The biggest concern is overfilling, so always weigh a new canister and write the total weight on the canister. Then be sure not to exceed that weight during a refill. Iso has a vapor pressure of only 30 psi at 70F, which isn't very high. Propane would be 100 - 200 psi and CO2 (not a fuel) would be around 900 psi.
I've always felt skeptical about the need for one of these. I typically end up taking my partial canisters on car camping trips and using them up that way where it's smaller issue if the canister runs out while cooking. But I think im gonna get one to try out. Thanks!
I’ve always felt the same way, I probably should have mentioned in the video that the store I work for started carrying these and we got one for store use and I played with it for the weekend.
Agree. That’s how I’ve used up my nearly-empty canisters: car camping. Then use puncture device and recycle metal canisters. That way, don’t have to spend the $30 for this device and don’t have to invest in scale, worry about overfilling, etc.
The larger canisters are cheaper per ounce, so I find good deals on them and refill my small ones. Definitely saves money. And if you know the weight of an empty canister it takes the guess work out of knowing how low you are. For the small MSRs, empty is about 3.5 ounces. I fill to a gross weight of 7.4 ounces.
You bring forth a very good point about not using the canisters too often. One way to solve the problem is to date code the canister, you simple use the newer dated one to transfer to. The older dated one gets tossed. This way you only use the canister once for a refill and that gets tossed. This even works with 2 old ones with the same date and two new ones with the same date. Toss out the old two, when you get two new ones to replace those they will have a newer date. Problem solved, now a hardy thank you for bringing this to my attention,
The budget conscious like me are incentivized to buy only one small canister and refill it over and over again from large canisters. What I'm thinking of doing is buying 1 small canister for every two large ones or something like that.
Great sharing of information, especially with the concerns about pressurized cannisters. I was leary of this device as well, because of that. But I recently tried it out and I think it's a great addition to our bag of tools. However, there's risk in everything we do; for example my friend's Jetboil had a minor explosion and meltdown this season. And she does not refill her fuel canisters!
That is certainly true, there is definitely always risk. No experience in the backcountry is guaranteed safe haha. That said, I think that it’s always wise to consider the safety of a thing or situation and plan accordingly. In this case I did choose to wait and see how it worked and im happy to say it proved to be safe. I think we all have the opportunity to approach things with our own filters of safety. Thanks for watching!
I'm still too scared to try it myself. Especially with the smaller cans if I'm getting low I'll just bring two and run one out. I think it's important to have a stove with a regulator so you can get the most amount of power out of the stove and can before having to make the switch. Def get the 'crunch it' tool from jetboil to puncture those empty cans and recycle! Nice one GM! 🙌
I have been doing this for 3-4 years. I'll refill until gut feeling tells me to purchase another small canister. I purchase the larger canisters and do the refilling from that. Saves money on fuel cost. I have also refilled my canister from discarded ones in hiker boxes. I have a method of refilling without overfilling.
I’ve been on the fence about these for awhile now. I had thought about getting a mosquito repellent device for the patio that works off of the same canisters just to use up the extra cans I’ve collected. I may still do that. Thanks for the info.
In addition to the fuel you need cartridges/pads that heat up. They contain the same or similar chemicals as the old fashioned mosquito coils have. The PIC brand of coils is usually around $1 for a four pack. So I haven't gone the thermacell type device repellent yet.
I bought one of those, haven't used it yet. In the past I've used the partial canisters for car camping or trailhead meals on day trips. For recycling, I've always dropped them off with the 1lb propane tanks at my recycling center/waste transfer station.
Great video. This nifty gadget is on my wish list. Not a super high priority, but would be nice to have, I think. I typically pack my "used" canisters on shorter car camping trips to finish them off.
Great video thanks. The cycling of pressure may not be too much of a worry as you are not entirely emptying canisters. The pressure of a quarter full canister can't be much lower than a full one. It's the evaporation of the fuel that maintains the pressure. I'd still only top up a canister a few times though!
