Let's pretend Bruce Timm is right for a sec. If he really felt that Batman needed more female villains why not make a new one instead of gender bending a male villain?
exactly he could've made a new acolyte for Penguin who is competent , has personality and nice design. i guarantee u she would've been a hit like Harley quinn back in the days
also there is a video by causally comics about quinne a character with two otheres name after cards wich was the proto royal flush gang and it didn't need much change just remove the joker from it and add some stuff and there we go there is also a video by youtber where she showcases different female villains that could have been add it
@user-dj8rr7gx1b Ima be real would have been interesting to see scarecrow. As a terrorist like how the trailer showed him to be. Or at least id like to see that
Harley Quinn, Catwoman, poison ivy, Talia al Ghul, the phantasm, lady shiva, white rabbit, female copperhead? Nah batman has only had only male villains apparently.
Don't forget all the original ones they made for BTAS. Baby Doll, Iron Claw, Roxy Rocket, Claendar Girl, Harley Quinn And that's only the ones that I CAN remember💀
1990s Timm making New Female Villians for His Batman. 0ld 2024 Timm says We don't have Good Female Villians, let's change a Dude to a She. Clearly Dini was the creative force behind Timm's Success. Each project He does, Dude slips deeper into Insanity.
@@jaylenjayden9305 Best live action Batman? Not by a longshot. The movie as a whole is good, but... Pattinson Batman? Nah. Affleck was still better than him.
@@P.Whitestrakebatfleck the guy who Broke the one Batman rule, he has cool fight scenes but that’s it, batfleck is as empty s character as the rest of the dceu
They just want to change Penguins gender just to, for the sake of it. It wasn't for the reason of "female character that will fit a role of bossing a crime family mob"
They worked because they werent just the same character with a different gender , calendere girl and man are very different characters both in motives and crimes @joshuataylor7443
He scrapes the bottom of the barrel for a guy like Onomatopoeia, but for some reason doesn't know about literally any female Batman villain who's just as obscure? No way.
The Phantasm is my favorite female villain. She was used only once in Mask of The Phantasm and was tragic, relatable, and badass. She only appears one more time in a cameo in Justice League Unlimited. Why tf couldn't she be used more like Harley Quinn was? The villain of one of the best Batman movies of all time just completely disregarded.
@@ΑΛΕΞΑΝΔΡΑ-ε1ω Thats fine for the DCAU universe. I'm more so meaning that Phantasm should be getting used in other universes where that isn't the case. She seems to only exist in the DCAU and idk about comics but they're not using her in main stream media at all. Awesome character with awesome potential that gets ignored.
HUH!? Bruce has lost his DAMN MIND😭 Did he forget all the original ones they made for BTAS. Baby Doll, Iron Claw, Roxy Rocket, Claendar Girl, Harley Quinn And that's only the ones that I CAN remember💀 1:35 EXACTLY. This man has LOST HIS MIND😭😭😭
Paul Dini would of been a better writer/creator of the series he actually knows what he’s doing while Bruce Timm I think he took a whole nose full of cocaine and lost his brains like the once great Frank Miller
Poison Ivy dodged a bullet and I'd like it to stay that way. They could've used Calendar Girl, Magpie, and Copperhead. Hell Huntress could work since she was a villain at first who could convert in later seasons. I'm not sure why these writers refuse to open comic books or DC Wikia.
Like I just don’t get Bruce timm logic I really don’t, like mostly because Batman has great female characters growing up and hearing him say this breaks my brain 🧠 in my opinion.
The three most iconic ones are cat woman,poison ivy and harley quinn But then you have more obscure ones like white rabbit or jane doe there’s countless other examples but I don’t think I’ll list every female villan who batman has ever fought.
@@DgardsGaming Catwoman, Copperhead, Duela Dent, Harly Quinn, Killer Frost, Lady Arkham, Lady Clay, Lady Shiva, Lynx, Lady Spellbind, Nyssa Raatko, Phantasm, Punchline, Rocky Rocket, Sofia Falcone, Talia al Ghul, & White Rabbit
I saw the tweet he posted and I listed about 12 different female villians from.the Batman comics and I was just like how does a man who worked on 3 different Batman shows not know Batman had all these female advisories
@@lightdarksoul2097 I mean a lot the ones who aren’t villains anymore still get written as villains if the story demands it so they could be written as villains for the show
Bruce Timm saying this when BTAS alone had some of the the most memorable female Batman Villains ever is crazy. Harley Quinn Poison Ivy Roxy Rocket Baby doll Catwoman Calendar Girl If he really thought Batman doesn't have enough female Villains, why didn't he just make a new character. Say what you want about Gotham, at least Fish Mooney was an original character.
@@Thed538dhskyes wasted opportunity she could have gone from boring to making a name for herself then being a cardboard cutout of a generic bond james villian
@@MrTao-iy2nf so many 1920's/30's/40's noir stories could be told with her in this show. Like her being a mob boss herself or an assassin or starting out criminal trying to grow bigger or a serial killer etc. but no. Instead we get Harley Quinn impersonating Hugo strange and penguin being a terrible mother. Thanks Timm...
It's really concerning how being an attractive female and/or canonically being attracted to a man disqualified so many villains in his eyes. Harley Quinn alone is still popular thanks to that 90's incarnation, which I say still cares her to this day after all the mangling and screwing up countless projects and series have done (looking at the DCEU especially). No joking diversion to Brave and the Bold today (it's still peak Batman for me), just sheer, unbridled disappointment.
Has Bruce Tim lost it? Batman has a lot of great female badass villains! Taila Al Ghul Catwoman She-Bat Harley Freaking Quinn Lady Shiva Poison Ivy White Rabbit Baby Doll The list goes on!!
@@ΑΛΕΞΑΝΔΡΑ-ε1ω Talia was never originally retired, Catwoman was never originally a hero, Harley was never originally a hero, and Ivy was originally a hero. This is an origin based story so the events you brought up don't make much sense.
While a geisha Harley Quinn might be interesting I still think race changing Harley is a dumb idea in the first place. Maybe create a new geisha or asian villain, OR as Kwing suggested use Lady Shiva instead!
