No. People aren't sick of superheroes. They're sick of movies about characters they've never heard of. Phase 4 and 5 mostly centered on the types of characters that wouldn't even appear in 90's video games. Man-Thing, Moon Knight, Ms.Marvel, G'aia, America Chavez, Wong, Shang Chi and Antman are not fan favorite characters of the main stream audiences. The characters we learned to love and follow were aged up, killed, replaced or retired. Oh but what about Loki? What ABOUT Loki? You can't mean him interacting with Hunter B-15, Mobius, and OB? These aren't really characters that had layers or depth beyond their place in that show. They're Loki's co-workers. And the characters we wanted to see interact with him, like Sylvie, barely did. There is no *Marvel Fatigue*, just disjointed projects and characters that don't hold a candle to Hulk, Cap, Ironman, Thor, Hawkeye or Black Widow.
"all of those things you said were incorrect because I don't have media literacy and can't be bothered to understand anything that isn't the sound of my last two braincells clanking together, if it's not the same video of baby shark that I've watched every day for the last five years, I don't wanna see it, only familiar things forever! What is that well written characters that feel things and grow? Get that stuff outta here! Imma big manly man and my emotional constipation is proof of that! I don't feel sissy things like 'sadness' or 'joy' or 'the inexplicable feeling of contentment when a loved one wants your presence in their life' .... I'm so lonely someone please love me...." There! I fixed your comment for you!❤
People are sick of seeing people make super hero videos on TH-cam. Especially when there is a small rumor. Every rumor doesn't need a 20 minute video with the same scenes. Every week a Loki video dropped you guys showed the same scenes from previous episodes. Watch. When Loki comes back in a future Marvel movie, they're going to show scenes from the Loki show to fill space. That is what makes people sick and tired.
@@Aeis_ArcadeScreenCrush hears a rumor about Jonathan Majors. Then they make a video showing the same scenes of him as Victor Timely and as He who remains in the Loki series.
I used to work for a major animation studio for the director and producer and I can tell you without hesitation that it’s not only studio notes that cause problems but they reach out to people like Spielberg and many other directors with great resumes to watch their cuts and give their notes. Then they review all the notes and go back to tweak the film over and over and over. Protecting these projects is like a mother trying to shield her baby in an apocalypse where bombs are going off all around. And EVERYONE even remotely associated with the production is trying to get their voices heard. So until they can get the filmmakers the autonomy they need, this will not change.
It's not JUST autonomy, though. It's producers AND directors who both care about the quality of the STORY/universe. I love Lord & Miller, but when I heard how they were managing Solo, even I thought Kennedy was right to say no.
I'm not fatigued, I'm just frustrated that over the past several years, the stories aren't self contained. They are part of an arc that won't get resolved until the next film or series.
But comic book movies, at least with the MCU, have always been serialized storytelling, just like actual comic books. Look at the storyline with Thanos; his arc didn't get resolved for YEARS, and no one complained. Why? Because the movies were good. If Marvel started making good movies again, I'm sure people would be happy to resume the ride.
I can't think of any MCU movie that didn't tell a complete story for its main character. Maybe some lose threads to string into future titles, but nothing that breaks a story. Unlike SpiderVerse ending with "to be continued"
"Sports fans routinely dress as their heroes and gather together to watch grown men play a child's game with balls" The wildest quote I've heard all week LMAO I'M DYING
This is Screencrush’s best video. I felt very seen in this and I’m going to share it with anyone that tries to tell my that superhero fatigue is a thing. Thank you for making this ❤️
Werewolf by Night is a perfect example of subverting the superhero genre by introducing monsters, horror, style, creative directing, practicality, and no studio interference more of that would be nice
At 15:00, I really actually liked this scene in Doctor Strange after doing a rewatch this year. At first, it just seemed like his cape was messing with him for comedic effect, but then I realized that the cape was actually wiping his tears away after his heavy conversation with Christine, telling him to be strong and showcasing that the cape cares for Stephen. To me, it was a brief moment of levity, and not as cringy as I had originally perceived it. The cape chose Strange, and its proven to be very protective of him over their time together
Oh yeah absolutely. I don't think there is a single instance of that kind of humor messing with the tone of that movie. But then there's Thor Love and Thunder...oof.
I still love superheroes. I love Invincible and rewatching old MCU movies. You know why? Because the writing and characters (for the most part) are actually good.
@@Last-Scar-5675 Not really, hence the question of "Super Hero Fatigue"...if the Writing was still good enough to get people in the seats, these questions wouldn't have been raised in the 1st place, but here we are...
So here's my take...I thought secret invasion and Ms. Marvel were really boring. BUT, watching Ms. Marvel all at once was a lot better than watching one episode every week. A lot of these shows really ARE cut up movies. Either take the time to properly write and build these stories or just release it all at once and hope for the best. In the words of Patrice O'Neal: If you offer me a stale donut, I'll take it. But I want it RIGHT NOW.
I for one enjoy the weekly watch, speculation, easter egg and theory videos, which for me gives a lot more enjoyable content. I can even go read some of the comics during the week to see what they referenced etc. If the whole season drops it’s gone in a day or two, instead of giving me something to wait for for a few months.
You beat me to my comment :p People are tired of bad writing. We didn't like Tony Stark because he was Iron Man, He liked Tony Stark because each of his movie appearances had an Arc, He started off flawed in his own was and over came them over the course of 12 or more movies. It was even to the point we didn't know he would snap to save the universe. because he wanted no part of putting his family in danger, he was finally a family man. He was happy. It's a very "human" story. Steve Rogers was the 180 from Tony. He was selfless, in the end he finally took something for himself. (as much as it didn't make sense, continuity wise)
Ryan “There has never been a live action Fantastic Four film” Me “you sit on a throne of lies!” Great video mate, you and the team did fantastic job of explaining something that I personally agree with it isn’t just superhero fatigue, It is just general mediocre movie fatigue
Very conflicted about this. I tend to enjoy a superhero film/show when I dip into it, but the thought of starting on one is REALLY tiring. The fatigue is real since despite a Disney+ connection, I really could not be bothered to keep up after Wandavision and She Hulk (which I dipped into at random and thought was a lot more fun than it got credit for). I thought Wandavision genuinely expanded the scope of storytelling in the genre but the inescapable problem is despite the emotional heft of the story, it will ALWAYS end with godlike creatures beating each other up. There was a time when the conflicts and action sequences were the high point of a film for me, but unless there's an entirely new visual vocabulary to the fights - like in the Spiderverse films - I'm now actively bored by visuals that would have made my jaw hit the floor back in the late 90s or through the 2000s. The closest analogy I can think of is eating four cheese pizzas - you may love them deeply, but as you get older, to keep that love going, the intervals between each time you have one needs to get longer and longer. But at least over the last couple of years, it feels like at least one big streaming platform has been replacing all the other food with four cheese pizzas, and the only alternative is the eight or 12 cheese pizzas of franchises I'm fundamentally uninterested in like Star Wars or ones that seem to have gone off the rails completely like The Simpsons. It gets harder and harder to find something that isn't these things without going back to really old shows. Over the last couple of years, some of the most fun I had was watching Dexter (which, despite its vastly variable quality between seasons, had an exhilarating unpredictably to it) and The Sopranos. Also sometimes its just a relief to watch something that is not being discussed threadbare at the time you are watching it. Fantastic video though, and a great companion piece to the one on Disney.
Great video. I think the fix is simpler than it seems: 1. Hire writers & directors who actually care 2. Don’t be afraid to adapt some of the comics more closely 3. Develop your talent 4. Let directors put their own ideas into projects 5. Stop leaving so many loose threads
That Stephano joke was so on point. I used to watch that show at work. Came back a few years later and had no idea what was happening. So there you go.
For real. I agree with them to some degree, but I'm so tired of this topic. They're doing a video like this at least once a week. Is the negativity really helping the channel?
