I love all the (nerdy)details about lifting....my wife just likes to move and gets overwhelmed by all the details. Flywheel training feels like a balance between those 2 worlds.
There is a learning curve here for sure that your wife might not like (if she wants things to be straightforward), but after that it works well. You are more or less just working hard. No need to think through weight, repetitions, and more. Just work hard. So that might be the answer for you for sure.
Hey sorry it took me awhile to reply, got buried in a few projects... They sent me two L discs, a medium, and now a small. I'm assuming the XL is a no go for me, I think you need the Pro or whatever they call the upgraded model
Nice job on this video, that camera work is looking awesome!! I’d love to hear how each exercise feels compared to normal loading with maybe a barbell or DBs.
thanks dude! and definitely, I'll be getting some perspectives from myself, my wife, my daughter, and then definitely some friends who come over. See what peoples initial thoughts are, as well as my own after being able to use for months on end.
Seems really well set up for squats, front raises, and curls. I’d be interested in knowing (a) how eccentric deadlifts feel for you, and (b) whether there are any other exercises / attachments that worked/didn’t work for you. Also interested in knowing how you fit this into your programming. I could envision programming in an “eccentric day,” working in the odd exercise, or having a complete eccentric block of a couple weeks. Would be curious what you found must useful.
Thanks for letting us take a look under the hood! Curious about if you can set this up to do: lat pulldowns, triceps extensions, lateral raises. Wonder if they are going to come out with a bracket to hold to a wall or rack to make those types of movements easier in the future?
Hey great review and looking forward to more follow-up reviews. I would like know what is the best value plate combo to purchase. Should I buy the 3 pack. With 3 plates(small, med, large) etc. Will,I,ever use the small plate etc?
Great question! Initial testings I can say, yes... I'm already asking them for a smaller plate. Lateral raises I can only get about 8 reps with the medium, and it is too heavy for my wife for a number of things, and too heavy for my daughter for everything. So I think a small disc would be helpful.
@@Nah-ow5gg not on its own. You could weigh it down with some dumbbells or maybe a strap attached to a rack or something, hook up a bench and make it work. Or you can connect the box into a cable system. Otherwise best you are going to get is some shoulder work. Overhead presses, lateral raises, etc.
When people say it overloads the eccentric portion of the lift I’m thinking, how? It only gives back what you put in. I’m almost certainly going to buy one but I’m just trying to work out how Im going to justify it to her in doors!
The "overloaded eccentric" is more of a... it actively PULLS on the eccentric. Where a bar or cable or dumbbells has gravity pulling the weight back down, the flywheel is PULLING almost like someone is playing tug of war on the other end.
I have not tried these but there seems to be a major compromise both for powerlifters and bodybuilders: the force curve is highest at the 'top' of all exercises. This is why heavy deadlifters put their foot on the plate at the beginning of their pull to get more force at the start when the speed (and thus force) of the plate is lowest. Bodybuilders want the maximum force when the muscle is most stretched. Again this is the opposite of most exercises on flywheel. So if beyond power voltra implemented a reverse band tension mode to address this it would make flywheels obsolete right?
Yeah in my experiments so far there is a definite negative to the flow of how the Flywheel works. I think you are trading eccentric overload for constant tension and other important aspects like you mentioned. VOLTRA has some new stuff built into a pre release firmware update. And I think they have more plans for it too. Smart Tech like the VOLTRA definitely poses a threat to a lot of these devices. $1200 for the Flywheel, or $2000 for the VOLTRA where you also get a full cable option that adjusts up and down the rack?
@@GrayMatterLifting right and Voltra also has an optional 'travel platform' you can stand on to get the kbox effect without a rack. I think there's some overlooked things on flywheel though, in some of their videos they have a pre-rep to get the speed high enough for a second maximum rep. How does that work? Doesn't the wheel stop at the bottom? I also suppose you could come down fast in the eccentric and brake right at the bottom to target weak areas, like the bottom of the squat or around the knees for a deadlift etc. but that would only work for the eccentric.. I think..
