This is simply a tutorial on how to quickly manipulate Reapers’ master fader by using RMS mode which just happens to match the desired LUFS value you want. I don’t have time for the science, just quick results. Bravo Kenny, Bravo!!!
One thing I do with Youlean is to go under the Settings (top right cog looking thing) and set the True Peak to 0dB. Another thing I noticed is that you might need an oversampling limiter to catch intersample peaks - esp if you mix loud styles of music (ones traditionally with a crest of 3-6:1) . I use the Elephant from Voxengo or similar. You can see this in Kenny's vid above when he rolls "tape" (yea I'm an ol'fart doing this for years) and you see the red dots at the top of Youlean's envelope as it rolls right to left I also have the Melda plugin too - great stuff. It has a envelope draw a bit different than Youlean. Kinda like J-Scope (another great plugin) when it rolls in enevelope mode... dpMeter from TBProaudio is a great plug in for real time RMS and LUFS readout - it matches Youlean quite well. I like having both - - dpMeter is small and simple and Youlean is great for final inspection. Also- Orban is a company I've used for years for broadcast FM. They make a standalone free thing called the Orban Loudness Meter www.orban.com/meter/ It runs standalone so you can use it when playing back (it grabs sound card audio) stuff from various services It also has a batch function that will allow you to load up some files and have it quickly give you a report (win7 64 up) Also note - TH-cam doesn't always limit to -13 or whatever - check this out (you don't need the Orban thing but it's nice to have): Note- it's easier to compare the two if you do a right click - open in new tab or something This from their label - uploaded Jan 20, 2018 th-cam.com/video/9mMIPcsHsaA/w-d-xo.html reads -14. on the Orban; player cranked in browser Now listen to this - same tune - uploaded by some guy named Retro Gamer (maybe a band member) uploaded Jan 22 2018 th-cam.com/video/ALo2Ach01AI/w-d-xo.html Huh ...-9.3 .... hmmm.... Dunno.... maybe they only reduce stuff submitted via services or labels. A bit about Orban: Their Orban optimod was/is standard for FM stereo gen/pilot gen. see these youboob vids: th-cam.com/video/fM8l0fJfM-4/w-d-xo.html th-cam.com/video/DXZioXlbu3s/w-d-xo.html - On a side note - note the two 1U rack units above the orban (really apparent in the second link). Those are Texars 4 band limiters. I first used those in mid-late 80's at Y97 in Pittsburgh. Texar was located nearby in Monroeville There's a great interview here - www.thebdr.net/articles/audio/proc/AudioPrism.pdf A bit of history on multiband processing here - www.thebdr.net/articles/audio/proc/proc-hist2.pdf BIG NOTE HERE - this is the beginnings of the what some call "the Loudness War". www.ajawamnet.com/ajawamnet/Turn%20it%20up%20Mudderfudder.html Recall- it's critical for FM's to limit peaks. You're allowed 102% for stereo (allows for Pilot and L-R) and some number of peaks for a given time ... I can't recall. For SCA's (things like paging and MUZAK on subcarriers) you were allowed a bit more. But I do know it was a hefty fine if the local FCC monitoring facility (our was in Langhorne if I recall) saw you go over that. So unlike a mix on Youboob or Ipoons that might result in just audio funky, it'd cost some serious cash the GM Mr Krabb's...
RMS and LUFS are totally different LUFS is weighted and non linear over the frequency sprectrum... set a tone at 20Hz at -14dbfs, your RMS(VU) meter will show you -14 where your LUFS meter will show you ~ -26 LUFS. the lufs metering takes into account the munson curve whereas the RMS is, at the base, only a measure of electrical tension
I think that's why he still checked it with a real LUFS meter. The line on the master meter at least gives you a target so you don't need to have the LUFS meter hogging your screen all the time.
This is misleading. There is a difference between LUFS and rms: the LUFS measurement is k-weighted, rms is not. Reaper has no native EBU R128 or K20/K14/K12 compliant meter. Also, to my knowledge TH-cam wants the peaks not to exceed -1dBFS, so a limiter ceiling of -0.1dB is too high. And having 1dB of headroom is a good idea anyway, because inter-sample peaks can be significantly higher (as you can see, your file has a +0.4dBTP).
@@davidmay268 As of right now, the terms LKFS and LUFS mean the same thing and are interchangable. Not a good situation, but that's how it is and you can read it up.
Thanks a million! I couldn't begin to tell what a struggle I've had with levels! I didn't know about tweaking the master meter to show you a target level in LUFS. I'm smiling today! 😁👍
Thank you Kenny, you have a great talent for keeping it simple. This, for some reason, has always been hard for me to wrap my head around. You cleared it up
Despite all the people splitting hairs and ignoring the fact you _did_ check against a LUFS meter this a very useful tip for getting your master meter to show something useful to get you in the ballpark so you don't need the LUFS meter on-screen all the time. Good video.
