Fanstoys Apache VS Ocular Max Saltus (Sit Down Saturday)
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This is a comparison of Fanstoys Apache vs Mastermind Creations Ocular Max Saltus. May the best Springer win.
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Springer's car mode always reminds me of the monstrosity of a car that Homer designed for Unky Herb on the Simpsons
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I bought Saltus because Apache was unavailable. But, as soon as I got him out of the box I knew I have made the right decision. I was pleasantly surprised by this figure. And he loves the camera. lol I also bought the rest of the animated movie cast this week too. But for the others I went with Fanstoys (except for Magnus and Wreck-Gar of course). And I like how they all look together. But the one that really blew my mind was Quietus/Cyclonus. Wow! What an amazing figure all around. Thanks for taking the time to make this video. It was very enjoyable and it even felt like watching a sports event. That was great.
I have Apache. His shelf presence is great. My eye is always drawn to him. Sculpt, weight and color is all impressive. The alt modes are only OK or good at best. I dont regret buying.
**open and play Big Spring sits in corner** am I a joke to you?
Thanks for the comparison. I really enjoy my Apache. It wins in the areas that are most important to me, plus I actually quite enjoy his transformation (as I do Koots as well). The MMC one does look like a good option though.
Surprised by the outcome, but not your integrity. It was a fair fight, and a very complete comparison. Outstanding work!
"Hello, police? I think someone took Bobby's identity..."
Good review. I have both now that Saltus has arrived and I think I agree that Apache is the right one for display/ Shelf-Bot but Saltus overall is just more "fun" for transforming and especially posing. And I'm glad MMC got the build quality back in line for this one too. They needed a return to form.
Thanks for going out of your way for the fans Bobby! Great content as usual!
Both car modes are a Stretch, one is a stretch limo (lol, I just can’t stop laughing every time I see it). I just want to see a cool car mode honestly. Great comparison. Well thought out.
Both are fantastic and it's great to see both FT and MMC at their best.
Nice. U need to do this type of video for all the stunticons!
Definitely!!!
Yeah, and since you have so many, it could be a defining event.
That would have to be a whole series of videos for each of the stunticon members and the combined bots.
The Predaking war was crazy. And then the Dinobots war.
A thorough, detailed, and informative review. Couldn't agree more. I have both. Love both.
Incredible job. I have almost the exact same opinion on all of it that you did. I was also thinking this is a perfect example for the video you did about collecting purposes. I wanted Fans Toys to win, but I agree they didn't objectively. However, I will not be getting MMC'S offer. The head sculpt alone wins it for me with FT. I'm mostly after presence, and there is just no competition in that category, IMHO. Thanks a million for the content. Keep it coming.
Idk man, I think MMC's car mode looks good despite of its inaccuracy, while FT's helicopter mode crushes MMC's.
I'm so torn between these 2 and have been waiting for a new version from someone to break the tie... but today... I can't pass up a huge retail discount and have to make a choice. I think I've watched this video a dozen times as well as the other related ones (OMG the other brands are so far down the ladder from these two) I can't get past the lazy paint instead of the hollows on the chest even though I like the shoulders better on the MMC. Thanks for helping me through the torment I even got imput from wife and kids because I'm so torn and there was no question... they immediately picked the Fanstoys... it just looks that much better.
I'm the opposite as I chose XTB and MMC over FT. Once I got my XTB, I immediately sold my FT. I won MMC on eBay for a measly $90, complete with box. I just bidded on it knowing I wasn't going to win and nobody else bidded so I ended up winning. Turned out he's not a bad figure at all. FT takes both alt modes but, since I keep most of my Transformers in robot mode, MMC wins this for me. The only exception would be Optimus Prime as I keep all my Primes in alt mode for whatever reason.
Thank you for taking the time to do this, they are definitely both well done figures and I think if Xtransbots ever actually do their version, they would need to go above and beyond to unseat either of these guys.
