At 50, I just got into mechanical watches recently. I am a very technical person by trade and by nature and love learning how things work. While I have zero intention (right now anyway) of ever opening up one of my watches, I thoroughly enjoy these entry level videos in helping us learn. Subbed! Many thanks for taking the time to teach...I just ordered my 1900 timegrapher.
Different lift angles only affect the amplitude, not the other readings. Usually the higher the lift angle the higher the amplitude, more or less. The accuracy and beat error is not affected by which lift angle you program into the machine.
Great tutorial. (Please note, in English 'who' is a _personal_ pronoun; it is not used for inanimate objects such as watches. For inanimate objects we say which, not who. So: This is the first of two videos which are going to be about timegraphers.) 👍
A bad lift angle will give a bad information on the amplitude but the other data stay accurate, isn'it ? This timegrapher is great, I test all my watch on it. Fun fact in the Seiko official seller at Paris, they don't have this timegrapher. It was a big help the last time I buied my new King turtle which was completely out, and the timegrapher was with a low amplitude beneath 200. Probably the last watch I will buy.
The beat error messes with the amplitude just a little bit. But having dialed in the wrong lift angle for the movement on the timegrapher can mess with the results a lot.
I have acquired a quarter hour repeater that I would like to test on my new timegrapher. It keeps very good time glass up on the shelf and it in my pocket loses about 9 seconds a day. The case says made in Switzerland, warranted for 20 years so I can safely assumed that it is gold filled. There is no name on the face but the movement says that it is of Swiss origin and there is a serial number as well. The seller knew zip about the watch that he had bought at an estate sale. I had to show him how to use the recessed set button. He is a reputable antique dealer and I rarely see a watch in his store. I know just a bit more about repeaters than he does. I saw a watch on ebay that seemed to be identical inside and out and was astounded to see that the asking price was $4,000 more than I had paid. My question is, where could I go to get information leading to determining the lift angle for this watch? Yours, Bill Deutermann
I should add that as much as I love this watch, I need to determine it's true value. There is no way that I can justify paying that much for it. I feel that I should return it to the dealer and explain why!
I don't know if you found your answer yet, but having just researched timegraphers both the new 1000 and the newer 1900 will do coaxial. The 1900 also has a bigger and color screen vs the monochrome 1000. I just ordered the 1900 for about $180.
Help please! Bought used tudor black bay 58 m79030n caliber MT5402 Time graph Test period 4s Lift Angle 49 degrees Wind 30 times let it run for 1 hour Then I tested it on timegrapher amplitude was under 250 so I wind it 20 more times then my readings were Dial up +1s/d Amplitude 262° Beat error 0. 3ms Parameters 28800 Vertical crown left -11s/d amplitude 189° bet error 0.3ms Parameters 28800 Vertical crown right -7s/d Amplitude 197° Beat error 0. Oms Parameters 28800 Dial face down -1s/d Amplitude 255° Beat error 0.2ms Parameters 28800 Does the watch need to be repaired? Should I return it? Thank you
Gravity can have an affect on the variations of seconds. If you are not sure, take the watch to a certified watchmaker for evaluation. It might be fine, but since it is a used, but a very nice watch, and there is no history with it, the watch may need servicing, which can be expensive.
I would add: Wear the watch for a full day so that you are 100% sure that the watch is fully wound. The MT5402 has a substantial power reserve, winding it 30 times will probably not even cover half of the power reserve. I would be really curious what the difference will be!
The lift angle is something that can be different with every caliber. You have to know what Movement you are dealing with, and then just look it up on Google.
Exactly right. More precisely: The first row represents the entry pallet on the pallet fork and the second row the exit pallet on the pallet fork. The space between them represents the beat error that is also displayed in the top Line. At 0.0ms and 0.0s they basically form a uniform line.
It is mostly a problem of accuracy. A beat error that is not corrected makes it hard to fine adjust a watch and have it run accurately in the long run.
The lift angel charts I have seen online give lift angle for many, but not all watches, and they are by make and movement numbers. The NH35 is not on any of them, but 52 is a good lift angle if the specific one cannot be found.
I've watched a number of videos about Timegraphers and there is one very obvious aspect of these that no one has yet to explain. What is the second row of numbers for?
It's the previous reading of Rate, seems to display every 6 second interval, when you watch the graph, it's when the blank spot reaches that area. It scrolls L to R, upgrading as it reads. It will correspond with the Rate on the top row at that specific interval.
You can define how often a measurement is taken, (for example, every 4 or 8 or 12 seconds). The current number in the second row always replaces the number in the first row. The past ones stay, so you have a way of making out tendencies.
Do you want to learn how to regulate a watch? See the video here: th-cam.com/video/QhLS68tEH-M/w-d-xo.html
At 50, I just got into mechanical watches recently. I am a very technical person by trade and by nature and love learning how things work. While I have zero intention (right now anyway) of ever opening up one of my watches, I thoroughly enjoy these entry level videos in helping us learn. Subbed! Many thanks for taking the time to teach...I just ordered my 1900 timegrapher.
Different lift angles only affect the amplitude, not the other readings. Usually the higher the lift angle the higher the amplitude, more or less. The accuracy and beat error is not affected by which lift angle you program into the machine.