SWS loudness analysis is in the actions list. When you open the actions list window, on that text box that gets focused, type loudness. "Analyse Loudness" will be the first item available on the list. Add a keyboard shortcut to this command for convenience. Hope this helps.
Thanks but I get nothing for "loudness". For "analy" I get "Analyze and display item peak and RMS" and "Set RMS analysis/normalize options". I'm suspicious there's more than one set of SWS extensions.
Geez! If it weren't for Kenny Goia's videos, I don't believe would've learned about all the deep details hidden inside of Reaper that I've never seen on some of the other training videos I've watched. My advice...go through all of Denny's stuff first, and then proceed to your other courses if need be. But let me warn you, you might not need to go anywhere else.
Hey Kenny I just wanted to say thanks man! I’ve recently got into recording with Reaper. And you literally cover just about everything. It’s great. Thanks for all the useful information!
A totally newbie to reaper and preparing audio -talk and music combines for a streaming radio show,. Im totally inept at all this only being familiar with electronic music recording all via midi. Thiese videos are AWESOME! Thank you!!
I followed this video to the T. I've downloaded the Youlean Loudness Meter and set it up following this video's instruction. my Reaper Mixer Master did show -6dB level like the video. However, the Youlean Loudness Meter shows -6.5 to -6.6 for Short Term and Integrated LUFS. I'm using the JS Master Limiter, and no matter how I adjust the Threshold, even up to -20 dB, the LUFS level ranges from 6.6 to 7.1 for Short term and Integrated respectively. I could never reach the same level as the video's presentation. No matter how I adjust the JS Master Limiter's Threshold level, it will jump back to -18 and the Youlean Loudness Meter will still display from 6.6 to 7.1 for Short term and Integrated respectively. Can anyone help and tell me what have I done wrong? Must I use Event Horizon Limiter only? Thanks!
Probably a noob question but if I mix way too low and I have to increase the volume, how do I increase the volume? Do I turn the volume up on all tracks, or do I simply move the Master volume up? Or do I normalize tracks? Or do I put a plugin or something?
Hello, First off, thanks for the video ! Could this be the reason why when I playback the track on my headphones via the audio interface it sounds loud but when rendered it sounds way too quiet ? Is it because there's no relative loudness to compare it too ? If this is the case, there's a lot of people (me included) wondering why their rendered files are too quiet. If this is the case probably modify the video title, I'm sure you'll get plenty of extra views this way. Cheers.
RMS and LUFS are two different things. For example Norah Jones - Come away with me (24bit/96kHz master) has RMS value of -19.6 and a LUFS value of -16.6. So setting main meter to display RMS value shouldn't cause it to display LUFS if I'm not missing something.
On another note, dBTP of the LUFS Metering.wav is over 0db on the r128x, which is "bad". You can also see Youlean displaying this with red True Peak overs on the moving graph as small red dots. The there is red 0.3 dB True Peak max value in the Yuolean overview (red indicating overs).
The clear some of the confusion, here is a link to Ian Shepards podcast (I think you visited the show once? excellent episode!) soundcloud.com/themasteringshow/44-loudness-units
RMS is more close to momentary LUFS. The window of around 300ms is RMS and is close to the momentary settings on LUFS meter (300~400ms). Shrot term LUFS is around 3 sec. (3000ms). Integrated LUFS (what is measured by the streaming services) has much more complex algorithm but can be tricked especially if you have quite parts in your song which will lower the overall integrated LUFS of your song. Hence you can push it a bit high on the volume.
So why Stats for nerds shows "Volume / Normalized 100% / 100% (content loudness -1.1dB)" if I just have applied volume up to 0dB without setting Display offset to14.0 dB in my Reaper when rendering? It seems the were fine with my file?
there is a point to make the master louder than streaming services playback, and that is for people who buy music and wanna get the high quality music with no recodec, people who download songs from youtube are gonna hear the original loudness of the track that was uploaded, so if someone downloads your song that was uploaded at -14 lufs is gonna sound way less louder than another song that was uploaded at -9 lufs for example, so there a reason why major labels, vevo and stuff still upload the music at a high lufs and letting youtube to mach it with other songs, but the loudness war is still out there
you are the reapers lord and i respect you... i love your voice even though i don't know the way you look... Please i want you to show us how to master a song in reaper using a pre-mastered instrumental i'm really lost
Thanks. Answered a question I had. I was going for "Peel Your Scalp" levels, and after uploading to TH-cam my music sounded LOUSY!!! They were turning me down to like 50%. Lost a lot of dynamics. So, that is explained now and will be corrected. My question is... I write progressive rock music. Which can be all over the place dynamically. Since the meter is based on Integrated LUFS if I set it to -14 wont the louder sections of my songs still be louder than that after averaging in the quieter sections?