Fanstoys wins! But they both look good! The sculpt and paint apps takes it. Super Great video!😹⭐🌟
I really enjoy the unique toys Allen, he is cartoon accurate and he is massively robust!
Yep. UT Springer has better, thicker tabs too. It's alt modes are way better tuan any other Spriger as well. I jave all 5 MP Springers, and you can't go wrong witj any of them, but UT Has more to offer in most of the categories important to a collector, and one tjat wants a fun toy.
Great comparison Bobby.
Mann! I must say they articulation on the mmc ocular max ps-12 Springer is insane! As always great review!
The Fan Toys fans crying!
I fully agree that neither are better than the other as they each have their own benefits. For me, I go for sculpt in all modes, and Fanstoys ALMOST nailed it. The car is far too long. I will not be switching out my Fanstoys for the MMC but that doesn't mean I will keep the Fanstoys if some is able to do it better.
Well said and I mostly agree with your takes. I personally prefer the alt modes of MMC, especially the automobile mode, but that's b/c I think the original G1 is somewhat ridiculous. But, when it comes to presence on the shelf I think Apache wins from the waist up, and to me that's the more visible area. But, I'm still torn, I'm debating on shelling out another buck-seventy to swoop up Paik's Apache... But, I'm just not sure it's worth that much money for a slight upgrade on presence.
Hello sir! I always enjoy the vs videos! The death match for Transformers collectors. Thanks for taking the time to do the video for this weekend. I know you had to run somehow so we appreciate the extra effort! It was a surprise at the end since my prediction was that Apache will win for a bit. I see your points regarding the collector’s profile. That makes sense when you analyze why we are biased against one or the other, or at least I agree on why I picked mine (Saltus) over Apache (which I consider superior over MMC’s imo). Great job sir! Pretty outstanding 🤯😁👍🏽👍🏽👍🏽
I don't think in this case you would be ultimately disappointed with which ever you decided to choose. I can't wait to see you do this with all the Menasors that is going to be one hell of a video.
IN JUNE 2020 you can get a new 2nd run Saltus right now on chosen prime in stock for 149.00. APACHE is only available for like 400 used on Ebay. Choice is clear
Seeing them compared this way I cant argue with how you came to score each of these. I'm all about the display. So, for me Fans Toys still wins this one...barely. I admit to being a FT fanboy. But I love seeing the competition close the gap in what I find most important in a figure (sculpt, presence, and articulation). It's a great time to be a collector in this hobby.
Nice review, really helped me make a decision. Finally got Saltus in the post today and I am so pleased with this figure - Looks great, well made, and most importantly, fun to transform. That last point is the polar opposite of most Fanstoys figures, in fact, I dread even touching them, let alone transforming them. I still have nightmares about trying to transform Rouge...
Really nailed this one. I find myself in a very happy place right now. I waited, all of these are still available at most stores. The price is comparable so now I can just pick the one I like best. 😀
Thank you for doing this Bobby! I'm sticking with my Apache.
Mmc to pose
Fans toys in vehicle mode
Brilliant review
I think I prefer the MMC one more, but the FT one does have a lot of things about it that I wish the MMC one did. That said, I'm not getting either of these. There hasn't been a 3P Springer that can get me to replace the Thrilling 30 Springer in my collection.
Very interesting. I wonder if we'll ever see the X-trans one - they do tend to back down from competition but it seems to have the accuracy in the sculpt.
This feels like Omega - FT vs DX9. Maybe one checked more boxes, but the boxes FT checked are just much more important to me, and the difference is bigger, especially that presence and look. Maybe the only thing I really prefer on MMC here is the lower legs; everything else, FT fits my preferences far more. Oh, the headlights are cool too, but it's never in that mode for me anyway.
MMC! MMC! I’m surprised MMC won, lol. I just bought Saltus. But, I wouldn’t replace Apache if I had him first. Thanks for the comparison!