@@karlmarrett4432In terms of the “pre-rep”, it’s basically there just to get a few winds of the strap coiled up so the flywheels can kick in. If you’re a bit lazy in terms of fully coiling the slack, sometimes the next rep won’t have the full “bite” of the flywheel-so sometimes I’ll not start counting my set until I know the flywheel is fully engaged and at speed. But even with just a single turn of the flywheel, it’s efficient enough to translate that into some initial momentum on the flywheel to prevent it coming to a dead stop. I’ve been a kBox and kPulley Go owner for about a year, wouldn’t say it’s something that I feel is necessary in every gym, but it’s definitely been a nice to have in my gym. You can get plenty strong with just flywheels, but I think for most it complements rather than replaces free weights. For me, it’s a nice change of pace at times-for example, it’s my best option for a belt squat in my gym atm, as I’ve never loved the way that any lever belt squat feels, including my new Fringe Sport one. For some of my clients that train more toward plyometrics and less of traditional strength training, having it as an additional tool in the toolbox has been valuable. I have a Voltra on its way from Asia arriving in a week or so. Looking very forward to directly comparing its damper mode along with the BP travel platform to the equivalent kBox and kPulley setups. On paper I think there is a significant amount of overlap between the two, but until I try it first hand, I’ll reserve judgement. Even if there is, I don’t think I’d entirely get rid of my flywheel stuff though, as Joe’s highlighted, the portability of the system is very very useful. I’ve seen (but never done myself) ppl doing things like strapping the kPulley onto objects like basketball poles or even tree trunks. The Voltra in my mind isn’t as portable and has battery life concerns to manage as well. Looking forward to seeing Joe’s long term thoughts though and comparing notes with my own training (and client usage).
@@carps_gym They’re out in Sweden and maintain a pretty low profile on social media, at least from what I’ve seen. IIRC the origin story correctly, their stuff was initially designed to help with hockey players training off ice.
I just got a new squat harness, I believe it is a Large? I'll have to check the details. It has a lot of adjustments so I think it would work for a lot of body sizes.
Hi, how many inertia flywheel do I need to buy? Will 4 x 0.070kg/m2 be too much for an average strength user. I read you only need 1 flywheel at 0.050kg/m2 for all your exercises. 0.050kg/m2 is equivalent to 160kg resistance force.
I don't know if you can fit 4 discs on at once, but I'll have to check. I've only stacked 2 discs so far. For my daughter, we are going to need one of the smaller discs. The medium is too much. For several smaller muscle groups and exercises, like lateral raises, the medium is pretty difficult for me but I can get there, but it is way too much for my wife. For things like RDLs I'm using a medium and large together right now I believe. I could see me using both large discs very soon. It looks like they have an XL, which I don't see a future anytime soon where I would need to stack two XL discs. I think it really depends on the strength levels of the people using the kBox. If you are like me, 6ft 260lbs with a 500+lb squat and 600+lb deadlift, you might need the bigger discs. If you are more in the zone of my wife, one large would probably take care of her for a LONG time, and she'll need a small and medium for the majority of her work.
Yes, I did open that door with my butt. What special tricks can YOUR butt do?
same thing, but with a round handle
@@tonyspamoni5641 I'm impressed
I am a HUGE fan of flywheel training and am looking forward to your thoughts on the K Box
I might pick your brain as I go. Could be cool to get some clips from you into the final video review if you are interested.
I love all the (nerdy)details about lifting....my wife just likes to move and gets overwhelmed by all the details. Flywheel training feels like a balance between those 2 worlds.
There is a learning curve here for sure that your wife might not like (if she wants things to be straightforward), but after that it works well. You are more or less just working hard. No need to think through weight, repetitions, and more. Just work hard. So that might be the answer for you for sure.
I have the KBox 4 and I love it. Exxentric knocks a lot of it out of the park with the quietness and the practicality of the product.
So far I'm enjoying it. It's definitely a completely different experience than lifting.
@@GrayMatterLifting Does your KBox 5 fit the XL disc? I bought an XL disc, but it doesn’t fit my Kbox 4.
