@jonathanwheeler963I think they adressed it pretty clearly, not sure the episode changes much really. Before the story wraps up, which they put some focus on as important, we don't know what it means and it is yet to break lore in any way. With the last episode, it's most likely that the Jedi will never find out about this guy. Everyone might die before they have a chance to tell the council. I believe what bothers them the most is probably that people assume the show won't cover the concerns way before it is finished. People complained about it breaking canon even when all we had were the trailers.
@jonathanwheeler963 Qimir: Name, I have no name. You Jedi though would call me a Sith. We can still be open with the interpretation of that dialogue. Whether or not he sees he's a Sith is still up to debate
He said “ some would call me sith” important distinction and there has absolutely been active sith for the last thousand years and they’ve been extremely powerful individuals.
Will you share your feeling about the other side of this equation the fans have certainly been toxic but I have rarely seen creators behaving the way lucasfilm has towards their fan base
You and Blindwave are the content creators, whose opinions on the current shows interest me the most because you both share your opinions in a differentiated way that talks about the stuff that works for you and that does'nt and explains it well. Thank you for creating great content and being a differentiated and kind voice in the fandoms you talk about!
Agree.. hey would you think dropping the whole Season from the start every episode , would have changed the negative views?.. I don't know just spit balling.. luv the conversation too
@@gavinp6609 I'm not Om1Media but honestly, while it probably *would* have changed some of the negative views, it would've been less interesting IMO. Part of the fun is the hype for the next episode, with people debating, discussing and coming up with their own explanations and theories for stuff. This way we take the time ot let what we saw in an episode sink in and then we start building up the expectation to what will happen next. If the whole season dropped at once we would just watch and go "cool". And after a few days talking about it, we would just move on to the next thing.
It is so refreshing to hear a conversation/discussion that discuss both the good and the bad in a clear and non judgemental way. If even half the Star Wars online community could discuss things as eloquently as both of you, it would be far better for it.
I personally don't like Acolyte at all, but I understand what you mean. Unfortunately, the online Star Wars community is very toxic. It's never possible to please everyone anyway, because opinions are subjective. I also hear a lot of hate towards Disney, but I don't think that's fair. Rogue One and Andor are, in my opinion, one of the best Star Wars projects ever.
@@Rugess-Nome Totally agree. In my opinion, Andor is not only one of the best pieces of Star Wars content we've gotten, it's one of the best television shows I've watched, period.
@@Agherosh This is the problem though, the well of discussion has been completely spoiled by grifters. Then the people who oppose the grifters lash out which further ruins it.. genuinely near impossible to have a proper discussion of the show in *most* online spaces.
I think the thing for me is as a person who has been around since New Hope debuted is that there’s never been a reliable set canon. The first printings of the novelization which Lucas worked on added items that were contradicted by ESB. This is leaving aside Splinter of the Mind’s Eye, which Lucas considered canon… until he didn’t. Lucas, who changed his canon constantly, based Star Wars on pulp serials and those didn’t care about canon either. He changed his mind constantly depending on what he thought made a better story that day
Well that was also while developing the main story, this show is supposed to be something that ADDS to the story, or even a new story you could say. It's in these shows that theres an issue breaking canon. It's supposed to add, not replace.
Exactly. I, like you, saw Star Wars in 1977 and over the next 6 years watched George retcon the story as he made it up. He did this because he wanted a good story. And sometimes to get a good story you have to retcon and make shit up. Darth Vader killed your father -> Darth Vader is your father (Nobody will EVER convince me that George wrote the original 1977 Vader to be Luke's father, yeah, no) "That boy was our last hope. No, there is another" The other WAS supposed to be Luke's sister, a Jedi (i think). BUT -> It was NOT supposed to be Leia. The girl he just made out with and she kissed him in the first movie? Leia was NEVER written as Luke's sister. But you know what? No big deal. Just make a good story. I'm enjoying The Acolyte very much. I don't really care about canon because I've been around long enough to know this is a cool space opera fantasy with lightsabers and real cool droids and Jedi and Sith. How anybody is getting so angry about "canon" is just beyond my mind to comprehend to be honest. Edit: I just remembered another famous retcon LOL. Obi-Wan tells look in tESB that Yoda was his master and trained him -> Nope. It was Qui-Gon.
@@ichigen511 Like I said in my comment above, it's not the same, from your examples the lore was still being created and the story was not finished. Additionally, this show is supposed to be new story, so why change lore, it doesn't make sense. For a story to be good everythings gotta be logical. you can't have 100's of plot holes just because "why not"..
@@perssontm1628 There's a big difference between 100s of plotholes and a story not being finished. There's also a difference between lore within a story depending on who tells it. For example, an eye witness could tell you what happened in a certain situation, but someone in a different place who wasn't there and only heard gossip or rumours would tell a different story. This idea is used in SW a lot since it takes place across a large time period, throughout a massive galaxy.
The cave of evil metaphor is so accurate with how we interact with media these days. Thank you guys for ever being a source of positivity in all your content even when you don’t like something.
They literally tell people not to watch it if they don’t like it so based on this premise how the fuck can someone know if they’ll like something if they didn’t watch it themselves first. Seems contradictory.
@@GacMan47 Now you guys are just creating assumptions in your heads, for me I disliked the 1st episode and left the show. That's it. Watching from the sidelines tho, it seems concerning how the cast and the lady heading the project, hates the whole fanbase...
Yeah... if i dont like something. I usually say "that didnt work for me, but it might be for you." And if ppl engaged on why or what I didn't like, I go into it. Yeah, it was too inconsistent, or not sophisticated enough for the writing, or hard to follow the plot... that kind of stuff... not these made up bullshit. u@FrostyMountain-wo3kl
@@RENT2_ well people say lots of things. Most claim that the producers know nothing about Star Wars. Yet they brought cortosis for the first time on the screen, and this isn't something that any casual person know, as cortosis only appears in side content like books and comics. For me it is like everyone is pushing the 'conflict' way too hard. if you don't care about the show anymore, I still recommend watching episode 5 or its fragments. Lots of great combat choreography there and pretty dark for modern Star Wars, so I would recommend at least that. For the rest - if you don't enjoy, then don't force yourself, obviously not everything is for everyone. And that is totally fine as long as people can discuss in civilized way and respect each other choices.
Genuinely thankful for you guys. In a fandom full of toxicity it’s so great to find people with positive outlooks and who aren’t always angry just to be angry. Thank you for your perspectives!
My take on the whole Acolyte situation is that the real problem with the show is not the show itself, is the people making the show. We can like or dislike any show, but once people started talking bad about The Acolyte the people making the show did the one thing they shouldn't have: they started labeling people who criticized the show as haters, racists, and other stuff. Actors, directors, writers should just shut the fuck up and let their work speak for itself, instead they engaged in toxic behaviour that makes them as bad as the toxic fans. This type of attitude was seen before in shows like Rings of Power and Velma, where in order to compensate their weak product they just deflect any type of criticism as some form of prejudice. The consequence of this is a growing resentment among the fans/audience, then things like "hate watch" happen, people will get furious and will hate the show even if is not that bad and attack people who liked the show, and the reverse will also happen with people defending the show against any criticism and attacking any one who disliked the show, and the toxic behaviour will go on and on and on. Talking now about my experience, I was ready to keep watching the show, but after everything that happened I just don't want to give audience to those people anymore, I can't see them as anything but toxic people. Even more so because at one point there was a debate in the community about "don't like, don't watch" and then people actually stopped watching, The Acolyte lost a bunch of viewership and what the people making the show did? They blamed the audience and went on with the toxic behaviour...
The only people that were ''labelled'' were the people who deserved it. The bigots, people spewing the toxicity. The people criticising it for non bigoted reasons are not the ones that LF are condeming.... I really don't get why this is so hard for people to understand and tell apart. Please show me proof, a tweet, article that comes from a credible source and not some grifter TH-camr, that LF is attacking everyone that doesn't like this show? It's just not the case.
@@katieee1203 Its also kind of a self inflicted wound in some ways. These content creators(grifters) often hide behind some legitimate criticism while sprinkling in the bigotry. Their fans then parrot this all over social media and it makes it really hard to tell who has actual legitimate constructive criticism and whose just a bigot. It's much easier to just lump the haters all into one category rather than go through tons of toxic comments just to find the handful of people who are being honest. You can blame them, but a large amount of blame also goes to the people being disingenuous with their criticism and stoking outrage.
No, it's not. If you have a functional brain you can watch something like Fast & Furious and even though you can like it, you'd definitely say "This is so fucking stupid, but I like it."
This video feels like the perfect addressal of these topics that resonates with how I feel, and how I'd like to. I tend to struggle ignoring the toxic discourse online about Star Wars just because I love seeing others' thoughts on the media I enjoy, but this channel has helped a ton by being such a strong source of positive, respectful commentary. Over time I've gotten better at being able to just ignore needlessly hostile videos and stuff about this franchise, and I hope others can do the same. Star Wars is a franchise meant to be enjoyed, and that's really all I set out to do when I watch some new piece of content. I hope that in the future, like or dislike any new media that comes out, there can be more rational, respectful discourse like this channel does. Thanks for making this, and keep going strong!
