First off, I need to say that 90% of my freight cars are equipped with Micro Trains trucks and couplers. But, I have some old, ('69 and '70's) MRC freight cars, with factory trucks with metal wheelsets, and they are by far, the best rolling freight cars I own. I've had 'em for over 50 years, cleaned the wheels once, and they're still running perfectly. never derail, and stay clean. I wish all my freight cars ran as well. Almost every time I see MRC freight cars come up for sale, I buy 'em up, and they all perform the same. I've never regretted the decision to pick up more. Thanks for your observations and opinions. I agree with you 100%.
Brian, I completely concur with your assessment of plastic vs, metal wheelsets. I have over 200 freight cars, and I'm about 2/3 done with the conversion process. I've found, my locomotives, after conversion, can pull over 20% more freight cars, starting with the same consist, than they were able to prior to the conversion to MT trucks and couplers. Just a little more validation to your conclusions. The only way to eliminate 'cruddy' wheels, is to invent, and run, Maglev trains !
I hope this post ends up on here because my last post went to Nederland for right now. I agree with you 💯% that it is a personal preference and I'm glad that you don't care either way. This means to me we can spend more on layout which makes me happy. I'm more about the fun of the hobby than the realism. Like always loved your video and I got a really good laugh with your intro. Again I say remember it's a personal preference! Great job on the video and I love you 💕
C'mon Brian, I was just taking a slurp of tea when you showed up like that, nearly came out of my nose LOL. Over this side of the pond in N & HO gauge we tend to go for metal wheels. They seem run more freely, tend to stay clean longer than plastic although all wheels as you said will pick up dirt, and they clean up easier. All our locomotives and rolling stock tend to be metal wheel. Some company's who put out kits you put together tend to come with plastic wheels but only I think to keep the cost down. We then simply change them to metal. Our goods wagons or as you call them freight cars in the period I cover 1950's are so small and light I have to put weights in them so they can at least have half a chance of staying on the track. As my layout is in the loft and we do get extreme temperature variations up there I have to put expansion gaps between track sections to allow for the track to stretch or shrink. Oh I have had some disasters when I did not allow for this. I have a gap of 1mm between each track section and believe me you can hear the clickety-clack as the train runs along, its lovely, brings back fond memories when us poor could afford to travel by rail. Now regarding the cocktail stick test, that might just be down to the coning of the axles. I have not tried these yet as all my stuff is fairly new but I have heard good things about Bearing Reamers which they make for us N Gaugers. They smooth out the imperfections in the coning of the axle bearings. Mate of mine has purchased them and he can now pull a third more in stock after using the Bearing Reamer as it has cut down on the friction and the wheels run better. Also they work with metal and plastic wheels so I am told. To be honest I dont swap mine out either, I leave whatever wheels are on there when I purchase them, unless I start to have issues. If it works dont fiddle with it. Regards Chris
Good video, but I found the comparison of 40 year old vs new trucks and wheels to be pretty strange. Yes the weight difference is small, but in some cases might be all that is needed to bring a car to proper weight. Another unmentioned advantage is on light cars, metal wheels will lower the center of gravity to help tracking etc… modern metal wheels aren’t usually as wide or have that big a flange as those you have. If you put a modern blma, fox valley, tangent or such wheelset in the same micro trains trucks, my experience is they will out roll plastic every time with an even lower amount of friction and personally I find they stay cleaner. To each his own. Very entertaining and I look forward to seeing your next video my friend.
Thanks! Yes, it was a "strange" comparison, but as I said before and after, it was only to show why I don't feel the need to swap out my plastic wheels. Thanks for watching!
Hi Brian! Thanks for your assessment of plastic vs. metal wheels. As you may know, I switching from plastic to metal wheels on my layout, but I still have both on my layout, and both work very well. I think good trackwork and the overall weight of the cars is more important. Bottom line (as you noted) is this: Like just about everything in model railroading, whether you use plastic or metal wheels on your layout comes down to a matter of personal preference. ...Roy
Interesting observations Brian. There are pros/cons for both options. I fully agree with your conclusion - do what you like with your railroad. But, both Steve C & Roy E have very valid points as well. I'm sure you knew that you weren't going to end this debate - it'll never end!