For me, it was the introduction of time travel and the multiverse. Not only do I find them confusing at times, they rewrite the rules on consequences. It's hard to care about life and death decisions when I know they can just press an undo button. The other thing is the brief cameo introductions of too many characters that we know almost nothing about, like you mentioned. They're not enough to excite us as characters and only serve to dilute the main story. Ironheart is a perfect example. Give us more short "Werewolf By Night" shows as backstories so we can be at least somewhat invested when they hit the screen. They don't always have to be either 10 minutes of screen time or 6-8 hour miniseries.
Yes I felt that Thor: Love and Thunder failed majorly due to the quick timelapses of him going from "DAD BOD to GOD BOD" and then the quick timelapse of his love life. The montages from Luis in Ant-Man movies were great! But in Love and Thunder, they took away fromt the story. Thor being "Bro-Thor" in Endgame was a big deal for many fans and we wanted to see him come back and turn God again. Also not to mention, the behind-the-scenes "KILLING SPREE" of Gorr. They didn't even show him killing gods after that one time at the start. The humour was miserable too!
I sort of agree but I think it was just THOSE ones. SpiderMan No Way Home was pretty good even though it involved the multiverse. Doctor Strange was just a huge turd. So many possibilities and thats what they came up with? I think Time Travel was just in that one movie wasn't it? Sure, invent a time machine in a weekend. Tony Stark shows up and basically says "you forgot to carry the one right, he turned into a baby". Yes, time travel is THAT easy. For me it wrecked the whole movie, although the battle scene at the end was pretty good.
@user-jp5nc8zf7m time travel in Endgame allowed the filmmakers to provide so much fabulous fan service by revisiting moments from favorite films. I don't believe time travel and Endgame, which I thought was fantastic btw) are the problems, the multiverse is a different animal than time travel.
I love that you mentioned the Epic of Gilgamesh, which is the oldest piece of literature that we've ever found... and it's a superhero story. Superheroes are literally the grandfather of narrative
I don't know if you've talked about it yet... but another problem that I'm noticing is the younger folks are less interested in movies and tv and more interested in short attention span streaming on their hand held devices.
Hard disagree. I’m a millennial surrounded by gen z at work and home life. They, almost exclusively, like watching movies and TV. Yes, they also like tik tok and some have short attention spans to things that don’t interest them, but I find it that older people don’t have time to watch anything but the news while drinking coffee in the morning. Movie theaters are full of young people when you go to the movies. Very rarely do I see anyone above 40 at the movies.
@@melmorenoi I wonder if it's a regional thing... or even just a component of Urban, Suburban and Rural communities. When I was in my 20s and we went to movies every seat was full and most everyone was my age +/- 10yrs. Now at 58 I go to local theaters and there's more seats empty than full and 2/3s are the exact same age group as from my 20's.... the younger folks tend to be the adult children of the old news watching coffee drinking fogies like me. Now.. in defense of the partially empty room, there's a dozen screens or more and in my youth 6-8 would have been the max (locally) so of course more screens allows the masses to be spread out, but shouldn't the increased population suggest that adding more screens has only managed to keep up with that growing population? I'm certainly no expert... but I do see my children's groups of friends far less interested in going to movies... unless I organize it for the four of us to go see a movie together... they're 35, 25 & 18 by the way. Oh and I live in a small city within 40 miles of Boston and 15 miles of Portsmouth NH... so there's plenty of things for young folks to do other than go to movies.
@@crittyluslowshout out to Salem?😄 I live in a small city in RI. Movies are one of only a few things that kids have to do here. Hallelujah for the new mini golf! And sadly, that affects the experience of others who go. I have seen a group of teenagers sitting in the back, chatting and talking as if they were in their living room at home. Running in and out for more snacks every five-ten minutes, and not just exiting....doing the "run, run, jump!" on the wide theater stairs as if they were 5 and not 15. They didn't grow up in theaters as we did, so they've no etiquette. Honestly, they would have saved their parents money if they had just gone out to a restaurant and had a meal together. Because they surely each spent more on those snacks than a restaurant meal would have cost them. And the phones come out, too. I've been in the classroom for 30 yrs, and I can tell you for certain that reduced attention span is partly to blame. So as an adult when I am faced with a friend, who wants to go to the 7 o'clock show of a new film so that she can get to bed in time (because she's older) or going to the 9 o'clock by myself so that I don't have to deal with loud teenagers ruining my experience, I'm caught. When a film is in its first week, if it is PG-13 or an easier rating, or it looks like it would be remotely of interest to teenagers, I wait until it has been out for a few days or a week.... Which means that I wind up missing a lot of films because I don't want to deal with that element.
Exactly what you said. It has been tough to convince people though that it is the executives at Disney setting these crazy deadlines and messing with the final result. If anyone doesn’t think Disney keeps a tight hold of the content they put out, they should listen to Alex Hirsch talk about the changes they would make to the gravity falls scripts… insane
Actually, this is a great take on the matter, i’m really tired of the bad wiritting, the bad characters, the boring strong female lead, and the bad use of old characters
The same story that destroys every industry and business: executives with too much power think they know better, make too many of the decisions and squeeze both the work force and the consumer base. Marvel built itself by making quality movies with interesting characters and fun stories but lately if feels like Marvel is living off of brand loyalty rather than quality.
It's not fatigue, it's just the first MCU felt very new and fresh, with a long time between two projects. Now there are loads of movies and series every year, and you must see everything to get the whole story. And also us fans watch videos to know which movies and series will come out in the next years so it really kills the surprise effect :)
@@berniemadoff9688 hi, i don’t think this is fatigue, i still enjoy a lot of super hero stories, and i enjoy most of what marvel is releasing (except secret invasion which was really bad). I think the issue the mcu has is the lack of surprise effect when a project comes out, but it seems they are going to release less projects this year some hopefully it will help.
I keep saying the problem is that they're focusing on Quantity over Quality. I love watching good superhero media, often times I'll go back and rewatch episodes of Daredevil or Jessica Jones, because they were well written shows.
Brilliant 👏🏾 An excellent deconstruction, and detailed narrative that examined and explored every genre of cinema that focuses on cultural archetypes. Kudos!
Thx for giving a shout out/recommendation for Blue Beetle!😀 My new favorite superhero movie…I just hope it gets a sequel 🤞 Keep up the awesome work on your videos!
Personally, with watching everything on streaming, or premium TH-cam, I'm never aware of new movies coming out, without someone like this channel mentioning/doing the trailer. Wish, Blue Beetle, etc....I had no idea these movies were even coming out until they were already in theatres. On top of those, having things like Black Widow available to purchase during COVID on D+ while it was in theatres, and the later super short (usually around 60-80 days) amount of time we have to wait for things to go from the theatre to streaming, it just doesn't seem worth it to go to the theatre anymore. Especially having not many nerdy friends/sig. other to go to the movies with, it just makes more sense for me to personally wait for movies to be available on streaming. I don't necessarily think superhero movies are DYING, but I DO think there's alot of people like me, who aren't fatigued, but also aren't going to the theatres. But it doesn't mean that (probably first week of release) that we're not watching those same movies once they're on streaming. I think if the streaming numbers later on were taken into consideration, numbers may seem higher. Also, I know it was controversial, but I really do think things like D+ should bring back the ability to rent a movie that's in theatres, on streaming, for a price. Those numbers + the theatres numbers might not be as much as pre-COVID, but I do think they would see a boost in revenue doing this
I haven't been to a theater since 2012. The first Avengers movie is the last one I watched at the theater. For me it's to expensive to take my family to see a movie. I can sit home fix a nice meal and enjoy a movie on streaming while sitting on my couch and relaxed.
It's not just one thing, but many reasons. Lack of stand alone stories, quality issues etc. Also, people going out the cinema in general has gone down. Myself, and others I know have had too many experiences of trying to go see a film, and kids with tablets at full volume during the movie, or just running around loudly, has become more and more common, especially after the pandemic. If you have a great TV and sound system at home, just wait a few months.
I think the “super hero fatigue” comments started at the same time that the stakes were time traveled away. Then they doubled down with infinite universes, realms, and timelines. There are no more stakes and the stories are suffering.
I don’t need to say anything about superhero fatigue, the numbers speak for themself. There will always be a small core audience for the genre but the wider fad is over.
