My Rockwool vs Fiberglass video made NAIMA mad
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 13 มิ.ย. 2024
- I got a letter from the Executive Vice President and General Counsel of NAIMA which is the North American Insulation Manufacturers Association. They represent manufacturers of fiberglass, rock wool and slag wool insulation products. They asked me to correct my Fiberglass versus Mineral wool/Rockwool video. Here you go..
Link to my Patreon page: / belinda_carr
Chapters
0:00 Introduction
1:04 Face protection required
3:02 Respiratory issues
4:32 Slag wool vs rock wool
6:20 Environmentally friendly claims
7:41 Conclusion
First off, I said that respiratory protection like a face mask is required when working with both fiberglass and rockwool, which apparently isn’t true. It is recommended to wear a mask when you’re exposed to a space with more than one fiber per cubic centimeter over an 8 hour time period which rarely ever happens. The few instances where you’d need an N95 respirator are when you’re blowing loose fill insulation in an attic or wall cavities, when you’re dumping or pouring unbonded, bulk or speciality fiber products and during insulation removal, repair or demolition.
However, lab tests are one thing, reality is another, right? I ran a poll on my TH-cam community page about this issue. 82% of people said that they always cover up when handling fiberglass and 12% have never had any issues. Most people said that they get itchy throats and red bumps on their skin, like I do, if they don’t wear a mask and long sleeves. One person said foil faced hullboard is the worst and itchiest fiberglass product he’s had to deal with. Another person said that pink batts used to feel much worse a few decades ago, it’s much softer now. That’s an interesting point, l wonder if the product has improved thanks to research and testing, but since its appearance has stayed the same, its reputation hasn't changed.
Next, I said that inhaling fibers can cause respiratory issues. In 1987 the International Agency for Research on Cancer or IARC identified glass, stone and slag wool as possible carcinogens or cancer-causing products. A cancer warning label had to be placed on all glass wool products. However, in 2001, after extensive research, they determined that glass fibers are not toxic and they do not increase the risk of lung cancer or mesothelioma. Unlike asbestos, which has a crystalline molecular structure, glass fibers are amorphous and dissolvable. Also, fiberglass manufacturers have replaced formaldehyde binders with a starch-based binder. Just like the previous point, fiberglass can’t shake off it’s reputation from 30 years ago. It’s great to know that it isn’t toxic and that it’s biosoluble, but I will still wear a mask to prevent the itchiness in the back of my throat, even if it is temporary.
NAIMA’s third issue is that I said slag wool is inferior to rock wool. They think that is a flat and unsubstantiated claim, which is false and misleading because there is no basis for the comparison. Ok, there are a couple of reasons why I said that; first, logical reasoning. Before the recent spike in prices, Thermafiber which contains 80-100% recycled slag and minimal basalt costs $2.6 per batt. Safe and sound which is mainly made of basalt rock, cost $4.6 per batt. During my call with the slag wool manufacturer, they couldn’t give me a reason for that significant price difference, it’s almost 50% cheaper. I’ve also found that slag wool disintegrates more easily than rock wool.
The second reason is this research I found online on the high acidity coefficient of slag wool compared to rockwool. The research found that slag wool is aging intolerant, its pH is higher than that of rockwool and its water resistance can only be moderately stable or unstable. They also discuss thermal conductivity performance, sulfur content and corrosion resistance. How can the ingredients be so different, but the end products and performance are the same?
www.insulationecoin.com/diffe...
They say that no insulation product can claim to be “environmentally friendly” because it suggests that the production has no impact on the environment. If we go by this Federal Trade Commision of FTC definition, there is nothing in the world that is green or environmentally friendly. Every single product has an impact on the environment but, we can quantify the impact through embodied carbon or embodied energy. This letter says that all insulation product manufacturers collect and process raw materials and create the end product with a process that requires energy of some sort. This is not exclusive to insulation. Also, if that’s the case, why do you claim that your role is to promote energy efficiency and environmental preservation through the use of glass, rock and slag wool insulation? Isn’t the term environmental preservation just as taboo as environmentally friendly?
#rockwool #fiberglass #mineralwool #insulation #construction #architecture #design #airtight - วิทยาศาสตร์และเทคโนโลยี
I got to use the timeless John Malkovich clip again!
Love watching your channel! Keep us the good work.
The Coen bro’s can do no wrong. That film was part of their idiot trilogy apparently. Twas wonderful.
Brilliant analysis and very thoughtful response to the letter.
It was priceless and so perfectly describes the emotion generated by their statement. Your videos on this topic are excellent. I like that they also give their point of view.
This video exemplifies why I SO enjoy your channel. Well done.
NAIMA employee: Hey should we reach out to Belinda and share the improved characteristics of our new product line? You know, we could invite her to one of our factories, make a day of it? Maybe develop a partnership and sponsor some of her videos?
NAIMA boss: No, send her a threatening snotty legal letter. That will surely improve our market reputation.
I tell you some corporations are retarded. They could have made a small fortune being good to her
Hahahahaha! Well said.
Not even that happened and we all know it.
We have all worked in places where the boss came in, Monday morning, with a video or a post he saw and said to the girl (or guy) working as his secretary: Write an angry letter to her saying this this and this and attach the seven pages we use in our retailer's info page.