@user-gj9uq3kb7y Dude, literally calling them heroes... alright, then that's like saying "well Venom is a hero now," Let's pretend that Venom was never a threat to Peter's life, tho 🤣
@user-gj9uq3kb7y Also, Batwoman had a movie in the animated series. Batwoman was getting revenge on Penguin, and Batman concentrated on discovering Batwoman's identity, plus Batwoman put others at risk for her goal.
@@ΑΛΕΞΑΝΔΡΑ-ε1ω This is an origin based story so ORGINALLY..... Catwoman was not a hero, Talia wasn't retired, Ivy wasn't a hero, and Harley wasn't a hero. Fixed it for you.👍
No good female villains? More like way too much of Harley Quinn, Poison Ivy and Catwoman. There’s a lot of female Batman villains that just get slept on because they never get any time to shine. They could have given a spotlight to characters like Jane Doe, Roxy Rocket, Baby Doll, Orca, Fright, March Harriet, White Rabbit, Copperhead, Peyton Riley, Arkham Knight, Punchline, Addison Cobblepot, Sofia Falcone or The Phantasm…but nah pointlessly gender swapping male characters is somehow better.
@@AndreyKrichevskyyes. Addison is Oswald’s daughter (she’s very underutilised as a character) this could have been a good opportunity to give her some exposure and explore her dynamic with her father, but they didn’t and just made up a random, middle aged woman and called her Penguin. Lame.
The same Bruce Timm that helped create one of Batman;'s most beloved female villains Harley Quinn. That Bruce Timm, Did someone like...remove his brain while he was sleeping or something
But gender-swapping is so easy! Takes little effort. Just make a couple of tweaks and boom, bam, you're done. Meanwhile creating original characters takes all that pesky originality, creativity and imagination. Who wants that? But seriously, it is shocking to hear someone who worked on BTAS say something like this. Finding preferable to do a lazy gender-swap over using an obscure character (possible popularizing her in the process) or creating new female characters altogether.
To some of the guys who try to defend the gender swapping of Penguin after Bruce Timms statement better check to see if their heads are on straight because there's no reason to gender swap a long time villain when there are other female Villains in Batman's lore that the show could've used. Gender and race swapping characters is nothing more but lazy writing, plain and simple.
@@ΑΛΕΞΑΝΔΡΑ-ε1ω I'm talking about unknown female Batman villains not female villains that already showed up in many Batman shows before, I mean if they could use unknown female villain like Natalie knight why no use villains like the mine,nocturnal,pix,siken spider, absence or even if they want a female villain instead of gender bending penguin why not use mother as the antagonist of the series she's already a female boss like villain?.
He's technically correct. Batman has no good female villains because they keep making all his female villains into heroes or antiheroes, because women can't be evil.
Bruce Timm's Batman Movie was 1993, Mask of the Phantasm. 1989 Batman was Tim Burton. Which inspired B. Timm to pitch His Batman show to Fox, which became BTAS in 92.
I would really like to see Zatanna incorporated into season 2. Yes she’s not a batman villain per say but she does have history with Bruce and I think her style could really fit into this 1940s-esque setting
I Disagree with Bruce Timm, because saying "there's no female villains" is like saying we don't breath air. There are plenty of female characters in the Batman rogue gallery, 1. Talia al Ghul 2. Poison Ivy 3. Red Claw 4. Magpie [the one you have mentioned, which I wasn't familiar with] 5. Baby Doll 6. Candice 7. Roxy Rocket 8. Martha Wayne* (Flashpoint) I don't consider neither Harley Quinn or Catwoman a villain. Harley Quinn is more misguided in one instance in the video game Injustice Gods Among Us she's part of the Insurgency [alternate timeline]. Whereas Catwoman is "two-faced", she's a jewel thief and other times she plays on the side of good.
Though I disagree with his statement, it might be worth acknowledging that there is a trend towards making Batman's villainesses more like anti-heroines. In BTAS, Catwoman did not get to be the main villain for a single episode. Harley became increasingly sympathetic as time went on. Poison Ivy was a true villainess, but with the environmental problems we face today, it might feel iffy depicting an environmentalist in such a negative light.
Look at what Gotham did. They wanted a female crime boss who would be threatening, smart, deadly and everything else. So what did they do? They created Fish Mooney. They didn't change Sal Maroni into Sally Maroni or Rupert Throne into Ruby Thorne. They created a character from scratch and they did an excellent job. And Batman has arguably the best female rogues gallery in all of comics. I mean you have Lady Shiva who is a better fighter than Batman, you have Phantasm a villain created from scratch again and is from the most popular DCAU movie, Harley Quinn a villain who now matches popularity (and possibly even greater than now) than Wonder Woman. The biggest problem is they try to make all their female villains into anti hero's for some reason. And here is the thing he is disrespecting all the bat female villains that are great but under utilized by gender swapping rather thana using them
Imagine if Harley after all this time finally got to do a heel turn and be the villain again? She goes back to Joker and actively takes a role in his mayhem and destruction once again. If only DC would be based.
These female villain ideas you suggested are much more interesting than female Penguin and this strange version of Harley Quinn. If Bruce Timm wasn't in charge of this show, I would hope to see more pre-existing female characters in season 2, but now I'm half expecting a female Riddler next season. On a side note, while I understand the Mad Hatter comparisons with her brainwashing people and dressing them up in funny costumes, this Harley really reminded me of Hugo Strange. Both are psychologists who use their patients' secrets against them to manipulate and brainwash them, as well as both having created psychological profiles of Batman for the GCPD.
That reminder of Baby Doll got me. Only 1 episode, but it was super impactful and despite what she did, I could completely get how she'd go crazy like that.
She actually has two episodes, the later one was in “The New Batman Adventures” with the character redesigns and she has an odd romance with Killer Croc. It definitely assassinated her character a bit.