I got both. Apache for MIB and Saltus for display.
I had been leaning MMC...and this helped me to decide on the MMC. Considering I prefer the aesthetic of their Arcee I feel he will scale better with her as well, and he just flat out looks fun, since I do tinker. I am surprised at how much the MMC pulls off over the Fans Toys, but, both are beautiful figures. Thanks for doing this one, Bobby.
Really amazing video, superb comparison, highly detail, informative , simply an amazing analysis but if you allow me to suggest to please include release dates and a 5 second conversation regarding the advantages and disadvantages with releasing a figure first vs last.
Mmc all the way. Articulation means more to me now that i quit leaving them as statues and want more of a dynamic pose.
Hmm.. I like the MMC car mode. It looks like an actual car.
But I've paused some Springer scenes in S3 of the cartoon, and the FT vehicle mode *nails* it.
It was just never a very appealing design in the first place.
I'm committed to completing my FansToys 86 Movie collection, but don't know if I'll keep buying FTs after that.
I agree with most of your points, HOWEVER I do have some contentions
Scale: I'd say is a push, the figures are very close height and with scaling being so wonky I can't pick one over the other
Alt mode: this figure has 2 alt modes and both much better on the fans toys
Accuracy: only accounts for 1 mode, I'd probably give the slightest of edges to mmc but the accuracy of all 3 modes pushes tf over the top
Category weighting: seems to me that sculpt and articulation should carry more weight then accessories, gimmicks, price
Also I can't truly decided until the entire skullface family weights in
I was about 30 seconds in, and was like, “Whoa! Memorial Day? Damn, I’m on the cutting edge! Oh, Memorial Day LAST year. Gotcha.”
Finally got to sit down 😎 and watch. Yes, Fanstoys does have the presence on the shelf. But MMC is a strong Transformer. Awesome as always Bobby.
you should add another category: first to market because imo that does matter. Things like ab crunch are recent trends that new molds have that older molds didn't place value on. Also I feel even if these designs are done the more recent release can see the earlier and make some tweeks. In theory the later release should be better
I think I’ll get the MMC version because of its cartoony looks and size. Honestly I’m brand new to the game and so far I’m glad this channel does some clear cut comparisons between transformers figures. I haven’t collected all the figures yet as I have for the Autobots Optimus Prime, Prowl, Smokescreen, Bumblebee, Wheeljack, and mainline series Fortress Maximus. For Decepticons I have Megatron, Soundwave, Sixshot, and mainline series Trypicon. I honestly have both mainline series Devastator and Predaking but I think I’ll just replace my Devastator cause he’s just trash (the looks are there but the build and posture is just not working for me)
Fantastic edition of your Sit Down Saturday! I ended up buying both so I wouldn't torture myself with regret for choosing one over the other. I do like MMC's offering a little better though. Oh, by the way, MMC will hit a grand slam with their Bruticus. Paik 4 Life has an early prototype of Vortex and Onslaught which includes them combined. Looks super awesome and has zero parts forming, eat your heart out Zeta, and unprecedented articulation for a gestalt.
I like the face of fans toys. The basic design of chest. But the coloring of the mmc is beautiful.
Yes. I did think you would give more tie if not pts for FT. You surprise me. And, yes, I got FT's and won't get MMC's because, FT's looks "just about right G1"...which looks intimidating. I was hoping MMC would do a better job on alt modes.
At this point, I really wished I could combine the best of both figures. I have the FT figure, but now want a MMC figure, too. No way could I justify both, though.