Just a little note to mention that the word "buss" (singular used by Kenny in this video) is of course a mistake as not the same than "bus" which is the correct word for this video...
Another great video, thank you Kenny! You are truly amazing!! You are one of the main reasons I decided to go with Reaper, your service is just incredible. Question: When customizing the meter I can now choose between "Stereo RMS" and "Combined RMS". Which one is the right one to check?
I am totally confused here... Reaper internally only shows RMS... you can't compare it to LUFS... the values can be similar in some contexts, but it is not exactly the same thing... I really wish I could have a LUFS meter directly in Reaper, but I am using the excellent TBProAudio freewares - dpMeterII and mvMeter2. I am surprised you did not choose his products, rather than youlean, knowing that he puts Reaper as his first DAW !
Yes, the example Kenny used seems to show LUFS and RMS levels about the same, but plenty of other music, especially with heavy bass, or even those with little bass content, will be far different RMS and LUFS values.
Great, that helps a lot. Stright to the point, BS free as always, practical. That's the way to go. One question: If you produce an album or a song (not for online video platforms etc.), is -14LUFS still the goal? Thanks.
If you don't care about a streaming service, then the goal is to make it sound good. That's all. This is just to prevent people from making loud masters if they don't have to.
Thank you nice video,touched on some things i needed to be clearified.Should I be changing my meter in reaper between tracking and mixing/mastering? I am using a midas m32 as an interface and also using it as a summing box to print tracks down then re-record into reaper.
There is a great free plugin called Loudness Penalty and it is free to use online.Use the compression that streaming services ise to help compress and bring out more sound.Their compressors arebtop secret,but sound really good when you use the right.
Hopefully Reaper will add a choice of weighting curves to the meter, K, K with lowpass, A, M. The R.128 K-weighting curve is very basic, and without a lowpass considers 3kHz and 23kHz tones equally loud. A basic equalizer doesn't consume much CPU.
I've been struggling with keeping the LUFS at a reasonable -10dB, yet still having a total mix that sounds as loud as the professional mixes that I love. I can push my mix louder without getting any clipping or ugly limiting, but then the LUFS appear too high, coming in around -8.5.
That's what you want. Most commercial releases come in around -6 to -9 LUFS. You do NOT need to master to -14 LUFS and make specific masters for streaming services. ZERO professional releases have separate masters for various streaming services. It's fine to let the streaming service turn it down. If you do put a track on Spotify at -14 LUFS (for example), your song will sound significantly quieter than the other commercial releases.
Would I be able to normalize, then just drag the top down to my target level... or is that a different scale? For example, Boooth Junkie did a video showing how he normalizes a voiceover track then sets it to -3 for a client.
There is also the free application from Orban. I do use Youlean for realtime analysis. It’s excellent. Although all what you told is correct, I see the 99.999999% of master engineers (also really big names. Even the ones you see here on YT, talking against the loudness war ... just to get views (?)) are mastering around -6 / -7 dB and very often the TP is +2/+3 dB, instead thd recommended -1 Not only: they don’t even care about different platforms’ standards. Having said that, the platforms are applying loudness policies ONLY for playback. Indeed, when you download the Audio (iTunes or Spotify or Deezer) or the video (through payed YT), you get the original master loudness and NOT the normalized one. On top of this, also in playback, iTunes and Spotify allow people to deactivate the normalization. Thus: what is loud, sounds loud. What is quite, sounds quite. Who’s screwed up? All the ones are carefully following the rules, also to prevent distortion due transcoding and so on. INSTEAD: if platforms start to refusing “out of LUFS and TP” files, things are forced to change. But they don’t want.
Because this guy doesn't understand professional mastering. Shoot for -6 to -9 LUFS. Hope that helps. This topic has been cleared up thousands of times, especially on Gearspace. It drives mastering engineers bonkers to have to explain to people that -7 LUFS is normal and it sounds great when done well. They watch things like this and then argue with mastering engineers about how their master, per Kenny, is too hot. I master music professionally and I am so tired of having to dispel this myth.
I'm a bit confused here. Why would you need to lower the LUFS yourself when the platform will do it for you anyway? If it's too loud it will be adjusted and if not loud enough it will remain quiter than others. So why not keep your mix above all platforms limits anyway?