Batman has great female villains. Bruce timm has sunk to the level of many appearances as the riddler from BTAS. 1) Poison Ivy 2) Catwoman 3) Harley Quinn 4) Talia Al Ghul 5) Shiva 6) Red Claw 7) Calendar Girl 8) Roxie Rocket 9) Magpie 10) Nocturna
My take on why they made gender bent penguin (which I disapproved of because Penguin is consistently a guy and should be accurate to comics) is not only because of a lazy attempt at representation but more they don’t believe the female villains have the star power and so they swapped Penguin’s gender. This change is a deservice to the variety of great Batman villains, male and female
Yeah, I saw Bruce Timm's comments and had a good laugh with the wifey. Batman arguably has the BEST rogues gallery of any comic character. I think only Spider-Man comes close. So many fleshed-out, well-written villains... yes, even female ones. Though, as others have mentioned, DC Comics keeps trying to make the female ones into "modern audience" anti-heroes because they're run by idiots. Poison Ivy was an awesome femme fatale with pheromone & plant powers. Now she's a body positive lesbian and I'm supposed to sympathize with her desire to destroy all humans. Harley Quinn was an awesome psycho with a great costume and a delightfully irritating voice. Now she's a girl-power lesbian and I'm supposed to sympathize with her murderous tendencies. Catwoman was a cat burglar who took things a bit too literal, in a fun way. Sometimes she was very naughty. Sometimes she'd shack up with Batman and rein it in. Lately, she's just been a bland anti-hero because eh. Also, her relationship with Batman took on "be my mommy" undertones that creeped me out. But even taking those three out of the picture, you still have Baby Doll, Shiva, the female Copperhead (who I loved in Origins. Established mutliple copperheads without gender-bending the main one), the Phantasm, and Talia Al'GHul. Plenty to work with, and Bruce Timm could always try to make up NEW villains if he feels that Batman has a dearth of worthy foes. But no... genderswap existing characters, because why bother demonstrating competence? Bizarre. Glad I passed on this show.
There was a character in Batman Beyond that was basically already the female Penguin from this show they could have repurposed, Ma Mayhem. She was the leader of a gang, and her gang was made up of her sons, and she had a similar build.
You’re right but I love what the new penguin and Harly but your ideas could be saved for the future of the show. I hope the writers listen to you and use your ideas in the future seasons, especially Roxy. What about the play bunny girl who can make a clone of herself
If you turn off your brain you might almost believe it. There are other ways can fix it by making a separate character. Not sure how female ventriloquist was received, sure could say was gender swapped but to me felt like different characters and interesting idea. Instead of making, because know its too hard or dont have real ideas they do this pathetic joke mess.
Even if what he said is true, why not make a compelling and original female villain to show off your writing skills instead of a lazy gender swap for easy brownie points?
Let’s agree that tailoring a show for “modern audiences” or any kind of audiences, is what’s hurting our creativity. I’m not saying that they should break what makes family friendly and what makes adult films, adult films, but what I’m saying is that there are way too many rules which hinders the creativity. And this makes shows lower than good. Barely above average.
he’s kinda right tho cause a lot of the important and most iconic female villains have gradually turned into antiheroes and/or were often reduced to just a love interest
I read in the article that Timm proposed to James Tucker to make Penguin female because "he didn't know what to do with his character in Caped Crusader." I never understood why people revered and praised Bruce Timm when he's no more than a mediocre writer. There were plenty of amazing or potential female villains that never got their shine or in my opinion ruined by becoming Batman's love interest (e.g. Catwoman, Talia). We have the villains you mentioned and I personally want to see more villains from the comics featured in a animated series or movie one day like Jezebel Jet.
Thank you for brining the Harley Quinn point up. The entire time I saw the episode I was questioning if it was Harley Quinn or genderbent mad hatter (which is honestly what they did). I’m appreciative that they did stray away from the original story now that Harley Quinn is her own character and doesn’t need joker but it’s so lazy to see Harley treated this way
Ok while I did enjoy my time with the show that is just a dumb reason for changing Penguin. I liked what they did but like it doesn’t take genius to know that Batman has iconic female villains
“Batman doesn’t have good female villains” is not a good take. Like compare to other heroes rouge gallery, Batman has one of the best villains both male and female. you could make a case with Superman or Spider-men not having good female villains, but definitely not Batman.
I think this show is ok, it can definitely get better. This whole creating for modern audiences is really destroying creativity, so is using that pencil to create new female villains too hard.
Bruce Timm's using the same garbage defense that some of the people under Lucasfilm are using. Despite the numerous pre-Disney female characters that were beloved like Padme, Mara Jade, and Aayla Secura, the company pulled that "There were no strong women in Star Wars" card.
When Bruce got canceled by woke mob over His Sexy Pin Up Art on His Website. So 5 years ago? He panders so hard to them now, for doing Fan Art. Crazy times
Instead of giving the more obscure female villains like Magpie, Roxy Rocket, Red Claw and Baby Doll more depth and spotlight he went the lazy route and gender swapped an iconic male one because it was just easier.
Unfortunately they Reform, Semi-reform all of them, expand them to other Heroes or discard them. Cat Woman Anti-Hero, Harley Anti-Hero or at-least Anti-Villain, and the list foes on he has a good female villain and it is revealed that she is actually an Anti-Villain or is reformed in to an Anti-Hero, or they are one and done story arcs before they are pushed aside or become part of the open roaster of Villains used by writers for just about any Hero. Bats doesn't get to be in an exclusive long-term relationship with any Female Villain that gets to stay a strait up Villain.
Harley, Ivy and Catwoman are enough, they could’ve gone with shiva or Talia if they wanted to not use the big villains. If they ain’t want any of that they shoulda just made new villains that are completely new ideas it worked well with BTAS
Bruce Timm sold his soul to corporate Hollywood just like George Lucas. Not only does Batman have female villains, but some of the most iconic creative female antagonists in comics.
Follow up video based on your comments. Are Batman's Female Villains only Anti-Heroes - th-cam.com/video/O4SleR-rdcA/w-d-xo.html
Bruce timm: “there are no female Batman villains”
You literally used three of them in the show
@@ericwithak
These are no longer villains
They are heroes now
@@ΑΛΕΞΑΝΔΡΑ-ε1ωNocturna obviously isn't.
@@ΑΛΕΞΑΝΔΡΑ-ε1ω Don't matter. They originated as villains.
@@ΑΛΕΞΑΝΔΡΑ-ε1ω They are no longer straight too 🤣
@@ΑΛΕΞΑΝΔΡΑ-ε1ωthis guy simping for Timm lol
Batman has good female villains
He doesn't have many.
