Carnage Plus EP27 - Running a SOHC Ford With A Barra ECU!
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 12 มิ.ย. 2019
- One of the most common questions we get about our AU XR6 is, "How did you run it with a Barra ECU?" So we try to answer that with some help from Bill Hooton at Everything Barra (find him on Facebook).
Note: It was raining very heavy outside so we had to run an audio cleaner through the video which means the audio may sound a little strange at times.
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hey guys I'm bill hooton from the video. cheers for all the support, it's great to see a lot of discussion about all this!
if you have any further questions post them here or hit me up on facebook and i'll be happy to help.
the everything barra page also has a lot of people with conversion info.
You already had me looking at XF's after last week. 🤣😂
So in the end was the motor tuned on the barra ecu?
@@costerjeffries281 yep was using full fg setup as per the vid
Your ecu patch would be great for a turbo conversion on a au
@@TheMrkylester101 That is the plan.
Just got to love the engineering that has gone into the AU and BA. Pity they pulled to plug on Aussie Ford.
My Red AU VCT XR6 sits in the garage. Engine bay gets used for hart surgery every now and then it's that clean. She gets driven on a Sunday and then she gets parked.
Long live the Falcon!!!
😅
This is great and really informative guys. My young fella wants to Barra his XG ute and this video makes me feel so much better about it.
I love what you guys have done with this car. The VCT XR6 was a bit of a niche car when it came out as it fell in between the regular XR6 and the XR8. You guys are obviously only working on performance but for a Ford fan who’s looking to do up something a bit different to a Barra you definitely show the potential of the vehicle. 👍
Adam Scott the vct xr6 was pointless though to anyone who actually wanted a fast 6 back then, the xr6 was faster than the vct xr6 because it was lighter, and they’re both almost as fast as the s1 xr8 anyway.. I’ve had vct falcons and also had the xr6 with no vct and i much prefer the non vct xr6
This is the stuff we want to see. Some great tips re conjured and pedal etc. you guys are doing a great job. my nl fairlaine is going to hum. Cheers fullas
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That's very impressive for single cam, in America we got crappy inline sixes from ford. The 4.9 was good in trucks for torque but doesn't respond well to modding. 79-82 mustang had a gutless 3.3 that also didn't respond well to mods. There were a few others in Lincoln and Ltds but nothing really worth mentioning.
It's defiantly the better 6 weve had in Australia:) but you guys have have some awesome shit in us we dnt have lol
The 4.2 Atlas is supposedly pretty good though. I guess people don't play with them much though
It only takes a few people to do it and show others that it's easy power :)
@@seanedwards1838 right on. I had a 79 inline six mustang with manual transmission. I always wanted to make it a GT slayer but with 85 hp from factory it would've taken serious work and more money than it should. I let my cousin use it for a week and it came back with a hole in the side of the block. Found out later it he was redlining it almost every gear everywhere he went so no wonder it gave up. I ended up scrapping it and no longer loaned out my vehicles to him.
Great video,answered many questions, solving many mysteries about this particular type of conversion
Yesssss nice work boys ! Straight onto the uploads !!!
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great video guys. heaps of good info. onya bill
Cool vid guys definitely very informative 👍
Awesome info thanks for the update.
Legends!!!! Alot of useful info cheers!!
Thank you for the Good videos keep up the good work 😊😊
I think you just raised the value of the ugly AU in nz by $1000. Keep up the good work Scotty!
It's not ugly - it's beautiful.
@@kevinobrien3122
You been drinking again boy?
Bill is the modern day delcoman 👌👌👌 love ya work !
Nice work, informative entertainment, good move.