And here comes the good part.
You see, we snatched that 7 pages info from some conference the boss went at, last December. Credibility of said content is unknown but oh well, who cares, someone else claimed it so we call it official long enough to BELIEVE it is. Research paper is never credited in the conference. At best it was snatched from some webpage of a somewhat credible manufacturer, (so this is all written by his underpaid marketing person writing an article to boost engagement really) or, worse, taken form a website CLAIMING to be the "North American research facility for this and that subject".
Most times, this "reasearch facilty" is the same underpaid marketing person in the previously mentioned company making fake sites to boost engagement and credibility. Because fake sites cost less than research.
Source for this story: I am a developer. I have made a lot of them fake sites, I know, trust me (you can find me on Linkedin too, you see, I use my real name in here as well as there).
Oh, also, on the boss man coming Monday morning with ideas, well.. he is the only one caring to spend his night watching some video on this, I will not spend my evening on the same thing I am making 8h per day. He is the capitalist making more money, I am the overworked worker, fuck that, I am watching Squid game.
@@KostasTsakalidis - Wow thats mad. Have you any examples of the fake sites? Mad curious!
She said it wasn't snotty at all.
Naima: Lets set this little girl straight and scare her into changing what she said.
Belinda: Hold my beer!
I like my sour beers...:)
Belinda : hold my gloves
@@BelindaCarr hi Belinda, do you think you will be able to test spray foam insulation as well? Especially comparing it the older forms of insulation?
P.S Love your work keep it up
I would love to see any building , built after Belinda Project . Doubt that there are any :))
Love your work, love that you can take constructive feedback, love that you don't take bullying and bull shit!!
This isn't even a topic I'm interested in, but it's honestly just relaxing to watch someone make calm, rational arguments for 10 minutes. It's basically nothing like dealing with the general public day to day on any subject at all.
Same
Same. I am in my premed but I'm actually looking at the Engineering department now
Same here, she is a kind, calm, honest researcher. She does not disreguard science on the field, but notes when someone is cutting some corners in their statements, like this video, where really, the research says it is safe and she recognizes it, but also notes that we are talking for newer products, and there is a lot of people who will fix an older attic or tear down some old material and install the new..
True😞
Yea... I design speakers since 10years as a hobby and evem know some actual speaker driver makers and what i have to deal with some ppl when i talk to em about that. They always act like they know a lot while they say shit that makes no actual sense. Drives me NUTS!
Your statement #1 was totally right. You said to wear a mask when "working with" those insulations. And that could involve both installations OR removals. Even if a new installation is cleaner and safer, ripping out old materials is not. It can be quite messy with lots of particles floating around in the air. So be smart and just wear the N95. +1 for you!
Statement #2 was true as well. Just because the latest formulations are now safer, that doesn't change the fact the older ones were unsafe. And once again, people may be exposed from methods other than new installs. I have an old knee wall crawl space with old fiber glass all through it. I have no idea how old that material is. So logically, I should assume it's older and unsafe for inhalation. You're trying to keep us safe. NAIMA is just trying to sell product.
Yep, I don't want to have "acceptable levels" of glass shards in my lungs, I'd rather prefer to have none. There are limits on lead exposure, doesn't mean I shouldn't reduce my exposure when reasonable to do so even if I'm under that limit.
@@invertexyz My thought as well, also one fibre per CC of air with 8 hours of exposure is a pretty low bar to set.
@@invertexyz I have no real knowledge to the subject, I am indead a developer and by no means have credible experience in the matter.
I would however like to note here that
a) the levels are set by scientists, and even though these days science results often "bought" or "cooked" to suit the needs of the company funding the research, atleast to some extent NO research should be discarded due to personal disbelief. You can be sceptical of it. But we can't disprove it because we are not scientists on the subject so accepting the existing science is better.
b) I 100% agree with you and the channel, and I would use protective measures, but as an extra measure to prevent discomfort, not because I am scared of the thing killing or even harming me. I am talking about new products here, not taking down some old one, that can be a whole different beast.
c) "Acceptable levels" means that the research we have SO FAR, says it is not more harmful to your lungs than say breathing air that is polluted due to cars in the city or say working in a workshop and breathing the fumes or other things people do for a living.
AGAIN, I would like to repeat that I am not a credible source for this, BUT I did some research about the specifics of this previous statement before typing it and the mortality rate.
I would note that I can easily have been mislead, I can't easily distinguish a credible source on the subject obviously but that is pointed out for the third time in this same comment..
@@KostasTsakalidis I wasn't implying it would kill me or seriously affect me, but at the end of the day, I want to reduce potential damage done to my body, even if it's an acceptable level. We have acceptable levels of lead and mercury too, but in general any amount is still toxic to us and our bodies will be better off not having to deal with it. Our cells can only multiply so many times before the telomeres are gone and our DNA degrades.
Acceptable does not mean "no harm at all", it just means a statistically low enough chance that it is worth approving.