They too good. And they have zero agenda which makes them great.
@@TheLuconic Which ones are you referring to that have no agenda?
He said he doesn't have good
Villains because he doesn't have more female villains
He does but besides catwoman he barely interacts with any of them tell me the last time there was a big Poison Ivy storyline with Batman
Let's pretend Bruce Timm is right for a sec. If he really felt that Batman needed more female villains why not make a new one instead of gender bending a male villain?
Especially when he was on a show ,batman tas, that created several women villains like roxy rocket and harley
exactly he could've made a new acolyte for Penguin who is competent , has personality and nice design. i guarantee u she would've been a hit like Harley quinn back in the days
also there is a video by causally comics about quinne a character with two otheres name after cards wich was the proto royal flush gang and it didn't need much change just remove the joker from it and add some stuff and there we go there is also a video by youtber where she showcases different female villains that could have been add it
Because then you couldn't disappoint and disrespect the fans.
The more he says the more I wonder if Paul Dini was all the brains
He was he wrote for Arkham city and asylum but didn’t return for knight
@@x0nixWow, really?! That's awesome!🥰🦇🤡🌃
@@x0nix Makes sense. Story for Knight wasn't as good.
@user-dj8rr7gx1b Ima be real would have been interesting to see scarecrow. As a terrorist like how the trailer showed him to be.
Or at least id like to see that
@@generalgrenade6463 he basically was
"Batman has no lovers.....aside from Batgirl." - Bruce Timm
ewwwwwwwww
@@kwingsletsplays ikr?
Harley Quinn, Catwoman, poison ivy, Talia al Ghul, the phantasm, lady shiva, white rabbit, female copperhead?
Nah batman has only had only male villains apparently.
Eh, White Rabbit is... Okay. The rest are great tho. Also don't forget Baby Doll.
@@fynnthefox9078 You think White Rabbit only okay but then you want to add Baby Doll?
Don't forget all the original ones they made for BTAS. Baby Doll, Iron Claw, Roxy Rocket, Claendar Girl, Harley Quinn
And that's only the ones that I CAN remember💀
Current wb let’s make them all gay
Red Claw, not Iron Claw. And Calendar Girl was a gender swap.
All the good female villains that will be brought up are literally from projects he’s connected to so it really doesn’t make sense
1990s Timm making New Female Villians for His Batman.
0ld 2024 Timm says We don't have Good Female Villians, let's change a Dude to a She.
Clearly Dini was the creative force behind Timm's Success. Each project He does, Dude slips deeper into Insanity.
Everyone you named is no longer considered a villain lmao
@@isaiahjackson1211 Then make new ones.
@@gimmeyourrights8292 aand then everyone is gonna complain how they like the old villains better
@@isaiahjackson1211 That depends on how poorly written the new villains are. Punchline was very well received.
Bruce Timm is an ego maniac living off his past glory that Paul Dini helped him attain. JJ Abrahams has no business working on a Batman project.
@Triple_AcesMatt reeves arguably gave us the best live action Batman film so he gets a pass
@Triple_Aces The Batman was an amazing movie
@@jaylenjayden9305 Best live action Batman? Not by a longshot. The movie as a whole is good, but... Pattinson Batman? Nah. Affleck was still better than him.
@Triple_Acesnope the Batman was the best live action Batman to me
@@P.Whitestrakebatfleck the guy who Broke the one Batman rule, he has cool fight scenes but that’s it, batfleck is as empty s character as the rest of the dceu
Bruce Timm is a fool! Batman is tied with Spiderman for the best gallery of villians. Batman has some of the best female villains lol
In my opinion batman , spiderman and superman have best rouge gallery than others superheroes
@@prixodiydacha8114imma throw flash in their as well
Spider-Man villians are overrated when it comes to writing
They just want to change Penguins gender just to, for the sake of it.
It wasn't for the reason of "female character that will fit a role of bossing a crime family mob"
How do you feel about the female copperhead and calendar girl those are sex change version of male characters.
Just have magpie
Instead
They worked because they werent just the same character with a different gender , calendere girl and man are very different characters both in motives and crimes @joshuataylor7443
@@maverickdarkrath4780 and the female firefly in the Gotham?
There's also the female Ventriloquist
Why wasn’t Paul Dini put in charge of this show, it had so much potential
Bruce Tim is just lying to justify him gender swapping penguin
Also, I know where that thumbnails from And do you have good taste sir
Wait, where did he get that thumbnail from?
@@Batman-fg4wu something unlimited and that is the name where it’s from
@@theravenking5930sauce
@@ngrjordi2352 something unlimited
He scrapes the bottom of the barrel for a guy like Onomatopoeia, but for some reason doesn't know about literally any female Batman villain who's just as obscure? No way.
As early as the '60s TV series, there were plenty of female villains to complement Catwoman: Zelda, Marsha, Minerva, Cassandra Spellcraft...
The Phantasm is my favorite female villain. She was used only once in Mask of The Phantasm and was tragic, relatable, and badass. She only appears one more time in a cameo in Justice League Unlimited. Why tf couldn't she be used more like Harley Quinn was? The villain of one of the best Batman movies of all time just completely disregarded.
She's not a villain, more like an anti-hero like the Huntress.
@@MR_HAYS1
She is retired
And recently she was in a relationship with Selina Kyle
@@ΑΛΕΞΑΝΔΡΑ-ε1ω Thats fine for the DCAU universe. I'm more so meaning that Phantasm should be getting used in other universes where that isn't the case. She seems to only exist in the DCAU and idk about comics but they're not using her in main stream media at all. Awesome character with awesome potential that gets ignored.
@@MR_HAYS1
Nope
She was in mainline DC Universe
Selina married Bruce
But after he died she ended up
With Andrea
If he wants female villains than either use original villains or create original and interesting ones but that’s too much to ask
no goodfemale villains bruce timm? wooow
My brother in chirst you helped created and made the best definitive versions of them once
HUH!? Bruce has lost his DAMN MIND😭
Did he forget all the original ones they made for BTAS. Baby Doll, Iron Claw, Roxy Rocket, Claendar Girl, Harley Quinn
And that's only the ones that I CAN remember💀
1:35 EXACTLY. This man has LOST HIS MIND😭😭😭
Same Page Bro
POOR BRUCE TIM WHAT HAS HAPPENED TO YOU BRO
His Bruce/Barbara shipping fried his brain. And he went woke.