Thankyou Scotty and Bill for the indepth talk about the Barra ECU. The talk last week about the adaptability of the ECU was awesome. The good old ACDelco/Kalmaker upgrade, worked absolute wonders for all the Isuzu motors, especially the 4ZC1 using the stock Isuzu EFI and the G family (161/180/200 SOHC) using of all things, the late 80s Lada Niva EFI as the Russians licenced the G161 motor. 🤯
Yeah I knew plenty of blokes who would rat the wrecking yards of Delco ECUs for budget projects
@@STREETMACHINETV I loved it Scotty. $50 for the ECU + $400 for the Kalmaker software fully tuned. 👍 The difference it made to 4ZC1's was intense, enter with a low 15sec car, leave with a mid 13 due to everything being either turned up or disabled. 😎😈
@@MafiaboysWorld now its $30 for ECU and $120 for HP Tuners credits. The future is a wonderful place
@@STREETMACHINETV Yes yes, stop living in the 20th century Maf...I already hear it Scotty. 😂🤣
Cheers mate. It was great to be a part of and get people talking again. Its how all this comes about!
Sounds like you had your head around it as much as we do back in the day.
Brilliant work guy's
U r a legend Bill
Sounds like a water feature in the background
Knowing Melbourne's weather recently I think it was rain.
Very informative video there, guys. I know a certain Cannonball Run AU that could benefit from this mod...
cool vid. i was keen to know how this was done so cheers. nice torana in the background
great video!
That was pure gold
great vid cheers guys
Ah, good old Misk going from the LPG bottle EB fire to youtube superstar, nice work man
hahaha yesm! how you been man?
@@miskone1044 Same old, trying to work out if a Barra ECU would be the best choice for my 302 EF now lol.
I have a feeling these last 2 vids are going to make Barra swaps a *lot* more popular, and swing huge work to you
@@FelixTheHat302 youd need to use a v8 ecu but yeah lots of people are asking about that, just chuck an au balancer on and youre set pretty much! good to see you around :)
Great work. I'm run the elite 2500 on a BA Barra now it's on an EB single cam through the dizzy using adaptor harness. I'll be fitting the Barra next .
haha that's mad that's its on the sohc still
might i add that its best to do up a drawing when you are done for future fault finding.
Love your work Bill , how Scotty did Bill set up the speed sensor on the ba pcm from the au abs unit ,keep up the great work . Can't wait for Bill to make my patch harness to suit my barracks turbo .
Holey fark the rain doesn't matter love the vids!! good edit!
you effing champs. thanks heaps.
Learnt heaps ❤️
I still come back to this video as I really want to do this to my xr6
i wish this video came out a couple months earlier, i have just had a harness done and my motor wont rev up. I have a ba pedal and a fg ecu and motor what a bugger. Great video love all the carnage episodes cheers
hey mate its bill from the vid, where you located? shoot me a msg on facebook if you want and i'll help you sort through it.
@@miskone1044 im in south australia, i have ordered a fg pedal should arrive soon. Cheers for the message, i will get in touch
Is this the actual episode for the week? :( dnt get me wrong it's very informative as I just got a ba barra powered falcon
Nice vid blokes
The falcon will live on forever.
Yep thanks for the upload, when is the FORD AU V's the HOLDEN VT going to happen, i know the weather has not been right for a while, but still why not drive up to swan hill then, because swanny sent ya. :)
Oooh so close to 100k congrats
Yep, won't be long now
Love your vids. My dad is buying a ford xr6 turbo Ute
@@mustafaalmasri9658 awesome, they're a good thing
Seems like a good idea.
My XH with the distributor under the inlet with aftermarket air is a major headache. Sounds like BF barraa time.
if you leave the dizzy in place with no cap the tacho and fuel pump etc all works with no change :)
Hey Scotty, AU gas motors have the same rods as the petrol versions.
But E series motors (except maybe the late EL hybrid motors) have stronger rods and people seem to be pushing 400kw out of stock.
That mullet 👌
*Barra the world*
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#BARRAGE !!!
I wouldn’t do this ! However the young guy has some brains 🧠
its certainly not the be all kinda thing, but it has gotten a lot of people talking about a lot of cool projects, which was ultimately my goal. it was kinda hard to portray that through video. has also been a fair joint effort over the years from a lot of people to get my here, appreciate it though mate :)
So if I want to go this route in my AU do you sell the patch looms?
Would rather go this route than a full Barra swap as that's just another thing that will need to be approved and MOD plated.
@misk one Love your work, can you use a FG ECU to run the BTR 4speed auto (petrol setup not Egas) or does it have to be a BA/BF setup?