Research on this kind of stuff also isn't perfect and is usually funded by the same industry that will benefit from it. The long-term studies of insulation workers have shown decreased lung function indicative of lung damage. pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/8457492/
Glass fibers also vary in size and may become engulfed in scar-tissue in the lungs, escaping the breakdown process and creating permanent damage.
So again, this just doesn't seem like a reasonable thing to put faith in when all you have to do is wear a mask. Our bodies did not evolve to inhale and break down glass shards.
(And believe me I am far from anti-science. The mRNA vaccines for example are an amazing piece of tech that I wish more people trusted and understood properly, they are the culmination of over 30 years of global research and development)
@@invertexyz As far as I'm concerned, there are NO 'acceptable' levels of any solids for my lungs.
NAIMA trying to tell people you don't need to wear a mask(but they recommend it) could have serious problems for homeowners working with their 30-40 year old fiberglass batts. The newest product may have improved, but the stuff in my attic hasn't.
I am very inspired by your well thought out content, Belinda, stay strong.
Very good point
My thoughts exactly! Can't wave a wand and fix old insulation like that, haha.
My house was built in 1960. You bet your ass I'm wearing a respirator when messing with my insulation.
Reminds of the tobacco companies saying, "Smoking is Safe!" Anything that produces dust while you work with it would be 'harmful' to some degree. I always wear a mask/resperator whichever is appropriate when working with materials.
@@mechanoid5739 oh definitely! Anything involving high particles concentration in the air is harmful for the lungs. This includes pottery (silica dust), cooking (oil fumes), pharmacy (powdered chemicals), etc. Good idea to always use a respirator/mask or have a good ventilation system when working in these conditions
"And naturally I went through it all", you are one of us!
Spoken like every engineering or material science geek _ever_ !
Yes, Belinda is one of _us_ , and that's why I love her channel. 😉
👍😊
NAIMA's heavy handed response actually makes me question if their overreaction was due to companies' fear that something negative might come out about their products and this is a knee-jerk reaction to that. There's nothing wrong with wearing a respirator when working with small particles, fibers or otherwise, so what are they frightened of?
same thoughts, makes me wonder if they have some tobacco company style studies showing it isn't safe or something that they buried.
Breathing in sharp glass fibers into your lungs is probably not ideal... I'd like to see the owners of that company forced to be exposed to their "safe" product 40hrs a week. Maybe their tone towards PPE might change.
"you do not need a mask when handling GLASS FIBERS" yeah, ok.
be wary of anyone recommending you not to be cautious
"You don't have to wear a mask, but we highly recommend it."
Maybe Dr. Fauci is the one directing the recommendations on wearing masks for insulation exposure, hahaha
they're trying to straddle the line between "it's safe to use" and "it might harm you". if you tell people they must wear a mask, you will be admitting that your product is unsafe. if you don't recommend a mask, they will get trounced by lawsuits in the future because there is probably still some minor danger. for example, the glass may dissolve and not damage DNA like asbestos, but repeated exposure probably does increase your risk of cancer slightly, just because of the repeated minor/temporary damage
Would be interesting to see how they setup their study for determining the recommended levels to wear a mask.
For example… if working in a room that’s 16’x20’x10’, that’s 3200 cu ft or 90,613,909 cu cm. So I could imagine having fiber levels >~90.6m is unlikely.
But a person is not breathing the clean air from the opposite side of the space, so I’d be more concerned with the fiber levels in that immediate couple cu ft around you that you’re actually breathing from.
Asbestos wasn’t bad either
@@jeremyr942 Asbestos is bad... Not as bad as most folks think though. That's the problem. Most people don't seem to be able to comprehend anything other than "it will kill you dead" and "it is perfectly safe" -_-
Real world is shades of grey
The fact that you publicly acknowledge feedback and accept corrections is a credit to your integrity and makes your videos even more credible
Probably 15 years ago, when I was in my late teens/early 20s, I installed faced fiberglass bats in the walls of a large upstairs room for my employer. It wasn't a lot of insulation and didn't wear a mask because of how hot it was. For a week or two afterwards my chest felt heavy, like it was full mucus, but when I would cough nothing would come out. Fortunately, it cleared up. three years ago, I installed un-faced fiberglass roll insulation in the crawl space attic of a house I recently bought. Not wanting to make the same mistake, I wore a P95 painting respirator that I had. By the time I was done the filters were so clogged that breathing was becoming difficult. I could literally see the glass fibers floating in the air in front of the work lights and my glasses were covered in them. It can't be good to inhale that much of that stuff.
That's how I always feel!! Even if someone tells you that its "ok to breath" Why would I? Ive seen similar situations where my filter got clogged. And I'm always like why wasn't there a warning about wearing a mask? Like I cant imagine actually breathing that stuff into my lungs.
@@trippg3261 Same. I don't care what they say I always wear a respirator in any attic now or I pay for weeks.
FDA says our food is safe to eat, does anyone actually believe that?😂 Same situation different products
Kudos to NAIMA for passing along the current information. Bigger Kudos to you, Belinda, for increasing your knowledge and addressing what we all need to know. I agree that the "big boys" in the industry got their knickers in a twist and wanted to slap you down a bit, but they failed. Watch out for yourself, and us, as you continue this EXCELLENT channel!
Thanks, Mark!