Very true, John! My point of this was use what you want, there's no right or wrong. My layout is so small, I could use the old crappy trucks and it wouldn't make much of a difference. It's true, it will never end, but a good debate can be good conversation as well!
Even tho almost midnite I felt compelled to watch. I needed a laugh and you didn't disappoint me. But like you, I run both types of wheels. My opinion, both need cleaning, and yes ,plastic runs well. But since I don''t care for made up work, I run them as they come out of their case.
I have both plastic and metal wheels on my layout, the Micro-trains plastic wheels are excellent performers, there really is no need to change these out, unless you want more clickty clack noise on your trains!, with metal wheels they vary per brand, my favorites where the Fox Valley ones, unfortunately no longer made, the wheels on Trainworx and Bluford Shop, cars are excellent also. BLMA metal wheels have too much drag and do not roll that freely, I have had issues With some Intermountain wheels, being out of gauge or imperfect. The old Model Power Metal wheels were pretty bad, most of the cars would wobble down the track! I like the Micro-trains metal wheels, but they are hard to come by, the Micro-trains wheels used on the 60ft TBOX cars are really super. Just my two cents. I have been following N scale trains since the late 60’s and modeling since around 1984. N scale has come a long way. Enjoyed your video.
First of all new sub here, very nice channel. You are correct in saying do what you want. For me its price. While I like the sound of metal wheels, I just don't have the excess money to switch out a bunch of rolling stock. You can buy Micro Trains trucks that are brown that I think look nice. One thing about your test is that the older rolling stock with metal wheels probably needed to have the bearing journal cleaned a little bit. Thanks for sharing. Dave
You're probably right about that, Dave, plus the metal wheel trucks I have are really old - But it was just to show that I'm fine with the plastic wheelsets as well as metal, doesn't matter to me as long as they work.
Brian, I personally think you should’ve done this comparison in reverse LOL. Your findings make total sense. I’ve changed half of my rolling stock to steel wheels only because I’m probably watching to many videos LOL I just performed the Brian Page test and OMG plastic is smoother, quieter but I do like the sound of “Clickity-Clack, it puts me to sleep 😂😂. I too have about 6 pieces with the old style Bachman and Atlas couplers, they seem to stay together better. Is it me or is it true, they’re GOOD, look funny but they work. Maybe we can change everyone’s minds and go back to the “Good Old Days”. 👍🏻😂 I’ll admit, I do like the prototypical look of the newer style couplers buuut, I’m getting off of your subject of wheels, I think that’s what you were talking about 😱 I’m so confused LOLOLOL
Nothing to worry about, Ron, the message of my video is to use whatever you like - It's your stuff! I swapped out all my old square Rapido couplers because they don't link up to each other very well, and they look horrendous. But here again, I believe everyone should use what they like.
Great video! I have both metal and plastic wheels, and I am astonished, how good the plastic wheels are actually. I like the sound of the metal wheels though…
I had Repedio couplers but they are so old they snap off going around the track, pluse if you have a derailment I have found they will pop out of their socket.
Brian just ran across you video. While I see your point and definitely agree with you , I must admit that I change ti metal wheels on bot my n and ho scale cars , the weight is there fir but just not as much for n scale . I run on the museum it San Diego and we encourage metal wheels . It will tell you we also recommend to clean your wheels before running as this gets rid of the build up of crude and the cars run better . I was surprised at your test results and aminpressed with the results till I remembered that n scale has one problem as ti axal size some can differ by as much as .o5 of an inch. Which can slow a car or fit to losses ly making a difference too. Try your test again wit micro train trucks and metL wheels. Let me say again I agree with you point of view too. 😉
Hi Jack - I have no problem with that at all, and I still have some cars with metal wheels. My point was that everyone can do with their stuff what they want!