Not sure if you found it already but this page explains it well: www.masteringthemix.com/blogs/learn/76296773-mastering-audio-for-soundcloud-itunes-spotify-and-youtube
I feel like, clipping the audio to an certain point brings some nice sounding and glueing effects - should i bring down the output (ceiling) instead of the input to reach the wanted lufs?
You should always do what's right to make the song sound the way you want it to. If that crushes the dynamics, and you end up at -10 LUFS, who cares? The streaming service will turn it down for you. No need to do it yourself. There's no actual "penalty" if you used compression and limiting to make the song sound a certain way, rather than just to achieve volume.
Because the master bus fader is the last thing in the chain. Always. The only plugins that should be on your master bus should be analyzation plugins, and you shouldn't touch the fader. Set up a Mix Bus, route everything to that, and route the mix bus to the master bus. Put your plugins that affect the sound on the Mix buss. Then you can use that fader the way you are trying to use the master fader.
Hi Kenny. Great video. Why didn't you mention the loudness tool from the SWS Extensions? Is it not ok to use and a means to double check the mix? Is there a problem with it?
So I turned up the TH-cam volume to 100% on this tutorial, right clicked it....Volume/Normalization says 100%/100% -3.9dB. Can you please explain the 100%/100% and the -3.9dB? Thanks!
First 100% is the player volume, second 100% is the normalization level (meaning it hasn't been changed), -3.9dB means it's 3.9 decibels below their maximum level before normalizing will occur. TH-cam only normalizes down.
Much appreciate the added explanation! So does that mean that technically, this video´s audio could have been raised by another 3.9 dB and not suffered any volume adjustments by TH-cam?
This is simply a tutorial on how to quickly manipulate Reapers’ master fader by using RMS mode which just happens to match the desired LUFS value you want. I don’t have time for the science, just quick results. Bravo Kenny, Bravo!!!
I'm new to Reaper. I want to say it's a freaking amazing software. And your voice and explanation are very clear. Keep it up. Good luck.!
I luf this video.
Haha
One thing I do with Youlean is to go under the Settings (top right cog looking thing) and set the True Peak to 0dB.
Another thing I noticed is that you might need an oversampling limiter to catch intersample peaks - esp if you mix loud styles of music (ones traditionally with a crest of 3-6:1) . I use the Elephant from Voxengo or similar. You can see this in Kenny's vid above when he rolls "tape" (yea I'm an ol'fart doing this for years) and you see the red dots at the top of Youlean's envelope as it rolls right to left
I also have the Melda plugin too - great stuff. It has a envelope draw a bit different than Youlean. Kinda like J-Scope (another great plugin) when it rolls in enevelope mode...
dpMeter from TBProaudio is a great plug in for real time RMS and LUFS readout - it matches Youlean quite well.
I like having both - - dpMeter is small and simple and Youlean is great for final inspection.
Also- Orban is a company I've used for years for broadcast FM. They make a standalone free thing called the Orban Loudness
Meter www.orban.com/meter/
It runs standalone so you can use it when playing back (it grabs sound card audio) stuff from various services
It also has a batch function that will allow you to load up some files and have it quickly give you a report (win7 64 up)
Also note - TH-cam doesn't always limit to -13 or whatever - check this out (you don't need the Orban thing but it's nice to have):
Note- it's easier to compare the two if you do a right click - open in new tab or something
This from their label -
uploaded Jan 20, 2018
th-cam.com/video/9mMIPcsHsaA/w-d-xo.html
reads -14. on the Orban; player cranked in browser
Now listen to this - same tune - uploaded by some guy named Retro Gamer (maybe a band member)
uploaded Jan 22 2018
th-cam.com/video/ALo2Ach01AI/w-d-xo.html
Huh ...-9.3 .... hmmm....
Dunno.... maybe they only reduce stuff submitted via services or labels.
A bit about Orban:
Their Orban optimod was/is standard for FM stereo gen/pilot gen.
see these youboob vids:
th-cam.com/video/fM8l0fJfM-4/w-d-xo.html
th-cam.com/video/DXZioXlbu3s/w-d-xo.html
- On a side note - note the two 1U rack units above the orban (really apparent in the second link).
Those are Texars 4 band limiters. I first used those in mid-late 80's at Y97 in Pittsburgh. Texar was located nearby in Monroeville
There's a great interview here - www.thebdr.net/articles/audio/proc/AudioPrism.pdf
A bit of history on multiband processing here - www.thebdr.net/articles/audio/proc/proc-hist2.pdf
BIG NOTE HERE - this is the beginnings of the what some call "the Loudness War".
www.ajawamnet.com/ajawamnet/Turn%20it%20up%20Mudderfudder.html
Recall- it's critical for FM's to limit peaks. You're allowed 102% for stereo (allows for Pilot and L-R) and some number of peaks for a given time ... I can't recall. For SCA's (things like paging and MUZAK on subcarriers) you were allowed a bit more.