Because people are tired of the same shit. Now, if they started phrasing these things as frontier movies (Fantastic Four) or monster movies (Swamp Thing). Maybe a Noir Detective film (The Batman), things would probably be better.
I think people know if they wait 3 months they can see the movies of thier choice on the platform they' like and at a convenient price , from the comfort of home where you can eat and drink or even wear what you want . Going outside takes work, so it's Laziness not fatigue, people are lazy and want convenience at thier own leisure. Also it's not just superhero movies , apparently it's all movies , so my theory has some weight to it ,
I think people are fatigued by leaks and being constantly barraged for 2-3 years about a movie, that then can’t provide them with a novel experience, because they have already seen and heard every detail of it a thousand times
I love marvel, since I watched Iron Man on 2008 I´ve never missed a movie or show on release weekend. But you were spot on when you said that lately we get all these teases that never give a payoff, right now the MCU feels disconnected and that needs to be fixed. I actually think the marvels was a step on that direction
Or maybe the reason the box office numbers are down is because we know we can wait a few months to watch marvel on Disney or DC on HBO max. It’s not that complicated; they give us an alternative option to watch (which has more content) then complain we don’t go to the theater to watch 1 movie for the same fee as the whole month
This video was exceptionally well edited, perfect with the memes. For some reason the matrix genre meme got me hard. Also totally agree on Blue Beetle being a good movie, I thought it was great. It really felt like a proper cape comic movie from the 90's in a lot of ways, but modern so best of both worlds.
I adore cinema, I watch films in every genre and I think the problem is suits messing with creative visions and awful writing. Btw, what a well written video.
@14:26 Another thing they all do is the "whoosh.". When they're looking at some digital /holographic info, then they want everyone to see, so they "grab" the outside of the image, and WHOOSH their hands apart, and the digital image suddenly enlarges to the size of the room. Happened in nearly every single MCU movie.
It's not fatigue, and it's not "wokeness" as I'm sure some guys will claim. The movies are awesome! It's just that it costs an arm and a leg to go to the theater and have some snacks, anymore. On a lesser note, I like to think that people are also fed up that theater owners (smaller ones in particular) don't get as much of a cut of ticket sales anymore.
17:59 After watching Oppenheimer 3 times I came across an article detailing how the movie going experience is an art form and should be experienced as such not just for content. They put to words much more elegantly than I can that I share that same sentiment and is the reason I saw Oppenheimer 3 times. The soundtrack to Oppenheimer is sublime, seeing it in 70mm film, the first case of black and white IMAX film, the performances of Emily Blunt and RDJ elevate the story beyond the creation of the atomic age and the father of the atomic bomb. I do not go to the theater to see something that I can otherwise watch on TH-cam or tv.
Really loving the fact other than super hero movie, the regular movies are getting a shine and yes now the box office is low for regular movies but in the future the regular movies will make more money than super hero movies. Things will go back to normal
The sports team analogy is pretty spot on. I think MCU is at a rebuilding phase, after losing players like Tony Stark and Cap, so it’s just not possible to do what infinity saga did in the end, right away in this point in time. We have to rebuild for something epic and hope it works. In the mean time, let the upcoming projects be good writing and great films, but our time will come again some day when all this pays off. I’m all here for it, and if nothing else i’m extremely glad i got to experience the infinity saga when it happened. I still rewatch all the movies while waiting for new ones.
I think we have record breaking opening weekends ahead of us, I think people will talk this way over and over until the fandom for a character or team is too big and it will have everyone watching again. If it's done right, it will show people that theres a turn around
Incredible video, Ryan, thank you! I feel like a lot of Marvel's past few years have been movies taking bigger swings with interesting ideas, trying to change up some of the usual formulas, but with mixed results. Dr Strange 2 was a horror movie, Wandavision was a slow-burn mystery/horror, Thor 4 was a romcom, The Celestials was a space epic. None of these were things they tried in the first saga of the MCU. Did they all work all the time? No, not really. Nothing was perfect, a lot of things kinda ended up back in "super hero movie" territory. But personally, I enjoyed the attempts. I can forgive a misstep when it's from trying something wild and different. I've had a ton of fun with most of the recent marvel productions, even when they're a little goofy. It almost seems to me that this is what Marvel maybe shouldn't have done? I wonder why it is that I'm still enjoying most of these things, but a lot of people are falling off. Am I just easy to please? Or am I just too much of a sucker for Sam Raimi? Should Marvel have just kept making movies like Iron Man 1 and never stopped?
I agree Blue beetle was amazing. I think the problem was blue beetle isn't an a lister. Much like a movie about the the question, or spectre would not do well no matter how good it is.
I don't most viewers are sick of superheroes. I would bet most fell in love with the 1st two Christian Bale Batman and most of the MCU Phase 1-3. Most where gritty comic book styled movies. The "fun movies" isn't what the paying customers want.
Completely agree with everything said. I think the main reason I liked Across the Spider-Verse, Guardians 3 & the Loki series is cause those all felt like they actually had some original ideas and flavors besides MCU Vanilla, which I love but it gets repetitive.
I would agree that it’s more of the mainstream population getting off the bandwagon. It’s unfortunate that a drop in quality came in at the same time to kind of reinforce the notion of‘superhero fatigue’
Amen brothers and sisters. It’s bad movie fatigue. I for one, like Ryan and many of you, can’t wait for Marvel to straighten up and continue with the many great characters and stories developed thru decades.
Do you think people have adjusted to streaming services by only going to movies that pop and go back less after watching a movie once knowing it will be on a streaming service in a few months?
Something that I have heard dozens of times from friends and family is that they just don't understand the Marvel movies any more because there's too much backstory to know and so they don't enjoy. Anyone watching this channel will probably have all the background and catch Easter eggs, but most viewers get lost when the stories are too involved and assume you know what happened in multiple other movies (and now Disney+ shows). I think that the big maps of the Marvel phases and associated movies and shows over decades show why Feige and team are treating this a bit too much like a soap opera where it's hard for a casual fan to follow what's going on if they haven't been watching everything closely for years.
I think it‘s more like franchise fatigue to be honest, not just only superhero movies. Franchises like Mission Impossible, Indiana Jones or Fast & Furious also tanked heavily this year. I think the era of blockbuster franchise movies is currently in decline because most of these movies have become somewhat like visual fast food. Just like that restaurant, Sylvie chose to work at in Loki season 2. You know what you‘re getting, it always tastes sorta ok, relatively cheap and you‘re getting it fast. And that‘s the same with franchise movies. Those have become sort of predictable to some extent, because they always appear at the same time of the year, have the same PR cycles around it and it feels more like an industrially made thing. Whereas movies like Oppenheimer or Barbie this year cleaned up at the box office, not only due to their incredible fan hype, but also because the movies offered something, other movies don‘t have: well written plots and characters. Barbie is an incredible movie about finding someone‘s identity in the modern world and learning about the male-dominated society that we are living in. Oppenheimer is a super-hero origin, heist movie and court-room drama in one for the price of one movie ticket. Applied to superhero movies: that would be something like realizing Demon in a bottle for Iron Man or Superior Spider-Man with Doc Ock taking over Peter Parker‘s body… or what Joker did, a psychological study of a cast-out comedian who slowly transitions into chaos and madness. That‘s what I really want tot see more of in the future: more surprises, more character developments, more intimacy.
It's not entirely CEO's fault. They respond to the shareholders that demand more money every year, so they decide to sell toys. When its not about the characters but about the toys, all its lost.