Thank you! And yes that is a fair point. My fears are definitely based in previous mind sets and I will be the first to admit that this device had been used for years now without much in the way of serious issues. I’m reasonably assured it’s safe. Thanks for watching!
Great advice there using your expertise and passing it on, as well as showing how the device works. It's worth getting, I think, because it will pay for It's self over time. 💯👍
I agree with the idea to only reuse a few times. One thing that comes to mind regarding pressure. If neither tank has ever had more than the factory fill pressure in them. It would lead me to think this transfer method would not increase that pressure at all. If one tank had 2 PSI and the other had 4 PSI the pressure between the two tanks would be 3. In the middle. The pressure would balance between the two tanks. Gravity is what pulls the fuel into the lower tank. Am I missing something?
You aren’t entirely wrong. The problem with pressure canisters with gas or liquid under pressure is that the pressure does change depending on how much of the contents are left. So it’s not that the pressure increases higher then it was when it was full, but it is the stretch that occurs between peaks, so yes the peaks of pressure are decreasing there is still and up and down change in pressure that causes flex in the container. That said, the pressure here is low enough that it probably would not significantly fatigue the metal unless done an excessive amount of times. Thanks for watching!
It saves time and $. I've been buying the big 1 lb canisters to fill a small 100g. Before a trip, I'll do a quick shake and if it feels around half empty, I'll fill it back up. I have the even simpler device without the pressure release. I don't even bother putting the small canister in the freezer anymore. After a few rounds of unscrewing and releasing the pressure, it fills. With a Sharpie I wrote on the canister in grams the 'max capacity' just in case I overfill.
Paused the video as soon as it started after the ads. Yes it’s worth it. Just used mine for the first time the other day. Worked great. I’ll refill small canisters from larger ones for hikes and then just use what’s left in the bigger canister for just camping or maybe short hikes.
We've been doing this with propane camping cannister. We find that eventually, the valve fails and starts leaking. I assume this will happen with this, too. I like the idea of marking them.
Make sure that your total weight doesn't exceed the capacity of the fuel canister. Each one should have a weight of canister and weight of fuel. If you overfill you'll end up above that. Waiting longer might have helped as well. It's a pretty small hole and the vapor phase has to move past the liquid that is flowing down. If there isn't a big pressure differential, that can take a while.
This is dangerous. When you use a canister, especially in cooler weather, the butane is burnt off leaving behind that 20% propane in the blend. When you consolidate all that mostly propane back into a full canister, the pressures are three times higher. So this is not safe. Eventually someone is going to have an unwelcome bang.
I think you have that backwards. The fuel canisters that most of us use backpacking are a mixture of 80% isobutane and 20% propane. Isobutane has a boiling point of -12 deg C and propane -42 deg C. At a temperature between those two boiling points propane will tend to move to the vapor phase and get burned off while most of the isobutane will be in the liquid phase and not get burned off (as fast). Over time the propane content of the fuel canister will decrease, not increase, and the partial pressure of propane will drop.
@ this is right from the Google: Canister pressure: Propane has higher pressures at room temperatures than isobutane. Canisters are not designed to withstand the pressures of propane in high percentages, so using a temperature differential to force the remaining fuel into a canister can be dangerous.
The biggest concern is overfilling, so always weigh a new canister and write the total weight on the canister. Then be sure not to exceed that weight during a refill. Iso has a vapor pressure of only 30 psi at 70F, which isn't very high. Propane would be 100 - 200 psi and CO2 (not a fuel) would be around 900 psi.
I've always felt skeptical about the need for one of these. I typically end up taking my partial canisters on car camping trips and using them up that way where it's smaller issue if the canister runs out while cooking. But I think im gonna get one to try out. Thanks!
I’ve always felt the same way, I probably should have mentioned in the video that the store I work for started carrying these and we got one for store use and I played with it for the weekend.
Agree. That’s how I’ve used up my nearly-empty canisters: car camping. Then use puncture device and recycle metal canisters.
That way, don’t have to spend the $30 for this device and don’t have to invest in scale, worry about overfilling, etc.