@@guardiansoulblade2673 He aged just like American entertainment, very poorly
I’m guessing cocaine
Paul Dini’s absence is what happened to him.
Bruce Timm happened.
Magpie also appears in Batwoman and Gotham.
Her version in Beware the Bat was also great. I wanted more of her and that show.
Paul Dini would of been a better writer/creator of the series he actually knows what he’s doing while Bruce Timm I think he took a whole nose full of cocaine and lost his brains like the once great Frank Miller
Paul is like the youndu of the batman universe.
"He may have beeing your father boy. But he wasn't your daddy"
@@motor4X4kombat agreed lol
This is your Brain on Drugs and this is Bruce Timm any questions?
@@GreenRangerFan2006 XD
Hey Bruce Timm, aren't you forgetting Catwoman, Poison Ivy and Harley?
These women
Are heroes now
Those three are soft, traumatised, lesbians now. They can’t be truly evil, it’s men’s fault that they’re even bad at all! - Current DC leadership.
They are antiheroes now, catwoman since the 70s
@@ΑΛΕΞΑΝΔΡΑ-ε1ω This is an origin based story it's not about "now"
@@anakinskywalker2142 The show is origin based and it doesn't cover the events from "now".
Poison Ivy dodged a bullet and I'd like it to stay that way. They could've used Calendar Girl, Magpie, and Copperhead. Hell Huntress could work since she was a villain at first who could convert in later seasons. I'm not sure why these writers refuse to open comic books or DC Wikia.
Like I just don’t get Bruce timm logic I really don’t, like mostly because Batman has great female characters growing up and hearing him say this breaks my brain 🧠 in my opinion.
It basically tells me he was just an artist and Paul Dini was the true writing talent.
Bruce Tim and the crew behind Batman the Animated Series created Harley Quinn. Did he completely forget about that?
How would like me to prove Bruce Timm wrong alphabetically or numerically list of all Batman female villains.
Yes
The three most iconic ones are cat woman,poison ivy and harley quinn
But then you have more obscure ones like white rabbit or jane doe there’s countless other examples but I don’t think I’ll list every female villan who batman has ever fought.
@@DgardsGaming Catwoman, Copperhead, Duela Dent, Harly Quinn, Killer Frost, Lady Arkham, Lady Clay, Lady Shiva, Lynx, Lady Spellbind, Nyssa Raatko, Phantasm, Punchline, Rocky Rocket, Sofia Falcone, Talia al Ghul, & White Rabbit
@@Payload82why didn’t you include Jane doe into that list?
@@BatFan1939-knightfall my bad a forgot her what Callender Girl from the new BTAS season
I saw the tweet he posted and I listed about 12 different female villians from.the Batman comics and I was just like how does a man who worked on 3 different Batman shows not know Batman had all these female advisories
because he took all the credit from paul dini
Craziest statement I've heard in a long time... If anything Batman has the most popular female rouges gallery in comics
Well... A good few aren't villains anymore
@@lightdarksoul2097 I mean a lot the ones who aren’t villains anymore still get written as villains if the story demands it so they could be written as villains for the show
Harley isn’t the mad hatter in the caped crusader she’s Hugo strange lol
Batman has a *lot* of female villains with great potential, they just choose not to use most of them lol.
Bruce Timm saying this when BTAS alone had some of the the most memorable female Batman Villains ever is crazy.
Harley Quinn
Poison Ivy
Roxy Rocket
Baby doll
Catwoman
Calendar Girl
If he really thought Batman doesn't have enough female Villains, why didn't he just make a new character. Say what you want about Gotham, at least Fish Mooney was an original character.
@@sincitty3323
Harley Quinn is a hero now
So is poison ivy and Catwoman
Don't forget red claw too who would also fit as an eastern European mobster
@@Thed538dhskyes wasted opportunity she could have gone from boring to making a name for herself then being a cardboard cutout of a generic bond james villian
@@MrTao-iy2nf so many 1920's/30's/40's noir stories could be told with her in this show. Like her being a mob boss herself or an assassin or starting out criminal trying to grow bigger or a serial killer etc. but no. Instead we get Harley Quinn impersonating Hugo strange and penguin being a terrible mother. Thanks Timm...
@@ΑΛΕΞΑΝΔΡΑ-ε1ω It's not about "now" this is supposed to be an origin based story where Harley Quinn & poison ivy are villains
It's really concerning how being an attractive female and/or canonically being attracted to a man disqualified so many villains in his eyes. Harley Quinn alone is still popular thanks to that 90's incarnation, which I say still cares her to this day after all the mangling and screwing up countless projects and series have done (looking at the DCEU especially).
No joking diversion to Brave and the Bold today (it's still peak Batman for me), just sheer, unbridled disappointment.
Thank you Kwing for an excellent video.
Has Bruce Tim lost it? Batman has a lot of great female badass villains!
Taila Al Ghul
Catwoman
She-Bat
Harley Freaking Quinn
Lady Shiva
Poison Ivy
White Rabbit
Baby Doll
The list goes on!!
eh she bat and baby doll aren't really great
@@sonicmoore6196
Talia is retired
Catwoman is a hero
Harley Quinn is a hero
Poison ivy is a hero
@@ΑΛΕΞΑΝΔΡΑ-ε1ω That's the problem, villains ain't villains anymore. Everyone is an anti-hero of some kind.
@@ΑΛΕΞΑΝΔΡΑ-ε1ω Talia was never originally retired, Catwoman was never originally a hero, Harley was never originally a hero, and Ivy was originally a hero. This is an origin based story so the events you brought up don't make much sense.
While a geisha Harley Quinn might be interesting I still think race changing Harley is a dumb idea in the first place. Maybe create a new geisha or asian villain, OR as Kwing suggested use Lady Shiva instead!