I agree with your score but I like to look at the FT on my shelf better. Square abdominal section on the other one would bug me every time
Fanstoys Apache will never be replaced even if Takara gives us one. I have 3 Apache’s for each mode. I’m not against buying the same characters from other companies especially if they are really good. The way I display my bots are with their alt modes so if I was to get Saltus I’d have him far enough away from Apache that it wouldn’t matter. Id like to display all of my bots together in their specific seasons and years they came out but if I did that I’d have to buy another figure of each in my collection to be able to do that which would result in 3, 4, and sometimes 8 of the same figures just to have an ark crew and ect. I love this Hobby but it really sucks up a lot of my extra money, that might be the reason I still don’t have a new vehicle. Lol
I agree with this assessment. I actually waited on purpose for MMC or any other company to complete Springer because I didn't feel that Fans Toys Apache would display well in robot mode for my setup. Although I really do think the Alt modes on Apache is better than Saltus. Thanks for putting this together Skully!
LOLOL I belly laughed good at the bane joke
wow FT lost.thats a first.great job bobby,your bias towards FT doesn’t takes away your honesty.I have to admit on some points,FT has better face sculpt,articulated fingers and ratcheted knee,IMO thats the only flaw MMC has compared to FT..others on MMC,i’ll give it a pass even though MMC does seems a little chubby and the rear wheels are covered.however,the back kibble which can be seen from FT front view really bugs me,and thats a money changer for me.kudos bobby for this splendid review.
IMO you should also do MMC vs OP,as I see OP isn’t far behind especially for his backpack.for me,MMC>OP>UT.yes UT,he’s good except for the faux chest.
but then again,thanks bobby for making this vid 👍
The chest on FT's makes it an easy decision to keep my Apache. If it wasn't for that, I would probably switch. Great video. Keep them coming!
I'm good with UT Allen for now. Got him really cheap and he's well made.
I think I’m gonna have to go with MMC on this one. I really am not a fan of the FT vehicle mode. I get that it’s more accurate but I prefer MMC’s. However, I will admit that I really love FT’s head sculpt and helicopter mode
Thanks for the fair comparison, Bobby. Based on what I want from this figure (which is primarily his robot mode to stand on a shelf), I'm going to stick with my FansToys Apache. If I wanted a toy that I planned to mess with regularly, I'd pick up the MMC.
for every one who buys saltus know that every reviewer has mist a vital part of helicopter mode doe in part because mastermind creation forgot to put in the instructions . but the pics at there Facebook show that hip flaps are meant to be flip down to give helicopter mode stability
It seems to me that regardless of the one you got, you win! Great efforts by both companies. If Apache didn't exist I would most definitely have gone with Saltus. Well done man!
I don't care about cartoon accuracy what I care about is spending a ton of money on these figures and they can't even stand up right even my '80s collections stands better than MMC figures. If there's one thing I can't stand is paying $200 for an item and and I have to pose him perfectly in order for him to stand upright this is why I love fast toys because none of that figures tilt backwards nor forward they stand upward perfectly
I would have liked more differences between the 2 to make my choice a bit easier... , they are definitely very similar and beautiful figures,but at the end, i am still on the fence.
Thanx for this great vid btw.
Thanks for your time on this matter Bobby, but I'm sticking with my Fanstoys.
The winner is Unique Toys Allen lmao
I love the MMC more but hate the torso. I hate the fact it doesn't have a belly. If they did what they did with their trailbreaker (terragies) and hoist (artifix) where the hood belly could compress, I think it would have been better.
For the FT. I like the vehicle modes better.
Also, Thanks bobby for doing this. I really think it help potential buyers make decisions on whats best for them and allows them to see both the pros and (decepti) cons of both figures.
I would say though because of how long it took this to come out and they learned their lesson from a lot of the other versions of this robot and tweaked a lot of different criticisms they got. I know I'm not saying that copied anything they didn't they did their own thing but there's something to be said to come last in the game
Great video of my favorite transformer, and thanks to this vs. video I know which one I'm gonna get
i`m gonna give a potentially unpopular opinion here.