But I do know it was a hefty fine if the local FCC monitoring facility (our was in Langhorne if I recall) saw you go over that. So unlike a mix on Youboob or Ipoons that might result in just audio funky, it'd cost some serious cash the GM Mr Krabb's...
RMS and LUFS are totally different LUFS is weighted and non linear over the frequency sprectrum... set a tone at 20Hz at -14dbfs, your RMS(VU) meter will show you -14 where your LUFS meter will show you ~ -26 LUFS. the lufs metering takes into account the munson curve whereas the RMS is, at the base, only a measure of electrical tension
Super helpful! Thanks for that explanation.
I think that's why he still checked it with a real LUFS meter. The line on the master meter at least gives you a target so you don't need to have the LUFS meter hogging your screen all the time.
well said. people dont seem to realise how meticulous gain staging needs to be for that sweet, sweet headroom
To anyone watching this in 2022, Reaper has been updated since this video... much clearer now if you wanna use LUFS
Great lesson as always. Thank you so much for your clarity and simple way to explane things
This is misleading. There is a difference between LUFS and rms: the LUFS measurement is k-weighted, rms is not. Reaper has no native EBU R128 or K20/K14/K12 compliant meter.
Also, to my knowledge TH-cam wants the peaks not to exceed -1dBFS, so a limiter ceiling of -0.1dB is too high. And having 1dB of headroom is a good idea anyway, because inter-sample peaks can be significantly higher (as you can see, your file has a +0.4dBTP).
Correct!
Pretty sure lufs isn't k weighted, that's lkfs
Also, lufs is based on rms, and Kenny is checking it against a loudness meter anyway, and it checks out
@@davidmay268 As of right now, the terms LKFS and LUFS mean the same thing and are interchangable. Not a good situation, but that's how it is and you can read it up.
@@davidmay268 It will check out more or less until you add bass to a mix, in which case the RMS value will increase more than the LUFS values.
Thanks a million! I couldn't begin to tell what a struggle I've had with levels! I didn't know about tweaking the master meter to show you a target level in LUFS. I'm smiling today! 😁👍
Thank you Kenny, you have a great talent for keeping it simple. This, for some reason, has always been hard for me to wrap my head around. You cleared it up
Despite all the people splitting hairs and ignoring the fact you _did_ check against a LUFS meter this a very useful tip for getting your master meter to show something useful to get you in the ballpark so you don't need the LUFS meter on-screen all the time. Good video.
The extent of your detailed knowledge is mind blowing. Thanks man!
The SWS extensions have a function to measure the loudness also
what's its name?
+Francesco Ameglio SWS Loudness
Matteo Nolli I can't find that one. Is there a newer set somewhere?
SWS loudness analysis is in the actions list. When you open the actions list window, on that text box that gets focused, type loudness. "Analyse Loudness" will be the first item available on the list. Add a keyboard shortcut to this command for convenience.
Hope this helps.
Thanks but I get nothing for "loudness". For "analy" I get "Analyze and display item peak and RMS" and "Set RMS analysis/normalize options". I'm suspicious there's more than one set of SWS extensions.
Geez! If it weren't for Kenny Goia's videos, I don't believe would've learned about all the deep details hidden inside of Reaper that I've never seen on some of the other training videos I've watched. My advice...go through all of Denny's stuff first, and then proceed to your other courses if need be. But let me warn you, you might not need to go anywhere else.
Hey Kenny I just wanted to say thanks man! I’ve recently got into recording with Reaper. And you literally cover just about everything. It’s great. Thanks for all the useful information!
SWS Action "Analyze and display item peak and RMS" or "Analyze loudness" plus "Normalize to LUFS/ LU/ RMS/ dB"
A totally newbie to reaper and preparing audio -talk and music combines for a streaming radio show,. Im totally inept at all this only being familiar with electronic music recording all via midi. Thiese videos are AWESOME! Thank you!!
Best of luck!
Really useful tut. Thanks so much. Very clear explanation of a topic that been confusing the hell out of me!
I followed this video to the T. I've downloaded the Youlean Loudness Meter and set it up following this video's instruction. my Reaper Mixer Master did show -6dB level like the video. However, the Youlean Loudness Meter shows -6.5 to -6.6 for Short Term and Integrated LUFS.
I'm using the JS Master Limiter, and no matter how I adjust the Threshold, even up to -20 dB, the LUFS level ranges from 6.6 to 7.1 for Short term and Integrated respectively. I could never reach the same level as the video's presentation. No matter how I adjust the JS Master Limiter's Threshold level, it will jump back to -18 and the Youlean Loudness Meter will still display from 6.6 to 7.1 for Short term and Integrated respectively.