Nah only egas can run 5spd and thry wont run a petrol tune. Went thru all this when i learned about fucking my fg lol
so when are you building up your valiant with a barra computer?
I wanna see that to be very interesting to see how it's done
I want too see this also. Been wanting a cheap way to modernise my 265 for years! Come on Scotty, show the chrysler fans some love!!
@@petermcardle656 im in the process of doing my rb20, will be up and running in a couple of dayse, thenm ill be dloing some tuning on it through the week. the process will be the same for any other engine really. im not sure how far the numbers in the tune can be fudged to actually go beyond what they were supposed to but we'll find out!
Great update!!
What did you do with the cam angle input, the barra ecu has 2 cam angle sensor inputs, where as the au engine only has one cam and I believe its a different configuration for triggering aswell.
I read somewhere cam angle imput was only for sequential injection, did you just disregard both inputs and run batch fire injection?
Good question but I don't think it was all that difficult. We just plugged it in. I'll have to check what Zane did at his end with the ECU
At the moment its not reading cam angle with it hooked up, i believe thats because of the cam trigger differences. Im going to cut the back of a cam off and weld it to an ef cam sensor shaft with a barra sensor and see if that will trigger it . Otherwise, yes it will run batch fire.
I guess sequential doesn't have a lot of benefits on a preformance system, its more for emissions, its definitely not holding you back in any way here, 350rwkw is a great effort.
keep up the great work!! !
Its possible to build a board that can be installed inside the Barra ECU to simulate the presence of a drive by wire throttle body... but a complete new operating system for this ecu would be great, including options to run a 4 cylinder and a wasted spark mode so they can be set up to batch fire a V8....
Business up front party in the back
im really keen to see how the pedal was mounted, already have a built vct on the way and a gt42... love your work Bill. ill be in touch soon.
also, unfortunately, the Au Gas motor is no stronger than the petrol varient, wasnt until 6/2006 ford made the gas motor stronger.
Check out the other episodes, they did a good job with the info :)
@@miskone1044 You basically show the pedal mount in this video. About half way through.
Can you explain anything about the security (Dumb Lock or Stupid Shield) and how that goes with the ECU switcheroos? Or is that info all elsewhere already? Point me to it.
Coz, honestly, LINK ECU is just out of my price range being broke arse... But do have a few ideas on getting 18psi from an Eaton M112 into the side of the VCT head sitting on the EF short block.
facebook.com/winzracing
Tony Hitch the au ecu doesn’t know any different so it doesn’t effect anything, as far as it’s concerned the Barra pcm isn’t there and it just thinks it’s still running the show
Get back to the Ford vs Holden $2000 challenge and answer the questions at the end
Id be curious about running a Windsor 302 powered au of a barra/boss ecu pedal and obviously a throttle body adapter if that ever been considered before ?
Yeah, it would need v8 boss ECU
The ECU doesn't care too much what it's hooked to, because it's just an air pump anyway.
yeah theres a lot that can be tweaked in the tune to cater to a few different setups.
That’s bullshit ! If you just randomly through an ecu into any car just like he said any conversion you will have issues ! You need to listen better, and I suggest you also get some real time automotive skills in actually doing this stuff to make a valid comment , because to me who has been an Auto technician for 25 years you sound like you know nothing! Just from that comment.
So basically is the FG V8 ECU can be used for conversions if you wanted to say in a Ranger wildtrak, now thats something i would like to see and i wonder how much it would cost, and still have the 4 x 4 system as well ? so basically a FG / X XR8 engine and ECU and convert a Ranger like what scotty has, now there's a good project for ya scotty, get that done, so you can offer more promotion / marketing for those who have the ranger's. :) So keep a look out for even the first gen FG FPV or even just a XR8 set ups, the 335KW engine and start converting them into ranger's. :)
making the motor run really isn't the hard part, its making the base car happy enough to be a good driver also. its harder with newer cars but not impossible as they all run canbus now and ppl are getting better at writing custom code to interface the two.
The actual number one question was "HOW MUCH ARE THESE BUILDS ACTUALLY COSTING, REALLY, COZ $2000 IS A BLOODY JOKE...."...
But yes, I did ask about this ecu too....
Great informative vid scotty and bill!