I think the best looking sculpt is Unique toys Allen.
his shape feels more animation faithful than any of the others to me, his more rounded
smooth lines and in particular the proportion of his legs and feet. feels more springery.
i prefer his much larger looking chonky wedge feet as apposed to the flapperdoodle feet that apachie and saltus have.,
the only things i feel that let Allan down is his brighter colours and the fact that his feet are yellow.
I think Apachies face is more accurate looking, but i feel like Both Apachie and saltus didn't nail the overall design
subtleties like the more gentle curvature on the limbs. The thigh to shin ratio on allen looks more like he does in the Movie to me personally, with the Shins being large and more tapered with the smoother lines. To me, the best springer would have been one that uses the overall design cues of Allen with his smoother more rounded lines but with Fanstoys head sculpt, hands and darker color scheme. also some of the hardware in the fanstoys of course..
Virtus is coming.
Great comparison video - as I said on the Saltus review, I find it's car mode at least cool looking; and I find in the comparison, what bugs me about the fantoys one - I really dislike the nose and cockpit of that thing somehow, it looks like a big fat tube with a stubby pseudo cockpit, so that warps my feeling about modes where that's visible (not sure that's fair, bc. in some art it seems about accurate, if slightly too 'high' and narrow.). But, since I prefer fun transformation and playability over display (I go more for 'deskbot of the week') I suppose I am anyway inclined more towards MMC's offering. I know your preferences are different, but, that's almost always what you manage in your reviews: make clear why you find something good/preferable or not, so we can make our choice accordingly.
MMC wins!
Nice! Thanks for the vid, Bobby.
Went with MMC, the articulation sold it for me
Just to be pedantic, but the Fanstoys does allow for both G1 toy and cartoon accurate shoulders.
I think you should have done the alt modes in detail like you do the bot mode. With those additional check points the F.T. would have won easily.
I love Apache. I wish I didn't love Fanstoys so much because I hate transforming every beautiful thing they made. However I buy it and put it on the shelf to never touch it again so LOOK is everything. Kudos to MMC .
Kind of glad i own the FT already because choosing looks to be a headache.
It definitely is....i wish it would have been more like a Deca Toys Kronos vs Phoenix, it would have been easy
thoroughly enjoyed this break down keep it up.. ebony maw thumb nailed it.... get it, yea u do
I'm torn between these,which one should I buy ugh!
The MMC looks like a 'toy' to me, where the FT looks like a 'display figure'. They both don't tick my personal boxes for a MP Springer, so I'm placing my bet on the XTB. Hate it that's it's the last one of the Springers to be released. If it turns out bad, I'm not sure how easy it'll be to get a MMC or FT at that time...
thank you for another great video man ... my arcee with den toys upgrade is still waiting for me to choose her springer... ugh , decisions decisions, im going to flip a coin
Hey sir, I like the wings! Cavs do fly...lol thank you for your thoughts you always give us food for thought.
From alot of the reviews the mmc one looked to be better articulated and more fun. But I'm not going to be switching out a figure that for 99% of it's time, will just be standing there. If mmc wasn't so late to the springer game, alot of folks would probably have went with a different option. Good review
Thanks
Great video man. I'm shocked at the outcome but I guess MMC "brought it" when it came to this figure.
Springer is my favorite "future" Autobot. So this is a very difficult choice for me. I like the accessories for the MMC I think its robot is ok at best and car mode solid ( not a fan of helicopter tho )
I like Fanstoys robot mode but it's not G1 enough for me ( while MMC is.)
I like the helicopter mode but hate the car mode. I still don't know what to do about this, I need help?
Very nice review 👍 fantoys Apache all the way
I wouldn’t compare these two. Sry just prejudice for unique toys sake. Perfect in my standings. Only other I’m even thinking of considering is xtransbots. Actually looks to be the best one yet.
I don't agree with every score point but I agree with the end result and the overall opinion. I would also go with FT if I had to choose between these two even though I agree that MMC gets more things right and I would also like to see FT win in the articulation department. I'm waiting for the MX-X Virtus, it looks very good, X-Tranbots/KFC have been evolving steadily as TF 3rd party companies and both have released great figures but they've also released some bad ones so I'm crossing my fingers for this Springer rendition. Nice comparison Mr. Skullface, thanks.