Let's hear it for twisted knickers. Yaaaaaaaaay!
100 on both points, Mark.
NAIMA were respectful, I think, and Belinda was humble enough to suggest that she learned something from the letter
shill.
You've got to be kidding, right? The only person that is likely to say your first sentence with a straight face is someone associated with the industry.
Wow! You got under their skin...ironically?! Their response is actually a good thing. It tells you that you are being seen AND taken seriously as an emerging voice. As long as your content is well researched and honest, nothing to worry about. Keep it up!
Thanks, Russel!
I think Naima is engaging in product defense industry practices. Many manufacturers have a legal and PR team dedicated for just that; they work by shutting down any criticism with vague statements, criticize and smear their skeptics, and cover up or silence everyone else.
that democrap for ya
@@valkyviktor3228 what does that word mean
@@roidroid democracy crap
@@roidroid democracy + crap
Wow, what an impressive, carefully organized video, using research but also real world feedback. I can't imagine NOT using skin and lung protection when using these products for insulation in a boiling hot attic.
That last comment from the industry "there are NO environmentally friendly products..." sounds like my former coworker who drove an SUV to work every day from the burbs, and snidely remarked that my bicycle used energy to produce.
From an industry that sells energy saving products...
My father was like that. Those people are deranged and completely devoid of self-awareness. I can't say for all other humans like that, but my father was a complete waste of space. Foolish, rich men know nothing.
And fwiw he didn't feed me. I ate trash and instant ramen when it was his responsibility to feed me.
@@grassgeese3916 is... is everything okay there? Is there something you wanna share to us?
There is not a thing soft about you in this video. This is 100% serious business. Great job.
Dear Belinda, You are my Hero. I can not even begin to describe my admiration for you. You express the desire to share information based on the available information known to an industry. You research your base of information with a desire of finding what is true and you are willing to acknowledge when others disagree with you. Thank you so much for all you provide and I want to know how your house project is progressing. Best of luck to you and your family.
As a Building Inspection Technology student, and former builder/remodeling contractor, I find your calm rational approach refreshing. I nominate you for building materials investigations chief.
As the poll indicated, I'm going to call bs on the no respirator. I installed batt rockwool in a 1500 sqft home walls. The first day I did the entire first floor and did not wear any protection. That night and the next day I woke a scratchy throat. A week later I returned to finish the project after my throat was all healed. This time a wore an n95 and had no issues what so ever.
Yep. You learn quickly to always wear a mask, gloves and long sleeve shirts. It may not be mandatory but if you ask me it's absolutely necessary.
Should really switch to a 100 designation mask a p100 should be better for that man
@@strange-universe,But she told me she could not have kids?LOL
I work in a factory that manufactures it and I've only found people on the oven side of the manufacturing process require that kind of PPE
Haha, when the big dogs get their feathers ruffled, you know that you're doing the right the thing! Keep it going, I enjoy your informative videos.
Big dogs getting their feathers ruffled....
Was that an animal in Harry Potter😁😁
I LOVE how fact-based, scientific, and practical you are!!!!!!
Excellent video! Glad I found you!
While fiberglass & rockwool insulation types may not contain carcinogens, breathing in glass or stone fibers CAN cause silicosis. I wouldn't want to breathe in ANY glass or rock fibers!
The FTC does go overboard on some labeling (yet not nearly far enough on others)and sadly to the point that many, I'd be willing to say most end-users, simply ignore their labeling for the most part, if not entirely.
You are refreshingly honest and thorough in all of your videos. As a physician, I trust your opinion far more than any corporation.
Thank You for all your help!!!
Thanks, David!
Ideally, you wouldn't trust anyone's opinion, whether a person or a corporation. Better to go with the evidence than someone's opinion. That is what made this channel good.
In the testing business, someone is going to be upset with your results. It happens, but you handled this like a professional. Well done!
You brought up an excellent point...testing can upset manufacturers...thanks!
Unless they are sponsoring your content, they don't have much say in the matter!
Just trying to scare you into a correction without having to go through 'too much' effort themselves (ie frivolous lawsuit)
What testing was done here??? All we saw was some inslation being fit into some panels and some fabric stapled over the top and some prices run through a calculator. The “results” of the research actually showed a lack of understanding of the products being discussed here.
As someone with asthma, I prefer to err on the safe side and if I ever handle insulation (no matter what kind), I'll be wearing a mask - probably an N95 or R95.
I have worked with Owens Corning and know a few inside things. What I can say is that you hit a nerve with them. They lost a very substantial class action lawsuit some years ago when they had products that did cause cancer. Now they are just covering their butts, and they allocate a large budget every year trying to clean up their reputation and sweep their history under the rug. I hope this information puts that letter into context.
I'm new to your channel. I really like your content, and as an engineer, I appreciate your style of delivery. I look forward to viewing the rest of your catalog. Great work!
It is interesting hearing you discuss the details about this.
As someone who works in construction and remodel, I can tell you that in the field, any substance that puts particulates into the air means I'm using the appropriate respiratory protection. I do not care what the labels say, or how toxic it may or may not be. I use a respirator.