Good video. This is why we love our automatic watches.
Nice tutorial. Thank you! Well done and I learned a lot.
Great tutorial. (Please note, in English 'who' is a _personal_ pronoun; it is not used for inanimate objects such as watches. For inanimate objects we say which, not who. So: This is the first of two videos which are going to be about timegraphers.) 👍
A bad lift angle will give a bad information on the amplitude but the other data stay accurate, isn'it ? This timegrapher is great, I test all my watch on it. Fun fact in the Seiko official seller at Paris, they don't have this timegrapher. It was a big help the last time I buied my new King turtle which was completely out, and the timegrapher was with a low amplitude beneath 200. Probably the last watch I will buy.
The beat error messes with the amplitude just a little bit. But having dialed in the wrong lift angle for the movement on the timegrapher can mess with the results a lot.
I have acquired a quarter hour repeater that I would like to test on my new timegrapher. It keeps very good time glass up on the shelf and it in my pocket loses about 9 seconds a day. The case says made in Switzerland, warranted for 20 years so I can safely assumed that it is gold filled. There is no name on the face but the movement says that it is of Swiss origin and there is a serial number as well. The seller knew zip about the watch that he had bought at an estate sale. I had to show him how to use the recessed set button. He is a reputable antique dealer and I rarely see a watch in his store. I know just a bit more about repeaters than he does.
I saw a watch on ebay that seemed to be identical inside and out and was astounded to see that the asking price was $4,000 more than I had paid.
My question is, where could I go to get information leading to determining the lift angle for this watch?
Yours,
Bill Deutermann
I should add that as much as I love this watch, I need to determine it's true value. There is no way that I can justify paying that much for it. I feel that I should return it to the dealer and explain why!
It was really useful
What the heck is the lift angle?
Dial up, Dial down, Crown at 3, 6, 9, 12. Just for reference these are the testing positions.
Hi sir have that machine but I don't know how to check it properly can you send me details about it?
You know if this weishi IS availeble for omega coaxial?
I don't know if you found your answer yet, but having just researched timegraphers both the new 1000 and the newer 1900 will do coaxial. The 1900 also has a bigger and color screen vs the monochrome 1000. I just ordered the 1900 for about $180.
Help please!
Bought used tudor black bay 58 m79030n
caliber MT5402
Time graph
Test period 4s
Lift Angle 49 degrees
Wind 30 times let it run for 1 hour
Then I tested it on timegrapher amplitude was under 250 so I wind it 20 more times then my readings were
Dial up
+1s/d
Amplitude 262°
Beat error 0. 3ms
Parameters 28800
Vertical crown left
-11s/d
amplitude 189°
bet error 0.3ms
Parameters 28800
Vertical crown right
-7s/d
Amplitude 197°
Beat error 0. Oms
Parameters 28800
Dial face down
-1s/d
Amplitude 255°
Beat error 0.2ms
Parameters 28800
Does the watch need to be repaired?
Should I return it?
Thank you
Gravity can have an affect on the variations of seconds. If you are not sure, take the watch to a certified watchmaker for evaluation. It might be fine, but since it is a used, but a very nice watch, and there is no history with it, the watch may need servicing, which can be expensive.
I would add: Wear the watch for a full day so that you are 100% sure that the watch is fully wound. The MT5402 has a substantial power reserve, winding it 30 times will probably not even cover half of the power reserve. I would be really curious what the difference will be!
what I don’t understand is how do I know the lift angle of my movement?
The lift angle is something that can be different with every caliber. You have to know what Movement you are dealing with, and then just look it up on Google.
@@SillyVintageWatches thanks, figured it out
I still don’t understand why there are two lines, is one the tic and the other the top? What causes the lines to slope?
Exactly right. More precisely: The first row represents the entry pallet on the pallet fork and the second row the exit pallet on the pallet fork. The space between them represents the beat error that is also displayed in the top Line. At 0.0ms and 0.0s they basically form a uniform line.
What will happen to the watch if it has 4.5 to 7.5 ms beat error and leave it that way ?
It is mostly a problem of accuracy. A beat error that is not corrected makes it hard to fine adjust a watch and have it run accurately in the long run.
how can i find the lift anger for tudor , omega for example? or other brands.
The lift angel charts I have seen online give lift angle for many, but not all watches, and they are by make and movement numbers. The NH35 is not on any of them, but 52 is a good lift angle if the specific one cannot be found.
Exactly, just google the specific movement and you will most likely come across a number. For the Seiko NH35 it is 53°
🙏🏻😍👌🏻
I am a watchmaker in Sri Lanka and I speak English I don't know, I want to know a few questions about it, are you willing to help
Sure! Go ahead, ask your questions. Maybe I can help.
I am very happy, thank you very much
I've watched a number of videos about Timegraphers and there is one very obvious aspect of these that no one has yet to explain. What is the second row of numbers for?
It's the previous reading of Rate, seems to display every 6 second interval, when you watch the graph, it's when the blank spot reaches that area. It scrolls L to R, upgrading as it reads. It will correspond with the Rate on the top row at that specific interval.
You can define how often a measurement is taken, (for example, every 4 or 8 or 12 seconds). The current number in the second row always replaces the number in the first row. The past ones stay, so you have a way of making out tendencies.