They should have used Hugo Strange instead of Harley Quinn for how they did her character. It would have fit his character so much better
@@shadowknight1509 Agreed! 👍
Thanks for the video Kwing! Villaina I love are Lady Shiva , Red Claw, Poison Ivy, Harley Quinn BTAS, and Calender Girl. ❤😊
Your Adorable, thanks for watching ❤️
This is awkward
@@MrsAmber_loves_MrKwing
Poison ivy and Harley Quinn
Are heroes now
@@ΑΛΕΞΑΝΔΡΑ-ε1ω By origin(which the show is based on) they ARE villains
Catwoman, Poison Ivy, Harley Quinn, Talia, Red Claw, Rossi Rocket, Baby Doll, Batwoman, Mask Phantasm, Nocturne, Lady Shiva, & Copperhead don't exist apparently for Bruce Timm.
@@venomj8179
Catwoman is a hero now
Talia is retired
Ivy is a hero now
Harley Quinn is a hero
When did Batwoman become a
Villain
@user-gj9uq3kb7y
Dude, literally calling them heroes... alright, then that's like saying "well Venom is a hero now," Let's pretend that Venom was never a threat to Peter's life, tho 🤣
@user-gj9uq3kb7y
Also, Batwoman had a movie in the animated series. Batwoman was getting revenge on Penguin, and Batman concentrated on discovering Batwoman's identity, plus Batwoman put others at risk for her goal.
@@ΑΛΕΞΑΝΔΡΑ-ε1ω This is an origin based story so ORGINALLY.....
Catwoman was not a hero, Talia wasn't retired, Ivy wasn't a hero, and Harley wasn't a hero.
Fixed it for you.👍
No good female villains? More like way too much of Harley Quinn, Poison Ivy and Catwoman. There’s a lot of female Batman villains that just get slept on because they never get any time to shine. They could have given a spotlight to characters like Jane Doe, Roxy Rocket, Baby Doll, Orca, Fright, March Harriet, White Rabbit, Copperhead, Peyton Riley, Arkham Knight, Punchline, Addison Cobblepot, Sofia Falcone or The Phantasm…but nah pointlessly gender swapping male characters is somehow better.
Wait, you're telling me there's an already existing female Cobblepot, and they still gender bent Penguin?
@@snowbunnie1113
Harley poison ivy and Catwoman
Are heroes now
@@AndreyKrichevskyyes, penguin's daughter
@@AndreyKrichevskyyes. Addison is Oswald’s daughter (she’s very underutilised as a character) this could have been a good opportunity to give her some exposure and explore her dynamic with her father, but they didn’t and just made up a random, middle aged woman and called her Penguin. Lame.
Catwoman was an antihero since the 70s
The same Bruce Timm that helped create one of Batman;'s most beloved female villains Harley Quinn. That Bruce Timm, Did someone like...remove his brain while he was sleeping or something
@@FsMetal-gk4iw she is a hero now
@@ΑΛΕΞΑΝΔΡΑ-ε1ωOnly in the comics. That doesn't matter. She was still used as a villain in this show.
@@ΑΛΕΞΑΝΔΡΑ-ε1ω This is an origin based story so the "now" is irrelevant.👎
We should just put kwing in charge of this show and fire Bruce timm. He’s completely lost his way and should be kept far away from projects.
Hell Yes!
I dont trust anti woke fans anymore than i trust woke people
Did he not help in episodes of BTAS like Dollface, Pretty Poison, and Harley’s Vacation just to name a few
But gender-swapping is so easy! Takes little effort. Just make a couple of tweaks and boom, bam, you're done. Meanwhile creating original characters takes all that pesky originality, creativity and imagination. Who wants that?
But seriously, it is shocking to hear someone who worked on BTAS say something like this. Finding preferable to do a lazy gender-swap over using an obscure character (possible popularizing her in the process) or creating new female characters altogether.
To some of the guys who try to defend the gender swapping of Penguin after Bruce Timms statement better check to see if their heads are on straight because there's no reason to gender swap a long time villain when there are other female Villains in Batman's lore that the show could've used. Gender and race swapping characters is nothing more but lazy writing, plain and simple.
He’s been gooning so much to the female Batman characters that he forgot they’re a part of the actual universe and not just his fan fiction.
Great video Kwing! Thanks!
Bruce Timm has clearly lost his mind.
Bruce Timm's ridiculous statements make me respect Paul Dini even more more
If only the writers read the Batman comics.
@@elijahbannis6474
Per comics
Talia is retired
Catwoman is a hero
So is ivy and Harley
@@ΑΛΕΞΑΝΔΡΑ-ε1ω I'm talking about unknown female Batman villains not female villains that already showed up in many Batman shows before, I mean if they could use unknown female villain like Natalie knight why no use villains like the mine,nocturnal,pix,siken spider, absence or even if they want a female villain instead of gender bending penguin why not use mother as the antagonist of the series she's already a female boss like villain?.
@@ΑΛΕΞΑΝΔΡΑ-ε1ω By the origin in the comics Ivy and Harley are villains and Talia isn't retired.
Well that's probably because they turn them all into Anti-Heroes.
@@chicken-films10 yes
So don't depict a homicidal maniac who likes flowers as a good guy problem solved
Too late @@roberthosford1658
@@lightdarksoul2097 if it's too late explain why Harley is so evil in this show
@@roberthosford1658 easy she is basically completely different and the show is just okay so I don't see this version getting popular
He's technically correct. Batman has no good female villains because they keep making all his female villains into heroes or antiheroes, because women can't be evil.
Excuse me but Harleu , Ivy and Catwoman are good villains
Exactly
@@REVERSE_Flash_ Catwoman more like antihero than villain
Well they were until DC, and guys like Bruce Timm turned them all into “anti heroes”.
@@snowbunnie1113 Catwoman works amazing as an anti hero, Harley works really well as an anti villain,
@@loonytunescrazy
These women are heroes now
Bruce Timmy really lose . I like his 1993 batman but right now he really lost his mind
Bruce Timm's Batman Movie was 1993, Mask of the Phantasm.
1989 Batman was Tim Burton.
Which inspired B. Timm to pitch His Batman show to Fox, which became BTAS in 92.