Hey sorry it took me awhile to reply, got buried in a few projects... They sent me two L discs, a medium, and now a small. I'm assuming the XL is a no go for me, I think you need the Pro or whatever they call the upgraded model
Enjoyed the video and look forward to see more and hear your thoughts and the questions from the community!
Thank you! I'm excited to see what everyone comes up with. I always get great ideas from the questions from everyone.
I just ordered mine and I can’t wait to get it
Fantastic! Keep me posted on what you think.
Professional level intro. Who did it 😉That's this years budget blown. Seriously, nice work!
Lol... 1 minute of clips took like 3 hours to shoot. But I enjoyed the intro enough that I'm ok with it
@@GrayMatterLifting So did we 😀
Nice job on this video, that camera work is looking awesome!! I’d love to hear how each exercise feels compared to normal loading with maybe a barbell or DBs.
thanks dude! and definitely, I'll be getting some perspectives from myself, my wife, my daughter, and then definitely some friends who come over. See what peoples initial thoughts are, as well as my own after being able to use for months on end.
Seems really well set up for squats, front raises, and curls. I’d be interested in knowing (a) how eccentric deadlifts feel for you, and (b) whether there are any other exercises / attachments that worked/didn’t work for you. Also interested in knowing how you fit this into your programming. I could envision programming in an “eccentric day,” working in the odd exercise, or having a complete eccentric block of a couple weeks. Would be curious what you found must useful.
Good questions. Appreciate those notes.
Thanks for letting us take a look under the hood! Curious about if you can set this up to do: lat pulldowns, triceps extensions, lateral raises. Wonder if they are going to come out with a bracket to hold to a wall or rack to make those types of movements easier in the future?
They have a rack mounted k pulley, that I think is their solution.
I keep wondering if I could connect this somehow to a cable piece...
Can this be connected to a surplus strength pulley system similar to, the rogue rhino ?
@@jimhollars509 interesting idea!
@@jimhollars509 you know what, I had the same idea. I'm going to try and think through it cause it makes sense in theory
i have a budget friendly flywheel with can do it all. platform, wall attachment (quickly changeable) and most important, it works very well!
Hey great review and looking forward to more follow-up reviews. I would like know what is the best value plate combo to purchase. Should I buy the 3 pack. With 3 plates(small, med, large) etc. Will,I,ever use the small plate etc?
Great question!
Initial testings I can say, yes... I'm already asking them for a smaller plate. Lateral raises I can only get about 8 reps with the medium, and it is too heavy for my wife for a number of things, and too heavy for my daughter for everything. So I think a small disc would be helpful.
Can you do any chest or upper body push exercises with this?
@@Nah-ow5gg not on its own. You could weigh it down with some dumbbells or maybe a strap attached to a rack or something, hook up a bench and make it work. Or you can connect the box into a cable system.
Otherwise best you are going to get is some shoulder work. Overhead presses, lateral raises, etc.
When people say it overloads the eccentric portion of the lift I’m thinking, how? It only gives back what you put in. I’m almost certainly going to buy one but I’m just trying to work out how Im going to justify it to her in doors!
The "overloaded eccentric" is more of a... it actively PULLS on the eccentric. Where a bar or cable or dumbbells has gravity pulling the weight back down, the flywheel is PULLING almost like someone is playing tug of war on the other end.
Radian bar review when ? :D
I'll have to check my notes, but I think it is slotted for April.
I have not tried these but there seems to be a major compromise both for powerlifters and bodybuilders: the force curve is highest at the 'top' of all exercises. This is why heavy deadlifters put their foot on the plate at the beginning of their pull to get more force at the start when the speed (and thus force) of the plate is lowest. Bodybuilders want the maximum force when the muscle is most stretched. Again this is the opposite of most exercises on flywheel. So if beyond power voltra implemented a reverse band tension mode to address this it would make flywheels obsolete right?
Yeah in my experiments so far there is a definite negative to the flow of how the Flywheel works. I think you are trading eccentric overload for constant tension and other important aspects like you mentioned.
VOLTRA has some new stuff built into a pre release firmware update. And I think they have more plans for it too.
Smart Tech like the VOLTRA definitely poses a threat to a lot of these devices. $1200 for the Flywheel, or $2000 for the VOLTRA where you also get a full cable option that adjusts up and down the rack?