Blind Wave/Wave Squadron is the only place for Star Wars fans that's not toxic beyond belief. Things get criticised but it's always objective and never bad mannered. 👍
Agreed. Although sometimes I think they're a little too forgiving of things. I get it though, its who they are. And it's interesting to see someones favored opinion whereas I may find it lackluster. There's things I hear Blindwave dislikes, I like. Things we agree on to like or dislike. And things I dislike they loved! Its a refreshing place to have these days in a world that tries so hard to shut out opposing opinions.
The Prequel is my favorite trilogy and it encouraged me to consume more of the other productions such as the books and the Clone Wars animation (which is by far what I love most about this universe), so I learned very early on in my Star Wars journey not to care/participate in fandom discussions. Your channel has been a blessing in my life, you are the only ones I follow to understand the plots and stories more deeply, (I must have already rewatched the CW react at least 5 times) and seeing the way you deal with new content as additions to the universe instead of looking for flaws just to complain is what always keeps me excited to learn more and more.
Erick's quote about people entering the cave with a light saber belt is the strongest and most truthful statement I've heard about Star Wars in a while
Wow, great video. The Acolyte is not my favorite Star Wars thing ever, but I have really been enjoying it (episode 5 was amazing), and have been disgusted by a lot of the conversation about the show. Thank you for talking about this topic in such an intelligent way. I appreciate you guys!
There is way too much hatred in the world now a days. Social media just feels like it’s constantly throwing more and more fuel on the fire. You guys are always a breath of fresh air. You keep things civil and respectful while being open to people different opinions. That’s something we are losing more and more. So I appreciate you guys for sticking to who you are and not getting all swept up in the bullcrap. Haha. I always enjoy hearing you guys talk about things you’re passionate about.
when Eric is talking about when people use the term "shill", i have never agreed more it is so annoying that simply being a fan and enjoying something will have people yelling at me because of their sense of ownership over star wars or anything else for that matter
Is everyone who gets labeled a shill actually a shill? No. However, creators posting photos of themselves at events with the Producer, With Filoni, etc. and then never criticising shows gives off a very bad look as well (Especially if they over-the-top react to stuff regularly). Is "Everything" wrong with Star Wars? Absolutely not. Are there decisions and writing points that are at a minimum poor and at a maximum a complete mess? Yes there are and those should be pointed out and discussed. For Instance I think that Mae having one of her daggers/Kunai/whatever you want to call them be Cortosis.....a report of a material shorting out a lightsaber from the EYE-WITNESS. Allows the writers to have a reference found in the Archives of the material. This gives a reason for the call back of Sol and team to Coruscant after Episode 2.....and it allows for 1-2 minutes of discussion of the material, Master Andara's Death, and the need to find not only Mae, but the Cortosis weapon itself too! Audience is informed of a niche asset that is going to become a bigger part of the story/battles, Andara's death AND lightsaber going dark get to be massive shocks in addition to explaining Andara's shocking death to a small "Normal" weapon.
@@joeyhoy5624 it goes the other way also and wished they would have addressed that also because people have said that the production value isn’t reflecting the amount they were given to make this show just look at the makeup effects for Jedi Master Mundi it just looks weird his head shape is different and looks deflated compared to the other live action version in the prequel. Just like how people complained about the look of the Grand Inquisitor in Kenobi. I’m probably gonna be called racist and a bigot against women and all because I think that the show is lacking in quality for having such a huge budget to make. I have seen fan films that have looked better.
For what exactly? For saying art is subjective the moment something he likes is massively disliked? Lmao i want to see him actually debate a big star wars fan to see if he has enough arguments to back himself up.
@@2010josemHe has always said art is subjective. Eric is capable of defending anything because he knows it’s not that deep. It’s a fantasy space show, get over yourself.
@@rohegarcia2802 yet, he trashed Theory's Vader Ep 1 because it wasn't realistic to what sith actually are. Sounds hypocritical to me. Btw, franchises need fans to make money, if nobody comsumes your shit, you're done. So it's deep enough to make people unemployed. So bad argument buddy
@@2010josemTheory is that of which he claims the rest of the fandom to be. A fake Starwars fan, his takes are consistently terrible, he contributes to the hate of the fandom, and he wonders why he’s not invited to certain events ?? “Dude no way it’s gonna be Maul !!” Actually embarrassing, and he wants to talk about the acolyte “breaking canon”. The irony of him not understanding Starwars and claiming that Disney doesn’t when George Lucas himself is on the sets giving approval for these things is down right hilarious.
@@kryssz4074 refute his arguments then 🤣if you're so knowledgeable it would be easy. The funny thing is people say he hates star wars to make money, but then people like you say he doesn't get invited to shows, so it's actually the opposite. You seagulls contradict yourselves for a living lmao.
Always loved hearing you guys talk about Star Wars, thank you for all your content. You guys are genuine and I really respect that. Can’t wait for Star Wars celebration in Japan! Hope to see the crew there! 🙌🏼
Old time OT fan, honestly I loooove Acolyte its so refreshing, and I see absolutely no canon breaking in it and agree with you guys its so dumb to think the show is bad before you have seen it all. Theres a reason why being a movie critic has some rules how to critique....
Yeah what did u like ? The insane Twin threating to kill her Sister if she dares to have an own Will ? That sets a fire and then blames everyone but herself ? The little beta Jedi ?
Am I the only one who thought when seeing TPM as a kid that Mace Windu and Yoda was keeping Sith a secret, I always thought Windu’s eyebrows raised to Yoda as if they already knew.
I have been obsessed with this idea for like 20 years. They give each other a look during that conversation that 100 percent implies they knew SOMETHING. I love the conspiracy theory that key members of the Jedi Council are desperately trying to cover up any evidence of Sith activity whatsoever from the rest of the Order and the Republic at large but they know the sith are lurking out there in the darkness of the galaxy.
@@patrickwaldeck6681 I mean they say, "Only 2 there are, no more no less." Same two characters and also how would they have known that because if we look at what little we know the Sith were not always 2 and most stories say that this changed around the time the war between the two sides ended. Of course all of that is based on Legends (including KOTOR)
This is why you guys are the best Star Wars fans on youtube, best content creators and just have a great community. Fair, balanced discussion about everything, non of this wild clickbait outrage
Just wanted to thank you guys. I am I guess more casual fan I'd seen all movies and a little of the shows. My wife had only seen 1-6 of the movies. So this year we decided to catchup so we could be ready for the new stuff. We Watched All chinama on Disney including playing fallen order and new lego game. We enjoy acolyte so far . But we know nothing about old republic or anything in books so we have been coming to your channel to watch reactions and learn more about those things. So thank you for staying positive and keeping it focused on the story. We agree with how you guys. We thought episode 3 was cool. This is a story about space wizards it's ment to be fun and explore the imagination and story telling. So thx you guys
Glad you’ve been enjoying it and I’m happy you’re watching Blind Wave/Wave Squadron. They always have the best Star Wars content. Hope you enjoy the rest of the Acolyte x
Thank you so much for discussing this with maturity and calmness. I’ve been so disappointed by so many creators and fans alike recently who are doing nothing but trash on the show and some even going so far as to call people who enjoy it stupid and it’s been really upsetting since I am a HUGE Star Wars nerd and fan and I know most of cannon and legends but I still am really enjoying this show. I love watching your guys videos they are a treat every time they come out and it lets me feel like I’m needing out over my favorite shows with someone too lol. Anyways thanks for being awesome!
I love watching you guys since you're so open and generally positive to everything you try out ❤. I try to stay away from for example Instagram comment sections since all the negativity is only making me aggravated. But sometimes I try to leave som love and positivity there to balance it out a little. But after ep 5 I accidentally found a much more positive climate on Threads which made me really happy 😍
I don't watch your channel for the reactions I watch because it feels like hanging out with buddies watching a show. I appreciate you guys trying to curve the toxcity that seeps into a lot of these reactions and discussions for "Disney" Star Wars... Some of these canon people hold high regards to what George Lucas has done and written, yet George sold Star Wars after the prequels...was it for money sure, was it for opening himself to do other things and time with family, sure...but to touch on your prequel points, he also saw that what he wanted, and what he did.. didn't jive with Fandom when those three came out and how toxic they were. Especially when. It came to Anikan...that little kid was cut down... Hayden was almost universally hate, probably affected his career.
I’m so happy you guys are talking about this. It feels like every other youtuber is making 15 clickbait videos on the subject instead of actually trying to see whether or not the show is breaking canon!