Metal wheels on metal rails are going to cause a small arch between the two - which would account for the accumulation of "dirt" which is actually a carbon build up. Even though the wheels are isolated so you don't short, you can still arch. Just a possible reason metal wheels could become 'dirtier' than plastic.
Wrong. For non-powered cars there can be no arc because there is no current between the wheels and rail. There can be no carbon because the wheel and rail both have no carbon. Do not speak from ignorance unless you want to out yourself as an idiot.
Brian all i can say to that Wig this my Brother I'm gonna bust a Something but We'll keep it Very Clean and Classy) Dude ya like an older Brother And i thank ya Much for the Shout Out ya Cool and hope to Meet ya someday soon or see that layout of yours Yea... don't Ditch the Wig. Its awesome...
Brian, very well thought out and presented. Here are a few additional comments/points. Noise: While the metal wheels "may" provide for more prototypical sound, the sound level is way higher than prototypical and the plastic wheels provide for a much lower sound level...a point many modelers prefer. Grime collection: Totally concur, metal wheels will also [pick ou crap, just look at locomotives and having to clean their wheels (even though alot of the loco grime is due to micro arching). BUT, metals wheels are much easier to clean and are not as susceptible to damage during cleaning. Friction/rolling. While your demo was a good idea, your methodology was somewhat flawed since you tested the friction/rollability of the entire truck assembly, NOT the true comparison between metal and plastic wheelsets. A better test is on a set decline, from a stop and lift a barrier and see how far the car travels once the decline levels off. Do this first with plastic wheels and then replace just the wheels (not the entire truck) with properly sized metal wheel sets. On my HO cars, without exception, the metal wheeled cars travel MUCH further than the cars did when they had plastic wheels. Now, again I am HO so the larger cars (heavier than N scale) makes the difference far more apparent. BUT, it really may not matter IF, the layout is flat, the trains being run are not excessively long. (btw, there is a tool that can be inserted into the truck pocket to reem the pocket out a little yo let the axles turn easier.....at least for HO. Weight difference: even in HO, the weight difference between plastic and metal wheels are negligible and the cars still need to be properly weighted in other methods. Like you, I have the same conclusion, not an advocating either of the other for other people....just simply attempting to provide facts so people can make their own determination of what is a good fit for themselves.
Agreed Steve, although my test wasn't strictly about the wheelsets, it was more about why I don't feel the need to change them. My metal wheelsets are so old it's no wonder they don't roll very well.
@@brianpagemodeltrains I whole heartedly agree under your circumstances where extra long trains are not run (and consists can cover for that anyway) nor are there any grades to deal with. I did want to point out the flawed "friction" test though ;)
Thanks for pointing that out Steve. The context of that demonstration was only to show that I don't need to run out to spend money, fixing something that already works. Again, my overall point was to use what you like.
You put on a great video on the wheels,and I agree ,they both have good and bad points, I do run plastic wheels ,keep of the great work and can’t wait for your nextvideo
Have you measured the size of the wheels? The overall length of the axles? The distance in between the flanges? This is what gets me so mad, HO has a tool to burnish the seats of the axle and N scale does not and we pop these wheel sets in and out without thinking of burrs, lengths and size of the wheels, flange, or even lenght.
To be honest, you used the old cheap metal wheels in a kadee truck and wondered why the plastic rolled further. Did you mike them?, the old metal wheels. when I converted to kadee years ago I found the old metal wheels where an issue with size in the truck. The new metal wheel sets are manufactured better now than the old metal wheels. Have you weighed the difference between the new metal wheels versus the new metal wheels, the old ones have plastic inserts. I pose a question to you , why did Kadee come out with metal replacement wheels, one answer is their metal wheels have plastic axels. So why run metal wheels. If you want operating signals each car has to have a resister so the detection can see the car clear the block so it can change the signal. I run both on my layout which has an upper and lower level.