Can anyone help and tell me what have I done wrong? Must I use Event Horizon Limiter only? Thanks!
I was literally looking for this stuff yesterday! Was excited to see it pop up in my feed 😀
🙏 thanks for the amazing video
Thanks so much for this !! Been shooting in the dark abit regarding the loundness levels of youtube ,, this nails it ,, fab tutorial !!
May God bless you more sir. Thank you very much , I really appreciate your kind teaching :)
Probably a noob question but if I mix way too low and I have to increase the volume, how do I increase the volume? Do I turn the volume up on all tracks, or do I simply move the Master volume up? Or do I normalize tracks? Or do I put a plugin or something?
Hello,
First off, thanks for the video !
Could this be the reason why when I playback the track on my headphones via the audio interface it sounds loud but when rendered it sounds way too quiet ? Is it because there's no relative loudness to compare it too ? If this is the case, there's a lot of people (me included) wondering why their rendered files are too quiet. If this is the case probably modify the video title, I'm sure you'll get plenty of extra views this way.
Cheers.
Great Video...A big help to a newbee....THANKS !!!
RMS and LUFS are two different things. For example Norah Jones - Come away with me (24bit/96kHz master) has RMS value of -19.6 and a LUFS value of -16.6. So setting main meter to display RMS value shouldn't cause it to display LUFS if I'm not missing something.
On another note, dBTP of the LUFS Metering.wav is over 0db on the r128x, which is "bad". You can also see Youlean displaying this with red True Peak overs on the moving graph as small red dots. The there is red 0.3 dB True Peak max value in the Yuolean overview (red indicating overs).
The clear some of the confusion, here is a link to Ian Shepards podcast (I think you visited the show once? excellent episode!) soundcloud.com/themasteringshow/44-loudness-units
RMS is more close to momentary LUFS. The window of around 300ms is RMS and is close to the momentary settings on LUFS meter (300~400ms). Shrot term LUFS is around 3 sec. (3000ms). Integrated LUFS (what is measured by the streaming services) has much more complex algorithm but can be tricked especially if you have quite parts in your song which will lower the overall integrated LUFS of your song. Hence you can push it a bit high on the volume.
Wow - love your videos! Awesome help. Thank you so much!
thank KENNY, you rock as usual👍
Another thing I haven't heard about before at all. Fascinating. "LUFS", huh. Thank you!
So why Stats for nerds shows "Volume / Normalized 100% / 100% (content loudness -1.1dB)" if I just have applied volume up to 0dB without setting Display offset to14.0 dB in my Reaper when rendering? It seems the were fine with my file?
Thank you, this is extremely informative!
there is a point to make the master louder than streaming services playback, and that is for people who buy music and wanna get the high quality music with no recodec, people who download songs from youtube are gonna hear the original loudness of the track that was uploaded, so if someone downloads your song that was uploaded at -14 lufs is gonna sound way less louder than another song that was uploaded at -9 lufs for example, so there a reason why major labels, vevo and stuff still upload the music at a high lufs and letting youtube to mach it with other songs, but the loudness war is still out there
you are the reapers lord and i respect you... i love your voice even though i don't know the way you look...
Please i want you to show us how to master a song in reaper using a pre-mastered instrumental i'm really lost
Thanks. Answered a question I had. I was going for "Peel Your Scalp" levels, and after uploading to TH-cam my music sounded LOUSY!!! They were turning me down to like 50%. Lost a lot of dynamics. So, that is explained now and will be corrected. My question is... I write progressive rock music. Which can be all over the place dynamically. Since the meter is based on Integrated LUFS if I set it to -14 wont the louder sections of my songs still be louder than that after averaging in the quieter sections?
Yeah! Great video, this has been a mistery for me so long, fantastic explanation!!
reaper is the true essence of passion
Great information & timely! Thanks Kenny.
Thanks Kenny, Great like always!
Thanks Bro. Simple straight to the Point. Great Vid💯
Thanks Kenny! You make this stuff easy as always...
Just a little note to mention that the word "buss" (singular used by Kenny in this video) is of course a mistake as not the same than "bus" which is the correct word for this video...
Another great video, thank you Kenny! You are truly amazing!! You are one of the main reasons I decided to go with Reaper, your service is just incredible.
Question: When customizing the meter I can now choose between "Stereo RMS" and "Combined RMS". Which one is the right one to check?
But LUFS analyzers have filter inside, so this method will be just RMS analyzing.
Watch the whole video. He checks it with an actual LUFS meter.