@@ThisisKyle no he isn’t. He’s made so many videos talking about how the show sucks. He claims people who like this show are “ruining Star Wars” and how the show “breaks canon” because of an age change. He threw a hissy fit for the Wookieepedia Controversy because he’s the one that brought it up and claimed that they are bought out by Disney (they were just doing their job). Even during his watch party, when Qimir used Cortosis, he claimed it broke canon. The metal has existed in Star Wars for a long time. He is nowhere close to unbiased
Luke and the cave is such a great analogy. I do find that a lot of people have missed every entire point of Star Wars. Also, I don't get the Ki-Adi-Mundi lore break. They're treating him as if he is talking absolute facts, while the statement he says is a direct contradiction to what is actual fact "sith haven't been around for a millennia" he said that in response to a Jedi fighting a fucking sith, who was a sith apprentice... Ki-Adi-Mundi wasn't put in the acolyte as a throwaway character. Him, of all people, is in this for a reason. To show that the jedi are blind.
No, you're trying WAY too hard to make excuses for bad writing. If it was just Mundi, you would have a point. Someone made a mistake. But the overall quality makes it quite clear they just didn't care or deliberately wanted to piss the fans off.
@@williammccormick984 what are the examples of bad writing. Be specific. I keep seeing this argument and NO ONE ever provides examples. It's just a talking point.
I am so happy to have channels like this during this dark time for how the fandom is reacting. You guys are just enjoying the show and reacting. It's hard to handle all the negative that comes up when I just want to look up some good theories and see some breakdowns.
People getting upset about wiki edits to the point of DEATH THREATS is ridiculous. The whole Wikipedia system has always been open to edits, so newly revealed or discovered information can be added about entries.
Nobody should send death threats for anything... but plenty on both sides of this divide do. Bad actors are not a reason to dismiss valid claims. They retconned something and you're just making excuses that don't address the issue.
@@stephenoliveau Strawman. I'm NOT "excusing" anything. I just said death threats are ridiculous. Which everyone should agree with, but here we are. Also, where IN CANON was the age of the Jedi being argued over said in a movie or TV show?
@scotthewitt258 I agreed with that portion of your comment. No strawman there. Your excuses come when you dismiss it as ThAtS HoW WiKis WoRk BS. The issue isn't the nature of a wiki... it's the disrespect for the source material. You're the one making strawman arguments. Your emphasis on 'in canon' shows you know exactly the problem, but are disingenuously arguing a different point... that wikis gunna wiki. Disney chose to decanonize plenty of beloved lore so they had an excuse to pull garbage like this. The disrespect of the source material is an extension of the disrespect for the fan base that built this franchise.
@@scotthewitt258honestly doesn’t matter if it’s canon or not, if I was a writer I wouldn’t even dare touch such a touchy topic just to not even risk the controversy leading to your show getting criticism valid or not said criticism is going to lead to your show getting shitty reviews, losing money, & getting cancelled.
@@stephenoliveau Ok, but there's been no such disrespect of canon material in this show thus far. You keep reframing your argument to have something to complain about.
The thing with L3 and Lando can be explained pretty easily, even with Legends justification. We don't know how long L3 had been around, but it's clear nobody ever did any memory wipes, which is how I understood people generally prevented droids from developing self-awareness.
Blind wave is what gives me hope Still being a Star Wars. One of if not the only channel that tackles things from multiple perspectives. This is what constructive criticism should be
Great stuff guys! I agree that this toxicity is just too much. I have my issues with The Acolyte but it's definitely not all bad, and Episode 5 was a great step in the right direction. Pretty intrigued to see where they go with it.....possibly seeing Darth Tenebrous?
Watching you guys for years I have a complete change of heart about everything I watch. Now, I find myself unable to read or take in reviews with negative for every show or movie I see.
At the end of the day, it's a franchise about a FICTIONAL galaxy. Six year old actors should NOT be cyberbullied into quitting acting and Wikipedia editors should NOT be getting death threats.....
@@scotthewitt258 Funny because I haven't seen any threat to anyone, the same way most people hasn't seen any racism the cast talks about. It may have something to do with it being a stupid ass minority. Maybe if you focused on researching what happens you'd also hear about the fact that the wookiepedia editor that cries so much is nothing but an identity thief who steals other people's photos.
@WaveSquadron this is such a breath of fresh air to just see a dialog of star wars and not a full blown hate fest for no reason. There has been some crazy irrational things said about the acolyte. It's not perfect by any means, but the hate it has gotten to the degree it has is way to much. Keep up the good work guys. I always love watching your reactions and your dialogs.
Its been very hard to be a star wars fan on youtube as of late, especially when the biggest voice of star wars on youtube thinks the complete opposite from you guys
@bongzilla1472 if you are trying to yuck someone's yum. You are on the wrong side. If you said, this art if objectively bad and you are wrong. You are on the wrong side.
@@MasterDoctorBenji subjective art doesn't mean let's do stupid shit because we can. Subjective art still comes from logical, objective thoughts to make it more close to heart.
@@2010josem that's just not true. Experimental cinema exists for this very reason. Picasso drew people wrong, objectively bad. Except obviously it ISNT! Objective changes, reality isn't fixed in that way. You are simply narcissistic.
I hate SWT so much because he is overdramatizing how bad the show is. At most, the show is mediocre. But bro is saying it’s “breaking canon” and it isn’t at all. Almost all of his videos is bashing the show and wookiepedia for doing their job.
This is the first time you guys even acknowledge it. If i wasnt on the internet, watched the whole show and THEN went on online i wouldve been confused at the amount of outrage. The show isnt either good OR bad enough to get this much emotion out of ppl this is the first time its just too much for me like ppl are just joining this wave of hate, Yall shouldve blown up the ANDOR show and gave that the love it deserved bur so far SW fans making more noise when they hate something
I finally blocked that channel the other day. He's the epitome of the type of star wars fan I don't want to associate with. Him and stupendous wave just a bunch of clickbaity grifters IMO
@marleykirton okay but how, just because his opinions are different than yours. What has he done that's real toxic. Disliking on a show because of bad writing and identity politics being clearly placed overtly.
How do you all feel about the Jedi even being tore down more. They’re possibly covering up a genocide. How are we supposed to root for them? Who’s the “good” I’m supposed to root for in this show?
Great video guys. So happy to see this healthy discussion on these topics. I find it wild that some people who have watched star wars and claim to be friends can be so hateful and full of anger. Literally like the whole message of these stories is to turn away from feelings of hatred and anger
@@DominickvdHoff there's nothing wrong with disliking a thing, the fact you are self aware to you saltiness (for lack of a better word) means you are a much better and more articulate person than some people hating on the show. 👍
I am enjoying this series as of now. When I said I don't really see why it is getting the amount of hate it is getting in a comment I got a reply saying "Cause it isn't Star Wars". That reply was deleted again a few hours later but still. That's just the tip of the iceberg of the unwillingness of some people to come forward with a fair discussion as to why they don't like it.
I personally believe that even if Master Sol reports to his fellow Jedi knights about his encounter on Khofar that either Ki-Adi-Mundi won’t be present, or they will not believe him and dismiss his story or they will believe him and refuse to tell the high council because they believe that in alerting the high council that the report might get out to the public which could cause widespread fear which I am certain is what the Jedi don’t want.
Eric and Aaron with the well-thought-out and very mature points! The vitriol against this show is so hilariously sad and the people that give it the 1 star are just telling on themselves. Thanks for doing what you guys are doing, keep it up!
Spot on! Exactly my thoughts. I was trying to explain to my wife that I thought watching Disney Star Wars is a lot like the cave from ESB, people bringing their ‘wokery’ and ‘agenda’ into it and it not being specifically part of the narrative. She’s not a SW fan, so she had no idea what I was talking about
Love the discussion, the acolyte is defenitly overhated, not the biggest fan because of the acting and some weird scene that takes me out but ep5 was fire
Same. Im not the biggest Star Wars fan, and some of the scenes and choices in ep 5 had we going "eh" but lord those fight scenes were top knotch. I do have to say the reveal of "The Master" felt way too on the nose and felt disappointing. Overall ive enjoyed the show
If i had to be fair i would say... fight scenes are top notch... scenery and sets are top notch, acting is good to passable. Writing is poor... Mainly due to character motivations beeing all over the place. so far rating 6.5/10.
Same. First four episodes were the definition of mid so I can agree with most criticisms but some of the complaints are just ppl looking to hate prematurely. Episode 5 was almost Peak Star Wars for me
@@cajeb5396 The episode was the best so far i agree but Mae's constant changing of her mind was giving me plot whiplash. Her character was all over the place... one second her loyalty is to the master... then its to her sister then she leaves her sister to die at the hand of the master and goes off on revenge aggain...
I miss the vibe star wars fans use to have. I remember seeing star wars revenge of the sith in a packed theater. In my small town at the end of the movie everyone got up and clapped. It was such a vibe never seen that happen with another film since .
I just want to say thanks for being one of the few channels that comes into each star wars show with an open mind. It was clear before the Acolyte was even released that many people had already made up their minds about the show and have since focused on anything that confirms their biases, rather than giving the show an honest viewing. Regarding the subject of canon, I wish more people understood that lore evolves, and characters like Ki Adi Mundi are fallible (his dialogue regarding the extinction of the Sith was written to show that the Jedi did not know the truth).
