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I made conservatives mad??? 😭
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 20 ต.ค. 2021
- Anthony talks about the attention his recent Tweet has gotten live on Twitch.
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Conservatism is by definition a defense of the status quo. It’s hard to be cutting edge when your cutting edge idea is that things should stay the same, or even go back in time.
Haha lol
I wouldn't say its about conserving the status quo because they are not happy with the current status quo. It would be more accurate to say they preserve values they consider to be "traditional" that may or may not have been the status quo at one point.
@@Altair4611 the status quo is definitely still right leaning. conservatives are just mad at the current status quo that they perceive, because they live in an alternate reality where cities are being burned down for BLM, and schools have litter boxes for trans species children.
The ignorance in your post is off the charts.
You're castigating every person who leans conservative as if conservatism rules EVERYTHING they do. I'm a conservative politically, but that doesnt mean I want to maintain the status quo on every fucking thing. I love music and its important to me personally, but that doesn't mean my political views bleed into my musical views. They're totally unrelated. Why would they be?
@@sHART1780"but that doesn't mean my political views bleed into my musical views."
then they aren't talking about you
isnt conservatism literally about not moving forward and not changing?
Yeah lmao that’s the whole problem with it
Pretty much. Its in the name for fuck sakes/
Lol basically yeah don’t change anything keep the system the same
likewise, liberalism is about revisionism and erasing and changing history. yikes
@@sigmaligmaballs2306 making our country better and distancing itself from its terrible past isn’t erasing history, it’s changing the present. But whatever helps you sleep at night buddy
"Sex Pistols". Literally had a song called "Anarchy in the UK" and called the Monarchy a "fascist regime". Real Conservative!
Oh yeah Sex Pistols, you mean the punk rock band that is now currently labeled as a bunch of “posers” by the punk community because one of the members talked about how the right are now the ones standing up to the establishment. Also didn’t Sid Viscious wear Nazi symbols?
Tho I agree with you. Funny you bring up Johnny rotten tho look at him now. And even some of lyrics back then the issue I always had with Sex Pistols is sometimes they didn’t take a side hard enough (it’s why the clash is better in lyrics) look at “bodies” he kinda calls both sides argument and doesn’t really pick one. And pil had awful lyrics imo
They were against everything. They wore Swazis and s&m they were trying to offend everyone. Not just conservatives, liberals too.
@@bowbow77 yeah, the turn JR made was a weird one, can't stand him now, but he certainly couldn't have been called a Conservative back in the day. Although the Pistols were basically a manufactured band so who knows what they really believed. Never really listened to PIL so can't really comment on them. But I agree on The Clash, far superior band IMO.
The Sex Pistols are utter crap, and nothing they ever wrote was of any actual meaning or substance. The lyrical contents of their songs are all juvenile drivel, and their chief songwriter basically bookended their career with "I don't actually believe in anarchy it just sounded cool, true anarchy would be a disaster" and "actually, the royal family is alright and the military is the most fundamental part of British society and requires the most funds"
"we are fun and interesting!" - guy whose dressed like a pastor.
Tbf my family is literally friends with pastors that are primarily a local indie rock duo lol, they're very open about not being conservatives tho
I went to my doctor to get extra T, he said you was there for gender surgery
@@WiloPolis03 nobody said you couldn't have a religion and not be conservative,
@@nore5888 I was just saying pastors can be fun and interesting, was also sorta shitposting
Some pastors are cool people.
One guy in the chat literally said that Rage Against the Machine is conservative. I'm done.
I really hope he was joking
They are the least conservative artist ever lmao
Knowing melon's fans, he was probably trolling
Grade A trolling right there
oh my god hahahahahahaha
"conservatives don't even have the guy who wrote 'born in the usa'"
chat is incredible
conservatism rarely supports art as a lifestyle or profession! it’s weird that dave rubin would even try to say conservatives are the next big thing in any category of art when that’s often discouraged as a life path
Mozart died poor.
wrong
@@ddvsgd9508 wrong
@@ddvsgd9508 and?
@@ddvsgd9508 Does rich=happy? no
Dave Rubin has obviously never listened to 100 Gecs
Prob jams Rage Against the Machine
100 gecs suck
@@CancelHappiness no
your pfp looks like a shoebill stork
@@lucasrienstra4163 that's your opinion. Mine is they suck. Music is subjective after all
“we’re the fun people, we’re the open minded people”
buddy, ur whole party got triggered over a gender neutral potato
💯😂
Now non sexy chocolate candies.
@@scythe13-13 that was the right who got upset over a potato and now apparently chocolate, that wasn’t fantano
They got mad over a fake yellow bird getting an immunization
@@charliesav4902 didn’t tpusa ban the whole cast of Sesame Street ? 😂
I love how Dave Rubin says “the next great art will come from the right” because it implies there isnt great art coming out right now. I would love to know what Dave thinks is the most recent great art.
the sistine chapel
Trapt's Shadow Work
Probably Huey Luis and the News
@@stephenzavatski8016 I was literally gonna put this in my comment but decided to keep it simple 😂
@@gregperez-greene7408 wait is Huey Lewis conservative because that would be specifically devastating to me
Conservativism is literally about conserving culture and not innovating on it. Art innovation is inherently progressive in a cultural context; not naturally leftist though.
Fuck conservatives, but this is a simplistic take on art. Major developments in art are not always innovative; they've often been rennovative. Look at modernist writers like Pound (with his famous command to "make it new"), Eliot, or Ungaretti; look at the Italian Renaissance, the Pre-Raphaelite Brotherhood, Neoclassicism...the idea of revitalizing the old ways (thereby preserving what's worth preserving of them) has been crucial throughout art history. Also, metal is kind of the element in the room for this whole discussion; black metal in particular has always been predominantly ultra-conservative, regardless of whether or not suburban soccer moms want their kids to listen to it.
wrong
@@sojirokaidoh2 tf are you on about? Is reimagining old concepts not inherently innovative?