It really is that the movies are missing good stories and interesting characters we can watch on an epic arc journey. Tony Stark became Ironman... but then from there we saw what his hubris brought... and then what Triana he had to live with... and him finally treating Pepper right and Tony becoming a dad and not like Clint Barton secret kids type of dad, but a guy who lived for his kid... in fact, it was his affection for Peter that made him change his no. He knows what being a dad feels like. And he finally made the sacrificial play. Huge satisfying charger arc over numerous movies. Superman, Batman, Guardians of the Galaxy... all good stories and made their heroes wrestle with things and grow. Now we get thrown into the middle of a story with characters that aren't compelling. I haven't seen the Marvels yet. I wanted to. I wanted to see what became of Monica after WandaVisiom and who doesn't love Kamala. The problem is, I never grew to love Captain Marvel - I don't hate her at all. I just couldn't loved her, because she was under utilized and under developed as a character. The fact is, I don't think they wanted her to be THE hero... maybe a franchise pawn or a cultural icon, but certainly not stepping up as The Strongest Avenger. So we get a movie that looked cool but lacked substance. Her back story would've bonded us to her, but she didn't remember it and we didn't really see it much. She was barely in the Avengers, didn't really bond with anyone, wasn't called for any previous intergalactic issues, and barely did what she was capable of doing (so as not to outshine our heroes or steal Tony's moment). I liked her most in End Game but still wish we could've seen her adventures in space. And we weren't given Carol Danvers in Secret Invasion with the people she was supposed to be helping... just her powers taken from some sample. So, yeah. Missing stories, character development, and arcs. My take. (Not a hot take, sounds like Ryan's.)
The comment about Marvel needing less money reminds me of this Coppola quote about filming Apocalypse Now. "There were too many of us. We had access to to to much money. Too much equipment. And little by little we went insane." Also, theres an incredible video by Patrick H Willems called "Who Killed Cinema," and it's absolutely worth a watch.
Yes. Usually when something becomes over saturated, the quality suffers.. Just like the mid-late 90s slasher film.. or the early-mid 00s with Teen movies..or the big blockbuster Action Hero no longer exists.
I wonder if anyone considers the amount of coverage these movies get as part of the fatigue. Big fan of ScreenCrush + Heavy Spoilers but would directly attach them to my fatigue. The amount of coverage and the content has completely changed over 5 years and in essence you can experience a majority of a movie without watching it just from these two channels alone. The amount of content being produced per individual movie is an endurance test for a person's interest on a topic.
I’m not tired of super hero movies. I did take some time to not be as hyped from every new announcement specifically because it seems like the studios are just putting things out for the sake of putting them out. The reason why the infinity saga was so beloved was because of how much easier it was to digest the new movies that would come out, giving the fans time to ponder what could come next. The MCU recently has tried to recreate those building blocks but without the strength of character and world building we saw from the beginning. Getting into the MCU later in my teen years helped me gain more interest in the source material, sparking new interest in the comics. Now I’d rather read the comics and forget all about whatever is coming next with the way things are going.
@ScreenCrush Sometime could you do a breakdown of what MCU works currently have unresolved cliffhangers or midcredit scenes? I just tried to do a list but it is super-long. We keep thinking Marvel will whittle down the list with the next movie (like the ten rings could have tied in with the Marvels somehow), but instead the list just keeps on growing. In the past, with the exception of Thanos, usually when we got a cliffhanger midcredits scene it was resolved one or two movies later, not years. Also, how do you think Blade could fit into the MCU by now? I had a theory the other day that the new Blade movie would be set in a different universe that collides with the MCU in Secret Wars, but Blade's appearance in Eternals disproves that.
one of my issues, which you address is them trying to make every title a comedy. yes you, thor 4. that was the final straw in my opinion. i like when my fantastical characters from the comics are presented as if the were real, with faults and things to overcome. otherwise it’s just bat nipples on everything. lastly i really hate knowing that marvel has tons of extra footage they never used but refuse to put out director cuts or reedit them into better movies after they have come and failed. yes, i talking to thor 4, but also age of ultron, the marvels, etc.
17:45 "Marvel studios is repeating the same mistakes from the comics". I agree. To me the start of the MCU movie universe was like Marvel Comics in the 60s. Everything was new and fantastic. But in the 70s Marvel Comics became a bit boring. There was a house style and each comic felt like a carbon copy of something done better in the sixties. Then in the 80s new young artists showed up and were allowed to create comics in their own style. Different to the established Marvel house style. For example Frank Millers Daredevil. Also John Byrnes Fantastic Four run had a clear John Byrne style. And in today's comics, all kinds of styles are "allowed" and that keeps comics interesting and fresh. Coming back to movies: We need film directors that deviate from the MCU formula and bring in their own film style, even if it will be totally different than all the MCU movies before. There was one MCU movie that did this: "The Eternals". Also in the DC universe, Zack Snyder brought in his own special film style.
Maybe the studios should allow for more autonomy for the storytellers/witers and directors (those who seem more invested in the characters and the stories). When corporate heads become involved, less care seems to be given to entertaining or thrilling the audience and more to investors and bankrolls (merchandise, etc.).
I've seen every MCU movie in the theater and I do not have superhero movie fatigue. On the other hand, I only watched a couple episodes of Ms. Marvel, Secret Invasion, and Loki season 2. And I liked Ms. Marvel and Loki but all it takes is missing a couple of weeks and you feel like you're so far behind that you're just not going to go back and watch it because now there's a whole other show starting. I have Disney+ fatigue. Honestly, I was really hoping for more one off specials like the Guardians Holiday Special and Werewolf By Night. Makes watching something on Disney+ an event again. That's how it started with Wanda/Vision. Back then it felt fresh and new to have weekly MCU content outside of Agents of SHIELD. Now it's every week there's either new Marvel or new Star Wars.
hmm...i'd say Star Wars was more a rare example of a 'mash-up' - it had the western elements at Mos Eisley and the vagabond rogue that was Han, but it also was a WW2 battle film...but it also was a knight rescues princess film...and THEN throw in Joseph Campbell into the mix.
Use SCVIDEO to get 55% off your first month at Scentbird sbird.co/3SUzWIO
No. People aren't sick of superheroes. They're sick of movies about characters they've never heard of. Phase 4 and 5 mostly centered on the types of characters that wouldn't even appear in 90's video games. Man-Thing, Moon Knight, Ms.Marvel, G'aia, America Chavez, Wong, Shang Chi and Antman are not fan favorite characters of the main stream audiences. The characters we learned to love and follow were aged up, killed, replaced or retired.
Oh but what about Loki? What ABOUT Loki? You can't mean him interacting with Hunter B-15, Mobius, and OB? These aren't really characters that had layers or depth beyond their place in that show. They're Loki's co-workers. And the characters we wanted to see interact with him, like Sylvie, barely did. There is no *Marvel Fatigue*, just disjointed projects and characters that don't hold a candle to Hulk, Cap, Ironman, Thor, Hawkeye or Black Widow.
"all of those things you said were incorrect because I don't have media literacy and can't be bothered to understand anything that isn't the sound of my last two braincells clanking together, if it's not the same video of baby shark that I've watched every day for the last five years, I don't wanna see it, only familiar things forever! What is that well written characters that feel things and grow? Get that stuff outta here! Imma big manly man and my emotional constipation is proof of that! I don't feel sissy things like 'sadness' or 'joy' or 'the inexplicable feeling of contentment when a loved one wants your presence in their life' .... I'm so lonely someone please love me...." There! I fixed your comment for you!❤
People are sick of seeing people make super hero videos on TH-cam. Especially when there is a small rumor. Every rumor doesn't need a 20 minute video with the same scenes. Every week a Loki video dropped you guys showed the same scenes from previous episodes. Watch. When Loki comes back in a future Marvel movie, they're going to show scenes from the Loki show to fill space. That is what makes people sick and tired.
@@Aeis_ArcadeScreenCrush hears a rumor about Jonathan Majors. Then they make a video showing the same scenes of him as Victor Timely and as He who remains in the Loki series.
It feels like you guys already made this video like 5 times in the past 1 year
I used to work for a major animation studio for the director and producer and I can tell you without hesitation that it’s not only studio notes that cause problems but they reach out to people like Spielberg and many other directors with great resumes to watch their cuts and give their notes. Then they review all the notes and go back to tweak the film over and over and over. Protecting these projects is like a mother trying to shield her baby in an apocalypse where bombs are going off all around. And EVERYONE even remotely associated with the production is trying to get their voices heard. So until they can get the filmmakers the autonomy they need, this will not change.
I’m also a studio vet and you make a great point. Studio meddling is a MAJOR issue.
It's not JUST autonomy, though. It's producers AND directors who both care about the quality of the STORY/universe. I love Lord & Miller, but when I heard how they were managing Solo, even I thought Kennedy was right to say no.