Thanks for the comments, Will! Yes, my little experiment was skewed due to using very old Rapido trucks, and that would have been an issue had I been trying to say one is better than the other, but I didn't. Apparently, everyone missed what I said right before and right after the experiment. I clearly stated that it was only to show why I don't feel the need to swap out my plastic wheelsets, not to say one is better than the other. The entire point of the video was to use whatever you like the best.☺
@@brianpagemodeltrains did not want you to think I was bashing your video and your thoughts. Yes, I understand you were not taking a side. to me you guys on TH-cam spend a lot of time and money creating content for the hobby. There are a lot of new guys who if it is on the internet it is gospel. I was just saying the pit falls I went through. Keep 'm coming.🏁
Your metal wheelsets are all very old. Newer metal wheelsets are more accurately sized and shaped. Those old sets with thin metal skin around a plastic hub are worse than modern plastic wheelsets. Modern metal sets do weigh a little bit more, and when you are talking a total weight of 1oz, that small amount is significant. I've found that using MTL trucks with metal wheelsets designed to go in them. And I am able to run at least 10% more cars (same cars only difference is metal vs plastic) with a single loco. Metal wheelsets are always isolated, shorts are not really an issue. You really should get some decent modern metal wheelsets to try in your MTL trucks (just get one pack and try it).
If I did that same test with two identical cars but using good new metal wheelsets, the metal one would go much farther than the plastic. Your old sets are crap, that's why they roll badly.
Thanks Roy! I realize that my old trucks are crappy, that's why I pointed that out. My point of the whole thing was use what you want because there's no right or wrong to it. As to some of the things I talked about, I don't necessarily agree or disagree, I just mentioned things I've heard or seen from other people. I'm only saying I don't feel the need to spend money to swap out the plastic.
@@brianpagemodeltrains I understand, but I think it would have been a better comparison with actual good metal wheels. Maybe I'll jump on the bandwagon and do a video too. :)
Ooh, I almost missed this one. I cannot wait to hear your thoughts on these. Damn, you really through down on this one. I hope you have your flame suit on. Wait, you bailed out at the end and did not come to a conclusion? My 2 cents, I think the Micro-Trains wheelsets use better plastic wheels than the cheap plastic wheels on HO scale. I think the metal wheels is an HO scale thing from when there really was a difference.
wig? I thought I was going to have to put in a copy rite claim against you,, lol with HO scale the metal wheels are just the thing to do, everyone else does it so I have to do the same?
First off, I need to say that 90% of my freight cars are equipped with Micro Trains trucks and couplers. But, I have some old, ('69 and '70's) MRC freight cars, with factory trucks with metal wheelsets, and they are by far, the best rolling freight cars I own. I've had 'em for over 50 years, cleaned the wheels once, and they're still running perfectly. never derail, and stay clean. I wish all my freight cars ran as well. Almost every time I see MRC freight cars come up for sale, I buy 'em up, and they all perform the same. I've never regretted the decision to pick up more. Thanks for your observations and opinions. I agree with you 100%.
Yes, whatever works best for you, I say stick with it!
Brian, I completely concur with your assessment of plastic vs, metal wheelsets. I have over 200 freight cars, and I'm about 2/3 done with the conversion process. I've found, my locomotives, after conversion, can pull over 20% more freight cars, starting with the same consist, than they were able to prior to the conversion to MT trucks and couplers. Just a little more validation to your conclusions. The only way to eliminate 'cruddy' wheels, is to invent, and run, Maglev trains !
Yeah, I caught a lot of flak on this one, which I knew I would. But the point was, use whatever you want!
@@brianpagemodeltrains absotively, posilutely !
I hope this post ends up on here because my last post went to Nederland for right now. I agree with you 💯% that it is a personal preference and I'm glad that you don't care either way. This means to me we can spend more on layout which makes me happy. I'm more about the fun of the hobby than the realism. Like always loved your video and I got a really good laugh with your intro. Again I say remember it's a personal preference! Great job on the video and I love you 💕
Thanks sweetie! That's what it's all about, use what works best for you!
@@brianpagemodeltrains Get a room you two!!
Heath, get out of our room!!
C'mon Brian, I was just taking a slurp of tea when you showed up like that, nearly came out of my nose LOL.