So if scotty decided he wanted to use a ZF6 in the AU (or any other non falcon conversion) would he have to use a specific ZF6 ECU or can any barra ecu talk to the ZF?
just needs to be linked to the ecu. one could be bolted behind this car straight away with the matching ecu.
We're actually looking at doing this post $2k Challenge
Thanks for the replies.
Bill i heard BF ZFs dont need the matching ECU?
@@MRMOPARMAN0426 the ecu has to match thr zf or it needs to be paired which can cost a bit. Ot saves a lot pf hassle having it match
@@STREETMACHINETV Will need the same box that the ECU comes from... Coz anti theft shit.
But hey, you're doing well so far....
Other than going with the factory mounting position on the ECU (hahaahhahhaha)
Great stuff! I've been running a turbo barra reduced to 16psi boost in an AU ute on an AU computer with J3 for about 3 years now. It's gone as far as I can take it with the J3 and I was toying with the idea of throwing the barra computer at it. I have a tuned BA computer (BPR 28psi) and pedal from the wreck the engine came out of. Where do I get the "patch loom" from?
Talk to Bill at Everything Barra
BILL .. was wondering about running it (AU) with an AUTO .. which ecu controls the AUTO .. and does it have a problem sharing the VSS output ..
The sharing of sensors seems like it might cause issues .. u have run a separate temp sensor but seems u share crank and vss (and others perhaps too)
hey mate, you can control the auto with the au ecu or the ba bf ecu. the temp sensors when shared created an issue, but the other sensors aren't as temperamental.
Great information guys. Is it easy to do a flash back to standard ford tune for a ba/territory system. My sct crashed and i lost my factory ford tune. I got it fixed but i need a factory tune to start all over again. Thanks
no not at all. having the osid and teartag will help a lot
Au lpg motor is the exact same bottom end
You know what i think Scotty used his own tubo Taxi FG ECU, which was already tuned and tricked it a little just so he gets the power down almost straight away, lol :)
Incorrect
@@STREETMACHINETV LOL, just thought it to save cash, lol:) Go holden. :) Still very interesting ,what about the auto ECU, because the AU has 4 speed and the FG Engine ECU, does it have any issues with the FG 6 speed auto or its does not matter, due to no input in the FG ENGINE ECU, cheers :)
The ECU we used came with an engine we bought for Turbo Taxi and it was a NA FG manual ECU.
@@STREETMACHINETV cheers thank you and good luck FORD and also HOLDEN, cant wait till it happens. :) Still its going to be a problem to have that much KW at the rear wheels getting traction, what type of tyres are you guys going to run, St drag radials or dedicated drag tyres. :)
Left over Street Drag Radials from Turbo Taxi
So I'd be able to run a 5.0 Clevor with 3V gear or a Clevo with EEC5 piggybacked with 3V gear?
hi im having problems with my 99 fairlane au series1 i have the vct engine ive got no crank an fuel ive tested fuel pump starter an changed inhibiter switch any ideas
Do you need a turbo ecu to run map, or can you get away with a standard ecu?
This was a standard FG NA ECU
Hi how can I get more info for my AU build 350hp Engine gearbox build i like this for Bill Hooton
I’m gonna do this on my AUII EX DETECTIVE CAR
Dedicated gas motor
What spark Plugs was ran in this
Hey boys where do the wires go from the cam at the front of a vtc au falcon motor do they go to the throttle body I have put one in my 1995 ef ford Fairmont if you have any suggestions or diagrams I could look at would be a great help
Bill Hooton ay Hootons Harnesses would be the guy to talk to
Hi Scotty, turboing a gas engine is the compression ratio not too high?
It work well with E85
At 8:40 as what he said it's amazing that the intech just ran without a tune with the FG ecu so it makes you think what the flow rate is between the AU intech head and FG head is if the tune didn't require bending a bit. Makes you think also if the old sohc engines might be stronger in the bottom end than lets say the BA Barrras NA block.
After all you probably won't have the same issues with the weak valvetrain either (BA that is) and this is proof! a stock intech making 340+rwkw.
