I really enjoy the style of delivery. Also,6010 should never be put in an oven-it requires 3-7% moisture content in the flux to run right,once it catches fire throw the rod out and grab a new one. We would even dip them in water before lighting up
I have a list of over 100 ideas and randomly pick one when I don’t know what to cover lol. The more I plan the harder it is to get things done lol. Great tip on the 6010 and no oven, you are 100% correct. 6010s run real rough when they are baked out and even change how they run as the rod burns down. I have dipped rods in water before when they ran poorly and it definitely makes a difference lol.
Thanks for giving this lecture. ❤
No problem 😀👍
thanks for the sticker and the new lesson i have trouble with 6010 period
If you can run a decent bead with other rods but not 6010 try to slow your travel speed significantly and be as consistent as possible. If you move as fast as you forward as any other rod it basically just undercuts the steel. The puddle so fast any movement is captured, so you must be consistent to weld decent with it. Even for me vertical up with a poor prop/hand rest and slightly wrong settings produces less than stellar results. Very little wiggle room before you get undercut lol.
got my sticker! i plan on putting it on my welding hood
Glad to hear it 😀. You are now a TH-cam certified welder 😅
Happy Sunday Greg, hope you are having a fantastic day my friend......gotta love my 6010....
but II09 is better......as it runs on AC/DC.......
Running downhill on an open butt pipe joint definitely makes for a better looking root. It's interesting to see what you get on a downhill fillet weld
On a beveled pipe with an open root the downhill would definitely work far better than a fillet weld. Part of the issue with a fillet weld is the angle you have forces you to weld through more weld pool metal than on beveled plates or on many other joints. I think I can get slightly more root fusion running downhill, I will do a part two soon 😀
These videos are awesome! If your welding something thats just gonna sit out in the weather can you just leave the slag on the weld? Will it effect the weld at all?
You can leave it on, but if you paint over it the paint will come off with the slag eventually. The weld will rust without being coated but that’s not a big deal. 6010 welds in field on rusty material tend to not be fully cleaned and left.
Hey Greg are up like near Milwaukee? That's a long drive from me, but I do HVAC work down here in Podunk, IN; and if I had the time, I wouldn't mind seeing if I could maybe install some air conditioning in your tin shed. Would make it a lot more enjoyable to work in. Maybe sometime like a 12K btu mini split, those don't need much power, and can run on a 120v 15 amp breaker.
I guess I need to check if you've done a bunch of mild steel tig welding videos. btw, where did you find that cool portable dry erase board?
I have a bunch of tig videos I am editing and will roll out soon. I had such a backlog of videos I had to edit and get through it took way longer than I wanted. 😀
I always learn something, sometimes a lot from your videos. It's amazing what you can learn from cutting and etching. What do you use for etching? Thanks. Well done.
Thanks and I am glad you have learned a bunch. To cut at etch the trick is to get a decent surface finish first. I use green rolloc discs but even a normal flap disc can do a ok job. Once the surface is consistent you take an acid and rub it on the area. I use naval jelly rust dissolver because it’s cheap and available everywhere. It works really good if the material is a bit warm.
@@makingmistakeswithgreg Thanks. I saw the Naval Jelly in the bottle on the table and wondered what it was for. That makes a nice safe etching solution. And it's readily available. I see some cutting and etching in my future this coming winter shop season.
I’m not much of a stick guy, but I always thought 6010 was better for this because the puddle freezes faster. Is that wrong?
That's right. That's one of the reasons 6010 works well for running open roots because it gives you a much larger degree of control in terms of your heat input, letting you whip in and out of the puddle to stay consistent, i.e. letting the puddle solidify quickly when you whip out of it.
As was mentioned 6010 offers the ability to bridge gaps in a fast manner that would be otherwise impossible to do with normal rods. It’s common for me to bridge a 1/4inch gap on some rusty material with 6010, with 7018/7014/6013/etc the molten pool would drip right off unless you do tack welds.
Hey there big fella, sorry for bothering ya, but I have a dumb question lol. Does ur little hone welder run normal 3/32 7018? At work people are starting to think they can use/borrow my Lincoln invertec, to use as needed. Ha. I assure you, that's not the case, with my 1900$ welder lol. So I'm looking for a decoy machine, so to speak lol.