Doug being so aggressive towards the Doug plushie is starting to be my new fav thing. Absolutely hilarious 😂😂
@user-ho2mj5wo7j facts. On one of the other vids Doug was yelling at the plushie and calling it stupid took me out lmao I was dyin
@@redskybyam586I just started watching this guy a few days ago. Is that a new thing? Lol I agree it’s hilarious
Everything Doug is great. I enjoyed the clips explaining movies to Doug.
I'm not into most comix or superheroes; Doug is why I'm here 😅
I'm not fatigued, I'm just frustrated that over the past several years, the stories aren't self contained. They are part of an arc that won't get resolved until the next film or series.
or won't get resolved at all, which is even worse.
Too right !
But comic book movies, at least with the MCU, have always been serialized storytelling, just like actual comic books. Look at the storyline with Thanos; his arc didn't get resolved for YEARS, and no one complained. Why? Because the movies were good. If Marvel started making good movies again, I'm sure people would be happy to resume the ride.
I can't think of any MCU movie that didn't tell a complete story for its main character.
Maybe some lose threads to string into future titles, but nothing that breaks a story.
Unlike SpiderVerse ending with "to be continued"
I'm fine with an arc taking two or three or even four movies, but he hit it on the head when he talked about all the teases and setups that never come
"Sports fans routinely dress as their heroes and gather together to watch grown men play a child's game with balls"
The wildest quote I've heard all week LMAO I'M DYING
As long as there are only real life supervillains controlling everything, there will always be a need for escapism.
💯
This is Screencrush’s best video. I felt very seen in this and I’m going to share it with anyone that tries to tell my that superhero fatigue is a thing. Thank you for making this ❤️
Werewolf by Night is a perfect example of subverting the superhero genre by introducing monsters, horror, style, creative directing, practicality, and no studio interference more of that would be nice
At 15:00, I really actually liked this scene in Doctor Strange after doing a rewatch this year. At first, it just seemed like his cape was messing with him for comedic effect, but then I realized that the cape was actually wiping his tears away after his heavy conversation with Christine, telling him to be strong and showcasing that the cape cares for Stephen. To me, it was a brief moment of levity, and not as cringy as I had originally perceived it. The cape chose Strange, and its proven to be very protective of him over their time together
Oh yeah absolutely. I don't think there is a single instance of that kind of humor messing with the tone of that movie. But then there's Thor Love and Thunder...oof.
I still love superheroes. I love Invincible and rewatching old MCU movies.
You know why?
Because the writing and characters (for the most part) are actually good.
The writing is actually gud in the current phase of the MCU
@@Last-Scar-5675I don't know what "gud" means, but if you follow this channel, you will be well versed in what makes the current marvel phase poor.
@@Last-Scar-5675 Not really, hence the question of "Super Hero Fatigue"...if the Writing was still good enough to get people in the seats, these questions wouldn't have been raised in the 1st place, but here we are...
Agreed
@@Last-Scar-5675Stop it
So here's my take...I thought secret invasion and Ms. Marvel were really boring. BUT, watching Ms. Marvel all at once was a lot better than watching one episode every week. A lot of these shows really ARE cut up movies. Either take the time to properly write and build these stories or just release it all at once and hope for the best.
In the words of Patrice O'Neal: If you offer me a stale donut, I'll take it. But I want it RIGHT NOW.
I for one enjoy the weekly watch, speculation, easter egg and theory videos, which for me gives a lot more enjoyable content. I can even go read some of the comics during the week to see what they referenced etc. If the whole season drops it’s gone in a day or two, instead of giving me something to wait for for a few months.
No. People are just sick of movies that aren’t good. Marvel’s content has just been substandard
Saw a supercut of the CGI slipping. Definitely cutting corners to rush sh't out. Also the bane of gaming studios too.
You beat me to my comment :p
People are tired of bad writing. We didn't like Tony Stark because he was Iron Man,
He liked Tony Stark because each of his movie appearances had an Arc, He started off flawed in his own was
and over came them over the course of 12 or more movies. It was even to the point we didn't know he would snap to save the universe.
because he wanted no part of putting his family in danger, he was finally a family man.
He was happy. It's a very "human" story. Steve Rogers was the 180 from Tony.
He was selfless, in the end he finally took something for himself. (as much as it didn't make sense, continuity wise)
Exactly 👍🏻
Faxts tho
This is why I'm making my own version of avengers the kang dynasty so we have a good story with good characters and good writing
Ryan “There has never been a live action Fantastic Four film”
Me “you sit on a throne of lies!”
Great video mate, you and the team did fantastic job of explaining something that I personally agree with it isn’t just superhero fatigue, It is just general mediocre movie fatigue
Very conflicted about this. I tend to enjoy a superhero film/show when I dip into it, but the thought of starting on one is REALLY tiring.
The fatigue is real since despite a Disney+ connection, I really could not be bothered to keep up after Wandavision and She Hulk (which I dipped into at random and thought was a lot more fun than it got credit for). I thought Wandavision genuinely expanded the scope of storytelling in the genre but the inescapable problem is despite the emotional heft of the story, it will ALWAYS end with godlike creatures beating each other up.
There was a time when the conflicts and action sequences were the high point of a film for me, but unless there's an entirely new visual vocabulary to the fights - like in the Spiderverse films - I'm now actively bored by visuals that would have made my jaw hit the floor back in the late 90s or through the 2000s.
The closest analogy I can think of is eating four cheese pizzas - you may love them deeply, but as you get older, to keep that love going, the intervals between each time you have one needs to get longer and longer.
But at least over the last couple of years, it feels like at least one big streaming platform has been replacing all the other food with four cheese pizzas, and the only alternative is the eight or 12 cheese pizzas of franchises I'm fundamentally uninterested in like Star Wars or ones that seem to have gone off the rails completely like The Simpsons.
It gets harder and harder to find something that isn't these things without going back to really old shows. Over the last couple of years, some of the most fun I had was watching Dexter (which, despite its vastly variable quality between seasons, had an exhilarating unpredictably to it) and The Sopranos. Also sometimes its just a relief to watch something that is not being discussed threadbare at the time you are watching it.
Fantastic video though, and a great companion piece to the one on Disney.
Great video. I think the fix is simpler than it seems: 1. Hire writers & directors who actually care 2. Don’t be afraid to adapt some of the comics more closely 3. Develop your talent 4. Let directors put their own ideas into projects 5. Stop leaving so many loose threads
Totally agree. I don’t have fatigue. Just tired of the suits ruining what could be really good movies.
That Stephano joke was so on point. I used to watch that show at work. Came back a few years later and had no idea what was happening. So there you go.
Is it possible to get fatigued from people explaining why I am supposed to be fatigued?
For real. I agree with them to some degree, but I'm so tired of this topic. They're doing a video like this at least once a week. Is the negativity really helping the channel?
There are channels out there that survive doing nothing but negative Disney videos, so yeah I guess so unfortunately.@@fizzle7421
For me, it was the introduction of time travel and the multiverse. Not only do I find them confusing at times, they rewrite the rules on consequences. It's hard to care about life and death decisions when I know they can just press an undo button. The other thing is the brief cameo introductions of too many characters that we know almost nothing about, like you mentioned. They're not enough to excite us as characters and only serve to dilute the main story. Ironheart is a perfect example. Give us more short "Werewolf By Night" shows as backstories so we can be at least somewhat invested when they hit the screen. They don't always have to be either 10 minutes of screen time or 6-8 hour miniseries.
Yes I felt that Thor: Love and Thunder failed majorly due to the quick timelapses of him going from "DAD BOD to GOD BOD" and then the quick timelapse of his love life. The montages from Luis in Ant-Man movies were great! But in Love and Thunder, they took away fromt the story. Thor being "Bro-Thor" in Endgame was a big deal for many fans and we wanted to see him come back and turn God again. Also not to mention, the behind-the-scenes "KILLING SPREE" of Gorr. They didn't even show him killing gods after that one time at the start. The humour was miserable too!