@@GrayMatterLifting right and Voltra also has an optional 'travel platform' you can stand on to get the kbox effect without a rack. I think there's some overlooked things on flywheel though, in some of their videos they have a pre-rep to get the speed high enough for a second maximum rep. How does that work? Doesn't the wheel stop at the bottom? I also suppose you could come down fast in the eccentric and brake right at the bottom to target weak areas, like the bottom of the squat or around the knees for a deadlift etc. but that would only work for the eccentric.. I think..
@@karlmarrett4432In terms of the “pre-rep”, it’s basically there just to get a few winds of the strap coiled up so the flywheels can kick in. If you’re a bit lazy in terms of fully coiling the slack, sometimes the next rep won’t have the full “bite” of the flywheel-so sometimes I’ll not start counting my set until I know the flywheel is fully engaged and at speed. But even with just a single turn of the flywheel, it’s efficient enough to translate that into some initial momentum on the flywheel to prevent it coming to a dead stop.
I’ve been a kBox and kPulley Go owner for about a year, wouldn’t say it’s something that I feel is necessary in every gym, but it’s definitely been a nice to have in my gym. You can get plenty strong with just flywheels, but I think for most it complements rather than replaces free weights. For me, it’s a nice change of pace at times-for example, it’s my best option for a belt squat in my gym atm, as I’ve never loved the way that any lever belt squat feels, including my new Fringe Sport one. For some of my clients that train more toward plyometrics and less of traditional strength training, having it as an additional tool in the toolbox has been valuable.
I have a Voltra on its way from Asia arriving in a week or so. Looking very forward to directly comparing its damper mode along with the BP travel platform to the equivalent kBox and kPulley setups. On paper I think there is a significant amount of overlap between the two, but until I try it first hand, I’ll reserve judgement. Even if there is, I don’t think I’d entirely get rid of my flywheel stuff though, as Joe’s highlighted, the portability of the system is very very useful. I’ve seen (but never done myself) ppl doing things like strapping the kPulley onto objects like basketball poles or even tree trunks. The Voltra in my mind isn’t as portable and has battery life concerns to manage as well.
Looking forward to seeing Joe’s long term thoughts though and comparing notes with my own training (and client usage).
Can you pause at the top? how quick does the flywheel switch directions?
You can not pause during reps. The top or bottom. The flywheel keeps pulling once you hit the top it is pulling you back down immediately
Did you try stacking more plates yet?
A little. It gets difficult fast.
Reminds me of a space saving Kratos
To be fair, Exxentric has been making flywheels for over a decade. So the Kratos is a bigger and more crazy version of the kBox 😂
@@GrayMatterLifting all good just never heard of them
@@carps_gym They’re out in Sweden and maintain a pretty low profile on social media, at least from what I’ve seen. IIRC the origin story correctly, their stuff was initially designed to help with hockey players training off ice.
Hi, what size squat harness do you wear?
I just got a new squat harness, I believe it is a Large? I'll have to check the details. It has a lot of adjustments so I think it would work for a lot of body sizes.
Hi, how many inertia flywheel do I need to buy? Will 4 x 0.070kg/m2 be too much for an average strength user. I read you only need 1 flywheel at 0.050kg/m2 for all your exercises. 0.050kg/m2 is equivalent to 160kg resistance force.
I don't know if you can fit 4 discs on at once, but I'll have to check. I've only stacked 2 discs so far.
For my daughter, we are going to need one of the smaller discs. The medium is too much. For several smaller muscle groups and exercises, like lateral raises, the medium is pretty difficult for me but I can get there, but it is way too much for my wife.
For things like RDLs I'm using a medium and large together right now I believe. I could see me using both large discs very soon.
It looks like they have an XL, which I don't see a future anytime soon where I would need to stack two XL discs.
I think it really depends on the strength levels of the people using the kBox. If you are like me, 6ft 260lbs with a 500+lb squat and 600+lb deadlift, you might need the bigger discs.
If you are more in the zone of my wife, one large would probably take care of her for a LONG time, and she'll need a small and medium for the majority of her work.