Over this side of the pond in N & HO gauge we tend to go for metal wheels. They seem run more freely, tend to stay clean longer than plastic although all wheels as you said will pick up dirt, and they clean up easier. All our locomotives and rolling stock tend to be metal wheel. Some company's who put out kits you put together tend to come with plastic wheels but only I think to keep the cost down. We then simply change them to metal.
Our goods wagons or as you call them freight cars in the period I cover 1950's are so small and light I have to put weights in them so they can at least have half a chance of staying on the track.
As my layout is in the loft and we do get extreme temperature variations up there I have to put expansion gaps between track sections to allow for the track to stretch or shrink. Oh I have had some disasters when I did not allow for this. I have a gap of 1mm between each track section and believe me you can hear the clickety-clack as the train runs along, its lovely, brings back fond memories when us poor could afford to travel by rail.
Now regarding the cocktail stick test, that might just be down to the coning of the axles. I have not tried these yet as all my stuff is fairly new but I have heard good things about Bearing Reamers which they make for us N Gaugers.
They smooth out the imperfections in the coning of the axle bearings. Mate of mine has purchased them and he can now pull a third more in stock after using the Bearing Reamer as it has cut down on the friction and the wheels run better. Also they work with metal and plastic wheels so I am told.
To be honest I dont swap mine out either, I leave whatever wheels are on there when I purchase them, unless I start to have issues.
If it works dont fiddle with it.
Regards Chris
Lol - Good thing it wasn't soda! I agree with your comments completely, my point was use whatever you like.
Great comparison Brian. Now you have me thinking my decision to stay away from plastic wheels. This will keep me up tonight. Thanks lol. Sean.
Sorry Sean - LOL! No, the point is to use whatever you are most comfortable with.
I am very fond of Micro-Trains plastic wheels. They sound is quiet, but they run soo smooth.
I agree, but I also have metal wheels, so it's whatever you like!
Good video, but I found the comparison of 40 year old vs new trucks and wheels to be pretty strange. Yes the weight difference is small, but in some cases might be all that is needed to bring a car to proper weight. Another unmentioned advantage is on light cars, metal wheels will lower the center of gravity to help tracking etc… modern metal wheels aren’t usually as wide or have that big a flange as those you have. If you put a modern blma, fox valley, tangent or such wheelset in the same micro trains trucks, my experience is they will out roll plastic every time with an even lower amount of friction and personally I find they stay cleaner. To each his own. Very entertaining and I look forward to seeing your next video my friend.
Thanks! Yes, it was a "strange" comparison, but as I said before and after, it was only to show why I don't feel the need to swap out my plastic wheels. Thanks for watching!
I think you said it all. Thanks for sharing, David
Thanks for watching, F & B!
Hi Brian! Thanks for your assessment of plastic vs. metal wheels. As you may know, I switching from plastic to metal wheels on my layout, but I still have both on my layout, and both work very well. I think good trackwork and the overall weight of the cars is more important. Bottom line (as you noted) is this: Like just about everything in model railroading, whether you use plastic or metal wheels on your layout comes down to a matter of personal preference. ...Roy
Precisely Roy, thank you! That was the message of the video.
Brilliant discussed and demonstrated. Excellent video and well presented! Nice job. I never worried about it in HO.
Thanks Anthony! That was my point, if the wheels work ok, use what you want.
Interesting observations Brian. There are pros/cons for both options. I fully agree with your conclusion - do what you like with your railroad. But, both Steve C & Roy E have very valid points as well. I'm sure you knew that you weren't going to end this debate - it'll never end!
Very true, John! My point of this was use what you want, there's no right or wrong. My layout is so small, I could use the old crappy trucks and it wouldn't make much of a difference. It's true, it will never end, but a good debate can be good conversation as well!
Even tho almost midnite I felt compelled to watch. I needed a laugh and you didn't disappoint me. But like you, I run both types of wheels. My opinion, both need cleaning, and yes ,plastic runs well. But since I don''t care for made up work, I run them as they come out of their case.
Thanks Melvin! Yeah, I'm a big supporter of doing what you want with your own stuff!