@@sojirokaidoh2 all art is built on innovations on the past cultural works. Black metal is is countercultural, which works against traditional conservative ideals. Conservative definition: adverse to change or innovation and holding traditional values.
@@karstencarsten9964 If it's done expressly to keep the old things fresh and alive, you can't deny that it's being driven by conservative values. Conservative/progressive isn't always as clean a dichotomy as you want it to be.
I feel like going through every individual musician and looking at their political views misses the broader point, the idea is that movements within music are very rarely initiated by conservatives or from a conservative ideological space. There might be conservative rock stars or rappers, but we don't have those genres in the first place because of conservative thought And it's more than likely conservatives that actively fought against the new wave in music (jazz, and rock, and hip hop) being accepted by broader society.
Appropriate take
@@HectorTWE yay! And it's like the more you think about it, and the deeper into any particular genre you go the more you see conservatives fighting against every new thing that happens in that genre. Like just in rock music you have conservatives against the black people who invented the genre, then Elvis for taking a lot of the sound and movements and popularizing it, the satanic panic when hard Rock and metal started, punk rock being anti-fascist, The folk rock around Vietnam and the hippie stuff, just decades and decades of conservatives being against pretty much every new thing that happens.
Conservatives have always been anti progress and all about conserving what they see as traditional and making sure things in society change as little as possible. Therefore every new wave of music, every experimental and innovative and unusual movement of art, have very little chances of coming from conservatives.
That’s what I was thinking. Movements in art and literature always has progressives at the forefront.
Facts
Dave Rubin's assertion that CONSERVatism, meaning wanting to CONSERVE an older way of life, is this "cool new thing," is just proof that Dave is too smart for the rest of us to understand. My brain is still recovering.
Because trumpist conservatism isn’t conservatism, it’s just far right populism
@@mattgassenheimer bUt ThAt'S NoT rEAaaAaAAL cONserVaTiSm
so basically
nostalgia is a Conservative trait?
@@angel_of_rust yes and no
@@angel_of_rust not really. I would say that the fear of change is a conservative trait. Nostalgia? Depends on how you look at it but I would say not really.
“Conservatives weren’t too big on that fuck the police track” had me dead.
someone has never heard of the king of rap, tom macdonald.
He’s so cool
WHITE. BOY. WHITE. BOY.
sTrAIgHT wHitE mAaAaAaLeEeEeEe
Lmao more like The King Of Cringe. I honestly can't take comments like yours seriously xD Just delete it HAHAHA
@@zenoevol5991 r/woooosh
Kanye is how a 15 year old is when they hear about politics for the first time on youtube
Literally XD Sways from one side to the other like a pendulum
still a billionaire
Kanye>your blood line
Or maybe he has all these positions to begin with, but each position only comes to the surface when the time comes to talk about it. Most people whose interactions aren't mostly online DO have a mixed bag of political positions. If that wasn't the case, elections wouldn't swing back and forth the way that they always do.
Bullshit, I was more informed at 14 than Kanye is now.
people in chat saying kendrick is conservative lmfao
I know that all conservatives do is project but man hearing him actually say that the left "doesn't like individuality" is fucking hilarious considering a lot of the things conservatives are consistently mad about is the left engaging in individuality, i.e. pronouns, dyed hair, clothing, gender identity, etc.
Edit: adding that I noticed someone in the chat said "conservatives don't get mad like snowflakes, we just laugh" which is the most hilariously delusional thing I've heard today
anything literally just said every conservative is a stupid piece of shit and youre acting like conservatives are the close minded ones.
All it proves is why everyone needs to delete Twitter for good.
Anthony fantano included tbh. He's a decent guy on TH-cam, but even if you agree with his stance of Twitter he comes of as a major tool.
@admech he’s extremely political on Twitter and gives views that he never talks about on TH-cam
Keep twitter, delete the people.
He seems chill when he guests in other people’s videos and talks about non music stuff but his whole social media presence outside of TH-cam is pretty insufferable.
@@ethanator5130’left is always insufferable’
🤓🤓🤓🤓
Every time Woody Guthrie gets brought up I feel like I have to mention that he wrote a song called "Old Man Trump" about how much he hated his racist landlord, who just happened to be the father of Donald Trump.
Woody Guthrie was unironically antifa
@@conciliator6440 I love being antifascist
Wasn’t he also in support of communism or at least socialism?
@@doormantdarner7815 He was an adamant supporter of the Communist Party. If not, a full-fledged member.
@@rapabsinthe786 he was never a full member because he did not want to leave behind his Christian faith.
Here is my take.
Can conservatives make good art. Sure, I think a conservative can and has made art that is atleast somewhat engaging. However usually that art is only vaguely influenced by their conservativism and it is not the main focus of the work, that usually results in bad art.
Will conservative ever drive the new cutting edge movement in art? No. Conservatives are traditionalists by nature. When you are a traditionalist you are naturally going to work within the framework of what is known, what is traditional. To create something new in art involves being transgressive. You have to push out of tradition, which conservatives aren't willing to do. Just look at Ben Shapiro and his incessant harping about how all music is a devolution of classical music
Well said
@@faust8218 uh no. That's still just a return to an old worn form. It's not pushing any boundaries. If I started writing in old English I'd certainly be doing something unfamiliar to a modern audience but it would be a stretch to say I'm doing anything that pushes the medium of writing forward.
@@anenemystand5582 Why is pushing the medium forward such a necessity though? Can you agree good things that don't innovate are possible?