Ef el motors will do 400rwkw all day. The pistons arent flash but the rods are strong
The au has the same internals as a ba tho. Just different valve cut. The aus making this ppwer safely cause its on e85. A ba will be happy at 400rwkw on e85 also
@@miskone1044 yes I was gathering that because the vct intech has a static cr of like 9.65:1 and the fg is around the 8.47 mark that safely tuning it on pump 98 would never get you to 347rwkw.. I didn't know that they share the same internals but I was guessing that the rods might have been different between the old engine and NA barras hence questioning it.. same goes for the valve train, we all know that the valve springs are the weak link in the early BA barra.
@@ceffydriverou can run a non turbo ba motor up to 320 on 98 reliably. tuning is so much better these days as are the motors. 10:1 is a common turbo comp ration these days.
@@miskone1044 yeah I get that! It's pretty amazing what most Tuners can achieve these days rather than worrying about highish cr and boost. Same goes for RBs, people used to think that the stock limit for 25s was just shy of 300kw before throwing rods, that's if you didn't have shit pistons with smashed ring lands which most do. Awesome work though and I can see this opening up a lot of options for people.
7:12 me in everyday life
When are we getting the end of the $2k challenge?
Hopefully we can have something at the end of next week
Zzzzzz
How much tuning did the speed density maps require to get it running on spec?
apparently not much lol no more than any normal barra tune. the earlier sohcs need a bit of work for sure but its all doable with time.
@@miskone1044 I guess the fact its the same capacity and the VE would be within 25% means it is within the limits of the standard O2 correction. Impressive.
Hey you got me thinking now.
I have a xf panelvan running a 460 385 series big block Ford. It also has an FG g6et interior complete dash etc.
I would really like to get the FG ecu and bcm to run the dash and maybe some of the engine controls. Such things as considering fuel injection and coil on plug. I am not sure about the throttle body, pedals , and other sensors such as the CAS TPS and MAP , what components can I use and which have to be from the same vehicle (one VIN) ?
hey mate, interesting project! you could run the big block off one but it would be a challenge. you'd need to mount the tps on a 4 barrel type throttle. that's kinda the hardest part lol. you would need a boss ecu and just matching engine harness. the rest can be taken from any 6cyl of matching series
misk one you got a loom and Boss ecu floating around for me. Not so easy to find these in NZ
@@bigmatlock62 I'm sure I could find one but theyre not super common here either. proly be 150 for ecu 150 or more for loom.
misk one I’ll keep my feelers out here too, you reckon any BOSS 5.4 ? Or Coyote one or either. Maybe even the 3v 5.4 in the odd Fairmont?
@@bigmatlock62 any v8 ecu :)
Keanu Reeves with a mullet
Ill take that haha, been called worse!
If I'm putting a FG engine in a BA-BF falcon what do I need to do to the wiring to get the pedal to work? Just change the connectors from 2 3wires to 1 6wire?
If I'm going to do rods and pistons, what are the FG motor differences? nothing?
How can I suck out data logging from the Barra ecu? suck it out of the CANbus?
hey mate just match the wire colors, I think theres 1 wire that doest match but its pretty straight forward.
you can data log a barra ecu with forscan or torque
Does anyone have a Falcon 250 2V head for sale? Preferably in NZ.
Do you need a ba/fg manual ecu if you run manual au? And what would a harness set me back
Contact Hooton's Harnesses
Someone needs to try and do something to a T3 TE/TS50
thatd be mint :) a few ppl have asked about windsors so that's the first step.
Hey guys. I have an AU lll wagon . Its not a vct. do I need one to do what you just showed here?
I am limited funds however what you showed looks like I could get 300 kw for under a grand. Is that correct?
I love my old wagon and would be happy to keep it rolling with a bit more spunk.
Gotta straight through system 2.5 inch with extractors, one muffler and hi flow K%N air filter currently.
It goes well and has fantastic mileage.
Any advice is greatly appreciated.
Cheers.
You don't need VCT, I'm not sure you can do it under a grand. Although if you find cheap injectors and turbo its possible I guess
Why did the LPGs come out with the same internals as the turbos, but minus the turbo?