And the people who went into the Acolyte knowing it was going to be shit was right. The show is shit. Shit writing, breaking canon, elements taken from legends and now applied as canon, and the issue doesn't even start with The Acolyte. It starts with the prequel trilogy shitting all over Anakin's story as the chosen one. Copium is strong with you.
Thank you for this. Channels like yours are like beacons of light and fresh air in the sh*thole that is the internet and the comment sections these days. 🙏
In the final episodes I am going to need some reasoning behind the jedi council not looking in to the disappearance of several jedi on Khofar and forgetting about the murders of the other jedi masters. I find it hard to believe they would just say "oh well" and not investigate further. I also wonder if Yoda would have felt their deaths. He could feel the other jedi dying during order 66 even through the "shroud of the dark side". My last complaint is I feel like given the budget of the show the writing and scope has been a disappointment.
C3PO being gay upset people makes me shake my head. People need to take a joke one, and also remember Anthony Daniels is pretty open about his sexual orientation..
Always appreciate your views. I think StarWars has some really passionate fans so no matter the project that comes out nowadays, theres always gonna be a more liking or more hating sitaution... but glad you guys are here to not only inform but also entertain, coz i too probably wouldnt look to the internet to see whats going on after each episode lol Great callback with the Twins reference too.. l😊😂
Slightly off topic, but in relation to what you said about yoda and chewbacca, I believe yoda says 'good relations with the wookies I have' when he offers to go to kashyyk in episode 3, so I'm guessing they do know each other well
This transcends star wars and it isn’t the fans to blame, the one that has a lot of growing up to do is Disney, being ignorant and defiant and just dealing with nonstop flops and money loss and not changing its ways.
No Star Wars is the one that has the growing up to do. Star Wars used to be good now it desperately wish it could even get close to the prequel levels of bad
I agree 100% with that entire beginning rant. I'm loving this show, but people are hating that I love it. People are telling me my taste sucks, and it's bothering me. So this was a breath of fresh air to listen to. Thank you.
What’s so wild about The Acolyte vitriol and nastiness is that this show is just…relatively inoffensive lol. There hasn’t been any tokenizing or “identity politics” literally beyond those characters existing in the ensemble 💀 in fact, I’d argue that this show is even less “offensive” (loose term) than the sequel trilogy in its political assertions (I say this as someone who’s very anti-capitalist and tired of big corporations tokenizing and misrepresenting peoples’ identities to the point where the actors become cannon-fodder for right-wing dickheads lol). For example, the only time gender has been brought in to The Acolyte is literally the one scene where Mother Aniseya talks about how difficult the galaxy is towards “women like us,” specifically referring to them being Force-wielding WITCHES operating outside of the Jedi’s purview. It was a statement of fact, and it was just about the most toothless comment that could’ve been made in that context. These rabid assholes should never try watching any Star Trek content if they think THIS is “woke” lmaooo. Star Wars for me has always been filled with its ups and downs. I have maaaaany criticisms of both the prequel and sequel trilogies, for example, but I can still sit down and enjoy films in both trilogies when I’m in the mood for them because I just love this saga at the end of the day. The originals are untouchable to me, but I can also acknowledge that they have their objective flaws - but that’s what makes them great. Disney has produced some of my favorite SW content of all time in Rebels and Andor, and I’ve also thoroughly enjoyed the majority of the live action content they’ve produced. Do I have my criticisms? Of course I do, but I’m not watching SW to hate on it; I’m watching it because I adore this universe and I’m fascinated by the endless possibilities it lends to storytelling. Even with some clunky elements and odd pacing at points, I’ve really enjoyed The Acolyte, and it’s now given me my new favorite villain along with some kickass lightsaber fights I’ll watch over and over again. The hate for this show is truly baffling and entirely unwarranted in its viciousness, so I’m grateful to content creators like y’all for having conversations like this that call the social media bullshit what it is and actually DISCUSS the damn show in all its positives and negatives. Fans like myself really appreciate y’all in times like this, so please do what you can to take care of yourselves in all the madness.
Exactly! The hate just seems so forced. I hear people talk about how much they disliked Book of Boba Fett and other Disney stuff, but it was never review bombed into oblivion. Like even if you think the dialogue or acting is bad there’s nothing egregiously offensive. And all the talk of story contradictions before the show is over just shows a lack of imagination. There are so many ways they could explain how it fits with the prequels, but nothing shown has explicitly broken canon yet.
NOTE: The Episode of Badonkagonk this highlight is from was recorded between the airing of The Acolyte 1x4 and 1x5
@jonathanwheeler963I think they adressed it pretty clearly, not sure the episode changes much really. Before the story wraps up, which they put some focus on as important, we don't know what it means and it is yet to break lore in any way. With the last episode, it's most likely that the Jedi will never find out about this guy. Everyone might die before they have a chance to tell the council.
I believe what bothers them the most is probably that people assume the show won't cover the concerns way before it is finished. People complained about it breaking canon even when all we had were the trailers.
@jonathanwheeler963
Qimir: Name, I have no name. You Jedi though would call me a Sith.
We can still be open with the interpretation of that dialogue. Whether or not he sees he's a Sith is still up to debate
@jonathanwheeler963he says the the opposite of that lol
He said “ some would call me sith” important distinction and there has absolutely been active sith for the last thousand years and they’ve been extremely powerful individuals.
Will you share your feeling about the other side of this equation the fans have certainly been toxic but I have rarely seen creators behaving the way lucasfilm has towards their fan base
Thank you all so much for sharing this! 100% with you all on all of this. Love you guys!
You and Blindwave are the content creators, whose opinions on the current shows interest me the most because you both share your opinions in a differentiated way that talks about the stuff that works for you and that does'nt and explains it well.
Thank you for creating great content and being a differentiated and kind voice in the fandoms you talk about!
One GOAT to another, love the Omn1 and Blindwave crossover here
The crossover I never knew I needed
Agree.. hey would you think dropping the whole Season from the start every episode , would have changed the negative views?.. I don't know just spit balling.. luv the conversation too
@@gavinp6609 I'm not Om1Media but honestly, while it probably *would* have changed some of the negative views, it would've been less interesting IMO. Part of the fun is the hype for the next episode, with people debating, discussing and coming up with their own explanations and theories for stuff. This way we take the time ot let what we saw in an episode sink in and then we start building up the expectation to what will happen next.
If the whole season dropped at once we would just watch and go "cool". And after a few days talking about it, we would just move on to the next thing.
‘A lot of people went into this with their blaster belt clipped in.’ Brilliant stuff!
This is why I love Blind Wave.
why cos they get paid to go Disney events so therefore have to lile the content
@@brolly2612 geez you just can’t believe the idea of someone liking content, completely proving their point.
@@brolly2612 you are a troll right.. the fact that you actually can't name 1 event they've been paid to go to lmaoo
It is so refreshing to hear a conversation/discussion that discuss both the good and the bad in a clear and non judgemental way. If even half the Star Wars online community could discuss things as eloquently as both of you, it would be far better for it.
I personally don't like Acolyte at all, but I understand what you mean. Unfortunately, the online Star Wars community is very toxic. It's never possible to please everyone anyway, because opinions are subjective. I also hear a lot of hate towards Disney, but I don't think that's fair. Rogue One and Andor are, in my opinion, one of the best Star Wars projects ever.
@@Rugess-Nome Totally agree. In my opinion, Andor is not only one of the best pieces of Star Wars content we've gotten, it's one of the best television shows I've watched, period.
Agreed
Yes, it's extremely hard to give arguments to things to only get the answer "WeLl, YoU'rE rAcIsT".
@@Agherosh This is the problem though, the well of discussion has been completely spoiled by grifters. Then the people who oppose the grifters lash out which further ruins it.. genuinely near impossible to have a proper discussion of the show in *most* online spaces.
I think the thing for me is as a person who has been around since New Hope debuted is that there’s never been a reliable set canon. The first printings of the novelization which Lucas worked on added items that were contradicted by ESB. This is leaving aside Splinter of the Mind’s Eye, which Lucas considered canon… until he didn’t. Lucas, who changed his canon constantly, based Star Wars on pulp serials and those didn’t care about canon either. He changed his mind constantly depending on what he thought made a better story that day
The issue is George himself was loose with the story so it’s at least consistent with everything else
Well that was also while developing the main story, this show is supposed to be something that ADDS to the story, or even a new story you could say. It's in these shows that theres an issue breaking canon. It's supposed to add, not replace.
Exactly. I, like you, saw Star Wars in 1977 and over the next 6 years watched George retcon the story as he made it up. He did this because he wanted a good story. And sometimes to get a good story you have to retcon and make shit up.
Darth Vader killed your father -> Darth Vader is your father (Nobody will EVER convince me that George wrote the original 1977 Vader to be Luke's father, yeah, no)
"That boy was our last hope. No, there is another" The other WAS supposed to be Luke's sister, a Jedi (i think). BUT -> It was NOT supposed to be Leia. The girl he just made out with and she kissed him in the first movie? Leia was NEVER written as Luke's sister.