The larger canisters are cheaper per ounce, so I find good deals on them and refill my small ones. Definitely saves money. And if you know the weight of an empty canister it takes the guess work out of knowing how low you are. For the small MSRs, empty is about 3.5 ounces. I fill to a gross weight of 7.4 ounces.
You bring forth a very good point about not using the canisters too often. One way to solve the problem is to date code the canister, you simple use the newer dated one to transfer to. The older dated one gets tossed. This way you only use the canister once for a refill and that gets tossed. This even works with 2 old ones with the same date and two new ones with the same date. Toss out the old two, when you get two new ones to replace those they will have a newer date. Problem solved, now a hardy thank you for bringing this to my attention,
Right on, sounds like a good system to me. Thanks for watching!
The budget conscious like me are incentivized to buy only one small canister and refill it over and over again from large canisters. What I'm thinking of doing is buying 1 small canister for every two large ones or something like that.
This is the best video explaining the fuel transfers! Thanks!
Thank you!
Excellent input! So glad I watched this before putting it to use.
Thank you! And Thanks for watching!
Great sharing of information, especially with the concerns about pressurized cannisters. I was leary of this device as well, because of that. But I recently tried it out and I think it's a great addition to our bag of tools.
However, there's risk in everything we do; for example my friend's Jetboil had a minor explosion and meltdown this season. And she does not refill her fuel canisters!
That is certainly true, there is definitely always risk. No experience in the backcountry is guaranteed safe haha. That said, I think that it’s always wise to consider the safety of a thing or situation and plan accordingly. In this case I did choose to wait and see how it worked and im happy to say it proved to be safe. I think we all have the opportunity to approach things with our own filters of safety. Thanks for watching!
Great video, thanks for these considerations I hadn't thought about :)
Thank you!
Thanks for sharing your expertise.
Thanks for watching! Just like everyone else I am just constantly learning as I go!
I'm still too scared to try it myself. Especially with the smaller cans if I'm getting low I'll just bring two and run one out. I think it's important to have a stove with a regulator so you can get the most amount of power out of the stove and can before having to make the switch. Def get the 'crunch it' tool from jetboil to puncture those empty cans and recycle! Nice one GM! 🙌
Thanks man!
A crunch it tool is not necessary to puncture. An ice axe, can opener, or knife will work just fine
I have been doing this for 3-4 years. I'll refill until gut feeling tells me to purchase another small canister. I purchase the larger canisters and do the refilling from that. Saves money on fuel cost. I have also refilled my canister from discarded ones in hiker boxes. I have a method of refilling without overfilling.
What's your method of not overfilling? Doing this worries me!
I’ve been on the fence about these for awhile now.
I had thought about getting a mosquito repellent device for the patio that works off of the same canisters
just to use up the extra cans I’ve collected. I may still do that. Thanks for the info.
I have definitely heard people doing the same thing and I think it is also a good strategy
Ooh, I've not seen such devices. That'd be a great idea, too.
@@lovedogsontheloose Thermacell makes one but I’m not sure how well they perform.
In addition to the fuel you need cartridges/pads that heat up. They contain the same or similar chemicals as the old fashioned mosquito coils have. The PIC brand of coils is usually around $1 for a four pack. So I haven't gone the thermacell type device repellent yet.
Thanks for the info, Doc.@@Doc_Watson
I bought one of those, haven't used it yet. In the past I've used the partial canisters for car camping or trailhead meals on day trips. For recycling, I've always dropped them off with the 1lb propane tanks at my recycling center/waste transfer station.
Great video. This nifty gadget is on my wish list. Not a super high priority, but would be nice to have, I think. I typically pack my "used" canisters on shorter car camping trips to finish them off.
I definitely need to do more car camping!
Great video thanks. The cycling of pressure may not be too much of a worry as you are not entirely emptying canisters. The pressure of a quarter full canister can't be much lower than a full one. It's the evaporation of the fuel that maintains the pressure. I'd still only top up a canister a few times though!