@@R0CKDRIG0 yeah, but BETTER things progress, and AVERAGE things conserve
@galuh ismi my fanfiction was so rejected by the masses. Am I just to much of a boundary pushing artist?
The responses from conservatives sure make them seem like fun people.
It’s goes both ways
conservatives are fun!! D:
@@veonoev ben 'dry ass p word' shapiro is fun indeed
@@veonoev Nah.
Turn off that rap fap sh*t, play that white racist guy playing piano music, my favourite!!!
Ben Shapiro pausing to ideologically object to John Lennon saying “imagine all the people living life in peace”
@WillyFisher412 brother i hope this was a copypasta or some shit because if not its incredibly embarrassing
like holy shit you wasted SO MUCH of your life to type all of this nonsense. if you showed this to literally ANYONE in your life they will think less of you as a person, your parents would be embarrassed, your SO would consider why they are with you and anyone you tried to date in the future would seriously consider if you're worth their time.
@WillyFisher412 new copypasta just dropped thank you for this
@WillyFisher412 oh my, thank god, my chin actually fell to the floor when i pressed "Read more". also that being a copypasta makes so much sense. and crazy how accurate @joedatius 's reply still is given the context lmao
I thought Joe was talking to agpra for a second I got so confused
@@thechatter7102 I missed the copypasta in question and I feel like I missed out on seeing fine art
I'm sorry but "they didn't bring anything sonically different to the table, just racism" while talking about Screwdriver was too funny
Sonic screwdriver… am I just too into Doctor Who or
@@DeathnoteBB Nah i saw that too for a sec
Dave Rubin is a grifter, he shouldn't be used as an example of a creative anything.
I hear he's an artist a con artist.
100%
@@UrinationNation hehehehe
Is there anyone who still respect this dude lol
Neither should fantano. He reviews music and sucks at playing bass.
Even as someone more conservative leaning its pretty easy to recognize that yeah those who lean left are going to tend to be more creative and artistic.
@@admech590 yeah definitely abit too harshly worded, but I agree with the overall message
@@admech590 Just admit it offended you and move on.
@@wienerstein2817 eh I don't care anymore. The moments passed.
And that's a function of associated personality traits, which is not to say that conservatives can't have those traits; it's just to recognize that people who tend to hold more left-leaning positions on social and political issues tend to have higher openness to experience and thus be more creative. There are always exceptions, of course. I myself am pretty high on openness to experience and I would say that I lean right, if anything.
And yes, I am probably way more conservative than the majority of Fantano's followers. I follow mainly for the music opinions and interviews, though. I am open to discussion about political issues as long as it's civil; I promise to be civil in return; at the end of the day, we're all human and all worthy of basic respect, so that's that.
Conservatives strongly identify with far left music like Rage Against the Machine etc because they care primarily about surface level aesthetics.
Song swears a lot = song is offensive = we're offensive, we're about triggering the libs
Song is angry = we're angry = song is for us
The medium is the message to them.
I mean… it’s in the name… conservative quite literally means safe and inside the box. When you’re trying to be careful of what stocks you get, blah blah, being safe is considered CONSERVATIVE.
No matter what, if a conservative decides to break a boundary, that is going against conservatism. It is literally impossible to be a boundary pushing conservative.
Exactly
Do you mean conservative or right wing, because conservative means conserving right wing principles and you can obviously push boundaries with right wing politics for better or worse
@@benwatford3068 I would need to hear a concrete example or something. I mean even fascism, the closest thing you get to a new conservative modern idea, is just turning to a past glory / traditionalism.
@@nevadanate4957 Italian futurism, works of Yukio Mishima, a lot of really creative people within the Nazi party
@@benwatford3068 what is conservative about those things other than the fact that individuals attached to the fascist parties did it
God, Twitter is an awful place
It really is
Yes.
Twitter is the only place we’re The Needle Drop and Dave Rubin would go at it. Two totally different TH-cam channels.
I think a lot of you’ve said is true. Maybe on individiul level, some artists might be conservative and still make good music/art. But in terms of new movements in art, especially in music, a lot of the times conservatives are usually against new movements. Yeah, maybe some metal bands active nowadays are conservative, but in early days of metal, conservatives hated it.
Especially metals anti war messages. They were literally calling them communist.
Dont get me started on Punk.
@@junjiito6298 The thrash bands of the 80's did have a strong anti-war message
When are conservatives not mad? They seem to quite literally always be angry at all times, even when they're "happy".
@@negativeincomemusic1470 projecting is the rights favorite defense mechanism.
@@aidencole5012 except that's what's leftists do. That's literally what ur doing right now lmao
@@negativeincomemusic1470 The left is action, the right is reaction. The rights entire ideology is getting triggered at what ever the left is doing. That's why they don't actually have any actual policies so instead default to dumb shit like Mr potato head.
@@negativeincomemusic1470 conservatism
noun
commitment to traditional values and ideas with opposition to change or innovation.
@@negativeincomemusic1470 You sound like an incel in debate class. Go touch grass.
These are the same people that think Fortunate Son is a pro war song
Exactly. The right cannot create great art as they cannot understand it
wish I could blame them bc they're defending the same companies that gave them lead poisoning and a hightened fear response as a result of that
Conservatives are about 40 years late to music trends and then they make watered down versions of it
This‼️
Twitch Chat Understanding Anthony Challenge (99% FAIL)
Yeah most of them are probably 10yr olds who melt their brains on TikTok 30 hours a day. It’s pretty funny to see the difference between him and his audience
Superunknown
@@GriffinK10 melting their brains 30 hours a day huh
Seeing a lot of it in the youtube comments here too
@@donjam33 yep. You're brain is so melted you couldn't even tell that was an exaggeration
When so much of conservative culture is about conserving and being opposed to change in society, it is unlikely that any musically progressive or groundbreaking styles will come out of that culture. It doesn't mean conservatives can't make good music, but that music is more likely to be from an already established style or creative lane.