But you know what? No big deal. Just make a good story. I'm enjoying The Acolyte very much. I don't really care about canon because I've been around long enough to know this is a cool space opera fantasy with lightsabers and real cool droids and Jedi and Sith. How anybody is getting so angry about "canon" is just beyond my mind to comprehend to be honest.
Edit: I just remembered another famous retcon LOL. Obi-Wan tells look in tESB that Yoda was his master and trained him -> Nope. It was Qui-Gon.
@@ichigen511 Like I said in my comment above, it's not the same, from your examples the lore was still being created and the story was not finished. Additionally, this show is supposed to be new story, so why change lore, it doesn't make sense. For a story to be good everythings gotta be logical. you can't have 100's of plot holes just because "why not"..
@@perssontm1628 There's a big difference between 100s of plotholes and a story not being finished. There's also a difference between lore within a story depending on who tells it. For example, an eye witness could tell you what happened in a certain situation, but someone in a different place who wasn't there and only heard gossip or rumours would tell a different story. This idea is used in SW a lot since it takes place across a large time period, throughout a massive galaxy.
The cave of evil metaphor is so accurate with how we interact with media these days. Thank you guys for ever being a source of positivity in all your content even when you don’t like something.
Why postive when something is bad ?
I'm so glad you addressed this. Love you guys and appreciate what you do, keep it up
Appreciate the breath of fresh air this discussion was. You guys rock.
People who have "never watched" something telling people how horrible it is just seems weird.....
Especially when all the episodes aren't even out yet. Never watching it is so much worse.
They literally tell people not to watch it if they don’t like it so based on this premise how the fuck can someone know if they’ll like something if they didn’t watch it themselves first. Seems contradictory.
@@GacMan47 Now you guys are just creating assumptions in your heads, for me I disliked the 1st episode and left the show. That's it.
Watching from the sidelines tho, it seems concerning how the cast and the lady heading the project, hates the whole fanbase...
Yeah... if i dont like something. I usually say "that didnt work for me, but it might be for you."
And if ppl engaged on why or what I didn't like, I go into it.
Yeah, it was too inconsistent, or not sophisticated enough for the writing, or hard to follow the plot... that kind of stuff... not these made up bullshit.
u@FrostyMountain-wo3kl
@@RENT2_ well people say lots of things. Most claim that the producers know nothing about Star Wars. Yet they brought cortosis for the first time on the screen, and this isn't something that any casual person know, as cortosis only appears in side content like books and comics.
For me it is like everyone is pushing the 'conflict' way too hard.
if you don't care about the show anymore, I still recommend watching episode 5 or its fragments. Lots of great combat choreography there and pretty dark for modern Star Wars, so I would recommend at least that. For the rest - if you don't enjoy, then don't force yourself, obviously not everything is for everyone. And that is totally fine as long as people can discuss in civilized way and respect each other choices.
Genuinely thankful for you guys. In a fandom full of toxicity it’s so great to find people with positive outlooks and who aren’t always angry just to be angry. Thank you for your perspectives!
Having an opinion is not toxicity. Grow thicker skin.
@@Taygon094 it is when the opinion is toxic. Lol
@@itsstrez What defines an opinion as toxic? By what standard?
@@itsstrez do you have an answer for this, or...? When is an opinion toxic exactly?
“If you criticize this show I like you are a toxic grifter”
My take on the whole Acolyte situation is that the real problem with the show is not the show itself, is the people making the show.
We can like or dislike any show, but once people started talking bad about The Acolyte the people making the show did the one thing they shouldn't have: they started labeling people who criticized the show as haters, racists, and other stuff. Actors, directors, writers should just shut the fuck up and let their work speak for itself, instead they engaged in toxic behaviour that makes them as bad as the toxic fans. This type of attitude was seen before in shows like Rings of Power and Velma, where in order to compensate their weak product they just deflect any type of criticism as some form of prejudice.
The consequence of this is a growing resentment among the fans/audience, then things like "hate watch" happen, people will get furious and will hate the show even if is not that bad and attack people who liked the show, and the reverse will also happen with people defending the show against any criticism and attacking any one who disliked the show, and the toxic behaviour will go on and on and on.
Talking now about my experience, I was ready to keep watching the show, but after everything that happened I just don't want to give audience to those people anymore, I can't see them as anything but toxic people. Even more so because at one point there was a debate in the community about "don't like, don't watch" and then people actually stopped watching, The Acolyte lost a bunch of viewership and what the people making the show did? They blamed the audience and went on with the toxic behaviour...
The only people that were ''labelled'' were the people who deserved it. The bigots, people spewing the toxicity. The people criticising it for non bigoted reasons are not the ones that LF are condeming.... I really don't get why this is so hard for people to understand and tell apart.
Please show me proof, a tweet, article that comes from a credible source and not some grifter TH-camr, that LF is attacking everyone that doesn't like this show? It's just not the case.
@@katieee1203 Its also kind of a self inflicted wound in some ways. These content creators(grifters) often hide behind some legitimate criticism while sprinkling in the bigotry. Their fans then parrot this all over social media and it makes it really hard to tell who has actual legitimate constructive criticism and whose just a bigot. It's much easier to just lump the haters all into one category rather than go through tons of toxic comments just to find the handful of people who are being honest. You can blame them, but a large amount of blame also goes to the people being disingenuous with their criticism and stoking outrage.
This is why I’m a fan of you guys. I love the rational, logical thinking. All art is subjective, period.
False.
No, it's not. If you have a functional brain you can watch something like Fast & Furious and even though you can like it, you'd definitely say "This is so fucking stupid, but I like it."
@@SilverFang95 What an incredible comment
@@SomePointlessGarbage Thanks, I wrote it myself.
@@SilverFang95 stay simple
This video feels like the perfect addressal of these topics that resonates with how I feel, and how I'd like to. I tend to struggle ignoring the toxic discourse online about Star Wars just because I love seeing others' thoughts on the media I enjoy, but this channel has helped a ton by being such a strong source of positive, respectful commentary. Over time I've gotten better at being able to just ignore needlessly hostile videos and stuff about this franchise, and I hope others can do the same. Star Wars is a franchise meant to be enjoyed, and that's really all I set out to do when I watch some new piece of content. I hope that in the future, like or dislike any new media that comes out, there can be more rational, respectful discourse like this channel does. Thanks for making this, and keep going strong!
good video. thanks for being a bastion of reason and positivity in this online cesspool of a fandom
Thank you for your videos Eric and Aaron! Always enjoy watching them 😊
Blind Wave is my safe space for Star Wars content
10000% I don't bother with anything else at this point
Yeah Kyle and Blindwave is also my safe haven for Star Wars.
That’s so awesome for u dude congrats! 🎉
Yeahh this is a safe space..I don't like the show..but people who never watched it and bullying others for liking it is sick behaviour
What about generation tech he does decent breakdowns with going into the hate of the loud pet of the fandom
Blind Wave/Wave Squadron is the only place for Star Wars fans that's not toxic beyond belief. Things get criticised but it's always objective and never bad mannered. 👍
Kyle Katarn is also a really positive place
@@vanessaaves3271 true, I forgot him for a moment 😅
Agreed. Although sometimes I think they're a little too forgiving of things. I get it though, its who they are. And it's interesting to see someones favored opinion whereas I may find it lackluster. There's things I hear Blindwave dislikes, I like. Things we agree on to like or dislike. And things I dislike they loved! Its a refreshing place to have these days in a world that tries so hard to shut out opposing opinions.
It's toxic in a positive sense, like a wife being positive about her beatings
@@burgermantheiii8623 At this point it seems like they don't want to say anything negative to get invites to cons ect.
It's the Anakin mantra. If you're not with me, then you're my enemy.
Love the non toxic attitude guys. It's so nice after seeing the storm of hate
It's not non Toxic it's disillusioned. It's bury your head in the sand and pretending everything is okay.
The Prequel is my favorite trilogy and it encouraged me to consume more of the other productions such as the books and the Clone Wars animation (which is by far what I love most about this universe), so I learned very early on in my Star Wars journey not to care/participate in fandom discussions. Your channel has been a blessing in my life, you are the only ones I follow to understand the plots and stories more deeply, (I must have already rewatched the CW react at least 5 times) and seeing the way you deal with new content as additions to the universe instead of looking for flaws just to complain is what always keeps me excited to learn more and more.
So beyond grateful for you guys and how you're able to use nuance and positivity to share your thoughts on Star Wars!!
Erick's quote about people entering the cave with a light saber belt is the strongest and most truthful statement I've heard about Star Wars in a while
It more represents burying your head in the sand because you don't want to hear crtizism.
If the last 5 times you went into a cave you got attacked by some poorly-written incoherent monster, you'd take your weapons in with you too.
Except it's not truthful at all because no one goes into these shows wanting to hate them
@ThisisKyle That is a blatant lie if I ever heard one.