Thank you! And yes that is a fair point. My fears are definitely based in previous mind sets and I will be the first to admit that this device had been used for years now without much in the way of serious issues. I’m reasonably assured it’s safe. Thanks for watching!
Great advice there using your expertise and passing it on, as well as showing how the device works. It's worth getting, I think, because it will pay for It's self over time. 💯👍
I think so as well. Thanks for watching!
I agree with the idea to only reuse a few times. One thing that comes to mind regarding pressure. If neither tank has ever had more than the factory fill pressure in them. It would lead me to think this transfer method would not increase that pressure at all. If one tank had 2 PSI and the other had 4 PSI the pressure between the two tanks would be 3. In the middle. The pressure would balance between the two tanks. Gravity is what pulls the fuel into the lower tank. Am I missing something?
You aren’t entirely wrong. The problem with pressure canisters with gas or liquid under pressure is that the pressure does change depending on how much of the contents are left. So it’s not that the pressure increases higher then it was when it was full, but it is the stretch that occurs between peaks, so yes the peaks of pressure are decreasing there is still and up and down change in pressure that causes flex in the container. That said, the pressure here is low enough that it probably would not significantly fatigue the metal unless done an excessive amount of times. Thanks for watching!
Thank you for the demo!
Thank you for watching!
It saves time and $. I've been buying the big 1 lb canisters to fill a small 100g. Before a trip, I'll do a quick shake and if it feels around half empty, I'll fill it back up. I have the even simpler device without the pressure release. I don't even bother putting the small canister in the freezer anymore. After a few rounds of unscrewing and releasing the pressure, it fills. With a Sharpie I wrote on the canister in grams the 'max capacity' just in case I overfill.
Great advice! Thanks for watching!
Paused the video as soon as it started after the ads. Yes it’s worth it. Just used mine for the first time the other day. Worked great. I’ll refill small canisters from larger ones for hikes and then just use what’s left in the bigger canister for just camping or maybe short hikes.
Yes I agree that it is worth it in several applications. It was just something that for myself I needed to see how it performed over time.
We've been doing this with propane camping cannister. We find that eventually, the valve fails and starts leaking. I assume this will happen with this, too. I like the idea of marking them.
Yeah, leaks can suck when flammable gasses are involved 😂. I’m just overly cautious due to my background haha. Thanks for watching!
Great Video but I'm not sold on this gizmo. Just mark your tanks, use each up, recycle, and move on to next tank.
I do use this tool to refill canisters. It works for me.
Awesome!
Make sure that your total weight doesn't exceed the capacity of the fuel canister. Each one should have a weight of canister and weight of fuel. If you overfill you'll end up above that. Waiting longer might have helped as well. It's a pretty small hole and the vapor phase has to move past the liquid that is flowing down. If there isn't a big pressure differential, that can take a while.
Absolutely. I definitely did more that was edited out for time.
So exist the refill can? Or you only can do it with another old can?
I’m sure you could use a full can to refill an empty. I just had an abundance of partial cans lying around so used that for the test.
Nice 👍
Thank you my friend. I hope you are well!
This is dangerous. When you use a canister, especially in cooler weather, the butane is burnt off leaving behind that 20% propane in the blend. When you consolidate all that mostly propane back into a full canister, the pressures are three times higher. So this is not safe. Eventually someone is going to have an unwelcome bang.
Thank you
I think you have that backwards. The fuel canisters that most of us use backpacking are a mixture of 80% isobutane and 20% propane. Isobutane has a boiling point of -12 deg C and propane -42 deg C. At a temperature between those two boiling points propane will tend to move to the vapor phase and get burned off while most of the isobutane will be in the liquid phase and not get burned off (as fast). Over time the propane content of the fuel canister will decrease, not increase, and the partial pressure of propane will drop.
@ this is right from the Google: Canister pressure: Propane has higher pressures at room temperatures than isobutane. Canisters are not designed to withstand the pressures of propane in high percentages, so using a temperature differential to force the remaining fuel into a canister can be dangerous.
@ an almost empty canister contains mostly propane. So it is bad to consolidate them.