Thanks man I have learn something. Big thumb up.
first time of viewing this...really helpful for me..thanks!
I am totally confused here... Reaper internally only shows RMS... you can't compare it to LUFS... the values can be similar in some contexts, but it is not exactly the same thing...
I really wish I could have a LUFS meter directly in Reaper, but I am using the excellent TBProAudio freewares - dpMeterII and mvMeter2. I am surprised you did not choose his products, rather than youlean, knowing that he puts Reaper as his first DAW !
Yes, you're right. RMS is only an approximation. Hopefully future versions of Reaper will have a LUFS display option for the master level meter.
That's why I compared both. While it may not be exactly the same thing, the result was the same.
Meldaproduction has a free LUFS meter. MLoudnessAnalyzer. Lots of meter options. One of the best, and free.
Yes, the example Kenny used seems to show LUFS and RMS levels about the same, but plenty of other music, especially with heavy bass, or even those with little bass content, will be far different RMS and LUFS values.
yes, but DPMeterII and MVMeterII are both free as well.. work really really well, very clear and large view,
and made by a Reaper fan :)
Great, that helps a lot. Stright to the point, BS free as always, practical. That's the way to go. One question: If you produce an album or a song (not for online video platforms etc.), is -14LUFS still the goal? Thanks.
If you don't care about a streaming service, then the goal is to make it sound good. That's all. This is just to prevent people from making loud masters if they don't have to.
Thank you nice video,touched on some things i needed to be clearified.Should I be changing my meter in reaper between tracking and mixing/mastering? I am using a midas m32 as an interface and also using it as a summing box to print tracks down then re-record into reaper.
Thanks! Love Kenny's videos! SO helpful!
There is a great free plugin called Loudness Penalty and it is free to use online.Use the compression that streaming services ise to help compress and bring out more sound.Their compressors arebtop secret,but sound really good when you use the right.
Ebu r128 is only for tv sound normalization. Streaming services work with itu 1770
Essentially identical (nowadays)
Thanks Kenny! Will you be doing another tutorial for the newer version (UI) of YouLean?
Well, I cannot find any form of master VU settings window anywhere? Any suggestions other than what is shown here?
Thanks Kenny
Very usefull. So we can use the master peak level (rms) meter, to master the song without a external plugin. Thats great.
When I open floating mixer it's just empty window
Kennyyyyy!thank you once again sir
Hopefully Reaper will add a choice of weighting curves to the meter, K, K with lowpass, A, M. The R.128 K-weighting curve is very basic, and without a lowpass considers 3kHz and 23kHz tones equally loud. A basic equalizer doesn't consume much CPU.
i need to know how to put the -14 lufs to then upload onto youtube without them turning down the volume.
th-cam.com/video/BF3SXuKBolM/w-d-xo.html
th-cam.com/video/aGy91FBNm5g/w-d-xo.html
In sws menu window click "loudness" it open a lufs analyzer for one or more item 👍🏻
what is sws menu?
Hey, what app should I use to open the r128x in windows? Cheers for the video!
knowledge is power to success
Thanks A Million again Kenny. You ARE The Man Brother..GOD Bless & ThankYou Sir, Cheers
Another mystery solved and demystified. Thanks
You are a good person man. Thanks. This was simple.I will try -10 Lufs as is recommended on Gearslutz.
DUDE Thank You Kenny!!
Fantastic video
When I zoom out I loose my wav forms. They disappear when I get more than 5 seconds on the display. How can I see them when zoomed out?
Landr medium preset is -10db. Maybe low would be even better with lesser compreesion. :) But I think it is quieter than -13 Lufs..
Needed this info. Thanks as always.
I've just noticed how TH-cam reduces volume of an ad to 31%, because its content loudness was 10.2dB. Thank you TH-cam.
I've been struggling with keeping the LUFS at a reasonable -10dB, yet still having a total mix that sounds as loud as the professional mixes that I love. I can push my mix louder without getting any clipping or ugly limiting, but then the LUFS appear too high, coming in around -8.5.
That's what you want. Most commercial releases come in around -6 to -9 LUFS. You do NOT need to master to -14 LUFS and make specific masters for streaming services. ZERO professional releases have separate masters for various streaming services. It's fine to let the streaming service turn it down. If you do put a track on Spotify at -14 LUFS (for example), your song will sound significantly quieter than the other commercial releases.
Fantastic video,
Would I be able to normalize, then just drag the top down to my target level... or is that a different scale? For example, Boooth Junkie did a video showing how he normalizes a voiceover track then sets it to -3 for a client.
Thanks, but they have made changes since you’ve posted this. Can you do an update? It’s a bit different. Love your videos btw
awesome - thanks Kenny!