I think Dave's idea of "this new thing on the right" is hysterical - conservatives, by definition, do not like new ideas. Conservatives will only take on new ideas if it means they can radicalise impressionable people, and those new ideas are just Rush Limbaugh talking points masquerading as PragerU videos presented by Jordan Peterson
Radicalizing impressionable people is a left issue as well, in fact I would say more than the conservatives.
I think conservatives also tend to try to take new ideas and redefine or reframe it in terms of their pre-existing conservative world view. And sometimes that can get pretty cringeworthy, like in this case with Dave Rubin. In situations like these, they can completely miss the point or any nuance in the idea that they’re trying to appropriate for themselves. It’s pretty predictable on the one hand but it’s also indicative of an issue with the conservative mindset in these situations.
To be fair though, people on the extreme left can do this too. They end up being just as resistant to new ideas or information that don’t fit their world view. Which is ironic considering that their world view was supposed to be on the side of allowing new information to change their world view, but they’ve become dogmatic in their “progressive” ideologies. Meanwhile it’s to be expected of an ideology which literally defines itself as being resistant to change. That, I think, is one of the major differences.
@@svoidsofinfinitechaos9367 This is a very based reply.
@@MrIrrelevant58 It's not a "left issue" or a "right issue", it's a political issue, or really just a general issue of life. Both the right and left are utterly stupid.
@@MrIrrelevant58 radicalizing impressionable people can be a good thing, it just depends on what they're getting radicalized for. Human rights, like abortion and free/affordable healthcare? Absolutely. Hating cis straight white men on the basis of being cis straight white men? Not so much. But that might be a touch of my political bias
There’s no art in punching down on minorities. Hate isn’t artistic or creative.
Facts
Exactly.
Facts!
@@faust8218 I have a double major arts degree, in Anthropology & Sociology and The Fine Arts, and I can confirm that there are objective ways to measure art and how good it is. Or else, everyone in my class would've passed with flying colours because its all 'subjective'. I'm happy to dig up the sheet which my tutors would use to mark my artworks against if you need a list of criteria.
Almost like there is no punching down on minorities in socialist countries, right?
People don't realise that "What about this operatic composer from 1704?" isn't a strong response because of the historical context. Freedom of speech and art consumption isn't the same in 1704 as it is today, you couldn't just say what you wanted and things didn't become popular organically (particularly not "high art"). Art in that time was deemed popular because it was approved by the church or state, essentially a popular opera from 1704 was popular because Pope Clement XI liked it or because Victor Emmanuel III vibed with it. Art was necessarily conservative as a consequence of the time. Saying "See, good art can be conservative when we force everyone to be conservative" isn't a brilliant gotcha, you're telling on yourself.
It's the exact same line of reasoning as "Look, all artists in the USSR during the 1930-1960s produced pro-USSR art, therefore the USSR must be good" while ignoring the fact that the USSR squashed all art that wasn't state-approved. Music in the 18th century being conservative isn't evidence that conservatives can lead art movements, it's an indictment of the time.
The problem with conservatives is that they don't invest in cultural things and entertainment. It's always the left (liberals or socialist) that has to do it.
So even if an artist has conservatives values, the ones writing his checks won't be conservatives. The ones inviting him to events won't be conservatives.
Conservatives don't value art like something that matters. It's just hobbies or childish stuff to them. And they don't encourage their descendants to get interested in art beyond academic purposes.
Lol this is actually how liberals and lefties think do conservatives? Absolutely delusional.
To be fair, even as a conservative (I'm now a right-leaning independent), I always appreciated and enjoyed output from artists that were more left-wing. Art is art. It's not a toy, and I don't see a lot of conservatives that would view it as such. There are definitely times where I feel like conservative commentators have misinterpreted/dismissed art from liberals (see Geraldo Rivera & Kendrick), but there are also conservative figures that appreciate that art (i.e. Marco Rubio, who listens to a lot of Kendrick Lamar and other artists). Is the "art is a childish hobby" objection held by some conservative groups (particularly those on the far right)? Sure. I think that's fair. Do Republicans tend to prefer older art because they tend to see social institutions and "traditional, American, Christian" values as overall positive forces that should be upheld? Probably. I'm not for that kind of viewpoint, though, and my parents and some of my friends who are conservatives aren't for that either.
I also think it's important to consider the context in which the word "conservative" is defined. You could conceivably be conservative on social and political issues and at the same time be for art and innovation, particularly if you believe that capitalism promotes and enhances those things.
I don't see a lot of right-wing rappers, though, although that's probably because most rappers are African-American and African-Americans tend to be more left-leaning than White people do. And I agree that Tom McDonald's music and the way he expresses his opinions is.....how should I say this diplomatically...not well thought-out. I also don't see any grounds for thinking conservatives would spark any more sociocultural innovations than liberals.
Massively agree, I was arguing with conservatives online who say we waste money on trivial things like arts funding (National Endowment of the Arts etc.) and I was like excuse me sir you're worried about 50 to 100 million dollars in funding for arts, what about the 660 BILLION dollar military spending lmfao
@@thomasnelson5758 lol people who want to defund certain programs while ignoring military budget are delusional
@R My parents are democrats
Conservatism: Commitment to traditional values and ideas with opposition to change or innovation.