Wow, great video. The Acolyte is not my favorite Star Wars thing ever, but I have really been enjoying it (episode 5 was amazing), and have been disgusted by a lot of the conversation about the show. Thank you for talking about this topic in such an intelligent way. I appreciate you guys!
this is a great discussion! thank you both and to all who worked on creating this but also to shed light on current events.
There is way too much hatred in the world now a days. Social media just feels like it’s constantly throwing more and more fuel on the fire. You guys are always a breath of fresh air. You keep things civil and respectful while being open to people different opinions. That’s something we are losing more and more. So I appreciate you guys for sticking to who you are and not getting all swept up in the bullcrap. Haha. I always enjoy hearing you guys talk about things you’re passionate about.
❤
when Eric is talking about when people use the term "shill", i have never agreed more it is so annoying that simply being a fan and enjoying something will have people yelling at me because of their sense of ownership over star wars or anything else for that matter
And how shocking is it Disney would want to invite people to things who are fans and not people who spend 20 hours a day hating them.
Is everyone who gets labeled a shill actually a shill? No.
However, creators posting photos of themselves at events with the Producer, With Filoni, etc. and then never criticising shows gives off a very bad look as well (Especially if they over-the-top react to stuff regularly). Is "Everything" wrong with Star Wars? Absolutely not. Are there decisions and writing points that are at a minimum poor and at a maximum a complete mess? Yes there are and those should be pointed out and discussed.
For Instance I think that Mae having one of her daggers/Kunai/whatever you want to call them be Cortosis.....a report of a material shorting out a lightsaber from the EYE-WITNESS. Allows the writers to have a reference found in the Archives of the material. This gives a reason for the call back of Sol and team to Coruscant after Episode 2.....and it allows for 1-2 minutes of discussion of the material, Master Andara's Death, and the need to find not only Mae, but the Cortosis weapon itself too!
Audience is informed of a niche asset that is going to become a bigger part of the story/battles, Andara's death AND lightsaber going dark get to be massive shocks in addition to explaining Andara's shocking death to a small "Normal" weapon.
@@joeyhoy5624 it goes the other way also and wished they would have addressed that also because people have said that the production value isn’t reflecting the amount they were given to make this show just look at the makeup effects for Jedi Master Mundi it just looks weird his head shape is different and looks deflated compared to the other live action version in the prequel. Just like how people complained about the look of the Grand Inquisitor in Kenobi. I’m probably gonna be called racist and a bigot against women and all because I think that the show is lacking in quality for having such a huge budget to make. I have seen fan films that have looked better.
Thank you so much for this! I'm so grateful that there still seem to be some voices of reason left in this fandom! This is the way. ❤
Eric would be a great Jedi Master... great take on the state of the fandom
For what exactly? For saying art is subjective the moment something he likes is massively disliked? Lmao i want to see him actually debate a big star wars fan to see if he has enough arguments to back himself up.
@@2010josemHe has always said art is subjective. Eric is capable of defending anything because he knows it’s not that deep. It’s a fantasy space show, get over yourself.
@@rohegarcia2802 yet, he trashed Theory's Vader Ep 1 because it wasn't realistic to what sith actually are. Sounds hypocritical to me. Btw, franchises need fans to make money, if nobody comsumes your shit, you're done. So it's deep enough to make people unemployed. So bad argument buddy
@@2010josemTheory is that of which he claims the rest of the fandom to be. A fake Starwars fan, his takes are consistently terrible, he contributes to the hate of the fandom, and he wonders why he’s not invited to certain events ?? “Dude no way it’s gonna be Maul !!” Actually embarrassing, and he wants to talk about the acolyte “breaking canon”. The irony of him not understanding Starwars and claiming that Disney doesn’t when George Lucas himself is on the sets giving approval for these things is down right hilarious.
@@kryssz4074 refute his arguments then 🤣if you're so knowledgeable it would be easy. The funny thing is people say he hates star wars to make money, but then people like you say he doesn't get invited to shows, so it's actually the opposite. You seagulls contradict yourselves for a living lmao.
Always loved hearing you guys talk about Star Wars, thank you for all your content. You guys are genuine and I really respect that. Can’t wait for Star Wars celebration in Japan! Hope to see the crew there! 🙌🏼
Old time OT fan, honestly I loooove Acolyte its so refreshing, and I see absolutely no canon breaking in it and agree with you guys its so dumb to think the show is bad before you have seen it all. Theres a reason why being a movie critic has some rules how to critique....
Yeah what did u like ?
The insane Twin threating to kill her Sister if she dares to have an own Will ?
That sets a fire and then blames everyone but herself ?
The little beta Jedi ?
Am I the only one who thought when seeing TPM as a kid that Mace Windu and Yoda was keeping Sith a secret, I always thought Windu’s eyebrows raised to Yoda as if they already knew.
That’s a good point
I have been obsessed with this idea for like 20 years. They give each other a look during that conversation that 100 percent implies they knew SOMETHING. I love the conspiracy theory that key members of the Jedi Council are desperately trying to cover up any evidence of Sith activity whatsoever from the rest of the Order and the Republic at large but they know the sith are lurking out there in the darkness of the galaxy.
@@patrickwaldeck6681 I mean they say, "Only 2 there are, no more no less." Same two characters and also how would they have known that because if we look at what little we know the Sith were not always 2 and most stories say that this changed around the time the war between the two sides ended.
Of course all of that is based on Legends (including KOTOR)
it would sense as how yoda would know about the rule of 2 which was created by bane in secret would even be tied to the sith itself.
plus remember they ignored doooku's warning various times before ep 1
This is why you guys are the best Star Wars fans on youtube, best content creators and just have a great community. Fair, balanced discussion about everything, non of this wild clickbait outrage
I love watching you guys. Thank you for being positive and having constructive discussions. You make being a Star Wars fan fun.
You guys are a fucking breath of fresh air. Thank you.
Always more thought and passion from this channel
Art quality is subjective, it’s up to the viewer to decide how different aspects of art have or don’t have meaning
Movies and TV shows are not art. They are things that can be objectively commented on when it comes to writing, acting and FX.
@@pixelsheep8939 If it can even be debated then it isn’t factual or objective. Movies and TV are forms of art.
@@Kriv-kj6lk But not writing. Writing is a fact and can be judged as such.
And yet funnily enough, its always the guys who say "Art is subjective" that throw a hissyfit when someone doesnt like their Show.
People should be accepting of other opinions, even if they disagree, that’s why it’s an opinion, not fact, it can be debated.
Just wanted to thank you guys. I am I guess more casual fan I'd seen all movies and a little of the shows. My wife had only seen 1-6 of the movies. So this year we decided to catchup so we could be ready for the new stuff. We Watched All chinama on Disney including playing fallen order and new lego game. We enjoy acolyte so far . But we know nothing about old republic or anything in books so we have been coming to your channel to watch reactions and learn more about those things. So thank you for staying positive and keeping it focused on the story. We agree with how you guys. We thought episode 3 was cool. This is a story about space wizards it's ment to be fun and explore the imagination and story telling. So thx you guys
Glad you’ve been enjoying it and I’m happy you’re watching Blind Wave/Wave Squadron. They always have the best Star Wars content.
Hope you enjoy the rest of the Acolyte x
Thank you for being the voice of reason
Thank you so much for discussing this with maturity and calmness. I’ve been so disappointed by so many creators and fans alike recently who are doing nothing but trash on the show and some even going so far as to call people who enjoy it stupid and it’s been really upsetting since I am a HUGE Star Wars nerd and fan and I know most of cannon and legends but I still am really enjoying this show. I love watching your guys videos they are a treat every time they come out and it lets me feel like I’m needing out over my favorite shows with someone too lol. Anyways thanks for being awesome!
You guys, Louise Julia, and Kyle Katarn are just built differently. And I'm here for it
Don’t forget Star Wars explained, he also finds the endless toxicity annoying.
100% this! You guys are great!
I love watching you guys since you're so open and generally positive to everything you try out ❤. I try to stay away from for example Instagram comment sections since all the negativity is only making me aggravated. But sometimes I try to leave som love and positivity there to balance it out a little. But after ep 5 I accidentally found a much more positive climate on Threads which made me really happy 😍
You guys are genuinely awesome, really appreciate how positive and rational you guys talk about topics like this
I don't watch your channel for the reactions I watch because it feels like hanging out with buddies watching a show. I appreciate you guys trying to curve the toxcity that seeps into a lot of these reactions and discussions for "Disney" Star Wars...
Some of these canon people hold high regards to what George Lucas has done and written, yet George sold Star Wars after the prequels...was it for money sure, was it for opening himself to do other things and time with family, sure...but to touch on your prequel points, he also saw that what he wanted, and what he did.. didn't jive with Fandom when those three came out and how toxic they were.
Especially when. It came to Anikan...that little kid was cut down... Hayden was almost universally hate, probably affected his career.