I sort of agree but I think it was just THOSE ones. SpiderMan No Way Home was pretty good even though it involved the multiverse. Doctor Strange was just a huge turd. So many possibilities and thats what they came up with?
I think Time Travel was just in that one movie wasn't it? Sure, invent a time machine in a weekend. Tony Stark shows up and basically says "you forgot to carry the one right, he turned into a baby". Yes, time travel is THAT easy.
For me it wrecked the whole movie, although the battle scene at the end was pretty good.
Agreed, Once you introduce time travel, you basically jump the shark imo
Only a good writer can handle an element like that
Also, the director is one of those people either love or hate due to his style of humour @@AVR0709
@user-jp5nc8zf7m time travel in Endgame allowed the filmmakers to provide so much fabulous fan service by revisiting moments from favorite films. I don't believe time travel and Endgame, which I thought was fantastic btw) are the problems, the multiverse is a different animal than time travel.
Best comic video I gave watched in a long time. Well reasoned and researched
Moon Knight was fantastic. The characters were fleshed out and Oscar Isaac's performance (and Ethan Hawk's) was great.
Moon Knight was terrible.
Agreed. I think that was the last decent thing from Marvel or DC for me.
oh, trust me; they're not sick of superhero films; they're just sick of bad films
I love that you mentioned the Epic of Gilgamesh, which is the oldest piece of literature that we've ever found... and it's a superhero story. Superheroes are literally the grandfather of narrative
I don't know if you've talked about it yet... but another problem that I'm noticing is the younger folks are less interested in movies and tv and more interested in short attention span streaming on their hand held devices.
Hard disagree. I’m a millennial surrounded by gen z at work and home life. They, almost exclusively, like watching movies and TV. Yes, they also like tik tok and some have short attention spans to things that don’t interest them, but I find it that older people don’t have time to watch anything but the news while drinking coffee in the morning. Movie theaters are full of young people when you go to the movies. Very rarely do I see anyone above 40 at the movies.
@@melmorenoi I wonder if it's a regional thing... or even just a component of Urban, Suburban and Rural communities. When I was in my 20s and we went to movies every seat was full and most everyone was my age +/- 10yrs. Now at 58 I go to local theaters and there's more seats empty than full and 2/3s are the exact same age group as from my 20's.... the younger folks tend to be the adult children of the old news watching coffee drinking fogies like me. Now.. in defense of the partially empty room, there's a dozen screens or more and in my youth 6-8 would have been the max (locally) so of course more screens allows the masses to be spread out, but shouldn't the increased population suggest that adding more screens has only managed to keep up with that growing population? I'm certainly no expert... but I do see my children's groups of friends far less interested in going to movies... unless I organize it for the four of us to go see a movie together... they're 35, 25 & 18 by the way. Oh and I live in a small city within 40 miles of Boston and 15 miles of Portsmouth NH... so there's plenty of things for young folks to do other than go to movies.
@@crittyluslowshout out to Salem?😄
I live in a small city in RI. Movies are one of only a few things that kids have to do here. Hallelujah for the new mini golf! And sadly, that affects the experience of others who go. I have seen a group of teenagers sitting in the back, chatting and talking as if they were in their living room at home. Running in and out for more snacks every five-ten minutes, and not just exiting....doing the "run, run, jump!" on the wide theater stairs as if they were 5 and not 15. They didn't grow up in theaters as we did, so they've no etiquette. Honestly, they would have saved their parents money if they had just gone out to a restaurant and had a meal together. Because they surely each spent more on those snacks than a restaurant meal would have cost them.
And the phones come out, too. I've been in the classroom for 30 yrs, and I can tell you for certain that reduced attention span is partly to blame. So as an adult when I am faced with a friend, who wants to go to the 7 o'clock show of a new film so that she can get to bed in time (because she's older) or going to the 9 o'clock by myself so that I don't have to deal with loud teenagers ruining my experience, I'm caught.
When a film is in its first week, if it is PG-13 or an easier rating, or it looks like it would be remotely of interest to teenagers, I wait until it has been out for a few days or a week.... Which means that I wind up missing a lot of films because I don't want to deal with that element.
Exactly what you said. It has been tough to convince people though that it is the executives at Disney setting these crazy deadlines and messing with the final result. If anyone doesn’t think Disney keeps a tight hold of the content they put out, they should listen to Alex Hirsch talk about the changes they would make to the gravity falls scripts… insane
All excellent points, and I'm glad I'm not the only one who is enjoying what we have now because we know what it was like before.
Actually, this is a great take on the matter, i’m really tired of the bad wiritting, the bad characters, the boring strong female lead, and the bad use of old characters
The same story that destroys every industry and business: executives with too much power think they know better, make too many of the decisions and squeeze both the work force and the consumer base.
Marvel built itself by making quality movies with interesting characters and fun stories but lately if feels like Marvel is living off of brand loyalty rather than quality.
It's not fatigue, it's just the first MCU felt very new and fresh, with a long time between two projects. Now there are loads of movies and series every year, and you must see everything to get the whole story. And also us fans watch videos to know which movies and series will come out in the next years so it really kills the surprise effect :)
Not trying to be a jerk here. But isn't your description the definition of fatigue? Perhaps I'm missing something?
@@berniemadoff9688 hi, i don’t think this is fatigue, i still enjoy a lot of super hero stories, and i enjoy most of what marvel is releasing (except secret invasion which was really bad). I think the issue the mcu has is the lack of surprise effect when a project comes out, but it seems they are going to release less projects this year some hopefully it will help.
I keep saying the problem is that they're focusing on Quantity over Quality.
I love watching good superhero media, often times I'll go back and rewatch episodes of Daredevil or Jessica Jones, because they were well written shows.
Brilliant 👏🏾 An excellent deconstruction, and detailed narrative that examined and explored every genre of cinema that focuses on cultural archetypes. Kudos!
Thx for giving a shout out/recommendation for Blue Beetle!😀
My new favorite superhero movie…I just hope it gets a sequel 🤞
Keep up the awesome work on your videos!
Personally, with watching everything on streaming, or premium TH-cam, I'm never aware of new movies coming out, without someone like this channel mentioning/doing the trailer. Wish, Blue Beetle, etc....I had no idea these movies were even coming out until they were already in theatres.
On top of those, having things like Black Widow available to purchase during COVID on D+ while it was in theatres, and the later super short (usually around 60-80 days) amount of time we have to wait for things to go from the theatre to streaming, it just doesn't seem worth it to go to the theatre anymore. Especially having not many nerdy friends/sig. other to go to the movies with, it just makes more sense for me to personally wait for movies to be available on streaming. I don't necessarily think superhero movies are DYING, but I DO think there's alot of people like me, who aren't fatigued, but also aren't going to the theatres. But it doesn't mean that (probably first week of release) that we're not watching those same movies once they're on streaming.
I think if the streaming numbers later on were taken into consideration, numbers may seem higher. Also, I know it was controversial, but I really do think things like D+ should bring back the ability to rent a movie that's in theatres, on streaming, for a price. Those numbers + the theatres numbers might not be as much as pre-COVID, but I do think they would see a boost in revenue doing this
Renting does exist it’s on Amazon prime and Apple Store.
I haven't been to a theater since 2012. The first Avengers movie is the last one I watched at the theater. For me it's to expensive to take my family to see a movie. I can sit home fix a nice meal and enjoy a movie on streaming while sitting on my couch and relaxed.
What a great season finale , thanks you both Colton and Ryan for covering this new what if season 2, it was great
Perfectly said and explained. Excellent work.
There's no rush to go out an watch a superhero film when you know you can stream it in a month.
It's not just one thing, but many reasons. Lack of stand alone stories, quality issues etc. Also, people going out the cinema in general has gone down. Myself, and others I know have had too many experiences of trying to go see a film, and kids with tablets at full volume during the movie, or just running around loudly, has become more and more common, especially after the pandemic. If you have a great TV and sound system at home, just wait a few months.
There is fatigue and there also are people who are just tired of 50 characters being introduced and nothing coming of it.
I think the “super hero fatigue” comments started at the same time that the stakes were time traveled away. Then they doubled down with infinite universes, realms, and timelines. There are no more stakes and the stories are suffering.