Rubin: "This new thing on the right"
conservatism doesnt oppose innovation. fucking elon musk is conservative. i will also point out that most of the middle east is conservative and are generally more advanced than us in some areas. its a leftist thing to say that innovation is against conservativism
@@jahterminatedlmao5473 elon musk hasn't innovated anything outside of the most expensive way to make the entire internet hate you
@@jahterminatedlmao5473 Scientifically and economically ahead of us. There’s also middle eastern countries that don’t have burgeoning music scenes due to cultural restrictions. You fucking with elons new album? no. Culturally conservatives look back and go “wow member the beatles? they was so much better than this modern crap”
interesting thing about frank sinatra, he wasn't actually conservative until later on in life, when he was younger he was very pro civil rights and a staunch democrat. it wasnt until jfk was killed that he started shifting right
fun, open minded people don't need to announce how fun and open minded they are
Ariel Pink says anthony only highly rates music which is safe, sterile, orthodox, etc. Did he forget the times anthony gave him a 9 and a 8?
ariel STINK. hate that shitty music
@@egodef7791 bad take pom pom still slaps and before today is a classic
Seems a bit ungrateful, although i can't say if i know if ariel knows fantano reviewed them.
@@trentnunyabiz6204 kind of small brain to say someone has bad takes as a critic if you haven't seen the reviews lol
Where did he say that? Love his music but can’t stand the dide
Ariel Pink thinks “The Money Store” is safe and pedestrian… oh oh my
NO!!!!! NOT THE HECKIN GRIPPERINOS!!!!!!😡😡😡😡
Funny cause Ariel is friends with Andy, and they sampled him on ex military
I saw Johnny Cash, Woody Guthrie, & Bob Dylan listed in the chat and can’t fathom the level of ignorance you would have to have to state that.
The fact that cons will claim every piece of pop culture as having a "culture war" agenda tells us everything we need to know about their priviness to what makes media great or interesting.
lmao the one conservative in the chat being like "actually yeah it's true we don't make good art" and the other ones around him trying to cope
grifters have no creativity or personality that’s their entire brand. “great music” to them is a country hit talking about loving police. not knocking country music or the police, but c’mon lmao. they don’t know what “great music” is
Nah go ahead, knock the police
Hence why they are called conservatives. They take that label to fucking heart, that's for sure.
The best part is “facts don’t care about your feelings” and these are facts. No conservative has ever made good, worthy art. They don’t know how
I just hate this narrative and idea that there needs to be such a thing as "the next great music" like the only music that can be great or matter has to define a generation or a cultural movement or something, else it's irrelevant. That's such a short-sided viewpoint in my eyes, there's so much great music coming out every week in basically every genre, why does there need to be "the next great music"?
BRO PREACH
its because dave doesnt actually give a damn about art or music to know
Its different now because streaming services have given underground mainstream succes. Artists like radiohead, death grips, or something like 100 gecs would never be succesful in the 80s because their succes is through the internet. Prior to the earl 2000's, people would have to buy 30-40 dollar vinyls. People were conservative when buying music
that's facts
Music is ever changing. Just look at country for example, it hasn’t changed in 20 years. Imagine if that were the case for all genres. Great unoriginal music is good, but view it like this. Imagine if apple never made a new phone, just doing the same one over and over again. It would never progress technology and we would still have using 4 inch plastic screens and bad connection. Innovation fuels progression, and the same applies for music.
I'd be interested in his opinion on whether he'd consider the straight edge movement in hardcore music to be conservative. I think Anthony's take is a little oversimplified but I get what he's saying, innovation is usually antithetical to conservatism.
Conservative like right wing
Right. His point wasn't as much that there were never exceptions but more that Dave Rubin is a simpleton who thinks that being a non-progressive is going to create new art. "New thing on the right" is an oxymoron, the whole point of conservatism is to keep things the same.
@@SBRS47
Your idea of conservatism is nothing but a strawman. You even conflate right-wing and conservative as if they are inherently the same thing.
You seem to have this idea that conservative = middle aged white man who never invents anything, and it’s just ridiculously dogmatic.
@@thomaharadja5307 Is conservatism not the idea of conserving current values and ideas?
@@SBRS47 A willingness to conserve some things doesn’t imply a complete aversion to change or to new things.
We are all conservative about some things anyway.
« Conservatives » are attached to some values and ideas that you may call current or even antiquated. It doesn’t necessarily inhibit their ability to innovate.
What a wholesome and respectful comment section this is about to be 🥰🥰
I contracted various diseases from reading it. Very nice 😄
I bet.
Lightly salted, just the way I like it.
Conservatives will make the new fun stuff? Conservatives? Read that word a few times, 'conservative'.
Birth of A Nation actually paved the way for filmmaking techniques we have today. Only issue of it being an incredibly racist movie and help destroying Reconstruction Era reforms that helped black people for a little while before white people decided to destroy it all again out of fear and race mixing. Also reforming the KKK and propping up new imagery and iconography of hatred. If anything, a new cutting edge conservative movie would probably focus more on Transgender people cuz they are an easy target.
I think Birth of a Nation and D. W. Griffith's role in pioneering certain techniques has been overblown, particularly by American critics/theorists. A lot of innovation from the 1900-1910s came from the UK, Australia and France which is overlooked because of the Griffith narrative. Though Griffith was a very talented filmmaker and popularised the techniques to an extent.
Griffith is still very important, if Birth of a Nation hadn't featured such good parallel montage without a doubt Star Wars wouldn't have used it and it wouldn't still be popular today, but he's not an innovator like Edwin S. Porter or Sergei Eisenstein (though no doubt both could be considered conservative by today's standards).
Influential sure, but would you call it a good movie?
I would add Alice Guy also as one of the most important and underrated filmakers of all time. Plus she is considered as the first woman in film making.