The experts used to tell us lead and asbestos was harmless. I'm not gonna take anyone's word for it that I can inhale synthetic fibers and be just fine 20 years from now.
And if people do end up getting cancer from the product, there's a decent chance that the corporate investors had taken the profits, cashed out, and shut the company down by the time the claims are finally proven beyond a reasonable doubt, so they won't even be held financially liable for the harm caused.
💯
💯
AMEN!!!
CEOs of the world listen up - YOU LOST OUR TRUST.
The government and the corporations will tell you one thing. But use common sense and protective equipment.
The people that sent that letter will not come help you if you develop cancer.
They only care about their money. Belinda wants to learn more so that we can get as close as we can to the actual truth.
I like how transparent you are with your videos and information and catching mistakes/explaining things. I watch a lot of build channels, like Matt Risinger for instance, and stumbled across your channel.
You’re awesome! I love all your clear, informative, no nonsense videos but this one made me appreciate you even more. The way you calmly responded to that letter from NAIMA, didn’t just get angry, read through everything, met with them, incorporated the new info, used common sense and logic and explained where you got your previous info and why it was wrong are all great steps in dealing with any problem and learning as you go. Well done! Stay curious and keep up the great work. You’re an inspiration!
I don't care what they say - I trust my skin, eyes and lungs and they tell me they're irritants at best, although Rockwool is certainly worse in my experience.
Wear a hat, mask, gloves, and long sleeve shirt. It's a better product.
With fiberglass (haven't ever handled rockwool), after working with it exposed skin itches, even with goggles my eyes sometimes would itch (yes I avoided touching them), and you can even smell it if you aren't wearing a mask. Sure it might not be deadly, but I don't buy "almost no fibers in the air, no problem!"
@@Sn0wZer0 Why risk introducing things into your lungs they weren't made for? A chinese full face respirator is $40 (just use real 3M filters)
@@RandyRandersonthefamous
(1) I don't use fiberglass anymore, only time I would touch it is to tear it out.
(2) Most of my experience was from 25 years ago; at the time they acted like it was completely safe ("only asbestos is bad"). PPE is a lot better now and more widely used. Knowledge and handling of silica, gypsum, and talcum dust were big changes since then too.
All that said, I also don't think we should overly discourage DIY-ers, as your total exposure is low if you aren't doing something every day for a year like a professional would. Get an N95 and decent goggles and you are good for most stuff -- except for things where even momentary exposure can be harmful, which you leave to the pros. DIY-ers need to worry more about rookie mistakes like misusing a ladder rather than 10-year exposure problems.
The part about Glass fibers magically dissolving in the lungs and being absorbed by the body really set off my bullshit radar. This info is right from the manufacturer?
you know you're doing a good job when it gets the attention of the officials and they feel they need to defend themselves
Yes!
Oh my god, you are a total boss! New subscriber; love your channel and your approach
Really great video Belinda! I have only seen this and your Rockwool comparison video so far, but I really appreciate how much detail you go into and the fact that you published a video like this!
I face similar regulatory hurdles. I want to build a traditional adobe house in Arizona. The local codes INSIST - require - Portland-cement-based cement exterior render. As anyone familiar with building science knows, Portland cement based concrete is a reservoir cladding - it absorbs and holds water. Adobe doesn't like water. Lime based plaster render, on the other hand, is so hydrophilic that it wicks moisture away from the adobe, thus preserving the adobe's structural integrity. That is why we have thousands of antique adobe-with-lime-plaster buildings from the Middle East, Spain, Mexico and the American southwest that are centuries to millennia old. Yet, adobe houses with Portland cement render rarely last more than 40 years. My diagnosis of this nonsense: the lawyers who write code do not understand building science or materials engineering, and the people who understand building science and materials engineering never write codes! Therefore, I am exempting myself from meeting ludicrous, counter-productive codes by building an "agricultural outbuilding." My brother teased me with, "So, your dream is to live in a mud barn?!" LOL Thank God for the internet and the opportunity to explore new ideas! God Bless you and Keep it up, Belinda. You are a necessary voice of reason and an excellent counter-balance to the wasteful production-builder standards we have come to expect as "normal."
Thanks for sharing that info, Linda! I sometimes wonder if homes are purposely built with short lifespans in the States. It's a money-making cycle of planned obsolesce.
@@BelindaCarr Precisely! That, and the absurdity of applying standards developed for stick-built homes in temperate and cold climates to alternative (adobe, cob, hempcrete, etc.) construction in a desert climate. I am firmly of the opinion that we need to move away from prescriptive codes to performance codes. Innovation moves MUCH faster than the law - it is now impossible for inspectors and law makers to keep up. Set universal standards for accessibility, emergency egress, thermal resistance and air quality, shear strength, water and sanitary supply, etc. and demand that homeowners provide a decent computer model (or stamped engineered plans) showing that their solution works. That way, inspectors are only burdened with ensuring that what has been approved is actually what gets built. A much simper solution legally and administratively. I fear that it will be a l-lo-o-o-n-g time before common sense infects building codes, however. Maybe in your lifetime, not mine. You are a breath of fresh air, Belinda - keep up the good work! Also - the standard for "respiratory danger" is absurd. Silicosis is real for miners and other occupational exposures, but is a myth when applied to inhaled glass? [brief pause for an eye roll] I'm ignoring the industrial standard and relying on common sense, instead. Thanks again, Belinda.