There is also the free application from Orban. I do use Youlean for realtime analysis. It’s excellent. Although all what you told is correct, I see the 99.999999% of master engineers (also really big names. Even the ones you see here on YT, talking against the loudness war ... just to get views (?)) are mastering around -6 / -7 dB and very often the TP is +2/+3 dB, instead thd recommended -1
Not only: they don’t even care about different platforms’ standards.
Having said that, the platforms are applying loudness policies ONLY for playback. Indeed, when you download the Audio (iTunes or Spotify or Deezer) or the video (through payed YT), you get the original master loudness and NOT the normalized one.
On top of this, also in playback, iTunes and Spotify allow people to deactivate the normalization. Thus: what is loud, sounds loud. What is quite, sounds quite.
Who’s screwed up? All the ones are carefully following the rules, also to prevent distortion due transcoding and so on.
INSTEAD: if platforms start to refusing “out of LUFS and TP” files, things are forced to change. But they don’t want.
Its so easy to just download the totally free VST PlugIn Youlean Loudness Meter 2, thats the route I took anyway. Its been working great!
excellent! excelente! from Brazil!
Kenny. That’s great info. Any chance you could go over mixing for iTunes?
Tu é foda Kenny Joia!
Is it me, or is this out of date? I don't get the same menu when right clicking the meter? I am using Reaper 6.35
You're a godsend Kenny
Great video! Anyone know what Lufs level are best for a wav going on a CD?
This is awesome Kenny. Would you recommend astering to kids if you plan to print physical cds or is this only if you plan to upload for streaming?
This is just for streaming. CDs can be whatever you want.
Awesome video.
How come I can export something at -13db LUFS and it sounds much quieter than other music that is on youtube and spotify?
Because this guy doesn't understand professional mastering. Shoot for -6 to -9 LUFS. Hope that helps. This topic has been cleared up thousands of times, especially on Gearspace. It drives mastering engineers bonkers to have to explain to people that -7 LUFS is normal and it sounds great when done well. They watch things like this and then argue with mastering engineers about how their master, per Kenny, is too hot. I master music professionally and I am so tired of having to dispel this myth.
@@danielmiller5521 Well thank you for dispelling it for me, I'll remember what you've said here.
Thanks a lot. You are the best👍🤝
Can't believe there's no automatic way to do this.
I'm a bit confused here. Why would you need to lower the LUFS yourself when the platform will do it for you anyway? If it's too loud it will be adjusted and if not loud enough it will remain quiter than others. So why not keep your mix above all platforms limits anyway?
Not sure if you found it already but this page explains it well:
www.masteringthemix.com/blogs/learn/76296773-mastering-audio-for-soundcloud-itunes-spotify-and-youtube
I feel like, clipping the audio to an certain point brings some nice sounding and glueing effects - should i bring down the output (ceiling) instead of the input to reach the wanted lufs?
You should always do what's right to make the song sound the way you want it to. If that crushes the dynamics, and you end up at -10 LUFS, who cares? The streaming service will turn it down for you. No need to do it yourself. There's no actual "penalty" if you used compression and limiting to make the song sound a certain way, rather than just to achieve volume.
Why does my LUFS meters only work prefader on master bus? I slide the level up and down and lufs only stay prefader, no change
Because the master bus fader is the last thing in the chain. Always. The only plugins that should be on your master bus should be analyzation plugins, and you shouldn't touch the fader. Set up a Mix Bus, route everything to that, and route the mix bus to the master bus. Put your plugins that affect the sound on the Mix buss. Then you can use that fader the way you are trying to use the master fader.
Thanx brother... like & Subbed 👏👐👍🏻
Hi Kenny. Great video.
Why didn't you mention the loudness tool from the SWS Extensions? Is it not ok to use and a means to double check the mix? Is there a problem with it?
I didn't know about it.
They were introduced on v2.4.0 #5 pre-release build (March 30, 2014). :P
Another great video ;-)
Great tutorial!!!
is it applied to audio in video as well?
So I turned up the TH-cam volume to 100% on this tutorial, right clicked it....Volume/Normalization says 100%/100% -3.9dB. Can you please explain the 100%/100% and the -3.9dB? Thanks!
First 100% is the player volume, second 100% is the normalization level (meaning it hasn't been changed), -3.9dB means it's 3.9 decibels below their maximum level before normalizing will occur. TH-cam only normalizes down.
Much appreciate the added explanation! So does that mean that technically, this video´s audio could have been raised by another 3.9 dB and not suffered any volume adjustments by TH-cam?
C'mon Kenny, show me how to turn on the luf...
Or, one could just use the Youlean meter.