Says conservatives are not smart or interesting
*Conservatives responds negatively
"Haha everyone is mad rent free"
He's right tho
ASIANS
"I'd just wish you'd be less political on twitter."
TF outta here with that. And conservatives call libs snowflakes, lmao. Deal with it or unsub. It's his platform and prerogative. Respect to melon for being so consistent in his belief.
I got the impression it was more 'why must you DO this to yourself, Anthony?!', but your point stands either way.
Keith Green is a Christian musician and he is a creative weirdo and intense. He's the only one I can think of though
not that conservative right though? he came out of the 60s acid scene and was a total hippie weirdo and always seemed on the progressive edge of christian music. maybe i need to do more research but that’s the vibe i got from listening to him growing up.
@@ssslamahhh Wayne only came to Trump since he "freed" him.
Keith Green was a fabulous musician and songwriter.. if I could play piano like him, I would throw rocks at my guitar and drums haha!
And I think it would appropriate to mention Phil Keaggy as another conservative/Christian artist! He’s great too.
Christians aren’t always conservative
@@JRNova11 True; Jesus's values were obviously leftist af. "If you have two coats and your neighbor has none, give him one." "It is easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to get into Heaven."
I rolled my eyes when he said he's going to play Dave Rubin, i can't listen to that guy more than a minute.
You can listen to that shitgibbon up to a minute?
My condolensces.
I D E A S
@@SBRS47 T H E L E F T
Dave is the grift that keeps on giving.
Thank you for reminding your audience your original context of the post, because conservatives have already twisted things into you bullying them like the outrage culture they’ve perpetuated endlessly in the face of valid criticism.
Conservatives always misunderstand everything to prove their “points.”
They just aren’t good faith.
@@junjiito6298 yeah
same goes for the other side. go back to screaming your brains out on college campuses and complaining that the constitution isnt relevant because it was from a different era
he literally called conservatives awful people
Art is and always has been, left leaning, as much as conservatives try to claim otherwise.
Bit of an extreme stance, there are some genuinely affecting works of art that I've seen from conservative leaning people. But definitely not from hard-core conservatives. And the "conservative artists" that get huge are usually a marketable pastiche of existing art movements.
His stance is more in regards to being on the cutting edge rather than making any sort of decent art, I think. Which I think is a completely fair stance given the inherent nature of conservatism being more concerned with keeping the status quo, it makes sense that most cutting edge and innovative stuff would more likely come from those that aren't very right-leaning. Doesn't mean a conservative person can't make something decent or even great, it's just very likely it'll be in a similar style of something that came before it.
@@jackteam54 his stance is "they don't make great art. their art sucks ass. period."
@@LightPink also they’re not smart
@@EulogizingSleep You don’t sound smart in the slightest lmao.
@@LightPink and in terms of hard leaning republicans, he's right
As a conversative this is kind of ridiculous the bullshit my party is doing lol
conservative isnt a party
@@jahterminatedlmao5473 maybe he is british, they have conversative party
This has never happened to me before but I actually fucking cackled out loud when Dave said that conservatives are open minded
Conservatives?!?! Angry?!?!? Impossible.
not just conservatives. ppl who are tired of watchin the average morons go about perpetuatin this fake war that is unecesary. we as humans need to get along and geralising half the population aint it chief
Before I watch:
Art has been generally averse to the tenets of modern conservatism for hundreds of years - only someone ignorant to anything that doesn't occur along the partisan spectrum between their left and right ears could so incredulously say "where's the next great music gonna come from - the left?", without a tinge of irony.
so... Art opposes conservatism and saying "where's the next great music gonna come from - the left?" is ignorant. This is a youtube comment section bro
Not to mention that history doesn’t necessarily have to mean anything lol. The Overton window is pushing the Left to the mainstream and making the Right counter-culture. These positions can flip without us recognizing or defining it. The aspect of conservatism that art typically rebels against is Authority. The Left is absolutely the authoritarians of the 20th century, bud.
@@BigHotSauceBoss69 The right is becoming "counter-culture" because they're losing mass droves of moderate support by being morally questionable, at best. Not counter-culture in the sense that it has rational grievances with which to challenge the status quo, no. Instead, it's become a counter-culture in the sense that sensible people don't identify with what has become centered around ardently partisan batshit-insanity, no matter how they might lean when it comes to actual policy.
"The left are the authoritarians of the 21st century" is an absolutely ridiculous, Tucker Carlson-level statement. Thank you for the hearty belly-chuckle on this fine sabbatical afternoon.
@@Hobbitfeetpics he actually said 20th century 😂 someones stuck in the past...
If you have to say “we are fun and interesting” your not
Late to the party, but conservatism will almost always take something they opposed and spin it to their favor, especially musically. Rock was started by black Americans and was taken, and POPULARIZED by white Americans; same with jazz. At the time, jazz was heavily opposed and shunned, and eventually conservatives can around to it when white people made it more “tame” and mainstream. They’ll even look back on it fondly. Frank Sinatra was a wonderful singer but quite a few of his songs were covers too.
Some rock song examples are Born in the USA (made into a patriotic song) and Fortunate Son (also made into a patriotic song). You hear these during the 4th of July, and conservatives who were young either during or late into the Vietnam War+70’s look back on rock music fondly and apply their own patriotism to it years later.
No u troll
So white people helped both genres out? I don't really see the problem here
You say it as if black=leftist & white=conservative
That's very simplistic
Guys, don't let this distract you from the fact that this was the same guy who gave MBDTF a 6 and Mac Miller's Swimming a 3
This joke still going a decade later. Amazing.
Remember when Kanye wore a maga hat than two weeks later he got a ten lmao
The album was relatively progressive though bruh the first time he went full on conservative with an album was JIK
in terms of great authors, H.P. Lovecraft is probably one of the most innovative writers in sci-fi and horror, he was also anti-immigrant racist bigot, even by early 20th century standards. He was also an atheist, which isn’t typical for right wingers.