I would really like to see Zatanna incorporated into season 2. Yes she’s not a batman villain per say but she does have history with Bruce and I think her style could really fit into this 1940s-esque setting
they'll ruin ma babe Zee. No thanks
Keep zatanna away from bruce timm. He'll make her weird somehow
I Disagree with Bruce Timm, because saying "there's no female villains" is like saying we don't breath air. There are plenty of female characters in the Batman rogue gallery,
1. Talia al Ghul
2. Poison Ivy
3. Red Claw
4. Magpie [the one you have mentioned, which I wasn't familiar with]
5. Baby Doll
6. Candice
7. Roxy Rocket
8. Martha Wayne* (Flashpoint)
I don't consider neither Harley Quinn or Catwoman a villain. Harley Quinn is more misguided in one instance in the video game Injustice Gods Among Us she's part of the Insurgency [alternate timeline]. Whereas Catwoman is "two-faced", she's a jewel thief and other times she plays on the side of good.
Though I disagree with his statement, it might be worth acknowledging that there is a trend towards making Batman's villainesses more like anti-heroines. In BTAS, Catwoman did not get to be the main villain for a single episode. Harley became increasingly sympathetic as time went on. Poison Ivy was a true villainess, but with the environmental problems we face today, it might feel iffy depicting an environmentalist in such a negative light.
To be honest I wouldn't really take whatever Bruce Timm has to say very seriously.
Look at what Gotham did. They wanted a female crime boss who would be threatening, smart, deadly and everything else. So what did they do? They created Fish Mooney. They didn't change Sal Maroni into Sally Maroni or Rupert Throne into Ruby Thorne. They created a character from scratch and they did an excellent job. And Batman has arguably the best female rogues gallery in all of comics. I mean you have Lady Shiva who is a better fighter than Batman, you have Phantasm a villain created from scratch again and is from the most popular DCAU movie, Harley Quinn a villain who now matches popularity (and possibly even greater than now) than Wonder Woman. The biggest problem is they try to make all their female villains into anti hero's for some reason. And here is the thing he is disrespecting all the bat female villains that are great but under utilized by gender swapping rather thana using them
Imagine if Harley after all this time finally got to do a heel turn and be the villain again? She goes back to Joker and actively takes a role in his mayhem and destruction once again. If only DC would be based.
"Oswald. Take Gotham as your city.
And burn it to the ground."
- Fish Mooney's last dying words.
These female villain ideas you suggested are much more interesting than female Penguin and this strange version of Harley Quinn. If Bruce Timm wasn't in charge of this show, I would hope to see more pre-existing female characters in season 2, but now I'm half expecting a female Riddler next season. On a side note, while I understand the Mad Hatter comparisons with her brainwashing people and dressing them up in funny costumes, this Harley really reminded me of Hugo Strange. Both are psychologists who use their patients' secrets against them to manipulate and brainwash them, as well as both having created psychological profiles of Batman for the GCPD.
That reminder of Baby Doll got me. Only 1 episode, but it was super impactful and despite what she did, I could completely get how she'd go crazy like that.
She actually has two episodes, the later one was in “The New Batman Adventures” with the character redesigns and she has an odd romance with Killer Croc. It definitely assassinated her character a bit.
@@cmrobbins88 I'm glad I forgot that one.
@@1tzyb1tzel yeah it was supposed to be a Bonny and Clyde type episode but it doesn’t land.
Batman has great female villains. It's Timm's fault he doesn't know how to use them.
Batman has great female villains. Bruce timm has sunk to the level of many appearances as the riddler from BTAS.
1) Poison Ivy
2) Catwoman
3) Harley Quinn
4) Talia Al Ghul
5) Shiva
6) Red Claw
7) Calendar Girl
8) Roxie Rocket
9) Magpie
10) Nocturna
@@kamenrangerzeo8251
Poison ivy is a hero now
Catwoman is a hero now
Harley Quinn is a hero now
Talia is retired
@@kamenrangerzeo8251
And nocturna was in Caped Crusader
Episode 8
@@ΑΛΕΞΑΝΔΡΑ-ε1ω "Now" is irrelevant since this is an origin based story which means..... Ivy and Harley ARE villains and Talia isn't retired.
My take on why they made gender bent penguin (which I disapproved of because Penguin is consistently a guy and should be accurate to comics) is not only because of a lazy attempt at representation but more they don’t believe the female villains have the star power and so they swapped Penguin’s gender. This change is a deservice to the variety of great Batman villains, male and female
Yeah, I saw Bruce Timm's comments and had a good laugh with the wifey. Batman arguably has the BEST rogues gallery of any comic character. I think only Spider-Man comes close.
So many fleshed-out, well-written villains... yes, even female ones. Though, as others have mentioned, DC Comics keeps trying to make the female ones into "modern audience" anti-heroes because they're run by idiots.
Poison Ivy was an awesome femme fatale with pheromone & plant powers. Now she's a body positive lesbian and I'm supposed to sympathize with her desire to destroy all humans.
Harley Quinn was an awesome psycho with a great costume and a delightfully irritating voice. Now she's a girl-power lesbian and I'm supposed to sympathize with her murderous tendencies.
Catwoman was a cat burglar who took things a bit too literal, in a fun way. Sometimes she was very naughty. Sometimes she'd shack up with Batman and rein it in. Lately, she's just been a bland anti-hero because eh. Also, her relationship with Batman took on "be my mommy" undertones that creeped me out.
But even taking those three out of the picture, you still have Baby Doll, Shiva, the female Copperhead (who I loved in Origins. Established mutliple copperheads without gender-bending the main one), the Phantasm, and Talia Al'GHul. Plenty to work with, and Bruce Timm could always try to make up NEW villains if he feels that Batman has a dearth of worthy foes.
But no... genderswap existing characters, because why bother demonstrating competence? Bizarre. Glad I passed on this show.
@@Ingel_Riday6690
Talia is retired
And Ra's is still dead
Just like Alfred
@@ΑΛΕΞΑΝΔΡΑ-ε1ω Irrelevant, this is an origin based story. This means.....Talia wasn't retired, Ra's is still around and so is Alfred.
There was a character in Batman Beyond that was basically already the female Penguin from this show they could have repurposed, Ma Mayhem. She was the leader of a gang, and her gang was made up of her sons, and she had a similar build.