I have both plastic and metal wheels on my layout, the Micro-trains plastic wheels are excellent performers, there really is no need to change these out, unless you want more clickty clack noise on your trains!, with metal wheels they vary per brand, my favorites where the Fox Valley ones, unfortunately no longer made, the wheels on Trainworx and Bluford Shop, cars are excellent also. BLMA metal wheels have too much drag and do not roll that freely, I have had issues With some Intermountain wheels, being out of gauge or imperfect. The old Model Power Metal wheels were pretty bad, most of the cars would wobble down the track! I like the Micro-trains metal wheels, but they are hard to come by, the Micro-trains wheels used on the 60ft TBOX cars are really super. Just my two cents. I have been following N scale trains since the late 60’s and modeling since around 1984. N scale has come a long way. Enjoyed your video.
I agree = The only reason I bought all the MT trucks was to easily get rid of all my old Rapido couplers.
First of all new sub here, very nice channel. You are correct in saying do what you want. For me its price. While I like the sound of metal wheels, I just don't have the excess money to switch out a bunch of rolling stock. You can buy Micro Trains trucks that are brown that I think look nice. One thing about your test is that the older rolling stock with metal wheels probably needed to have the bearing journal cleaned a little bit. Thanks for sharing. Dave
You're probably right about that, Dave, plus the metal wheel trucks I have are really old - But it was just to show that I'm fine with the plastic wheelsets as well as metal, doesn't matter to me as long as they work.
Good informative video. Melvin and Steve post are informative as well 👍
Thanks CDP!
Brian, I personally think you should’ve done this comparison in reverse LOL.
Your findings make total sense.
I’ve changed half of my rolling stock to steel wheels only because I’m probably watching to many videos LOL
I just performed the Brian Page test and OMG plastic is smoother, quieter but I do like the sound of “Clickity-Clack, it puts me to sleep 😂😂.
I too have about 6 pieces with the old style Bachman and Atlas couplers, they seem to stay together better. Is it me or is it true, they’re GOOD, look funny but they work.
Maybe we can change everyone’s minds and go back to the “Good Old Days”. 👍🏻😂
I’ll admit, I do like the prototypical look of the newer style couplers buuut, I’m getting off of your subject of wheels, I think that’s what you were talking about 😱 I’m so confused LOLOLOL
Nothing to worry about, Ron, the message of my video is to use whatever you like - It's your stuff! I swapped out all my old square Rapido couplers because they don't link up to each other very well, and they look horrendous. But here again, I believe everyone should use what they like.
Brian, your videos never disappoint. I love the way you did this and even in HO, I have to agree. Use what you want and can afford, thats it
That's right, Ray Thanks!
Yep, that's a good conclusion.
Yeah, my whole point was use whatever you like!
I also have no preference. Great video. Im gonna read all these comments.. i can already see people tossing there chairs across the room. LOL
You got that right, Rick!
Great video! I have both metal and plastic wheels, and I am astonished, how good the plastic wheels are actually. I like the sound of the metal wheels though…
True! The metal wheels make a nice realistic sound. Go with what works for you!
I had Repedio couplers but they are so old they snap off going around the track, pluse if you have a derailment I have found they will pop out of their socket.
Yeah, I got rid of mine not only because of those issues, but also because I didn't like the looks.
Brian just ran across you video. While I see your point and definitely agree with you , I must admit that I change ti metal wheels on bot my n and ho scale cars , the weight is there fir but just not as much for n scale . I run on the museum it San Diego and we encourage metal wheels . It will tell you we also recommend to clean your wheels before running as this gets rid of the build up of crude and the cars run better . I was surprised at your test results and aminpressed with the results till I remembered that n scale has one problem as ti axal size some can differ by as much as .o5 of an inch. Which can slow a car or fit to losses ly making a difference too. Try your test again wit micro train trucks and metL wheels. Let me say again I agree with you point of view too. 😉
Hi Jack - I have no problem with that at all, and I still have some cars with metal wheels. My point was that everyone can do with their stuff what they want!
@@brianpagemodeltrains you are so right !