Politically he endorsed socialism towards the end of his life.
@@BungleJoogie68 interesting, i didn’t know that
@@BungleJoogie68 Sure but he wrote most of his stuff when he was a raging racist. Some will even say it was his racism that fueled a lot of recurring themes in his stories (eg. fear of the unknown, tribal witchcraft etc.). Though granted, I’d say his brand of racism was quite different to other conservatives because he made Englishmen look weak, scared and confused about other cultures, rather than superior to them (which I guess is why white supremacists don’t tend to appropriate his art).
THAT BECAUSE HE BELIEVED IN LOVECRAFTIAN GODS INSTEAD
Whist I don’t want to dismiss or excuse racism, one can’t negate the fact that conservatism was quite different in the 1920s/30s than it is now. No I don’t think Lovecraft’s racism was much worse than the average resentful bankrupt white person at the time. My knowledge of US politics isn’t great but I’m pretty sure both parties were actively pushing for segregation at the time and aside from some radical progressive groups, the majority of people didn’t oppose it.
people saying "why you make music political" I'm in tears lmfao welcome, hope your stay under the rock for decades went well
"We are the interesting people" While he looks like the text book definition of "Cliche White Guy #1"
what?
He looks like a soyjak more to me
It actually kinda makes sense. The right has always been more interested in the past and keeping things the same while the left, for better or worse, has always been more able to look to the future. How is any good art gonna come from the side that doesn’t want to innovate?
Clearly you all don't know anything about the real Left, live in any southamerican country for only a week and you'll see.
@@MenteColectiva enlighten us grandpa
We aren't in such a bad situation here, at least not where i live in. Obviously there's countries in critical situation due to a bad government and some people tend to say that it's because of leftist ideologies, but the ones with a righteous ideology aren't perfect neither, there's a lot of controversy in wether the sacrifice of the nature (one of the biggest resources of this part of the world) in favor of progress is a correct decision. While a lot of people from first world countries may think right ideologies are all what's wrong, there are countries in development that had suffered so many years of crisis due to a bad presidents trying leftist governments techniques. And the people from this exact countries are all against this ideologies, they don't care about the progressive ideas of the the left, they feel safer and believe that life will be easier with the right.
@@MenteColectiva As if the US would ever allow the left to flourish in its backyard. Do you know nothing about 20th century history?
Look, I'm a socialist, but Italian futurism happened and paved the way for a lot of contemporary noise and industrial music!
Bascially a lot of modern aesthetic has its roots in fascism.
Thank you very much.
Italian futurism mostly took part in fascist party. Their ideas where pretty reactionary, but they did make great art. They supported Italy entering the First World War.
I would say though, as far as I know Luigi Russolo (which is one of the progenitor of noise) did not take part in fascist party. But that doesn't change the fact that the whole artistic movement was mostly reactionary. And they were very unique in their style
The relationship between futurists and fascists is more one of opportunism than of acceptance. Futurists just wanted to break with tradition and dogmatic institutions in order to pave the way for the future (literally the opposite of what conservatism is about), and back then it seemed like embracing fascism was one way to achieve this. Had Italy turned socialist after WWI instead, futurists likely would've been just as happy. Back in Nazi Germany, Italian futurists were included among other modern artists in degenerate art exhibitions and accused of having Jewish influences, and in Italy itself they never got the explicit acceptance of Mussolini they lobbied for, so while a lot of futurists embraced fascism, few fascists embraced futurism.
@@ultru3525 this is very insightful! Thanks for fleshing out what was a pretty limp take on my part!
“Here I go being the main character again” Please put that on a t-shirt 😂
Jpegmafia is my favorite conservative artist. “Beta Male Strategies” really helped me stand up to bullies in the cafeteria and “Veteran” is awesome because it’s about the vets baby.
AMEN BROTHER I LOVE PDFMAFIA
What are u talking about if you watch interviews with him he constantly makes fun of conservatives lmao
@@philiphammar maybe, just maybe, it’s sarcasm
Kanye is the political compass
Kanye is too East to be West.
FAKE AND GAY COMPASS
they hated the Melon because he told them the truth.
David Ruban seems to think conservatism is progressive. Its the opposite, my dude.
Anthony I agree with alot of what you were saying but I was a little confused when you said "Stalin did nothing wrong"
and how he later on put on a headband with a swastika on it, and put on a blonde wig was the most confusing part for me ngl.
@@tokitoki9156
And then he read the entirety of the Communist Manifesto in that getup, I didn't understand it very much
It’s a joke bruh
lmao is "this new thing on the right" what they're calling fascism now?
Only if its right of Bernie, unless it fails then it was red fascism and we should try again.
The fact that he’s saying “next great music” just shows that he probably doesn’t listen to a lot of music 😂
Wait until Melon says something about Vic Mignonga, that would be fun
I love when melon gets political
It's far better than his shittastic music tastes...
@@cdvideodump at least we don't have to see swimming get a 3 again
@@Designed1 or godsmack get a not good...
@okno or Green Day getting a 0 for arguably their best album ever
@@cdvideodump Or Swans getting a 10
Being conservative in politics doesn't mean someone is conservative in making art. Art may contain political themes, but art is ultimately not political in itself. Fantano overlooks that distinction. Rubin is talking about political correctness that stands in the way of artistic freedom and idiosyncrasy. Too bad to see such simple souls in the comment section who think that being politically conservative means that one cannot innovate in art.