Great question. I ran some 3/32 vertical up on some stuff so it runs it no problem. The amp dial is dead on at 90a too (the only place it is accurate lol) so it should work as expected.
@@makingmistakeswithgreg awesome! And thank you, too. I actually bought a yes welder 125 already, but it doesn't run them. I tried 7018 ac, and they worked, but come up, they're not the same. Not crying either, don't get me wrong. I didn't spend 65$ on a machine and expect it to be Miller. I'm fully aware of why my good one was so expensive. Some things cost a lot, because they're worth it. Anywho, thanks again, and please do have a good night, Sir.
@@andrewbradstreet4218. The 7018 starts on it aren’t the best, but it has no problem running them. 6010 is a no go and 6011 is pretty limited. The fact it will run a 7018 at 90a makes it worth the price as far as I am concerned lol.
@@makingmistakeswithgreg exactly! Pretty impressive what you can get for so little these days, at least in that dept. Everybody else hasn't got the memo yet, apparently.
I don’t know how you can do it without at least a fan going. I have done got so dehydrated they thought my kidneys were shutting down.
So I had a fan and had to run it when the camera shut down due to temps. The internal temp of the tin shed didn’t drop below 90 at any point and hovered right near 100 virtually the whole day. I filmed from 9-10am to atleast 6pm. I have a very high heat tolerance, I was wearing pants, and a long sleeve shirt the whole time. I focused on how important it was to make content and put the discomfort to the back of my mind. Luckily the tin shed has heat so winter won’t be bad at all 😀.
Your mentioning of thinking your kidneys were shutting down is a great idea for a video. Dehydration is no joke, the scary part is when you hit the dangerous point it’s almost too late to do something about it. That’s where if you’re working alone it can be very dangerous.
@@makingmistakeswithgreg yeah that’s what I do and it’s got to where I have to stop or collapse. If your neck starts hurting and you can’t hold your head up that’s from your spinal cord swelling and you need to get some ice and put it on your neck and if possible get air. Just be careful you can also get a cheap cooling vest .
How would fluxcore run downhill ?
So I have done it a bunch on exhaust. It honestly welds pretty good. It will do the same exact thing as 6010 in the sense it will lose all penetration. Which on thin material isn’t the end of the world. Flux core is universally run uphill in the manufacturing world.
@@makingmistakeswithgreg You're right, you don't really want to blow holes in exhaust pipe. Because then you'd never finish the job, and be chasing holes all day, haha. Bead on caulk works on exhaust we're just trying to glue 2 pieces of non-structural metal together and not have leaks.
@@makingmistakeswithgreg
I had to run a combination of up and downhill on a hinge repair for a pretty heavy swing gate .
I didn't want to run stick as I was welding a 6 mm hinge plate onto probably 2mm walled galvanized square tubing .
The previous guys welded it really badly with a few 1/2 inch welds which is crazy for that size gate leaf ( 100kg + ) .
Did you just use a non dry erase marker on a dry erase board 👺
if he did, you can just use a dry erase marker over the non dry erase marks and they come right off
Haha I have before, but I do indeed have a black dry erase marker 😅. I used purple power to get a sharpie mark off, I thought it was done for when I realized I did that before 😅
@@makingmistakeswithgreg A little brakekleen works too, but you have to be fast or it can melt the white plastic. Also use the non chlorinated kind, chlorinated brake cleaner and welding don't mix very well...
Normally you seem to be spot on but this time... maybe learn to manipulate the rod and mig gun into the base metal more for down hill. (other weld vids show this with bend and etch tests) All you are doing is showing that _you_ have issues going down hill.
I am not sure, you seem to be confused. Running vertical down is impossible to have as much penetration as up. The heat input is higher going up and gravity makes it easier to hit the root over welding through the pool. Manipulation doesn’t change this, please link a video that shows someone getting the same penetration going down as up. If you’re going to make a suggestion that the information is wrong, but not post supporting evidence or links, it doesn’t make your opinion very strong. Also, the video demonstrates what can happen when you use the same amperage and run a weld downhill vs up. What actually happens is dependent on many factors. There is a reason vertical down is not commonly done in industry and on thicker plate. I think you’re confusing thinner material like 1/8th with thicker material and not understand what’s actually going on.