Because of backfires. Early LPG engines were bending rods so they switched to the thicker turbo rods
When’s the next eopisode of Holden vs Ford
Hopefully next week
Can some please explain to me why the need to use the barra ecu? I am not sure what they are trying to achive here.
It's can be tuned whereas the factory ECU is limited
When are we going to see the LC???
Soon
ACM were selling Barras on special for $50 bucks. I'm enjoying this build purely for the education and understanding the possibilities for both my AU and my BA. But dollar for dollar wouldn't a barra conversion be cheaper?
Possibly but it's good to try different things. I th i nk we've achieved some pretty good performance for the money
Oh yeah definitely for this project it was awesome. I just meant if someone was going to do their own project would be something to consider. Keep these kind of vids coming, I'm learning heaps.
Where did ACM advertise this? Their twitter is dead and their insta doesn't mention it.
Last year special on their website. Point is they're dirt cheap everywhere, gumtree marketplace. I just checked it's still live=ACM Parts
4.5 landcruiser or 4.8 patorl on barra computer?
a few people have been looking at it yep. I'm not sure what the limit of tweaking the ecu to work on complete wrong motors is but it'll be interesting to find out. I'm sure a few tuners are gonna hate me :)
Curious how they got around the PATS system?
HP Tuners
what about the holden ? 😂
I'd be interested to know anyones thoughts on taking a Ford Territory say 2015 model....... and throwing on a standard turbo kit from obviously a xr6t or whatever.......... anyone done it. I know there is a compression difference etc but ...... yeh.
Look up Toxic Avenger Territory part-2
dose this work with EF/L as well?
Yes
Will we ever see the big block barina again?
Yes
"They don't know what they're doing" Ford electronics in general tbh.
yep very true hahah but that's good in a way when you understand how to trick it. its take me 5 years to figure a few things out tho haha
Is there a major difference in doing this with an auto AU? Would a BA Auto ECU work?
no difference at all. you can leave the au auto in place and itll still shift like factory or fit a ba bf or even zf6 and it'll all work like factory still
@@miskone1044 Cheers for the reply, it's all so awesome. If the au ecu is still in place, is it actually controlling anything? Just thinking about the things you'd deal with in daily driving.
@@archg8323 its controlling the body of the car, its more integrated than the previous models. It also runs the cluster amd vct
@@archg8323 im working with someone to make an ac module to go on canbus to activate the ac thru the barra ecu so fans and idle up work
@@miskone1044 That's awesome mate. Keeping the vct would be awesome, as that and the irs make these AUs pretty special.
My j3 chip keeps the AC stuck on by default, so I've had to run a bypass switch straight to the compressor. Would be great to see it working properly with this setup. Is there an insta/fb page where I can follow your progress?
That audio distortion is bad with that filter just saying, have you guys got lapel mics.
We were wearing lapel mics. The rainfall was extremely heavy while we were filming
@@STREETMACHINETV oh okay ahahah must have been pretty bad rain just bad luck I take it, don't listen to those of us complaining then ahaah nothing you can do.
Fucking went to town on these sideburns
If I converted a Cleveland to EEC4 could I piggyback a BA 3V ECU and throttle body onto it using a drive by wire accelerator pedal? This would increase tunability considerably.
It would. You can probably skip the eec4 completely though
@@STREETMACHINETV Just use the EEC4 manifold?
@@STREETMACHINETV How many teeth would I need on my crank trigger? Just use a 3V one?
can you run the 302 on a newer ecu or is the winnie way too ancient
Not a Barra ECU
@@STREETMACHINETV 5.4 dohc?
wait dont vct and lpg have the same rods?
We're going to find out
Have heard a number of people saying all au bottom ends are the same, only change between the standard Intech, hp and vct is the head, cam, valve springs and tune. But have also heard that b series turbo rods fit so would be interesting to see
All AU bottom ends are the same , the only difference with lpg engine is exhaust valves. HP and VCT have different heads but same valves and springs as standard. HP and VCT have different cams though. I worked on the engine assembly line from EL to FG.
@@SLO666AU youf need to use ba lpg rods as turbo rods are floating gudgeon pin. Ba and bf1 turbo rods are just floating na rods anyway
What’s the big advantage ? Big increase in hp?
Tunability