Eric summed it up in the first 5 minutes
I’m so happy you guys are talking about this. It feels like every other youtuber is making 15 clickbait videos on the subject instead of actually trying to see whether or not the show is breaking canon!
it's wasting bandwidth and people's time
Get some original stuff prepared and we MAY give you a chance
@@KarlKraus1 Then watch Star Wars Theory. The dude is calm, cool, and collected and is giving better criticisms of the show than anyone in TH-cam
@@VoiceNerdno he doesn’t bro💀
@@itschewsday5252Yes he does.
@@ThisisKyle no he isn’t.
He’s made so many videos talking about how the show sucks. He claims people who like this show are “ruining Star Wars” and how the show “breaks canon” because of an age change. He threw a hissy fit for the Wookieepedia Controversy because he’s the one that brought it up and claimed that they are bought out by Disney (they were just doing their job). Even during his watch party, when Qimir used Cortosis, he claimed it broke canon. The metal has existed in Star Wars for a long time.
He is nowhere close to unbiased
Kinda nuts how much energy people put into something they hate that they'll prolly forget about pre soon
I don't think they will forget about it any time soon
Luke and the cave is such a great analogy.
I do find that a lot of people have missed every entire point of Star Wars.
Also, I don't get the Ki-Adi-Mundi lore break. They're treating him as if he is talking absolute facts, while the statement he says is a direct contradiction to what is actual fact "sith haven't been around for a millennia" he said that in response to a Jedi fighting a fucking sith, who was a sith apprentice...
Ki-Adi-Mundi wasn't put in the acolyte as a throwaway character. Him, of all people, is in this for a reason. To show that the jedi are blind.
No, you're trying WAY too hard to make excuses for bad writing. If it was just Mundi, you would have a point. Someone made a mistake. But the overall quality makes it quite clear they just didn't care or deliberately wanted to piss the fans off.
@@williammccormick984 Hi mate, I hope everything in your life is okay. Genuinely.
@@williammccormick984 20:45. Please watch the next 10 seconds from that point :)
@@williammccormick984 what are the examples of bad writing. Be specific. I keep seeing this argument and NO ONE ever provides examples. It's just a talking point.
@@williammccormick984 go touch some grass, maybe you will stop being such a hateful person.
I am so happy to have channels like this during this dark time for how the fandom is reacting. You guys are just enjoying the show and reacting. It's hard to handle all the negative that comes up when I just want to look up some good theories and see some breakdowns.
People getting upset about wiki edits to the point of DEATH THREATS is ridiculous.
The whole Wikipedia system has always been open to edits, so newly revealed or discovered information can be added about entries.
Nobody should send death threats for anything... but plenty on both sides of this divide do. Bad actors are not a reason to dismiss valid claims.
They retconned something and you're just making excuses that don't address the issue.
@@stephenoliveau Strawman. I'm NOT "excusing" anything. I just said death threats are ridiculous. Which everyone should agree with, but here we are.
Also, where IN CANON was the age of the Jedi being argued over said in a movie or TV show?
@scotthewitt258 I agreed with that portion of your comment. No strawman there.
Your excuses come when you dismiss it as ThAtS HoW WiKis WoRk BS. The issue isn't the nature of a wiki... it's the disrespect for the source material.
You're the one making strawman arguments. Your emphasis on 'in canon' shows you know exactly the problem, but are disingenuously arguing a different point... that wikis gunna wiki. Disney chose to decanonize plenty of beloved lore so they had an excuse to pull garbage like this.
The disrespect of the source material is an extension of the disrespect for the fan base that built this franchise.
@@scotthewitt258honestly doesn’t matter if it’s canon or not, if I was a writer I wouldn’t even dare touch such a touchy topic just to not even risk the controversy leading to your show getting criticism valid or not said criticism is going to lead to your show getting shitty reviews, losing money, & getting cancelled.
@@stephenoliveau Ok, but there's been no such disrespect of canon material in this show thus far. You keep reframing your argument to have something to complain about.
I thank The Force itself for you guys and your rational thinking on a daily basis!
Thank you so much guys
The thing with L3 and Lando can be explained pretty easily, even with Legends justification. We don't know how long L3 had been around, but it's clear nobody ever did any memory wipes, which is how I understood people generally prevented droids from developing self-awareness.
That’s why Blind Wave is best!
At the end of the final episode, I want to see a cloaked Bith species strike down Qimir.
The prequel hate was different. SW fans ran George off his IP 😂 had actors on suicide watch. It was all crazy
And now instead of actors on suicide watch, they're sending death threats.
And those same turds are now saying they miss the prequels and want Lucas back lol
@@KCon-go7et Exactly.
They didn’t run off of anything, the man put JarJar in multiple Clone Wars eps because he knew people hated him.
@@jwiggs82 They definitely ran him off .
Blind wave is what gives me hope Still being a Star Wars. One of if not the only channel that tackles things from multiple perspectives. This is what constructive criticism should be
What just accepting any old shit?
Great stuff guys! I agree that this toxicity is just too much. I have my issues with The Acolyte but it's definitely not all bad, and Episode 5 was a great step in the right direction. Pretty intrigued to see where they go with it.....possibly seeing Darth Tenebrous?
Watching you guys for years I have a complete change of heart about everything I watch. Now, I find myself unable to read or take in reviews with negative for every show or movie I see.
At the end of the day, it's a franchise about a FICTIONAL galaxy.
Six year old actors should NOT be cyberbullied into quitting acting and Wikipedia editors should NOT be getting death threats.....
Amen.
You mean the wookiepedia editor who used pictures stolen from other people online because she hated herself so she stole someone's identity?
@@Agherosh All I heard about was Wookiepedia editors being threatened with MURDER.
Which is believe had to do with the current "debate".
@@scotthewitt258 Funny because I haven't seen any threat to anyone, the same way most people hasn't seen any racism the cast talks about. It may have something to do with it being a stupid ass minority.
Maybe if you focused on researching what happens you'd also hear about the fact that the wookiepedia editor that cries so much is nothing but an identity thief who steals other people's photos.
@@Agherosh that honest to god depends on if thats true or if you are pulling that out of your ass to justify death threats
@WaveSquadron this is such a breath of fresh air to just see a dialog of star wars and not a full blown hate fest for no reason. There has been some crazy irrational things said about the acolyte. It's not perfect by any means, but the hate it has gotten to the degree it has is way to much. Keep up the good work guys. I always love watching your reactions and your dialogs.
Its been very hard to be a star wars fan on youtube as of late, especially when the biggest voice of star wars on youtube thinks the complete opposite from you guys
Well, both sides are not wrong here.
@bongzilla1472 if you are trying to yuck someone's yum. You are on the wrong side. If you said, this art if objectively bad and you are wrong. You are on the wrong side.
@@MasterDoctorBenji subjective art doesn't mean let's do stupid shit because we can. Subjective art still comes from logical, objective thoughts to make it more close to heart.
@@2010josem that's just not true. Experimental cinema exists for this very reason. Picasso drew people wrong, objectively bad. Except obviously it ISNT! Objective changes, reality isn't fixed in that way. You are simply narcissistic.
I hate SWT so much because he is overdramatizing how bad the show is. At most, the show is mediocre. But bro is saying it’s “breaking canon” and it isn’t at all. Almost all of his videos is bashing the show and wookiepedia for doing their job.
This is the first time you guys even acknowledge it.
If i wasnt on the internet, watched the whole show and THEN went on online i wouldve been confused at the amount of outrage.
The show isnt either good OR bad enough to get this much emotion out of ppl this is the first time its just too much for me like ppl are just joining this wave of hate,
Yall shouldve blown up the ANDOR show and gave that the love it deserved bur so far SW fans making more noise when they hate something
Eric's criticism towards Star Wars Theory was SO thoughtful and really encapsulates how mature I think he is analytically.
Very smart it’s how u have to be with those type of channels
I finally blocked that channel the other day. He's the epitome of the type of star wars fan I don't want to associate with. Him and stupendous wave just a bunch of clickbaity grifters IMO
@marleykirton okay but how, just because his opinions are different than yours. What has he done that's real toxic. Disliking on a show because of bad writing and identity politics being clearly placed overtly.
Thank you, guys for sharing!... this is awesome.
#STARWARSFAN4LIFE!!
Thats why I like you guys, damn
How do you all feel about the Jedi even being tore down more. They’re possibly covering up a genocide.
How are we supposed to root for them?
Who’s the “good” I’m supposed to root for in this show?
I will say the first thing is to wait for the actual reveal before making the a big fire about it.
Great video guys. So happy to see this healthy discussion on these topics. I find it wild that some people who have watched star wars and claim to be friends can be so hateful and full of anger. Literally like the whole message of these stories is to turn away from feelings of hatred and anger
I like that you guys stay positive in this environment.
You're better people than me though, I've been quite salty over some stuff. but I can appreciate the positives too.
@@DominickvdHoff there's nothing wrong with disliking a thing, the fact you are self aware to you saltiness (for lack of a better word) means you are a much better and more articulate person than some people hating on the show. 👍
This background is incredible
Great discussion.