Finally, I thought I was the only one seeing this distinction. Most of if not all conservatives are conserving a system of values, not the way music sounded at one point (although there's a a few examples of classical elitists). Most cons are for different and new types of *music*. I also thought it was interesting he didn't touch on like gospel music (which influences many artists today like Chance and Kanye), Christian metal, and the christian music movement as a whole. It's been going on since at least the 70s
Conservatism is almost by it's very definition not creative. It's about preserving existing structures. I have met empathetic and what conservatives.... Just not both at the same time. They're either empathetic and misguided, or smart but lacking in empathy.
What do you think about Italian futurism
This is a myopic take. There have been periods where "great art" was made by really conservative people or in a right-wing context. For instance, lots of baroque/classical music was sanctioned by the church, Wagner was a total nationalist, and a lot of "great art" in the early 20th century was outright fascist (Ezra Pound, Futurism, among others)
The big difference now is the cultural context - "great art" today is often defined by how boundary-pushing and "new" it is, and that's currently more aligned with a left-wing ideology. Plus, everyone running the museums and grant foundations is left-of-center.
Total false dichotomy. You need to escape your binary thinking. It’s possible with the proper self awareness, but the fact that you think they must be either or doesn’t sound rational nor like an intelligent analysis to me. This entire comment section has been an echo
chamber of affirming fallacies.
I didnt think this would be a controversial statement: If you're empathetic and smart, you recognize the value in free health care, a strongly tapered tax system, and a broad welfare net to support the most vulnerable members of society. If you don't support those things, maybe you're empathetic, but lack the intelligence to recognize that trickle down economics doesn't work and conservative ideology will inevitably harm the most vulnerable members of society while serving the interests of the wealthy... or maybe you are smart enough to recognize that, but lack the empathy to find it a compelling justification to give your own money into a system designed to help others. If you are smart enough to understand that, *and* you have the empathy to appreciate it, then you aren't conservative.... By all means write another dismissive response that substitutes a 4 syllable word for an effective argument.
@@robertjones3701 of course you didn’t think that would be controversial, you aren’t used to your “smart” and “empathetic” friends debate you
Conservative means to conserve. The opposit of progress. The boring people afraid of change.
Even as someone who leans way more to the Left, I dont even necessarily think this is true. If someone makes good shit, well then they make good shit. I don't give a damn who they support politically.
He's just saying people with conservative mindsets are scared of experimenting. Which I find to be true.
@@khailils446 exactly
@@khailils446 facts
1. That’s only true for stereotypical conservatives. Try not to box them in like that.
2. Not all music has to be super experimental. Sometimes creating a bop is good enough
@@IK-yb5rn but we're talking about the greats here. For something to be truly great, it has to bring something new to the table. Maybe that's just me idk.
My issues with your statement or rubin's one is that you're all eager to put people in their own little box. It ain't about joining a team. It does not define you. Extremely generalist statement.
I understand what fantano is saying but I completely agree with you
a rare light of reason, truest shit my man.
"In olden days a glimpse of stocking was looked on as something shocking but now lord knows, anything goes" 🎶 conservative music
This is almost an extension of “Can you separate art from the artist”
I dont really find anyone who's super into politics to be fun or interesting to be honest...
Yeah
real recognize real
@@curtismorrow1651 But that’s relative right? So why should it matter then?
Tell ‘em Tony !!
Love your music lemmy, even though it stinks
Kanye West's political ideology: "yes"
yes
KANYE WEST MUSIC SUCKS. BUT IT ISNT HIS FAULT. ITS HIS RESTRAINT.
As someone who doesn't live in th US I find it funny how whack you all get about your politics. Like ah if your on this side, THERE'S 0 CHANCE YOU ARE INTERESTING OR CREATIVE. What the hell does a political opinion have to do with someone's ability to create cool art. I dunno just my take.
As someone who doesn’t live in the US, you have no idea how much ppl let their politics identify them. Or, how fucked our politics are or the nuances of what they mean at the moment. I mean, think about conservative values. Are conservative values ever equated with anything cool? Conservative values and the execution of conservative policy by those on the top and those with money. They’ve inspired a lot more music by being terrible humans than they’ve ever created.
I am not American either. It amuses me how many Americans make their political position their whole/only personality. It's like they think the U.S. is the only country in the world. It's like they think there aren't other countries in the world with different politics.
@@thevinyltruffle So them being terrible gives them credit for the art of people whom are opressed beneath them? Change comes from a person who wants change and they take credit for it, not the person who didn't want change in the first place.
Conservatives can be great artists who are boundary pushing. BUT if they are boundary pushing, it's because they are being ANTITHETICAL to conservatism. Because conservatism is a movement born out of literally NOT challenging traditional ideas/traditions/values, and instead upholding them.
Anything new and cutting edge is therefore, generally, never going to come from these movements.
Anthony really exposed himself on this. He showed to us that he doesn’t really listen to music; he listens for an ideology.
You can't make good art when your worldview is centered around trying to preserve the past and prevent the future. Especially when it's a misunderstanding of the past.
A lot of it, I think, comes down to the fact that what is progressive is constantly changing. What was considered progressive ten years ago isn’t anymore. So a lot of these musicians were progressive at the time they were making music, but they stayed still ideologically so progressivism has passed them by. That’s why so many of the artists from the 60s, 70s, and 80s are parroting conservative views today when they used to be revolutionary during their peak. Johnny Rotten may have called the Queen a fascist, but the John Lydon of today never would.
someone in chat literally tried to say RTJ was on the right
Ain't no fuckin way lmao
LMAO
You dismiss Eric Clapton by saying he was washed by Hendrix??? You could say that about any guitarist.
Right like Chuck Berry was “washed” by Eric Clapton but nobody’s denying his innovations
“They’re all hysterical and angry,” I say, disassembling and reassembling my AR15.