@@lindacgrace2973 Different state so different rules but here in GA if you get an engineer to sign off on the plans that overrules the rubberstamp fools at the code office. Maybe you could find one that would do such for a nominal fee.
@@dampierstucco5778 I sure hope so. I am now taking a Living Building Design course. I hope that obtaining approval for my 'alternative' ideas from a nationally recognized building standards body will help as well (and it had a members directory wo that I can tap professionals for help). Keep your fingers crossed for me!
The balance between innovation to improve things and regulation to make it harder for people to do silly things is an eternal struggle. Good luck with your “barn”!
Wow, just wow. Independent opinions are allowed on the internet, that is one reason I love your channel so much. Must of the other channels out there educating about insulation or other materials are sponsored and it tends to show. But not yours and we appreciate that so much!
What a great channel! I am so impressed with your sharp reasoning and perseverance to eliminate all the nonsense and self-interest thrown up by sales people and promoters. I am thrilled by your willingness to update and correct comments when new information is presented. You clearly enjoy learning about these subjects. Will I always be a subscriber? YES!
Thank you, Dennis!
I don't care if any product is pronounced safe by the manufacturer or their lackeys in some association. I choose to not take particles of their product into my lungs. They should be taking steps to ensure I don't have to and not wasting time and effort in pulling your excellent channel down to their gutter level. I don't know what it is about your presentations Belinda, but they are almost spellbinding, very informative, very easy to watch and a great learning tool. You are clearly very intelligent and put a lot of effort into your work. Thankyou.
NAIMA today: Protection isn't necessary when using this pile of tiny glass shards
TV commercial 10 years from now: "If you or your loved one worked with fiberglass and has suffered from..."
😂 So true.
Glass is made largely from silicon dioxide, aka silica, aka quartz. Use of artificial stone countertops, made of silica, has proven to be far more dangerous to the lungs of workers who cut and polish the "stone" slabs than working with real stone. Last time I looked, my aquarium glass has not dissolved and let all the water and fish pour out onto the floor. How small must glass fibres be in order for them to dissolve? I wouldn't want to find out the answer the hard way.
I am thinking the same thing. We know silica dust is dangerous to your lungs but large pieces are not. There is some danger cutoff point in between, where exactly does that lie?
@@goodun2974 I think biosoluable in a sence that tobacco tar is ie. the lung cells can push out the glasswool fibers unlike with asbestos, so you end up with phleghm in the lungs that in theory can be coughed out.
Still not something you would like to inhale in any case also when removing old wool you have no way of knowing if it's an older bat made with cancerous materials even if the new materials aren't.
In conclusion wear a respirator in any case they are only 1.50$ a pop in a packet of 20 and a cheap insurance for your lungs.
There are massive differences between amorphous fibers and crystaline fibers (more like shards, in that case).
Silica exists and is handled in both forms, the amorphous form is called glass.
Belinda, thank you for the eye-opening video. I stand with you and your analysis. Most of those companies have a financial motive for their position. I speak as an ex-corporate flunky who has witnessed all sorts of shenanigans. FYI, while at university I was a lab assistant, and one day I told my boss (Prof.) that another lab was questioning our project. My boss did something which stuck with me all these years. He went to the blackboard and wrote “Theories will come and go but a well-made observation will stand forever!” Again, thank you, stand strong, keep up the good works. Best wishes.
You rock Belinda!!! Love to see more frequent videos.
Also, wish you explore a minimalist yet pragmatic architecture for a single family home.
Just started watching, love how honestly you present this info. Keep up the good work!
I love literally everything about this! ❤
From industry wide organizations getting upsetti spaghetti at one persons TH-cam channel, to your calm and professional yet stinging clapbacks. From shipping container die-hards, raseists, keyboard warriors to supposed "professionals". I never would have imagined Home Building had so much drama. LOL * SNAP * You gettem girl!!
Haha! "Upsetti spaghetti" is my new fav phrase!
@@BelindaCarr a friend of mine says it all the time and I got hooked
UPSETTI SPAGHETTI FTW!!!! I will, quite literally, use this for the rest of my life. Thank you for such a phenomenal saying.😆
Sorry you had that experience, but it sounds like NAIMA weren't complete asses about it, and they even provided some new info for you. Thanks for sharing it with us. Your "relatively small" YT channel obviously punches above its weight!
Yes, new info that they approved for maximum profit, they must sleep well at night
The youtube algorithm is strange and sometimes unpredictable. Small channels and single videos can become mainstream news at any moment.
That was literal corporate assholery. They can’t make their assholery too obvious or they can get sued. They believed they were shutting up someone “complaining” about their product. That’s being an ass.
@@MamaMOB This letter should have come from a scientific/engineering advisor not a lawyer.
Normally i skip ahead in videos but i keep going back to listen to things over and over. As someone who is looking to build a first time home and make it as efficient as possible ....... Thank You. Very professional and informative.
I love your sense of humor and How humble you are. I'm learning a lot from your channel!