I am enjoying this series as of now. When I said I don't really see why it is getting the amount of hate it is getting in a comment I got a reply saying "Cause it isn't Star Wars". That reply was deleted again a few hours later but still. That's just the tip of the iceberg of the unwillingness of some people to come forward with a fair discussion as to why they don't like it.
I personally believe that even if Master Sol reports to his fellow Jedi knights about his encounter on Khofar that either Ki-Adi-Mundi won’t be present, or they will not believe him and dismiss his story or they will believe him and refuse to tell the high council because they believe that in alerting the high council that the report might get out to the public which could cause widespread fear which I am certain is what the Jedi don’t want.
Eric and Aaron with the well-thought-out and very mature points! The vitriol against this show is so hilariously sad and the people that give it the 1 star are just telling on themselves. Thanks for doing what you guys are doing, keep it up!
Well thought out points. The whole point :art is subjective. Lmaoo
Spot on! Exactly my thoughts. I was trying to explain to my wife that I thought watching Disney Star Wars is a lot like the cave from ESB, people bringing their ‘wokery’ and ‘agenda’ into it and it not being specifically part of the narrative. She’s not a SW fan, so she had no idea what I was talking about
Ironic that so many fans give in to hate considering the message of Star Wars...
Eric thank you for reminding us that these are made up stories about space wizards and not to be taken so damn seriously. 😉
Ya ture bad if it's not good it's not good
Yeah don't take it so seriously when you criticize it but when you're praising it you should take it incredibly serious. You people are hypocrites
@@ThisisKyleI love that you can’t see the irony of your own comment. Lol
@@M0M0117 What's the irony?
@@pixelsheep8939 he’s hating on them for praising the show, because he wants them to hate show so he can praise them.
Love the discussion, the acolyte is defenitly overhated, not the biggest fan because of the acting and some weird scene that takes me out but ep5 was fire
Same. Im not the biggest Star Wars fan, and some of the scenes and choices in ep 5 had we going "eh" but lord those fight scenes were top knotch. I do have to say the reveal of "The Master" felt way too on the nose and felt disappointing. Overall ive enjoyed the show
If i had to be fair i would say... fight scenes are top notch... scenery and sets are top notch, acting is good to passable. Writing is poor... Mainly due to character motivations beeing all over the place. so far rating 6.5/10.
I agree, don’t like the acolyte but there are no objective criticisms and it hasn’t broken canon yet.
Same. First four episodes were the definition of mid so I can agree with most criticisms but some of the complaints are just ppl looking to hate prematurely. Episode 5 was almost Peak Star Wars for me
@@cajeb5396 The episode was the best so far i agree but Mae's constant changing of her mind was giving me plot whiplash. Her character was all over the place... one second her loyalty is to the master... then its to her sister then she leaves her sister to die at the hand of the master and goes off on revenge aggain...
I miss the vibe star wars fans use to have. I remember seeing star wars revenge of the sith in a packed theater. In my small town at the end of the movie everyone got up and clapped. It was such a vibe never seen that happen with another film since .
I just want to say thanks for being one of the few channels that comes into each star wars show with an open mind.
It was clear before the Acolyte was even released that many people had already made up their minds about the show and have since focused on anything that confirms their biases, rather than giving the show an honest viewing.
Regarding the subject of canon, I wish more people understood that lore evolves, and characters like Ki Adi Mundi are fallible (his dialogue regarding the extinction of the Sith was written to show that the Jedi did not know the truth).
And the people who went into the Acolyte knowing it was going to be shit was right. The show is shit. Shit writing, breaking canon, elements taken from legends and now applied as canon, and the issue doesn't even start with The Acolyte. It starts with the prequel trilogy shitting all over Anakin's story as the chosen one.
Copium is strong with you.
Paraphrasing "What happened to grace?"
Grace doesn't sell. Outrage sells. That's the math, homie, and it sucks balls, but it is what it is.
This is nice and refreshing. Keep it up.
You guys are the best, I hope y’all realize how much it means to us to have this space not be infected like the rest of the fandom.
Thank you for this. Channels like yours are like beacons of light and fresh air in the sh*thole that is the internet and the comment sections these days. 🙏
In the final episodes I am going to need some reasoning behind the jedi council not looking in to the disappearance of several jedi on Khofar and forgetting about the murders of the other jedi masters. I find it hard to believe they would just say "oh well" and not investigate further. I also wonder if Yoda would have felt their deaths. He could feel the other jedi dying during order 66 even through the "shroud of the dark side". My last complaint is I feel like given the budget of the show the writing and scope has been a disappointment.
Love this discussion!!! Always enjoy your thoughts on star wars
There is definitely objectively bad movies/tv shows. Acting, writing, directing, visuals can be measured objectively
C3PO being gay upset people makes me shake my head. People need to take a joke one, and also remember Anthony Daniels is pretty open about his sexual orientation..
This
The robot is gay?
Always appreciate your views. I think StarWars has some really passionate fans so no matter the project that comes out nowadays, theres always gonna be a more liking or more hating sitaution... but glad you guys are here to not only inform but also entertain, coz i too probably wouldnt look to the internet to see whats going on after each episode lol
Great callback with the Twins reference too.. l😊😂
Thanks to Eric and Aaron for their reasonable assessments! 🌌
Slightly off topic, but in relation to what you said about yoda and chewbacca, I believe yoda says 'good relations with the wookies I have' when he offers to go to kashyyk in episode 3, so I'm guessing they do know each other well
It's a damn shame these guys even had to do this. The Star Wars fanbase, in general, has a lot of growing up to do.
This transcends star wars and it isn’t the fans to blame, the one that has a lot of growing up to do is Disney, being ignorant and defiant and just dealing with nonstop flops and money loss and not changing its ways.
@@nickmacias00how is that anyone’s problem but Disney? Why spread vitriol over a company making bad movies or tv? Who cares?
No, we don't. We see the shit for the trees.
No Star Wars is the one that has the growing up to do. Star Wars used to be good now it desperately wish it could even get close to the prequel levels of bad
I agree 100% with that entire beginning rant. I'm loving this show, but people are hating that I love it. People are telling me my taste sucks, and it's bothering me. So this was a breath of fresh air to listen to. Thank you.
Couldn’t have explained it better, it’s not the best show to exist, but most of the hate is totally uncalled for.
C3P0 and R2D2 were speculated to being an old married couple the way they bickered but truly loved and would do anything for each other.
What’s so wild about The Acolyte vitriol and nastiness is that this show is just…relatively inoffensive lol. There hasn’t been any tokenizing or “identity politics” literally beyond those characters existing in the ensemble 💀 in fact, I’d argue that this show is even less “offensive” (loose term) than the sequel trilogy in its political assertions (I say this as someone who’s very anti-capitalist and tired of big corporations tokenizing and misrepresenting peoples’ identities to the point where the actors become cannon-fodder for right-wing dickheads lol). For example, the only time gender has been brought in to The Acolyte is literally the one scene where Mother Aniseya talks about how difficult the galaxy is towards “women like us,” specifically referring to them being Force-wielding WITCHES operating outside of the Jedi’s purview. It was a statement of fact, and it was just about the most toothless comment that could’ve been made in that context. These rabid assholes should never try watching any Star Trek content if they think THIS is “woke” lmaooo.
Star Wars for me has always been filled with its ups and downs. I have maaaaany criticisms of both the prequel and sequel trilogies, for example, but I can still sit down and enjoy films in both trilogies when I’m in the mood for them because I just love this saga at the end of the day. The originals are untouchable to me, but I can also acknowledge that they have their objective flaws - but that’s what makes them great. Disney has produced some of my favorite SW content of all time in Rebels and Andor, and I’ve also thoroughly enjoyed the majority of the live action content they’ve produced. Do I have my criticisms? Of course I do, but I’m not watching SW to hate on it; I’m watching it because I adore this universe and I’m fascinated by the endless possibilities it lends to storytelling.
Even with some clunky elements and odd pacing at points, I’ve really enjoyed The Acolyte, and it’s now given me my new favorite villain along with some kickass lightsaber fights I’ll watch over and over again. The hate for this show is truly baffling and entirely unwarranted in its viciousness, so I’m grateful to content creators like y’all for having conversations like this that call the social media bullshit what it is and actually DISCUSS the damn show in all its positives and negatives. Fans like myself really appreciate y’all in times like this, so please do what you can to take care of yourselves in all the madness.
Exactly! The hate just seems so forced. I hear people talk about how much they disliked Book of Boba Fett and other Disney stuff, but it was never review bombed into oblivion. Like even if you think the dialogue or acting is bad there’s nothing egregiously offensive. And all the talk of story contradictions before the show is over just shows a lack of imagination. There are so many ways they could explain how it fits with the prequels, but nothing shown has explicitly broken canon yet.
@@Luminousbeing99 or maybe more people just dont like this and think its not very good?
I will always pray that Filoni brings Plo Koon back. Iirc he said he wants to and has also talked about his love for the character.
This is why I adore you sweet puddins. Thank you for just having a good time. ❤
I'm gonna start calling people sweet puddins. I love that so much. Haha
Well said guys!