Metal wheels on metal rails are going to cause a small arch between the two - which would account for the accumulation of "dirt" which is actually a carbon build up. Even though the wheels are isolated so you don't short, you can still arch. Just a possible reason metal wheels could become 'dirtier' than plastic.
Very true, but I don't actually know if either gets dirtier than the other - I guess time will tell. Thanks!
Wrong. For non-powered cars there can be no arc because there is no current between the wheels and rail. There can be no carbon because the wheel and rail both have no carbon. Do not speak from ignorance unless you want to out yourself as an idiot.
Good video like and subscribed from Czech Republic 🙂👍👍👍
Thanks for subscribing and watching! It's great knowing the model train community is all around the world.
@@brianpagemodeltrains you're welcome 🙂
Brian all i can say to that Wig this my Brother I'm gonna bust a Something but We'll keep it Very Clean and Classy) Dude ya like an older Brother And i thank ya Much for the Shout Out ya Cool and hope to Meet ya someday soon or see that layout of yours Yea... don't Ditch the Wig. Its awesome...
Thanks for the idea, Allen, and hopefully we'll get some more people to check out your videos out of curiosity!
Brian, very well thought out and presented. Here are a few additional comments/points.
Noise: While the metal wheels "may" provide for more prototypical sound, the sound level is way higher than prototypical and the plastic wheels provide for a much lower sound level...a point many modelers prefer.
Grime collection: Totally concur, metal wheels will also [pick ou crap, just look at locomotives and having to clean their wheels (even though alot of the loco grime is due to micro arching). BUT, metals wheels are much easier to clean and are not as susceptible to damage during cleaning.
Friction/rolling. While your demo was a good idea, your methodology was somewhat flawed since you tested the friction/rollability of the entire truck assembly, NOT the true comparison between metal and plastic wheelsets. A better test is on a set decline, from a stop and lift a barrier and see how far the car travels once the decline levels off. Do this first with plastic wheels and then replace just the wheels (not the entire truck) with properly sized metal wheel sets. On my HO cars, without exception, the metal wheeled cars travel MUCH further than the cars did when they had plastic wheels. Now, again I am HO so the larger cars (heavier than N scale) makes the difference far more apparent. BUT, it really may not matter IF, the layout is flat, the trains being run are not excessively long. (btw, there is a tool that can be inserted into the truck pocket to reem the pocket out a little yo let the axles turn easier.....at least for HO.
Weight difference: even in HO, the weight difference between plastic and metal wheels are negligible and the cars still need to be properly weighted in other methods.
Like you, I have the same conclusion, not an advocating either of the other for other people....just simply attempting to provide facts so people can make their own determination of what is a good fit for themselves.
Agreed Steve, although my test wasn't strictly about the wheelsets, it was more about why I don't feel the need to change them. My metal wheelsets are so old it's no wonder they don't roll very well.
@@brianpagemodeltrains I whole heartedly agree under your circumstances where extra long trains are not run (and consists can cover for that anyway) nor are there any grades to deal with. I did want to point out the flawed "friction" test though ;)
Thanks for pointing that out Steve. The context of that demonstration was only to show that I don't need to run out to spend money, fixing something that already works. Again, my overall point was to use what you like.
You put on a great video on the wheels,and I agree ,they both have good and bad points, I do run plastic wheels ,keep of the great work and can’t wait for your nextvideo
Thanks, Stanley!
Great video! new to the hobby and this info is great!
New sub from Stockholm Sweden
/Victor
Thanks and welcome aboard, Victor! It's always great to have folks in the hobby from around the world!
I have a Combo of Metal and Plastic on my Rolling Stock Eventually I may Change From Plastic to Metal.
Very cool - Thanks for watching!
Have you measured the size of the wheels? The overall length of the axles? The distance in between the flanges?
This is what gets me so mad, HO has a tool to burnish the seats of the axle and N scale does not and we pop these wheel sets in and out without thinking of burrs, lengths and size of the wheels, flange, or even lenght.
I can only speak to the plastic wheelsets I have, and they are smooth and fit my Kato track very well.