I need to add some updates to my comment so... I ended up canceling the X-Transbots Virtus (I did it today actually) because I completely lost my fate in X-Transbots with their latest fiascos. The Motormaster trailer lack of quality and price increase, that Kup QC issues they say was the factory's fault, the fact that the only update to the Virtus was a price increase (making me pay extra for a couple of accessories I don't want) and to top it all off the eminent release of the Protectorbot Streatwise (that looks flimsy, prone to breaking, has a messy transformation and is very pannely) before the release of Virtus (that I had already paid for in full ages ago) was what pushed me into completely losing my fate in this company.
Fortunately (for me) both Fans Toys and MMC are rereleasing their Springer versions but even though I said I would buy the FT if given the chance to choose between FT and MMC I ended up preordering the MMC one because FT Apache was rerelease at around 200USD that when compared to the 139USD with shipping included rerelease price of the MMC Saltus is ludicrous.
In the end it all turned out completely different then what I though and maybe it will turn out in my favor because I have a feeling that Virtus may end up (everything points that way) being the biggest X-Transbots flop yet, specially for 190USD.
@@brenoferreiraferreira4409 Thanks for the update Breno, Streetwise (Fuzz) has been a complete disaster. I have Locke (1st run) and dare not transform him. I bring him out for the occasional picture and right back in the box he goes.
I already paid in fill for Virtus, I'm going to see if ShowZstore will let me transfer that payment to Saltus....worth a shot otherwise I'm stick with Virtus.
@@dooeebear That was exactly what I did and I did at Show.Z, they are the best.
Makotron was part of the design team for Saltus. That wins it for me.
Great Review...as always!
Does anyone remember that Xtransbots Springer? Whatever happened to that?
Great video. Do you think XTB is ever going to release theirs? Visually it looks like the best but I'm not confident it will actually be released at this point. I bit the bullet and got Apache.
I didn't expect it to be this big a scoring difference. I thought it'd be a good deal closer, like maybe one or two points apart in either direction. Of course...they both crush Unique Toys Allen...
And minus the paint job, Allen looks better in all three modes than both of these guys do.
For me, the best alt mode is open and play one.. but the robot mode, mmc is better
This is so split for me. One point that matters to me is that all modes of a bot need to look presentable (that does not factor in the transformation, although that rule does bend depending on how horrid a figure’s transformation can be). FT’s Apache fails in that regard, which isn’t on them. It’s on the original design that is at fault. This is where I would’ve preferred if a company had taken more liberty to change things. Which is what MMC did. The car mode looks way better and I’m okay with it not being accurate to the G1 model. However, another big rule for me is that the sculpt on the head needs to look good (and that varies since what I consider good may be shit vice versa). This is where MMC falls flat. I’m not a big fan of that head sculpt, and FT knocks it out of the park. However, I’m willingly to sallow that pill over the other positives you mentioned. But I really like FT’s Apache. It’s like you said, both are pretty much solid pieces. Both are great in their respective fields. Personally I’m going with the MMC one. I just wish that there was some way I could switch the heads and have the FT’s head on the MMC Saltus
The Producers .....producer strikes again! Yes Ocular Max for the win!
To be honest I’m a Fanstoys fanboy but I’ve never been 100% happy with Apache, so this result is not that surprising.
Once you put the figure on the shelf, how often do you REALLY transform them?
Depends on whether or not it's a Fanstoys figure.
I think the open play one beats both of them ,it just needs a face lift and different hands .
Weel, the robot mode is nice, except for the face. The alt modes are decent, but were blunted, so to say...should have been more added to the back of those 2 modes. I still think it's it'sa decent figure though. A pleasure to transform it.