The quality of Andor is the direction I want comic and sci-fi content to go.
I don’t need to say anything about superhero fatigue, the numbers speak for themself. There will always be a small core audience for the genre but the wider fad is over.
Because people are tired of the same shit. Now, if they started phrasing these things as frontier movies (Fantastic Four) or monster movies (Swamp Thing). Maybe a Noir Detective film (The Batman), things would probably be better.
I think people know if they wait 3 months they can see the movies of thier choice on the platform they' like and at a convenient price , from the comfort of home where you can eat and drink or even wear what you want . Going outside takes work, so it's
Laziness not fatigue, people are lazy and want convenience at thier own leisure.
Also it's not just superhero movies , apparently it's all movies , so my theory has some weight to it ,
I think people are fatigued by leaks and being constantly barraged for 2-3 years about a movie, that then can’t provide them with a novel experience, because they have already seen and heard every detail of it a thousand times
There’s only mid fatigue we need better writers and people who actually care about the products they produce!
I love marvel, since I watched Iron Man on 2008 I´ve never missed a movie or show on release weekend. But you were spot on when you said that lately we get all these teases that never give a payoff, right now the MCU feels disconnected and that needs to be fixed. I actually think the marvels was a step on that direction
I think the lack of interconnectedness in recent projects is part of the problem.Also, the lack of marketing for some of these projects
Or maybe the reason the box office numbers are down is because we know we can wait a few months to watch marvel on Disney or DC on HBO max.
It’s not that complicated; they give us an alternative option to watch (which has more content) then complain we don’t go to the theater to watch 1 movie for the same fee as the whole month
This video was exceptionally well edited, perfect with the memes. For some reason the matrix genre meme got me hard.
Also totally agree on Blue Beetle being a good movie, I thought it was great. It really felt like a proper cape comic movie from the 90's in a lot of ways, but modern so best of both worlds.
Basically corporate speak for "we're not the problem, the customers are the problem."
It is fatigue, just look at the Box Office in 2023
After Endgame the majority of the audience moved on with their lifes
I adore cinema, I watch films in every genre and I think the problem is suits messing with creative visions and awful writing.
Btw, what a well written video.
@14:26 Another thing they all do is the "whoosh.". When they're looking at some digital /holographic info, then they want everyone to see, so they "grab" the outside of the image, and WHOOSH their hands apart, and the digital image suddenly enlarges to the size of the room. Happened in nearly every single MCU movie.
It's not fatigue, and it's not "wokeness" as I'm sure some guys will claim. The movies are awesome! It's just that it costs an arm and a leg to go to the theater and have some snacks, anymore. On a lesser note, I like to think that people are also fed up that theater owners (smaller ones in particular) don't get as much of a cut of ticket sales anymore.
Good god Iger admitted it was about social BS
That's why my family and I haven't been to a theater since 2012. It just cost to much.
No it‘s definitly the wokeness
When your waiting for the person in-front of you to show the teacher you’re essay
17:59 After watching Oppenheimer 3 times I came across an article detailing how the movie going experience is an art form and should be experienced as such not just for content. They put to words much more elegantly than I can that I share that same sentiment and is the reason I saw Oppenheimer 3 times. The soundtrack to Oppenheimer is sublime, seeing it in 70mm film, the first case of black and white IMAX film, the performances of Emily Blunt and RDJ elevate the story beyond the creation of the atomic age and the father of the atomic bomb. I do not go to the theater to see something that I can otherwise watch on TH-cam or tv.
Really loving the fact other than super hero movie, the regular movies are getting a shine and yes now the box office is low for regular movies but in the future the regular movies will make more money than super hero movies. Things will go back to normal
The sports team analogy is pretty spot on. I think MCU is at a rebuilding phase, after losing players like Tony Stark and Cap, so it’s just not possible to do what infinity saga did in the end, right away in this point in time. We have to rebuild for something epic and hope it works.
In the mean time, let the upcoming projects be good writing and great films, but our time will come again some day when all this pays off. I’m all here for it, and if nothing else i’m extremely glad i got to experience the infinity saga when it happened. I still rewatch all the movies while waiting for new ones.
I think we have record breaking opening weekends ahead of us, I think people will talk this way over and over until the fandom for a character or team is too big and it will have everyone watching again. If it's done right, it will show people that theres a turn around
Incredible video, Ryan, thank you!
I feel like a lot of Marvel's past few years have been movies taking bigger swings with interesting ideas, trying to change up some of the usual formulas, but with mixed results. Dr Strange 2 was a horror movie, Wandavision was a slow-burn mystery/horror, Thor 4 was a romcom, The Celestials was a space epic. None of these were things they tried in the first saga of the MCU. Did they all work all the time? No, not really. Nothing was perfect, a lot of things kinda ended up back in "super hero movie" territory. But personally, I enjoyed the attempts. I can forgive a misstep when it's from trying something wild and different. I've had a ton of fun with most of the recent marvel productions, even when they're a little goofy.
It almost seems to me that this is what Marvel maybe shouldn't have done? I wonder why it is that I'm still enjoying most of these things, but a lot of people are falling off. Am I just easy to please? Or am I just too much of a sucker for Sam Raimi? Should Marvel have just kept making movies like Iron Man 1 and never stopped?
"Or take a shortcut and read Joseph Campbell's Power of Myth"
Or stake a whole semester's project on it in grad school
I agree Blue beetle was amazing. I think the problem was blue beetle isn't an a lister. Much like a movie about the the question, or spectre would not do well no matter how good it is.
I don't most viewers are sick of superheroes. I would bet most fell in love with the 1st two Christian Bale Batman and most of the MCU Phase 1-3. Most where gritty comic book styled movies. The "fun movies" isn't what the paying customers want.
Completely agree with everything said. I think the main reason I liked Across the Spider-Verse, Guardians 3 & the Loki series is cause those all felt like they actually had some original ideas and flavors besides MCU Vanilla, which I love but it gets repetitive.
I would agree that it’s more of the mainstream population getting off the bandwagon. It’s unfortunate that a drop in quality came in at the same time to kind of reinforce the notion of‘superhero fatigue’
Amen brothers and sisters. It’s bad movie fatigue. I for one, like Ryan and many of you, can’t wait for Marvel to straighten up and continue with the many great characters and stories developed thru decades.
Useless Executive fatigue.
Pointless Middle Management fatigue.
But most of All, GREED FATIGUE.
Do you think people have adjusted to streaming services by only going to movies that pop and go back less after watching a movie once knowing it will be on a streaming service in a few months?
Something that I have heard dozens of times from friends and family is that they just don't understand the Marvel movies any more because there's too much backstory to know and so they don't enjoy. Anyone watching this channel will probably have all the background and catch Easter eggs, but most viewers get lost when the stories are too involved and assume you know what happened in multiple other movies (and now Disney+ shows). I think that the big maps of the Marvel phases and associated movies and shows over decades show why Feige and team are treating this a bit too much like a soap opera where it's hard for a casual fan to follow what's going on if they haven't been watching everything closely for years.
I think it‘s more like franchise fatigue to be honest, not just only superhero movies. Franchises like Mission Impossible, Indiana Jones or Fast & Furious also tanked heavily this year. I think the era of blockbuster franchise movies is currently in decline because most of these movies have become somewhat like visual fast food. Just like that restaurant, Sylvie chose to work at in Loki season 2. You know what you‘re getting, it always tastes sorta ok, relatively cheap and you‘re getting it fast. And that‘s the same with franchise movies. Those have become sort of predictable to some extent, because they always appear at the same time of the year, have the same PR cycles around it and it feels more like an industrially made thing. Whereas movies like Oppenheimer or Barbie this year cleaned up at the box office, not only due to their incredible fan hype, but also because the movies offered something, other movies don‘t have: well written plots and characters. Barbie is an incredible movie about finding someone‘s identity in the modern world and learning about the male-dominated society that we are living in. Oppenheimer is a super-hero origin, heist movie and court-room drama in one for the price of one movie ticket. Applied to superhero movies: that would be something like realizing Demon in a bottle for Iron Man or Superior Spider-Man with Doc Ock taking over Peter Parker‘s body… or what Joker did, a psychological study of a cast-out comedian who slowly transitions into chaos and madness. That‘s what I really want tot see more of in the future: more surprises, more character developments, more intimacy.