@@brianpagemodeltrains I have found the overall length of the axles can put a bind on the trucks pockets.
Found through the many years of N scaling,some metal wheelset/truck combinations, Kato for instance, roll far easier,than MT trucks
Yeah, I don't have any newer metal wheelsets, so mine are not so good. Thanks Dave!
To be honest, you used the old cheap metal wheels in a kadee truck and wondered why the plastic rolled further. Did you mike them?, the old metal wheels. when I converted to kadee years ago I found the old metal wheels where an issue with size in the truck. The new metal wheel sets are manufactured better now than the old metal wheels. Have you weighed the difference between the new metal wheels versus the new metal wheels, the old ones have plastic inserts. I pose a question to you , why did Kadee come out with metal replacement wheels, one answer is their metal wheels have plastic axels. So why run metal wheels. If you want operating signals each car has to have a resister so the detection can see the car clear the block so it can change the signal. I run both on my layout which has an upper and lower level.
Thanks for the comments, Will! Yes, my little experiment was skewed due to using very old Rapido trucks, and that would have been an issue had I been trying to say one is better than the other, but I didn't. Apparently, everyone missed what I said right before and right after the experiment. I clearly stated that it was only to show why I don't feel the need to swap out my plastic wheelsets, not to say one is better than the other. The entire point of the video was to use whatever you like the best.☺
@@brianpagemodeltrains did not want you to think I was bashing your video and your thoughts. Yes, I understand you were not taking a side. to me you guys on TH-cam spend a lot of time and money creating content for the hobby. There are a lot of new guys who if it is on the internet it is gospel. I was just saying the pit falls I went through. Keep 'm coming.🏁
@@wilzdart - It's all good, Will - Thanks!
Your metal wheelsets are all very old. Newer metal wheelsets are more accurately sized and shaped. Those old sets with thin metal skin around a plastic hub are worse than modern plastic wheelsets. Modern metal sets do weigh a little bit more, and when you are talking a total weight of 1oz, that small amount is significant. I've found that using MTL trucks with metal wheelsets designed to go in them. And I am able to run at least 10% more cars (same cars only difference is metal vs plastic) with a single loco. Metal wheelsets are always isolated, shorts are not really an issue. You really should get some decent modern metal wheelsets to try in your MTL trucks (just get one pack and try it).
If I did that same test with two identical cars but using good new metal wheelsets, the metal one would go much farther than the plastic. Your old sets are crap, that's why they roll badly.
Thanks Roy! I realize that my old trucks are crappy, that's why I pointed that out. My point of the whole thing was use what you want because there's no right or wrong to it. As to some of the things I talked about, I don't necessarily agree or disagree, I just mentioned things I've heard or seen from other people. I'm only saying I don't feel the need to spend money to swap out the plastic.
@@brianpagemodeltrains I understand, but I think it would have been a better comparison with actual good metal wheels. Maybe I'll jump on the bandwagon and do a video too. :)
@@RoyEltham - You should make one, Roy! The comparison in my case wasn't the point, my point was use what you want.
Which metal wheelsets?
Ooh, I almost missed this one. I cannot wait to hear your thoughts on these.
Damn, you really through down on this one. I hope you have your flame suit on.
Wait, you bailed out at the end and did not come to a conclusion?
My 2 cents, I think the Micro-Trains wheelsets use better plastic wheels than the cheap plastic wheels on HO scale. I think the metal wheels is an HO scale thing from when there really was a difference.
Yep, Heath, I just talked about things I've heard other people saying, and my point was to use whatever you like!
wig? I thought I was going to have to put in a copy rite claim against you,, lol
with HO scale the metal wheels are just the thing to do, everyone else does it so I have to do the same?
I kept the wig part short so I wouldn't infringe on you, Sparky! No, use whatever works for you!
ok plastic vs metal vs to brian vs to who knows 😀
Exactly, Dwight - Thanks for watching!
good vid
Thanks, Lee!
I think maybe your stick is out of calibration.
LOL - Thanks Steven, you're probably right!