I'm amending this comment. You definitely need a mask when working with both fiberglass or rock wool. I actually wasn't wearing any when I started to install my rock wool insulation on my solar shed and it didn't present a problem at the time. HOWEVER, as soon as I had to start cutting the rock wool to fill the smaller spaces, I started hacking up a lung. That's when I put on a face mask. It wasn't N-95 - just a surgical mask - but it really helped. In spite of the job being a shed and having the double-door wide open, the dust is just pervasive and will get everywhere, including your lungs.
I appreciate your professional, rational response to NAIMA- I also appreciate where you accept new information and correct the (Outdated) information you based your video on ( from the manufacturer's own websites!!) One would think a manufacturer would update their own information- if a manufacturer can't be bothered to keep current with the industry findings how the _____ are you supposed to know different!? All this to say- this makes me trust you even more for a source of info.
All I know is, whenever there is fiberglass anywhere, I break out in itches and hives. Don't care what NAIMA or any other group who has obvious invested interest has to say.
Keep up the good work!
"and naturally, I went through it all" of course you did! Great work!
You have a remarkable talent for angering engineers with a simple youtube channel.
Who would have thought? :)
Having worked with a number of engineers, it has been my experience that they tend to be thin-skinned by nature. "You can always tell an engineer ----- the problem is, you can't tell them *anything*". Plus, statistically it is likely that the insulation manufacturing engineers are male, and they definitely don't like being schooled by a woman. As for the letter Belinda received, it had to have been reviewed in advance by numerous lawyers, and the 1st instinct of a CORPORATE lawyer is to go for the jugular, always, even when it isn't warranted. (PS, My dad was an attorney, in private practice, and not on a corporate retainer; he could be tough in defense of clients, but he was fair, and he wasn't vicious).
@@goodun2974 I pictured their lawyers in my head as the ones from the Simpsons: "Yor onnuh, we object to da' phrase 'urine-stained' hell-hole' and prefer da' phrase 'pee-pee stained heck-hole'.
Having glass fibers dissolving in my lungs sounds like a fun time...
Just like you said Belinda, the big dogs of the industry are at work doing their thing. Thank you for getting to the bottom of things
Imagine all the horrific animal testing that was done just so the Corporation could make this claim which ultimately is a less than good idea to either implement or recommend considering they are basing this on an optimal installation environment which is rarely real world.
You're are the best; I really like your honesty and your transparency and how you explain and demystify the insulation subject based on data facts and experience that not Mr/Ms everybody knows or is familiar in our everyday lives, this valuable information allow us to make a decision of what to get and how to invest which empower us to take a desicion without the bais of a sales person, a contractor or in this case a manufacturer. I encourage you to continue posting your videos and to share your knowledge and experience with the world. Many thanks :)
I’m looking to install insulation in my basement. More to help with sound transference, when I stumbled upon your original video. Your research mistakes were mistakes I would’ve made. I appreciate this video and you being able to say you didn’t realize some of the info was outdated. Great videos (both of them)! Keep up the good work!!
Belinda got people beefin with her now, but she still came with all of the receipts.
My body is far more intelligent than any scientific data. It was one of the reasons I changed to Rockwool, there was considerably less irritation from the product on both my skin and throat.
If i'm anywhere near exposed fiberglass wool for a few minutes, my skin and lungs are hurting for a long time. Being stung inside and/or outside the body with a myriad microscopic glass needles is no joke! Protection is a must (if you care about yourself). Love your videos, Belinda!
I just found your videos today. Thank you for being so informative! Your research and the way you explain it to us is exceptional. I've subscribed.
I love the video clips that you add to your videos. I’m with you, when I use any insulation, I cover up. I guess you’re not just a “little channel” anymore. Keep the videos coming. Your viewers appreciate them.
Thanks, Michael. That John Malkovich clip comes in handy :)
Well on point 1: fiberglass is literally glass splinters! from splinter size to microscopic fragments.. now think of glass splinters in your lungs. and saying that its bio soluble is questionable, because I had a colleague which had a huge splinter in his hand till the point that it had to be surgically removed, because his hand was going numb and becoming unusable, just because he didn't use gloves once!
I’m so grateful this channel came up in my feed! Brenda, you do great work! Thank you!
Every word of your rebuttal was well thought out and carefully presented. Bravo. You have the most elegant of claws.
Thank you for your efforts and videos. Your personal quest to seek the reality of construction versus the theory they teach in university has benefited us, your followers. You mentioned Europe, and they are decades ahead of us in so many construction materials and methods, our industries should be ashamed. Keep up the good work!
Thank you!
Well, the best way to know that you’re successful is when you get messages like that.
Keep up the good work! And good on you for sharing some of the new information that is actually relevant.
Your video has huge impact. I am looking at rockwool after a series of videos, yours bring the most organized and methodical, with strong intuition, authenticity, and logical flow. Always good to wear respiration protection, regardless of particulate count, all it takes is one. Someone high up got stuck on missing definitions and your video impacted someone's economics. I support you being more involved in science, teaching, testing, sharing and establishing standards.
Your videos are great and so informational, as an architecture student i’m learning lots. Love your channel!