I feel like I don't need to watch 100s of hours of other super hero shows in order to know what's going on in the movies.
It's not entirely CEO's fault. They respond to the shareholders that demand more money every year, so they decide to sell toys. When its not about the characters but about the toys, all its lost.
Okay but can anyone explain to me why joker is my favorite movie of all time since it’s not really a superhero movie?
It really is that the movies are missing good stories and interesting characters we can watch on an epic arc journey.
Tony Stark became Ironman... but then from there we saw what his hubris brought... and then what Triana he had to live with... and him finally treating Pepper right and Tony becoming a dad and not like Clint Barton secret kids type of dad, but a guy who lived for his kid... in fact, it was his affection for Peter that made him change his no. He knows what being a dad feels like. And he finally made the sacrificial play. Huge satisfying charger arc over numerous movies.
Superman, Batman, Guardians of the Galaxy... all good stories and made their heroes wrestle with things and grow.
Now we get thrown into the middle of a story with characters that aren't compelling.
I haven't seen the Marvels yet. I wanted to. I wanted to see what became of Monica after WandaVisiom and who doesn't love Kamala. The problem is, I never grew to love Captain Marvel - I don't hate her at all. I just couldn't loved her, because she was under utilized and under developed as a character. The fact is, I don't think they wanted her to be THE hero... maybe a franchise pawn or a cultural icon, but certainly not stepping up as The Strongest Avenger. So we get a movie that looked cool but lacked substance. Her back story would've bonded us to her, but she didn't remember it and we didn't really see it much. She was barely in the Avengers, didn't really bond with anyone, wasn't called for any previous intergalactic issues, and barely did what she was capable of doing (so as not to outshine our heroes or steal Tony's moment). I liked her most in End Game but still wish we could've seen her adventures in space. And we weren't given Carol Danvers in Secret Invasion with the people she was supposed to be helping... just her powers taken from some sample.
So, yeah. Missing stories, character development, and arcs. My take. (Not a hot take, sounds like Ryan's.)
The comment about Marvel needing less money reminds me of this Coppola quote about filming Apocalypse Now. "There were too many of us. We had access to to to much money. Too much equipment. And little by little we went insane."
Also, theres an incredible video by Patrick H Willems called "Who Killed Cinema," and it's absolutely worth a watch.
Yes. Usually when something becomes over saturated, the quality suffers..
Just like the mid-late 90s slasher film.. or the early-mid 00s with Teen movies..or the big blockbuster Action Hero no longer exists.
Every movie is either a "superhero" movie.. yeah, you said exactly what I've been thinking and saying for years! Great video!!
And yet a certain head of a certain studio claims that MORE executive involvement would have prevented a certain movie tanking
I wonder if anyone considers the amount of coverage these movies get as part of the fatigue.
Big fan of ScreenCrush + Heavy Spoilers but would directly attach them to my fatigue. The amount of coverage and the content has completely changed over 5 years and in essence you can experience a majority of a movie without watching it just from these two channels alone.
The amount of content being produced per individual movie is an endurance test for a person's interest on a topic.
I’m not tired of super hero movies. I did take some time to not be as hyped from every new announcement specifically because it seems like the studios are just putting things out for the sake of putting them out. The reason why the infinity saga was so beloved was because of how much easier it was to digest the new movies that would come out, giving the fans time to ponder what could come next. The MCU recently has tried to recreate those building blocks but without the strength of character and world building we saw from the beginning. Getting into the MCU later in my teen years helped me gain more interest in the source material, sparking new interest in the comics. Now I’d rather read the comics and forget all about whatever is coming next with the way things are going.
Mid fatigue, not superhero fatigue. You hit the nail on the head.
I love these more editorial essays & how you always imagine solutions instead of only noting the issues.
20:27 since Ryan said Blue Beetle is good I will give it a try
i love how u threw that bill parcels reference in. you’re not as much of nerd as i thought
Really exceptional breakdown of why the movies are suffering. Wish they would let the cooks get their own ingredients and cook how they want.
Damn, this is your best commentary video to date! Well done!
@ScreenCrush Sometime could you do a breakdown of what MCU works currently have unresolved cliffhangers or midcredit scenes? I just tried to do a list but it is super-long. We keep thinking Marvel will whittle down the list with the next movie (like the ten rings could have tied in with the Marvels somehow), but instead the list just keeps on growing. In the past, with the exception of Thanos, usually when we got a cliffhanger midcredits scene it was resolved one or two movies later, not years.
Also, how do you think Blade could fit into the MCU by now? I had a theory the other day that the new Blade movie would be set in a different universe that collides with the MCU in Secret Wars, but Blade's appearance in Eternals disproves that.
one of my issues, which you address is them trying to make every title a comedy. yes you, thor 4. that was the final straw in my opinion. i like when my fantastical characters from the comics are presented as if the were real, with faults and things to overcome. otherwise it’s just bat nipples on everything. lastly i really hate knowing that marvel has tons of extra footage they never used but refuse to put out director cuts or reedit them into better movies after they have come and failed. yes, i talking to thor 4, but also age of ultron, the marvels, etc.
I'm corporation-fatigued. People in suits sucking the joy out of the things we love in the name of profit.
17:45 "Marvel studios is repeating the same mistakes from the comics". I agree.
To me the start of the MCU movie universe was like Marvel Comics in the 60s. Everything was new and fantastic.
But in the 70s Marvel Comics became a bit boring. There was a house style and each comic felt like a carbon copy of something done better in the sixties.
Then in the 80s new young artists showed up and were allowed to create comics in their own style. Different to the established Marvel house style. For example Frank Millers Daredevil. Also John Byrnes Fantastic Four run had a clear John Byrne style.
And in today's comics, all kinds of styles are "allowed" and that keeps comics interesting and fresh.
Coming back to movies: We need film directors that deviate from the MCU formula and bring in their own film style, even if it will be totally different than all the MCU movies before.
There was one MCU movie that did this: "The Eternals". Also in the DC universe, Zack Snyder brought in his own special film style.
As an 18 year old, yes it is my childhood still.
Wesley Snipe's Blade was the onset of what superhero movies have become today.
Maybe the studios should allow for more autonomy for the storytellers/witers and directors (those who seem more invested in the characters and the stories). When corporate heads become involved, less care seems to be given to entertaining or thrilling the audience and more to investors and bankrolls (merchandise, etc.).
Marvel should stick to 3 shows and 2 movies a year because most of the time the shows are better than the movies!
We don't have "Heroe's Journeys" anymore; people start at 1000 and there's no journey down or upward: thus, no story to tell.
Video game and Anime movies/shows are gonna have a golden era next, super hero/comic movies will have a silver age
This is the best take on "Superhero Fatigue"
I've seen every MCU movie in the theater and I do not have superhero movie fatigue. On the other hand, I only watched a couple episodes of Ms. Marvel, Secret Invasion, and Loki season 2. And I liked Ms. Marvel and Loki but all it takes is missing a couple of weeks and you feel like you're so far behind that you're just not going to go back and watch it because now there's a whole other show starting. I have Disney+ fatigue. Honestly, I was really hoping for more one off specials like the Guardians Holiday Special and Werewolf By Night. Makes watching something on Disney+ an event again. That's how it started with Wanda/Vision. Back then it felt fresh and new to have weekly MCU content outside of Agents of SHIELD. Now it's every week there's either new Marvel or new Star Wars.
I'm with you Ryan. Not fatigued, but agree more character driven films focusing on individual story over overarching narrative would be preferred.
I don't have superhero fatigue, I have bad movie fatigue
hmm...i'd say Star Wars was more a rare example of a 'mash-up' - it had the western elements at Mos Eisley and the vagabond rogue that was Han, but it also was a WW2 battle film...but it also was a knight rescues princess film...and THEN throw in Joseph Campbell into the mix.
oh, and you get into that very mash-up idea just a minute after I wrote this in the Superman review. :)