You’re right but I love what the new penguin and Harly but your ideas could be saved for the future of the show. I hope the writers listen to you and use your ideas in the future seasons, especially Roxy. What about the play bunny girl who can make a clone of herself
He knows this isnt true. He is just trying to justify the genderswap
Its almost like Dini was the real powerhouse...
If you turn off your brain you might almost believe it. There are other ways can fix it by making a separate character. Not sure how female ventriloquist was received, sure could say was gender swapped but to me felt like different characters and interesting idea. Instead of making, because know its too hard or dont have real ideas they do this pathetic joke mess.
I think they just wanted to do something different and needed a big name for the "female family mob boss" vibe.
@@dillydraws then just make a new one. Modern writers and directors just have NO balls...
Even if what he said is true, why not make a compelling and original female villain to show off your writing skills instead of a lazy gender swap for easy brownie points?
You know the reason Why. That's Hollywood
The most abundant statement made this year.
To quote a South Park character to Mr. Timm: Are you high or just incredibly stupid?
Let’s agree that tailoring a show for “modern audiences” or any kind of audiences, is what’s hurting our creativity. I’m not saying that they should break what makes family friendly and what makes adult films, adult films, but what I’m saying is that there are way too many rules which hinders the creativity. And this makes shows lower than good. Barely above average.
One key thing: call them villainesses! It's functionally PC, it's affirmative toward females, and it's aesthetically nicer.
Kwing isn't Politically Correct. Not that i've ever seen.
I'm not spotting a way that that matters in this instance, @@GreenRangerFan2006
he’s kinda right tho cause a lot of the important and most iconic female villains have gradually turned into antiheroes and/or were often reduced to just a love interest
I read in the article that Timm proposed to James Tucker to make Penguin female because "he didn't know what to do with his character in Caped Crusader." I never understood why people revered and praised Bruce Timm when he's no more than a mediocre writer. There were plenty of amazing or potential female villains that never got their shine or in my opinion ruined by becoming Batman's love interest (e.g. Catwoman, Talia). We have the villains you mentioned and I personally want to see more villains from the comics featured in a animated series or movie one day like Jezebel Jet.
Thank you for brining the Harley Quinn point up. The entire time I saw the episode I was questioning if it was Harley Quinn or genderbent mad hatter (which is honestly what they did). I’m appreciative that they did stray away from the original story now that Harley Quinn is her own character and doesn’t need joker but it’s so lazy to see Harley treated this way
Ok while I did enjoy my time with the show that is just a dumb reason for changing Penguin. I liked what they did but like it doesn’t take genius to know that Batman has iconic female villains
That’s like saying Anime has no male protagonists 😑
“Batman doesn’t have good female villains” is not a good take. Like compare to other heroes rouge gallery, Batman has one of the best villains both male and female. you could make a case with Superman or Spider-men not having good female villains, but definitely not Batman.
I think this show is ok, it can definitely get better. This whole creating for modern audiences is really destroying creativity, so is using that pencil to create new female villains too hard.
Bruce Timm's using the same garbage defense that some of the people under Lucasfilm are using. Despite the numerous pre-Disney female characters that were beloved like Padme, Mara Jade, and Aayla Secura, the company pulled that "There were no strong women in Star Wars" card.
When did Bruce Timm turn woke?
When Bruce got canceled by woke mob over His Sexy Pin Up Art on His Website. So 5 years ago?
He panders so hard to them now, for doing Fan Art. Crazy times
@@kwingsletsplays That’s disappointing. How the mighty have fallen. We need Paul Dini back.
Bruce Timm should have asked advices from Paul Dini to help Caped crusader
What's crazy was female penguin didn't bug me until Bruce Timm ran his mouth
Bro how could he say that when he was part of the DCAU?! WTF is going on with these people?!
Brainwashing. If Lucasfilm has an LGBTQ reeducation camp, I wouldn't put it past other companies
Is it me or is Harley more like Punchline in this show ? Also Who was that holiday themed villain from Btas the Ex model
That would be Calender Girl, she wore like a blank face mask because of some deformity due to plastic surgery.
@@NeoKratosfan2007 she's a dope villainess I'd love to see more of her
That was Mannequin going by the wrong name seriously just call her Mannequin no reason to pretend that she has anything to do with Calendar Man
Thanks for the video. My favorite BTAS villain is poison Ivy
Good work everyone
Instead of giving the more obscure female villains like Magpie, Roxy Rocket, Red Claw and Baby Doll more depth and spotlight he went the lazy route and gender swapped an iconic male one because it was just easier.
They could’ve done a Gotham and had Fish Mooney and have a younger Penguin be her underling a setup for later episodes
Batman The Animated Series has it's writers bible online for free for everyone to read. Why can't a show creator just follow that?
Unfortunately they Reform, Semi-reform all of them, expand them to other Heroes or discard them. Cat Woman Anti-Hero, Harley Anti-Hero or at-least Anti-Villain, and the list foes on he has a good female villain and it is revealed that she is actually an Anti-Villain or is reformed in to an Anti-Hero, or they are one and done story arcs before they are pushed aside or become part of the open roaster of Villains used by writers for just about any Hero.
Bats doesn't get to be in an exclusive long-term relationship with any Female Villain that gets to stay a strait up Villain.
It didn’t make sense to me, to see a female variant of PENGUIN, in the (BATMAN: CAPED CRUSADER) animated show.
this just show that paul dini was the truly talented guy of the 2
Bruce Tim the same guy who made a Batman , badgirl , nightwing love triangle somehow, he should stick to character designs
Oh I loved Baby Doll. That ending was heartbreaking.
I'm glad you brought up Red Claw. She was one of my favourites as a kid. They could maybe have used the phantasm some how as well.
Harley, Ivy and Catwoman are enough, they could’ve gone with shiva or Talia if they wanted to not use the big villains. If they ain’t want any of that they shoulda just made new villains that are completely new ideas it worked well with BTAS
Bruce Timm sold his soul to corporate Hollywood just like George Lucas. Not only does Batman have female villains, but some of the most iconic creative female antagonists in comics.
I'm tired of that creep