Uh-oh! Someone(s) told on you... a sure sign you are doing the right thing!
Contamination and concentrations also depend on how the material is handled. The same goes for woodworking. Saw dust can cause cancer if exposed enough. My good friend could testify to that if he were still alive. If a material, fiberglass especially, will release more fibers if handled roughly. And when your insulating, not the best job out there, you want to get done quickly. So it goes.
I loved your calm and reasoned answers to questions raised. I admire you.
Never underestimate the power of your channel to shape opinions. :)
I appreciate you bringing this to light as it is good info. I also like that industries are reaching out to try to correct info they see as incorrect.
I answered your question with "sometimes"
If I was installing batt insulation for hours I would wear a respirator, no matter the product.
NAIMA are not 'correcting your misconceptions' they are trying to cover their ass. (and just drawing more attention to themselves)
Just own what everybody in the trades already knows. It is an unhealthy product to handle cavilerly.
the 1 thumb down was from Naima
Belinda, Thank you for being honest, competent, and transparent in all your videos.
I just discovered your channel. It is so very well produced and interestingly informative. Thank you. I have being building homes for more than 26 years and I’m always using and exploring new products. And yes I always wonder if their claims are well investigated and substantiated. Thank you for thanking the time. Well done.
Let them be offended! You’re putting out great content and educating the Audio community!
Thank your for holding these organisations accountable to their claims, sorry you had to deal with this pettiness. I suspect they are only mad because you called them out on their BS and they are afraid that if people knew how their products really compared they would find their own products don't stack up so well. Thanks for being a trustworthy source of information in an area where it's surprisingly hard to find good quality information.
Thank you MS Carr. I am preparing to build a home and I have seen several of your videos because of the great content. Please keep up the great work.
Love your honesty and integrity,,, Keep providing us with great content Belinda!
Don't worry about these corporate lawyers just keep making truthful, informative videos like you always have and let your conscience be your guide, trust your instincts. If you rattled them it is THEY wo are hiding something.
#4: what about Hemp wool & Sheep wool!! just to annoy them
Thanks as always, Belinda. Your work is so informative and really useful.
I don't know how I found your channel, but I love it! I need to insulate my loft in Scotland, I am not sure what products are available or which is ' best'. You videos are really helpful, thank you.
Well girl, you got someone’s attention. It means you are having an impact and making a difference to someone. You go girl.
Keep up the good work Belinda. As for the manufactures... I've been around long enough to know what appropriate PPE I will use, and respiratory protection is required anytime insulation is involved. I'm not going to put myself or my family through the pain of litigation when evidence indicates inadequate protection was recommended by manufactures or industry special interest groups.
You are a gem! Young people like you is all we need to construct a better society. Analyze facts calmly...that is refreshing. I have nothing to do with construction, but I want to do some upgrades in my house, so I find your videos very informative! Continue spreading knowledge
Having watched a few of your videos, this was the one I subscribed to/from. I absolutely abhor people who can not methodically, logically and sensibly reason, speak and articulate an opposing point, and NAIMA is no different, just bullies. Though their information was revised and new-er they could have presented you with a gentler communication precept and invite you to the conversation. In return, YOU methodically broke the conversation down, stately, respectfully and distinguishably. Well done!
So happy you received that NAIMA letter, it gave you opportunity to create this video! I loved it and my only complaint is that I can't subscribe because I already did after a previous video. You bring hope to many in a time when it is very much needed. Thanks.
Haha! Thanks, Glen
Great clapback Belinda. Glad to see you had time today. They aren’t ready for that flawless defense.
Thanks, Malcom!
Came across your original Rockwool vs Fiberglass video and thought, 'What a great video'...then I looked at your channel and watched this one... Subscribed!!!
Love your very calm and organized video answering such claims thrown at you. Keep it up! :)
👏 👏 👏
Can’t see how you could have dealt with this matter any better 👍
Great video! Don’t let the big industry push you around!
Most companies don’t live in the real world, just some laboratory in very controlled environments.
I think it's awesome that you can raise the ire of so many different groups of people with your videos. That's a special talent and its nice to know people are watching.
An absolute pleasure to watch your videos. Excellent work…I hope you continue to post your thoughts and findings! 🥇
As for the "green" products-- while everything we make has an environmental impact, there are some products that are more environmentally friendly than other products. It all depends on the materials and manufacturing process.
I think that the fact that you have to use less heating and cooling if a home is well insulated is factored in to being "green". Less electricity or gas used in a home reduces the environmental impact of said home, so I think they might be claiming those reductions make their insulation material more "environmentally friendly" than it is if it were based solely on the material used and manufacturing process.
I don't know for sure if that's the case, but I think it's pretty likely.
As they say, when you're taking flak, you know you're over the target. Thanks for all your excellent work!
Thanks for the info! Don't let any body discourage you . You are helping oblivious folks ,like me!!!
Your "small TH-cam channel" has helped me to pick the best materials to finish my house's above ground basement. I'm very grateful for your content. It's entertaining and it's made this a hobby which helps me unwind from school, work and parenting. Also, personal opinion after working with comfortboard and comfortbatt, Rockwood is the superior product on the market. Less itch. Better r value. Etc etc